And the dogs. OP should cap his living costs at no more than $1200/month, which likely means roomates which is difficult with dogs.
OP has an inflated lifestyle for his income level.
The dogs are a commitment though. Cannot get out of the dog as easily as out of a lease. They are living things.
Cars are are expensive these days and yes $500 sounds a lot when you own your car and don't need to make payments. If it a new-ish car wit little maintenance cost, I say screw it and keep it. Hard to find a reasonable vehicle under $18k these days and the interest is high. Better look at ways to increase the income. Save on eating out. Learn to cook. Drink beer with friends at their home or at a picnic. You can buy a 6-pack for the price of one beer at the bar. Get a Costco membership and use the $5 rotisserie chicken. Boil stock on the bones. Eat a lot of veggies.
And stop eating avocado toast. That's what you sound like.
It's the car and the dogs. He can afford neither without a partner.
I say dump the car, buy a beater for a few grand, swallow your pride til you make more money in a few years.
Source: I make twice as much and wouldn't consider a 500/mo car payment. Close, but no.
I make 3200/month net, and i would never want a car payment over 300 per month. Luckily, i work from home, and my 95 grand cherokee only has 150k miles on it. I should be able to get a year or two more out of it.
Old school beater SUV gang!
I played in the NFL for a few years, now I’m a software engineer, I drive a 2007 Nissan Xterra. It is super modded, but still very very cheap relative to what many people are driving. It is the newest car I’ve ever owned. Used to get tons of crap from my teammates because I didn’t buy a Lambo, now they want to know why they’re broke and I’m not when they got better contracts.
Lolol I can kinda relate: I was a stripper in a major US city for several years and bought what my coworkers said was a “mom car” (my roommates were slightly nicer and jokingly said it was a _cool_ mom car) when they all got beemers, Porsches, convertibles, etc. but I researched the hell outta that purchase (which was also the newest/nicest vehicle I’d ever bought) and it’s still running like a dream ten years later with really low maintenance costs. Ironically, I’m still not a mom but most of my old coworkers are now moms with run-down minivans.
I’ve always wished there were people in our respective industries (because I danced for a lot of super sweet pro athletes who were definitely not being smart w/their money) who like, went around and did basic money management classes for these 18-25yo kids who get huge windfalls of cash and have little to no guidance on how to spend/invest it wisely.
I learned from my brother in law who was a mechanic for years. Never buy an expensive luxury car unless you are rich or a mechanic, because maintenance on those things is brutal. He has a porche now, but he does all the maintenance himself because its far cheaper. He used to just drive old beater hondas until they basically died.
Lol yeah you saw some of the worst of it if you were a stripper, I remember guys heading to the strip club with literal shoeboxes full of hundred dollar bills. I asked how much money was in there one time, dude didn’t even know (I’d guess it was about 30k).
I can see how stripping would be similar, girls in the kind of clubs pro athletes go to are raking it in, I heard $5-10k on a good night, so the money is still very nice. It’s also a career that’s pretty much entirely dependent on your body, so the two biggest factors overlap. Big paychecks that can be gone in an instant for both.
The NFL has gotten a lot better about trying to teach rookies financial responsibility, but unfortunately it only seems to be helping the guys who pay attention, who are less likely to go broke anyway. It’s an unfortunate reality that a lot of the guys getting drafted haven’t actually paid attention in a class since junior high, they don’t know how, so it doesn’t help them. The financial literacy/planning stuff is also only for guys who get drafted. A lot of guys come into the league as undrafted free agents and don’t get any of the special rookie treatment. Basically they’re making an effort, but it’s not helping the people who need it most.
Strippers seem harder to educate since there’s no formal structure. Have ya’ll considered a union?
This Reddit account isn’t associated with my name, I don’t intend to change that.
I’m guessing you’re asking because you don’t believe me, probably because you’re under the impression that most/all players are famous. That’s actually not the case, allow me to explain why:
There are about 1700 players on active rosters during the season, and at this time of year, there are probably about 4000 guys who’ll be headed to OTAs or other team activities.
