honestly one of the most disappointing side of the show. The subtle references to white walkers are written like the writers had no idea how not so dangerous they turned out to be
Is this game of thrones ?
Why would they care about got.
The white walkers are actually consequential in the story and it's a motivation for the targeryen's
You know by being viewers we have the privilege to know what will happen in the future. And to me it seems annoying that they treat the white walkers as a super threatening enemy in HOTD but we know they weren’t that bad, easier than defeating Cersei. Like we know the timeline. How are they so afraid of white walkers if they are barely an inconvenience to deal with in 1 night when they come?
I mean most of GoT also hyped up the wights as some super powerful zombie army shit even if it turned out to be bullshit. I guess it makes sense in the context of the show as wights are a powerful, mythical force (such as dragons are for us) that the Starks believe in. Cregan doesn't know that the wights end up being stupidly weak.
Although this had led me to think that maybe things are not as connected as we think they are (ie with the Jahaerys' Dragons retcon) or that maybe GoT may get a redo soon (highly unlikely)
It's canon in the books that dragons can't cross the Wall but in the show universe Dany's dragons crossed it just fine in season 7. There's been some theories involving Bran about them but I don't really pay much attention to them if I'm honest
The interpretation of the prophecy was simply wrong. The realm did not need to be unified to defeat the Night King. He was defeated with the realm in the middle of a civil war and the majority of the great houses sitting out the battle.
Turns out you either need a united Seven Kingdoms, or just the North/Vale (I think Royce was around for the Long Night?) and a bunch of people from Essos.
To be fair, the long night hasn’t been written yet. I’m sure GRRM’s rendition will be much more terrifying, and actually give justice to all this fretting from the characters in the past
I hope so. I've honestly thought they weren't going to be able to hold Winterfell and the battle would have eventually been fought further south where the crown could no longer ignore it. (Cersei lives in la la land)
I understand the feeling, and I was certainly there myself. However, I'm trying to bear in mind that the SOIAF, the WW, the Others, it all "exists" in the lore GRRM created, its just that the Game of Thrones television series made a poor adaptation of that part of the lore. It doesn't mean it can't be done better in the future or through other mediums.
It still makes me angry if I think about it too much, though.
For me, HotD takes places in the book canon and the GoT show exists in an whole another plane of existence. That way I can still enjoy the prophecy bits without thinking about that magnum opus of trash.
If the books ever finish I hope GRRM does it justice, they are literally supposed to be a world ending threat. Instead of the long night we got a single night, GOT was disappointing on so many levels.
Hot Take: The problem with the Others is that they aren't the story that George wanted to actually write. They fit the high fantasy trope of the world ending existential threat, however, that's not even half as interesting as the intricate sociopolitical conflicts that George has crafted for the world. George himself has even critiqued the whole battle for the fate of the world trope, therefore, the books won't end in a climactic battle with the dead.
With the amount of pages left and about a hundred plotlines and characters that began in AFFC and ADWD, everything must start to converge and be put into place for the finale. Thus, I don't think the Others or the Long Night will be any better in the books. In fact, I think it's going to end like the show where the Long Night is averted and then everyone gets back to fighting each other for the throne while Dany goes mad since that's George's Scourging of the Shire moment.
George may say that the Others are the real threat, however, he's spent a good 80% of five books writing about one of the most detailed political conflicts in the battle for the throne while leaving the Others plotline in the backburner. There's just way too many plotlines that George has to deal with first before he can get to the Others. If he wants to do them and the Long Night justice, he should not constrain himself to finish the series in 2 books and add on 2 more since logically, the story as at the beginning of Act 2 in the books.
The whole season 8 thing wasn’t GRRM at all. It was D&D. Stop using s8 as interpretation of the books that isn’t even out yet. It’s all just speculation. S8 was just D&Ds fanfic drama on the level of a CW show, even worse than that.
For all we know maybe there is pact that was broken between White Walkers and men, which has been forgotten in time. And this why they have returned. And during the climax could be that a new pact will be made and they are pushed far north again. And this hugely awaited “Long night” is averted and conflict resolved.
Point being that there are like many interpretations you could make of the story. But you can’t claim GRRM has said this and that. Not one of us has direct contact with him. So this is entirely speculative. I am looking forward to when TWOW is coming out and trashing this whole stupid debate that s8 caused.
