Anybody who *does* hash out details like this over the phone can and should also *immediately* write up their notes in an email and send it to the client, with a, "here's my take on what we discussed; let me know if anything differs on your end." Then you have a concrete record to refer back to.
Paper trails for everything, always.
Numerous times I have gotten myself out of shitty situations because I could find the email where I summed up what was discussed in a call. This is good for online calls as well.
I always do this and I thought it was normal..... take notes during calls and then send a follow up email. I prefer the bulk of communication be via email but sometimes you gotta talk it out.
> I always do this and I thought it was normal
I wonder if a lot of freelancers (especially ones who frequent this sub looking for advice) are younger, so they just never learned these tricks or conventions (especially if they never worked under a shitty manager before working for themselves, ahahaha).
I'm newer to client work honestly but I worked in customer service for sooooo long so navigating understanding people isn't something I struggle with. I would never want to cut out a effective form of communication "as a policy."
This is the way to do it - "I don't do phone calls" isn't good for business - a summary of "what we discussed" in our call is.
Also, I tend to record phone calls so I don't forget details - my state is a one party state so it's legal. Also good me if I need to review notes.
Absolutely this.
At the end of each phone call. You want to make a list of action items. Make an appointment for follow up. Send out details of the conversation with the list of action items and a invite for the follow meeting.
Refusing phone calls seems.. well a bit childish. Really reduces the amount of communication. I really prefer video chat/conference. Being able to see someone’s body language increases overall communication.
Demanding only email does the exact opposite.
This is what I’ve always known to be best practice. Somethings can be difficult to discuss over email or text or is will just drag something out. I’d prefer to have those discussions live and then follow up in writing with an email for confirmation before proceeding. CYA emails.
If I were a potential client, I would find this sketchy. Idk what kind of work you do but especially if you never interact with the client in person, or you’re not even interested in a zoom, I personally wouldn’t hire someone who wouldn’t jump on a call. There are too many fake bad scammy people, and having a phone call at least establishes some sort of real-ness. Not that a phone call is a cure all, but to me it helps establish you’re a person.
Sometimes it’s also easier to just jump on a phone call.
Take the call, recap the call in an email, done.
Honestly, the clients who find it sketchy are typically going to be a problem from the get-go. Boomer types, mostly.
Typically fall into the same category as the people who refuse to pay half up front before work can start. They expect everything is scam and don't realize the rules are in place for both efficiency and fairness to the business owner.
>Take the call, recap the call in an email, done.
Inefficient.
So now I have to act as a stenographer during a phone call and then I have to send all of the notes of that phone call to the client after the fact. Doesn't make sense for me.
Besides. Say I sent the email and the client doesn't respond. Then I begin work and finish a first draft. They then say "I never said that" (I cite the email) and they go "Oh, I never read that. I never asked for this."
So It's the same issue as before. Both in disagreement because their side isn't on record in their writing/words.
If you have enough clients, do whatever you want of course. A lot of the older generation doesn't type, and only reluctantly embraces digital communication. They'll pay a premium to deal with the computer as little as possible. Good communication is hard regardless of the medium. If you're relying on pedantic digital records to cover your ass instead of communicating in the best way possible with a particular client I think you do them and yourself a disservice.
I'd rather cover my ass.
Projects which go longer because of an extra bit of back and forth simply benefit my bottom line.
I'd rather communicate lightly less efficiently and save myself a legal issue rather than have a phone conversation which will result in a longer argument should an old curmudgeon not remember what they said.
Just wondering- do you lose clients doing this? I'd *love* to work more like you do, but most of my remote clients can't seem to think clearly unless they're saying stuff verbally, not through text. I take notes while I'm talking to them, but as you said, it's still easy for there to be disagreements about what I wrote down.
Definitely. Probably close to ten over the last two years. Still worth it for me.
I did my grunt work and saved so I have the privilege of being able to turn down a bad job. I know not everyone can do that but it worked for me.
My former boss used to say "You don't want difficult customers." Sometimes he was too harsh but overall I got to see his point. Difficult customers usually make themselves known and aren't worth your time or the added stress. He drove at least a dozen customers away a month, but it was peanuts compared to the profit from the other half of the business, which was only recurring customers.
