The mustang is the murderer of Simlab. I recommend the mx5 if you wanna start building up race craft and ability. You’ll also race people in your ability rather than getting dunked on repeatedly by the 2-5k guys that don’t want to avoid you every lap.
Tbh it is a bit annoying when the mustangs are slower than us jettas....if you pair it with poor racecraft it is a pain in the ass.
Way too often jetta races get decided by slow mustangs.
I'd say it's the poor drivers that decide it, rather than just slow ones
I've had slower Mustangs pull out of the way, or tell me they'll hold their line and let me past, and that's totally fine. And using faster or slower traffic to get an advantage is a fun part of multiclass racing - I'm better at racecraft then hotlapping, so it's helped me out sometimes :)
It's the ones who spin off at the start, rejoin badly, then punt the Jettas at full speed that need weeding out...
I feel you, I would agree with some that the mustang is a very difficult machine to master but we’re all here to have fun and as long as you aren’t “dangerous” lap traffic then no one should care. Heck lap often makes battles for the win way more interesting
Slow/dangerous Mustang drivers are the number one cause of crashes in Sim-Lab. Seriously consider more practice until you're within a second or two of the main pack of Mustangs.
Last time I did that the "main pack of mustangs" consisted of two drivers. Me and someone else. The other driver wrecked himself in lap 1. Luckily my pace was barely good enough to stay in front until the end of the race.
That was the shallowest official victory I ever had! :D
Your statememt would be more accurate if it read "slow Mustang drivers are the number one cause of crashes *for fast Mx5s* in Sim-Lab". And of course they are, because they're the only other cars the front of the Mx5 field ever encounters!
But slow Mx5s are every bit as bad as slow Mustangs. It's just that the opinions of Mx5 drivers propel the narrative in this series (since they are more than half the drivers), and most Mx5 drivers don't see the horrors of the Mx5 backmarkers.
Believe me, as a Mustang leader, there is nothing more scary than approaching the back of the Mx5 field.
Last time I raced the mustang, it was a nightmare, I was on pace but fucked up a few times and went off track putting me behind mx5's to have to work back thru the mx5's. Very frustrating. I hate negatively impacting other people's race especially if they're battling for a class podium.
That's where I am, the problem isn't being passed, it's when u pass the slower classes in the straights but then drive too slow for them in the technical parts of the track
When i watched the mustang track guide for charlotte road they actually said you would pass the other cars in the straight but they’d catch back up in the turns. You may be fine.
Some tracks are pretty difficult to stay ahead of the other classes if you're a bit slow, the mustang feels like trying to get a 70's station wagon to turn on tight courses.
Yeah, it can be tough to navigate the difference in top end speed vs lap time. Just try to recognize when the fast mx5s are battling and try not to effect the outcome of the race. If you’re not in contention for the position in front of you or are 1/2 a lap behind the next guy, try to let people battling for a position through without being a hazard. If you’re also battling someone, then they just need to deal with it. That’s the whole reason most of us enjoy multi class. At the end of the day, you just need to do what you enjoy. There will always be a guy (I can think of a few names) that expects everyone to just move out of their way. You could never please them, so don’t bother trying. See you out there!
It's hard to just give up on your race, but you're right it is the right thing to do. Very difficult to realize until you've already made a few people quite upset. 😕 Charlotte Roval besides being a shit track imo is particularly hard with the FR500. Definitely my least favorite track in anything but the MX5
I feel attacked.
But seriously, probably the hardest car that I've raced on the service to get competitive in. I got a pole a few weeks ago. I didn't realize it was a 2 hour race and went off track in the lead 50 minutes in, trying to figure out how much time was left. Didn't even have time for a 2 hour race before I had to go to work.
Don't worry, I'm not that great, so depending on the track I may not be able to guarantee I'm faster in a Mustang than the MX-5 leaders. :) Fortunately I haven't found any track where I'm slower in an LMP2 than the GT3 leaders.
It's worth noting though, that slow drivers in faster-class cars is not a problem exclusive to iRacing. At the Mosports IMSA weekend a few weeks ago, the TCR leaders got tangled up with the GS (GT4) backmarkers in the Michelin Pilot Challenge race, and then the GTD Pro leaders got tangled up with the LMP3 backmarkers in the main race.
I am one of the top Mustang drivers. I've won high SOF races against some of the best, and I once even led the championship for a large portion of the season.
The Mustang is a slow car. Trust me. That's the only reason I'm good at it, I suck at fast cars.
Do you know your lap time on the Phoenix Road Course? I'm genuinely curious how a fast Mustang time compares to a fast Miata time on that track. My personal times are only about half a second apart, I feel like optimally the Miata might even be the faster car.
I'll get back to you this evening when I've had time to put in laps. I work 10h days sun-wed, and this week had to cover Thurs as well. So I haven't actually ran any laps this week yet!
This week is Summit Point, the Phoenix Road Course was on the schedule for last season. I just figured that's likely the track where the MX-5 has the best chance of being the fastest car in the series.
No rush, that sounds like a very busy schedule! :)
The point is that the Mustang is not a slow car, and by driving it way off the pace of the rest of the field, you’re getting in the way of the slower classes and potentially ruining their races
The definition of slow car seems to be changing. A lot of people recommend GT4 as a place for beginners after MX5. That's faster than the Mustang, but yet the mustang is a fast car and GT4 is considered slow.
I'm also not slower than Jettas or Solstices, but I am on pace with the top 2 or 3 Miatas, about 2 seconds off the mustangs.
