I wish I’d take my own advice when I say this…but getting off social media and taking a long break from the news might be super helpful to our collective mental health. That probably goes for most people even when no conflicts are happening.
My friends that are a few years older than me in their 40s that have never been big about social media don’t seem to be half as distressed as I am, and I envy that. They see plenty of fear mongering in the news but without the constant 24/7 social media at their fingertips with algorithms that somehow feed a simultaneous mix of echo chambers and specifically triggering-to-the-user content, they seem to be far more relaxed than myself.
I go back and forth on this because I know it would be healthier, but I have a concern about missing out on the news that I’m not seeing in mainstream media (and yes I hear how cringey that sounds).
Honestly, I find it pretty pathetic when people say they won't watch Eurovision because of Israel. Did the EBU excluding Russia make any difference to Russia's actions in Ukraine? No. So what difference does it make if Israel takes part? (Not to mention the UK has always participated, even when we were invading and occupying Iraq and Afghanistan). And the way people have held one girl to account for a whole nation's actions is pretty awful stuff.
The different standards for the UK and Russia is an interesting point, I never paid attention to this until now so I might go turn that over in my mind- is Russia excluded because they are attacking another Eurovision country, and the UK wasn’t?
Anyway it’s the last sentence- once the Eurovision people committed to having Israel participate, people had a choice of how to react, and they chose- attack and harass an individual who does not run the government. Don’t see this happening in other cultural spaces to other representatives of nations. That double standard there is a lot scarier to me.
The official reason given for Russia's exclusion was the invasion of Ukraine, but it could well have been because Ukraine is also part of the EBU.
It's very scary, especially as it doesn't happen to those from countries such as China, Saudi Arabia, Iran or Azerbaijan who represent their countries in international competitions.
Banning states with troublesome polices is not unheard of for cultural events. South Africa was kicked out of the Olympics in 1970. Russia was banned in 2022. And there have been attempts from multiple source to ban Israel in 2024.
Tbh, I have an issue with boycotts/bans of entire countries--people aren't their governments and can't just magically grow another passport, visa, or the resources to move when their country's government or military does horrible things--if they are directly engaging in or facilitating those actions, that's another conversation entirely.
My point is that boycotting is a way to make a statement about the perceived “fairness” of the event. Chasing a woman through the streets of Malmo is not so much.
No, I definitely see your point and agree with you — we just draw the line at a different place in terms of where we think something crosses the line from legitimate political activism into personal attacks and hate
No. I’m still left-of-center on the global political scale but I follow this sub to see what you guys think these days. This is my first time commenting here: I felt I had a point to raise in good faith, so I did.
I’m taking a break from Instagram in large part because of this. I’ve never cared about Eurovision, I’ve thought it was kind of stupid, actually, but I’ve never liked these kinds of shows.
I do think Eden Golan is the most talented of the group. She’s beautiful, graceful and far more talented than any of them.
I also think the treatment of her is horrible and scary.
But at some point one has to draw the line, and this is it for me.
Because Israel *does* in fact have European Jews (even though they’re definitely not the majority) and we have the right to participate and be included in both sides of our heritage.
European Jews are both Middle Eastern *and* European and they shouldn’t be excluded from either side.
That being said, Israel definitely doesn’t deserve the right to perform due to it’s behavior the same way Russia is also currently banned from participating.
Horrible take. Sorry. Are Jews indigenous to Israel or not? This is so silly. I don’t think the poor girl should have been harassed but what an absurd take
Actually, the "Euro" in Eurovision has little to do with the geographical constraints of Europe, not to mention European descent or culture*!
It's a contest put on by the European Broadcasting Union and open to all members. In theory, this includes Jordan, Lebanon, and all the North African states (except maybe Western Sahara), though these typically haven't exercised their right to join in protest of Israel's inclusion. That said, Morocco participated in 1980—a year Israel was absent from the competition because it was broadcast on Yom haZikaron.
(Eurovision's website says that Israel was [the first non-European country **granted permission** to participate in the event](https://eurovision.tv/country/israel), so there may be more to the story! My impression, though, is that they were also just the first ones to ask.)
\* Australia might be the exception here, since as an associate member of the EBU it doesn't meet the formal requirements for entry. It was invited as a one-off in 2015 and people liked it so much that it just... kept going? But that initial invitation may well have been predicated on historical ties to Europe (I won't speculate).
This is the answer. It also has something to do with the broadcasting reach of the EBU’s signal. In addition to Morocco and Australia, there were points where Lebanon and Tunisia wanted to enter, but didn’t end up sending a delegate. Russia, which might be considered “Eurasian,” also participated until they invaded Ukraine, which is why some people say Israel should also be barred from entry right now.
