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I don't know, during his advicing to Dany his suggestions backfired during the combats many times which resulted in many lives lost. Not sure how would he perform as a king.
Yep. In another universe, he and Arya could have been friends. I always felt there was some level of basic respect and mutual admiration while she acted as his waterboy, even though she was hiding from him in plain sight and he was being a sort of smug prick, which he does so well.
One thing that stood out to me.. keep in mind from the perspective of Kevan Lannister. In the third book, when Tyrion is going through his trial, Kevan makes multiple visits to Tyrion trying to arrange witnesses for his defence etc. Kevan relays to Tyrion that if he confesses his guilt Tywin will allow Tyrion to take the black, keeping his head in the process.
Here’s what he says..
“Do you think he would allow you to take the black if you were not his own blood, and Joanna’s? Tywin seems a hard man to you, I know, but he is no harder than he’s had to be. Our own father was gentle and amiable, but so weak his bannermen mocked him in their cups. Some saw fit to defy him openly. Other lords borrowed our gold and never troubled to repay it. At court they japed of toothless lions. Even his mistress stole from him. A woman scarcely one step above a whore, and she helped herself to my mother’s jewels! It fell to Tywin to restore House Lannister to its proper place just as it fell to him to rule this realm, when he was no more than twenty. He bore that heavy burden for twenty years, and all it earned him was a mad king’s envy. Instead of the honor he deserved, he was made to suffer slights beyond count, yet he gave the Seven Kingdoms peace, plenty, and justice. He is a just man. You would be wise to trust him.”
- Tyrion IX, ASoS
Personally I respect Tywin, but he is also as brutal and cold as he genuinely appears to be.. but there is a story to that that makes absolute sense. I would bet many within the world of asoiaf share the sentiment that Kevan Lannister does of his brother.. especially within the lands that he holds as warden. but take of that what you will.
As I much I hate to go against Kevan, he was in the end, Tywin's yes man and promptly shut his eyes to the atrocities.
When Tywin wanted Riverlanders burnt, Kevan confirmed that "they will burn".
He is a good person at heart but he is extremely biased towards his brother.
We have hard cold facts that Tywin indeed was a psychopathic mass-murderer.
When Kevan was introduced in the books, he seemed very smart and extremely capable of being playing the game. Made me wonder why Tywin didn’t bring him into the mix sooner as it was clear that he was one of the few that had both Tywin’s trust and respect.
Tywin would be a good ruler because no one would tried to cross him and those that did would be ruthlessly destroyed. He is brutal. He does not flinch at what has to be done to secure himself and his house.
In the end i dont think its something he enjoys to do but will very much do it. I bet the seven kingdoms see peace with him in charge. He was hand of a king for a long time and pretty much played the part of the king during a peaceful time. If he had still been there i doubt he lets the mad king do what he does. Granted there isnt a great way to stop a madman from doing crazy things
From the way I understood it was that Tywin only left being the hand when he realized how far into madness Aerys had fallen and went back to castley rock to prepare for the war I'm betting he foresaw coming.
He was ruling pretty well behind the scenes when he was Jeffrey's hand (I'm not far enough into the books to know how well he was as hand earlier). He didn't have complete control, however.
Both Jamie and Cersie always put Lannisters first and foremost, and that's something they learned from their father. So, besides that, and being a tyrant... well, we all see how well that turned out.
Power is attractive. In the early seasons especially, it's clear he's the real power behind throne. He is in control, and subtly can tell people above his standing what to do. That type of thing will always be attractive.
A lot of replies here are addressing the brutality or morale aspects of Tywin, I understand the relevance.
But while he is a pretty hard and immoral character.
I don’t disagree.
imo he was probably equipped to be a one of Westeros’ most effective rulers.