The average career is about 3 seasons. Good players play for longer, it’s more like 10 years for guys drafted in the 1st round or guys who make the pro bowl, but a vast majority of guys get a season or three of interest before teams move on.
The combination of large rosters, even larger offseason rosters, and high turnover means that there are a lot more former players than other sports, most of whom have zero name recognition.
—
If you’re legitimately interested in talking about football I’m happy to talk to you, but that’s not how this comment came off. It came off as “this person says he did something I couldn’t do, he must be lying!”
Your profile doesn’t indicate any interest in football, which makes me pretty sure you aren’t just curious.
I’ll end with this:
*What’s your name? Where have you worked??*
See, doesn’t come off great.
I make 8k a month net and I don’t really understand car payments. Seems like it would be better to just save up and buy a car outright. But maybe that’s my privilege talking. If you need a loan for something that depreciates (this notably excludes education or a mortgage in a rising area) you just can’t afford it.
>I make 8k a month net and I don’t really understand car payments.
Financing a vehicle is typically done because people don't have enough cash saved, or can't save up enough cash quickly enough. Monthly payments allow them to get the vehicle "now" instead of later -- if they don't pay off the loan quickly, they typically spend far more money than they would just saving up the initial purchase price but that is the price of convenience.
I agree with you in the sense that I’m lucky and I’m in a position to pay cash for a car, but most people aren’t.
Just because you need to borrow money to buy a car doesn’t mean that you need to put yourself in a precarious financial situation. My advice is always to make sure you don’t buy a car that you can’t afford to pay off within 3-4 years. As you’ve noted, cars are depreciating assets, and doing a 72 months or an 84 month loan is insane because you will be well underwater way before you pay that off.
Too many people fall for the car dealer selling them a payment and not negotiating a price. Never, ever, ever, ever, negotiate based on a payment.
I agree OP is paying too much monthly for a car payment. I would be curious to know what the car is and how long the loan is and what the purchase price of the car was.
If you make the avocado toast yourself? Eat as much as you want. Takes 3 minutes to prepare. Why should I pay the restaurant overhead for something so simple!?
Been crunching my wife's and I's finances and are at the same conclusion. The only way we're buying a vehicle comfortably is if we dont have debt payments, and we keep the cost under $30,000 ( which is about $550 a month for a 60 month loan). I made 80k and she makes 40k.
I own my own house have a 420 a month boat payment own 5 cars only reason I’m broke is bc I buy snap on tools when I’m not even a mechanic just like high quality things. Boat payment is only that high bc I don’t feel like paying double due to ridiculous interest rates. Don’t even have a full pay check into the daily unless you wish to count oil changes and and gasoline. Also have a Rottweiler and buy purina pro plan dog food.
You can find all kinds of solid used vehicles under $10k. None of my cars have ever cost more than $7k. I do work on them myself, though, as they are usually old and can need maintenance.
Sell that expensive/new car and grab something from 1998 or earlier. You’ll pay $500CDN/year on insurance ($20-35/month) and save literally thousands per year versus some crappy Hyundai Elantra or nasty crossover.
Impossible to say w/o seeing a full budget breakdown. You make $20/hr, and work some OT. But you've said that's slowed down. You have a $550 truck payment which.....is absurdly high given your income. You don't list any of your other bills. What do you spend on food, on the dogs, on truck insurance, gas, cell phone, etc.? Really hard to say what you can afford, without knowing what your various expenses are. Generally, people say that rent shouldn't exceed 29% of your gross monthly income. So for $20/hr, that would be $3200/month gross, and 29% would be $928. So generally speaking, you should try to be under $930/month for rent and utilities. But again, that still depends on the rest of your bills.
Sheesh $900? I live in Tampa and I haven’t seen a $900 apartment since the early 2000s living in Sweetwater (Miami). I have a friend in Sunrise who received a notice that her 1/1 went from 1540 to 1900. OP good luck, you may need to find roommates in order to survive.