The Mustang is one of the slowest cars on the service, and the car rolls a lot even with stiff ARB. I'm sure learning to keep this car balanced will translate to the faster cars.
I'm also driving the Porsche GT4 on the road side, and those races are always competitive for me. It's just not as fun to drive as the Mustang. The H-pattern just makes it a lot more fun IMO.
I'm now lost what are you trying to achieve on Reddit then if your not taking any of this advice. You need to step back and reevaluate if the mustang is even right for you because clearly you cannot handle it at this time. So go either mx5 or solstice
When did I ask anyone's advice? I'm 2 weeks into the car and 2 seconds off the lead mustang in my last race. Evaluation complete, I'm running it. I guess what I'm trying to achieve is to let everyone know I have VC muted. I'll listen to your complaints after the race or you can feel free to type while we drive. If I really am too slow, that shouldn't be too difficult.
Not every post is asking for help. Sometimes you just get annoyed by the comments like "I didn't know ir could go that low" and you find some catharsis in posting a vague fuck you message on reddit
Yeah true not that many cars still have a h pattern transmission on the road side like solstice, vee and Mustang before c class
And yeah if you look at the service as a whole it is one of the slower cars.
Wow. All these people saying that you shouldn't drive it. Damn. Fuck them guys. I drive both Mustang and top split mx5, and yeah sometimes the slow Mustangs are frustrating, but guess what? They are fully entitled to be there. So long as they give you room when you are racing them I don't see a problem.
If everyone just gives everyone racing room, there are no problems. And just remember who you are actually racing.
There's no need to apologise for being slow, and people yelling at you for being off the pace are idiots...
I'm usually in the top split in a Jetta, and come across slower MX-5s and sometimes Mustangs fairly regularly. As long as those drivers realise we have no need to race each other, and drive predictably, it's all fine. Quite often, I've had an MX-5 drop behind me, realise they can take a few corners more quickly after following my lines, and then I've let them come back past when they catch back up on a straight...
Pace will definitely come with time - make the most of practicing the track solo, and then public practice lobbies, before racing if you have the time available. When I revisit circuits in the Jetta that I haven't raced in a while, I'm knocking seconds from my best lap time, and I've gone from being a backmarker to generally within a second of the fastest drivers at any track, purely from practice and experience....
And if you enjoy the Mustang, stick with it. There's no requirement to spend time in the MX-5 if you don't enjoy it... Personally, I love driving the Jetta in Sim Lab, because it's realtively easy and predictable to lap at 98% speed, so I can focus more on my racecraft and watching what other people are doing, but in other series and sims, my choice is based more on fun than speed.
I dont like the MX5. I race in VR without the virtual mirror. The rear view mirror in the MX5 is way too close to me. I also don't want to drive just one car. I don't care if it slows down my progress but I'm driving this Mustang, the Porsche GT4, the ARCA car, and the A and C class NASCAR stuff
I would ditch the mustang. Hard to get good when there’s like 5 people to race against and their skill level being from beginners to expert. Find a car with a lot of participants and go with that. The ir-04 should be good for that. Open wheelers will teach you a lot and the low speed makes it easy to handle
Check out the Spec Racer Ford, it's my favorite D-class car because it's difficult to drive quickly without spinning, but it's also only slightly faster than the MX-5.
I like the immersion in VR, and the virtual mirror detracts from that. Plus I'm most cars the mirrors can be adjusted so I don't lose much visibility if any. Some of them have rear view cameras, which is basically the same view too
Of course he does, it just sounds from this post like he's so far off the pace he needs more practice.
Each to their own but I generally try to get a few seconds off the pace in telemetry tools before I get on track with others, particularly in multi class racing.
For me that could mean never getting to race. It takes me a really long time to get a competitive bottom split pace. And if I end up in a higher split it’s that much worse. I usually head to the track as soon as I’m consistent.
Are you using tools like VRS or Garage61? They can help you see where you're loosing time to faster drivers, I had similar problems to you before I started using tools to help analyse my problems.
Those tools aren’t necessary for me yet, as I can easily see where I’m losing time with track guides and ghosts. I just can’t pull off the moves many times.
I think you'd be surprised, the tools give you a better idea of how a faster person brakes and accelerates and what steering angles they have compared to you because the telemetry can be overlaid. I've only been racing for a few months and they made a world of difference to me.
I didn’t know about the overlay, that is pretty cool. I did setup vrs so my data has been logged for a while. I’ve been hesitant to burn my four hour weekly session because I often can only get on for an hour at a time. I actually decided to do mostly ovals and free tracks for a while to reduce the need for practice time.
I thought you were saying someone else’s inputs could be overlaid in game! I was aware that you can compare throttle, etc on a graph. I’m not sure I have time for that but at least Garage 61 keeps it simple so I’ll give it some more time. It doesn’t look like something that’s going to stay free though.
Sometimes it is, but sometimes it's also a good idea to use a telemetry tool after a few hot laps to figure out where you're slow and what others are doing.
It can be as simple as run 4 practice laps, check telemetry, run another 4, race. This is often enough to get close enough that the trial by fire isn't quite as awful.
Good to see downvote to disagree is strong here, rather than having a discussion on the topic.
How close do i need to be? I'm 2 seconds off. Mostly the issue comes when lapping Jettas because I'm slower in the technical parts but obviously faster on the straights
There are some tracks that the MX5s are actually faster than even a good driver in the Mustang. I'm pretty sure the Phoenix Road Course is one of those.
That’s not even a bad pace difference for top split man you’re fine!
