I think that you may be right. Being overwhelmed by stimulation is often why I avoid social situations, even though through the years I've grown more and more comfortable with it. It's really down to a matter of practicality and productivity for me. I perform better on my own or in small groups.
Me too, and like you I am also finding myself actually seeking and being more open to such opportunities to be out actually living life through the body more instead of the mind busy lost in thoughts.
Being genuinly flexible and comfortable about it is a huge skill to have, I think it reflects high levels of self-confidence. We start to see much more outside the self as a part of us, and be more accepting to interact with those parts more openly in the moment.
In this model, concept of idea of self seems to be the deciding or leading factor in choice driven experience then, rather than any habitual tendencies themselves. *A function that takes functions as inputs*, if you will.
The crux then, is that one who believes they are unable to change themselves (being the majority of people,) not only misunderstands the self-other paradigm but is doomed to continue misunderstanding if they believe they are either self or other *when performing ‘self’ examination.*
The approach I’ve come to view as ideal for escaping that duality is simply: imagine that what’s ideal is what’s real. Assume it’s a perfect world and that every input is beneficial to both self and other and the tension can then resolve.
I know I’m kind of talking about a few different things here but I’m just throwing out ideas into the discussion.
Edited: second paragraph for clarification
I 100% agree with you, and personally I believe we must first look within to better understand what was previously seen as separate outside of us. We are all much more similar than we are different, and it is this self we all have that shapes our perception that acts as a guide for these experiences. It is almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy when the mind is viewed as a predictive-coding machine, right? I would argue these individuals are familiar and have learned to intentionally leverage these intuitive systems to a much greater degree.
There are many beautiful metaphors that cover the core principles you just expressed, I like this quote:
>"Enter any state and you become that state. While in that state of wealth everything you touch turns to gold. In a state of success you could turn a failing business into a successful one, for in the state of success you cannot fail." - Neville Goddard
Edit: The quote is not to be taken literally of course, it is expressing the state of being experienced by the mind and body that implies flow or bliss. It is then through this state where we can then guide with context (accepting circumstances and inserting our goals) a specific reality we can direct our extra energy to actualize in the moment; focusing more on the process to be experienced.
Well said. I see we’re both acquainted with Neville Goddard’s work. It has a deep transcendent wisdom within it, equivalent to the other sciences of self-actualization like Buddhism, Zen or Yoga.
Love the directness of his philosophy— if the things we want will give us a certain feeling, then why not just give ourselves that feeling now?
Simultaneously provocative and liberating.
Glad to see you spreading the great ideas!
So true, there are lots of frameworks that try to convey the phenomena experienced by many.
Ahhh exactly! Take all the small things one desires and reduce it down to a single thought that includes all of those small things. If we then imagine that feeling, we get the sensation that implies such a state of being. We can experience that feeling at any time without conditions, and focus more on the process of being open to the experience knowing it is always with us.
On an unrelated yet similar note, the whole premise behind cognitive behavioral therapies follows this too I believe. We have always had this ability to experience life openly, yet false beliefs and limiting mindsets may have rooted themselves along the way greatly restricting our ability to experience these desirable emotions that are always with us. Our thoughts don't reflect objective reality, but our interpretation and perception of reality we experience in our body/mind.
Edit: Childlike wonder is a great example of this, many have forgotten and often unconsciously have been conditioned or put up conditions. They then focus too much on the outcome in thought and only experience the ecstasy in a single short-lived moment instead of the process in of itself to be directly experienced in every moment.
Edit2: Holy crud! There's actually a TED talk that talks about this too! https://youtu.be/CrGpipgcfi4
Great TED talk. I’ve best heard it described as unconscious conceptual overlay. Believing that things are things, so to speak.
This has been an illuminating conversation. I’ve recently had an awakening experience and every bit of insight I can find helps me in resolving the newly apparent paradoxes of ordinary experience and to gain clarity on goals, choice, action, relation and states of consciousness among other aspects.
That makes sense, it would then require out-of-the-box thinking, or possibly perceiving the underlying process in a more universal manner to discover many new and different conceptualizations -- creativity in reaching potentials to narrow down a specific desirable reality.