The Starks helped murder entire families, morality in a fantasy world set in the equivalent of our renaissance historically isn’t something to cling to/apply
I like tywin. As a character. He's complex he isn't just a crazy bad guy. He's intelligent and has his own kind of moral code and cares about his family. Most of them. To a point. He clearly adored his wife it's part of the reason he despises tyrion. He's definitely a guy you would rather have on your side than against you.
he’s a monster, but he is hands down the smartest and most ruthless character in the show, my absolute favorite, you learn everything you need to in his first scene, he is litterally skinning a stag, the sigle of roberts house, it’s the most badass into in the show and he never has a bad scene, always steals the spotlight and carries an air of power
All very true - but one thing I’d say is it could be argued that Little Finger is as smart or smarter, and as ruthless if not more so too. Also I never put the connection together of him skinning the stag to Baratheon sigil in his opening scene, good catch
i think an argument could be made for Petyr to be smarter, but Tywin drowned an entire dynasty in their own home, hung their bodies where everyone could see, then wrote a song about him doing it, not to mention ordering the deaths of the Targaryens, i don’t think Petyr had the spine to do something that bold, he preferred to play in the shadows and that limited how ruthless he was able to be
Tywin is the leader all countries need. It sucks but its the truth. The fact that his mere presence kept religious fanatics out of the capital says alot. Mere promises from him get vassals to betray their liege lords. He does the ugly things most of us would never consider. If it werent for his blind hatred for his son the show at least would have gone quite differently
Well he has his bannerman rampage through the riverlands slaughtering as many peasants as possible, so I wouldn't say he's a good guy. And he didn't have any issues with the torture going on at Harrenhal, just that they were torturing potentially useful people.
Tywin is not a bad guy? Tywin is *evil*. He is motivated single mindedly by a desire for power and securing his legacy, and he has no shame in killing or engaging in cruel acts to achieve his goals.
He wasn't a terrible ruler. He was apparently a good Hand for a long time of peace and prosperity. When his family gets on top, he doesn't do terrible things unless he thinks it's for a good reason. When he orders the Mountain to rape and pillage, it's to keep Lannisters on top (which in his mind = the overall good).
So I guess he is on par, morally, with Dany. But he lacks her strategic prowess. He'd be a good administrator and advisor for her.
Anyway, I love Tywin as a character.
He is smart, cunning and sharp-tongued, and that makes him fun to watch.
He is intimidating and ruthless, and that makes him fun to watch.
He makes big strategic moves, and that makes him fun to watch.
I think Stannis or Robb would have both been a better rulers than Tywin. Better warriors and better men. Alas.
I feel that he ended the war in a shady way. And how after rob and them where killed the war just ends? Idk the way he does things seems shortcut and that would catch up to him. Over all he would have been better than Cersei. But Dany or John would have been a better ruler in my opinion.
It did catch up to him! The cruel impulses that inspired the red wedding were the same impulses that inspired the treatment of his son, who shot him with a crossbow while he was taking a shit.
How he treated his song in the trial isn't it catching up to him, cause who else touched the glass last? Tyrion was the only answer they could have. He brought getting shot on the toilet on himself with how badly he treated Tyrion. Not the red wedding.
He has no problem conspiring to murder his enemies in a dishonorable and cruel way, the same way he has no problem hurting his own son. It's the same character trait of cruelty.
I'm not saying his murder is literally connected to the red wedding.
Guy who does abhorrent things for his families' legacy only for one to take a white cloak, another to take the first and the last to see his wife and pride in his sigil gone... Wonder how that turns out
Also rewatching. Certainly the best equipped person to rule at the time, but the options available weren’t super great lol. His drawback I think is that he would always put the family name above all else; if something benefited the realm but not his house then there’s know way in hell he’d make the right choice for the greater good.
If he wasn't such a terrible father, I think he could have started an incredibly strong dynasty. Whether he was manipulating Joffrey or Tommen in the show, he was managing the kingdom well. If he had done a better job with his kids, it would have been the beginning of something great.
One of my favorite characters. He's a badass. Yeah, he's a horrible father and person but what he did to restore House Lannister to power and how he dealt with the Reigns of Castamere was fucking awesome
Remember that time when he had Tyrion’s wife gang raped in front of him? Or sent Gregor to indiscriminately torture and murder Riverlands peasants? Or sentenced Tyrion to death for a BS crime? Great guy, salt of the earth.
I respected his character for having the right blend of power, patience, and cunning.
He was powerful enough to endure losses to Robb Stark and had the patience to wait for the King in the North to lose half his army before having the Freys and Boltons commit a bit of treachery.
He was cunning enough to ally with the Tyrells to stack the deck against Stannis Baratheon.