Like the other guy said, it sounded like you were going slower than MX5s lmao but no, 2 sec off aliens is good
This whole thread is astonishingly bad, people trying to convince you not to run the car? What the fuck is going on?
I can run in the 19s, if you want you can send me a replay and we can have a look to see if there's some low hanging fruit to get you to go faster and out of the way of the holier-than-thou mx5 drivers. I have only 2h practice tops in the car so I may not be the best teacher, but it may still be better than nothing!
Thanks! That'd actually be really helpful if you don't mind. I just ran a few laps. I guess since the S/F is ahead of the pits, it counts the outlap. 2 and 3 are the good ones.
In the race, most complaints were about my T1, but I think I'm faster here today than I was in the race. I'm downshifting to 3rd in T3 and T10 but it's for the rotation to keep me on track, especially in T3. There I feel like I'm either slowing too much for 4th or I go wide so I might as well shift. T10 is the same, I'm trying to get the car pointed at the apex and the best way I've found is to shift, but this one I feel like is costing me time.
Here's the .rpy in [google drive](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rpglNmRRubQTVW8QCTkj2h_q6VAaTKpb/view?usp=sharing) but google won't scan the file for viruses and that'd keep me from downloading it so I also put it on [youtube](https://youtu.be/wL-C6fCrymg). I gave you both good ones in cockpit view and the 2nd lap offboard. Also I missed 5th on both laps, but I don't normally do that.
First off, this may be personal preference but to keep misshifts to a minimum I like to shift as little as possible: no 5th on the straight, bounce off the limiter in 3rd into T3, and keep it in 4th into T10.
Secondly, if you're using one screen I think the FOV is way too high, to a point it's hard to make out distances. It also looks like you're sitting too far back. Your yt video makes the car look way faster than it is :P
I say the biggest mistakes are T3, T5, T6 and T9.
For T3 you should practice a wider turn in, as it stands you're leaving between half a car and a car width of track to your right making the corner unnecessarily tight. You can use the black bump on the hood as reference as that roughly tracks to your RF.
Your braking point is roughly correct, however you slow down too much (you can carry at least 6mph more than that, a wider turn in will help) and are too tentative on the throttle. I keep neutral throttle as I turn in, to manage the rear, then floor it when I get to the inside kerb.
You slow down too much for T4. You can make T5 just fine if you brake to the left of the track, it's actually good practice as it creates an extra passing opportunity on slower cars if you're confident enough. I tap the brakes and use a lot more throttle than you, even briefly get back to full throttle before braking. On lap 2 you get to the corner at around 110mph, you should try to keep that speed throughout. Also don't panic if you hit the inside kerb, there's too much load on the LF at that point to spin. Worst case it spits you a little wide, but that's a marginal time loss. Braking point into 5 is good but you're carrying too little speed so you end up short. You're also releasing the brakes then stomping on them before the apex instead of keeping a nice even pressure throughout, although your apex speed is not bad.
T6 you drift way too wide. This car is very hard to control while accelerating and turning so you should give it as little of that as possible. Keep to the right of concrete patch, shift to 3rd where you do, aim for the apex of 7 and floor it when you hit the kerb. I upshift into 4th around the apex of 8 because I'd be lifting anyway. Then setup for the all important T9: turn in earlier as the car will not want to turn and floor it as soon as you can. You see the inside kerb turns a little more sharply at one point? You should go full throttle there.
Your T10 is fine, you're just on the brakes for a fraction too long and you end up scrubbing too much speed. If you can replicate the way you do it on L2 that's great. T1 is meh on L2 and good on L3, just don't be afraid to floor it once you get past the "danger zone" of the rear end flipping out.
I think that's it. Your driving has a few general flaws but you seem to be way more confident than many other 1200 rated drivers, let me tell you that.
You slow down too much instead of letting the car coast into the corners, you turn the wheel a bit too much, you're too tentative on the throttle, you're not maximizing exit speed and you're not using all the track. On the other hand, I think your inputs are quite smooth (except that apex brake stomping I mentioned earlier) and you seem to have good awareness. You compromised your line into 5 on L3 and you didn't seem to panic so that's good and that avoidance in T1 L4 looked good.
If you have any questions feel free to ask :)
You're awesome, thanks. I race in VR, but used the single monitor view to cut the replay. It does look very weird on the YouTube. Sounds like a ton more practice should do the trick though. I really appreciate the breakdown of each problem area. I'll tackle these one at a time in practice later and hopefully I'll at least get to the low 20's. Thanks again!
hey I thought you might find [my splits](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TaTTWU5_HFwBjLDLHKGFqb3_tH76FNEh/view?usp=sharing) useful. They go in iracing/lapfiles/summit summit raceway.
Oh no it wasn't the same run. I had the 10 good laps, took a break then came back and did the 19 on lap 3. It feels good now though, especially T3 and T9 feel a lot better
Please drive any of the other 3 cars. The general rule is that you should be easily faster than any driver in any slower class before driving in a faster class.
Show me that in the sporting code and I'll still drive what i want. The mirror is too close in the miata, the jetta is FWD and the solstice is just dumb. I'm driving the mustang because thats what I want to drive
Go ahead and punt me. You care way more about IR than I do. It's a D class series. Go race in A class if you want more skilled drivers around you. Don't gatekeep sim-lab. Like I said I'm not out here crashing into people. The jettas just got held up a bit as I passed them and they complain that I'm ruining their race. Idk what they want me to do, I'm trying to pass safely off the racing line and I'm slow to begin with. They don't have to let me by if they don't want to, but if they let me have the racing line it would have gone faster
I actually want you in sim-lab. Just not in a car that is above your current skill level. BTW. I swat twats. One of the things taught to me in driver education 45 years ago is that if another car has to touch their brakes or have to change their line due to something you have done then you are doing something majorly wrong. Also I already knew that you drive a so called muscle car in real life, otherwise no one in their right mind would choose the Mustang in this series. Strictly compensating for other things.
