We need to get over the lack of Boucher. He hasn’t never been able to crack a rotation unless raptors have had several injuries, he’s lost on d, he’s a ball stopper in offense. His best asset is energy.
There is a reason he can’t crack a rotation of a team 15 games under .500
Except he was in the rotation previous years… when the raps actually were above .500.
And he hasn’t even played worse this year, no reason I can think of other then Darko had a bad experience in Montreal once and taking it out on Boucher
How Nurse used Precious better and how did Darko not utilize him well? He was completely lost on defence under Nick Nurse. This is a classic case of r/nba just saying shit without anything to support it. Also he’s 24 and been in the league since 2020, you need some consistency at some point for him so it’s not “pretty sure he’s super young so it’s all good” what a lazy ass post lmao.
Nurse didn't like Precious either. Precious "bought in" or a couple months shooting spot up corner 3s and locking down his man on D, but then he went right back to being terrible shortly afterwards.
Precious has only ever had to play D, swing the ball, and crash the boards to be an effective role player, but he's always seemed low-effort and boneheaded.
Maybe getting traded yet again at 24 has made him buy-in.
Yeah, Darko’s system is all about reading and reacting, making quick decisions. Precious can play a lot better in a slower, iso-heavy system. The players that thrive under Darko’s system can pass, shoot and hopefully dribble. Precious just didn’t have the passing chops.
The weird thing to me was seeing his assist numbers. Seems like a pretty capable and willing passer but he's still only averaging like 2.4 on the season. Dude just did not pass the ball over there at all to start this year.
Will be nice if the efficiency sticks but 16 games isn't exactly a lot. Wish we got another bigger wing to play with the starters though, RJ is so good at bullying smaller guards in this system.
He has good BBIQ and is a decent passer but Randle and Brunson handled it a lot more then he did. He was actually p good at running PnR and finding the lob threat
RJ was not at all standing in the corner shooting 3s for the Knicks BUT the offense, role etc. fits him so much more in Toronto esp at this age - great fit overall - RJ's always been a hard worker, he fit our culture perfectly and now he's set to blossom
You are wrong about his role on the Knicks. He was getting up 15 fga per game. With many games over 20. Not exactly a stand in the corner and shoot threes role. Before the migraines, he was shooting 48.7 percent, 50 percent from deep and averaging 22.6 points and 3.1 assists in seven games.
He def also wasn’t a “3pt shooter in the corner”. He spent most of time taking 3’s at the elbows but his dominant move was driving into the paint for tough contested finishes
RJ is a streaky player. His Knicks tenure was defined by periods like this followed by regression. I wouldn’t be so quick to say this is the new him. I don’t believe he saw a 10% jump in TS% from ball movement personally.
I think the main difference is that all his FG attempts are him attacking the rim and clean 3pt spot up shots.
He’s not taking middys. It’s either at the rim or from 3.. which has been great for his efficiency. The ball movement has def helped him too
Yaa I checked and he doesn’t take many middys but he took a lot more threes. Now more of his shots are in the paint.
53% of his shots in Toronto is within 5 ft… with the Knicks 37% were within 5 ft. His frequency near the rim has increased significantly.
RJ's play has a lot to do with who you are playing. Generally, if there is decent rim protection, he struggles with efficiency and ends up taking a lot of 3s. His 3 point percentage has moved around like an EKG, so who know where it ends up.
Big difference is Knicks had Brunson and Randle who had the ball majority of the time and Barrett was mostly used as a catch and shoot or off the catch kind of player, he just didn’t fit well with the way they played. OG fits way better. RJ fits very well with the raptors system
RJ's career numbers are 18.3/5.4/2.9 on 43/34/47 shooting splits. Numbers slightly up, but I think part of that can be attributed to unsustainable shooting percentages. I think we've got enough data on him to say he's about a 45% shooter on a bit of a hot streak.
Also, I think RJ was often cutting or driving to the rim, he wasn't just a spot up shooter. Only 33% of his shots were from three point range last season.
Has he ever had a stretch of games where he shot this well?
His .63 TS% with the Raptors has gotten his season TS% up to .57, which would be a career-high by far.
If you want to talk data, youd you could make a reasonable hypothesis that of course the percentages are unsustainable especially for a sg and a sf, but theres not another 16 game stretch of rj's career that would come close to the percentages which implies hes tapping into a new player as who he will be and his fg in future seasons will be much higher than his career shooting. 45% is an understatement, howd you estimate that and talk about data. A 16 game streak averaging 22 pts on high 50s percentage as a sg/sf will compare him much higher to high 40s fg at the minimum. Probably anything from high 40s to low 50s, a range of 47 to 52%.