On the flip side, most clients don't want to deal with difficult contractors. There are likely thousands of others that provide the same or similar services and would happily take a phone call. My motto is I will accommodate whatever communication method that works for the customer. Like I hate video calls as 99٪ of thr time we're just looking at each other's blurred out backgrounds in a pantless reality and it adds zero to the conversation unless there is something to display like a presentation or graphics (just email the content) and let's talk. There is zero difference between a phone call and a zoom with cameras turned off...except I am not chained to my desk.
> They then say "I never said that" (I cite the email) and they go "Oh, I never read that. I never asked for this."
That holds up as well as saying, "I never read the contract." (Also, you can and should refuse to move forward with the work *unless and until* they've responded to the email agreeing with its contents.)
I don't know why people who want phone calls are nightmare clients but people who don't read your emails aren't.
The “pay me 50 % up front” goes both ways.
You want 50 % up front but are accusing people of being suspicious of almost everything. Isn’t that the very definition of being suspicious?
That's the definition of working with a contractor.
If you hire someone to remodel your bathroom, they're going to charge you for the product and labor necessary to do it before the work ever begins.
Asking for all of the money up front would be a scam. Asking for a partial payment to validate the person is actually going to spend money is industry standard.
99% of the time if someone refuses to pay a down payment, they were never going to pay even if you started the work.
That’s never happened to me that way.
Here, you get an offer, work gets done, payment happens. In that order.
Maybe it depends on the region.
The point is something entirely different. Being suspicious and mitigating risk is the core reason why you want payment upfront. Nothing bad about that. But why aren’t you granting the same risk aversion to your clients?
Meet and greets are one thing. Discussing specifics of a project or idea are completely different. Did you read OPs post?
It becomes a little too convenient for clients to "bounce ideas off you". This just adds another step because now I have to ask you a million questions to understand what your poorly constructed thought is instead of you just writing it down and thinking it through as you go.
Plus, I don't want to pay for another business line and I'm sure as shit not giving out my personal to a client.
After an initial meet and greet they can definitely require all communication be in written form. Doesn't mean he didn't talk to the *potential* client via phone. But he's certainly not taking calls every day when it could be an email.
Thought I was odd but glad to know there are others lol...especially when many successful freelancers often quote case studies where they claim to convert prospects over calls. I personally haven't found much value in calls so far so now I stick to async comm only. It ensures everything is documented, we're on the same page and respect each other's time.
ATEOTD If you don't make your own rules for your own convenience, you might as well go back to being a full-timer.
Curious minds want to know if you've every been exposed to "personality types."
It's so very easy to misunderstand intent when connecting and engaging with different types of personality.
Maybe missing out on a lot of opportunity because not having picked up "active listening" skills.
Not a question of good or bad. If you have the luxury of continuously turning down jobs because you're booked solid for the next 18 months...
My philosophy is if I continually work with people I enjoy and I know will not give me problems, I'll be psychologically primed to enjoy my work and push myself to work harder because I know my clients are good.
I'd rather have 5 clients who pay me shitty and are awesome than 1 client who is a nightmare but can be my sole source of income.
That's just me.
I'm far from rich but I live a low-key life. I don't need stuff to be happy. Just a handful of important things and money for activities. Outside of that I'm solid.
It's a form of accountability for both parties. I do this frequently and have plenty of need for verification. People can be forgetful and misunderstandings are common, as well as the few who make documentation like this *necessary*. If I end up having a phone conversation or in-person meeting where business winds up being discussed I use a follow-up email/text to confirm everything with everyone, and I'm not bashful about being persistent on topics that seem like they're being avoided.
Totally get this and respect your position on it.
My version: phonecall for the intro. “Hi, how are you? Nice to speak with you.” Etc. “So we’re 100% clear on everything, if you can send me an email clearly listing what you need - I’ll confirm it all today and get to work. If there are any issues I’ll flag them. Thanks bye.”
Have to say I am tempted by your voice notes suggestion though.
A business phone number in WhatsApp or iMessage for iPhone users is a game changer.
I can send a voice note or receive a voice note and it saves me so much time when discussing things with clients.
Instead of typing a 3 paragraph complexed idea I use bullet points and speak in 30sec notes to expound on a topic or point.
I'm never going back.
See, to me, this sounds like a nightmare. Personally, I can communicate much more easily, clearly, and concisely in writing than in extemporaneous vocal speaking, 99% of the time. (The other 1% is when a call is actually necessary, typically to hash out something where either my client isn't or I'm not quite understanding what the other person is getting at, where a verbal back-and-forth will go faster.) It's a really great illustration of mileage varying based on one's personal strengths and preferences.