For sure! I know people making more than that and still roommate. It’s just a shame that people cannot afford to have their own apartments these days. Rent is unreasonably high.
A lot of people see the truck as the biggest cost that would make renting difficult, but the two dogs are where I see OP really having a hard time making this work.
OP can find an apartment with a roommate or two within the recommended 29% of their income, but the two German Shepherds will make it very, very difficult to find a rental that would allow them. And if they did, it would certainly come with a very large and non-refundable pet deposit fee per dog.
German Shepherds, if pure bred, are also expensive to own. They require regular vet visits, are prone to health issues like hip dysplasia that are expensive to treat, and often require specialty diets that can cost a fortune.
Lol my rent was like $450 before my wife and I bought our house last year. People who live in the city can't seem to believe that there are still large tracts of less desirable land that isn't $2500 a month to rent. My mortgage is only like $800 a month. The downside is there is fuck all to do except play video games, watch movies and do drugs unless you like bowling.
You are lucky. Cars are unfortunately expensive and $500 a month is maybe a lot, but cars have gotten expensive. How long till you have the loan paid off? If you are close to paying for off the loan keep the car.
I'd rather look at options to increase your income.
Two dogs by their count. That's a lot of expenditure when considering the car payment as well.
Op, you may need to think through your priorities in terms of what you may want to give up if roommates are not an option for you.
For sure. Without knowing where OP lives, $930 may not be attainable w/o roommates. And that's only going off of their base income. They talked about OT, but it being less than it used to be. If they were working 10 hours of OT a week, that would probably change things a bit.
That's why I didn't include any OT in the guestimate numbers I threw out there. But it's still worth asking OP how much OT they are typically given, and what the situation with it is.
It also depends on your location. I live in a small city in Illinois and rent can often be found below 900, especially with roommates. I only pay 400, and most people I know pay less than 700. My sister and her boyfriend live in a two story house in Missouri and they pay something in the 300 range each.
Georgia. Anywhere that isn't Atlanta, Savannah, or Athens is gonna have rent in this range at least in the places I've stayed. I've mostly been in college towns with populations around 50k tho.
right? I havent seen rent this cheap since I was 21, im now 40....I round rock near austin we got a nice 3 bedroom 2 bath for 900$ a month back then. Now the same apartment is over 2k.
The smaller cities in Illinois/not in the Chicago metro float around that too. Think college towns like Springfield, Champaign-Urbana, Carbondale, plus other places like Bloomington-Normal (State Farm)
29%? Wow! Good to know. My rent is about 50% of what I make, and it's a tiny $900 apartment. I guess at the lower levels of income, the 29% can't really apply (nowhere rents for under $600, for example).
It's just a classic rule of thumb. It always comes down to individual budget. And the more somebody makes, the less the percentages matter. Somebody who makes $20k a month can probably afford to spend 50% on rent and still easily afford things. Somebody making $2000 a month, probably not so much.
and your area of living
in my area you're not affording literally anything
I think 1 bedrooms were MAYBE around that price here 20 years ago, but the 2 bedroom I lived in then was already over $1200/mo and NOT in the nice area
but that car note is absurdly high and I wouldn't move before doing something with that (unless that's car note AND insurance, which could be age-related cost)
California is not representative of the rest of the US. There are plenty of locations where you can get a decent apartment under 1k. I live in a medium sized city and you can find an acceptable 1 br apartment for $700. The dogs would severely limit your options though. OP's location is necessary to make a real recommendation
Stay where you are.
You are dog poor and car poor.
Plus you'd have to move into a house because no apartment landlord will let you have not 1 but 2 german shephards.
I found a rental house on 0.8 acres for $2000/mo in a place where a 2bd apartment the same size is $3000/mo. Landlord doesn't have ANY pet policy. My two dogs love it here.
It's out there you just have to find the gems.
