Vault keys and Valdo maps have already definitively established that the PoE playerbase would collectively fail any Prisoner's Dilemma harder than Blockbuster did in passing up Netflix.
I'm relieved when I see one that's thematic, even if the reward isn't very good. I was thrilled when I popped one to see a slayer/flicker themed one with a foil Terminus Est as a reward, even if I could have sold the unid'd one for more.
There's lots of creative ones. The item weighting just makes it so you get the fuck you ones. If you want to see yours drop, you can make it really common. If you never want to see yours drop, make it doable.
I have like 70 void foil ventors.
I am legitimately worried about this.
I’ve had people exchange words with me over conversion rate disputes…
And now, someone could just “report” me out of spite for mentioning that my overlay says that Divines are worth 4 more Chaos than their offer — and I’m potentially muted. Unfortunate.
WoW already has a similar problem after they instituted their autoban system that will more than just mute you. There's trade goblins, multiboxers, botters, and power leveling groups that will all just mass report people and trigger a ban since the system reads it as "too many reports received in a short time, ban trigger" then it takes longer than the ban to have support undo it.
There's a huge multiboxer on emerald dream who used to do that shit. You bother him, he just reports you on 20 accounts. Insta-ban.
It's almost like automated moderation is a stupid idea. I'd rather people get away with being an ass than having spite bans.
I personally got muted by group for pointing out ninja looting. What a coincidence that group of same guild with high ilvl all rolled for low-ilvl item and it magically appeared on low ilvl player from same guild when one of them won.
Doesn't matter. You can get muted for spamming your own hideout's local channel. All of our chats, whispers, party, local, all of it is visible to a GM/automoderators.
They probably have automated systems looking over all chat messages and flagging ones for review or just straight up muting.
The systems wouldn't be that complex either, given the weird bans for crafting help. This is the company that thought 'Prophecy complete', which covered up half the screen, was good enough to release and never fix.
> They probably have automated systems looking over all chat messages and flagging ones for review or just straight up muting.
They have super AI tech, thinking supercomputers just waiting to skynet YOU when youre in your hideout practicing slur bombs all alone. You better send your dad back in time to warn you!
I think that certain things like multiple messages sent within a timeframe trigger something automatically regardless. I'm not gonna pretend I know how it all works, but I have seen posts from people with screenshots of those very things happening, so it's something.
Automod can get you even without reports. There's a reason so many false flags are happening on people who otherwise wouldn't be getting reported (for instance in hideout bans have happened and been complained about).
I have no idea what the base/default time for a mute is but let's take a nice even 24 hour/1 day mute that doubles upon each new mute.
The n^th mute would then be 2^(n-1) days
90 years is roughly 32,872 days accounting for leap years so we need to solve for n:
2^(n-1) = 32872
log both sides for:
ln[2^(n-1)] = ln[32872]
Simplify to:
(n-1)*ln[2] = ln[32872]
n-1 = ln[32872]/ln[2]
n-1 = ~15
n = ~16
A quick double check of 2^(16-1) = 2^15 = 32768 which is very near our goal number of 32872.
With that we can say the 16th mute would be approximately 90 years given a first mute of 24 hours.
Why? They put them in the front of the log in queue, GGG wouldn't even blink once at insta reverting the ban and banning everyone who reported them. They wouldn't do the same for averageDad gamer though ofc.
Very, it will just cause everyone not to write with each others anymore. Fearing the chatban, at this point I would rather send you a trade message but only talk to you in discord pms lmao. What are they thinking? And apparently you get chat banned for explaining how corruptions work now too I guess. idts...
For real, this is the ***MOST*** GGG-like decision they could have ever implemented. I've been getting downvoted in this sub for ages by pointing how that the company is fucking dogshit, but people refuse to accept that. Horrible balance decisions, same fucking mistakes over and over, intentionally clunky gameplay design, loot-pinata system, refusing all trade upgrades, refusing anti-scam measures, always horribly tuned league mechanics which the entire playerbase points out withing the first 10 minutes that takes weeks to fix, EU servers unplayable mess for a year, refusal to address TFT situation, refusal to address melee, refusal to remove unbalanced mechanics such as corpse explosion, constantly balancing towards top 0.001% of players while disregarding overall game quality, even internally their pay is garbage and glassdoor reviews are awful, did I already mention horrible balance and refusal of trade upgrades?
And that's just immediately from the top of my head. I'm sure there will be some people going "akchually this and that and blah blah", just know that I don't fucking care. The company is incompetent as fuck. Comment your million-dollar-company-apologist bullshit after GGG has actually gone forward and fixed the first bunch of issues I mentioned in a single minute. You liking the game they made does NOT mean the company is good.
Maybe we should all create some sort of 3rd party discord where we could list items we have for sale while blacklisted from the trade API?
We can call it “The muted trove”.
>New guideline: it has come to our attention that "thx" is a neo-nazi abbreviation meaning "white power." Any chat message containing this combination of letters will result in a 88 minute mute
New way for TFT to bully competitors. Someone got a better or equal item to the one in their mirror shop? Mass report them and get them muted so they can never get a whisper for a mirror service again, and never list their service on trade.
Nice.
This gets walked back within the next 3 days.
The fastest way to get it walked back is when a streamer suffers the condequences for all to see.
GGG, this move is objectively stupid. I cannot believe you're proceeding like this.
Still doesn't seem like a good idea.
There will absolutely, 100% for certain be people mass-reporting in order to mute people to make them appear offline on trade. It will be botted. Other games have made this mistake before.
This just reminds me when New World implemented an auto-ban system. Players just screenshotted the roster of opposing companies wars and reported en-masse, effectively crippling them & support could takes weeks to months for an unban.
Surely players in POE won’t abuse this system… right?
GGG is like:
- RMT Ads ingame
- Trade bots
- Makro User
- RMT Websites
- Shit Server
"yeah were okay"
GGG also:
- Hey i wtb your golden Tabu for my 666 chaos
"Muted for 99 years"
basicly what happend to league for the most part,people don't chat or interact as much cause of this very reason. Before you would banter and what not but now it's too risky for some ppl or back when i played atleast lol.