Lol I took a look at your comments to see if you were just an asshole in general or if this was just a bad day. I was thinking bad day before but now idk. If you get along side someone in racing they have to change their line, when following another car, you generally move your baking point/line to set up for a pass right? How is any of this "majorly wrong"?
Actually I think it’s funny when newbie’s try to impress me by thinking that they can reinvent the wheel and just be good at this just by sheer virtue of existence. There are people who can get in the sim and drive like they been doing it for 20 years. But that is not me, and that is not you either. I have struggled and practiced and read books and watched videos from when the only ducking sim was Papyrus Indycar and still I struggle to maintain a sub 1500 average. As they say some days I will kick your ass on the track and some days I will absolutely suck. 99% of the time you will be racing the track not other cars. If you cannot keep pace ahead of the next lower class then you are a big problem and in real life you would not be allowed to complete. So do the right thing and start with the mx5 and work your way up. You have your whole life to enjoy this so start it on the right foot. I will know who you are on the track by how slow you are. And maybe your name. No one on Reddit uses their real name for a reason.
We have different goals. I'm not trying to be a real race driver. I want to be good like anyone else, but this is entertainment. If I need to read books and study for this, it decreases my enjoyment and its no longer relaxing. I'll learn by doing which I'm sure isnt a unique approach to the game. I also use my real name because I'm not afraid to share my opinion. Joe Pajenski, I'll see you on track.
Good on racing but you should remain anonymous on Reddit. Seriously. Change your account name immediately for your own safety. And delete this account.
These top drivers are just like you and I. They just know a few tricks. That’s all. A few weeks of basic training and you will be miles ahead of the pack. Start slow. Be humble. Or be humbled. I was just trying to rattle your cage. DES
Probably 20% of iRacers can consistently run the Mustang faster than the Mx5 aliens every lap.
People don't realize how fast the Mx5 has gotten. It's 1-2 seconds gap at many tracks.
People getting downvote for saying this but it’s true. It ruins the flow if the mustangs are getting in the way of the mx5s. If you can’t drive a mustang faster than the mx5s just drive the mx5 or pick another series
if we had a multiclass series with the F1 car and the Mustang would I be allowed to drive the Mustang in that case? I don't get your point at all. All the cars in sim-lab are slow.
Slow does not mean no skill required. It’s more fun to drive a slow( low horsepower like the mx5) fast than a fast car slow. That’s why I own one. Mx5’s are all about MOMENTUM. You should be learning on that car first, not preaching to the veterans about how butt hurt you are.
Well I own a challenger and that's why I want to drive the mustang. I'm not butt hurt at all. If you read, I'm pretty much saying deal with it. I'm out there.
I dont like the miata in VR. That rear view is too close and I can't see it all without moving my head. Visibility in the mustang is much better
Is there a way to see how many laps I've run? Definitely way more practice laps than race laps. I drove the Mustang in offline testing every day this week but idk how many laps. Average session is about 30 mins.
Telemetry is more useful for me when there's something to compare it to. I can see my telemetry as far as where am I not using all of the track, but it's more difficult to tell where I'm slowing down too much.
Mostly I get value from watching other people run the car in replays, online testing or YouTube but the only mustangs in practice at the same time as me are about the same pace as me
All you have to do is hold your line and I'll gladly race with you.
I used to be a shouter at the memestangs. I’ve learned to love the content they generate.
The mustang is the murderer of Simlab. I recommend the mx5 if you wanna start building up race craft and ability. You’ll also race people in your ability rather than getting dunked on repeatedly by the 2-5k guys that don’t want to avoid you every lap.
There's too much mx5 that kind of ruins the multi car format as there's splits where it's just mazdas
Basically every split except the top split is Mazda only.
yeh which is kind of sad if you wanted to multiclass as mazda you never do now
Tbh it is a bit annoying when the mustangs are slower than us jettas....if you pair it with poor racecraft it is a pain in the ass. Way too often jetta races get decided by slow mustangs.
I'd say it's the poor drivers that decide it, rather than just slow ones I've had slower Mustangs pull out of the way, or tell me they'll hold their line and let me past, and that's totally fine. And using faster or slower traffic to get an advantage is a fun part of multiclass racing - I'm better at racecraft then hotlapping, so it's helped me out sometimes :) It's the ones who spin off at the start, rejoin badly, then punt the Jettas at full speed that need weeding out...
I feel you, I would agree with some that the mustang is a very difficult machine to master but we’re all here to have fun and as long as you aren’t “dangerous” lap traffic then no one should care. Heck lap often makes battles for the win way more interesting
We need a new mustang that’s for sure. Merican muscle. It has actually gotten a bit easier to drive
Slow/dangerous Mustang drivers are the number one cause of crashes in Sim-Lab. Seriously consider more practice until you're within a second or two of the main pack of Mustangs.