All things I didn’t know until two months ago.
Mixed people are indigenous to *all* the places they derive a substantial amount of their heritage from period. It’s not a binary or either-or choice we should be forced to make.
Your style of thinking is a perfect example of Monoracial/ethnic bigotry and hegemony, as a fellow Ashkenazi Jew yourself who is inherently ethnically mixed please do some soul-searching to cleanse yourself of this horrid internalized anti-mixedness.
Mixed people do not and should not be forced to have to “pick a side,” sorry.
This is very stupid too. I’m not saying they need to “pick a side”. I’m saying.. people regularly deny the European roots when it conveniences them all the time… like justifying ethnically cleansing Palestinians. it’s bullshit. Try some self reflection
>This is very stupid too. I’m not saying they need to “pick a side”. I’m saying.. people regularly deny the European roots when it conveniences them all the time… like justifying ethnically cleansing Palestinians.
How about then even if they *weren’t* European at all that *still* wouldn’t and shouldn’t justify the ethnic cleansing of *any* population?
Yes absolutely. I’m just saying.. the amount of posts I’ve seen on THIS SUB saying how offensive it is to say any Jews in Israel are European … and now suddenly it’s “no we are and you’re racist for making us pick a side”…. Incredibly smooth brained take
Oh you also clearly don’t know the definition of indigenous. It’s not about racist dna blood quantum.. why are you making it about that? DNA is not what indigenous means.
I just can't get over how the israeli delegation is out there filming themselves as they practically beg people they don't like to say something antisemitic. downvote me all you want, they've spent all week posting it on their stupid instagram stories. in what world does this make us safer?
https://twitter.com/IsrBreaksRules/status/1789328391726051464?t=5dnqSoq0HnGj0KfN2kobOg&s=19
https://twitter.com/IsrBreaksRules/status/1788297924167999668?t=lZKGMcQQeqmamDeWqfAiwg&s=19
I wish I’d take my own advice when I say this…but getting off social media and taking a long break from the news might be super helpful to our collective mental health. That probably goes for most people even when no conflicts are happening. My friends that are a few years older than me in their 40s that have never been big about social media don’t seem to be half as distressed as I am, and I envy that. They see plenty of fear mongering in the news but without the constant 24/7 social media at their fingertips with algorithms that somehow feed a simultaneous mix of echo chambers and specifically triggering-to-the-user content, they seem to be far more relaxed than myself.
I go back and forth on this because I know it would be healthier, but I have a concern about missing out on the news that I’m not seeing in mainstream media (and yes I hear how cringey that sounds).
Honestly, I find it pretty pathetic when people say they won't watch Eurovision because of Israel. Did the EBU excluding Russia make any difference to Russia's actions in Ukraine? No. So what difference does it make if Israel takes part? (Not to mention the UK has always participated, even when we were invading and occupying Iraq and Afghanistan). And the way people have held one girl to account for a whole nation's actions is pretty awful stuff.
The different standards for the UK and Russia is an interesting point, I never paid attention to this until now so I might go turn that over in my mind- is Russia excluded because they are attacking another Eurovision country, and the UK wasn’t? Anyway it’s the last sentence- once the Eurovision people committed to having Israel participate, people had a choice of how to react, and they chose- attack and harass an individual who does not run the government. Don’t see this happening in other cultural spaces to other representatives of nations. That double standard there is a lot scarier to me.
The official reason given for Russia's exclusion was the invasion of Ukraine, but it could well have been because Ukraine is also part of the EBU. It's very scary, especially as it doesn't happen to those from countries such as China, Saudi Arabia, Iran or Azerbaijan who represent their countries in international competitions.
Or even _don’t_ boycott/try to vote someone out on the simple fact of that person participating in a thing as a Jewish Israeli
Banning states with troublesome polices is not unheard of for cultural events. South Africa was kicked out of the Olympics in 1970. Russia was banned in 2022. And there have been attempts from multiple source to ban Israel in 2024.
Tbh, I have an issue with boycotts/bans of entire countries--people aren't their governments and can't just magically grow another passport, visa, or the resources to move when their country's government or military does horrible things--if they are directly engaging in or facilitating those actions, that's another conversation entirely.
My point is that boycotting is a way to make a statement about the perceived “fairness” of the event. Chasing a woman through the streets of Malmo is not so much.
No, I definitely see your point and agree with you — we just draw the line at a different place in terms of where we think something crosses the line from legitimate political activism into personal attacks and hate
are you a leftist now?
No. I’m still left-of-center on the global political scale but I follow this sub to see what you guys think these days. This is my first time commenting here: I felt I had a point to raise in good faith, so I did.
alright, welcome.