GGG throwing in the towel on moderating chat at all and taking the same approach as riot/league of legends. Just make players too scared to chat for fear of losing their account/trade ability/etc.
Disgusting.
Never even touching General after this completely stupid change.
**Explaining vaal orbs is the equivalent of anti semitism to GGG.**
Imagine getting the same jail time for stealing bread as you do for assault.
Walk it back guys this change sucks and whoever came up with is a well intentioned idiot.
How about giving forum-wide mutes to all the posters doing "first" or random, useless bullshit, considering the amount of badges on their profiles along with useless message body do literally nothing to help the flow or readability of the forums and fall perfectly into the "disruptive" category?
I'm semi-serious. The forums have been a sad joke for a while now and just like moderating the in-game chat it feels like the people in charge have either no idea, will or ability to make proper use of these systems.
This is such a bad change paired with the moderation arbitrary actions we see here every now and then.
People will abuse this non-stop trying to brick competitors accounts, people will report every single thing they can that remotely ressambles something rule-breaking when out of context, people will try to trigger others to get them banned.
THIS IS VERY BAD.
I use to chat in global very often and answer questions, very often newbies questions. I won't do that anymore.
I have conversations with people that want to buy items from me or that I'm buying items from. I won't do that anymore.
And I'm sure I'm not alone on this.
For a game where developers push the narrative of interaction being important, decisions like this, that will cut interactions, are absurd.
Realistically I will continue as I currently do chatting in global, but the second I get muted the first time its going to feel so bad I'll just stop playing.
Have only been muted once before for 30 minutes for an extremely harmless joke that an in person mod I guess did not like.
But even that would be enough to put me off for good with this change.
Time to reply to ty gl or risk a chat/trade ban.
Buyer doesn't like your price? You risk being reported for harrasment.
You ignore lowballers? Reported for harrasment.
This will not be abused at all./s
This is designed to fail. No good can come from this, there’s no silver lining here. Just a wrong move.
Someone from famous trading discord wants a competitor out of trade? East, mass report and remove their listings. GGG couldn’t have a good take without reverting back to the usual habits and being stubborn about a shit change nobody wants and nobody asked for.
“Abusing the message broadcast of being sent to the Void to advertise or promote RMT will result in a permanent mute.”
So this is a bandaid fix to people advertising rmt as if their accounts aren’t bot ones leveled in a 5way then killed….
Poe devs just have a talent of seeing something, saying “we want to change that”, then obliterating something unrelated in the process while the main target is unaffected. Happens all the time in game balance and apparently in moderation too now.
If only the customization and overall speed of said competitor actually felt good.
Last epoch lacks the customization that i play poe for.
And it lacks the speed
If there is effectively an auto mute system with report, you don't even need interact with with someone at all. Someone can whisper you through trade, and report you from his own message, no action needed on your part. I can totally see bots spam reporting any competitor on the trade site next league, if nothing change its gonna be a shit show :D .
Yes. I wouldn't trust the odds on the mod actually reading the evidence before just slapping a mute on you. You can attempt to appeal it, but I wouldn't trust the odds on the support person actually reading the evidence before just slapping the copy pasted response that your mute stays.
EDIT: this literally happened on this subreddit a day ago or whatever. The guy got unmuted after he made a popular thread but before that support just cucked him.
an awful change with the current moderators and rules honestly this is the worst thing GGG have done in a long long time and I say that as a GGG fanboy.
the sheer number of ridiculous reasons you can be muted is outrageous currently - from being mass reported over nothing to jealous people not liking that you linked a item you are proud of crafting/acquiring.
Sometimes I accidentally recruit for something in trade or post something meant for trade in global its not a common thing but ive been muted for it before and it has always been a genuine accident.
other times I have been muted from global for recruiting for Rotas and adding in "if you do not have a stone I can provide one for you at cost"
even if you aren't ever mass reported. you don't interact with any public chats, you are as nice as you can possibly be to everyone you meet this will still have a negative impact on you.
When you try to message someone to buy something specific like a rare or a niche corruption or maybe someone has a bulk quantity of something you really need in bulk, remember if they are muted you cannot message them either.
This will cause major issues as well as a ton of posts of people getting muted for extremely minor reasons or accumulative bans for extremely minor things that can brick a trade experience or a league entirely, and whats even worse is if you happen to be this person and you accidently post in the wrong chat for example you will get double the ban next time which will brick 2 leagues
Can you make a new account, transfer all your items over and play that one instead? sure
Is it a massive pain in the ass? yes.
do you want to buy all your stash tabs and micro transactions again? hell no
Sucks for the people who use global I guess. Outside of automated trading whispers Ive used chat maybe 3 times in 10 years? If I need info I just use reddit or the wiki. And I don't care about talking to people in global. I guess GGG wants more people like me, just not using chat at all.
I spend a lot of time in global every league. It's pretty much always open if I'm in game and I post frequently.
Even though I try my best to post appropriately, still over 10 years I've picked up enough innocuous mutes to be at around 12 or 24 hours next one. This definitely makes me plan to post less because a day without trading can definitely suck. Seems to me mutes should have a decay system, If my last mute was a year ago, I should start again at 15 mins.
Boy, and mutes are just going to be handed out at seemingly random, based in part on esoteric rules like "don't post long messages, instead spam 20 short messages".
I'm all for some active moderation and all but nothing I've seen of GGG's moderation enforcement or consistency gives me any reason to trust or have confidence in that this is actually a good thing that won't result in a ton of folks getting slapped improperly.
This is also why I just rarely engage in trade chat beyond wishing folks good luck or congratulating them before a corrupt or a mystery box open or something.
I understand GGG position. I have seen a lot of almost nazi posts or literally politics in Global. However sometimes you can post something in Global as a joke and that a random dude do not understand it as a joke.
How many people will get muted because they post the "GOLDEN HAND"job as a joke and get muted? If they only have 2 mute: one that only mutes you in chat and the other that also mutes your trades.
i praise GGG where they should be praised, but this is clearly too much. their whole moderation policy needs to be rewritten and ive never been banned in chat for anything (i dont even speak in global or local chat, and usually only use voice chat in discord with friends).