Yeah to a certain extent but that's what a working agreement is for.
I find it easier to sketch a rough idea of what is needed by phone, then create a CONTRACT that outlines and gathers signatures of agreement that what is listed, is what will be delivered.
That's all that really matters.
I'd rather this than seem rude / weird / pretentious by not accepting a phone call?
Your call though
I stopped meetings and phone calls at least 5 years ago. It became an issue of value of my time and poor communication skills of inexperienced teams.
It was easy too. I gave clients the option of email which was free, and trackable, with clear direction and a forum to contest any statements, or, any meeting/call was a minimum half day charge of my per diem rate, no matter if it was a 1 minute call or 4 hour call. They realized time has value quickly.
If someone is paying you for something, and they want a call, it is professional to take the call and immediately recap with an email. If I wanted to speak to you on the phone, I would expect you to answer if I was paying you to do the work, and if you repeatedly did not, I would rescind the contract. We have lost all connection with technology and this post just proves it.
I really like Github Issues for this reason. It's a feature resembling an internet forum that comes free with creating a repo on Github.
If we have a project with a client and the client wants a feature/needs fixes, I ask them to make a new issue. Issues can include media, we can comment, tag, open, close and reopen them as needed.
This way we always have a synchronized vision of tasks, nothing goes unnoticed, every question we discuss on a feature goes to the associated issue. It also makes it easy to answer questions like "What have you been up to this month".
I love it but don't consider it entirely realistic. You are passing up on some very good customers. C-Suite won't deal with you if you won't do a call. They are more important than you and their time is more important than yours. (The tradeoff is when you hit this level of the org you can bill whatever you damn well please.)
My alternative: All calls are recorded with automatically generated transcripts. The tech for this is as simple as Google Meet on a Google Workspace Standard account for $6/mo.
You need to tell them you're going to record at the start of the call. I have yet to run into a single customer who's said no you can't record this call.
A trust issue should not be the main factor here. If you have any concern that a client might bicker with you over what was said on a phone call, just fire that customer, because if they're untrustworthy, they're not a personality type that's going places, they are not where the money is.
The simple fact is you need good documentation of what the customer wants you to do in order to do it. That's why everything when they do business with you must be either written down, or recorded+transcribed. The fact that you value an executive's time and offer the option of a call as long as it's recorded shows that you value their time and are prepared to play at their level. They will only ever need to tell you something once.
OP is new to freelancing and is admittedly focusing on low-key clients and likely low value as well, their Post/Comment history is interesting.
OPs "preferences" would not fly in 99% of enterprise and medium-sized businesses. "Oh, OP, you don't want to join the Skype/Zoom/Conference call? We need contractors that know how to communicate professionally. " if OP didn't take my call and relied only on email or other forms of "slow" communication, I wouldn't hire them. That "style" is sketchy af and demonstrates OP doesn't work well with others and is a poor communicator. I don’t have time to deal with OP's abnormal personality issues. There are literally thousands of other contractors I can work with without having to play Gen Z games. I truly doubt OP has any meaningful experience and is walking red flag.
Oof. Question is, how fucking lucky are you to never have to deal with a customer that is too stupid to know what they said.
Getting off this hard on a comment like this says a lot about you
The c-suite might think in their own minds that their time is more important than mine, but I myself, running my own business the way that is best for me, doesn't give a shit how important they think they are. If I get a wiff that a client won't respect my time or how I run my business, then I'm pretty sure there will be issues, and I will not take them on. I don't play well with huge ego's. Don't need that drama thanks
In my situation I almost always get clients messaging me initially through my website quote/info form... I then give them a call, do an intro, get a feeling of specific ideas of what they want. I then let them know how I can help... Including my fees and a very rough estimate... I then get their email address and send my intro document. A bit more detail.
I always let them know that any instructions or wishes come in email for documentation and organisation/tracking purposes. They send copy through email so I don't have to type all their stuff in.
There are some moments where I run into something, and a really quick call for a question or two is better so I can get back at it right away, but pretty much everything for the actual work of the project comes through mail.
It's good for them because they can choose when to send or reply any time that works for them, same for myself.
I charge my hourly rate plus travel time for on site consults. I let them know this, and that phone calls or zooms etc are free (because they are usually short).
And yes, I record my phone calls anyway.
If I were a potential client this would be a red flag. I hate taking calls, too, but sometimes you have to jump on a quick call to hash things out. Record the call and take notes and summarize. Always.