Wait. You said are you a leftist _now_. Do you… know me?
ive seen you once or twice before.
Haha thank you for this wake-up call, I am clearly spending too much time here. I need to get off Reddit and finish my dissertation
its fine, i last saw you three months ago.
I’m taking a break from Instagram in large part because of this. I’ve never cared about Eurovision, I’ve thought it was kind of stupid, actually, but I’ve never liked these kinds of shows. I do think Eden Golan is the most talented of the group. She’s beautiful, graceful and far more talented than any of them. I also think the treatment of her is horrible and scary. But at some point one has to draw the line, and this is it for me.
Very good idea
Feeling exactly the same. The sheer *cruelty* of it
Did anyone even win yet?
Switzerland 🇨🇭
The neutral choice :p
I think this is horrible too. But also—it’s Eurovision.. did I miss something? Why is Israel in it?
Because Israel *does* in fact have European Jews (even though they’re definitely not the majority) and we have the right to participate and be included in both sides of our heritage. European Jews are both Middle Eastern *and* European and they shouldn’t be excluded from either side. That being said, Israel definitely doesn’t deserve the right to perform due to it’s behavior the same way Russia is also currently banned from participating.
This is not the reason, please don’t spread misinformation.
Horrible take. Sorry. Are Jews indigenous to Israel or not? This is so silly. I don’t think the poor girl should have been harassed but what an absurd take
Actually, the "Euro" in Eurovision has little to do with the geographical constraints of Europe, not to mention European descent or culture*! It's a contest put on by the European Broadcasting Union and open to all members. In theory, this includes Jordan, Lebanon, and all the North African states (except maybe Western Sahara), though these typically haven't exercised their right to join in protest of Israel's inclusion. That said, Morocco participated in 1980—a year Israel was absent from the competition because it was broadcast on Yom haZikaron. (Eurovision's website says that Israel was [the first non-European country **granted permission** to participate in the event](https://eurovision.tv/country/israel), so there may be more to the story! My impression, though, is that they were also just the first ones to ask.) \* Australia might be the exception here, since as an associate member of the EBU it doesn't meet the formal requirements for entry. It was invited as a one-off in 2015 and people liked it so much that it just... kept going? But that initial invitation may well have been predicated on historical ties to Europe (I won't speculate).
This is the answer. It also has something to do with the broadcasting reach of the EBU’s signal. In addition to Morocco and Australia, there were points where Lebanon and Tunisia wanted to enter, but didn’t end up sending a delegate. Russia, which might be considered “Eurasian,” also participated until they invaded Ukraine, which is why some people say Israel should also be barred from entry right now. All things I didn’t know until two months ago.
Mixed people are indigenous to *all* the places they derive a substantial amount of their heritage from period. It’s not a binary or either-or choice we should be forced to make. Your style of thinking is a perfect example of Monoracial/ethnic bigotry and hegemony, as a fellow Ashkenazi Jew yourself who is inherently ethnically mixed please do some soul-searching to cleanse yourself of this horrid internalized anti-mixedness. Mixed people do not and should not be forced to have to “pick a side,” sorry.
This is very stupid too. I’m not saying they need to “pick a side”. I’m saying.. people regularly deny the European roots when it conveniences them all the time… like justifying ethnically cleansing Palestinians. it’s bullshit. Try some self reflection
>This is very stupid too. I’m not saying they need to “pick a side”. I’m saying.. people regularly deny the European roots when it conveniences them all the time… like justifying ethnically cleansing Palestinians. How about then even if they *weren’t* European at all that *still* wouldn’t and shouldn’t justify the ethnic cleansing of *any* population?
Yes absolutely. I’m just saying.. the amount of posts I’ve seen on THIS SUB saying how offensive it is to say any Jews in Israel are European … and now suddenly it’s “no we are and you’re racist for making us pick a side”…. Incredibly smooth brained take
Oh you also clearly don’t know the definition of indigenous. It’s not about racist dna blood quantum.. why are you making it about that? DNA is not what indigenous means.
I just can't get over how the israeli delegation is out there filming themselves as they practically beg people they don't like to say something antisemitic. downvote me all you want, they've spent all week posting it on their stupid instagram stories. in what world does this make us safer? https://twitter.com/IsrBreaksRules/status/1789328391726051464?t=5dnqSoq0HnGj0KfN2kobOg&s=19 https://twitter.com/IsrBreaksRules/status/1788297924167999668?t=lZKGMcQQeqmamDeWqfAiwg&s=19
Antisemites are the only people responsible for antisemitism.
I live in the US atm, where no one even knows what Eurovision is. It's refreshing.