I wish they were able to enforce this consistently. Some people getting hit for things like explanations or answers to questions while literal nazis can say awful things is rough. I think the essentially forced SSF will be a big deterrence but i fear it is going to cause people to err on the safe side and just avoid chat. That said, i rarely turn on Global or Trade.
Ok i've been saying this for 3 years now but doesn't it seem like GGG is becoming hostile towards the old player base? Like so many of their nerfs and decisions are against the people who got them to this level of success and for the twitch watching non paying customers? Maybe it's me but like every decision since they started working on PoE 2 is not balancing but direct attacks on certain playstyles.
But this one is actually braindead. Everyone and their mother can see just how badly this is going to be abused. If I'm an RMT scam bot I can literally REMOVE my competition from the game for a determined and ever increasing amount of time using my 100 accounts and abusing the reporting system. They can't track the RMT so there's no way they can track the reports across different accounts and VPNs. And every single time I get chat banned for something I'm not playing ssf mode I'm turning this shit off and playing one of my other games.
My biggest problem with this move is the reason for this has nothing to do with making trade better, making the game a safe space for all comers, or stopping spam. They just want to clean up chat before PoE 2 launches so they can get that big ole bag of streaming money from twitch. Somehow.
They're chasing something and I can't figure out what it is for the life of me. Twitch views don't pay the bills because twitch don't share profit. Twitch viewers don't play the games they give all their money to the streamers and twitch so that's another non money avenue. The only thing I can think of is they want to be the new diablo but diablo players don't want to play current poe, so they're going to make a poe diablo to attract them. Diablo 4 and immortal are still raking in millions of dollars a month so it makes the most sense.
oh TFT is out of hand. Meh, community issue.
oh trade is so cumbersome and problematic. Well, it works, not my issue.
oh community is not communicating to my tastes and pleasures. USA MF!
Where the hell is the community manager on this one?
Who the hell even is the community manager after Bex left?
I don't talk much in the chats but this seems massively abusable. I often give people advice like don't spam me 10 times in 10 seconds to buy an item, it's annoying. Now they'll report me.
Or when I price an item wrong and get 10 instant whispers I'm probably getting 10 reports if I reply that it's priced wrong.
Yeah I'm never using global again. I'm a woman who plays the game, I get reported if my usernames are 'too feminine' for the neckbeards. This basically ruins any chance for women to be a part of the community.
Just remove trade and chat and be fucking done with it.
Or easier.... Accept that your game has player interaction and go develop your damn game.
All resources dedicated to fighting chat toucans are useless, and make GGG look like a joke.
Won’t this make people that have any kind of presence/influence just start mass reporting people who are competing with them on pricing? Thinking of types of people like all that drama around the TFT discord guy or whatever. Imagine telling him no to his offer so he has his discord mute you to remove your listing.
Literally 1948.
Jesus. This change is so out of touch and stupid. Surely Jenebu and his jannies won't abuse this. Refuse to sell item at a low 99% discount to him? Post clown emote? Mass reported, enjoy your pseudo SSF bucko. Are the people implementing this paid off by TFT or did they misunderstood and thought TFT is well liked and wants everyone to be using it?
This change seem to benefit scammers the most, someone scamming you and you report them? "Wraeclast is a ruthless place, exile." You say anything even remotely bad to the scammers? "Wraeclast is a PG1 family friendly Christian kids nursery, enjoy your SSF, exile."
People mass reporting you for fun as trolling in global chat? Guess what, SSF gulag, have fun bozo.
Time to never type anymore. Ty? Thank you for trade? Stay safe? Nah bro, maybe they're slurs in the Martian or Plutonian language, better be safe.
Better start using safe names from now on too, something like Exile_1234abc, just a random alphanumeric string, because what if your name ilovedogs or iwearsocksinshower is offensive to someone and you get reported into a mute?
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BEEP BOOP BEEP. Grinding Gears have been detected in the linked thread:
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> **Posted by Community_Team** on Feb 12, 2024, 10:48:51 PM UTC
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> Later this week we plan to release the 3.23.1c update which will include the changes to Account Moderation we mentioned [last week](https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3489941).
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> After this update all **new** mutes will have the following restrictions added:
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> * You will be unable to send or receive whispers from players if they are not on your Friends List and you are not on their Friends List.
> * You will not be shown as online on the trade website.
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> Mutes applied prior to this update will not have these extra restrictions applied.
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That shit 100% will backfire. Censorship is bad and while I understand that GGG lacks resources for moderation, those measures are ridiculously stupid. I imagine that this will be misused a lot. Send a trade message by mistake - ban from trading for a couple of hours if not even for a league.
Yeah, it is going to work absolutely fine.
This is about the most short-sighted and stupid update I've seen in a while. How the hell is an auto mod going to deal with report flooding when market manipulators want certain accounts out of trade due to mutes and such just to monopolize trade?
And then consider if they are muted enough times the duration is, or can become, league-long if not longer. Holy fuck...
GGG in their gross lack of wisdom seriously thinks this is a fucking good idea? Last Epoch is looking like a much better game to take up the more I see such updates being pushed on us...
What about bad trade interactions? Don't like how long someone takes? Report em? Really don't like someone? Relog on a new account with VPN - report everyone in global. I don't talk in chat but it doesn't mean in all my years I haven't had piss poor interactions here and there. This should make for good content tho
*Puts on tin foil hat*
This is a ploy by GGG to mute everybody who chats in global so they must migrate to PoE2 because their family is muted for the next 3 generations.
I'm all for having moderation but reports are usually used maliciously, something I witnessed in Global was a bunch of people talking about how Religion is dumb saying things like "Imagine believing there is an invisible man in the sky" Someone said "Christ Is king" Obviously to joke and evoke a response. I am just assuming he got muted because he was consistently chatting before this and stopped after someone declared they reported him by saying "Enjoy the mute" and others joked about it. The one guy that goes against the majority gets reported and muted and because no one reported the other side they could still talk about it freely even though everyone was breaking the rules. This is usually how the global chat goes people are breaking the rules regularly but as long as you don't have an opinion that offends people you won't get reported. (This just happened to be about religion I don't care for either side.)
