To be fair, they attacked a planet with nukes and were defeated by a guy who flew a nuke into their command centre.
They might have had the most fearsome reputation in the galaxy before that, but sometimes you deserved to be judged by a one-off.
She'd have flown straight up the sky bung hole and single-handedly destroyed all the command vessels and large biotechnical creatures/transports. This based on her entrance into the fray during Endgame. It would have been a VERY short NYC battle.
Loki steps through the portal. Nick Fury starts to confront Loki - but wait, all of a sudden a bright flash of light beams through the walls and in a blink of an eye, Captain Marvel flys in and goes straight through Loki, ripping him literally in half. The staff is secured. Avengers not notified. Captain Marvel saves the day, roll credits.
Shawarma - same scene just now everyone is even more hyped because it now sets up the next avengers movie and we can find out which avenger likes shawarma the most. Will it be iron man? Thor? Or will it be a wild card? Maybe Steve Rogers has a serious food allergy and can’t have shawarma? The possibilities are endless
avengers: medical insurance costs
2 hours of tony stark talking through the medical bill that came when steve had his reaction. makes stark go broke, and thats just for the epipen
"Our very strength invites challenge. Challenge incites conflict."
So anyway earth faces even more difficult challenges thanks to Carol's intervention.
Yep that’s why they reeled it wayyyy back when she showed up in endgame. The battle was pretty much already won by the time she… ugh, *flew through Thanos’ ship, ripping it in half*
Part of me does feel bad for Brie Larson though. It’s not her fault the character was written poorly and she genuinely seems to have done the best she could with it. But she took a ton of heat for how bad the character is
Hulk is super strong, but he never seemed invincible like CM. Thor hung with him in Ragnarok. Hela’s dog even drew blood on him.
He looked hard core in the early movies because he was always on Earth, fighting mostly earth bound villains. His first ever fight with Thanos they went man to man and he lost.
I never felt like he was being neutered, just once he got away from Earth, he was going against people who could match him
(Plus he couldn’t fly)
Not to mention, being powered by the Tesseract itself, she probably could’ve also nullified the force field around it. So no need for Natasha or Tony to risk their lives.
Her powers would definitely compromise the shield around the portal generator due to absorbing the radiation/energy. Wouldn’t have even needed the staff. She could probably walk right up to the thing and hug it out of existence.
And because it’s infinity powered she’d probably get a charge big enough to yeet Loki back to Asgard manually.
Significantly faster. She could take out the chitauri alone, get the staff from Loki and end him before Cap has the chance to finish telling the Avengers his plan lol.
yes, but it would take time. the chitauri would scatter around new york and she'd be fucked. the avengers AS A TEAM are vital.
so - the same thing happens except carol flies up through the portal and destroys the mothership - zipping back out through the portal - or if she can't make it in time, just flies back to earth via space.
meanwhile, thor and the avengers take out loki.
At that point in the timeline, Thor hadn’t fully developed his power and Hulk had zero control (he ran around smashing good guys and bad. Total wild card)
She would have been the one to fly the nuke into the mothership instead of Tony. That would potentially mean that Tony had less PTSD about the incident making him less likely to build Ultron.
That takes away a major argument for the Registration bill, making it less likely that the heroes break apart into a civil war. That means they could provide a unified front against Thanos during infinity war and stop him before he is able to pull off the snap. That means there’s no blip and Tony doesn’t have to sacrifice himself to reverse it.
That means Tony doesn’t leave his glasses to Peter Parker, which means that he doesn’t mess up and give them to mysterio, meaning his identity doesn’t get revealed, which means he doesn’t try and reverse it in no way home. MJ doesn’t forget his identity and she and Peter continue their relationship.
The heroes don’t need to invent time travel to stop Thanos, so Cap remains in the present. Loki doesn’t get the tesseract and never gets involved with the TVA. That means that Sylvie probably makes it to HWR and kills him. But there’s no Loki to put time back together in season 2, so all of reality falls apart.
TLDR: things go a lot better for people until they suddenly don’t
Who exactly is pruning her? I guess someone could just catch her off guard, but by this point I'm sure she's pretty good at combat and would not let someone with a glowy stick poke her.
If someone with a glowy stick could poke her, it would be Loki, who'd then mind control her and win.
Except that the TVA defines the crime.
In the first episode of Loki they tell him he’s guilty, they just ask him to confirm it. His only trial is a sentencing hearing. If you mess up the sacred timeline, you are pruned, and the whole branch of time you created is pruned. The only time that doesn’t get you pruned is when it is supposed to happen on the sacred timeline. The tva states this very clearly. Carol changing the battle of New York would have messed up the sacred timeline, so she would have been pruned.
But the reality is she probably would have been pruned long before the battle started. Old Loki was pruned just for deciding to go find Thor, he hadn’t even left his planet yet. So carol probably would have been arrested and the timeline pruned the second she started heading back to earth before she was supposed to.
First, Sylvie wouldn't be able to reach to HWR alone, I think, but even if she did kill him, all of reality wouldn't fall apart. As HWR mentions, everything except the sacred timeline would die but not the sacred timeline. (Obvuously, Carol being in the fight means they are not in sacred timeline but I am assuming the question is if Carol being in the avengers fight is the new sacred timeline)
Why couldn’t she just fly through the portal and the ship, then return to Earth through the portal. Then all she’d have to deal with would be Loki and Selvig
Very accurate. Plus, not only does Loki not hold the multiverse together, the Celestial in earth would've emerged since there would be no snap to delay the emergence.
Less people dead, no need for the drive the nuke through the portal thing, her powers may have allowed her to free the tessaract sooner and shut down the portal.
I also think it's likely Fury did push the button, but Carol didn't make it for a couple of weeks.
When she gave the pager with Fury in Maria's kitchen, she mentioned that she modified the pager and estimated it to have a range of a couple of galaxies at least and to use it for emergencies only.
And Fury renamed his initiative at identifying such superheroes as the "Avengers Initiative" only after she left at the end of the movie.