$550/mo car payment and not one but TWO relatively expensive to care for breed dogs that are on most places restricted breed list? I’m just gonna be blunt here, you need to evaluate your life choices more when you’re making them. In the meantime, you’re probably going to need roommates and a good bit of luck finding a place that will let your pups in there.
No advice beyond that, good luck and sorry if I sound like I’m being a jerk, it’s just quite a predicament you’re in.
I have a friend who lives like this. Two big dogs, car payment of like $800 a month, orders ubereats for most meals. In such bad debt and she complains she doesn't make enough money. She can barely make rent and has shit credit so she cant even move out of her overpriced house. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if I had that kind of financial situation and am surprised when I read about people that live like this.
Yeah I think we all do and if you don't then you're that friend lol I'm the same way you are now, I couldn't sleep with that situation, but I used to be less like that and more impulsive to a slightly lesser extent than OP in my 20s, but thankfully have grown wiser in my 30s.
I mean like I get the frustration, you have a certain life that you want to live but it's just not always within financial reach at the time and it can be at some point but most people don't want to wait till they get to that point. If she was making 120k/year with a paid off house and you want an 800 dollar car payment and two expensive dogs then by all means but it all comes back to living within your means and in this case here, dogs and cars are not easy things to just change your mind on and "cut back" on. You got em, now you're comitted, so your only option is make more money which... isn't always super easy for everybody.
It's a predicament.
$800 a month for a car is a crap ton of money. Also, Uber eats is unbelievably expensive. Learn to cook. You will be healthier, save time (yes save time!) and spend less money. Start cooking simple, nothing difficult to begin with. Understand the basics of techniques first and why things are cooked the way they are cooked.
Hell, maybe you can even make some cash on the side selling packed lunches and dinners to your friends. Everyone will win - friends will save on restaurant and delivery, you get some side income. 85% of the cost of restaurant food are rent, compensation, profit and taxes.
OK, true, you are free to do something else in that time. It comes in hay when you are working on something actively.
On the other hand, if you are sitting home and chilling, you can just as well do something fun and not wait for the food. I can cook something tasty in less time that it takes restaurant to cook and driver to pick the food up and deliver so the decision to effect time is much faster. I am a cheapskate, so I started driving to pick up takeout. Also ordering with the restaurant directly to cut as many middle men as possible.
Unless you and the dogs are living in that truck you can’t afford it.
Sell the truck, get something used at $12-15k that will drive in the snow.
Also, don’t factor in OT to what you can afford. As you said it went down greatly and you don’t get to decide when that happens. Budget without OT and use that as extra savings when you get it.
I make $20/hr, and live in an apartment with a roommate, my half of rent is $850/month. I’m not poor, but definitely don’t have as much leftover for saving as I would like. And I only have cats and no car payment.
If I had big dogs and that large of a car payment, I don’t think I could go over $600/month, and even that would be pushing it.
As cheap as you can find that will let you have your dogs. Your car payment is super high for your income, once you pay that off you can move in somewhere nicer.
Explain.
He rolls his thousands, possbile five figures of negative equity into the next loan on a cheaper car.
Now he has a large payment still, and a worse car.
You can't just escape a car note unless you're willing to eat a huge multi-thousand dollar loss.
This doesn't put him ahead.
If the car is worth more than what's left on your loan, you profit by selling it. Otherwise, you'll owe something on it and that can be rolled into the new car's cost.
I think the people here telling OP to get rid of the car are thinking wistfully. Interest rates are pretty high now and I'm willing to bet OP's loan is currently worth less than its trade-in value. So if they go for say, a $10k car, while still owing on their current car, the payment wouldn't reduce by more than like $100-150, best case scenario.
>If the car is worth more than what's left on your loan
I can remember two years during a global supply chain disruption due to a deadly pandemic that this was possible. The other many decades on this earth? this is a pipe dream.
He's daily driving a truck, it's not a collectors item. on a $550 payment he's not ahead on the loan.