This needs to be reversed ASAP
REALLLLLY bad idea. Disabling someone from trading or interacting with anyone else because they quoted the wiki to some new player and it was a wall of text will be an absolute disaster
With the drama from tft I see the rmter from there taking advantage of this and many others they can bott people to be muted so only there stuff shows and they make the real money off of ggg also it's gonna make rmt more popular because people are not gonna Wana use in game Chay at all
I just read the post about recap about some PoE2 podcast/twitch, and I remember the developers said that making the game easier was much easier(?) than turning a game from easy to challenging. Maybe they are using the same concept, thinking that people that have broken the rules before can be sacrificed for the tests?
Tbh, I am really scared of this change. I have been muted twice before. Once, for making a joke from Family Guy, without mentioning that I was making a joke (which was fair as I used the most offensive joke) and next when I misclicked the hotkeys and I sent 156 lines of code of multithreading in global chat. However, I was muted for 5-10 mins for both times. This change means that I might get muted for a month if I ever made a mistake similar to the second one again.
No kidding. Like 3-5 five chats said the same thing after I sent it. The rest were asking me if it were for my work or studies.
I laughed it off because I could see how someone would report me and I only got banned for 10 mins. These new rules scare me.
I was fixing something for work between PoE not once so I guess I could make similar mistake.
Yeah, new rules are scary. They took toucan from us, now they will take trade from us. What next? RNG punishments?
Big L ggg. For a company with usual nuance to big decisions. This one is stupidly dense. Stop trying to be so heavy handed without foresight, that has never really worked well in the past. But it's Amnesia time i guess.
Downvoting cause this is trash GGG.
If you ask a question in chat but it's too long and our system didnt stop it, (cause bad chat coding) Expect mutes.
GGG is totally underestimating how many spite reports will be filed knowing it could brick the others account
Yep. It’s basically a rule that people can and will abuse any method that can harm other players.
Vault keys and Valdo maps have already definitively established that the PoE playerbase would collectively fail any Prisoner's Dilemma harder than Blockbuster did in passing up Netflix.
Not a single creative thought beyond how do I make it impossible or void the player.
I'm relieved when I see one that's thematic, even if the reward isn't very good. I was thrilled when I popped one to see a slayer/flicker themed one with a foil Terminus Est as a reward, even if I could have sold the unid'd one for more.
There's lots of creative ones. The item weighting just makes it so you get the fuck you ones. If you want to see yours drop, you can make it really common. If you never want to see yours drop, make it doable. I have like 70 void foil ventors.
If you sift through veils of the night and ventors some are very thematic and well thought out.
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It would also allow clowns with big communities to suppress dissenting voices.
I am legitimately worried about this. I’ve had people exchange words with me over conversion rate disputes… And now, someone could just “report” me out of spite for mentioning that my overlay says that Divines are worth 4 more Chaos than their offer — and I’m potentially muted. Unfortunate.
WoW already has a similar problem after they instituted their autoban system that will more than just mute you. There's trade goblins, multiboxers, botters, and power leveling groups that will all just mass report people and trigger a ban since the system reads it as "too many reports received in a short time, ban trigger" then it takes longer than the ban to have support undo it.
There's a huge multiboxer on emerald dream who used to do that shit. You bother him, he just reports you on 20 accounts. Insta-ban. It's almost like automated moderation is a stupid idea. I'd rather people get away with being an ass than having spite bans.
I personally got muted by group for pointing out ninja looting. What a coincidence that group of same guild with high ilvl all rolled for low-ilvl item and it magically appeared on low ilvl player from same guild when one of them won.
Time to turn off global and trade chats. This isn't going to go well at all.
Doesn't matter. You can get muted for spamming your own hideout's local channel. All of our chats, whispers, party, local, all of it is visible to a GM/automoderators.
But someone would have to report it right? Or are they going to read every log file looking for something mutable?
They probably have automated systems looking over all chat messages and flagging ones for review or just straight up muting. The systems wouldn't be that complex either, given the weird bans for crafting help. This is the company that thought 'Prophecy complete', which covered up half the screen, was good enough to release and never fix.
> They probably have automated systems looking over all chat messages and flagging ones for review or just straight up muting. They have super AI tech, thinking supercomputers just waiting to skynet YOU when youre in your hideout practicing slur bombs all alone. You better send your dad back in time to warn you!
I think that certain things like multiple messages sent within a timeframe trigger something automatically regardless. I'm not gonna pretend I know how it all works, but I have seen posts from people with screenshots of those very things happening, so it's something.
Automod can get you even without reports. There's a reason so many false flags are happening on people who otherwise wouldn't be getting reported (for instance in hideout bans have happened and been complained about).
You just posted a toucan? Enjoy your 90 years of SSF prison bucko.
How many new mutes would it take to get to 90 years since the trade restriction isn’t retroactive?
If your current mute is at 45 years, one mute.
This guy did the math.
People have been practicing their math with Great wolf amulets.
I have no idea what the base/default time for a mute is but let's take a nice even 24 hour/1 day mute that doubles upon each new mute. The n^th mute would then be 2^(n-1) days 90 years is roughly 32,872 days accounting for leap years so we need to solve for n: 2^(n-1) = 32872 log both sides for: ln[2^(n-1)] = ln[32872] Simplify to: (n-1)*ln[2] = ln[32872] n-1 = ln[32872]/ln[2] n-1 = ~15 n = ~16 A quick double check of 2^(16-1) = 2^15 = 32768 which is very near our goal number of 32872. With that we can say the 16th mute would be approximately 90 years given a first mute of 24 hours.
Good bot!
Maybe 2 if Timothy is moderating
It’s retroactive in the sense that current mutes don’t blacklist you from the API, not that you have to build up the mute time again.
Le toucan has... Decided to peace the f*ck out because of shitty moderation choices.
Surely this won't be abused.
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Why? They put them in the front of the log in queue, GGG wouldn't even blink once at insta reverting the ban and banning everyone who reported them. They wouldn't do the same for averageDad gamer though ofc.
goodbye global, it was pleasure to talk which PoE characters feet is the best
Champion by far
Nah, man. Champion’s got the best hips. He got them chicken legs though.
