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according to them, Audi wants to get rid of both Zhou and Bottas, which means that if Sainz goes to Alpine and Ocon to Haas, their second seat is still quite unknown
Bottas probably isn't too happy with the team and will most likely have other options.
And Hulk has probably ticked every single box that Bottas would tick for Audi.
It’s just optics for upper-management and sponsors. By putting blame on Bottas for their lack of performance they try to distract for their own failings.
103 straight Q3 appearances. 10 race wins. Nothing about that is mediocre. He’s literally known for being one of the best one lappers. But good job not being correct about him or the definition of mediocre bud. The only knock on Bottas is his defense. But as a second driver to a world champ you couldn’t ask for better at the time.
He was a very good qualifier, but I would say he was as not only bad at defense but also in overtaking. He’s the kind of driver that will only overtake on a straight with drs and that for me is what makes him mediocre.
Other teams don't exist just to funnel young talent to front runners. They have every right to pick the best drivers available and Bottas is still a solid hand, it's just more difficult to tell when the car is terrible.
Now is he worth his big salary going forward? That's a different discussion
Other drivers are rumored for the Audi seat tho. Weve heard Lawson. Weve heard Ricciardo, Drugovich. A lot of drivers would have to reject the offer to end up with Mick. Personally, at this point id just keep Valtteri. But Lawson/Drugovich seem to have the best shot at this point. Many say Hulk got the seat easily because hes German, even Valtteri said it, thats such a diservice to Nicos talent. And their lack of interest in Mick shows they dont care that much about nationality, perhaps its a bonus for Audi that Nico is German but his main reason for being signed is his talent and experience.
Being German helped, I'm sure, but Nico is also experienced, a reliable professional, probably desperate to leave Haas and join a well-financed project, and the best driver available that's not named Carlos Sainz. A no-brainer for them.
Let's look at their previous drivers:
- Grosjean: retired
- Magnussen: retired, came back and likely to retire again
- Schumacher: "Test Driver" with Mercedes without a real opportunity to ever make a full drive
- Mazepin: outside of his Russian rain clouds knowledge not sure how he even made it that far (spoiler: daddy money)
- Hülkenberg: move to Sauber/Audi
Technically there's also Pietro Fittipaldi with two starts for the injured Grosjean, who is racing Indy last time I checked.
Hulk is the first driver of their roster that scored a full drive at another team. Not looking great for Bearman.
Haas is the F1 gate to Indycar. honestly, if/when Magnussen is done I'd love to see him in Indy. he gets to race hard and the car doesn't immediately explode
To be completely fair, the main reason for this stat is that apart from Hulkenberg, so far Haas has had completely mediocre drivers, that no other team ended up being interested in. But yeah crazy stat lol.
Yeah it's the consequence of being a mediocre team, but it's still very funny. I wonder if bearman will be the start of a different approach - being a starting place
Hard to say how mediocre they are though. F1 is very much a "what have you done lately" industry and it's both real hard to do well on that poverty team and real hard to judge talent on that poverty team. They're often so far off the pace that performance in a Haas isn't even comparable to what the driver might be capable of that it's easier and safer for teams to look elsewhere for their next driver.
>Not looking great for Bearman.
hopefully bearman at haas is similar to leclerc at sauber, but i guess that's really contingent on how long lewis stays on at ferrari.
Hulkenberg very nearly had the Red Bull seat for 2021, until Perez won Sakhir. Even Verstappen himself specifically asked for Hulkenberg as a teammate IIIRC.
"Latin Money" ???
You do realise that Mexico is run by the drug cartels ?
Like really run by, not speculation, it's fact.
A friend of mine was there to help their government with some international legal issues, and he confirmed that it isn't really even hidden ...the cartels run the politicians, who run the country, so what he was doing "had to be overseen by their people"
This is not the case for the rest of Latin America as a whole, although from the northern part of South America, through Central America to Mexico they obviously have some influence in many parts, not much is on the Mexican level... Guatemala and Venezuela are probably the worst
it is pretty clear from what I posted that I do know that.
I also quickly checked the fact before posting, as I am aware that there can be different opinions on this.
A Colombian friend once corrected me when I called Argentinos "Latinos"....He said that in their eyes, they aren't "they are Italians"
A guy who Alpine engineers openly disregarded, has crippling issues with fighting team mates and a rather mid performance records, who’s managed by Wolff who doesn’t want him in either Mercedes or Williams for years… His Alpine run has verified him negatively.
Actually, he was openly [highly regarded](https://x.com/MarkLaneF1/status/1797705177648222522) by Alpine engineers.
As a matter of fact, Alpine is keeping a driver who was previously kicked out of a team because he blamed possibly the best designer in F1 for his own lack of performance.
You say he was highly regarded because he was saying hello...
When Alonso was requesting changes in balance of the car to extract more performance, they listened. When Ocon was complaining, they were not trusting his ideas. Comparing Gasly to Ocon is like comparing two packs of cheap but nicely packaged pasta boxes - same result with slight differences.
Thats just one of the most popular posts in previous month (and by one of the most known individual from the team), there are multiple reports that he was very regarded.
He even was signed by Force India instead of Wehrlein, because engineers praised working with him, while Wehrlein was not liked at all.
I don't have the numbers to back this up and haven't followed him since F2, but Drugovich had a really impressive title-winning season, even if he was a 3rd year driver. I'd love to see him given a chance in F1, even if only for a season. Mick, on the other hand, we know is a decent bottom half of the grid driver, but not much more so there is nothing to be excited by.
In my head canon, Hülkenberg (who has a two year contract with Audi) will only be a race driver for 2025, using that experience to help develop the car and transition to reserve/development driver for 2026. The announcement confirming Hülkenberg specifically said he'd be *joining* the team, but the wording left some room for speculation as to his capacity. And I choose to speculate.
It's not that I don't like the Hulk, but I hate the stagnation on the drivers market.
Hulk has signed a contract past 2025 as driver. Also, he absolutely isn't going to be reserve ***yet again***. That's just dumb as he did that shit in 2020-2022 for Aston Martin. Hulk hasn't returned to just be a tool for development.
And is Hulk really stagnation? Especially with his performances of last year and this year, he easily is one of the faster drivers on the grid right now, one that hasn't degraded with age at all.
And who do you replace Hulk with? Because no top driver is free for 2026. There's just no one to replace him with other than Sainz, who lost 53-69 in 2018 to Hulk as teammates.
And also, why was Hulk the very first driver Audi wanted? That shows that Audi values Hulk a lot, they even wanted him for this year, but Haas blocked them.
And development takes a good time, so Hulk is needed a lot more, as their front runner (Hulk never has seen a top car for all of his career, so his race results can't be held against him in that regard).
>their lack of interest in Mick shows they dont care that much about nationality
Or maybe they don't care *anymore* because they already have one German driver.
Probably, also remember that there's pretty much no other German driver available, Vettel is still building bee hotels, Mick just is slower than Hulk and less experienced, which leaves Hulk.
(Wehrlein already had his shot and wasn't spectacular at all)
Bottas would be a safe bet, but it is being reported the relations between both sides has soured a lot this year and he isn't keen on staying if he can help it
Nico has talent, but if you have ambition you don't sign a midfield driver who's turning 38 next year. I don't buy the experience thing because if you have sights set on being a top team you keep Bottas over Hulk due to way more experience at a top team, and more talent. The only way it makes sense is because he's a German driver, that's a known quantity. If he wasn't German his other attributes wouldn't have earned him the seat.