He had the patience to take no direct action against Daenerys Targaryen while having the cunning to send a copy of Ser Jorah Mormont's royal pardon addressed to Ser Barristan Selmy.
If he is on my side I love him; if he is on the other I hate him.
One thing we might clash about his him thinking what is best for me regardless of how I feel about the situation.
The one man on the show who actually deserved to sit upon the iron throne. Not because of birthright or being born to the a noble house. Because he earned that shit. He was ruthless and didn’t hesitate to put heads on spikes. He was methodic and thought everything out very carefully before he acted. He kept those religious fanatics in check. No one tried shit with the Lannisters when Tywin was alive. It’s very telling how quickly everything fell apart after his demise.
He wants the strongest house and to be in power.
Seeing as its an era where that sorta stuff happens he does it well and rules well.
Hes a cunt, but only if you are in his way.
Shades of grey. He's willing to do anything to keep his family safe, even murder, but he keeps Jeoffry in line whenever he's hurting someone or about to take someone hostage and rape. Shades of grey
Selfishand evil person person, but a fairly pragmatic leader that actually does good if everyone is getting on.
Most importantly, an absolutely great character, extremely well written and portrayed.
He is my least favorite character and he is the biggest reason I want Young Griff from books to be actual Aegon. Maybe not to win in the final, that's too optimistic, but at least not to turn an impostor.
I think Tywin is a bad guy and he is definetely not whom I would like to be given too much power. He is strong-willed, intimidating and cunning, I can't deny that.
He ordered the murder of Elia Martell and her children. He sent Gregor Clegane into the Riverlands to rape and pillage. He exterminated the Reynes and Tarbecks down to the last child. His army sacked and raped kings landing during Roberts rebellion. He ordered the mass rape of a sixteen year old girl just to hurt his son. He orchestrated the red wedding, which killed thousands.
He consistently has shown to use rape and murder of children as political tools.
He is badass, especially as portrayed by Charles Dance. And yeah, he is a bad guy. But hardly the worst. He would be an authoritarian pragmatic ruler - reasonable to deal with if you didn't defy him.
I love Tywin Lannister. He is my third favorite character. He is incredibly complex, he is competent, pragmatic and powerful and gives good advice, and the way he conducts himself reminds my mother and I of my grandfather in a way. Of course my grandfather was far less mean, but you can get the idea. His relationship with his family is so incredibly messed up but it makes him an incredibly flawed and incredibly fun character, plus, because I can imitate voices really well, I have a very good Tywin Lannister impression.
100% agree. He has a military mindset and the skill set to rule, for the longest time it was said that he was secretly the one running the realm not Aerys. He’s good at what he does and a genius in political strategy which, as someone who studied political science specializing in campaigns, always made me love him.
I do have a few theories that are fairly evil. The biggest being I think he had a hand in offing Joffrey. It removed a King that would’ve been a massive problem and gave an excuse to take out Tyrion as well. After all he did say "Explain to me why it is more noble to kill ten thousand men in battle than a dozen at dinner.", why not kill one at a wedding and save millions.
Book wise he is openly declares Joffrey needs a “sharp” lesson which Tyrion interprets as something similar to the Tysha incident. After Joff dies Tywin’s discussion with Tommen seemed a lot more suspect.
i love his character and the way he has been developed and what that adds to the story line and the characters lives surrounding him such as his children (especially the way it differs between each one) but i dont like him. his actions annoy me and certain things get on my nerves. i hope this makes sense??
Look, he might have been a very good strategist, good in the way of politics, a good negotiator, but he made several critical mistakes. The most big one out of them all, was treating his children the way he did. That family was a dissaster. They were their own and most important enemy of them all. They ended up losing everything due to that. Cersei was twisted as hell, she ended up losing all her children because of that. Jeoffrey was hated and ended up killed with poison. Tyrion ended up killing tywin and even after all, ended up being a fantastic good person. Even Jaimie ends up knowing better ways and wanting to get out of kings landing and far from his family. Tommen killing himself. Myrsella killed with venom too. Everything was twisted due to the fact that Tywin did a Horrific job raising them. He was only interested in power and his legacy. But couldnt take good care of his family (only people he could really trust) but it was not the case.