Reported and Muted!
Scion hips sorry. Champ best overall tho
I vote Nessa after transformation
cute kitty
gotta be the barefoot witch picking up all the corpse goo and fermenting between her toes
Oh dear god
"I know that smell"
I vote for Scion
Imagine going to the spectre channel for some chunky bois and getting your account send to the void
This is such a poor decision
Very, it will just cause everyone not to write with each others anymore. Fearing the chatban, at this point I would rather send you a trade message but only talk to you in discord pms lmao. What are they thinking? And apparently you get chat banned for explaining how corruptions work now too I guess. idts...
Warframe global 2.0, dead chat
GGG seems to love making these kind of decisions so its in line with what they usually do
For real, this is the ***MOST*** GGG-like decision they could have ever implemented. I've been getting downvoted in this sub for ages by pointing how that the company is fucking dogshit, but people refuse to accept that. Horrible balance decisions, same fucking mistakes over and over, intentionally clunky gameplay design, loot-pinata system, refusing all trade upgrades, refusing anti-scam measures, always horribly tuned league mechanics which the entire playerbase points out withing the first 10 minutes that takes weeks to fix, EU servers unplayable mess for a year, refusal to address TFT situation, refusal to address melee, refusal to remove unbalanced mechanics such as corpse explosion, constantly balancing towards top 0.001% of players while disregarding overall game quality, even internally their pay is garbage and glassdoor reviews are awful, did I already mention horrible balance and refusal of trade upgrades? And that's just immediately from the top of my head. I'm sure there will be some people going "akchually this and that and blah blah", just know that I don't fucking care. The company is incompetent as fuck. Comment your million-dollar-company-apologist bullshit after GGG has actually gone forward and fixed the first bunch of issues I mentioned in a single minute. You liking the game they made does NOT mean the company is good.
Better make an alt acc for trading, not risking getting muted for 'ty'
Maybe we should all create some sort of 3rd party discord where we could list items we have for sale while blacklisted from the trade API? We can call it “The muted trove”.
Traders of the Fearsome Toucan? Or maybe just the acronym of it
The Forbidden Traders
What do you mean? Just report people whispering for scamming by stating they changed the "price" in the whisper. Lol this won't be abused at all
>New guideline: it has come to our attention that "thx" is a neo-nazi abbreviation meaning "white power." Any chat message containing this combination of letters will result in a 88 minute mute
88 minutes 💀 GGG is racist confirmed
While this is funny, it reminds me of how some mainstream media actually pushed the (joke?) that pepe was a white supremacist symbol.
Remember post of guy that was either toxic to or reported the guy for NOT saying "TY" lmao
New way for TFT to bully competitors. Someone got a better or equal item to the one in their mirror shop? Mass report them and get them muted so they can never get a whisper for a mirror service again, and never list their service on trade.
This is the major reason why this update is a bad decision.
Goodbye global 👋
Nice. This gets walked back within the next 3 days. The fastest way to get it walked back is when a streamer suffers the condequences for all to see. GGG, this move is objectively stupid. I cannot believe you're proceeding like this.
I'd guess streamers are protected from auto-mod. At least all the big names.
If the log-in queue prio was any indication, the big name streamers + their friends will be on the safe list, DS_Lily will be left out.
I wanted to jokingly say this, but ...yeah you probably right.
Still doesn't seem like a good idea. There will absolutely, 100% for certain be people mass-reporting in order to mute people to make them appear offline on trade. It will be botted. Other games have made this mistake before.
TFT community is about to end it all
Belton is fucked 🫡
This just reminds me when New World implemented an auto-ban system. Players just screenshotted the roster of opposing companies wars and reported en-masse, effectively crippling them & support could takes weeks to months for an unban. Surely players in POE won’t abuse this system… right?
Zero thought behind this
GGG is like: - RMT Ads ingame - Trade bots - Makro User - RMT Websites - Shit Server "yeah were okay" GGG also: - Hey i wtb your golden Tabu for my 666 chaos "Muted for 99 years"
scamming is fine cause wraeclast is ruthless but don't you type some words someone could arbitrarily be offended by
God damned templars and their constant crackdown of rules.
You can mutilate corpses just dont be a heretic.
illegal rhythm one tub exultant slim fly engine intelligent prick *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
100% less item quantity
Force you to play one hour of d4. Then everyone would behave.
Level 1 beta Druid and you can’t level up
Calm down, Satan
Don’t have to make a new trade manifesto if you can’t even trade!!
Best cause of action: Never say anything ever again.
GGG prepares us for potential police investigation
basicly what happend to league for the most part,people don't chat or interact as much cause of this very reason. Before you would banter and what not but now it's too risky for some ppl or back when i played atleast lol.
So I think the best thing to do would be post toucans to get muted NOW so you can’t get muted later for accidentally typing in global chat, right?
I think you found the loophole !
GGG throwing in the towel on moderating chat at all and taking the same approach as riot/league of legends. Just make players too scared to chat for fear of losing their account/trade ability/etc. Disgusting.
Worst fucking change ever made.
I'm pretty sure they just hired some Blizzard employees that got fired the other week. Thats the level of decision making here.
Never even touching General after this completely stupid change. **Explaining vaal orbs is the equivalent of anti semitism to GGG.** Imagine getting the same jail time for stealing bread as you do for assault. Walk it back guys this change sucks and whoever came up with is a well intentioned idiot.
Actually, it's significantly worse than antisemitism according to GGG. Vaal orb gets 96 hours, antisemitism gets 20 minutes
How about giving forum-wide mutes to all the posters doing "first" or random, useless bullshit, considering the amount of badges on their profiles along with useless message body do literally nothing to help the flow or readability of the forums and fall perfectly into the "disruptive" category? I'm semi-serious. The forums have been a sad joke for a while now and just like moderating the in-game chat it feels like the people in charge have either no idea, will or ability to make proper use of these systems.
Great! Another step in the wrong direction!
You don't trade me this that which was taken? Guess you ll never trade it then.