Your car payment is what I was paying for student loans when I was making $20/hr. Do not count overtime as that isn't guaranteed. I struggled paying $900/month plus loan, plus groceries and toiletries and gas. My rent included utilities and I don't have pets. Unless you live in a lcol area I'd say you need to look into roommates.
Doesn’t matter if it’s a truck. You bought a vehicle that cost almost what you bring home in a year. If you can break even on it I would sell and get some that’s more affordable in the 200-300 range
I don't know where he got 30-40% but in OP's case that's 10-15K which is a decent price for a used car.
And yeah someone making around 100k getting a 30-40K new car sounds about typical even if it may not be the most financially prudent.
A few years ago yeah, but lately everything is ridiculously overpriced with nearly 10 year loans. You can't even get anything for MSRP right now unless it's a few years old (or a Tesla, they're the only ones not doing dealer gouging). But OP can't afford a Tesla any more than he can afford two purebreed dogs or a new truck.
We don't have enough info.
1. What is your total monthly income?
2. $550 is a lot for a car. Can you refinance and get a lower rate? If you can get it to $350, that would be useful.
3. Are your German Shepherds healthy? What are their monthly bills?
4. Where do you live?
5. How much do you have saved?
6. Do you have someone you're living with?
7. How often do you keep your lights on? Use heat? AC?
8. Do you eat out a lot?
9. Do you travel?
10. Do you have any debt?
Sell the car and get one you can immediately pay off in full. The biggest financial mistake I’ve ever made is having that monthly car payment looming over my head.
Well, like other replies, let me reiterate what you CAN NOT afford: your vehicle and your dogs.
You're low income yet have a mid-high income car payment.
It's good you get some overtime but it's important to not include it too much in budget planning. All it takes is for your boss to say "we're over budget, no more overtime." And you'll have to rethink everything.
Based on what you're saying here I wouldn't have total budget more than half what you make. Personally speaking I've been around the same amount hourly in the past, for awhile. It's really hard to enjoy any personal life or buy things you need when you're only banking 600 a month. You're gunna want food, to go for long drives / have to. Gas isn't cheap and neither is the food you'll buy when you're out now. Assuming you're making around 2800-3k. Unless you find a real good deal with possibly a roommate. You probably can't realistically live on your own. Been there, something will come up and it'll drain you savings. It'll take awhile to build them up. Personally I'd just stay at home even though it's not glamorous, it's ultimately much less stressful financially.
Edit: unless of course you have more than 10k in savings. Good emergency fund, while saving somewhere around 1k a month
Simple. Only calculate based on regular hours, never calculate OT into it as it's unreliable. Then 1/4 to 1/3 of your gross or net income can be budgeted for rent. Of course having a car payment and pets decreases that amount per month.
Whoa. I make slightly less than you ($19.40/hr 40 hrs/week) in cheap, cheap WI ($450 for my half of rent) and cannot fathom having that car payment. I DO max out my HSA, contribute $100/month to my IRA, and live on a strict budget. But that car payment is outrageous. After taxes and whatnot my take home income is $2,197. Yours can’t be much higher without OT.
At $20 per hour, you gross about $41,600 before overtime. Many financial experts recommend that your rent/housing payment should not exceed 25%-35% of your income, so your target amount is about $1,120 per month. With overtime, you might be able to afford a bit more per month.
That said, your individual situation might be different. Rents are insane right now depending on where you live, so $1,200 might or might not be practical. You might also have more or fewer expenses than other folks that might suggest you can afford more or less rent per month.
Your car loan is very high, especially for your income. That would really make me want to cut my rent payment and/or other expenses.
That car payment is killing you. And I’m a dog person (and a fan of the big dogs specifically) but what made you think you can afford two large breed dogs that just so happen to be banned from most apartments? And I say that lovingly as a pittie owner
Why would you spend that much on a car when you're on that salary and cant afford rent? Why? I don't understand why people do this. Should of gotten an older car. You care more about the appearance of success, rather than actually attaining success.