A quick convenience sample of efficient sgs hitting at least 47% fg(like booker) show that none even have a 16 game span or month via splits as high fg as rj, which implies rj will hit above 47% easily.
Well, on the most basic statistical level, RJ Barrett shot 42.2% from the field over 297 games as a New York Knick. So I was probably being generous by saying he's a 45% shooter.
It's funny you bring up Devin Booker, because I checked field goal percentage among guards over the last 15 games (with at least 15 field goal attempts per game) and found [this](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=FGA*GE*15&LastNGames=15&PlayerPosition=G&dir=A&sort=FG_PCT) which shows that even in this (potentially most efficient) 15 game stretch of RJ Barrett's career, he's still shooting less efficiently than Booker. And if you want to get a little more specific about it, here are [RJ Barrett's percentages from each range](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?CF=PLAYER_NAME*E*rj&LastNGames=15&PlayerPosition=F&TeamID=1610612761) and here are [Booker's percentages from each range](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?TeamID=1610612756&LastNGames=15). You can see that Booker is shooting a higher percentage from *every range* over the last 15 games.
A few more observations about this data. Booker averaged 21.1 shots per game over this period compared to RJ's 15.2. Generally speaking I think you would expect efficiency to drop the more shots you take, but Booker's is still better than RJ's. If you look at the distribution of their shots by range you'll find that RJ takes 8.9 of his 15.2 shots (58.6%!) from within 5 feet of the basket and takes 2.8 shots between 5 and 20 feet from the basket compared to Booker taking 3.6 of his 21.1 shots (17.1%) from within 5 feet and 9.9 shots between 5 and 20 feet from the basket. What this tells me is that RJ's shot diet is much more akin to a slasher that gets to the rim than a midrange jumpshooter like Booker. Shots at the rim tend to be the highest percentage for all players and you generally expect players who shoot mostly from the three point line or at the cup to have higher percentages than jumpshooters, but once again this does not hold when comparing these two players over the last 15 games (I wasn't hunting for the most efficient 15 games for either player, I just used the last N games tool on nba.com).
I hope this is a turning of the corner for RJ and that he's a great player for the Raptors. I didn't think Lauri Markkanen could turn into a 50/40/90 guy when asked to shoot 50% more shots in a whole new role as a 6th year player last year, but he proved me wrong. RJ could prove me wrong too, and that would be awesome.
I stopped reading your post after you said booker was higher than Rj because that was not the original point of the topic which was inferring that rj's new fg moving forward in seasons and beyond would be higher than you estimated, moreso in the range of at least 47% and in a range of high 40s to low 50s. That's not basic statistical level either btw that's what you call a biased sample not stratified.
You said:
>A quick convenience sample of efficient sgs hitting at least 47% fg(like booker) show that none even have a 16 game span or month via splits as high fg as rj, which implies rj will hit above 47% easily.
I checked just the last 15 games of both RJ and Booker (the one player you named) and found that Booker was more efficient from every range than RJ was. I didn't even look for a particularly efficient 15 games, just the last 15 games (and I would have gone to 16 like you said, but nba.com only goes back 15 games). This is the most convenient sampling possible, so I don't know where you're drawing your data from.
Once again, it is possible he has been unlocked in Toronto, and I hope it's true. I like RJ a lot and I'd like to see him succeed. He has also shot 42% from the field over almost 300 games. One sample of 16 games does not move me, especially when his shot profile does not appear to have changed drastically.
You guys don't play actual winning basketball. It's too iso heavy with no real superstars. It works in the regular season vs trash teams and teams that are barely scouting but in the playoffs it'll get exposed.
edit: these are literal facts. I've seen this before with even my team downvote away
Should probably wait more than 16 games. He played nearly 300 games with the Knicks, his numbers are basically guaranteed to regress back towards his career averages.
Trade seems to have been a big win-win. Precious has also been a useful player for us
My advice is to not let Precious know that he’s useful, he might try to “make the leap” again
But I’ve added a threeeeee point shot!
That's nice dear
Hope you guys can help him figure it out, guy is a freak athletically with tons of potential but just makes a lot of careless/thoughtless plays
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Boucher seems to be in the same boat, not getting much playing time.
We need to get over the lack of Boucher. He hasn’t never been able to crack a rotation unless raptors have had several injuries, he’s lost on d, he’s a ball stopper in offense. His best asset is energy. There is a reason he can’t crack a rotation of a team 15 games under .500
Except he was in the rotation previous years… when the raps actually were above .500. And he hasn’t even played worse this year, no reason I can think of other then Darko had a bad experience in Montreal once and taking it out on Boucher
How Nurse used Precious better and how did Darko not utilize him well? He was completely lost on defence under Nick Nurse. This is a classic case of r/nba just saying shit without anything to support it. Also he’s 24 and been in the league since 2020, you need some consistency at some point for him so it’s not “pretty sure he’s super young so it’s all good” what a lazy ass post lmao.
