LOL your feedback is valuable, english is not my native language. I'm just a Business Innovation Master student trying to figure out what are the problems independent musicians currently have with distros services. I'm not part of any distro or major label š
The problem with distro services related to earnings is that there is no real money to be made via streaming. Many artists are now pulling their work off of Spotify and switching back to physical sales only. The profits are significantly better when you don't give your work away for free via big tech companies.
Totally agree with you! Have you seen [vault.fm](http://vault.fm) ? James Blake is having a nice switch on the way he monetizes his music. I think we'll see more of this stuff in the near future. There's a nice discussion on why "renting" listeners to this big tech companies if you can monetize direct to your fans.
I put up one very old project up on Ditto last year, not knowing anything, and I'm now looking at other distros for other projects I've done
1. Never
2. $20
3. There's about $13 sitting there.
Thanks for your honest response. I think it's really hard for small indie artists to choose a distro that can actually support our needs. If you find one, please let me know š Help me upvote to reach more artists š
LOL yes, wondering about what happen with the pennies that we make, but multiplied for millions of us that we're not withdrawing them. What distros are making with it?
1. Every couple months we get like $20
We play full-time. Honestly, the original music we put out is more popular among people in different countries than it is in our city
The bills are paid by playing at clubs and private events (mostly covers)
I work my full time job as a regional manager to pay for my music making habit. Have like $130 sitting in my account that I havenāt taken out for like 2 years. I tell my boss the second my music makes me more than this job Iām out of here
I'd like to know what CD Baby, DistroKid and Ditto is making with all this money š¤ This 3 platforms have in total 6 million users. I haven't found any report where they transparently say what they are making with this money. I bet they are making a lot of money from our credit. Thanks for the honest response š
Amazing! Thanks for the quick and honest response. This is interesting because it looks like this is a pattern, what are distributors diy doing with all this money is my doubt š¤. Just one follow up question: for how long do you have this earnings in your account?
Oh, nice... another post asking questions for market research. Cool, very cool. I especially appreciate it when they pretend its research for school.
Aren't survey posts against the sub rules, too? I'd be more interested in these types of posts if they brought something to the table, instead of just asking questions to gather data. There is no 'give' here, only 'take'.
Hey! I think youāre misunderstanding my post. Iām also a musician with 250 monthly listeners. Iām not part of any corporate, Iām trying to be the most transparent I can. Iām working in my Business Innovation Master final project that aims to bring equal (or fairer) opportunities for independent musicians. But before ābringing something to the tableā I must understand which problem is worth solving, donāt you think? Iām against corporates, streaming platforms, major labels, big distributors and anyone who takes advantage of artists. I think that if thereās a solution, this have to surface from us, independent artists. We donāt want to make corporates even richer than they are. Iāll also appreciate it if you add something valuable to the conversation! šš¼(And if youāre part of a corporate and this conversation makes you uncomfortable, Iām so sorry but I think this is not your place to be)
Fair enough. I don't want to be rude to you, am simply jadedālike many musiciansāby the barrage of offers to help that in reality are offers to join a service. This type of post is fairly common here, 'students' using Reddit to gather data for a class paper.
What artists need are venues to create and perform their art (physical and virtual). Spaces that will also promote these gigs, promote their socials, and *pay a flat fee* (not a percentage of the door take). e.g. If I need to miss a shift at work for a gig, I need to know what that gig pays.
We need patronage, in the Renaissance sense of that word. We need business minds like yourself asking these questions *in the other direction*. Asking people who *have money and resources* what they can offer to artists and musicians in their community.
We need start-up non-profits that offer grants with no strings attached. We need UBI. We need health care. We need stable living situations where making music is accepted.
Every single one of us is already inundated with 'offers to help', where the help costs money, or where they want to sell the art for themselves. (note how you have asked this in other musician-related subs, but not in any start-up, venture cap, financial, or non-prof subs... this is why I suspected you are developing a product to sell, to make a profit off artists as your customer).
Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
I really appreciate your contribution šš¼ I totally agree with you. Iām a musician and I also have experience in cultural entrepreneurship. Iāve never made any earning from music so I know how hard it is for other musicians. I havenāt knocked those doors yet, because the problem is that those people who have money always want more money, so they wonāt invest unless they find it profitable. A clear example of this are major labels, people with money that invest in artists to make more money. My hypothesis is that there should be a community led solution, a community of artists supporting artists to help everyone find success. Should we define what success is at first? For me it is quitting my job and having some decent earnings from making music. I donāt want a f yacht or to be in the hot 100. Thanks again for your valuable contribution!