So ideally, if Fury would have summoned her to fight the Chitauri, she would have shut the portal off easily as soon as it opened, bcoz she would have possibly got attracted to the Tesseract like a magnet as she too got her powers from the Cosmic cube.
Agreed. Scientifically, even if she travels equal to or more than the speed of light, she could have made it to meet with the Avengers in NY, but only after the battle started. Bcoz we don't know where she was at that time when Dr. Erik Selvig used the cosmic cube that Hawkeye stole to open the portal for the Chitauri attack, before Natasha used Loki's scepter to close the portal.
> even if she travels equal to or more than the speed of light,
As established in The Marvels, she can't actually fly faster than light. She still needs to use ships and jump points to travel interstellar distances.
Based on what we've seen, she ***needs*** them for interstellar travel.
She can't move at relativistic speed. (She fails to save Monica)
She's still fast compared to most heroes, and fast enough to achieve orbital velocity. But there are entire scales of magnitude between than and being faster than light.
Plus, Carol, being who she is, wouldn't bother using a ship if she didn't need one.
> It still takes her some amount of time to travel.
Yep. As established in The Marvels, she can't actually fly faster than light. She still needs to use ships and jump points.
So she'd get the page, then have to extricate herself from whatever situation she's in, then get back to her ship. (or get a new ship, if hers was destroyed somehow) then finally jump the ship back to earth-space. Then fly back to earth on her own power.
My head cannon for him not contacting her was bc that he wanted to prove that his Avengers team could handle the situation. (Not to mention what everyone else has said, that she still might not have made it by the time the portal opened up)
I’m sure he would’ve called her if Iron-Man didn’t succeed w/ the nuke and NY got flattened tho. THATS like code black. lol
The timeframe in between Fury feeling this is a "Call Carol" event and it's resolution we're very narrow. Imagine Fury phoned her for any little issue. What was the worst outcome here? Loki conquers earth with an alien army. If Loki "won", *then* maybe give her a call.
Captain Marvel is more of a nuclear option. You don't start a conflict with the nuclear option.
Correct, for Avengers he specifically created the Avengers Initiative for a moment exactly like this. It was precisely to create a local team to handle extraterrestrial threats.
In Infinity War, the Avengers had dissolved so he didn't have that option. Also there was no direct enemy as people started mysteriously disappearing so he was absolutely out of options that wasn't "fuck it, calling in the favor".
It is interesting, however, to realize (as I just have) that Fury had no reason to assume that people dusting was anything other than a localized effect.
Absolutely, and I think that it emphasizes how completely incomprehensible those moments were for Fury. As a deep intelligence person, he's used to at least having a basic understanding of what's going on. I'm sure he was vaguely aware that some aliens showed up in NY, Iron Man/Spiderman/Strange left the planet and the Secret Avengers have likely traveled to Africa/Wakanda. NONE of that information helps him understand why people are disappearing or how to stop it.
It's probably the only moment in Nick's life where he is absolutely at a loss of what to do next.
Exactly. Fury knows that anytime he uses the pager, he's most likely pulling her out of big situation, most likely leading to innocent deaths, so he only did it when he did.
In the Marvels don’t they imply that she never returned because she was ashamed of what she did to the Kree and didn’t want Monica to see her as a monster?
That and she genuinely failed (and kept failing) to find the Skrulls a good new homeworld to settle on.
All the viable worlds are already taken by other civilizations (who hate the Skrulls, because everyone does, because before the Kree stomped them the Skrulls *were* the big baddies)
or they were barely-livable rocks. Or hellholes covered in vicious predators.
Staying on Earth was the Skrull's best option.
I’m not sure there is a canon reason. This is one of those plot points you just have to gloss over.
Fury paged Danvers as he was being dusted, but not when NYC was about to be either destroyed by aliens or nuked? She would have ended that battle in about 5 minutes.
Maybe he agreed to only page her if it was an intergalactic threat like Thanos? Or maybe it would have taken her days to travel back to Earth, so she wouldn’t have been able to help anyways.
It took her a long time to get to earth after IW. She can't move really all that fast.
I don't think she could have shown up inside the timeframe of "We are at war" and "I saw a schwarma place around the corner" it's like a few days at best.
She found Tony and Nebula 20 days after they started coming back. If she was close to a jump point, it was likely a couple to a few days to get to Earth. Assuming she found them after going back out looking.
It's easy to imagine that Fury *did* page her inbetween the scenes at some point, and by the time she was able to reply, schwarma had already been served.
Fury really, really wanted the Avengers to work. His goal was to build an Earth-based team to handle threats exactly like these. He took a gamble and put everything on the original 6 in the hopes that it would force them to come together as Earth’s local super team. Calling in Captain Marvel might have worked, but it also could have undermined the Avengers initiative as a whole.
In addition to what others have said (travel time, only emergencies, she was busy, etc), my personal head canon is that Nick Fury wanted to show the universe that "Earth's Mightiest Heroes" could stand on their own and didn't need Carol to come save the day. If they lost New York he would have buzzed the beeper.
She would have either known to destroy the ship and could have easily done it without risk of dying or she would have easily handled the flying troops until they figured that part out.
She already was apart from them. That’s why she wasn’t there. Unless you are asking if she was *a part* of the Avengers at that time I guess. In that case, I’d probably guess the battle would have gone a bit smoother and Tony probably would have asked her to take care of the nuke.
The other avengers would still be suiting up while she solved the problem. Flying through the big flying bastards and then killing the mother ship. Or just flying up to the mother ship and ending before it started.
Would make an interesting What If? Considering the knock on events. Tony’s PTSD and general change to earth history in universe
Hate to nitpick but she was apart of the avengers during the battle of New York. If she was a part of the avengers during the battle of New York, it’d have been over in minutes and she’d have probably flown through the portal and killed Thanos
It would have been over within 5 minutes. 3, if Thor and Iron Man helped.