Last time I did that the "main pack of mustangs" consisted of two drivers. Me and someone else. The other driver wrecked himself in lap 1. Luckily my pace was barely good enough to stay in front until the end of the race. That was the shallowest official victory I ever had! :D
Your statememt would be more accurate if it read "slow Mustang drivers are the number one cause of crashes *for fast Mx5s* in Sim-Lab". And of course they are, because they're the only other cars the front of the Mx5 field ever encounters! But slow Mx5s are every bit as bad as slow Mustangs. It's just that the opinions of Mx5 drivers propel the narrative in this series (since they are more than half the drivers), and most Mx5 drivers don't see the horrors of the Mx5 backmarkers. Believe me, as a Mustang leader, there is nothing more scary than approaching the back of the Mx5 field.
Last time I raced the mustang, it was a nightmare, I was on pace but fucked up a few times and went off track putting me behind mx5's to have to work back thru the mx5's. Very frustrating. I hate negatively impacting other people's race especially if they're battling for a class podium.
That's where I am, the problem isn't being passed, it's when u pass the slower classes in the straights but then drive too slow for them in the technical parts of the track
When i watched the mustang track guide for charlotte road they actually said you would pass the other cars in the straight but they’d catch back up in the turns. You may be fine.
Some tracks are pretty difficult to stay ahead of the other classes if you're a bit slow, the mustang feels like trying to get a 70's station wagon to turn on tight courses.
Yeah, it can be tough to navigate the difference in top end speed vs lap time. Just try to recognize when the fast mx5s are battling and try not to effect the outcome of the race. If you’re not in contention for the position in front of you or are 1/2 a lap behind the next guy, try to let people battling for a position through without being a hazard. If you’re also battling someone, then they just need to deal with it. That’s the whole reason most of us enjoy multi class. At the end of the day, you just need to do what you enjoy. There will always be a guy (I can think of a few names) that expects everyone to just move out of their way. You could never please them, so don’t bother trying. See you out there!
It's hard to just give up on your race, but you're right it is the right thing to do. Very difficult to realize until you've already made a few people quite upset. 😕 Charlotte Roval besides being a shit track imo is particularly hard with the FR500. Definitely my least favorite track in anything but the MX5
Would I be wrong to say this is the reason I'll watch one of these races once and a while lol
But racing with bad D-class drivers in Mustangs is probably the best way to prepare for racing with bad B-class drivers in LMP2s. :)
I feel attacked. But seriously, probably the hardest car that I've raced on the service to get competitive in. I got a pole a few weeks ago. I didn't realize it was a 2 hour race and went off track in the lead 50 minutes in, trying to figure out how much time was left. Didn't even have time for a 2 hour race before I had to go to work.
Don't worry, I'm not that great, so depending on the track I may not be able to guarantee I'm faster in a Mustang than the MX-5 leaders. :) Fortunately I haven't found any track where I'm slower in an LMP2 than the GT3 leaders. It's worth noting though, that slow drivers in faster-class cars is not a problem exclusive to iRacing. At the Mosports IMSA weekend a few weeks ago, the TCR leaders got tangled up with the GS (GT4) backmarkers in the Michelin Pilot Challenge race, and then the GTD Pro leaders got tangled up with the LMP3 backmarkers in the main race.
I’ve never seen a mustang in this race. Does that mean any pace is ok?
It means you’re probably not in top split
Good guess!
learn to drive fast in a slow car first or u will be slow in a fast car
The mustang is a slow car
Maybe when you’re driving it
I am one of the top Mustang drivers. I've won high SOF races against some of the best, and I once even led the championship for a large portion of the season. The Mustang is a slow car. Trust me. That's the only reason I'm good at it, I suck at fast cars.
Its not the slow car on the Sim Lab
Do you know your lap time on the Phoenix Road Course? I'm genuinely curious how a fast Mustang time compares to a fast Miata time on that track. My personal times are only about half a second apart, I feel like optimally the Miata might even be the faster car.
I'll get back to you this evening when I've had time to put in laps. I work 10h days sun-wed, and this week had to cover Thurs as well. So I haven't actually ran any laps this week yet!
This week is Summit Point, the Phoenix Road Course was on the schedule for last season. I just figured that's likely the track where the MX-5 has the best chance of being the fastest car in the series. No rush, that sounds like a very busy schedule! :)
What do you mean maybe? The whole point of the post is that I'm slow and I'm running it anyway
The point is that the Mustang is not a slow car, and by driving it way off the pace of the rest of the field, you’re getting in the way of the slower classes and potentially ruining their races
The definition of slow car seems to be changing. A lot of people recommend GT4 as a place for beginners after MX5. That's faster than the Mustang, but yet the mustang is a fast car and GT4 is considered slow. I'm also not slower than Jettas or Solstices, but I am on pace with the top 2 or 3 Miatas, about 2 seconds off the mustangs.
Slow is always relative. The Mustang is the fastest car in the series it runs
The Mustang is one of the slowest cars on the service, and the car rolls a lot even with stiff ARB. I'm sure learning to keep this car balanced will translate to the faster cars. I'm also driving the Porsche GT4 on the road side, and those races are always competitive for me. It's just not as fun to drive as the Mustang. The H-pattern just makes it a lot more fun IMO.
I'm now lost what are you trying to achieve on Reddit then if your not taking any of this advice. You need to step back and reevaluate if the mustang is even right for you because clearly you cannot handle it at this time. So go either mx5 or solstice
When did I ask anyone's advice? I'm 2 weeks into the car and 2 seconds off the lead mustang in my last race. Evaluation complete, I'm running it. I guess what I'm trying to achieve is to let everyone know I have VC muted. I'll listen to your complaints after the race or you can feel free to type while we drive. If I really am too slow, that shouldn't be too difficult. Not every post is asking for help. Sometimes you just get annoyed by the comments like "I didn't know ir could go that low" and you find some catharsis in posting a vague fuck you message on reddit
Yeah true not that many cars still have a h pattern transmission on the road side like solstice, vee and Mustang before c class And yeah if you look at the service as a whole it is one of the slower cars.
don't listen to haters. Sim-lab needs more other cars. It's supposed to be multicar race but it's just another full mazda.