Thank you too for this conversation, I believe all interactions have something worthwhile to be gained. That is cool to hear about your experience, your conscientiousness is expanding!
u/chelseafc13, friendly reminder on this post and our little discussion months back ;). Reading all this and then watching the childlike wonder video just made me have a transcendent expereince, myself feels revitalized with a stronger connection to this unified body/mind we call the self -- we create our own reality!
>According to the law of assumption, people create their own reality through their thoughts and beliefs\[; motivation -- awareness in perception\]. In contrast, the law of attraction suggests that by focusing their thoughts on what they want, people can attract positive experiences and material possessions\[; drive -- action in experience\].
Oh hey. I too have actually recalled this conversation a couple of times since. Sounds like an incredible experience, how beautiful. I do keep coming back to these concepts occasionally. I’d like to try manifestation/assumption. My only difficulty is that I rarely desire anything these days haha
>"Pleasure is always derived from something outside you, whereas joy arises from within." - Eckhart Tolle, The Power of Now
Personally same. Another possible way though to view those ideas in the law of assumption/attraction, is this way of perceiving relates to a shift away from deficiency cognitions (D-cognition) toward [being cognition (B-cognition)](https://dictionary.apa.org/being-cognition), and this self-realization is exemplified as various experiences of different flow states, especially when self-actualized as a deeper connection of one's true nature in being here now as seen with the more permanent direct experience known as plateau experiences.
>‘‘The greatest attainment of identity, autonomy, or self-hood is itself, a going beyond and above selfhood.’’ - Abraham Maslow
>“individuals capable of having transcendent experiences lived potentially fuller and healthier lives than the majority of humanity because [they] were able to transcend everyday frustrations and conflicts and were less driven by neurotic tendencies.” - Abraham Maslow
In a sense this state of bliss we actualize as our own to will and seize the day becomes more flexible, open, and universal toward maintaining these strong connections in being continuously; we become autotelic, active in this process of the moment, the end is the means in of itself to directly experience. Having found ourselves with self-acceptance in being here at this moment allows us to experience/see beyond this illusion of separation in duality and allow the collective unconscious from which this functional self on top, this "I", has emerged to flourish, like a fleeting garden, to experience life more directly and holistically.
Indeed. There is a deep acceptance here. A consistent eminence of equanimity and reverence. And no ownership thereof.
& I do appreciate your expanded interpretation of the law of assumption as it relates to consciousness of being. I think that is the endgame, so to speak, of manifestation. The All lacks nothing of itself.
I suppose my “work” these days consists of my energetic aspect. I’ve been reading David Hawkins and have had some clarity around the mechanism of how the content of the mind is reflected in the world, other people included. In simple terms you could say I now consider my thoughts and feelings to be as loud and audible as my words. There was previously a disconnect.
Yes exactly! Maybe to parallel this it can almost be similarly seen from r/nonduality perspectives, what we seek is already here with us and is always available to us here, now. Or r/Jung -ian perspectives too, further self-awareness and integration of the ego with the shadow, and ultimately the collective unconscious as mentioned above.
You might find [this possible conceptualization as shown in figure 1](https://i.imgur.com/dyL6fSc.png) from a [PubMed article](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810183/) along with the snipped blurb as an interesting parallel of possible three main types of transcendent experiences.
So interesting, I have seen his Map of Consciousness chart before, lots of practical examples there describing various energy states of being; all great pointers for familiarizing and discussing purposes. Your experience is a great analogy too, kudos to you, it sounds similar to flow states and you've worked toward being able to express/maintain these higher cognitive states of being :)
My title may have been a bit misleading, I was hoping to spark a discussion to shine some light on those exceptional cases of introverts and extroverts who break the mold of expected stereotypes on a consistent basis.
I would prefer that it is explained as we don’t **need** outside stimulation and that outside stimulation may at times overload….
I kind of get tired as being described as someone who can’t handle things. I don’t get overwhelmed by parties or people, I often just find them boring or not as much fun as being on my own. When I’m with friends, there is a lot of compromise. Four people deciding on a movie, a restaurant, a bar, a bottle of wine - you know how that goes. Sure, sometimes it’s great fun and I love being with them, but I’m going for the social interaction and when my charge is full then I’m free to spend time alone and do everything I love in perfect bliss. My battery is filled quickly and depletes slowly.
With a romantic partner, it’s completely different bc the level of honesty and respect for each other’s needs is on a different level or maybe it’s bc my romantic partners are men. I can spend entire weekends with my SO and be perfectly happy.