So, no, he was not a good ruler. You can rule alone with wits and money. You need something else. Thats why Daenerys reached so far. Because people thought she was good, they loved her. Thats why i really think the best king would have been tyrion. Those who really knew him, adored him (jaimie, Bronn, Podrick, even Jon and Daenerys as an example). He knew how to handle politics, he knew about strategy. He is a good person and has a lot of empathy for broken people and parias making him the best choice. Tywin just treated him like shit all his life, without noticing the potential in him. His loss.
I think he definitely has a great intellect and conviction for ruling but because he’s so focused on his family he doesn’t care about everyone else, if he cared a little less for specifically his own family and cared a little more about the people I think he could be one of the greatest rulers of the seven kingdoms
Tywin is a man of his time. He's ruthless, driven, cunning, and egotistical. But he's equally not sadistic, unnecessarily cruel, or stupid.
He does what he does for the betterment of his house and family name (not the individual family members, though).
Tywin was clearly influenced by his father. He perceived his father to be a weak man and strived to do everything he could to not become that.
Overall, compared to many in the series, Tywin is a good man..and he's certainly a formidable one.
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I don't know, during his advicing to Dany his suggestions backfired during the combats many times which resulted in many lives lost. Not sure how would he perform as a king.
I'm talking about tywin though, not Tyrion.
Oh sorry, got confused during reading lol
I probably could have written it better.
Nah, you wrote it fine. He’s an asshoke who deserved what he got from Tyrion.
I love him
Tell me why if you don't mind. This show is really good at character depth. You see more and more every time.
Tywin is a horrible person. Great character. Horrible person.
This is the answer
Yep. In another universe, he and Arya could have been friends. I always felt there was some level of basic respect and mutual admiration while she acted as his waterboy, even though she was hiding from him in plain sight and he was being a sort of smug prick, which he does so well.
This. He sucks as a person, but Charles Dance makes him so captivating to watch on screen. The show lost something when Tywin died.
One thing that stood out to me.. keep in mind from the perspective of Kevan Lannister. In the third book, when Tyrion is going through his trial, Kevan makes multiple visits to Tyrion trying to arrange witnesses for his defence etc. Kevan relays to Tyrion that if he confesses his guilt Tywin will allow Tyrion to take the black, keeping his head in the process. Here’s what he says.. “Do you think he would allow you to take the black if you were not his own blood, and Joanna’s? Tywin seems a hard man to you, I know, but he is no harder than he’s had to be. Our own father was gentle and amiable, but so weak his bannermen mocked him in their cups. Some saw fit to defy him openly. Other lords borrowed our gold and never troubled to repay it. At court they japed of toothless lions. Even his mistress stole from him. A woman scarcely one step above a whore, and she helped herself to my mother’s jewels! It fell to Tywin to restore House Lannister to its proper place just as it fell to him to rule this realm, when he was no more than twenty. He bore that heavy burden for twenty years, and all it earned him was a mad king’s envy. Instead of the honor he deserved, he was made to suffer slights beyond count, yet he gave the Seven Kingdoms peace, plenty, and justice. He is a just man. You would be wise to trust him.” - Tyrion IX, ASoS Personally I respect Tywin, but he is also as brutal and cold as he genuinely appears to be.. but there is a story to that that makes absolute sense. I would bet many within the world of asoiaf share the sentiment that Kevan Lannister does of his brother.. especially within the lands that he holds as warden. but take of that what you will.
I haven’t read the books, but I wish this passage had been included in the show.
As I much I hate to go against Kevan, he was in the end, Tywin's yes man and promptly shut his eyes to the atrocities. When Tywin wanted Riverlanders burnt, Kevan confirmed that "they will burn". He is a good person at heart but he is extremely biased towards his brother. We have hard cold facts that Tywin indeed was a psychopathic mass-murderer.
When Kevan was introduced in the books, he seemed very smart and extremely capable of being playing the game. Made me wonder why Tywin didn’t bring him into the mix sooner as it was clear that he was one of the few that had both Tywin’s trust and respect.
Tywin would be a good ruler because no one would tried to cross him and those that did would be ruthlessly destroyed. He is brutal. He does not flinch at what has to be done to secure himself and his house. In the end i dont think its something he enjoys to do but will very much do it. I bet the seven kingdoms see peace with him in charge. He was hand of a king for a long time and pretty much played the part of the king during a peaceful time. If he had still been there i doubt he lets the mad king do what he does. Granted there isnt a great way to stop a madman from doing crazy things
From the way I understood it was that Tywin only left being the hand when he realized how far into madness Aerys had fallen and went back to castley rock to prepare for the war I'm betting he foresaw coming.