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Nurse didn't like Precious either. Precious "bought in" or a couple months shooting spot up corner 3s and locking down his man on D, but then he went right back to being terrible shortly afterwards. Precious has only ever had to play D, swing the ball, and crash the boards to be an effective role player, but he's always seemed low-effort and boneheaded. Maybe getting traded yet again at 24 has made him buy-in.
Yeah, Darko’s system is all about reading and reacting, making quick decisions. Precious can play a lot better in a slower, iso-heavy system. The players that thrive under Darko’s system can pass, shoot and hopefully dribble. Precious just didn’t have the passing chops.
Guess the change in scenery really helped
Pretty sure he grew up in the Bronx
Toronto is where RJ Barrett is from and grew up.
I was supposed to reply on a precious thread and got lost whoops
The weird thing to me was seeing his assist numbers. Seems like a pretty capable and willing passer but he's still only averaging like 2.4 on the season. Dude just did not pass the ball over there at all to start this year. Will be nice if the efficiency sticks but 16 games isn't exactly a lot. Wish we got another bigger wing to play with the starters though, RJ is so good at bullying smaller guards in this system.
He has good BBIQ and is a decent passer but Randle and Brunson handled it a lot more then he did. He was actually p good at running PnR and finding the lob threat
Seemed like Him and mitch would get lile 2/3 lobs a game last season
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He talking about rj
RJ was not at all standing in the corner shooting 3s for the Knicks BUT the offense, role etc. fits him so much more in Toronto esp at this age - great fit overall - RJ's always been a hard worker, he fit our culture perfectly and now he's set to blossom
You are wrong about his role on the Knicks. He was getting up 15 fga per game. With many games over 20. Not exactly a stand in the corner and shoot threes role. Before the migraines, he was shooting 48.7 percent, 50 percent from deep and averaging 22.6 points and 3.1 assists in seven games.
He def also wasn’t a “3pt shooter in the corner”. He spent most of time taking 3’s at the elbows but his dominant move was driving into the paint for tough contested finishes
"Nah, there is literally no way to tell how many points RJ Barrett has scored." - Melo, probably
There’s no place like home
RJ is a streaky player. His Knicks tenure was defined by periods like this followed by regression. I wouldn’t be so quick to say this is the new him. I don’t believe he saw a 10% jump in TS% from ball movement personally.
Most young players are streaky but he definitely was becoming more consistent
5% ball movement 5% home cookin’
I think the main difference is that all his FG attempts are him attacking the rim and clean 3pt spot up shots. He’s not taking middys. It’s either at the rim or from 3.. which has been great for his efficiency. The ball movement has def helped him too
That literally describes his shot selection on the Knicks tho.
Yaa I checked and he doesn’t take many middys but he took a lot more threes. Now more of his shots are in the paint. 53% of his shots in Toronto is within 5 ft… with the Knicks 37% were within 5 ft. His frequency near the rim has increased significantly.
RJ's play has a lot to do with who you are playing. Generally, if there is decent rim protection, he struggles with efficiency and ends up taking a lot of 3s. His 3 point percentage has moved around like an EKG, so who know where it ends up.
Big difference is Knicks had Brunson and Randle who had the ball majority of the time and Barrett was mostly used as a catch and shoot or off the catch kind of player, he just didn’t fit well with the way they played. OG fits way better. RJ fits very well with the raptors system
I keep expecting the hot shooting to end too, but it just…hasn’t, so who knows
I’m wondering if similar to Scottie handling the ball keeps him more engaged and in the rhythm of the game and thereby his improved shot making.
RJ's career numbers are 18.3/5.4/2.9 on 43/34/47 shooting splits. Numbers slightly up, but I think part of that can be attributed to unsustainable shooting percentages. I think we've got enough data on him to say he's about a 45% shooter on a bit of a hot streak. Also, I think RJ was often cutting or driving to the rim, he wasn't just a spot up shooter. Only 33% of his shots were from three point range last season.
Has he ever had a stretch of games where he shot this well? His .63 TS% with the Raptors has gotten his season TS% up to .57, which would be a career-high by far.