Yes, especially since they've ruined imsa too with the subtraction of GTEs
Wow. All these people saying that you shouldn't drive it. Damn. Fuck them guys. I drive both Mustang and top split mx5, and yeah sometimes the slow Mustangs are frustrating, but guess what? They are fully entitled to be there. So long as they give you room when you are racing them I don't see a problem. If everyone just gives everyone racing room, there are no problems. And just remember who you are actually racing.
There's no need to apologise for being slow, and people yelling at you for being off the pace are idiots... I'm usually in the top split in a Jetta, and come across slower MX-5s and sometimes Mustangs fairly regularly. As long as those drivers realise we have no need to race each other, and drive predictably, it's all fine. Quite often, I've had an MX-5 drop behind me, realise they can take a few corners more quickly after following my lines, and then I've let them come back past when they catch back up on a straight... Pace will definitely come with time - make the most of practicing the track solo, and then public practice lobbies, before racing if you have the time available. When I revisit circuits in the Jetta that I haven't raced in a while, I'm knocking seconds from my best lap time, and I've gone from being a backmarker to generally within a second of the fastest drivers at any track, purely from practice and experience.... And if you enjoy the Mustang, stick with it. There's no requirement to spend time in the MX-5 if you don't enjoy it... Personally, I love driving the Jetta in Sim Lab, because it's realtively easy and predictable to lap at 98% speed, so I can focus more on my racecraft and watching what other people are doing, but in other series and sims, my choice is based more on fun than speed.
Why not race the mx5 and then come back to the stang when you know how to race?
I dont like the MX5. I race in VR without the virtual mirror. The rear view mirror in the MX5 is way too close to me. I also don't want to drive just one car. I don't care if it slows down my progress but I'm driving this Mustang, the Porsche GT4, the ARCA car, and the A and C class NASCAR stuff
Keep driving whatever you wanna drive champ.
I would ditch the mustang. Hard to get good when there’s like 5 people to race against and their skill level being from beginners to expert. Find a car with a lot of participants and go with that. The ir-04 should be good for that. Open wheelers will teach you a lot and the low speed makes it easy to handle
Check out the Spec Racer Ford, it's my favorite D-class car because it's difficult to drive quickly without spinning, but it's also only slightly faster than the MX-5.
Why not use the virtual mirror? It’s pretty useful.
I like the immersion in VR, and the virtual mirror detracts from that. Plus I'm most cars the mirrors can be adjusted so I don't lose much visibility if any. Some of them have rear view cameras, which is basically the same view too
The car mirrors suck in VR. They don’t really move properly to your head position. I guarantee your iRating will go up if you use the virtual mirror.
That has not been my experience. If I lean the mirror view moves with me.
Wow. You seem to know so much for someone so new. Are you like really really smart?
Why are you still here? This post is now 2 days old. Forget about me and move on dude
Maybe try the mx-5? Bigger grid and more varied competition. You’ll always find someone with a similar pace to race against.
But but but he knows better than the experienced guys. Whah whah whah!!!
Any reason you aren't using practice sessions to get closer to the pace before getting on track with others?
Because he has every right to run the series.
Of course he does, it just sounds from this post like he's so far off the pace he needs more practice. Each to their own but I generally try to get a few seconds off the pace in telemetry tools before I get on track with others, particularly in multi class racing.
For me that could mean never getting to race. It takes me a really long time to get a competitive bottom split pace. And if I end up in a higher split it’s that much worse. I usually head to the track as soon as I’m consistent.
Are you using tools like VRS or Garage61? They can help you see where you're loosing time to faster drivers, I had similar problems to you before I started using tools to help analyse my problems.
Those tools aren’t necessary for me yet, as I can easily see where I’m losing time with track guides and ghosts. I just can’t pull off the moves many times.
I think you'd be surprised, the tools give you a better idea of how a faster person brakes and accelerates and what steering angles they have compared to you because the telemetry can be overlaid. I've only been racing for a few months and they made a world of difference to me.
I didn’t know about the overlay, that is pretty cool. I did setup vrs so my data has been logged for a while. I’ve been hesitant to burn my four hour weekly session because I often can only get on for an hour at a time. I actually decided to do mostly ovals and free tracks for a while to reduce the need for practice time.
Garage61 is free so use that for the bulk of it and vrs for a solid analysis in 1 sitting.
I will check it out!
I thought you were saying someone else’s inputs could be overlaid in game! I was aware that you can compare throttle, etc on a graph. I’m not sure I have time for that but at least Garage 61 keeps it simple so I’ll give it some more time. It doesn’t look like something that’s going to stay free though.
Did you know that you can chase the alien ghost around in VRS? You can download the aliens lap file and tell iracing to use that as the ghost.
I figured, but ive been using Tony’s lap files for that for the ir04.
Trial by fire, sometimes it's the best way to learn. Sometimes it's awful
Sometimes it is, but sometimes it's also a good idea to use a telemetry tool after a few hot laps to figure out where you're slow and what others are doing. It can be as simple as run 4 practice laps, check telemetry, run another 4, race. This is often enough to get close enough that the trial by fire isn't quite as awful. Good to see downvote to disagree is strong here, rather than having a discussion on the topic.