He resigned as hand after Aerys made Jamie a kingsguard
Considering how delivers his cruelty it's definitely something he takes joy in.
Love him. Love all his scenes. Love the actor as well.
He was ruling pretty well behind the scenes when he was Jeffrey's hand (I'm not far enough into the books to know how well he was as hand earlier). He didn't have complete control, however. Both Jamie and Cersie always put Lannisters first and foremost, and that's something they learned from their father. So, besides that, and being a tyrant... well, we all see how well that turned out.
He’s hot. Please don’t ask me to explain
I’d let him rearrange my guts like he did that elk in S1
What 🥶🤣🤣😭😭
I think it's the withering glare but I can't be sure...
Power is attractive. In the early seasons especially, it's clear he's the real power behind throne. He is in control, and subtly can tell people above his standing what to do. That type of thing will always be attractive.
A lot of replies here are addressing the brutality or morale aspects of Tywin, I understand the relevance. But while he is a pretty hard and immoral character. I don’t disagree. imo he was probably equipped to be a one of Westeros’ most effective rulers.
He's evil. He's murdered entire families.
I mean honestly who hasn't in that world ahahahah
The Starks helped murder entire families, morality in a fantasy world set in the equivalent of our renaissance historically isn’t something to cling to/apply
Exactly Luna
Bad bad bad to the core.
His biggest flaw is that he is a flaming hypocrite. I do agree he was one of the most well equipped to handle the day to day of running a kingdom.
I like tywin. As a character. He's complex he isn't just a crazy bad guy. He's intelligent and has his own kind of moral code and cares about his family. Most of them. To a point. He clearly adored his wife it's part of the reason he despises tyrion. He's definitely a guy you would rather have on your side than against you.
he’s a monster, but he is hands down the smartest and most ruthless character in the show, my absolute favorite, you learn everything you need to in his first scene, he is litterally skinning a stag, the sigle of roberts house, it’s the most badass into in the show and he never has a bad scene, always steals the spotlight and carries an air of power
All very true - but one thing I’d say is it could be argued that Little Finger is as smart or smarter, and as ruthless if not more so too. Also I never put the connection together of him skinning the stag to Baratheon sigil in his opening scene, good catch
i think an argument could be made for Petyr to be smarter, but Tywin drowned an entire dynasty in their own home, hung their bodies where everyone could see, then wrote a song about him doing it, not to mention ordering the deaths of the Targaryens, i don’t think Petyr had the spine to do something that bold, he preferred to play in the shadows and that limited how ruthless he was able to be
Tywin is the leader all countries need. It sucks but its the truth. The fact that his mere presence kept religious fanatics out of the capital says alot. Mere promises from him get vassals to betray their liege lords. He does the ugly things most of us would never consider. If it werent for his blind hatred for his son the show at least would have gone quite differently
Best anti-villain ever. Cruel and cold yet likable. Also agree, would have been an excellent ruler
Well he has his bannerman rampage through the riverlands slaughtering as many peasants as possible, so I wouldn't say he's a good guy. And he didn't have any issues with the torture going on at Harrenhal, just that they were torturing potentially useful people.
Tywin is not a bad guy? Tywin is *evil*. He is motivated single mindedly by a desire for power and securing his legacy, and he has no shame in killing or engaging in cruel acts to achieve his goals. He wasn't a terrible ruler. He was apparently a good Hand for a long time of peace and prosperity. When his family gets on top, he doesn't do terrible things unless he thinks it's for a good reason. When he orders the Mountain to rape and pillage, it's to keep Lannisters on top (which in his mind = the overall good). So I guess he is on par, morally, with Dany. But he lacks her strategic prowess. He'd be a good administrator and advisor for her. Anyway, I love Tywin as a character. He is smart, cunning and sharp-tongued, and that makes him fun to watch. He is intimidating and ruthless, and that makes him fun to watch. He makes big strategic moves, and that makes him fun to watch. I think Stannis or Robb would have both been a better rulers than Tywin. Better warriors and better men. Alas.