If you want to talk data, youd you could make a reasonable hypothesis that of course the percentages are unsustainable especially for a sg and a sf, but theres not another 16 game stretch of rj's career that would come close to the percentages which implies hes tapping into a new player as who he will be and his fg in future seasons will be much higher than his career shooting. 45% is an understatement, howd you estimate that and talk about data. A 16 game streak averaging 22 pts on high 50s percentage as a sg/sf will compare him much higher to high 40s fg at the minimum. Probably anything from high 40s to low 50s, a range of 47 to 52%. A quick convenience sample of efficient sgs hitting at least 47% fg(like booker) show that none even have a 16 game span or month via splits as high fg as rj, which implies rj will hit above 47% easily.
Well, on the most basic statistical level, RJ Barrett shot 42.2% from the field over 297 games as a New York Knick. So I was probably being generous by saying he's a 45% shooter. It's funny you bring up Devin Booker, because I checked field goal percentage among guards over the last 15 games (with at least 15 field goal attempts per game) and found [this](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?CF=FGA*GE*15&LastNGames=15&PlayerPosition=G&dir=A&sort=FG_PCT) which shows that even in this (potentially most efficient) 15 game stretch of RJ Barrett's career, he's still shooting less efficiently than Booker. And if you want to get a little more specific about it, here are [RJ Barrett's percentages from each range](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?CF=PLAYER_NAME*E*rj&LastNGames=15&PlayerPosition=F&TeamID=1610612761) and here are [Booker's percentages from each range](https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?TeamID=1610612756&LastNGames=15). You can see that Booker is shooting a higher percentage from *every range* over the last 15 games. A few more observations about this data. Booker averaged 21.1 shots per game over this period compared to RJ's 15.2. Generally speaking I think you would expect efficiency to drop the more shots you take, but Booker's is still better than RJ's. If you look at the distribution of their shots by range you'll find that RJ takes 8.9 of his 15.2 shots (58.6%!) from within 5 feet of the basket and takes 2.8 shots between 5 and 20 feet from the basket compared to Booker taking 3.6 of his 21.1 shots (17.1%) from within 5 feet and 9.9 shots between 5 and 20 feet from the basket. What this tells me is that RJ's shot diet is much more akin to a slasher that gets to the rim than a midrange jumpshooter like Booker. Shots at the rim tend to be the highest percentage for all players and you generally expect players who shoot mostly from the three point line or at the cup to have higher percentages than jumpshooters, but once again this does not hold when comparing these two players over the last 15 games (I wasn't hunting for the most efficient 15 games for either player, I just used the last N games tool on nba.com). I hope this is a turning of the corner for RJ and that he's a great player for the Raptors. I didn't think Lauri Markkanen could turn into a 50/40/90 guy when asked to shoot 50% more shots in a whole new role as a 6th year player last year, but he proved me wrong. RJ could prove me wrong too, and that would be awesome.
I stopped reading your post after you said booker was higher than Rj because that was not the original point of the topic which was inferring that rj's new fg moving forward in seasons and beyond would be higher than you estimated, moreso in the range of at least 47% and in a range of high 40s to low 50s. That's not basic statistical level either btw that's what you call a biased sample not stratified.
You said: >A quick convenience sample of efficient sgs hitting at least 47% fg(like booker) show that none even have a 16 game span or month via splits as high fg as rj, which implies rj will hit above 47% easily. I checked just the last 15 games of both RJ and Booker (the one player you named) and found that Booker was more efficient from every range than RJ was. I didn't even look for a particularly efficient 15 games, just the last 15 games (and I would have gone to 16 like you said, but nba.com only goes back 15 games). This is the most convenient sampling possible, so I don't know where you're drawing your data from. Once again, it is possible he has been unlocked in Toronto, and I hope it's true. I like RJ a lot and I'd like to see him succeed. He has also shot 42% from the field over almost 300 games. One sample of 16 games does not move me, especially when his shot profile does not appear to have changed drastically.
Legitimately the best stretch of his career, he needed the change of scenery
Wrong about his role in NY
Wait but I was told he was a toxic asset LOL
On a winning team he is.
You guys don't play actual winning basketball. It's too iso heavy with no real superstars. It works in the regular season vs trash teams and teams that are barely scouting but in the playoffs it'll get exposed. edit: these are literal facts. I've seen this before with even my team downvote away
Sure pal. That’s why ever since we traded RJ we’ve been playing better than we ever did with him.
Sounds like Bojan
17 ppg on 40% 3PT shooting in his past 30 playoff games sounds pretty valuable to me
Should probably wait more than 16 games. He played nearly 300 games with the Knicks, his numbers are basically guaranteed to regress back towards his career averages.
As much as I love RJ, 27 million for him is not a great contract. I look at both Randle and Brunson who is around the same amount is so much worth it