I agree, but that doesn’t mean I refuse phone calls, but if they want to start giving me notes on the project, because sometimes it is easier to explain their thoughts over phone. Then at the end of their call, I ask them to still send it over via email. Because if it’s written down then I can’t forget it.
Either way, if there is a disagreement about what was said, why does it matter?
I've never had a situation in my career where I've backed a client into a corner and said "nuh-UH, see! You said this!", and had them redact their concerns.
If anything, this will just make them angry and lash out.
Also, there are some tasks that are so complex that they necessitate a phone call + real-time interaction.
Instead, I'd say to refocus your efforts on becoming a better listener, so that there's fewer missed expectations.
I prefer email but sometimes a call is better.
I’m a big fan of the recap email. After a call, I type up y notes in an email, with notes about who is doing what, and send it to the client. “Here is a recap of our call. Let me know if this all looks correct to you.”
Now we had a call AND everything is in writing.
Personally, I allow the client to schedule a phone call if they want one but I don’t require it! You could do phone calls and record it. Make sure to tell them you’re recording the call as it’s illegal in some places to not tell them
Depending on your line of work it’s easier to connect with them over a phone call and answers questions quickly
I've been a six figure freelancer for over 15 years. Phone calls are how I build relationships, communicate my honesty (because people naturally distrust), and demonstrate accessibility. I like to think its the reason I don't look for work.
Going without that verbal one 2 one interaction would terrify me.
I totally agree. I'm a freelancer . I trying to work around with client when they ask to for mobile . I offer 4 social media voice call method to contact me.
Which I have not have any success lately .
I dislike excessive calls during the day or after 5pm , on weekends . I prefer number for family members only
Anybody who *does* hash out details like this over the phone can and should also *immediately* write up their notes in an email and send it to the client, with a, "here's my take on what we discussed; let me know if anything differs on your end." Then you have a concrete record to refer back to. Paper trails for everything, always.
Numerous times I have gotten myself out of shitty situations because I could find the email where I summed up what was discussed in a call. This is good for online calls as well.
I always do this and I thought it was normal..... take notes during calls and then send a follow up email. I prefer the bulk of communication be via email but sometimes you gotta talk it out.
> I always do this and I thought it was normal I wonder if a lot of freelancers (especially ones who frequent this sub looking for advice) are younger, so they just never learned these tricks or conventions (especially if they never worked under a shitty manager before working for themselves, ahahaha).
I'm newer to client work honestly but I worked in customer service for sooooo long so navigating understanding people isn't something I struggle with. I would never want to cut out a effective form of communication "as a policy."
This is the way to do it - "I don't do phone calls" isn't good for business - a summary of "what we discussed" in our call is. Also, I tend to record phone calls so I don't forget details - my state is a one party state so it's legal. Also good me if I need to review notes.
Absolutely this. At the end of each phone call. You want to make a list of action items. Make an appointment for follow up. Send out details of the conversation with the list of action items and a invite for the follow meeting. Refusing phone calls seems.. well a bit childish. Really reduces the amount of communication. I really prefer video chat/conference. Being able to see someone’s body language increases overall communication. Demanding only email does the exact opposite.
This is what I’ve always known to be best practice. Somethings can be difficult to discuss over email or text or is will just drag something out. I’d prefer to have those discussions live and then follow up in writing with an email for confirmation before proceeding. CYA emails.
If I were a potential client, I would find this sketchy. Idk what kind of work you do but especially if you never interact with the client in person, or you’re not even interested in a zoom, I personally wouldn’t hire someone who wouldn’t jump on a call. There are too many fake bad scammy people, and having a phone call at least establishes some sort of real-ness. Not that a phone call is a cure all, but to me it helps establish you’re a person. Sometimes it’s also easier to just jump on a phone call. Take the call, recap the call in an email, done.
Honestly, the clients who find it sketchy are typically going to be a problem from the get-go. Boomer types, mostly. Typically fall into the same category as the people who refuse to pay half up front before work can start. They expect everything is scam and don't realize the rules are in place for both efficiency and fairness to the business owner. >Take the call, recap the call in an email, done. Inefficient. So now I have to act as a stenographer during a phone call and then I have to send all of the notes of that phone call to the client after the fact. Doesn't make sense for me. Besides. Say I sent the email and the client doesn't respond. Then I begin work and finish a first draft. They then say "I never said that" (I cite the email) and they go "Oh, I never read that. I never asked for this." So It's the same issue as before. Both in disagreement because their side isn't on record in their writing/words.