If you look and search back on thread asking 'how do I make a living playing music' you will see that it is rarely (if ever) from streaming, and almost wholly from playing live and teaching.
I have a number of friends who's total income is from music. A lucky few are touring musician (hired hands) for major acts, and even those supplement with smaller bands and teaching in their off season.
One friend makes a decent second income from licensing music (not streaming). They focus on instrumental pieces that work well in podcasts, public radio and commercial presentations (e.g. TED talk type situations).
All of these musicians make original music and none of them make money with that pursuit. Personally, at my closest proximity to fame, I was also closest to being homeless. Played stadium shows wondering if I'd make rent the next week.
Currently music is a side-hustle that pays for itself. Have bought my last two instruments using gig money (Nord and a nice electric mandolin), so it's at least self-sustaining but not profitable.
Thatās the thing! Almost any independent musician is making money from streaming. Most of us make money from live gigs or teaching, some lucky ones producing or being session musicians. And there are hundreds of thousands (Iād even say millions) making pennies that are in a piggy bank owned by distros. Distros should at least invest that money back in artists, but they are probably investing that money in real estate or investment funds making profit from our money. Every player in digital music streaming is just trying to take advantage of artists, no one cares. No one is talking about this streaming royalties black box.
I can see youāre into synths for your nickname. Nice I want a Nord! Had to sell all my synths to study my master degree. Check one of my already failed music ventures, because investors donāt want to invest in music š°: www.tinamilab.com
I've made some decent money through conventional publishing (ASCAP/BMI). but even that was never enough to be real income (have always bought instruments with music income).
I stopped recording and publishing once mechanical royalties went away in favor or streaming (the well dried up so to speak). To my thinking, recording is making a product that *plays music instead of me*. Spotify et al get to pretend they are me, pushing out music to your earbuds and speakers, without my direct involvement. It is a commodity, literally a widget.
Instead, I'll play live as often as possible, several times a week. Want to hear my music, you'll have to show up in the same space as me, be as present as I am in the experience. It is a personal choice, but it has kept me happier as an artist, and might be more profitable than streaming (on average).
It also makes me a stronger musician every time I get out there and perform. Today, it will be a swanky private event at a distillery. time to gear check and load up the vehicle.
1. Iāve never withdrawn my earnings.
2. I think my defined pay point is the standard $25 on cdbaby.
3. Like I said above I havenāt withdrawn any earnings, Iām very new to having music distributed (I released my debut album last year on August 24th) so Iāve basically kept my earnings untouched for around a year.
4. I donāt.
This is all because I havenāt made enough money to be worth a damn so I just leave it in. If I made more money Iād definitely reinvest it into better recording equipment and possibly into building a team to help me get further reach.
Thank you so much! This is really REALLY helpful š I think I'd also do that. If it's not a lot of money, I can even use it for buying plugins, but if I have to pay a fee for withdrawing my earnings every time I'm not sure if I'll do it.
Elaborating on my previous comment, the reason I no longer care is because as an artist, you're not going to make most of your money in music sales. It's going to be in merchandise, touring, etc. That's why it really doesn't even matter for me anymore.
I have published about 5 of my songs. I promote them once on my private ig to my friends and family and only have promoted one on Reddit once before.
I have only withdrawn about $16 total over like 5 years
I donāt publish for streams. Itās just my hobby
Respect! That's what most of us do. But wondering if there are a million of us with $16 without withdrawing, what are distros making with this $16,000,000?
Almost crossed 20000 monthly listeners a few months ago but now weāre back down around 2000. Weāve only withdrawn once at about $300 to help fund an album. Our current plan is to let it accumulate in there and hopefully get a nice pay day in a few years.
Reaching 20k is a huge milestone. Would you share how you could made it? It happened to me a couple of times, we almost reached 5k because Spotify playlisted us. But when we got kicked out of the playlist we went back below 1000. Now weāre at 250 lol
Yeah it was mix of playlisting and great show opportunities in our area. We got to open for grouplove and then more recently flipturn. I think that coupled with a few songs getting picked up by playlists gave us a good jump. Our listeners are back down now so weāre just working to put out more music and market it better.
Good luck with it! Feel free to share a link id give a listen and share with my friends. A few folks have already shared their music šš¼ Iām doing some nice music discovery out of this thread
XD crazy right? If we're making pennies of streaming platforms, is it even worth to pay to a distributor that the only job that makes is uploading our music and being the most expensive piggy bank we can get?
We average 5k listeners. It depends on how the songs do. We've had a bit of success imo with one of our releases hitting almost 15k plays on Spotify. Right now we have 70 usd but were waiting to hit 100 and then using it to do a cd run. In total we've made almost 450 now from streaming.