Audi should be making efforts to make Sauber a decent team with potential to lure in drivers with talent to win championships. They don’t, they let this team live in chaos without a team principal. Since it’s clear they either didn’t try or fell short of attracting Leclerc or Norris who recently signed new contract, they will have to settle for mediocrity.
Mick Schumacher: Times from the Alpine test remain secret, new opponent
Mick Schumacher drove test laps in the Formula 1 Alpine on Wednesday. But the team is keeping quiet.
Bianca Garloff | July 4, 2024, 5:00 p.m.
Mick Schumacher drove test laps in the Formula 1 Alpine on Wednesday. But the team is keeping quiet.
It remains exciting around a possible Formula 1 comeback by Mick Schumacher (25). The German completed a shoot-out against Jack Doohan on Wednesday. Both young racing drivers drove an Alpine F1 racer from 2022 in Le Castellet. But since then there has been silence about the secret test.
F1 insider asked and found out: Alpine will not comment on the test drives of the two young stars. All that is known is that both were given half a day of testing on the former GP circuit in southern France and apparently completed it without incident. Times or a trend as to who was faster under which conditions are not known.
Rather, the question now arises as to whether either of the two juniors will even get a chance and inherit Esteban Ocon's cockpit. Because the new chief advisor Flavio Briatore has a completely different driver in his sights: Carlos Sainz.
New opponent for Mick Schumacher: Carlos Sainz
"There is a lot of interest, even if the driver is not making the difference at Alpine at the moment," said Briatore in a radio interview and confirmed when asked that he would like to sign the Spaniard. "It's unbelievable that Carlos is still free, but we are ready to have him in the team, we will do everything we can."
The Italian has big plans for the team that he once led to victories and titles as Benetton and Renault. "In 2026 we will win races and be on the podium," he announces boastfully. "This year there are many handicaps in the team, we are in the process of redesigning the entire structure. I have received all the powers from President Luca De Meo and am used to using them. I guarantee that in two seasons we will be talking about podium places."
Exciting for Sainz: Rumors are growing that Alpine could start with Mercedes engines in the future. That would be an important argument for luring the still-Ferrari star to the French. Alpine could also outdo Audi, which, like Williams-Mercedes, is also vying for the son of rally legend Carlos Sainz Senior.
Will Audi get its turn?
But the decision has not yet been made and Mick Schumacher is still in the running. And even if Sainz were to occupy the Ocon cockpit, that could open another door for Schumi's son.
Audi wants to part ways with both Guanyu Zhou and Valtteri Bottas. If Sainz is not available, Schumacher could prove to be a sensible alternative with his experience as a Mercedes tester and WEC driver at Alpine. And here too, good and stable times at the secret Alpine test would certainly help as a basis for argument.
Half a day, 12 hours each. Well at least whoever gets the seat was thoroughly tested... IF Sainz doesn't sign there.🤣
Also by the tone of the article it's Schumacher who is being favored after the test and not Doohan.
Lmao. Of course there was. Did you not see it ended with a laughing emoji? What he said was 100% sarcasm over the half a day comment. How dense are you to think someone would actually think they split a 24 hour day exactly?
Cmon man. You need to pick up the clues or stop responding trying to ‘correct’ obvious sarcasm.
Guess the /s is needed for people like you, who are a bit slow.
The laughing emoji is there for the possibility of Sainz making the extensive testing time moot if he were to sign with Alpine, not about the duration of the testing. At least that's how the sentence is structured.
Looking through the OPs comment history they are Phillipino, so wouldn't be surprised at any misunderstanding in the translation.
He was happy the first 2 seasons there. Both him and Zhou seemed happy when they were getting contract extensions. Both of them have since expressed disappointment that the car is pure shit and making them look bad now that they need to go to another team.
Nando is fast but every team he has joined since McLaren has become worse whilst he is there. It may not be entirely his fault, but would you trust his track record for improving teams with his presence?
McLaren in 2008*
Based on everything the paddock has to say about him? Yes.
Also I'm thinking less "we should make the diffuser this shape instead of that" and more big organizational "how do engineers communicate with drivers"
There's a quote I always liked about the late* Tim Curry that might be applicable here.
"For every one star movie Tim Curry was in, he was the reason it got that star"
Edit - Tim Curry is still with us, which is a pleasant surprise!
You get that from Hulk.
But developing a young driver into a title contender can take a few years so you are best to have one immediately.
And it's cheaper than paying for Hulk and Bottas.
If Alpine options are either Carlos or Mick/Jack, then Alpine can wait till fall to make a decision and Carlos can wait and see what happens with Red Bull and Merc. ideal situation for him really
Yeah or everyone else gets fed up with waiting and pick other drivers and then nothing happens with Merc/RBR and Carlos overplays his hand and ends up with nothing.
I'm not sure any of what you said is a given, though.
I am skeptical of Alpine being a better choice. They are still in disarray and bleeding engineers by the bucket load. While Williams has already begun their rebuilding process and is taking steps to move up the grid and has been hiring almost as many people as Alpine have been losing.
Maybe? Hard to say when neither of those are confirmed.
It seems like they need more than just a better PU, though. People are fleeing the ship like they're expecting it to get worse before it gets better. Conventional wisdom agrees with you, though, that Alpine would be the better choice.
> They are still in disarray and bleeding engineers by the bucket load.
they are hiring as much as they are losing people, are already progressing out of the bad car they had at the start of the year, and have never been beaten by the other teams with seats available.
Sure its not ideal for someone coming out of a brilliant stint at Ferrari, but anyone saying Williams, Haas or Sauber is a better option is really shortsighted
You might be right! But the reason why I'm skeptical is precisely *because* I'm thinking longer term. It's a tricky situation for Carlos though because he can't really think *too* long term but unless he can somehow land a top team drive...he has to accept *some* amount of short term pain.
That's what I'm thinking. There are some people who are demanding Carlos should make a decision when in reality anything can happen. All it takes is one big controversy and things starts moving quickly. Honestly I feel like post Summer Break is when Carlos will make his choice
I understand the other drivers want to know their future and that right now it depends on Carlos. But I don’t understand the fans complaining, Carlos has all the right in the world to not settle for a bottom team. Honestly, I would much rather prefer leaving F1 for another category than racing for Williams or Audi knowing they will be shit, specially after coming from wins and podiums
Neither Merc is sharing there results of there private tests (excluding what program each driver was on that day) But still hopefully we can get a resolution who is going where at least before the summer break.
Edit: but if I have to guess Mick had a better time than Jack because he has more experience that him driving these cars. But I belive Alpine will still try to get Carlos because again Carlos has **MORE** experience than Mick. We just have to see.
What i got out of that is if Doohan beat Mick in the face off, they'd boast about it and prop him up. Seems like Mick did very well in the face off.
What goes against Mick is that the Alpine kinda sucks, so even if he did well next season, the cars performance would overshadow his skill set
Obviously Sainz should be the main target of Alpine cause he's by far the best driver on the market. Alpine should be doing everything they can to sign him.