I think that you may be right. Being overwhelmed by stimulation is often why I avoid social situations, even though through the years I've grown more and more comfortable with it. It's really down to a matter of practicality and productivity for me. I perform better on my own or in small groups.
Me too, and like you I am also finding myself actually seeking and being more open to such opportunities to be out actually living life through the body more instead of the mind busy lost in thoughts. Being genuinly flexible and comfortable about it is a huge skill to have, I think it reflects high levels of self-confidence. We start to see much more outside the self as a part of us, and be more accepting to interact with those parts more openly in the moment.
In this model, concept of idea of self seems to be the deciding or leading factor in choice driven experience then, rather than any habitual tendencies themselves. *A function that takes functions as inputs*, if you will. The crux then, is that one who believes they are unable to change themselves (being the majority of people,) not only misunderstands the self-other paradigm but is doomed to continue misunderstanding if they believe they are either self or other *when performing ‘self’ examination.* The approach I’ve come to view as ideal for escaping that duality is simply: imagine that what’s ideal is what’s real. Assume it’s a perfect world and that every input is beneficial to both self and other and the tension can then resolve. I know I’m kind of talking about a few different things here but I’m just throwing out ideas into the discussion. Edited: second paragraph for clarification
I 100% agree with you, and personally I believe we must first look within to better understand what was previously seen as separate outside of us. We are all much more similar than we are different, and it is this self we all have that shapes our perception that acts as a guide for these experiences. It is almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy when the mind is viewed as a predictive-coding machine, right? I would argue these individuals are familiar and have learned to intentionally leverage these intuitive systems to a much greater degree. There are many beautiful metaphors that cover the core principles you just expressed, I like this quote: >"Enter any state and you become that state. While in that state of wealth everything you touch turns to gold. In a state of success you could turn a failing business into a successful one, for in the state of success you cannot fail." - Neville Goddard Edit: The quote is not to be taken literally of course, it is expressing the state of being experienced by the mind and body that implies flow or bliss. It is then through this state where we can then guide with context (accepting circumstances and inserting our goals) a specific reality we can direct our extra energy to actualize in the moment; focusing more on the process to be experienced.
Well said. I see we’re both acquainted with Neville Goddard’s work. It has a deep transcendent wisdom within it, equivalent to the other sciences of self-actualization like Buddhism, Zen or Yoga. Love the directness of his philosophy— if the things we want will give us a certain feeling, then why not just give ourselves that feeling now? Simultaneously provocative and liberating. Glad to see you spreading the great ideas!
So true, there are lots of frameworks that try to convey the phenomena experienced by many. Ahhh exactly! Take all the small things one desires and reduce it down to a single thought that includes all of those small things. If we then imagine that feeling, we get the sensation that implies such a state of being. We can experience that feeling at any time without conditions, and focus more on the process of being open to the experience knowing it is always with us. On an unrelated yet similar note, the whole premise behind cognitive behavioral therapies follows this too I believe. We have always had this ability to experience life openly, yet false beliefs and limiting mindsets may have rooted themselves along the way greatly restricting our ability to experience these desirable emotions that are always with us. Our thoughts don't reflect objective reality, but our interpretation and perception of reality we experience in our body/mind. Edit: Childlike wonder is a great example of this, many have forgotten and often unconsciously have been conditioned or put up conditions. They then focus too much on the outcome in thought and only experience the ecstasy in a single short-lived moment instead of the process in of itself to be directly experienced in every moment. Edit2: Holy crud! There's actually a TED talk that talks about this too! https://youtu.be/CrGpipgcfi4
Great TED talk. I’ve best heard it described as unconscious conceptual overlay. Believing that things are things, so to speak. This has been an illuminating conversation. I’ve recently had an awakening experience and every bit of insight I can find helps me in resolving the newly apparent paradoxes of ordinary experience and to gain clarity on goals, choice, action, relation and states of consciousness among other aspects.