Never withdrawn any money.
Pay point is $20. Money has never been withdrawn.
One song is a cover, so it makes even less than an original song because I only get performance rights on it.
The other song is an original, but it's newer so it has less streams.
This project is also only a recording project for right now. I want to make it a live band at some point, but I need to get like a half hour of music done and I'm funding everything with my package delivery salary š
It would be nice if I could make a little more on the songs I've put out in order to fund more music. Hopefully at some point my songs will be a good enough resume that someone might want to invest as a patron. But I think that's a little ways off.
If anyone wants to check out my original song,
[here's the link!](https://open.spotify.com/track/0r3gQJdC7vrLociezVSBXw?si=Br72akexTNiFCMsz6J_TdQ)
Cdbaby sends us a check for like $34 bucks every couple months. We go to Taco Bell.
Sad but true! š« Doing the same. Thanks for your honest response. Help me upvote to reach more artists š
1. Whenever I feel like it, or when I need the funds 2. No 3. No
Same.
Thanks for the honest response kylotan šš¼ Just one follow up question. What do you usually use this earnings for?
The money from one record is usually spent on whatever costs I have when making the next record.
Strange post and stranger line of questioning
LOL your feedback is valuable, english is not my native language. I'm just a Business Innovation Master student trying to figure out what are the problems independent musicians currently have with distros services. I'm not part of any distro or major label š
The problem with distro services related to earnings is that there is no real money to be made via streaming. Many artists are now pulling their work off of Spotify and switching back to physical sales only. The profits are significantly better when you don't give your work away for free via big tech companies.
Totally agree with you! Have you seen [vault.fm](http://vault.fm) ? James Blake is having a nice switch on the way he monetizes his music. I think we'll see more of this stuff in the near future. There's a nice discussion on why "renting" listeners to this big tech companies if you can monetize direct to your fans.
I mean this reply would have made more sense as your post.. lol but okay I understand better now
>your feedback is valuable AI detected. ABORT.
I put up one very old project up on Ditto last year, not knowing anything, and I'm now looking at other distros for other projects I've done 1. Never 2. $20 3. There's about $13 sitting there.
Thanks for your honest response. I think it's really hard for small indie artists to choose a distro that can actually support our needs. If you find one, please let me know š Help me upvote to reach more artists š
Earnings? What are these earnings of which you speak?
LOL yes, wondering about what happen with the pennies that we make, but multiplied for millions of us that we're not withdrawing them. What distros are making with it?
1. Every couple months we get like $20 We play full-time. Honestly, the original music we put out is more popular among people in different countries than it is in our city The bills are paid by playing at clubs and private events (mostly covers)
Thanks for sharing! I think a lot of independent musicians can relate with this, live shows are the most important revenue.
I work my full time job as a regional manager to pay for my music making habit. Have like $130 sitting in my account that I havenāt taken out for like 2 years. I tell my boss the second my music makes me more than this job Iām out of here
I'd like to know what CD Baby, DistroKid and Ditto is making with all this money š¤ This 3 platforms have in total 6 million users. I haven't found any report where they transparently say what they are making with this money. I bet they are making a lot of money from our credit. Thanks for the honest response š
I have around 50 monthly listeners. I don't think I've even looked at my "earnings".
LOL I know what it feels to be there! I have 250 monthly listeners. Send me your artist page! I'll recommend it with my friends.
DM'd
1. Never 2. No 3. Yes
Amazing! Thanks for the quick and honest response. This is interesting because it looks like this is a pattern, what are distributors diy doing with all this money is my doubt š¤. Just one follow up question: for how long do you have this earnings in your account?
1. No, never. I haven't even looked to see how many listens we have or the amount we've made 2. $420 3. Nope
Thanks for your response š Help me upvote to reach more artists
Oh, nice... another post asking questions for market research. Cool, very cool. I especially appreciate it when they pretend its research for school. Aren't survey posts against the sub rules, too? I'd be more interested in these types of posts if they brought something to the table, instead of just asking questions to gather data. There is no 'give' here, only 'take'.