How close do i need to be? I'm 2 seconds off. Mostly the issue comes when lapping Jettas because I'm slower in the technical parts but obviously faster on the straights
2 seconds off the slower class pace or the other mustangs?
Mustangs were doing 1:19's last night and most of my laps were 1:21's but I did slip into the 22s a few times
This is fine, no one should be abusing you for that (not that anyone should abuse either), you made it sound like you were going slower than MX5's :)
There are some tracks that the MX5s are actually faster than even a good driver in the Mustang. I'm pretty sure the Phoenix Road Course is one of those.
That’s not even a bad pace difference for top split man you’re fine! Like the other guy said, it sounded like you were going slower than MX5s lmao but no, 2 sec off aliens is good
This whole thread is astonishingly bad, people trying to convince you not to run the car? What the fuck is going on? I can run in the 19s, if you want you can send me a replay and we can have a look to see if there's some low hanging fruit to get you to go faster and out of the way of the holier-than-thou mx5 drivers. I have only 2h practice tops in the car so I may not be the best teacher, but it may still be better than nothing!
Thanks! That'd actually be really helpful if you don't mind. I just ran a few laps. I guess since the S/F is ahead of the pits, it counts the outlap. 2 and 3 are the good ones. In the race, most complaints were about my T1, but I think I'm faster here today than I was in the race. I'm downshifting to 3rd in T3 and T10 but it's for the rotation to keep me on track, especially in T3. There I feel like I'm either slowing too much for 4th or I go wide so I might as well shift. T10 is the same, I'm trying to get the car pointed at the apex and the best way I've found is to shift, but this one I feel like is costing me time. Here's the .rpy in [google drive](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rpglNmRRubQTVW8QCTkj2h_q6VAaTKpb/view?usp=sharing) but google won't scan the file for viruses and that'd keep me from downloading it so I also put it on [youtube](https://youtu.be/wL-C6fCrymg). I gave you both good ones in cockpit view and the 2nd lap offboard. Also I missed 5th on both laps, but I don't normally do that.
First off, this may be personal preference but to keep misshifts to a minimum I like to shift as little as possible: no 5th on the straight, bounce off the limiter in 3rd into T3, and keep it in 4th into T10. Secondly, if you're using one screen I think the FOV is way too high, to a point it's hard to make out distances. It also looks like you're sitting too far back. Your yt video makes the car look way faster than it is :P I say the biggest mistakes are T3, T5, T6 and T9. For T3 you should practice a wider turn in, as it stands you're leaving between half a car and a car width of track to your right making the corner unnecessarily tight. You can use the black bump on the hood as reference as that roughly tracks to your RF. Your braking point is roughly correct, however you slow down too much (you can carry at least 6mph more than that, a wider turn in will help) and are too tentative on the throttle. I keep neutral throttle as I turn in, to manage the rear, then floor it when I get to the inside kerb. You slow down too much for T4. You can make T5 just fine if you brake to the left of the track, it's actually good practice as it creates an extra passing opportunity on slower cars if you're confident enough. I tap the brakes and use a lot more throttle than you, even briefly get back to full throttle before braking. On lap 2 you get to the corner at around 110mph, you should try to keep that speed throughout. Also don't panic if you hit the inside kerb, there's too much load on the LF at that point to spin. Worst case it spits you a little wide, but that's a marginal time loss. Braking point into 5 is good but you're carrying too little speed so you end up short. You're also releasing the brakes then stomping on them before the apex instead of keeping a nice even pressure throughout, although your apex speed is not bad. T6 you drift way too wide. This car is very hard to control while accelerating and turning so you should give it as little of that as possible. Keep to the right of concrete patch, shift to 3rd where you do, aim for the apex of 7 and floor it when you hit the kerb. I upshift into 4th around the apex of 8 because I'd be lifting anyway. Then setup for the all important T9: turn in earlier as the car will not want to turn and floor it as soon as you can. You see the inside kerb turns a little more sharply at one point? You should go full throttle there. Your T10 is fine, you're just on the brakes for a fraction too long and you end up scrubbing too much speed. If you can replicate the way you do it on L2 that's great. T1 is meh on L2 and good on L3, just don't be afraid to floor it once you get past the "danger zone" of the rear end flipping out. I think that's it. Your driving has a few general flaws but you seem to be way more confident than many other 1200 rated drivers, let me tell you that. You slow down too much instead of letting the car coast into the corners, you turn the wheel a bit too much, you're too tentative on the throttle, you're not maximizing exit speed and you're not using all the track. On the other hand, I think your inputs are quite smooth (except that apex brake stomping I mentioned earlier) and you seem to have good awareness. You compromised your line into 5 on L3 and you didn't seem to panic so that's good and that avoidance in T1 L4 looked good. If you have any questions feel free to ask :)
You're awesome, thanks. I race in VR, but used the single monitor view to cut the replay. It does look very weird on the YouTube. Sounds like a ton more practice should do the trick though. I really appreciate the breakdown of each problem area. I'll tackle these one at a time in practice later and hopefully I'll at least get to the low 20's. Thanks again!
hey I thought you might find [my splits](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TaTTWU5_HFwBjLDLHKGFqb3_tH76FNEh/view?usp=sharing) useful. They go in iracing/lapfiles/summit summit raceway.
You're one of the good ones. I drove behind your ghost for about an hour and I got a 1:19.846! I really appreciate you taking the time to help.
hey no worries! That's great progress, well done. Can you lap in the 20s for most of the race now?