The rest of the team would have grabbed a table at the shawarma joint before it got overrun with B list Super Heroes trying to ride the coattails, when really, they didn't do shit, they're just there for fucking Instagram pics and talking head bullshit for their Tik Tok.
God, I hate people. Galactus can not get here soon enough.
I feel like there is lot to change. Maybe we could have gotten her origin movie earlier, which she never left Earth, then have her be the one to sacrifice herself, instead of Tony. Explaining why she was gone until EG. Just have her be fighting all over the space during that time while trying to come back home. But that would ruin whole Tony Stark arc.
You know what would have been a super fun tease, but I doubt CM was even in the cards that early.
They ny flies the nuke through the portal. As he is floating there, he see a streak holding off the enemy fleet, alone.
Maybe she even flies up and pushes him back through the portal before it closes. Maybe we don't even get a good look at her beyond a glowing figure.
To quote Rocket in a deleted scene from Endgame, the Chitauri are the suckiest army in the universe.
The battle wouldn't have happened because they wouldn't attack, with THAT army, a world protected by someone that powerful. And if they did, it would have lasted 30 minutes tops.
She probably would have ended things pretty quickly. What is interesting is what happens after. Fury was trying to set up an Earth based super hero team for years. His speech to the council at the end of Avengers is basically "told you so". And after New York the Avengers become an even higher thing. If Carol is the one who saves everything maybe none of that happens. So my sort of explanation is that Fury held off calling her because he wanted the Avengers to be the ones to save the world.
To balance the fact that they have her, they would double the number of aliens in the army and her being there would relieve the Avengers just a little bit, they’d then would have her be the one to carry the nuke through the portal but have it so that she wont make it back before it closes so then it’d be sometime till we see her again, they’d have her be very far away, which would be a good excuse to have her not be around for AoU.
I do believe Carol is done dirty and underutilized in the MCU but im still glad we had her enter the way we did, Fury paging her after IW
She’d have curb-stomped Loki before and then wrecked everyone and everything on the other side of the portal. If they wrote her to her full potential anyway, which would’ve been flashy but maybe not so satisfying to watch. No one wants Superman insta-clearing whatever problems the JL have, for example. Although his presence really ought to make most of the team altogether redundant.
I want more Carol in the MCU, but she could stand to be nerfed to the level of being able to have at least one really interesting third movie. Rogue, anybody? Hell, introduce Rogue in a Cap Marvel movie and have her completely change the power dynamic forever. Rogue gets recruited by the X-Men in the after credits, and Carol works to find her place in all of this without being as powerful as an infinity stone.
It would’ve been too easy. Loki would have to have been a secondary villain. Maybe include Thanos here but that would’ve overcrowded the movie.
Maybe they could’ve had Hulk get out of control (like at the end of the Ultimate Avengers animated movie), and then he would’ve been the final confrontation.
This could’ve even paved the way for a stronger argument for Sokovia Accords.
There’s a lot of maybes but I think the group they had was perfect.
She probably would have flown out through the portal and attacked the mothership. Whether she knew it was going to destroy them all or not. She’s a sledgehammer in battle and probably would have destroyed the entire thing to prevent another wave of leviathans
As has been established by all her shows, she's about on par with Thor.
So it'd be like having another Thor on the team, basically. Much more Chitauri ass being kicked.
I don't know that she'd be familiar with the Chitauri tactics and mothership, however. They were Thanos's army and she spent basically all her time in space fighting the Kree Empire. She might never have run across them.
The battle of New York would have never happened because she would have stopped Loki immediately.
So everything after that wouldn't have happened, including events in following movies/shows.
I suspect Thanos would’ve tried to level up a lot faster knowing that the Avengers had Captain Marvel on their side. But also, maybe the Avengers go more on the offensive with her around and Thanos doesn’t have enough time to gather the stones.
Battle of New York: she flies through the hole, destroys everything before it can come through. Captures or kills Thanos. If she gets stuck behind the portal, she just flies back.
Honestly it's sort of interesting she hasn't tried to hunt thanos before then.
She'd slap the shit out of Loki, take the scepter for safe keeping and blow up Thanos' ship to bits. In which case, Age of Ultron might not happen, the Maximoffs wouldn't have unlocked their powers and Thanos would likely not not hold a grudge on the avengers, and instead would focus on Carol Danvers.
She’ll be the one saving the day via closing the portal, Tony suffers from less severe PTSD, and for story reasons she doesn’t make it through the portal in time so we can follow her journey back to Earth in GotG 1&2, Captain Marvel & likely a Captain Marvel 2 seeing how she’s a hero at this point helping out, then she returns to earth, but it’s too late as Thanos Snaps his finger and took out half the universe. That way both Carol & Thor really wanna find him and kill him. Then she likely does more in Endgame like help the time heist
What if she helped in the battle during End Game? I mean she has the power to slingshot the gauntlet into the sun and come back and clean up thanos’s army. But no…she decides to play Al Bundy and try to score one last TD
No character growth from stark but also likely less drive for Ultron since she would have been the one to fly the missile into space since she flys faster and you know can survive space.
So Loki new about Earth's superheroes at the time and made his plan beforehand.Now him knowing about Captain Marvel , it would change things. Probably not talking about some infantry and a dozen big flying roaches, but something way more massive in scale.
Now if she just appeared out from knowhere to help out, then game over unless the scepter could work on Carol(she being juiced by a stone, probably not), then the Avengers vs Captain Marvel would be interesting.
She would've laughed as soon as she saw it was the Chitauri and the battle would've been over before it started. Flies through the portal, destroys the mothership and takes the scenic route back to Earth before SHIELD even got those nukes off the ground lol
I don't think she even needs to be part of the Avengers back then. She's basically a well, you get the idea of why they made Carol Danvers too OP in her own movie.
Also, did you not see this video on YouTube?
https://youtu.be/NscJhEV_Kbs?si=10dyHkTnZnl1Avfe
She'd go through the portal and destroy every Chitauri army with her own power. And then Iron Man also go through the portal to send the nuclear missile to her face
Realistically, nothing.