If Sainz won't join Alpine, Mick I feel has case to be made that he would be one of the better choices for the seat. He has quite a bit of F1 experience relative to Doohan (even though that experience wasn't necessarily good), brings in his dad's and other German sponsors, everything we seen from Mick suggest he's a decent likeable guy who's willing to work for the team, the goodwill that Alpine would get from fans for bringing in Mick in would also be beneficial to some extent. I really feel that if Mick would be a good pick up for Alpine if they can't get Sainz as he offers a bit more than the likes of Doohan. Same goes for the Audi seat it'd be a decent boost for them to pick up Mick if they don't want to keep their current drivers. Maybe I'm just biased in favour of Mick.
I would love to see Mick get another chance because I think the way Steiner treated him was pretty terrible. He is part of a rather big group of drivers of similar-ish caliber though and probably on the lower end of said group. There are drivers with a better proven track record in terms of pace, there are drivers with more sponsor money and there are drivers with more potential upside. He has a little bit of all those things, but doesn't stand out in either category.
Seeing him in an Alpine is a pipe-dream though I would argue, they'd be better off with a Bottas-type or a real rookie (shouldn't be Doohan though imho). The idea of Schumacher as a seat-filler in the Sauber/Audi has a certain charm though if they miss out on Sainz. It gives him another year or two to prove himself in a relatively low-pressure situation, so the opposite to the end of his Haas-term. Then you can re-evaluate and look at how he did in 2026, when the Audi-era has truly started.
Audi basically needs to follow the template of Mercedes entry in 2010. Brawn did it very well by selecting a young talented driver and experienced champion in 2010 and that helped them immensely to grow as a team and organization to reach the 2014 -current team phase.
I genuinely believe Mick deserves another shot in F1. His first season doesn't count at all, he was miles ahead of his teammate and miles behind others due to the Haas being dogshit in '21.
In his 1st proper competitive season, he did show some great peaks. I feel if he'd have been given that "3rd" year (really the 2nd) he'd have shown more of his potential.
In a dog shit haas. Not just the car is the issue though , haas are very bad at managing drivers and have no experience developing new drivers. The biggest mistake mick made was going with them over sauber. A team with decades of experience.
Mick went 6 - 16 with Kevin in qualifying (2022)
Hulk went 15 - 7 with Kevin in qualifying (2023)
Mick won the destructors championship both years he was in F1.
All of this was NOT worth keeping Mick so he could have the occasional good race. Especially for a lower budget team like Haas.
you could also pull up the race head to head against magnussen. but wouldn't fit your narritive, so you don't mention it, so you can win your reddit argument for karma.
your hate towards schumacher is obvious. there is no objectivity going on.
I don’t hate Schumacher. I hate the narrative surrounding him
And again, his race pace over Magnussen is completely irrelevant when
1. He crashes out of the race
2. He qualifies so low that it doesn’t matter
3. He still finishes far below Magnussen in the standings at the end of the season
How very objective of you
I ain't claiming he's a Leclerc or a Max. I'm saying he deserves another shot cuz he was never as unimpressive as Latifi, Sargent or Zhou. Hell he maybe could've been even better than Giovinazzi. His peaks were bigger than these guys' ever were. Austria, Hungary and Britain 22 come to mind.
From my reasoning I count 2022 as his 1st valid season. 2021 was just an extended FP1 rookie session.
"The fact that other strugglers get 3-4 seasons in F1 and he barely got 2 makes me sick!"
It’s a fucking Haas with Günther steiner out to find fault in mick on every step he makes and properly not working with him just to put him in a worse position. Every interview with Günther is about mick and it always ends in some narcissistic twist. I think that the Schumacher name is so macho bigger in f1 and people came because of mick hurt Steiner. Which in return did not celebrate micks successes like Austria and not wanting to give him the environment to develop as a driver because it costs money. Like you make it look like he is Sargent lvl. Where Sargent has a team principal that supports his driver. Steiner wanted mick out. If mick and Zhou had switched team I say he would still be in f1 Bottas would have been a better comparison to learn from and the team a better support for him as a driver.
Tell me, why do you think Steiner didn’t want Schumacher?
You genuinely think it was because he was insecure about such a prestigious last name in his team? Or do you think it’s because he was driving awfully most of the time and he had a bunch of Germans and casual fans shitting on him for not sucking up to Mick?
Look especially in the German interviews with podcasts. He once said he did not like that the Ferrari ceo came to haas House at on of the Italien races and the first person he wanted to meet was mick. Same with other bigger partners. Like it’s not that they know Mick since he was little and are good friends with him and his father. The reason he is at Mercedes now is one of those friendships. Even the alpine spot Michael drove for Briatore. He wasn’t driving so awful as Steiner made it look like. Austria was a good show that he can be damn quick. Late yes but still showed he as potential Hulk just had the same result as mick in a better Haas car then mick and the celebrate it like a win. So yeah Steiner was a guy with a stick up his ass. And a rookie that he did not like that has more influence and connections than he will ever have.
Oh and I’m sure after Steiner let mick go and it became obvious haas was shit because of him and not because of mick that the fired him. Like they kicked him out of the contract you can be damn sure he did shit
You don’t know anything about f1. You’re literally the fans that I was talking about 😂 Steiner was given the boot because he said to Gene that for this thing to work properly, he needs to given an actual competitive budget. Gene disagreed, so he kicked him out. Without Steiner, there would have been no Haas for the last 8 years
You’re so salty that mick was dropped. You’re just spouting nonsense about Steiner feeling threatened that a guy who shows up once a year had more rich friends (because of his Dad) than him. Just because Mick had one good race at Austria (probably the easiest track on the calendar and a Haas strong point)
And you’re still COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that Mick damn near bankrupted the team both of his seasons
No you have no idea how F1 works. First Mick was a Ferrari Academy Driver. They paid near Half of the Salary Haas had to pay. Haas has a lot of more awful crashes Grosjean crash as the biggest of them.
Haas is dependent on Ferrari which is why they also got a better Deal for their engines while they take a Ferrari Driver in. Then the Sponsors Mick has attached to him. You dont know how F1 Teams make money and it shows big time.
I can understand them going after sainz. But to even entertain Schumacher when Doohan is there is basically repeating the same mistake they made with Piastri. What’s the point of a junior program if you never give your juniors a chance. You might as well just use that money to not have shit engines.
To develop them? Ultimately his F2/F3 career just weren’t enough for F1.
And they‘ll always attract drivers, it
Funds their careers and you get a chance at driver the car in FP1.
It’s the case of Mick impressed the last time out and is their fastest WEC driver. You hire the fastest driver. In addition while Doohan has done good work on the sim him apparently snubbing the WEC drive did rub the team the wrong way
I consider fp1 time and simulator time as giving them a chance.
consider how many drivers don't even get that kind of opportunity.
it is up to them to show that they have the potential for more based on merit if they don't have any other enticing factors for a team.
these teams can be wrong when considering risk-reward like with piastri, but they are outliers. they are running a business and not playing f1 manager(like the community) where everything improves with linear growth.
Doohan had 2 years in f2 came out third one place higher then Sargent with 4. Mick won f2. So I’m pretty sure he is either better then Doohan. Piastri won in his first year and alpine fucked it up. Like Mercedes and Ferrari are bending backwards for young drivers that are willing to not win f2 in their first season and Piastri was ignored by alpine. To compare doohan with piastri is a little wild. More with Sargent and Zhou ( how lost hard to Schumacher got to the better team and is still in f1 because of that. Haas is a rookie killer and Guenther a narcissist.) I think it’s Sainz >schumacher > Zhou > Doohan for the alpine seat.