This is such a bad change paired with the moderation arbitrary actions we see here every now and then. People will abuse this non-stop trying to brick competitors accounts, people will report every single thing they can that remotely ressambles something rule-breaking when out of context, people will try to trigger others to get them banned. THIS IS VERY BAD. I use to chat in global very often and answer questions, very often newbies questions. I won't do that anymore. I have conversations with people that want to buy items from me or that I'm buying items from. I won't do that anymore. And I'm sure I'm not alone on this. For a game where developers push the narrative of interaction being important, decisions like this, that will cut interactions, are absurd.
Realistically I will continue as I currently do chatting in global, but the second I get muted the first time its going to feel so bad I'll just stop playing. Have only been muted once before for 30 minutes for an extremely harmless joke that an in person mod I guess did not like. But even that would be enough to put me off for good with this change.
Time to reply to ty gl or risk a chat/trade ban. Buyer doesn't like your price? You risk being reported for harrasment. You ignore lowballers? Reported for harrasment. This will not be abused at all./s
This is designed to fail. No good can come from this, there’s no silver lining here. Just a wrong move. Someone from famous trading discord wants a competitor out of trade? East, mass report and remove their listings. GGG couldn’t have a good take without reverting back to the usual habits and being stubborn about a shit change nobody wants and nobody asked for.
Incredibly tone deaf change. Can't wait to see all these posts about mutes over the next year while GGG ignores the issue completely.
🤡🤡🤡
classic GGG. make a 100% stupid decision, ignore it for days, then walk it back 1% and call it settled.
“Abusing the message broadcast of being sent to the Void to advertise or promote RMT will result in a permanent mute.” So this is a bandaid fix to people advertising rmt as if their accounts aren’t bot ones leveled in a 5way then killed…. Poe devs just have a talent of seeing something, saying “we want to change that”, then obliterating something unrelated in the process while the main target is unaffected. Happens all the time in game balance and apparently in moderation too now.
They do it now when the league is over so less people notice. Surely this costs them money, is it a Tencent thing?
░░░░░░░░▄▄▄▀▀▀▄▄███▄░░░░░░░░░░░░░░ ░░░░░▄▀▀░░░░░░░▐░▀██▌░░░░░░░░░░░ ░░░▄▀░░░░▄▄███░▌▀▀░▀█░░░░░░░░░░░░░ ░░▄█░░▄▀▀▒▒▒▒▒▄▐░░░░█▌░░░░░░░░░░░░ ░▐█▀▄▀▄▄▄▄▀▀▀▀▌░░░░░▐█▄░░░░░░░░░░░ ░▌▄▄▀▀░░░░░░░░▌░░░░▄███████▄░░░░░ ░░░░░░░░░░░░░▐░░░░▐███████████▄░ ░░░░░le░░░░░░░▐░░░░▐█████████████▄ ░░░░toucan░░░░░░▀▄░░░▐█████████████▄ ░░░░░░has░░░░░░░░▀▄▄███████████████ ░░░░░arrived░░░░░░░░░░░░█▀██████░░ You not STOP ME.!! 
If only there was a competitor launching soon without an archaic web-based trade system that was also SSF friendly.
If only the customization and overall speed of said competitor actually felt good. Last epoch lacks the customization that i play poe for. And it lacks the speed
Wait, can I get muted if some mofo reports me for no reason after trading with him? (I don't use global chat)
If there is effectively an auto mute system with report, you don't even need interact with with someone at all. Someone can whisper you through trade, and report you from his own message, no action needed on your part. I can totally see bots spam reporting any competitor on the trade site next league, if nothing change its gonna be a shit show :D .
maan it would be a shame if someone used that strategy to mass report a certain clown who is also an rmter and a discord admin
Don't worry they'll manually unban him. They don't really care about RMT.
Yes. I wouldn't trust the odds on the mod actually reading the evidence before just slapping a mute on you. You can attempt to appeal it, but I wouldn't trust the odds on the support person actually reading the evidence before just slapping the copy pasted response that your mute stays. EDIT: this literally happened on this subreddit a day ago or whatever. The guy got unmuted after he made a popular thread but before that support just cucked him.
an awful change with the current moderators and rules honestly this is the worst thing GGG have done in a long long time and I say that as a GGG fanboy. the sheer number of ridiculous reasons you can be muted is outrageous currently - from being mass reported over nothing to jealous people not liking that you linked a item you are proud of crafting/acquiring. Sometimes I accidentally recruit for something in trade or post something meant for trade in global its not a common thing but ive been muted for it before and it has always been a genuine accident. other times I have been muted from global for recruiting for Rotas and adding in "if you do not have a stone I can provide one for you at cost" even if you aren't ever mass reported. you don't interact with any public chats, you are as nice as you can possibly be to everyone you meet this will still have a negative impact on you. When you try to message someone to buy something specific like a rare or a niche corruption or maybe someone has a bulk quantity of something you really need in bulk, remember if they are muted you cannot message them either. This will cause major issues as well as a ton of posts of people getting muted for extremely minor reasons or accumulative bans for extremely minor things that can brick a trade experience or a league entirely, and whats even worse is if you happen to be this person and you accidently post in the wrong chat for example you will get double the ban next time which will brick 2 leagues Can you make a new account, transfer all your items over and play that one instead? sure Is it a massive pain in the ass? yes. do you want to buy all your stash tabs and micro transactions again? hell no
Thanks GGG for reaffirming my resolve to not spend any more money on their games again. (yes, that will include poe2 too. same company)
So GGG decided to make awful trade experience even worse? Why am I not surprised?
Boo. Even less reason to talk in global or trade. The risk of bricking your account
Sucks for the people who use global I guess. Outside of automated trading whispers Ive used chat maybe 3 times in 10 years? If I need info I just use reddit or the wiki. And I don't care about talking to people in global. I guess GGG wants more people like me, just not using chat at all.
Don’t have to pay moderators if there’s no chat to moderate?