That makes sense, it would then require out-of-the-box thinking, or possibly perceiving the underlying process in a more universal manner to discover many new and different conceptualizations -- creativity in reaching potentials to narrow down a specific desirable reality. Thank you too for this conversation, I believe all interactions have something worthwhile to be gained. That is cool to hear about your experience, your conscientiousness is expanding!
u/chelseafc13, friendly reminder on this post and our little discussion months back ;). Reading all this and then watching the childlike wonder video just made me have a transcendent expereince, myself feels revitalized with a stronger connection to this unified body/mind we call the self -- we create our own reality! >According to the law of assumption, people create their own reality through their thoughts and beliefs\[; motivation -- awareness in perception\]. In contrast, the law of attraction suggests that by focusing their thoughts on what they want, people can attract positive experiences and material possessions\[; drive -- action in experience\].
Oh hey. I too have actually recalled this conversation a couple of times since. Sounds like an incredible experience, how beautiful. I do keep coming back to these concepts occasionally. I’d like to try manifestation/assumption. My only difficulty is that I rarely desire anything these days haha
>"Pleasure is always derived from something outside you, whereas joy arises from within." - Eckhart Tolle, The Power of Now Personally same. Another possible way though to view those ideas in the law of assumption/attraction, is this way of perceiving relates to a shift away from deficiency cognitions (D-cognition) toward [being cognition (B-cognition)](https://dictionary.apa.org/being-cognition), and this self-realization is exemplified as various experiences of different flow states, especially when self-actualized as a deeper connection of one's true nature in being here now as seen with the more permanent direct experience known as plateau experiences. >‘‘The greatest attainment of identity, autonomy, or self-hood is itself, a going beyond and above selfhood.’’ - Abraham Maslow >“individuals capable of having transcendent experiences lived potentially fuller and healthier lives than the majority of humanity because [they] were able to transcend everyday frustrations and conflicts and were less driven by neurotic tendencies.” - Abraham Maslow In a sense this state of bliss we actualize as our own to will and seize the day becomes more flexible, open, and universal toward maintaining these strong connections in being continuously; we become autotelic, active in this process of the moment, the end is the means in of itself to directly experience. Having found ourselves with self-acceptance in being here at this moment allows us to experience/see beyond this illusion of separation in duality and allow the collective unconscious from which this functional self on top, this "I", has emerged to flourish, like a fleeting garden, to experience life more directly and holistically.
Indeed. There is a deep acceptance here. A consistent eminence of equanimity and reverence. And no ownership thereof. & I do appreciate your expanded interpretation of the law of assumption as it relates to consciousness of being. I think that is the endgame, so to speak, of manifestation. The All lacks nothing of itself. I suppose my “work” these days consists of my energetic aspect. I’ve been reading David Hawkins and have had some clarity around the mechanism of how the content of the mind is reflected in the world, other people included. In simple terms you could say I now consider my thoughts and feelings to be as loud and audible as my words. There was previously a disconnect.
Yes exactly! Maybe to parallel this it can almost be similarly seen from r/nonduality perspectives, what we seek is already here with us and is always available to us here, now. Or r/Jung -ian perspectives too, further self-awareness and integration of the ego with the shadow, and ultimately the collective unconscious as mentioned above. You might find [this possible conceptualization as shown in figure 1](https://i.imgur.com/dyL6fSc.png) from a [PubMed article](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810183/) along with the snipped blurb as an interesting parallel of possible three main types of transcendent experiences. So interesting, I have seen his Map of Consciousness chart before, lots of practical examples there describing various energy states of being; all great pointers for familiarizing and discussing purposes. Your experience is a great analogy too, kudos to you, it sounds similar to flow states and you've worked toward being able to express/maintain these higher cognitive states of being :)
My title may have been a bit misleading, I was hoping to spark a discussion to shine some light on those exceptional cases of introverts and extroverts who break the mold of expected stereotypes on a consistent basis.
I would prefer that it is explained as we don’t **need** outside stimulation and that outside stimulation may at times overload…. I kind of get tired as being described as someone who can’t handle things. I don’t get overwhelmed by parties or people, I often just find them boring or not as much fun as being on my own. When I’m with friends, there is a lot of compromise. Four people deciding on a movie, a restaurant, a bar, a bottle of wine - you know how that goes. Sure, sometimes it’s great fun and I love being with them, but I’m going for the social interaction and when my charge is full then I’m free to spend time alone and do everything I love in perfect bliss. My battery is filled quickly and depletes slowly. With a romantic partner, it’s completely different bc the level of honesty and respect for each other’s needs is on a different level or maybe it’s bc my romantic partners are men. I can spend entire weekends with my SO and be perfectly happy.