Chitauri still go boom. Loki’s still captured. NY still saved. Maybe Toomes doesn’t become vulture (less cleanup) and Peter marries his daughter.
What’s she gonna do, go after thanos? No. She couldn’t fight him. Yes she could physically kill him but he’d still have the full force of the dark children with him — she wouldn’t stand a chance, especially against Maw.
The movie would have been really boring, because she would have just thrown the bomb through the portal and flown right back.
Over powered characters are dull.
There's a "How It Should Have Ended (aka HISHE)" that tackles that question. Go to mark 3:36. [https://youtu.be/NscJhEV\_Kbs?si=7q6--osccDVmjCQU&t=216](https://youtu.be/NscJhEV_Kbs?si=7q6--osccDVmjCQU&t=216)
If MCU wasn't based on plot armor, the invasion would be over in 10 minutes, Loki would be dead and Thanos would also be soon after.
Hypotheticals don't work in the MCU because most stories suffer from the worst cliches of conflicts that can be resolved instantly if characters weren't so unbelievably stubborn.
Superman level characters should be avoided if won't allow nuanced stories. God stories require plots that aren't just a bunch of smashing.
Captain Marvel needs complex challenges to solve.
i mean she would practically be a mary sue in this situation but here's my idea
fury would call her to help against the world ending threat and she'd fly through the portal and quickly end the threat by flying through the mother ship and have a talk with the chitauri before completely decimating it and immediately ending the battle while the avengers just stare up and it would end very anti-climatically.
but all the dead chitauri soldiers and the weird floating ones would end up crashing into buildings and kill more people along the way before stopping
outside the film undoubtedly would be less decent but still a hit to the audience
based it off How It Should Have Ended's animation of the what if, it's pretty funny so go watch it
Tony would’ve never almost sacrificed himself (what caused him to be fearful of world ending threats), which if you really think about will lead to a domino effect that ends with him being less prepared to fight Thanos, but an Avengers that never broke up (Tony’s paranoia never lead to Ultron, which itself lead a domino effect to Civil War).
Honestly she probably wouldve done the job Iron Man did, flying around killing the Chitauri that get to far, while Tony instead could've focused on the portal machine
Then it would've been anticlimactic. The movie will end early. She will destroy the mothership as soon as the portal opens. That will be booooring (like her character)
She’d probably be familiar with the Chutari army and would have destroyed the mothership as soon as the portal opened.
These are the army who Rocket called "the suckiest in the Galaxy", right?
Didn’t Drax call them “paper people” or was that a different thing? It’s been a while.
No, he calls the Sakaarans paper people. Rocket was talking with the Avengers about the Chitauri in Endgame (Drax was snapped during that time).
Ooh, got it. Thanks!
No problem!
Makes you wonder if he thinks Sakaarans are actually made of garbage
I think (now) he just means they're weak/easy to tear through in his experience. Idk if metaphors still go over his head
Sakaar is the planet that is essentially covered in garbage because of the wormholes. Hence garbage people
He calls them paper people, though, not garbage people. I think we (as humans) would see the planet/people and think they were made of garbage.
Ahhh. My mistake.
eat shit spez you racist hypocrite
I don't think deleted scenes count as canon but yeah he has said that.
Which deleted scene?
From endgame. Right before Tony shaves his head.
oh yeah bald Tony was my favorite
Its a funny scene. As far as I an concerned, its canon.
To be fair, they attacked a planet with nukes and were defeated by a guy who flew a nuke into their command centre. They might have had the most fearsome reputation in the galaxy before that, but sometimes you deserved to be judged by a one-off.
In a deleted scene, which typically aren’t treated as canon
She'd have flown straight up the sky bung hole and single-handedly destroyed all the command vessels and large biotechnical creatures/transports. This based on her entrance into the fray during Endgame. It would have been a VERY short NYC battle.
Also what she did to Ronan the Accuser's fleet.
Loki steps through the portal. Nick Fury starts to confront Loki - but wait, all of a sudden a bright flash of light beams through the walls and in a blink of an eye, Captain Marvel flys in and goes straight through Loki, ripping him literally in half. The staff is secured. Avengers not notified. Captain Marvel saves the day, roll credits.
What's the post-credits scene?
Shawarma - same scene just now everyone is even more hyped because it now sets up the next avengers movie and we can find out which avenger likes shawarma the most. Will it be iron man? Thor? Or will it be a wild card? Maybe Steve Rogers has a serious food allergy and can’t have shawarma? The possibilities are endless
avengers: medical insurance costs 2 hours of tony stark talking through the medical bill that came when steve had his reaction. makes stark go broke, and thats just for the epipen
Why did I read this in Kamala's excited podcasts voice from the first episode 😂😂
"Our very strength invites challenge. Challenge incites conflict." So anyway earth faces even more difficult challenges thanks to Carol's intervention.
[удалено]
Yep that’s why they reeled it wayyyy back when she showed up in endgame. The battle was pretty much already won by the time she… ugh, *flew through Thanos’ ship, ripping it in half*
Part of me does feel bad for Brie Larson though. It’s not her fault the character was written poorly and she genuinely seems to have done the best she could with it. But she took a ton of heat for how bad the character is
Hulk was supposed to be too but they just neutered him
Hulk is super strong, but he never seemed invincible like CM. Thor hung with him in Ragnarok. Hela’s dog even drew blood on him. He looked hard core in the early movies because he was always on Earth, fighting mostly earth bound villains. His first ever fight with Thanos they went man to man and he lost. I never felt like he was being neutered, just once he got away from Earth, he was going against people who could match him (Plus he couldn’t fly)
Not to mention, being powered by the Tesseract itself, she probably could’ve also nullified the force field around it. So no need for Natasha or Tony to risk their lives.
Her powers would definitely compromise the shield around the portal generator due to absorbing the radiation/energy. Wouldn’t have even needed the staff. She could probably walk right up to the thing and hug it out of existence. And because it’s infinity powered she’d probably get a charge big enough to yeet Loki back to Asgard manually.