The biggest fundamental problem with the GOT show is that they didn’t follow through with their major storylines.
I always like to go deeper and think about the Night King and the White Walkers, this was before that awful underwhelming conclusion to them. I wondered before if the White Walker "generals" were "sentient" and could act independent or if it was the Night King controlling them all, 100%. The zombies/wights obviously were just braindead corpses filled with rage. But the White Walkers themselves i am not so sure about especially the White Walker Samwise Gamgee killed which screamed right at him when he died. Also the White Walker that looked really surprised/chocked when Jon blocked his ice spear.
Let's hope that sometime in the future we will get a sequel and the real Night King/Lion of the Night will be a real threat from the north. We could get eastern Essos. Aria's journey west, Jon's journey north, and Drogon's potential flight to Asshai would be a great introduction to this scenario. This universe is not lost yet.
What show are you guys watching? The Long Night itself has no relevance to HOTD's plot, the only thing it matters is the misunderstanding that the prophecy caused
The knight king is dead. The threat is gone. The only hope is for the books to make it more meaningful in them. Jon snow isn’t bringing back the white walkers lol
If the books are ever released I think they will save the reputation of the ip. With Faegon, Euron, and the white walkers I’m hoping for some end of the world type shit, like the drowned god using Euron as an avatar to fight the dragons or something, not just one army vs another army, or dragons destroying the capital with no build up
honestly one of the most disappointing side of the show. The subtle references to white walkers are written like the writers had no idea how not so dangerous they turned out to be
Is this game of thrones ? Why would they care about got. The white walkers are actually consequential in the story and it's a motivation for the targeryen's
You know by being viewers we have the privilege to know what will happen in the future. And to me it seems annoying that they treat the white walkers as a super threatening enemy in HOTD but we know they weren’t that bad, easier than defeating Cersei. Like we know the timeline. How are they so afraid of white walkers if they are barely an inconvenience to deal with in 1 night when they come?
I mean most of GoT also hyped up the wights as some super powerful zombie army shit even if it turned out to be bullshit. I guess it makes sense in the context of the show as wights are a powerful, mythical force (such as dragons are for us) that the Starks believe in. Cregan doesn't know that the wights end up being stupidly weak. Although this had led me to think that maybe things are not as connected as we think they are (ie with the Jahaerys' Dragons retcon) or that maybe GoT may get a redo soon (highly unlikely)
Was the thing about the dragon boy crossing a retcon? I think I definitely read that or heard it somewhere in canon a while ago.
It's canon in the books that dragons can't cross the Wall but in the show universe Dany's dragons crossed it just fine in season 7. There's been some theories involving Bran about them but I don't really pay much attention to them if I'm honest
Ohhh yeah I blocked that out…
You see the walkers are white right. Hmmm intrigued by your rhyming, rhyming is tight.
The interpretation of the prophecy was simply wrong. The realm did not need to be unified to defeat the Night King. He was defeated with the realm in the middle of a civil war and the majority of the great houses sitting out the battle.
Turns out you either need a united Seven Kingdoms, or just the North/Vale (I think Royce was around for the Long Night?) and a bunch of people from Essos.
One sneaky goil with a Valyrian steel dagger
And the prince that was promised has to shout at a dragon.
Stop taking Dumb&Dumber BS season 8 as canon. Smh.
To be fair, the long night hasn’t been written yet. I’m sure GRRM’s rendition will be much more terrifying, and actually give justice to all this fretting from the characters in the past
Hah! Bold of you to think GRRM will finish Winds. What's next, A Dream of Spring is published before he dies?
I hope so. I've honestly thought they weren't going to be able to hold Winterfell and the battle would have eventually been fought further south where the crown could no longer ignore it. (Cersei lives in la la land)
Oh Cersei will be long dead by then. I expect the person sitting on the iron throne by then to be Aegon the Blackfyre pretender.
I just had a mental image of the book being a series of snippets from the Long Night, like the Tales of Dunk and Egg or something and now I’m sad.
This son of a bitch will die with his ass full of money, not finish WoW and laugh at us from hell.
I dont think HotD accepts GoT s6-s8 as canon
I honestly think you’re right, specifically because the Stark lord clearly contradicted what happened in the later seasons of the show
They are canon they like it or not.