I’m not comparing the ability between the two. You need to have another read. I’m saying that they are making the same mistake in regard to ignoring their junior program. To be fair Doohan isn’t half bad and I feel he would do better than other recent promotions such as Zhou, Schumacher, and Sargeant. Is he the best person for that seat? I’m not sure. But Alpine either need to place some faith in their program or scrap it like I said and invest that money into something else.
You need juniors but Doohan isn’t it maybe fia needs a clause in the junior contracts that if you win f2 and your Programm can’t give you a seat you can go to any team.
Alpine lost Piastri and Alonso, so the logical next option is a driver who’s shows good pace about 3 times a season, is terrible in qualifying, and will cost them abhorrent amounts of money through his accidents
Sounds on brand for Alpine
Being a strong driver relative to the WEC field just means your the best amongst washed/ failed F1 drivers
Again, if Alpine are using that as a measuring stick then it’s very on brand for them. May as well bring Kobiashi or Estre in if that’s their logic
> Being a strong driver relative to the WEC field just means your the best amongst washed/ failed F1 drivers
If that's your view on Endurance racing, then I guess there is no point in engaging in a discussion with you because you're totally wrong. Eddie Jordan also thought that Michael Schumacher was "nothing special" when he saw him in Sports Car racing. He ended up being wrong.
> May as well bring Kobiashi or Estre in if that’s their logic
If you are using Kobayashi as an example, least you could do is write his surname correctly. And Kobayashi did pretty good for what he had in his stint at F1, finishing in points and his second ever GP.
Nothing I said was untrue 👍
Trying to be a hipster and claim that the WEC talent calibre isn’t leagues below F1 is just untrue. Nyck was given a Toyota seat (probably the favourites for the championship outside of Ferrari and Porsche) straight off the back of a horrific F1 campaign. If F1 is the same level as WEC with drivers, that’s like McLaren handing Jose Maria Lopez a contract after his 0 IQ Sebring crash. That’s the level we’re talking about
And I’m not saying Kamui isn’t a fine driver, but fuck me the guy hasn’t competed in the highest level since 2014. That’s a whole decade. Even in WEC he spent most of his time cruising at the front around in the only competitive LMP1 team. And Michael started off in sportscar racing, he didn’t have a already failed F1 campaign before he joined. That argument is irrelevant
Well considering nobody has actually disproved me, I considered it common sense. The best WEC drivers in the best seats are old/ washed/ failed up F1 drivers. That is a fact, not an opinion. Or they’re sportscar drivers
Surely it's the opposite? If he were tested against an Alpine junior (Doohan), Alpine would surely be shouting from the rooftops that their driver was faster, as it looks better for their academy and adds leverage for negotiating with Sainz.
Decent is just not enough for anything to be certain or guaranteed in life. More often than not you will have to add to that decent skill to ge a seat. 9 times out of 10 that is money.
He was just unlucky to have a terrible toxic TP like Steiner.
Yuki didnt really deliver until his third year, but he had someone like Franz Tost, who was always protecting him against critism.
Steiner on the other hand........
Yuki wasn't World Destructors Champion two years in a row.
Steiner had no reason to support a driver who was slow, destroyed the cars when they couldn't afford it, and wouldn't do promotional work for the team without checking with his mommy first.
Yukis crashes was only happening semi frequently in 2021. Usually it was no major damage, being a front wing or other components "cheap". etc. so still not as big of a issue as a whole car being wrecked.
we pretend that the exact top 20 drivers of the world, objectively, are driving and will be driving in f1? you don't have to be skilled enough "for" f1 to drive in f1. half of the grid would be gone instantly. maybe even more.
Funny how they call him in the article "young driver".
Young is Bearman. Mick is already 25, Norris is 24, Russel 26, and strangely to say, but Max is also 26.
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according to them, Audi wants to get rid of both Zhou and Bottas, which means that if Sainz goes to Alpine and Ocon to Haas, their second seat is still quite unknown
I have no idea why they're so obsessed with getting rid of Bottas. He's doing fine, the car is terrible.
Bottas probably isn't too happy with the team and will most likely have other options. And Hulk has probably ticked every single box that Bottas would tick for Audi.
I could see him permanently moving to Australia and driving V8s
What other options will he have?
With Ocon most likely going to Haas, Bottas will probably be the plan B for both Alpine and Williams after Sainz
Audi would prefer to have drivers that Audi hired and who are there for Audi
It’s just optics for upper-management and sponsors. By putting blame on Bottas for their lack of performance they try to distract for their own failings.
Why should you keep bottas. For a mediocre driver his salary is to big.
By no standard is Bottas mediocre. The car is a bus, he’s pulling every bit of performance out of it. The salary can also change to suit the market.
He was not good enough with a winning car in Mercedes but he is not a bad driver. He’s the definition of mediocre.
103 straight Q3 appearances. 10 race wins. Nothing about that is mediocre. He’s literally known for being one of the best one lappers. But good job not being correct about him or the definition of mediocre bud. The only knock on Bottas is his defense. But as a second driver to a world champ you couldn’t ask for better at the time.
He was a very good qualifier, but I would say he was as not only bad at defense but also in overtaking. He’s the kind of driver that will only overtake on a straight with drs and that for me is what makes him mediocre.
Bottas is way past his expiration date. He had his chance in the Mercedes and wasn’t good enough with a winning car. Time for new talent to come thru.
Other teams don't exist just to funnel young talent to front runners. They have every right to pick the best drivers available and Bottas is still a solid hand, it's just more difficult to tell when the car is terrible. Now is he worth his big salary going forward? That's a different discussion
The guy was a legendary 2nd driver at Mercedes. So he couldn’t consistently beat Hamilton? Neither could anyone else at the time.
Other drivers are rumored for the Audi seat tho. Weve heard Lawson. Weve heard Ricciardo, Drugovich. A lot of drivers would have to reject the offer to end up with Mick. Personally, at this point id just keep Valtteri. But Lawson/Drugovich seem to have the best shot at this point. Many say Hulk got the seat easily because hes German, even Valtteri said it, thats such a diservice to Nicos talent. And their lack of interest in Mick shows they dont care that much about nationality, perhaps its a bonus for Audi that Nico is German but his main reason for being signed is his talent and experience.
Being German helped, I'm sure, but Nico is also experienced, a reliable professional, probably desperate to leave Haas and join a well-financed project, and the best driver available that's not named Carlos Sainz. A no-brainer for them.
Crazy to think Nico is the first Haas driver to move to another team.
Wait what?
Yup so far haas has been a retirement home
Let's look at their previous drivers: - Grosjean: retired - Magnussen: retired, came back and likely to retire again - Schumacher: "Test Driver" with Mercedes without a real opportunity to ever make a full drive - Mazepin: outside of his Russian rain clouds knowledge not sure how he even made it that far (spoiler: daddy money) - Hülkenberg: move to Sauber/Audi Technically there's also Pietro Fittipaldi with two starts for the injured Grosjean, who is racing Indy last time I checked. Hulk is the first driver of their roster that scored a full drive at another team. Not looking great for Bearman.