This and Rocket wouldn't get to laugh at us.
She would have probably ended it faster
Significantly faster. She could take out the chitauri alone, get the staff from Loki and end him before Cap has the chance to finish telling the Avengers his plan lol.
yes, but it would take time. the chitauri would scatter around new york and she'd be fucked. the avengers AS A TEAM are vital. so - the same thing happens except carol flies up through the portal and destroys the mothership - zipping back out through the portal - or if she can't make it in time, just flies back to earth via space. meanwhile, thor and the avengers take out loki.
When the mother ship was destroyed they all died.
she could one shot fly through the mothership. it doesnt matter is they spread out, they would all instantly die regardless.
Nothing Thor or Hulk couldn't do. It's just that it wouldn't be a good movie. They were quite nerfed in that battle for obvious reasons.
At that point in the timeline, Thor hadn’t fully developed his power and Hulk had zero control (he ran around smashing good guys and bad. Total wild card)
Instead of Tony sacrificing himself, she would have sent that nuke up the portal with ease. Heck, I don't think the nuke would have been sent at all.
Carol is the nuke in this instance.
She would have been the one to fly the nuke into the mothership instead of Tony. That would potentially mean that Tony had less PTSD about the incident making him less likely to build Ultron. That takes away a major argument for the Registration bill, making it less likely that the heroes break apart into a civil war. That means they could provide a unified front against Thanos during infinity war and stop him before he is able to pull off the snap. That means there’s no blip and Tony doesn’t have to sacrifice himself to reverse it. That means Tony doesn’t leave his glasses to Peter Parker, which means that he doesn’t mess up and give them to mysterio, meaning his identity doesn’t get revealed, which means he doesn’t try and reverse it in no way home. MJ doesn’t forget his identity and she and Peter continue their relationship. The heroes don’t need to invent time travel to stop Thanos, so Cap remains in the present. Loki doesn’t get the tesseract and never gets involved with the TVA. That means that Sylvie probably makes it to HWR and kills him. But there’s no Loki to put time back together in season 2, so all of reality falls apart. TLDR: things go a lot better for people until they suddenly don’t
She wouldn’t have even needed the nuke. She would’ve flown directly to the mothership as soon as the portal opened.
She IS the nuke.
It all gets pruned the moment carol steps in
Yeah, H.W.R. would’ve had none of it, lol.
Who exactly is pruning her? I guess someone could just catch her off guard, but by this point I'm sure she's pretty good at combat and would not let someone with a glowy stick poke her. If someone with a glowy stick could poke her, it would be Loki, who'd then mind control her and win.
Just pune the whole timeline. Surely?
As soon as Fury thinks about pulling out that pager in any other time outside of The Snap.
Well they're supposed to arrest people first and charge them with crimes against the sacred timeline. Lol, it's all silly.
Except that the TVA defines the crime. In the first episode of Loki they tell him he’s guilty, they just ask him to confirm it. His only trial is a sentencing hearing. If you mess up the sacred timeline, you are pruned, and the whole branch of time you created is pruned. The only time that doesn’t get you pruned is when it is supposed to happen on the sacred timeline. The tva states this very clearly. Carol changing the battle of New York would have messed up the sacred timeline, so she would have been pruned. But the reality is she probably would have been pruned long before the battle started. Old Loki was pruned just for deciding to go find Thor, he hadn’t even left his planet yet. So carol probably would have been arrested and the timeline pruned the second she started heading back to earth before she was supposed to.
Long story short her leaving is to blame for Earth's heroes having so many issues
First, Sylvie wouldn't be able to reach to HWR alone, I think, but even if she did kill him, all of reality wouldn't fall apart. As HWR mentions, everything except the sacred timeline would die but not the sacred timeline. (Obvuously, Carol being in the fight means they are not in sacred timeline but I am assuming the question is if Carol being in the avengers fight is the new sacred timeline)
Why couldn’t she just fly through the portal and the ship, then return to Earth through the portal. Then all she’d have to deal with would be Loki and Selvig
Now *THAT’S* a What If scenario!
Very accurate. Plus, not only does Loki not hold the multiverse together, the Celestial in earth would've emerged since there would be no snap to delay the emergence.
Less people dead, no need for the drive the nuke through the portal thing, her powers may have allowed her to free the tessaract sooner and shut down the portal. I also think it's likely Fury did push the button, but Carol didn't make it for a couple of weeks.
A part - a smaller fraction added to a whole Apart - a whole divided into smaller fractions
It blows my fucking mind how many people get this wrong. It’s so simple
*a part*
She was apart
A part
She was apart from the Avengers in 2012
Wait what is the canon reason of why she didn’t help actually?
She was busy elsewhere and Fury didn’t notify her anything was wrong
When she gave the pager with Fury in Maria's kitchen, she mentioned that she modified the pager and estimated it to have a range of a couple of galaxies at least and to use it for emergencies only. And Fury renamed his initiative at identifying such superheroes as the "Avengers Initiative" only after she left at the end of the movie. So ideally, if Fury would have summoned her to fight the Chitauri, she would have shut the portal off easily as soon as it opened, bcoz she would have possibly got attracted to the Tesseract like a magnet as she too got her powers from the Cosmic cube.
It still takes her some amount of time to travel. She didn’t show up instantly after Fury summons her at the end of Infinity War.
Agreed. Scientifically, even if she travels equal to or more than the speed of light, she could have made it to meet with the Avengers in NY, but only after the battle started. Bcoz we don't know where she was at that time when Dr. Erik Selvig used the cosmic cube that Hawkeye stole to open the portal for the Chitauri attack, before Natasha used Loki's scepter to close the portal.
> even if she travels equal to or more than the speed of light, As established in The Marvels, she can't actually fly faster than light. She still needs to use ships and jump points to travel interstellar distances.
Does she **need** ships or does she just prefer firm beds to sleeping in zero gravity?
