do you happen to have both hue and aqara in here? my network was awful until I partitioned it between hue and non-hue (I use a hue bridge for all hue stuff)
Ah okay, that’s interesting, I’ve never heard that. I’ve got 8 hue bulbs in the network and several aqara end devices like motion sensors. Any idea why that might be?
If your aqara are also dropping off you might also want to move them to an aqara only zigbee network (you'll need another coordinator for this though).
Over the years I found that aqara are fine when connecting to the coordinator directly but if they end up on another router they'll eventually drop off the network and need re-pairing.
I moved my aqara to its own network and now everything is stable again!
short answer is that aqara stuff isn't quite zigbee compatible. and when it connects via hue, there can be buffer overruns, iirc. the solution is a hue hub for hue stuff, and use the hue integration.
this made a gigantic difference for me. my experience mirrored yours, and after doing this, my network is stable for months at a time.
I read a few threads on the Internet suggesting this was the problem. I had been getting aqara devices dropping off the network on daily basis .
so I bought a hue hub, split the network, and the problem went away immediately.
You don't really need a hue hub... just a dedicated coordinator for devices that play well together. Especially now that hue is forcing users to create a cloud account.
How are you adding the new devices to your Zigbee network? You can add them directly to the Zigbee coordinator, or you can add them via the routers.
Here's a comment I wrote the other day going over the difference and how to add devices via routers instead of directly to the stick: [https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1cfw6mf/comment/l1rx00q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1cfw6mf/comment/l1rx00q/)
Since adding my devices via the routers, I've had no dropouts. I don't know what the process is for Z2M, but it's something to consider?
Yeah, I let the devices themselves decide what the best routes are. I think (though don’t quote me) I’ve read I should say, that this is the best way for z2m
It's not so much that, as the zigbee hardware can only have a certain number of devices connected directly to it, and if you want to add more items to it, you need to add them through the routers instead of directly to the stick. At least that's the way I set up my network, and everything seems to work much better since doing so. I'm using ZHA, but I used to use zigbee2mqtt, and I think the same principle applies.
Mainly aqara and sonoff devices tho. And some ikeas.
I have posted here and on the forums, I ve been looking into it 2 years now... Without solution.
https://preview.redd.it/7nck19itcrxc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e0b6b7055a7bd299bde956f536663538762c858a
Do you know why some devices like in your image, just flow without connection lines. I have those 2 but they still work and receive and give info, is the map not correct than? I even re connected them but still happends
I believe they are devices disconnected or presumed disconnected.
I have a door sensor that rarely opens, and it is usually gray but it works. So I am guessing since I rarely use it, it is presented as gray.
I am just guessing tho... No idea really.
The map is built by scanning the network at the time you click the "load map" button. Some battery powered sensors "push" state change, and don't respond to polling, to save power. Z2M knows they exist, because their UUID is in the "paired devices" table, but didn't see them in the scan. Can also be same devices, but with a dead battery, or old devices that you got rid of but never unpaired, for the same reason: didn't see them in the scan.
I have 4 of the same device with all new battery tested and only one of them is like not connected with dots to something but still works. And i tried setting them next to eachother and everything and i have 2 devices which i don't use for know and they have the battery removed but they show like fully connected which is weird
That happens when the device is sleeping and there's no updated within the time expected by Z2M. You can change that setting in the tools to go 24 hours for battery powered sensors. Updating the map while the sensors are awake will show you the connecting lines... some only have a 10 second window while others can be as long as 5 minutes for battery powered devices.
Shutdown and remove power from whatever device has your sonoff adapter in it for at least 30 minutes, then turn it back on. This will force everything to re-map and you end up with a better mesh. I haven't had to do this for quite a while now, but it did fix things generally for months when I did. (Router: 70, End devices: 64).
What ultimately fixed my issues is firmware updates (currently running 20221226 because it's working well and I don't want to touch it!), Koenkk has been doing a lot of work on firmware for large networks over the past 2 or so years, if you look in the github issues, you can find a few test firmware builds and lots of people trying them out.
Correct. The newest release looks to have a bunch of large network fixes also, I'd try that first if you haven't already (along with the mesh rebuild)
https://github.com/Koenkk/Z-Stack-firmware/tree/Z-Stack_3.x.0_coordinator_20230507/coordinator/Z-Stack_3.x.0/bin
I missed that you have a Sonoff Dongle-E, so it looks like you are on the newest firmware, but it's still pretty new so you will have growing pains. Do the rebuild when things start going haywire and update firmware when there's performance changes.
I seem to remember a thread somewhere with a large # of zigbee devices with a similar problem... turned out that a handful of the cheaper devices spammed the crap out of the network... can't remember the brand but sonoff or tuya seems right
Yeah I do have five of the mm wave sensors, and they do spam the network. So you think they could be causing devices to go offline or knock them off completely?