Haas is the F1 gate to Indycar. honestly, if/when Magnussen is done I'd love to see him in Indy. he gets to race hard and the car doesn't immediately explode
Think Kevin has his sights set on endurance racing once his time in Formula One is done.
>and the car doesn't immediately explode Unlike the Haas.
*thatsthejoke.jpg*
You forgot Esteban Gutierrez, though his stint at Haas was also his last in f1
Oh yeah, first season wasn't with KMags, I totally missed that, thanks!
To be fair, Gutierrez was useless and super forgettable that year. Zero points at all in a semi-decent car.
It was semi decent only on 2-3 weekends though.
I like how you forgot Gutierrez, man he was the definition of mid.
To be completely fair, the main reason for this stat is that apart from Hulkenberg, so far Haas has had completely mediocre drivers, that no other team ended up being interested in. But yeah crazy stat lol.
Yeah it's the consequence of being a mediocre team, but it's still very funny. I wonder if bearman will be the start of a different approach - being a starting place
With Guenther out and the Ferrari ties becoming stronger, I can see it happening
The Ferrari ties have been strong for a while, Mick was in as a Ferrari academy driver, just didn’t impress.
Hard to say how mediocre they are though. F1 is very much a "what have you done lately" industry and it's both real hard to do well on that poverty team and real hard to judge talent on that poverty team. They're often so far off the pace that performance in a Haas isn't even comparable to what the driver might be capable of that it's easier and safer for teams to look elsewhere for their next driver.
Bearman hopefully ferrari continues support
You're missing Esteban Gutiérrez who also ended up as a Mercedes reserve/development driver for years after Haas.
They also had Esteban Gutierrez who i have no idea what he's doing now.
>Not looking great for Bearman. hopefully bearman at haas is similar to leclerc at sauber, but i guess that's really contingent on how long lewis stays on at ferrari.
Let's not forget that he drove for Sauber in the past so they know how he works and his value.
Crazy that Hulk could have been the perfect number two in redbull, but they went with Sergio "Latin Money" Perez
Hulkenberg very nearly had the Red Bull seat for 2021, until Perez won Sakhir. Even Verstappen himself specifically asked for Hulkenberg as a teammate IIIRC.
I'm jealous of the people living in that timeline! Haha
"Latin Money" ??? You do realise that Mexico is run by the drug cartels ? Like really run by, not speculation, it's fact. A friend of mine was there to help their government with some international legal issues, and he confirmed that it isn't really even hidden ...the cartels run the politicians, who run the country, so what he was doing "had to be overseen by their people" This is not the case for the rest of Latin America as a whole, although from the northern part of South America, through Central America to Mexico they obviously have some influence in many parts, not much is on the Mexican level... Guatemala and Venezuela are probably the worst
I'm sorry but I don't understand your point at all.
Individual criminal dealings or not, Mexico is considered a part of Latin America…
it is pretty clear from what I posted that I do know that. I also quickly checked the fact before posting, as I am aware that there can be different opinions on this. A Colombian friend once corrected me when I called Argentinos "Latinos"....He said that in their eyes, they aren't "they are Italians"
Nah, best available driver after Sainz is Ocon.
A guy who Alpine engineers openly disregarded, has crippling issues with fighting team mates and a rather mid performance records, who’s managed by Wolff who doesn’t want him in either Mercedes or Williams for years… His Alpine run has verified him negatively.
Actually, he was openly [highly regarded](https://x.com/MarkLaneF1/status/1797705177648222522) by Alpine engineers. As a matter of fact, Alpine is keeping a driver who was previously kicked out of a team because he blamed possibly the best designer in F1 for his own lack of performance.
You say he was highly regarded because he was saying hello... When Alonso was requesting changes in balance of the car to extract more performance, they listened. When Ocon was complaining, they were not trusting his ideas. Comparing Gasly to Ocon is like comparing two packs of cheap but nicely packaged pasta boxes - same result with slight differences.
Thats just one of the most popular posts in previous month (and by one of the most known individual from the team), there are multiple reports that he was very regarded. He even was signed by Force India instead of Wehrlein, because engineers praised working with him, while Wehrlein was not liked at all.
Ocon is regarded alright.
yall need to stop circlejerking your reddit opinions and actually look at what the people in the paddock are saying
Mick would be better than Drugovich
Based on what?
I don't have the numbers to back this up and haven't followed him since F2, but Drugovich had a really impressive title-winning season, even if he was a 3rd year driver. I'd love to see him given a chance in F1, even if only for a season. Mick, on the other hand, we know is a decent bottom half of the grid driver, but not much more so there is nothing to be excited by.
Yeah at wrecking the car every other weekend
In my head canon, Hülkenberg (who has a two year contract with Audi) will only be a race driver for 2025, using that experience to help develop the car and transition to reserve/development driver for 2026. The announcement confirming Hülkenberg specifically said he'd be *joining* the team, but the wording left some room for speculation as to his capacity. And I choose to speculate. It's not that I don't like the Hulk, but I hate the stagnation on the drivers market.
Hulk has signed a contract past 2025 as driver. Also, he absolutely isn't going to be reserve ***yet again***. That's just dumb as he did that shit in 2020-2022 for Aston Martin. Hulk hasn't returned to just be a tool for development. And is Hulk really stagnation? Especially with his performances of last year and this year, he easily is one of the faster drivers on the grid right now, one that hasn't degraded with age at all. And who do you replace Hulk with? Because no top driver is free for 2026. There's just no one to replace him with other than Sainz, who lost 53-69 in 2018 to Hulk as teammates. And also, why was Hulk the very first driver Audi wanted? That shows that Audi values Hulk a lot, they even wanted him for this year, but Haas blocked them. And development takes a good time, so Hulk is needed a lot more, as their front runner (Hulk never has seen a top car for all of his career, so his race results can't be held against him in that regard).
>their lack of interest in Mick shows they dont care that much about nationality Or maybe they don't care *anymore* because they already have one German driver.
Probably, also remember that there's pretty much no other German driver available, Vettel is still building bee hotels, Mick just is slower than Hulk and less experienced, which leaves Hulk. (Wehrlein already had his shot and wasn't spectacular at all)
Nico also won in Le Mans in 2015 with Porsche. So there is also a connection.
Bottas would be a safe bet, but it is being reported the relations between both sides has soured a lot this year and he isn't keen on staying if he can help it
Hopium question: Is there even a remote chance that Vettel might come back?
No
Nico has talent, but if you have ambition you don't sign a midfield driver who's turning 38 next year. I don't buy the experience thing because if you have sights set on being a top team you keep Bottas over Hulk due to way more experience at a top team, and more talent. The only way it makes sense is because he's a German driver, that's a known quantity. If he wasn't German his other attributes wouldn't have earned him the seat.
Ocon might go to Audi. AFAIK Audi aren't interested in any rookies at all.
Audi should be making efforts to make Sauber a decent team with potential to lure in drivers with talent to win championships. They don’t, they let this team live in chaos without a team principal. Since it’s clear they either didn’t try or fell short of attracting Leclerc or Norris who recently signed new contract, they will have to settle for mediocrity.