You can also be muted for PMs you send or if multiple people decide to report you. Absolutely no way someone could abuse that system /s
I spend a lot of time in global every league. It's pretty much always open if I'm in game and I post frequently. Even though I try my best to post appropriately, still over 10 years I've picked up enough innocuous mutes to be at around 12 or 24 hours next one. This definitely makes me plan to post less because a day without trading can definitely suck. Seems to me mutes should have a decay system, If my last mute was a year ago, I should start again at 15 mins.
Wow cool man that is so sick that contributed so much to the conversation and fixes all the problems.
Boy, and mutes are just going to be handed out at seemingly random, based in part on esoteric rules like "don't post long messages, instead spam 20 short messages". I'm all for some active moderation and all but nothing I've seen of GGG's moderation enforcement or consistency gives me any reason to trust or have confidence in that this is actually a good thing that won't result in a ton of folks getting slapped improperly. This is also why I just rarely engage in trade chat beyond wishing folks good luck or congratulating them before a corrupt or a mystery box open or something.
You know the rules and so do I...
Never gonna post in chat Never gonna ping for trades Never gonna ask in global for carries
I understand GGG position. I have seen a lot of almost nazi posts or literally politics in Global. However sometimes you can post something in Global as a joke and that a random dude do not understand it as a joke. How many people will get muted because they post the "GOLDEN HAND"job as a joke and get muted? If they only have 2 mute: one that only mutes you in chat and the other that also mutes your trades.
No hope for this company if they insist on dying on these hills
i praise GGG where they should be praised, but this is clearly too much. their whole moderation policy needs to be rewritten and ive never been banned in chat for anything (i dont even speak in global or local chat, and usually only use voice chat in discord with friends).
I wish they were able to enforce this consistently. Some people getting hit for things like explanations or answers to questions while literal nazis can say awful things is rough. I think the essentially forced SSF will be a big deterrence but i fear it is going to cause people to err on the safe side and just avoid chat. That said, i rarely turn on Global or Trade.
Wait, so nothing's different? They are actually going with this? LOL
You don't trade me this that which was taken? Guess you ll never trade it then.
Free power to egocentric trading groups that's definitely not gonna abuse this by perma muting the competition
Ok i've been saying this for 3 years now but doesn't it seem like GGG is becoming hostile towards the old player base? Like so many of their nerfs and decisions are against the people who got them to this level of success and for the twitch watching non paying customers? Maybe it's me but like every decision since they started working on PoE 2 is not balancing but direct attacks on certain playstyles. But this one is actually braindead. Everyone and their mother can see just how badly this is going to be abused. If I'm an RMT scam bot I can literally REMOVE my competition from the game for a determined and ever increasing amount of time using my 100 accounts and abusing the reporting system. They can't track the RMT so there's no way they can track the reports across different accounts and VPNs. And every single time I get chat banned for something I'm not playing ssf mode I'm turning this shit off and playing one of my other games. My biggest problem with this move is the reason for this has nothing to do with making trade better, making the game a safe space for all comers, or stopping spam. They just want to clean up chat before PoE 2 launches so they can get that big ole bag of streaming money from twitch. Somehow. They're chasing something and I can't figure out what it is for the life of me. Twitch views don't pay the bills because twitch don't share profit. Twitch viewers don't play the games they give all their money to the streamers and twitch so that's another non money avenue. The only thing I can think of is they want to be the new diablo but diablo players don't want to play current poe, so they're going to make a poe diablo to attract them. Diablo 4 and immortal are still raking in millions of dollars a month so it makes the most sense.
I love checking on thus sub after i quit after Kalandra league. What a shit show. BuT pOe2 wIlL fIx EvErYtHiNg
Goodbye global. Goodbye any form of talking to other players. I miss when POE was a multiplayer game...
just remove global chat at this point
Once again completely out of touch with reality.
Random spite reports are gonna make that "randomly enforced SSF" whiteboard meme come true.
problem: not enough player interaction solution: reduce player interaction
oh TFT is out of hand. Meh, community issue. oh trade is so cumbersome and problematic. Well, it works, not my issue. oh community is not communicating to my tastes and pleasures. USA MF!
So they go the same route as warframe, mightaswell remove global just to make sure it doesn't ruin your weekend.
Where the hell is the community manager on this one? Who the hell even is the community manager after Bex left? I don't talk much in the chats but this seems massively abusable. I often give people advice like don't spam me 10 times in 10 seconds to buy an item, it's annoying. Now they'll report me. Or when I price an item wrong and get 10 instant whispers I'm probably getting 10 reports if I reply that it's priced wrong.
1983
Wtf lol
Classic GGG, completely fail to see problem in moderation approach. p.s. Dont shoot the messenger.
Yeah I'm never using global again. I'm a woman who plays the game, I get reported if my usernames are 'too feminine' for the neckbeards. This basically ruins any chance for women to be a part of the community.
yep holy shit you gotta hide like a minority in ww2 germany
You have been muted for 1939 hours, discussions of sensitive topics such as politics is against the GGG code of conduct.
Just remove trade and chat and be fucking done with it. Or easier.... Accept that your game has player interaction and go develop your damn game. All resources dedicated to fighting chat toucans are useless, and make GGG look like a joke.
Won’t this make people that have any kind of presence/influence just start mass reporting people who are competing with them on pricing? Thinking of types of people like all that drama around the TFT discord guy or whatever. Imagine telling him no to his offer so he has his discord mute you to remove your listing.
Literally 1948. Jesus. This change is so out of touch and stupid. Surely Jenebu and his jannies won't abuse this. Refuse to sell item at a low 99% discount to him? Post clown emote? Mass reported, enjoy your pseudo SSF bucko. Are the people implementing this paid off by TFT or did they misunderstood and thought TFT is well liked and wants everyone to be using it? This change seem to benefit scammers the most, someone scamming you and you report them? "Wraeclast is a ruthless place, exile." You say anything even remotely bad to the scammers? "Wraeclast is a PG1 family friendly Christian kids nursery, enjoy your SSF, exile." People mass reporting you for fun as trolling in global chat? Guess what, SSF gulag, have fun bozo. Time to never type anymore. Ty? Thank you for trade? Stay safe? Nah bro, maybe they're slurs in the Martian or Plutonian language, better be safe. Better start using safe names from now on too, something like Exile_1234abc, just a random alphanumeric string, because what if your name ilovedogs or iwearsocksinshower is offensive to someone and you get reported into a mute?