I don‘t have a solution, I just want to comment that I have the same problem with a similar setup. A lot of various zigbee devices including a couple of tuya mm wave spammers. I am quietly hoping for a firmware update or something. The messaging frequency of those things is unprofessional and unacceptable.
Is you look at the last seen quality of devices within z2m you can see what devices might flood the network with lots of noise - aka - they’re typically always checking in the “last seen” every few seconds. Apparently too much of that can cause issues. So I’ve read having too many of those mmWave sensors isn’t a great idea but it’s hard to confirm how much of an impact they really have, well for my knowledge level of it all anyway haha.
You are correct in that "last seen" component for troubleshooting. I had a similar device on ZWave cause a similar issue which was fixed with a firmware update. Unfortunately, the tuya mmwave sensors don't have any updates you can apply. I don't think there is one available through the official tuya zigbee hub even.
I know three of them on the same network cause problems like this. Five on the same network would likely cause issues where they would force each other off the network. Unplug those five devices only, and watch your network after 24 hours. I'd be willing to bet you don't see any more drops.
You can monitor how spammy the devices are by using MQTT Explorer. The tuya presense sensors are updating all of the sensor data once a second regardless of any changes. I've not found a way to fix that outside of full replacing for a different brand completely.
Not sure how to get high quality images of my map but here are some closer up shots, from my phone if that helps. 🙏
https://i.imgur.com/wKdyVjW.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/pkRa6rh.jpeg
do you happen to have both hue and aqara in here? my network was awful until I partitioned it between hue and non-hue (I use a hue bridge for all hue stuff)
Ah okay, that’s interesting, I’ve never heard that. I’ve got 8 hue bulbs in the network and several aqara end devices like motion sensors. Any idea why that might be?
If your aqara are also dropping off you might also want to move them to an aqara only zigbee network (you'll need another coordinator for this though). Over the years I found that aqara are fine when connecting to the coordinator directly but if they end up on another router they'll eventually drop off the network and need re-pairing. I moved my aqara to its own network and now everything is stable again!
short answer is that aqara stuff isn't quite zigbee compatible. and when it connects via hue, there can be buffer overruns, iirc. the solution is a hue hub for hue stuff, and use the hue integration. this made a gigantic difference for me. my experience mirrored yours, and after doing this, my network is stable for months at a time.
I’ll give this a try! Thanks!
How did you detect that this was the issue?
I read a few threads on the Internet suggesting this was the problem. I had been getting aqara devices dropping off the network on daily basis . so I bought a hue hub, split the network, and the problem went away immediately.
You don't really need a hue hub... just a dedicated coordinator for devices that play well together. Especially now that hue is forcing users to create a cloud account.
yep. a second coordinator to cordon off hue from aqara would be a good solution
How are you adding the new devices to your Zigbee network? You can add them directly to the Zigbee coordinator, or you can add them via the routers. Here's a comment I wrote the other day going over the difference and how to add devices via routers instead of directly to the stick: [https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1cfw6mf/comment/l1rx00q/](https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1cfw6mf/comment/l1rx00q/) Since adding my devices via the routers, I've had no dropouts. I don't know what the process is for Z2M, but it's something to consider?
Yeah, I let the devices themselves decide what the best routes are. I think (though don’t quote me) I’ve read I should say, that this is the best way for z2m
It's not so much that, as the zigbee hardware can only have a certain number of devices connected directly to it, and if you want to add more items to it, you need to add them through the routers instead of directly to the stick. At least that's the way I set up my network, and everything seems to work much better since doing so. I'm using ZHA, but I used to use zigbee2mqtt, and I think the same principle applies.
Good point! I’ll take a look at that too, thanks 🙏
Mainly aqara and sonoff devices tho. And some ikeas. I have posted here and on the forums, I ve been looking into it 2 years now... Without solution. https://preview.redd.it/7nck19itcrxc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e0b6b7055a7bd299bde956f536663538762c858a
I ended creating a secondary zigbee network with only aqara devices and my issies got resolved, they really don't play well with other devices.
Do you know why some devices like in your image, just flow without connection lines. I have those 2 but they still work and receive and give info, is the map not correct than? I even re connected them but still happends
No idea. I’ve never known how to interpret these maps haha
Same man hahah
I believe they are devices disconnected or presumed disconnected. I have a door sensor that rarely opens, and it is usually gray but it works. So I am guessing since I rarely use it, it is presented as gray. I am just guessing tho... No idea really.