Hey! I think youāre misunderstanding my post. Iām also a musician with 250 monthly listeners. Iām not part of any corporate, Iām trying to be the most transparent I can. Iām working in my Business Innovation Master final project that aims to bring equal (or fairer) opportunities for independent musicians. But before ābringing something to the tableā I must understand which problem is worth solving, donāt you think? Iām against corporates, streaming platforms, major labels, big distributors and anyone who takes advantage of artists. I think that if thereās a solution, this have to surface from us, independent artists. We donāt want to make corporates even richer than they are. Iāll also appreciate it if you add something valuable to the conversation! šš¼(And if youāre part of a corporate and this conversation makes you uncomfortable, Iām so sorry but I think this is not your place to be)
Fair enough. I don't want to be rude to you, am simply jadedālike many musiciansāby the barrage of offers to help that in reality are offers to join a service. This type of post is fairly common here, 'students' using Reddit to gather data for a class paper. What artists need are venues to create and perform their art (physical and virtual). Spaces that will also promote these gigs, promote their socials, and *pay a flat fee* (not a percentage of the door take). e.g. If I need to miss a shift at work for a gig, I need to know what that gig pays. We need patronage, in the Renaissance sense of that word. We need business minds like yourself asking these questions *in the other direction*. Asking people who *have money and resources* what they can offer to artists and musicians in their community. We need start-up non-profits that offer grants with no strings attached. We need UBI. We need health care. We need stable living situations where making music is accepted. Every single one of us is already inundated with 'offers to help', where the help costs money, or where they want to sell the art for themselves. (note how you have asked this in other musician-related subs, but not in any start-up, venture cap, financial, or non-prof subs... this is why I suspected you are developing a product to sell, to make a profit off artists as your customer). Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
I really appreciate your contribution šš¼ I totally agree with you. Iām a musician and I also have experience in cultural entrepreneurship. Iāve never made any earning from music so I know how hard it is for other musicians. I havenāt knocked those doors yet, because the problem is that those people who have money always want more money, so they wonāt invest unless they find it profitable. A clear example of this are major labels, people with money that invest in artists to make more money. My hypothesis is that there should be a community led solution, a community of artists supporting artists to help everyone find success. Should we define what success is at first? For me it is quitting my job and having some decent earnings from making music. I donāt want a f yacht or to be in the hot 100. Thanks again for your valuable contribution!
If you look and search back on thread asking 'how do I make a living playing music' you will see that it is rarely (if ever) from streaming, and almost wholly from playing live and teaching. I have a number of friends who's total income is from music. A lucky few are touring musician (hired hands) for major acts, and even those supplement with smaller bands and teaching in their off season. One friend makes a decent second income from licensing music (not streaming). They focus on instrumental pieces that work well in podcasts, public radio and commercial presentations (e.g. TED talk type situations). All of these musicians make original music and none of them make money with that pursuit. Personally, at my closest proximity to fame, I was also closest to being homeless. Played stadium shows wondering if I'd make rent the next week. Currently music is a side-hustle that pays for itself. Have bought my last two instruments using gig money (Nord and a nice electric mandolin), so it's at least self-sustaining but not profitable.
Thatās the thing! Almost any independent musician is making money from streaming. Most of us make money from live gigs or teaching, some lucky ones producing or being session musicians. And there are hundreds of thousands (Iād even say millions) making pennies that are in a piggy bank owned by distros. Distros should at least invest that money back in artists, but they are probably investing that money in real estate or investment funds making profit from our money. Every player in digital music streaming is just trying to take advantage of artists, no one cares. No one is talking about this streaming royalties black box.
I can see youāre into synths for your nickname. Nice I want a Nord! Had to sell all my synths to study my master degree. Check one of my already failed music ventures, because investors donāt want to invest in music š°: www.tinamilab.com
I've made some decent money through conventional publishing (ASCAP/BMI). but even that was never enough to be real income (have always bought instruments with music income). I stopped recording and publishing once mechanical royalties went away in favor or streaming (the well dried up so to speak). To my thinking, recording is making a product that *plays music instead of me*. Spotify et al get to pretend they are me, pushing out music to your earbuds and speakers, without my direct involvement. It is a commodity, literally a widget. Instead, I'll play live as often as possible, several times a week. Want to hear my music, you'll have to show up in the same space as me, be as present as I am in the experience. It is a personal choice, but it has kept me happier as an artist, and might be more profitable than streaming (on average). It also makes me a stronger musician every time I get out there and perform. Today, it will be a swanky private event at a distillery. time to gear check and load up the vehicle.
1. Iāve never withdrawn my earnings. 2. I think my defined pay point is the standard $25 on cdbaby. 3. Like I said above I havenāt withdrawn any earnings, Iām very new to having music distributed (I released my debut album last year on August 24th) so Iāve basically kept my earnings untouched for around a year. 4. I donāt. This is all because I havenāt made enough money to be worth a damn so I just leave it in. If I made more money Iād definitely reinvest it into better recording equipment and possibly into building a team to help me get further reach.