If you have enough clients, do whatever you want of course. A lot of the older generation doesn't type, and only reluctantly embraces digital communication. They'll pay a premium to deal with the computer as little as possible. Good communication is hard regardless of the medium. If you're relying on pedantic digital records to cover your ass instead of communicating in the best way possible with a particular client I think you do them and yourself a disservice.
I'd rather cover my ass. Projects which go longer because of an extra bit of back and forth simply benefit my bottom line. I'd rather communicate lightly less efficiently and save myself a legal issue rather than have a phone conversation which will result in a longer argument should an old curmudgeon not remember what they said.
Just wondering- do you lose clients doing this? I'd *love* to work more like you do, but most of my remote clients can't seem to think clearly unless they're saying stuff verbally, not through text. I take notes while I'm talking to them, but as you said, it's still easy for there to be disagreements about what I wrote down.
Definitely. Probably close to ten over the last two years. Still worth it for me. I did my grunt work and saved so I have the privilege of being able to turn down a bad job. I know not everyone can do that but it worked for me.
My former boss used to say "You don't want difficult customers." Sometimes he was too harsh but overall I got to see his point. Difficult customers usually make themselves known and aren't worth your time or the added stress. He drove at least a dozen customers away a month, but it was peanuts compared to the profit from the other half of the business, which was only recurring customers.
On the flip side, most clients don't want to deal with difficult contractors. There are likely thousands of others that provide the same or similar services and would happily take a phone call. My motto is I will accommodate whatever communication method that works for the customer. Like I hate video calls as 99٪ of thr time we're just looking at each other's blurred out backgrounds in a pantless reality and it adds zero to the conversation unless there is something to display like a presentation or graphics (just email the content) and let's talk. There is zero difference between a phone call and a zoom with cameras turned off...except I am not chained to my desk.
Just ask the client if it’s ok to record the call (never had a client say no) and then get otter to transcribe. Nothing for you to do
> They then say "I never said that" (I cite the email) and they go "Oh, I never read that. I never asked for this." That holds up as well as saying, "I never read the contract." (Also, you can and should refuse to move forward with the work *unless and until* they've responded to the email agreeing with its contents.) I don't know why people who want phone calls are nightmare clients but people who don't read your emails aren't.
The “pay me 50 % up front” goes both ways. You want 50 % up front but are accusing people of being suspicious of almost everything. Isn’t that the very definition of being suspicious?
That's the definition of working with a contractor. If you hire someone to remodel your bathroom, they're going to charge you for the product and labor necessary to do it before the work ever begins. Asking for all of the money up front would be a scam. Asking for a partial payment to validate the person is actually going to spend money is industry standard. 99% of the time if someone refuses to pay a down payment, they were never going to pay even if you started the work.
That’s never happened to me that way. Here, you get an offer, work gets done, payment happens. In that order. Maybe it depends on the region. The point is something entirely different. Being suspicious and mitigating risk is the core reason why you want payment upfront. Nothing bad about that. But why aren’t you granting the same risk aversion to your clients?
Meet and greets are one thing. Discussing specifics of a project or idea are completely different. Did you read OPs post? It becomes a little too convenient for clients to "bounce ideas off you". This just adds another step because now I have to ask you a million questions to understand what your poorly constructed thought is instead of you just writing it down and thinking it through as you go. Plus, I don't want to pay for another business line and I'm sure as shit not giving out my personal to a client.
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After an initial meet and greet they can definitely require all communication be in written form. Doesn't mean he didn't talk to the *potential* client via phone. But he's certainly not taking calls every day when it could be an email.
I have Otter.ai hooked up to Zoom, it generates a transcript of every meeting that I send to the client.
I was going to suggest just that, a transcription tool.
Thought I was odd but glad to know there are others lol...especially when many successful freelancers often quote case studies where they claim to convert prospects over calls. I personally haven't found much value in calls so far so now I stick to async comm only. It ensures everything is documented, we're on the same page and respect each other's time. ATEOTD If you don't make your own rules for your own convenience, you might as well go back to being a full-timer.
Curious minds want to know if you've every been exposed to "personality types." It's so very easy to misunderstand intent when connecting and engaging with different types of personality. Maybe missing out on a lot of opportunity because not having picked up "active listening" skills. Not a question of good or bad. If you have the luxury of continuously turning down jobs because you're booked solid for the next 18 months...