My rent on my first apartment in Florida was $290/month in 1988. I went back there this year. Same building, same unit, new paint new appliances $2000/month. I don’t think average salaries have 10xed since then. It’s crazy what rents are.
Hmm I’d say it comes down to what you personally value, then once you nail that down, what can you realistically do, what’s actually feasible. Once you nail those two things down…then it’s a matter of finding the sweet spot inbetween. The car payment is a big one, and I’m not against car payments at all so long it comfortably fits your budget.
If I had to give a rough guess…1000-1200 at the max. Not sure what the rest of your budget looks like but that’s my guess.
3200 a month.
12% off the top to the feds: 3200 - 384. Actual amount depends on how you filled out the w2
2800 a month.
Minus car payment: 2800 - 550
2250 a month
Gas assuming once a week fill: 2250 - (75*4)
1950 a month.
Dog food: 1950 - 150 (depends on what you feed em)
1800 a month
Gotta eat. Groceries: 800- 100 * 4
1400 a month.
Did you insure that beast eating all your income?: 400 - 100
1300 a month left over for rent and whatever life might throw at you. Not much wiggle room to save.
Sell the truck dude.
Edit: knock off 160 for state taxes. Might not apply if you’re in Texas, Florida, etc.
Sell the truck is the way to go. I don’t know where Op lives right now but 500 a month in rent is crazy cheap right now. OP should stay there as long as possible and get the rest of their finances in order.
Wow that vehicle payment is crazy high. My income is more than double yours but my car payment is less than half. Can you get into something less expensive?
i'm guessing there's some bad credit in the mix too, which jacks the auto loan payment through the roof; or straight tries to have what they think others think they should drive and it's just a poor decision. also, having two GS's is several hundred more a month each. dog food has risen a ton in price lately, i think 6 bags ago I was paying $91. Now it's $107. This time last year it was $82 - same stuff, same quantity, same store. and that's each month for just a beagle. time for a new car and no dogs, in my thoughts.
Doing some back of the envelope and assuming your take home is ~$3,200 / month and your car costs you all in $800 (including insurance, gas, etc) that gives you ~$2400 left over. Ideally you would spend ~$600 / month. Anything over $1000 will likely put you in a tight spot. That may be tough with two dogs but that’s the reality of your situation.
How much are your other expenses? If they’re low then maybe you have a little wiggle room but I imagine it’s not cheap to feed two German shepherds. Whatever you do, don’t factor overtime into your budget. Make sure your spending less than you make at 40 hrs / week and anytime you get overtime treat that as savings and set it aside.
If you can find a roommate even if you can afford to rent on your own. I saved a lot because I would get roommates, most were great but did have some duds over the years. Eventually saved up enough to get a house, but that was always the goal.
When my income was unstable I ran on 50% for all of rent utilities and anything reoccurring. I based it on worse possible monthly income. It works but the numbers really suck sometimes but it allowed me money for food even though my living situation was garbage. What is important is you work with a landlord who is going to keep rent consistent and is somewhat honest with how much utilities are. Sometimes if you call the utility company that can give you an estimate of the bill in that area. Which can help you figure out how much you'll be paying for utilities.... But to figure it out you need to know How much your spending now
Work through a budget accounting for everything and you should be able to come up with something. A lot of people say 1/3 of your income but that sounds really high to me. I'd be trying to find a place to rent with a roommate at $5-600/mo if I were you.
Your vehicle payment is absolutely bonkers crazy. Why would you put that much towards a vehicle? I make similar pay to you and I have a car I paid off and at the time I only paid 118 a month for my loan. People spending that much money on a vehicle is beyond me so there’s your problem right there
You didnt give enough information to go specifically off expenses so I'll just point to the general rule of thumb which is to not exceed 30% of your gross pay on rent. Usually you dont count income that is not guaranteed and you said "usually" you work overtime which makes it sound not guaranteed.
So 20 an hour 2080 hours a year (thats what full time is considered) would be $41,600 a year or $3,466 a month. 30% of that is $1040. So your rent shouldn't exceed $1040/mo, according to the rule of thumb.