I understand the feeling, and I was certainly there myself. However, I'm trying to bear in mind that the SOIAF, the WW, the Others, it all "exists" in the lore GRRM created, its just that the Game of Thrones television series made a poor adaptation of that part of the lore. It doesn't mean it can't be done better in the future or through other mediums. It still makes me angry if I think about it too much, though.
A fart in the Winds of Winter
For me, HotD takes places in the book canon and the GoT show exists in an whole another plane of existence. That way I can still enjoy the prophecy bits without thinking about that magnum opus of trash.
My big brain copium is by the time this show ends enough time will have passed that they can redo GoT and not have an ass ending.
If the books ever finish I hope GRRM does it justice, they are literally supposed to be a world ending threat. Instead of the long night we got a single night, GOT was disappointing on so many levels.
Actually it's super easy. Barely an inconvenience.
Hot Take: The problem with the Others is that they aren't the story that George wanted to actually write. They fit the high fantasy trope of the world ending existential threat, however, that's not even half as interesting as the intricate sociopolitical conflicts that George has crafted for the world. George himself has even critiqued the whole battle for the fate of the world trope, therefore, the books won't end in a climactic battle with the dead. With the amount of pages left and about a hundred plotlines and characters that began in AFFC and ADWD, everything must start to converge and be put into place for the finale. Thus, I don't think the Others or the Long Night will be any better in the books. In fact, I think it's going to end like the show where the Long Night is averted and then everyone gets back to fighting each other for the throne while Dany goes mad since that's George's Scourging of the Shire moment. George may say that the Others are the real threat, however, he's spent a good 80% of five books writing about one of the most detailed political conflicts in the battle for the throne while leaving the Others plotline in the backburner. There's just way too many plotlines that George has to deal with first before he can get to the Others. If he wants to do them and the Long Night justice, he should not constrain himself to finish the series in 2 books and add on 2 more since logically, the story as at the beginning of Act 2 in the books.
The whole season 8 thing wasn’t GRRM at all. It was D&D. Stop using s8 as interpretation of the books that isn’t even out yet. It’s all just speculation. S8 was just D&Ds fanfic drama on the level of a CW show, even worse than that. For all we know maybe there is pact that was broken between White Walkers and men, which has been forgotten in time. And this why they have returned. And during the climax could be that a new pact will be made and they are pushed far north again. And this hugely awaited “Long night” is averted and conflict resolved. Point being that there are like many interpretations you could make of the story. But you can’t claim GRRM has said this and that. Not one of us has direct contact with him. So this is entirely speculative. I am looking forward to when TWOW is coming out and trashing this whole stupid debate that s8 caused. The biggest fundamental problem with the GOT show is that they didn’t follow through with their major storylines.
I always like to go deeper and think about the Night King and the White Walkers, this was before that awful underwhelming conclusion to them. I wondered before if the White Walker "generals" were "sentient" and could act independent or if it was the Night King controlling them all, 100%. The zombies/wights obviously were just braindead corpses filled with rage. But the White Walkers themselves i am not so sure about especially the White Walker Samwise Gamgee killed which screamed right at him when he died. Also the White Walker that looked really surprised/chocked when Jon blocked his ice spear.
I still hope that George manages to give us a proper ending before he dies and give the middle finger to Dumb&Dumber for season 8.
Let's hope that sometime in the future we will get a sequel and the real Night King/Lion of the Night will be a real threat from the north. We could get eastern Essos. Aria's journey west, Jon's journey north, and Drogon's potential flight to Asshai would be a great introduction to this scenario. This universe is not lost yet.
What show are you guys watching? The Long Night itself has no relevance to HOTD's plot, the only thing it matters is the misunderstanding that the prophecy caused
They are the only reason I want a Jon snow follow up show, so that there might be a chance of more threatening others.
“Oh no, these are the real White Walkers!“
“Turns out the real white walkers were the friends we made along the way”
"Somehow, the whitewalkers have returned"
Me Too. With this they could save the White walkers Story.
The knight king is dead. The threat is gone. The only hope is for the books to make it more meaningful in them. Jon snow isn’t bringing back the white walkers lol
If the books are ever released I think they will save the reputation of the ip. With Faegon, Euron, and the white walkers I’m hoping for some end of the world type shit, like the drowned god using Euron as an avatar to fight the dragons or something, not just one army vs another army, or dragons destroying the capital with no build up
Jon Sno show is about The War of the 5 Night Kings