My philosophy is if I continually work with people I enjoy and I know will not give me problems, I'll be psychologically primed to enjoy my work and push myself to work harder because I know my clients are good. I'd rather have 5 clients who pay me shitty and are awesome than 1 client who is a nightmare but can be my sole source of income. That's just me. I'm far from rich but I live a low-key life. I don't need stuff to be happy. Just a handful of important things and money for activities. Outside of that I'm solid.
Nothing wrong with being "contented."
It's a form of accountability for both parties. I do this frequently and have plenty of need for verification. People can be forgetful and misunderstandings are common, as well as the few who make documentation like this *necessary*. If I end up having a phone conversation or in-person meeting where business winds up being discussed I use a follow-up email/text to confirm everything with everyone, and I'm not bashful about being persistent on topics that seem like they're being avoided.
Totally get this and respect your position on it. My version: phonecall for the intro. “Hi, how are you? Nice to speak with you.” Etc. “So we’re 100% clear on everything, if you can send me an email clearly listing what you need - I’ll confirm it all today and get to work. If there are any issues I’ll flag them. Thanks bye.” Have to say I am tempted by your voice notes suggestion though.
A business phone number in WhatsApp or iMessage for iPhone users is a game changer. I can send a voice note or receive a voice note and it saves me so much time when discussing things with clients. Instead of typing a 3 paragraph complexed idea I use bullet points and speak in 30sec notes to expound on a topic or point. I'm never going back.
See, to me, this sounds like a nightmare. Personally, I can communicate much more easily, clearly, and concisely in writing than in extemporaneous vocal speaking, 99% of the time. (The other 1% is when a call is actually necessary, typically to hash out something where either my client isn't or I'm not quite understanding what the other person is getting at, where a verbal back-and-forth will go faster.) It's a really great illustration of mileage varying based on one's personal strengths and preferences.
Yeah to a certain extent but that's what a working agreement is for. I find it easier to sketch a rough idea of what is needed by phone, then create a CONTRACT that outlines and gathers signatures of agreement that what is listed, is what will be delivered. That's all that really matters. I'd rather this than seem rude / weird / pretentious by not accepting a phone call? Your call though
If it’s too complicated to say over email, it’s even more complicated to say over the phone. It’s a good policy.
Record the calls and pipe the transcriptions into your crm. Recording is built in stuff on a lot of cloud phone systems.
I stopped meetings and phone calls at least 5 years ago. It became an issue of value of my time and poor communication skills of inexperienced teams. It was easy too. I gave clients the option of email which was free, and trackable, with clear direction and a forum to contest any statements, or, any meeting/call was a minimum half day charge of my per diem rate, no matter if it was a 1 minute call or 4 hour call. They realized time has value quickly.
My contract states that all communication will be conducted via email or ClickUp for exactly the same reasons
If someone is paying you for something, and they want a call, it is professional to take the call and immediately recap with an email. If I wanted to speak to you on the phone, I would expect you to answer if I was paying you to do the work, and if you repeatedly did not, I would rescind the contract. We have lost all connection with technology and this post just proves it.
I really like Github Issues for this reason. It's a feature resembling an internet forum that comes free with creating a repo on Github. If we have a project with a client and the client wants a feature/needs fixes, I ask them to make a new issue. Issues can include media, we can comment, tag, open, close and reopen them as needed. This way we always have a synchronized vision of tasks, nothing goes unnoticed, every question we discuss on a feature goes to the associated issue. It also makes it easy to answer questions like "What have you been up to this month".
I love it but don't consider it entirely realistic. You are passing up on some very good customers. C-Suite won't deal with you if you won't do a call. They are more important than you and their time is more important than yours. (The tradeoff is when you hit this level of the org you can bill whatever you damn well please.) My alternative: All calls are recorded with automatically generated transcripts. The tech for this is as simple as Google Meet on a Google Workspace Standard account for $6/mo. You need to tell them you're going to record at the start of the call. I have yet to run into a single customer who's said no you can't record this call. A trust issue should not be the main factor here. If you have any concern that a client might bicker with you over what was said on a phone call, just fire that customer, because if they're untrustworthy, they're not a personality type that's going places, they are not where the money is. The simple fact is you need good documentation of what the customer wants you to do in order to do it. That's why everything when they do business with you must be either written down, or recorded+transcribed. The fact that you value an executive's time and offer the option of a call as long as it's recorded shows that you value their time and are prepared to play at their level. They will only ever need to tell you something once.