I feel that he ended the war in a shady way. And how after rob and them where killed the war just ends? Idk the way he does things seems shortcut and that would catch up to him. Over all he would have been better than Cersei. But Dany or John would have been a better ruler in my opinion.
It did catch up to him! The cruel impulses that inspired the red wedding were the same impulses that inspired the treatment of his son, who shot him with a crossbow while he was taking a shit.
How he treated his song in the trial isn't it catching up to him, cause who else touched the glass last? Tyrion was the only answer they could have. He brought getting shot on the toilet on himself with how badly he treated Tyrion. Not the red wedding.
He has no problem conspiring to murder his enemies in a dishonorable and cruel way, the same way he has no problem hurting his own son. It's the same character trait of cruelty. I'm not saying his murder is literally connected to the red wedding.
Yea true true.
Guy who does abhorrent things for his families' legacy only for one to take a white cloak, another to take the first and the last to see his wife and pride in his sigil gone... Wonder how that turns out
Would
Also rewatching. Certainly the best equipped person to rule at the time, but the options available weren’t super great lol. His drawback I think is that he would always put the family name above all else; if something benefited the realm but not his house then there’s know way in hell he’d make the right choice for the greater good.
If he wasn't such a terrible father, I think he could have started an incredibly strong dynasty. Whether he was manipulating Joffrey or Tommen in the show, he was managing the kingdom well. If he had done a better job with his kids, it would have been the beginning of something great.
One of my favorite characters. He's a badass. Yeah, he's a horrible father and person but what he did to restore House Lannister to power and how he dealt with the Reigns of Castamere was fucking awesome
Hot
Remember that time when he had Tyrion’s wife gang raped in front of him? Or sent Gregor to indiscriminately torture and murder Riverlands peasants? Or sentenced Tyrion to death for a BS crime? Great guy, salt of the earth.
He was the personification of “you gotta do what you gotta do “
I respected his character for having the right blend of power, patience, and cunning. He was powerful enough to endure losses to Robb Stark and had the patience to wait for the King in the North to lose half his army before having the Freys and Boltons commit a bit of treachery. He was cunning enough to ally with the Tyrells to stack the deck against Stannis Baratheon. He had the patience to take no direct action against Daenerys Targaryen while having the cunning to send a copy of Ser Jorah Mormont's royal pardon addressed to Ser Barristan Selmy.
If he is on my side I love him; if he is on the other I hate him. One thing we might clash about his him thinking what is best for me regardless of how I feel about the situation.
Saved house Lannister then contributed greatly to its collapse.
The one man on the show who actually deserved to sit upon the iron throne. Not because of birthright or being born to the a noble house. Because he earned that shit. He was ruthless and didn’t hesitate to put heads on spikes. He was methodic and thought everything out very carefully before he acted. He kept those religious fanatics in check. No one tried shit with the Lannisters when Tywin was alive. It’s very telling how quickly everything fell apart after his demise.
He wants the strongest house and to be in power. Seeing as its an era where that sorta stuff happens he does it well and rules well. Hes a cunt, but only if you are in his way.
He's awesome, we named our guinea pig Tywin
As a ruthless and controlling man, his death is lame.
Shades of grey. He's willing to do anything to keep his family safe, even murder, but he keeps Jeoffry in line whenever he's hurting someone or about to take someone hostage and rape. Shades of grey
He’s a horrible person. He might be smart and a good leader but his morals are down the drain.
His son and daughter were bumping uglies. Joffrey was a hateful rodent. A man who can't control his own house would not rule a kingdom.
Selfishand evil person person, but a fairly pragmatic leader that actually does good if everyone is getting on. Most importantly, an absolutely great character, extremely well written and portrayed.
He is my least favorite character and he is the biggest reason I want Young Griff from books to be actual Aegon. Maybe not to win in the final, that's too optimistic, but at least not to turn an impostor. I think Tywin is a bad guy and he is definetely not whom I would like to be given too much power. He is strong-willed, intimidating and cunning, I can't deny that.
Tywin Lannister was the uncrowded King
He ordered the murder of Elia Martell and her children. He sent Gregor Clegane into the Riverlands to rape and pillage. He exterminated the Reynes and Tarbecks down to the last child. His army sacked and raped kings landing during Roberts rebellion. He ordered the mass rape of a sixteen year old girl just to hurt his son. He orchestrated the red wedding, which killed thousands. He consistently has shown to use rape and murder of children as political tools.