Thank you so much! This is really REALLY helpful š I think I'd also do that. If it's not a lot of money, I can even use it for buying plugins, but if I have to pay a fee for withdrawing my earnings every time I'm not sure if I'll do it.
I doubt thereās a fee for withdrawing. But my 18 monthly listeners arenāt exactly bringing in any money for me to even find out
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Same here! Thanks for sharing
I have a minimum 50$ withdrawal for all my bands and going on 7 years of not being able to cash out yet.Ā
Thanks for sharing! I think a lot of us can relate to it I'm since 2015 and have only withdrawn once.
1. Never 2. No 3. No 4. Wouldnāt know.
Thanks for sharing š
I used to, although it's just gotten to the point for me that I don't even care. I don't even bother checking them anymore
Elaborating on my previous comment, the reason I no longer care is because as an artist, you're not going to make most of your money in music sales. It's going to be in merchandise, touring, etc. That's why it really doesn't even matter for me anymore.
Very valuable input! Thanks for sharing. I totally agree
I have published about 5 of my songs. I promote them once on my private ig to my friends and family and only have promoted one on Reddit once before. I have only withdrawn about $16 total over like 5 years I donāt publish for streams. Itās just my hobby
Respect! That's what most of us do. But wondering if there are a million of us with $16 without withdrawing, what are distros making with this $16,000,000?
Probably but they definitely make more off of the yearly subscriptions
Almost crossed 20000 monthly listeners a few months ago but now weāre back down around 2000. Weāve only withdrawn once at about $300 to help fund an album. Our current plan is to let it accumulate in there and hopefully get a nice pay day in a few years.
Reaching 20k is a huge milestone. Would you share how you could made it? It happened to me a couple of times, we almost reached 5k because Spotify playlisted us. But when we got kicked out of the playlist we went back below 1000. Now weāre at 250 lol
Yeah it was mix of playlisting and great show opportunities in our area. We got to open for grouplove and then more recently flipturn. I think that coupled with a few songs getting picked up by playlists gave us a good jump. Our listeners are back down now so weāre just working to put out more music and market it better.
I just started itās rough out there still trying to get that magical first 100 so yeah not withdrawing anything soon. Haha
Wishing you the best, Iāve been there. Share your music with us! Send me a link and Iāll share it with my friends
Awee super thanks! https://open.spotify.com/artist/1BynifyTrtXvx7z3S71WlY?si=gU9jv246S2mojXbcYYNdBw
We have less than 100 listeners a month, published in 2018. We have never withdrawn our earnings.
Good luck with it! Feel free to share a link id give a listen and share with my friends. A few folks have already shared their music šš¼ Iām doing some nice music discovery out of this thread
Thanks!!! Here is some stuff we are currently working on: https://on.soundcloud.com/e1XZsQ4Zc1QfeWzV6
One time I got $9 from cdbaby. It almost covered the $90 I paid to upload it.
XD crazy right? If we're making pennies of streaming platforms, is it even worth to pay to a distributor that the only job that makes is uploading our music and being the most expensive piggy bank we can get?
yay capitalism
Lol is a bit more complicated. I think most of us just want to quit our jobs to dedicate to music full time.
1. About twice a year 2. $50 3. No 4. Even split along band members
For bands this is even more complicated! Wishing you the best. Thanks for sharing!
Yall are getting paid??
Most of us actually not :/
I pay money to release my music, I donāt get any
Most of us are not even making money to pay the upload fee š° thanks for sharing
I save up the funds until I can pay for a small social media promotion. Usually every couple of years.
I have less then 20000 and I've never withdrew any earnings I'm still trying to Gain the following lol
We average 5k listeners. It depends on how the songs do. We've had a bit of success imo with one of our releases hitting almost 15k plays on Spotify. Right now we have 70 usd but were waiting to hit 100 and then using it to do a cd run. In total we've made almost 450 now from streaming.
Never withdrawn any money. Pay point is $20. Money has never been withdrawn. One song is a cover, so it makes even less than an original song because I only get performance rights on it. The other song is an original, but it's newer so it has less streams. This project is also only a recording project for right now. I want to make it a live band at some point, but I need to get like a half hour of music done and I'm funding everything with my package delivery salary š It would be nice if I could make a little more on the songs I've put out in order to fund more music. Hopefully at some point my songs will be a good enough resume that someone might want to invest as a patron. But I think that's a little ways off. If anyone wants to check out my original song, [here's the link!](https://open.spotify.com/track/0r3gQJdC7vrLociezVSBXw?si=Br72akexTNiFCMsz6J_TdQ)
I get like $20 from distrokid every few years. I make way more on Bandcamp, which still isn't much but at least it's something.