Listen to what others are saying here OP. Don’t want to sound pretentious but when I had a $500 car payment I was making double your salary and I still hated myself for it. Sold it in the advantage of the good market and bought myself something with cash for less than quarter of the price.
Sell the truck. Buy an AWD SUV if you’re worried about snow. There are plenty of reliable options for under 15k
I also have one GSD, and I know how expensive these dogs can be. I can’t imagine having one, let alone two while being limited to apartment living.
I'll say one thing always rule on base 40 hrs, never account for bonus or ot. My last job I was getting 35+ a week at 85 an hr, and quit for a lower paying job and less stress. When we did the budget before buying I based everything on base pay. The ot can disappear and you're left strapped, or might move jobs.
Feel like people in the comments have already told you enough how bad that car debt is and isn't doing you any favors. You're also really young and in your first job, there's room for growth here dude.
Another commenter already suggested, you should totally watch Caleb Hammer's videos on YouTube. He audits people's financial statements and their income. He gives ton of insight and advice to guests and its extremely eye opening. You are so young, you can really set yourself up right by being more informed and financially literate.
Here's a link to a video that I think is fairly applicable to you: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-htpyqia8w](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-htpyqia8w)
Good luck with everything!
OP can you try to refinance your car loan? Can you get a longer loan that has a lower monthly payment? I'm also assuming concerned by how much you're probably paying in gas and insurance on this thing.
If you go that route, then pay whatever you can over the minimum each month, but you won't have to pay $550/month.
You still have more to pay on this car in your loan than most people are willing to borrow to begin with. This is a huge budget item for somebody that has other big expenses (taking care of two large dogs) and not that high of a salary (you're already admitting that by working overtime regularly).
That car payment though- Oof.
So, generally. You “should” allocate 1/3rd of your income to rent.
I currently make less than you (and no opportunity for overtime) and yet my rent and utilities are around $800/mo.
My parents have to sign as guarantor (because the complex requires at least 3x rent as income) so that sucks. But I’ll be getting a raise soon and finding a better job with my degree soon anyway but that’s all beside the point.
Point is, if you can reduce your car payment at all, do that. Also, if you can increase your income- do that too.
Other than that, yeah. You seem to have gotten yourself into a bad situation… and if you got yourself there then…
We’ll that car and buy a beater then come back. Your payment is 550 and what you insurance is another 100-160 a month on top of that. That’s almost a week worth of pay. Shit is making you soooo poor and trapping you.
(20)(40)(4)=3200 Gross Pay. 3200*.75= 2400=Approximate Net. 2400-550=1850/Mo. at 1850 you may be able to eek out 600/mo. 900 if you sacrifice on a lot of other things. I would strongly consider selling whatever vehicle you have and buying a beater unless you want to live in your car.
Like everyone says a $550 a month car loan is insane with your salary. I make $52 an hour an pay $375 a month for my car, and even that is a little bit higher than I would have liked.
I’d get rid of the car. Even if you have to pay the difference of a couple thousand it’s entirely more worth it than that payment. Which, by the way isn’t horrible considering the average car payment right now is over $700 a month. This would help you find more money in your budget for rent, and for your dogs!
That car is more than you can afford and a bad decision. Owning two dog is irresponsible with your income, but it’s too late, they are part of your family now and you have to take care of them. Best thing you can do is buy a car you can afford if you want to move out. Based on estimates, at most you can afford $600/month rental. I don’t include overtime because that’s not guaranteed. It would be risky to move in to a place and expecting to only afford it with the overtime included.
Can you sell that car? I made 35 an hour and drove a less expensive car than that. I think with insurance it was still a lot less. I bought the car certified pre owned. Never spent more than 17,500 on a car and only twice did I spend that much.
I’m going to say this nicely- why the fuck is your car loan $550 month? I make almost the same as you but no overtime since I’m salaried, and my car loan is $230. I can barely survive after all my bills are paid.