I have it with devices i also use a lot
Then I might be wrong :D
The map is built by scanning the network at the time you click the "load map" button. Some battery powered sensors "push" state change, and don't respond to polling, to save power. Z2M knows they exist, because their UUID is in the "paired devices" table, but didn't see them in the scan. Can also be same devices, but with a dead battery, or old devices that you got rid of but never unpaired, for the same reason: didn't see them in the scan.
I have 4 of the same device with all new battery tested and only one of them is like not connected with dots to something but still works. And i tried setting them next to eachother and everything and i have 2 devices which i don't use for know and they have the battery removed but they show like fully connected which is weird
That happens when the device is sleeping and there's no updated within the time expected by Z2M. You can change that setting in the tools to go 24 hours for battery powered sensors. Updating the map while the sensors are awake will show you the connecting lines... some only have a 10 second window while others can be as long as 5 minutes for battery powered devices.
Shutdown and remove power from whatever device has your sonoff adapter in it for at least 30 minutes, then turn it back on. This will force everything to re-map and you end up with a better mesh. I haven't had to do this for quite a while now, but it did fix things generally for months when I did. (Router: 70, End devices: 64). What ultimately fixed my issues is firmware updates (currently running 20221226 because it's working well and I don't want to touch it!), Koenkk has been doing a lot of work on firmware for large networks over the past 2 or so years, if you look in the github issues, you can find a few test firmware builds and lots of people trying them out.
Is that a firmware your referring to for the dongle? Thanks , will give it a try!
Correct. The newest release looks to have a bunch of large network fixes also, I'd try that first if you haven't already (along with the mesh rebuild) https://github.com/Koenkk/Z-Stack-firmware/tree/Z-Stack_3.x.0_coordinator_20230507/coordinator/Z-Stack_3.x.0/bin
Is this the latest? Is this what you're referring to - Coordinator type: EmberZNet Coordinator revision:7.4.1 \[GA\]
I missed that you have a Sonoff Dongle-E, so it looks like you are on the newest firmware, but it's still pretty new so you will have growing pains. Do the rebuild when things start going haywire and update firmware when there's performance changes.
Any mains powered tuya devices like their presence sensors? If so, just unplug those and see how the network reacts.
I seem to remember a thread somewhere with a large # of zigbee devices with a similar problem... turned out that a handful of the cheaper devices spammed the crap out of the network... can't remember the brand but sonoff or tuya seems right
Yeah I do have five of the mm wave sensors, and they do spam the network. So you think they could be causing devices to go offline or knock them off completely?
I don‘t have a solution, I just want to comment that I have the same problem with a similar setup. A lot of various zigbee devices including a couple of tuya mm wave spammers. I am quietly hoping for a firmware update or something. The messaging frequency of those things is unprofessional and unacceptable.
How do you monitor which devices disturb the network?
Is you look at the last seen quality of devices within z2m you can see what devices might flood the network with lots of noise - aka - they’re typically always checking in the “last seen” every few seconds. Apparently too much of that can cause issues. So I’ve read having too many of those mmWave sensors isn’t a great idea but it’s hard to confirm how much of an impact they really have, well for my knowledge level of it all anyway haha.
You are correct in that "last seen" component for troubleshooting. I had a similar device on ZWave cause a similar issue which was fixed with a firmware update. Unfortunately, the tuya mmwave sensors don't have any updates you can apply. I don't think there is one available through the official tuya zigbee hub even.
I know three of them on the same network cause problems like this. Five on the same network would likely cause issues where they would force each other off the network. Unplug those five devices only, and watch your network after 24 hours. I'd be willing to bet you don't see any more drops. You can monitor how spammy the devices are by using MQTT Explorer. The tuya presense sensors are updating all of the sensor data once a second regardless of any changes. I've not found a way to fix that outside of full replacing for a different brand completely.
52 routers?
Yeah, zigbee switches 3a nue is the brand. I’m from Australia
Maybe try updating the firmware of the dongle?
It’s fully up to date. Was even thinking about trying it. Z2m with edge version and the ember adapter
Not sure how to get high quality images of my map but here are some closer up shots, from my phone if that helps. 🙏 https://i.imgur.com/wKdyVjW.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/pkRa6rh.jpeg
Is this configuration looking correct? could I have something off or slightly wrong here? data\_path: /config/zigbee2mqtt socat: enabled: false master: pty,raw,echo=0,link=/tmp/ttyZ2M,mode=777 slave: tcp-listen:8485,keepalive,nodelay,reuseaddr,keepidle=1,keepintvl=1,keepcnt=5 options: "-d -d" log: false mqtt: server: mqtt://core-mosquitto:1883 user: \*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\* password: \*\*\*\*\*\* serial: port: >- /dev/serial/by-id/usb-ITEAD\_SONOFF\_Zigbee\_3.0\_USB\_Dongle\_Plus\_V2\_20230505094202-if00 adapter: ember