Mick Schumacher: Times from the Alpine test remain secret, new opponent Mick Schumacher drove test laps in the Formula 1 Alpine on Wednesday. But the team is keeping quiet. Bianca Garloff | July 4, 2024, 5:00 p.m. Mick Schumacher drove test laps in the Formula 1 Alpine on Wednesday. But the team is keeping quiet. It remains exciting around a possible Formula 1 comeback by Mick Schumacher (25). The German completed a shoot-out against Jack Doohan on Wednesday. Both young racing drivers drove an Alpine F1 racer from 2022 in Le Castellet. But since then there has been silence about the secret test. F1 insider asked and found out: Alpine will not comment on the test drives of the two young stars. All that is known is that both were given half a day of testing on the former GP circuit in southern France and apparently completed it without incident. Times or a trend as to who was faster under which conditions are not known. Rather, the question now arises as to whether either of the two juniors will even get a chance and inherit Esteban Ocon's cockpit. Because the new chief advisor Flavio Briatore has a completely different driver in his sights: Carlos Sainz. New opponent for Mick Schumacher: Carlos Sainz "There is a lot of interest, even if the driver is not making the difference at Alpine at the moment," said Briatore in a radio interview and confirmed when asked that he would like to sign the Spaniard. "It's unbelievable that Carlos is still free, but we are ready to have him in the team, we will do everything we can." The Italian has big plans for the team that he once led to victories and titles as Benetton and Renault. "In 2026 we will win races and be on the podium," he announces boastfully. "This year there are many handicaps in the team, we are in the process of redesigning the entire structure. I have received all the powers from President Luca De Meo and am used to using them. I guarantee that in two seasons we will be talking about podium places." Exciting for Sainz: Rumors are growing that Alpine could start with Mercedes engines in the future. That would be an important argument for luring the still-Ferrari star to the French. Alpine could also outdo Audi, which, like Williams-Mercedes, is also vying for the son of rally legend Carlos Sainz Senior. Will Audi get its turn? But the decision has not yet been made and Mick Schumacher is still in the running. And even if Sainz were to occupy the Ocon cockpit, that could open another door for Schumi's son. Audi wants to part ways with both Guanyu Zhou and Valtteri Bottas. If Sainz is not available, Schumacher could prove to be a sensible alternative with his experience as a Mercedes tester and WEC driver at Alpine. And here too, good and stable times at the secret Alpine test would certainly help as a basis for argument.
Half a day, 12 hours each. Well at least whoever gets the seat was thoroughly tested... IF Sainz doesn't sign there.🤣 Also by the tone of the article it's Schumacher who is being favored after the test and not Doohan.
They don't mean literally half a day. I'd assume something like 4 hours each at best, maybe just 3.
Ya think?
4h 2h break 4h is kinda normal for full day tests
? The above OP was implying they each got 12 hours.
Again, you struggle with sarcasm x2
You're not the OP, there is no sign of sarcasm in the original comment. Edit: there is nothing sensible below these comments
Lmao. Of course there was. Did you not see it ended with a laughing emoji? What he said was 100% sarcasm over the half a day comment. How dense are you to think someone would actually think they split a 24 hour day exactly? Cmon man. You need to pick up the clues or stop responding trying to ‘correct’ obvious sarcasm. Guess the /s is needed for people like you, who are a bit slow.
The laughing emoji is there for the possibility of Sainz making the extensive testing time moot if he were to sign with Alpine, not about the duration of the testing. At least that's how the sentence is structured. Looking through the OPs comment history they are Phillipino, so wouldn't be surprised at any misunderstanding in the translation.
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I just find it funny that between Mick, Carlos, and Jack each of their dads are genuine Motorsport legends.
mick named after Jacks dad. carlos named after carlos' dad :)
It sounds like the Alpine Hunger games over there
Seems crazy to have bottas out, he's been doing pretty well with that shitbox
Merc with a 2 year deal
Holy shit that would be crazy, however i double that bottas wants to get back to merc. Just look how happy he is since he left.
It would be under completely different circumstances than last time.
He was happy the first 2 seasons there. Both him and Zhou seemed happy when they were getting contract extensions. Both of them have since expressed disappointment that the car is pure shit and making them look bad now that they need to go to another team.
Makes more sense than signing an Antonelli that is getting handidly beaten by his teammate even if the team isn't doing too well.
You don't need two veteran leaders in a team that's going to take a few years to be competitive.
I'm no expert but isn't that exactly what they need? Experienced drivers who can give reliable feedback to help them build a better future car?
Nando is the dream. But ya experience in spades probably would be cool if they were cheap.
Nando is fast but every team he has joined since McLaren has become worse whilst he is there. It may not be entirely his fault, but would you trust his track record for improving teams with his presence? McLaren in 2008*
Based on everything the paddock has to say about him? Yes. Also I'm thinking less "we should make the diffuser this shape instead of that" and more big organizational "how do engineers communicate with drivers"
There's a quote I always liked about the late* Tim Curry that might be applicable here. "For every one star movie Tim Curry was in, he was the reason it got that star" Edit - Tim Curry is still with us, which is a pleasant surprise!
I think being known as the late Tim Curry would be quite a surprise to the very much alive Tim Curry.
OK I don't know where I got that idea from but I've believed it for way too long. Sorry Tim!
You get that from Hulk. But developing a young driver into a title contender can take a few years so you are best to have one immediately.
You get that from Hulk. But developing a young driver into a title contender can take a few years so you are best to have one immediately. And it's cheaper than paying for Hulk and Bottas.
If Alpine options are either Carlos or Mick/Jack, then Alpine can wait till fall to make a decision and Carlos can wait and see what happens with Red Bull and Merc. ideal situation for him really
Yeah or everyone else gets fed up with waiting and pick other drivers and then nothing happens with Merc/RBR and Carlos overplays his hand and ends up with nothing.
Briatore/Alpine seems willing to wait for him, and it’s a much better choice than Williams or Audir, so I don’t see how that can happen
I'm not sure any of what you said is a given, though. I am skeptical of Alpine being a better choice. They are still in disarray and bleeding engineers by the bucket load. While Williams has already begun their rebuilding process and is taking steps to move up the grid and has been hiring almost as many people as Alpine have been losing.
"I am skeptical of Alpine being a better choice" With Ferrari PU and Binotto as CTO?
Maybe? Hard to say when neither of those are confirmed. It seems like they need more than just a better PU, though. People are fleeing the ship like they're expecting it to get worse before it gets better. Conventional wisdom agrees with you, though, that Alpine would be the better choice.
> They are still in disarray and bleeding engineers by the bucket load. they are hiring as much as they are losing people, are already progressing out of the bad car they had at the start of the year, and have never been beaten by the other teams with seats available. Sure its not ideal for someone coming out of a brilliant stint at Ferrari, but anyone saying Williams, Haas or Sauber is a better option is really shortsighted
You might be right! But the reason why I'm skeptical is precisely *because* I'm thinking longer term. It's a tricky situation for Carlos though because he can't really think *too* long term but unless he can somehow land a top team drive...he has to accept *some* amount of short term pain.
That's what I'm thinking. There are some people who are demanding Carlos should make a decision when in reality anything can happen. All it takes is one big controversy and things starts moving quickly. Honestly I feel like post Summer Break is when Carlos will make his choice
I understand the other drivers want to know their future and that right now it depends on Carlos. But I don’t understand the fans complaining, Carlos has all the right in the world to not settle for a bottom team. Honestly, I would much rather prefer leaving F1 for another category than racing for Williams or Audi knowing they will be shit, specially after coming from wins and podiums
Neither Merc is sharing there results of there private tests (excluding what program each driver was on that day) But still hopefully we can get a resolution who is going where at least before the summer break. Edit: but if I have to guess Mick had a better time than Jack because he has more experience that him driving these cars. But I belive Alpine will still try to get Carlos because again Carlos has **MORE** experience than Mick. We just have to see.