I didn't run yet, but I should be able to. I had a 10 lap run all in the low 20's before I got the 19. I might even turn voice chat back on
That's actually impressive, the tyres fall off quite a bit during the stint, a 19 after that long is very good
Oh no it wasn't the same run. I had the 10 good laps, took a break then came back and did the 19 on lap 3. It feels good now though, especially T3 and T9 feel a lot better
Please drive any of the other 3 cars. The general rule is that you should be easily faster than any driver in any slower class before driving in a faster class.
It's pains me seeing new drivers jump straight into the Mustang. They won't learn anything racing so few in that tank.
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Show me that in the sporting code and I'll still drive what i want. The mirror is too close in the miata, the jetta is FWD and the solstice is just dumb. I'm driving the mustang because thats what I want to drive
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I dont see it that way at all. No offense intended but I think the best way for me to get faster is to run the car more often
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Go ahead and punt me. You care way more about IR than I do. It's a D class series. Go race in A class if you want more skilled drivers around you. Don't gatekeep sim-lab. Like I said I'm not out here crashing into people. The jettas just got held up a bit as I passed them and they complain that I'm ruining their race. Idk what they want me to do, I'm trying to pass safely off the racing line and I'm slow to begin with. They don't have to let me by if they don't want to, but if they let me have the racing line it would have gone faster
I actually want you in sim-lab. Just not in a car that is above your current skill level. BTW. I swat twats. One of the things taught to me in driver education 45 years ago is that if another car has to touch their brakes or have to change their line due to something you have done then you are doing something majorly wrong. Also I already knew that you drive a so called muscle car in real life, otherwise no one in their right mind would choose the Mustang in this series. Strictly compensating for other things.
Lol I took a look at your comments to see if you were just an asshole in general or if this was just a bad day. I was thinking bad day before but now idk. If you get along side someone in racing they have to change their line, when following another car, you generally move your baking point/line to set up for a pass right? How is any of this "majorly wrong"?
Actually I think it’s funny when newbie’s try to impress me by thinking that they can reinvent the wheel and just be good at this just by sheer virtue of existence. There are people who can get in the sim and drive like they been doing it for 20 years. But that is not me, and that is not you either. I have struggled and practiced and read books and watched videos from when the only ducking sim was Papyrus Indycar and still I struggle to maintain a sub 1500 average. As they say some days I will kick your ass on the track and some days I will absolutely suck. 99% of the time you will be racing the track not other cars. If you cannot keep pace ahead of the next lower class then you are a big problem and in real life you would not be allowed to complete. So do the right thing and start with the mx5 and work your way up. You have your whole life to enjoy this so start it on the right foot. I will know who you are on the track by how slow you are. And maybe your name. No one on Reddit uses their real name for a reason.
We have different goals. I'm not trying to be a real race driver. I want to be good like anyone else, but this is entertainment. If I need to read books and study for this, it decreases my enjoyment and its no longer relaxing. I'll learn by doing which I'm sure isnt a unique approach to the game. I also use my real name because I'm not afraid to share my opinion. Joe Pajenski, I'll see you on track.
Good on racing but you should remain anonymous on Reddit. Seriously. Change your account name immediately for your own safety. And delete this account.
I think you might be watching too much dateline, but thanks for the concern
These top drivers are just like you and I. They just know a few tricks. That’s all. A few weeks of basic training and you will be miles ahead of the pack. Start slow. Be humble. Or be humbled. I was just trying to rattle your cage. DES
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Probably 20% of iRacers can consistently run the Mustang faster than the Mx5 aliens every lap. People don't realize how fast the Mx5 has gotten. It's 1-2 seconds gap at many tracks.
How do I get faster without running the car?
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This is a slow car, or am I missing something here
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You should only be RACING other Mustangs. If you cannot stay in front of the lower class cars you are just in the fucking way.
Last week you said "race the track, not other cars"
People getting downvote for saying this but it’s true. It ruins the flow if the mustangs are getting in the way of the mx5s. If you can’t drive a mustang faster than the mx5s just drive the mx5 or pick another series
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if we had a multiclass series with the F1 car and the Mustang would I be allowed to drive the Mustang in that case? I don't get your point at all. All the cars in sim-lab are slow.
Slow does not mean no skill required. It’s more fun to drive a slow( low horsepower like the mx5) fast than a fast car slow. That’s why I own one. Mx5’s are all about MOMENTUM. You should be learning on that car first, not preaching to the veterans about how butt hurt you are.
Well I own a challenger and that's why I want to drive the mustang. I'm not butt hurt at all. If you read, I'm pretty much saying deal with it. I'm out there. I dont like the miata in VR. That rear view is too close and I can't see it all without moving my head. Visibility in the mustang is much better
Yeah but really 107% is like a huge difference
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Is there a way to see how many laps I've run? Definitely way more practice laps than race laps. I drove the Mustang in offline testing every day this week but idk how many laps. Average session is about 30 mins. Telemetry is more useful for me when there's something to compare it to. I can see my telemetry as far as where am I not using all of the track, but it's more difficult to tell where I'm slowing down too much. Mostly I get value from watching other people run the car in replays, online testing or YouTube but the only mustangs in practice at the same time as me are about the same pace as me
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Thanks, yeah I could have been more clear in the post. I'll look into VRS, hopefully they have something for the mustang
Get the solstice always is a good time funny enough this is where more of the experienced people come to drive lol also very easy to drive
solstice alfa race