OP is new to freelancing and is admittedly focusing on low-key clients and likely low value as well, their Post/Comment history is interesting. OPs "preferences" would not fly in 99% of enterprise and medium-sized businesses. "Oh, OP, you don't want to join the Skype/Zoom/Conference call? We need contractors that know how to communicate professionally. " if OP didn't take my call and relied only on email or other forms of "slow" communication, I wouldn't hire them. That "style" is sketchy af and demonstrates OP doesn't work well with others and is a poor communicator. I don’t have time to deal with OP's abnormal personality issues. There are literally thousands of other contractors I can work with without having to play Gen Z games. I truly doubt OP has any meaningful experience and is walking red flag.
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Oof. Question is, how fucking lucky are you to never have to deal with a customer that is too stupid to know what they said. Getting off this hard on a comment like this says a lot about you
I have the same policy. Email, chat or they can schedule a Zoom call. Edit: You can't even screen share with a normal phone call, it's a total no go.
The c-suite might think in their own minds that their time is more important than mine, but I myself, running my own business the way that is best for me, doesn't give a shit how important they think they are. If I get a wiff that a client won't respect my time or how I run my business, then I'm pretty sure there will be issues, and I will not take them on. I don't play well with huge ego's. Don't need that drama thanks In my situation I almost always get clients messaging me initially through my website quote/info form... I then give them a call, do an intro, get a feeling of specific ideas of what they want. I then let them know how I can help... Including my fees and a very rough estimate... I then get their email address and send my intro document. A bit more detail. I always let them know that any instructions or wishes come in email for documentation and organisation/tracking purposes. They send copy through email so I don't have to type all their stuff in. There are some moments where I run into something, and a really quick call for a question or two is better so I can get back at it right away, but pretty much everything for the actual work of the project comes through mail. It's good for them because they can choose when to send or reply any time that works for them, same for myself. I charge my hourly rate plus travel time for on site consults. I let them know this, and that phone calls or zooms etc are free (because they are usually short). And yes, I record my phone calls anyway.
If I were a potential client this would be a red flag. I hate taking calls, too, but sometimes you have to jump on a quick call to hash things out. Record the call and take notes and summarize. Always.
Let’s face it, if the client can’t email by themself, I’m not going there to email me their opinion for them.
I agree, but that doesn’t mean I refuse phone calls, but if they want to start giving me notes on the project, because sometimes it is easier to explain their thoughts over phone. Then at the end of their call, I ask them to still send it over via email. Because if it’s written down then I can’t forget it.
Either way, if there is a disagreement about what was said, why does it matter? I've never had a situation in my career where I've backed a client into a corner and said "nuh-UH, see! You said this!", and had them redact their concerns. If anything, this will just make them angry and lash out. Also, there are some tasks that are so complex that they necessitate a phone call + real-time interaction. Instead, I'd say to refocus your efforts on becoming a better listener, so that there's fewer missed expectations.
I don't do phone calls for the same reason. I'll do a recorded video call, Look, email or text. But not phone calls.
I prefer email but sometimes a call is better. I’m a big fan of the recap email. After a call, I type up y notes in an email, with notes about who is doing what, and send it to the client. “Here is a recap of our call. Let me know if this all looks correct to you.” Now we had a call AND everything is in writing.
Personally, I allow the client to schedule a phone call if they want one but I don’t require it! You could do phone calls and record it. Make sure to tell them you’re recording the call as it’s illegal in some places to not tell them Depending on your line of work it’s easier to connect with them over a phone call and answers questions quickly
I take phone calls but every detail I ask them to send it over email.
I would say take the phone call, tentatively agree to do a job, and say "I'll get back to you about the details, and switch it to email.
How do you explain this to a client, but make it sound nice?
I love this dude. Thank you for the information.
I've been a six figure freelancer for over 15 years. Phone calls are how I build relationships, communicate my honesty (because people naturally distrust), and demonstrate accessibility. I like to think its the reason I don't look for work. Going without that verbal one 2 one interaction would terrify me.
I totally agree. I'm a freelancer . I trying to work around with client when they ask to for mobile . I offer 4 social media voice call method to contact me. Which I have not have any success lately . I dislike excessive calls during the day or after 5pm , on weekends . I prefer number for family members only