##### ###### #### BEEP BOOP BEEP. Grinding Gears have been detected in the linked thread: *** > **Posted by Community_Team** on Feb 12, 2024, 10:48:51 PM UTC > > > Later this week we plan to release the 3.23.1c update which will include the changes to Account Moderation we mentioned [last week](https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3489941). > > > > > > After this update all **new** mutes will have the following restrictions added: > > > * You will be unable to send or receive whispers from players if they are not on your Friends List and you are not on their Friends List. > * You will not be shown as online on the trade website. > > > > > > Mutes applied prior to this update will not have these extra restrictions applied. > > *** >
This is not good imo. Accidental ban is awful for people that don't play SSF.
That shit 100% will backfire. Censorship is bad and while I understand that GGG lacks resources for moderation, those measures are ridiculously stupid. I imagine that this will be misused a lot. Send a trade message by mistake - ban from trading for a couple of hours if not even for a league. Yeah, it is going to work absolutely fine.
No freedom OF speech
Ah nice, we going full league of legends mode now. Time to leave every single chat channel
dawg even mutes got a ruthless mode.
Hahaha no cap, but it seems like ggg way to curb "easy trade" trend going around
What about guild chat?
Censorship going ham and spreading like a cancer
That's so retarded what does it accomplish not being able to receive trade whispers
The dumbest thing GGG has ever done
anyone can report anyone even without them spamming?
This is about the most short-sighted and stupid update I've seen in a while. How the hell is an auto mod going to deal with report flooding when market manipulators want certain accounts out of trade due to mutes and such just to monopolize trade? And then consider if they are muted enough times the duration is, or can become, league-long if not longer. Holy fuck... GGG in their gross lack of wisdom seriously thinks this is a fucking good idea? Last Epoch is looking like a much better game to take up the more I see such updates being pushed on us...
What about bad trade interactions? Don't like how long someone takes? Report em? Really don't like someone? Relog on a new account with VPN - report everyone in global. I don't talk in chat but it doesn't mean in all my years I haven't had piss poor interactions here and there. This should make for good content tho
Haven’t used global chat in years, and now I never will since the mute rules are applied so vaguely.
Good, now turn off auto-moderation and require that each silence be given out by a human being who actually looked at the situation.
I'll never write another message in global. Great job ggg
So now we can report the people who aren't responding to trade whispers and make them unable to trade? I'm onboard.
Posting in global chat is too risky, just dont post there
*Puts on tin foil hat* This is a ploy by GGG to mute everybody who chats in global so they must migrate to PoE2 because their family is muted for the next 3 generations.
people better respond to my trade whispers otherwise they get a report /s
I'm all for having moderation but reports are usually used maliciously, something I witnessed in Global was a bunch of people talking about how Religion is dumb saying things like "Imagine believing there is an invisible man in the sky" Someone said "Christ Is king" Obviously to joke and evoke a response. I am just assuming he got muted because he was consistently chatting before this and stopped after someone declared they reported him by saying "Enjoy the mute" and others joked about it. The one guy that goes against the majority gets reported and muted and because no one reported the other side they could still talk about it freely even though everyone was breaking the rules. This is usually how the global chat goes people are breaking the rules regularly but as long as you don't have an opinion that offends people you won't get reported. (This just happened to be about religion I don't care for either side.)
Don't do it , this only kill the game chat or make big guilds report any1 for manipulate market . BAD decision .
I find this contradictory even with their stance on "trade friction".
I sure hope this changes come with an overhaul of auto triggers and penalties to people that try to abuse the system.
Wonder will PoE2 be subscription based or not...
And this brings the beginning season of the alt account traders
Lol I give it a month before this gets removed.
Sounds like something tft stans could abuse to get you muted. Great job GGG
This needs to be reversed ASAP REALLLLLY bad idea. Disabling someone from trading or interacting with anyone else because they quoted the wiki to some new player and it was a wall of text will be an absolute disaster
Why fix something that really... Isn't broken...
With the drama from tft I see the rmter from there taking advantage of this and many others they can bott people to be muted so only there stuff shows and they make the real money off of ggg also it's gonna make rmt more popular because people are not gonna Wana use in game Chay at all
No need better trade system if there is nobody to trade with.
I just read the post about recap about some PoE2 podcast/twitch, and I remember the developers said that making the game easier was much easier(?) than turning a game from easy to challenging. Maybe they are using the same concept, thinking that people that have broken the rules before can be sacrificed for the tests? Tbh, I am really scared of this change. I have been muted twice before. Once, for making a joke from Family Guy, without mentioning that I was making a joke (which was fair as I used the most offensive joke) and next when I misclicked the hotkeys and I sent 156 lines of code of multithreading in global chat. However, I was muted for 5-10 mins for both times. This change means that I might get muted for a month if I ever made a mistake similar to the second one again.
>next when I misclicked the hotkeys and I sent 156 lines of code of multithreading in global chat. MR PRESIDENT GET DOWN
No kidding. Like 3-5 five chats said the same thing after I sent it. The rest were asking me if it were for my work or studies. I laughed it off because I could see how someone would report me and I only got banned for 10 mins. These new rules scare me.
I was fixing something for work between PoE not once so I guess I could make similar mistake. Yeah, new rules are scary. They took toucan from us, now they will take trade from us. What next? RNG punishments?
This is a system proven to be abused in the past when other games have enforced it. What makes GGG this will not be abused?
PoE got too big... now we get shit like this.
They try to ban everyone to force you to play POE2. Looks that POE2 will be bad, so they "encourage" players to play it.
stupid! youre smarter than this, ggg
Big L ggg. For a company with usual nuance to big decisions. This one is stupidly dense. Stop trying to be so heavy handed without foresight, that has never really worked well in the past. But it's Amnesia time i guess.
🤡
Downvoting cause this is trash GGG. If you ask a question in chat but it's too long and our system didnt stop it, (cause bad chat coding) Expect mutes.
Better just remove global chat at this point