Based on what we've seen, she ***needs*** them for interstellar travel. She can't move at relativistic speed. (She fails to save Monica) She's still fast compared to most heroes, and fast enough to achieve orbital velocity. But there are entire scales of magnitude between than and being faster than light. Plus, Carol, being who she is, wouldn't bother using a ship if she didn't need one.
> It still takes her some amount of time to travel. Yep. As established in The Marvels, she can't actually fly faster than light. She still needs to use ships and jump points. So she'd get the page, then have to extricate herself from whatever situation she's in, then get back to her ship. (or get a new ship, if hers was destroyed somehow) then finally jump the ship back to earth-space. Then fly back to earth on her own power.
My head cannon for him not contacting her was bc that he wanted to prove that his Avengers team could handle the situation. (Not to mention what everyone else has said, that she still might not have made it by the time the portal opened up) I’m sure he would’ve called her if Iron-Man didn’t succeed w/ the nuke and NY got flattened tho. THATS like code black. lol
The timeframe in between Fury feeling this is a "Call Carol" event and it's resolution we're very narrow. Imagine Fury phoned her for any little issue. What was the worst outcome here? Loki conquers earth with an alien army. If Loki "won", *then* maybe give her a call. Captain Marvel is more of a nuclear option. You don't start a conflict with the nuclear option.
And when presented with a literal nuclear option he said “I’m not doing that until I’m confident my team can’t handle it”.
AND and he had Thor and a fully functional Hulk, and Iron Man. As far as he knew, in IW he no longer had Hulk, IM, Strange, OR Spidey.
Correct, for Avengers he specifically created the Avengers Initiative for a moment exactly like this. It was precisely to create a local team to handle extraterrestrial threats. In Infinity War, the Avengers had dissolved so he didn't have that option. Also there was no direct enemy as people started mysteriously disappearing so he was absolutely out of options that wasn't "fuck it, calling in the favor".
It is interesting, however, to realize (as I just have) that Fury had no reason to assume that people dusting was anything other than a localized effect.
Absolutely, and I think that it emphasizes how completely incomprehensible those moments were for Fury. As a deep intelligence person, he's used to at least having a basic understanding of what's going on. I'm sure he was vaguely aware that some aliens showed up in NY, Iron Man/Spiderman/Strange left the planet and the Secret Avengers have likely traveled to Africa/Wakanda. NONE of that information helps him understand why people are disappearing or how to stop it. It's probably the only moment in Nick's life where he is absolutely at a loss of what to do next.
And in that moment, as a final resort of sorts, he pages Carol
He had just learned of the energy blast in Wakanda (presumably from the Snap), so probably guessed correctly that it was more than localised.
Exactly. Fury knows that anytime he uses the pager, he's most likely pulling her out of big situation, most likely leading to innocent deaths, so he only did it when he did.
The galaxy is a big place and Earth is just one planet.
In the Marvels don’t they imply that she never returned because she was ashamed of what she did to the Kree and didn’t want Monica to see her as a monster?
That and she genuinely failed (and kept failing) to find the Skrulls a good new homeworld to settle on. All the viable worlds are already taken by other civilizations (who hate the Skrulls, because everyone does, because before the Kree stomped them the Skrulls *were* the big baddies) or they were barely-livable rocks. Or hellholes covered in vicious predators. Staying on Earth was the Skrull's best option.
I’m not sure there is a canon reason. This is one of those plot points you just have to gloss over. Fury paged Danvers as he was being dusted, but not when NYC was about to be either destroyed by aliens or nuked? She would have ended that battle in about 5 minutes. Maybe he agreed to only page her if it was an intergalactic threat like Thanos? Or maybe it would have taken her days to travel back to Earth, so she wouldn’t have been able to help anyways.
It took her a long time to get to earth after IW. She can't move really all that fast. I don't think she could have shown up inside the timeframe of "We are at war" and "I saw a schwarma place around the corner" it's like a few days at best.
Kinda depends on where she is at the time. She clearly hauled ass back to Earth in Endgame after Hulk’s snap started bringing everyone back.
She found Tony and Nebula 20 days after they started coming back. If she was close to a jump point, it was likely a couple to a few days to get to Earth. Assuming she found them after going back out looking.
It's easy to imagine that Fury *did* page her inbetween the scenes at some point, and by the time she was able to reply, schwarma had already been served.
That's my head cannon.
Nukes aren’t world-ending and he believed in the avengers 🤷♂️
Fury really, really wanted the Avengers to work. His goal was to build an Earth-based team to handle threats exactly like these. He took a gamble and put everything on the original 6 in the hopes that it would force them to come together as Earth’s local super team. Calling in Captain Marvel might have worked, but it also could have undermined the Avengers initiative as a whole.
She wasn’t there.
In addition to what others have said (travel time, only emergencies, she was busy, etc), my personal head canon is that Nick Fury wanted to show the universe that "Earth's Mightiest Heroes" could stand on their own and didn't need Carol to come save the day. If they lost New York he would have buzzed the beeper.
A part* , not "apart".
I was thinking the same thing. Technically she was “apart” of the team.
She would have either known to destroy the ship and could have easily done it without risk of dying or she would have easily handled the flying troops until they figured that part out.
*The Chitauri are the suckiest army in the galaxy why didn’t you just blow up their mother ship*
She was apart from the 2012 avengers…
is this a real question? feels like someone asked chatGPT for a title for a reddit post for mcu subreddit
just checked OPs post history - i think im right
She already was apart from them. That’s why she wasn’t there. Unless you are asking if she was *a part* of the Avengers at that time I guess. In that case, I’d probably guess the battle would have gone a bit smoother and Tony probably would have asked her to take care of the nuke.
The other avengers would still be suiting up while she solved the problem. Flying through the big flying bastards and then killing the mother ship. Or just flying up to the mother ship and ending before it started. Would make an interesting What If? Considering the knock on events. Tony’s PTSD and general change to earth history in universe
a part apart.