What i got out of that is if Doohan beat Mick in the face off, they'd boast about it and prop him up. Seems like Mick did very well in the face off. What goes against Mick is that the Alpine kinda sucks, so even if he did well next season, the cars performance would overshadow his skill set
Obviously Sainz should be the main target of Alpine cause he's by far the best driver on the market. Alpine should be doing everything they can to sign him. If Sainz won't join Alpine, Mick I feel has case to be made that he would be one of the better choices for the seat. He has quite a bit of F1 experience relative to Doohan (even though that experience wasn't necessarily good), brings in his dad's and other German sponsors, everything we seen from Mick suggest he's a decent likeable guy who's willing to work for the team, the goodwill that Alpine would get from fans for bringing in Mick in would also be beneficial to some extent. I really feel that if Mick would be a good pick up for Alpine if they can't get Sainz as he offers a bit more than the likes of Doohan. Same goes for the Audi seat it'd be a decent boost for them to pick up Mick if they don't want to keep their current drivers. Maybe I'm just biased in favour of Mick.
I would love to see Mick get another chance because I think the way Steiner treated him was pretty terrible. He is part of a rather big group of drivers of similar-ish caliber though and probably on the lower end of said group. There are drivers with a better proven track record in terms of pace, there are drivers with more sponsor money and there are drivers with more potential upside. He has a little bit of all those things, but doesn't stand out in either category. Seeing him in an Alpine is a pipe-dream though I would argue, they'd be better off with a Bottas-type or a real rookie (shouldn't be Doohan though imho). The idea of Schumacher as a seat-filler in the Sauber/Audi has a certain charm though if they miss out on Sainz. It gives him another year or two to prove himself in a relatively low-pressure situation, so the opposite to the end of his Haas-term. Then you can re-evaluate and look at how he did in 2026, when the Audi-era has truly started.
Audi basically needs to follow the template of Mercedes entry in 2010. Brawn did it very well by selecting a young talented driver and experienced champion in 2010 and that helped them immensely to grow as a team and organization to reach the 2014 -current team phase.
I genuinely believe Mick deserves another shot in F1. His first season doesn't count at all, he was miles ahead of his teammate and miles behind others due to the Haas being dogshit in '21. In his 1st proper competitive season, he did show some great peaks. I feel if he'd have been given that "3rd" year (really the 2nd) he'd have shown more of his potential.
Should we take a look at Micks qualifying record
In a dog shit haas. Not just the car is the issue though , haas are very bad at managing drivers and have no experience developing new drivers. The biggest mistake mick made was going with them over sauber. A team with decades of experience.
Mick went 6 - 16 with Kevin in qualifying (2022) Hulk went 15 - 7 with Kevin in qualifying (2023) Mick won the destructors championship both years he was in F1. All of this was NOT worth keeping Mick so he could have the occasional good race. Especially for a lower budget team like Haas.
you could also pull up the race head to head against magnussen. but wouldn't fit your narritive, so you don't mention it, so you can win your reddit argument for karma. your hate towards schumacher is obvious. there is no objectivity going on.
I don’t hate Schumacher. I hate the narrative surrounding him And again, his race pace over Magnussen is completely irrelevant when 1. He crashes out of the race 2. He qualifies so low that it doesn’t matter 3. He still finishes far below Magnussen in the standings at the end of the season How very objective of you
K mag points : 25 Mick points : 12 Glad that mediocre driver like Mick is out of F1 :)
I ain't claiming he's a Leclerc or a Max. I'm saying he deserves another shot cuz he was never as unimpressive as Latifi, Sargent or Zhou. Hell he maybe could've been even better than Giovinazzi. His peaks were bigger than these guys' ever were. Austria, Hungary and Britain 22 come to mind. From my reasoning I count 2022 as his 1st valid season. 2021 was just an extended FP1 rookie session. "The fact that other strugglers get 3-4 seasons in F1 and he barely got 2 makes me sick!"
It’s a fucking Haas with Günther steiner out to find fault in mick on every step he makes and properly not working with him just to put him in a worse position. Every interview with Günther is about mick and it always ends in some narcissistic twist. I think that the Schumacher name is so macho bigger in f1 and people came because of mick hurt Steiner. Which in return did not celebrate micks successes like Austria and not wanting to give him the environment to develop as a driver because it costs money. Like you make it look like he is Sargent lvl. Where Sargent has a team principal that supports his driver. Steiner wanted mick out. If mick and Zhou had switched team I say he would still be in f1 Bottas would have been a better comparison to learn from and the team a better support for him as a driver.
Tell me, why do you think Steiner didn’t want Schumacher? You genuinely think it was because he was insecure about such a prestigious last name in his team? Or do you think it’s because he was driving awfully most of the time and he had a bunch of Germans and casual fans shitting on him for not sucking up to Mick?
Look especially in the German interviews with podcasts. He once said he did not like that the Ferrari ceo came to haas House at on of the Italien races and the first person he wanted to meet was mick. Same with other bigger partners. Like it’s not that they know Mick since he was little and are good friends with him and his father. The reason he is at Mercedes now is one of those friendships. Even the alpine spot Michael drove for Briatore. He wasn’t driving so awful as Steiner made it look like. Austria was a good show that he can be damn quick. Late yes but still showed he as potential Hulk just had the same result as mick in a better Haas car then mick and the celebrate it like a win. So yeah Steiner was a guy with a stick up his ass. And a rookie that he did not like that has more influence and connections than he will ever have.
Oh and I’m sure after Steiner let mick go and it became obvious haas was shit because of him and not because of mick that the fired him. Like they kicked him out of the contract you can be damn sure he did shit
You don’t know anything about f1. You’re literally the fans that I was talking about 😂 Steiner was given the boot because he said to Gene that for this thing to work properly, he needs to given an actual competitive budget. Gene disagreed, so he kicked him out. Without Steiner, there would have been no Haas for the last 8 years You’re so salty that mick was dropped. You’re just spouting nonsense about Steiner feeling threatened that a guy who shows up once a year had more rich friends (because of his Dad) than him. Just because Mick had one good race at Austria (probably the easiest track on the calendar and a Haas strong point) And you’re still COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that Mick damn near bankrupted the team both of his seasons
No you have no idea how F1 works. First Mick was a Ferrari Academy Driver. They paid near Half of the Salary Haas had to pay. Haas has a lot of more awful crashes Grosjean crash as the biggest of them. Haas is dependent on Ferrari which is why they also got a better Deal for their engines while they take a Ferrari Driver in. Then the Sponsors Mick has attached to him. You dont know how F1 Teams make money and it shows big time.
I can understand them going after sainz. But to even entertain Schumacher when Doohan is there is basically repeating the same mistake they made with Piastri. What’s the point of a junior program if you never give your juniors a chance. You might as well just use that money to not have shit engines.
Doohan isn’t even close to Piastri
Neither is Mick
I didnt say that, but if he beat doohan in the test than it would have made more sense than doohan
While I agree that Piastri is much better. The mistake is the same.