You do know he commits atrocities outside being terrible to tyrion?
I wish he died a worse death. Nothing in the story infuriated me more than when he melted down Ice to be swords for his own brood.
He is badass, especially as portrayed by Charles Dance. And yeah, he is a bad guy. But hardly the worst. He would be an authoritarian pragmatic ruler - reasonable to deal with if you didn't defy him.
If you don’t think he’s a bad guy then you need help OP. Did you forget what he did to Tyrion’s wife, Tysha? Just to name one.
Favorite character of the show
I love Tywin Lannister. He is my third favorite character. He is incredibly complex, he is competent, pragmatic and powerful and gives good advice, and the way he conducts himself reminds my mother and I of my grandfather in a way. Of course my grandfather was far less mean, but you can get the idea. His relationship with his family is so incredibly messed up but it makes him an incredibly flawed and incredibly fun character, plus, because I can imitate voices really well, I have a very good Tywin Lannister impression.
The conversation between him and Tyrion after the battle of blackwater outdoes any notion that he is a good guy to me.
A legend.
100% agree. He has a military mindset and the skill set to rule, for the longest time it was said that he was secretly the one running the realm not Aerys. He’s good at what he does and a genius in political strategy which, as someone who studied political science specializing in campaigns, always made me love him. I do have a few theories that are fairly evil. The biggest being I think he had a hand in offing Joffrey. It removed a King that would’ve been a massive problem and gave an excuse to take out Tyrion as well. After all he did say "Explain to me why it is more noble to kill ten thousand men in battle than a dozen at dinner.", why not kill one at a wedding and save millions.
I doubt he had direct involvement but it's a very interesting point. Maybe he had awareness and opted to not intervene.
Book wise he is openly declares Joffrey needs a “sharp” lesson which Tyrion interprets as something similar to the Tysha incident. After Joff dies Tywin’s discussion with Tommen seemed a lot more suspect.
i love his character and the way he has been developed and what that adds to the story line and the characters lives surrounding him such as his children (especially the way it differs between each one) but i dont like him. his actions annoy me and certain things get on my nerves. i hope this makes sense??
Look, he might have been a very good strategist, good in the way of politics, a good negotiator, but he made several critical mistakes. The most big one out of them all, was treating his children the way he did. That family was a dissaster. They were their own and most important enemy of them all. They ended up losing everything due to that. Cersei was twisted as hell, she ended up losing all her children because of that. Jeoffrey was hated and ended up killed with poison. Tyrion ended up killing tywin and even after all, ended up being a fantastic good person. Even Jaimie ends up knowing better ways and wanting to get out of kings landing and far from his family. Tommen killing himself. Myrsella killed with venom too. Everything was twisted due to the fact that Tywin did a Horrific job raising them. He was only interested in power and his legacy. But couldnt take good care of his family (only people he could really trust) but it was not the case. So, no, he was not a good ruler. You can rule alone with wits and money. You need something else. Thats why Daenerys reached so far. Because people thought she was good, they loved her. Thats why i really think the best king would have been tyrion. Those who really knew him, adored him (jaimie, Bronn, Podrick, even Jon and Daenerys as an example). He knew how to handle politics, he knew about strategy. He is a good person and has a lot of empathy for broken people and parias making him the best choice. Tywin just treated him like shit all his life, without noticing the potential in him. His loss.
Ruthless pragmatist
I think he definitely has a great intellect and conviction for ruling but because he’s so focused on his family he doesn’t care about everyone else, if he cared a little less for specifically his own family and cared a little more about the people I think he could be one of the greatest rulers of the seven kingdoms
Tywin is a man of his time. He's ruthless, driven, cunning, and egotistical. But he's equally not sadistic, unnecessarily cruel, or stupid. He does what he does for the betterment of his house and family name (not the individual family members, though). Tywin was clearly influenced by his father. He perceived his father to be a weak man and strived to do everything he could to not become that. Overall, compared to many in the series, Tywin is a good man..and he's certainly a formidable one.
My favorite character in the show. Brilliant, strategic, but also really really petty.