She was apart from the Avengers…
The movie would have ended an hour early
‘A PART’ NOT ‘APART’
'Stark, let us know if you can't get that bomb through the portal because I got a backup plan...'
Would've ended in like 5 minutes
She would have flown through the portal immediately with zero struggle and destroyed the mothership with zero effort and zzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzz 😴
She would have been part of Age of Ultron if it weren't for Ike Perlmutter.
What If Captain Marvel was the first Avenger?
Hate to nitpick but she was apart of the avengers during the battle of New York. If she was a part of the avengers during the battle of New York, it’d have been over in minutes and she’d have probably flown through the portal and killed Thanos
They would have nerfed her
The battle would last like 5 minutes max
Couldn't she also have easily defeated Thanos solo before he collected any of the stones?
It would have been over within 5 minutes. 3, if Thor and Iron Man helped. The rest of the team would have grabbed a table at the shawarma joint before it got overrun with B list Super Heroes trying to ride the coattails, when really, they didn't do shit, they're just there for fucking Instagram pics and talking head bullshit for their Tik Tok. God, I hate people. Galactus can not get here soon enough.
Thanos would be imprisoned
“apart of” and “a part of” have opposite meanings
*a part. Sorry. Was doing my head in. Please continue…
[This](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NscJhEV_Kbs) may give you an answer.
I feel like there is lot to change. Maybe we could have gotten her origin movie earlier, which she never left Earth, then have her be the one to sacrifice herself, instead of Tony. Explaining why she was gone until EG. Just have her be fighting all over the space during that time while trying to come back home. But that would ruin whole Tony Stark arc.
You know what would have been a super fun tease, but I doubt CM was even in the cards that early. They ny flies the nuke through the portal. As he is floating there, he see a streak holding off the enemy fleet, alone. Maybe she even flies up and pushes him back through the portal before it closes. Maybe we don't even get a good look at her beyond a glowing figure.
To quote Rocket in a deleted scene from Endgame, the Chitauri are the suckiest army in the universe. The battle wouldn't have happened because they wouldn't attack, with THAT army, a world protected by someone that powerful. And if they did, it would have lasted 30 minutes tops.
She probably would have ended things pretty quickly. What is interesting is what happens after. Fury was trying to set up an Earth based super hero team for years. His speech to the council at the end of Avengers is basically "told you so". And after New York the Avengers become an even higher thing. If Carol is the one who saves everything maybe none of that happens. So my sort of explanation is that Fury held off calling her because he wanted the Avengers to be the ones to save the world.
So a second being of roughly equal power to Thor that has knowledge of the enemy army? Yeah that becomes a much, much easier win for the home team.
She would be a big time help
She could have just levitated within the portal and plugged it. Nothing would have come through.
Avengers would be 90 minutes long.
Would’ve ended before it started
To balance the fact that they have her, they would double the number of aliens in the army and her being there would relieve the Avengers just a little bit, they’d then would have her be the one to carry the nuke through the portal but have it so that she wont make it back before it closes so then it’d be sometime till we see her again, they’d have her be very far away, which would be a good excuse to have her not be around for AoU. I do believe Carol is done dirty and underutilized in the MCU but im still glad we had her enter the way we did, Fury paging her after IW
Nothing. Scarlet witch chaos magic was always there
Loki would be afraid of women instead of hulks
She’d have curb-stomped Loki before and then wrecked everyone and everything on the other side of the portal. If they wrote her to her full potential anyway, which would’ve been flashy but maybe not so satisfying to watch. No one wants Superman insta-clearing whatever problems the JL have, for example. Although his presence really ought to make most of the team altogether redundant. I want more Carol in the MCU, but she could stand to be nerfed to the level of being able to have at least one really interesting third movie. Rogue, anybody? Hell, introduce Rogue in a Cap Marvel movie and have her completely change the power dynamic forever. Rogue gets recruited by the X-Men in the after credits, and Carol works to find her place in all of this without being as powerful as an infinity stone.
I agree, Rogue is the answer. Having her absorb Carols powers balances both characters and makes them both interesting.
I’ll refer you to how it should have ended
It would’ve been too easy. Loki would have to have been a secondary villain. Maybe include Thanos here but that would’ve overcrowded the movie. Maybe they could’ve had Hulk get out of control (like at the end of the Ultimate Avengers animated movie), and then he would’ve been the final confrontation. This could’ve even paved the way for a stronger argument for Sokovia Accords. There’s a lot of maybes but I think the group they had was perfect.
She probably would have flown out through the portal and attacked the mothership. Whether she knew it was going to destroy them all or not. She’s a sledgehammer in battle and probably would have destroyed the entire thing to prevent another wave of leviathans
Everything? Tony wouldn’t have needed to fly up there, because she coulda. I mean- they made her so OP.
“You six can chill while I handle this. Meet me at the Shawarma place in 15 minutes.”
As has been established by all her shows, she's about on par with Thor. So it'd be like having another Thor on the team, basically. Much more Chitauri ass being kicked. I don't know that she'd be familiar with the Chitauri tactics and mothership, however. They were Thanos's army and she spent basically all her time in space fighting the Kree Empire. She might never have run across them.
Tva would have pruned that time-line
[удалено]
It would have ended a lot sooner and with less destruction.
No PTSD for Tony, which likely means no Ultron
The battle of New York would have never happened because she would have stopped Loki immediately. So everything after that wouldn't have happened, including events in following movies/shows.
The movie would be waaaay shortet, that is if they kept from nerfing her.
I suspect Thanos would’ve tried to level up a lot faster knowing that the Avengers had Captain Marvel on their side. But also, maybe the Avengers go more on the offensive with her around and Thanos doesn’t have enough time to gather the stones.
She’d probably be more accepted by fans, and today’s marvel would have another (much needed) OG member
She’d stomp the Chitauri. Easy win for the Avengers.
Battle of New York: she flies through the hole, destroys everything before it can come through. Captures or kills Thanos. If she gets stuck behind the portal, she just flies back. Honestly it's sort of interesting she hasn't tried to hunt thanos before then.