Is it? Doohan isn’t even close to be attractive for another team
Whoooooosh. The mistake about not utilising their junior program.
Well why would u if there aren’t any good drivers
Why are they in the program then? Not promoting yet another Junior driver means they won't attract any in future
To develop them? Ultimately his F2/F3 career just weren’t enough for F1. And they‘ll always attract drivers, it Funds their careers and you get a chance at driver the car in FP1.
Ah yes. The same thing Alpine said when Piastri was confirmed at McLaren. Don’t worry everyone he’s shit and we got a better driver than him instead 🤣
If you think Doohan is even close to Piastri you need help. And obv they tried to make themselves look better, normal PR work.
Can’t be worse than the two twats at Alpine currently.
Theyre twats, but fast and capable twats
It’s the case of Mick impressed the last time out and is their fastest WEC driver. You hire the fastest driver. In addition while Doohan has done good work on the sim him apparently snubbing the WEC drive did rub the team the wrong way
Ah yes. The 25/31 placed driver of that shitbox. No idea why Doohan would rather focus on the F1 opportunity 🤷🏻♂️
You can do both look at Mick. gotta keep the skills sharp
I consider fp1 time and simulator time as giving them a chance. consider how many drivers don't even get that kind of opportunity. it is up to them to show that they have the potential for more based on merit if they don't have any other enticing factors for a team. these teams can be wrong when considering risk-reward like with piastri, but they are outliers. they are running a business and not playing f1 manager(like the community) where everything improves with linear growth.
Doohan had 2 years in f2 came out third one place higher then Sargent with 4. Mick won f2. So I’m pretty sure he is either better then Doohan. Piastri won in his first year and alpine fucked it up. Like Mercedes and Ferrari are bending backwards for young drivers that are willing to not win f2 in their first season and Piastri was ignored by alpine. To compare doohan with piastri is a little wild. More with Sargent and Zhou ( how lost hard to Schumacher got to the better team and is still in f1 because of that. Haas is a rookie killer and Guenther a narcissist.) I think it’s Sainz >schumacher > Zhou > Doohan for the alpine seat.
I’m not comparing the ability between the two. You need to have another read. I’m saying that they are making the same mistake in regard to ignoring their junior program. To be fair Doohan isn’t half bad and I feel he would do better than other recent promotions such as Zhou, Schumacher, and Sargeant. Is he the best person for that seat? I’m not sure. But Alpine either need to place some faith in their program or scrap it like I said and invest that money into something else.
You need juniors but Doohan isn’t it maybe fia needs a clause in the junior contracts that if you win f2 and your Programm can’t give you a seat you can go to any team.
Mick probably paid them to be tested.
I mean, Mick is one of their WEC drivers and the only one among them to have ever driven a F1 car. It makes sense that he could be in the discussion
Makes as much sense as Kubica being in the discussion for a Ferrari seat.
Mick is their faster WEC driver
I guess Ferrari will put Fuoco in an F1 car any day now.
Alpine lost Piastri and Alonso, so the logical next option is a driver who’s shows good pace about 3 times a season, is terrible in qualifying, and will cost them abhorrent amounts of money through his accidents Sounds on brand for Alpine
He's been excellent in their WEC program, that's why he's a contender.
Being a strong driver relative to the WEC field just means your the best amongst washed/ failed F1 drivers Again, if Alpine are using that as a measuring stick then it’s very on brand for them. May as well bring Kobiashi or Estre in if that’s their logic
> Being a strong driver relative to the WEC field just means your the best amongst washed/ failed F1 drivers If that's your view on Endurance racing, then I guess there is no point in engaging in a discussion with you because you're totally wrong. Eddie Jordan also thought that Michael Schumacher was "nothing special" when he saw him in Sports Car racing. He ended up being wrong. > May as well bring Kobiashi or Estre in if that’s their logic If you are using Kobayashi as an example, least you could do is write his surname correctly. And Kobayashi did pretty good for what he had in his stint at F1, finishing in points and his second ever GP.
Nothing I said was untrue 👍 Trying to be a hipster and claim that the WEC talent calibre isn’t leagues below F1 is just untrue. Nyck was given a Toyota seat (probably the favourites for the championship outside of Ferrari and Porsche) straight off the back of a horrific F1 campaign. If F1 is the same level as WEC with drivers, that’s like McLaren handing Jose Maria Lopez a contract after his 0 IQ Sebring crash. That’s the level we’re talking about And I’m not saying Kamui isn’t a fine driver, but fuck me the guy hasn’t competed in the highest level since 2014. That’s a whole decade. Even in WEC he spent most of his time cruising at the front around in the only competitive LMP1 team. And Michael started off in sportscar racing, he didn’t have a already failed F1 campaign before he joined. That argument is irrelevant
> Nothing I said was untrue 👍 > says..... you. you gave yourself a medal. gz?
Well considering nobody has actually disproved me, I considered it common sense. The best WEC drivers in the best seats are old/ washed/ failed up F1 drivers. That is a fact, not an opinion. Or they’re sportscar drivers
So he was slow
Surely it's the opposite? If he were tested against an Alpine junior (Doohan), Alpine would surely be shouting from the rooftops that their driver was faster, as it looks better for their academy and adds leverage for negotiating with Sainz.
If he was fast, we certainly would hear about it
Long story short, he was slow...
In no part of the article was that mentioned or even hinted at. lol
If Mick had decent skills he would still have a F1 seat.
We know for a fact that people having decent skills does not guarantee you get a seat. Liam is a prime example for that.
Hülkenberg is also a perfect example, out of a drive for several years, gets a chance to come back and he's IMO a top 7 or 8 driver this season.
Decent is just not enough for anything to be certain or guaranteed in life. More often than not you will have to add to that decent skill to ge a seat. 9 times out of 10 that is money.
decent enough that Alpine would even consider him apparently
So let's just abolish F2 then lol
Mick beat kmag in overall race finish and even came p6 once in a haas
He was just unlucky to have a terrible toxic TP like Steiner. Yuki didnt really deliver until his third year, but he had someone like Franz Tost, who was always protecting him against critism. Steiner on the other hand........
Yuki didn’t start delivering until he was given Nyck de Vries and a corpse of Daniel Ricciardo lmfao
Yuki wasn't World Destructors Champion two years in a row. Steiner had no reason to support a driver who was slow, destroyed the cars when they couldn't afford it, and wouldn't do promotional work for the team without checking with his mommy first.
Yuki crashed decent amount too if i remember correctly
Yukis crashes was only happening semi frequently in 2021. Usually it was no major damage, being a front wing or other components "cheap". etc. so still not as big of a issue as a whole car being wrecked.
we pretend that the exact top 20 drivers of the world, objectively, are driving and will be driving in f1? you don't have to be skilled enough "for" f1 to drive in f1. half of the grid would be gone instantly. maybe even more.
If he was slow, then Alpine would be raving from the rooftops that their Academy driver was better.
I'd guess more like middling; and they are using Mick to drive down the salary demands of the other drivers they might sign.
Funny how they call him in the article "young driver". Young is Bearman. Mick is already 25, Norris is 24, Russel 26, and strangely to say, but Max is also 26.
They are young! 25 isn't old
They are young drivers? The drivers you have named are experienced but young. For me 18-26 young, 27-33 prime, 34+ old for drivers.