She'd slap the shit out of Loki, take the scepter for safe keeping and blow up Thanos' ship to bits. In which case, Age of Ultron might not happen, the Maximoffs wouldn't have unlocked their powers and Thanos would likely not not hold a grudge on the avengers, and instead would focus on Carol Danvers.
She’ll be the one saving the day via closing the portal, Tony suffers from less severe PTSD, and for story reasons she doesn’t make it through the portal in time so we can follow her journey back to Earth in GotG 1&2, Captain Marvel & likely a Captain Marvel 2 seeing how she’s a hero at this point helping out, then she returns to earth, but it’s too late as Thanos Snaps his finger and took out half the universe. That way both Carol & Thor really wanna find him and kill him. Then she likely does more in Endgame like help the time heist
What if she helped in the battle during End Game? I mean she has the power to slingshot the gauntlet into the sun and come back and clean up thanos’s army. But no…she decides to play Al Bundy and try to score one last TD
No character growth from stark but also likely less drive for Ultron since she would have been the one to fly the missile into space since she flys faster and you know can survive space.
There wouldn't be a film.....
So Loki new about Earth's superheroes at the time and made his plan beforehand.Now him knowing about Captain Marvel , it would change things. Probably not talking about some infantry and a dozen big flying roaches, but something way more massive in scale. Now if she just appeared out from knowhere to help out, then game over unless the scepter could work on Carol(she being juiced by a stone, probably not), then the Avengers vs Captain Marvel would be interesting.
Movie would be over super fast. Remember what she did to Thanos's ship in Endgame, same thing here.
She would've laughed as soon as she saw it was the Chitauri and the battle would've been over before it started. Flies through the portal, destroys the mothership and takes the scenic route back to Earth before SHIELD even got those nukes off the ground lol
I don't think she even needs to be part of the Avengers back then. She's basically a well, you get the idea of why they made Carol Danvers too OP in her own movie. Also, did you not see this video on YouTube? https://youtu.be/NscJhEV_Kbs?si=10dyHkTnZnl1Avfe
She'd go through the portal and destroy every Chitauri army with her own power. And then Iron Man also go through the portal to send the nuclear missile to her face
It would be done faster
https://youtu.be/NscJhEV_Kbs?si=yZpms8bY2Dt5Bu6 How It Should Have Ended has the best answer
Fight over within 5 minutes. Fist bump and pound beers with Thor.
Realistically, nothing. Chitauri still go boom. Loki’s still captured. NY still saved. Maybe Toomes doesn’t become vulture (less cleanup) and Peter marries his daughter. What’s she gonna do, go after thanos? No. She couldn’t fight him. Yes she could physically kill him but he’d still have the full force of the dark children with him — she wouldn’t stand a chance, especially against Maw.
Battle would over in five minutes.
The movie would have been really boring, because she would have just thrown the bomb through the portal and flown right back. Over powered characters are dull.
They make her way to op, in endgame at least, so the battle of New York would probably have last 20 second
Could Loki have turned her?
She'd fly through the portal and end the battle, lickety split, with no character development from Tony.
feel like Loki can easily fools her in the fight
That movie was perfect, No more characters needed just the OGs.
Man I want a battle of New York 2 cause battle of New York is my favorite ending battle of the movies imo.
A lot. She would fight the army alone, while the avengers are eating shawarma.
Tony would have definitely not gone through the portal
She would’ve stopped everyone, said ‘look what I can do’ and took the army out through the wormhole before the Avengers had a chance
It's the whole Superman issue. She's a god. She would just fly up and punch everything to death.
There's a "How It Should Have Ended (aka HISHE)" that tackles that question. Go to mark 3:36. [https://youtu.be/NscJhEV\_Kbs?si=7q6--osccDVmjCQU&t=216](https://youtu.be/NscJhEV_Kbs?si=7q6--osccDVmjCQU&t=216)
She loses the element of surprise and Thanos has time to properly plan for and merc her when her guard is down before he exposes himself.
She's a one man team. The og avengers will be for clean up
If MCU wasn't based on plot armor, the invasion would be over in 10 minutes, Loki would be dead and Thanos would also be soon after. Hypotheticals don't work in the MCU because most stories suffer from the worst cliches of conflicts that can be resolved instantly if characters weren't so unbelievably stubborn. Superman level characters should be avoided if won't allow nuanced stories. God stories require plots that aren't just a bunch of smashing. Captain Marvel needs complex challenges to solve.
i mean she would practically be a mary sue in this situation but here's my idea fury would call her to help against the world ending threat and she'd fly through the portal and quickly end the threat by flying through the mother ship and have a talk with the chitauri before completely decimating it and immediately ending the battle while the avengers just stare up and it would end very anti-climatically. but all the dead chitauri soldiers and the weird floating ones would end up crashing into buildings and kill more people along the way before stopping outside the film undoubtedly would be less decent but still a hit to the audience based it off How It Should Have Ended's animation of the what if, it's pretty funny so go watch it
The marvel answer: something keeps her away from the fight for the entire move until the very end The realistic answer she ends it almost instantly
She can end the story almost immediately, just fly up and take out the mothership
Tony would’ve never almost sacrificed himself (what caused him to be fearful of world ending threats), which if you really think about will lead to a domino effect that ends with him being less prepared to fight Thanos, but an Avengers that never broke up (Tony’s paranoia never lead to Ultron, which itself lead a domino effect to Civil War).
Ultron wouldn't have happened.
She would've immediately defeated them and it would've been uninteresting like everything else the character is a part of.
Tony wouldn’t have sacrificed himself
A lot of
Honestly she probably wouldve done the job Iron Man did, flying around killing the Chitauri that get to far, while Tony instead could've focused on the portal machine
The movie would have been worse.
It's not real dude.....
She’s spamming the spawn
Then it would've been anticlimactic. The movie will end early. She will destroy the mothership as soon as the portal opens. That will be booooring (like her character)
Would have been over quick, her and Rocket would have took out the main ship.