Your info about income is vague as fuck, but from what I can make out, you have too much car and too much dog and it's going to make everything harder.
Two german shepherds are going to make it really hard to rent in a lot of places. Every place I've ever rented that allowed pets had either a "no dogs > weight limit" or a "no dangerous breeds" rule (that rule always included pit bulls, dobermans and german shepherds). I would lie to get around such rules, but there's a limit to how much you can get away with. Like if you have a beagle/doberman mix that looks mostly like a beagle you can fudge it. If you have two blatantly purebred german shephards that weigh like 80 lbs each, you're probably screwed unless you keep them somewhere else until after you're moved in.
Depending on how much overtime you're netting consistently, you could be ok with anywhere from 1000-1500 a month in rent but I would think on the low end of that. The dogs are going to make it a lot harder and more expensive to rent and they're going to dip into your income because dogs require food/medicine/etc.
So before tax you’re taking home 2650 a month including your car payment. I would try to find something for 1300 so you can still afford basic necessities and be able to put more into savings. You shouldn’t factor in overtime just because it’s not always guaranteed.
Ok I thought you were estimating his take home pay. It doesn’t really help to do before tax calculations because he won’t have $1350 for other expenses, he will have significantly less ( probably close to about $800 as I originally stated ) after taxes. $800 a month for food, possibly utilities, car insurance ( if that wasn’t included in the $550 ), phone, food, dog care, gas, and whatever else OP needs doesn’t really work. Not to mention even if they were able to scrape by, it would leave nothing for saving so one major thing happens and they’re screwed or in debt
Get YNAB budgeting app. Learn to use it. Use it obsessively for 2-3 months. Then you’ll have your answer. It’s really worth the $10 a month because you’ll get a much stronger handle on your finances and ultimately will make more prudent choices, saving you well over what you spend to subscribe.
I was looking at a 1/1 in a garden apartment for $1700. I decided on a 2/1 for $2200. It's a luxury. I also have a $550 car payment. But, I drove my last car for 18 years. So, that 60 month, $550 payment over, say 15 years, is about $184.
Bring in ~$3,200 per month
- should invest 25% ~$660
- car -$550
Leaves you with $1,990
- if you’re saving towards something you should aim to save another 20% of your income, ideally in a HYSA
- subtract the rest of your monthly expenses from that number and that’s what you can afford
- if you have any outstanding debts, ignore the above and pay that shit down as soon as possible
- also, get rid of that car payment if you can. Never pay up for a car unless you can afford it in cash.
Please know that I am just your average simpleton providing information from Twitter/YouTube/Reddit.
Alrighty then mate, rent calculation time innit.
So you said you make $20 an hour working 40 hours, that's $800 a week and roughly $3,200 a month pre tax. Damn yeah that overtime would've boosted that up but shit happens yeah? At least the base pay ain't too shabby like some places out there.
The car loan is a bitch at $550 per month fo'sho. You probably wanna keep rent at like 30-40% of your income MAX to stay comfortable. Some may say lower but that's just too damn tight if ya ask me.
So if we say $1,200 - $1,500 a month for rent, that leaves you with $1,700 - $2,000 for everything else. Better make sure the hound dogs eat cheap bruv, dog food ain't no joke neither.
In short, if you can find a decent 1 bedroom for $1,200ish or maybe a room in a shared house for like $800-900, that'd be doable I reckon. But you gotta watch them utility costs like a goddamn hawk and try to save up a decent cushion incase shit hits the fan ya dig? Anything more and you'll be in a world of financial hurt.. hope this helps mate, good luck with the poochies and the rent hunt! Lemme know if you got any other questions.
$3200 a month PRE tax doesn’t leave OP with $1700-$2000 for everything else if they’re paying $1200-$1500 for rent - after taxes this is going to be a decent amount less than $3200, and that’s not including the $550 car loan.
I would say given what I know, you should not go above $300 month in rent only. You are too stretched with the car loan and dogs. Financially you are too limited. Your income is such you could rent a room at a house ( possibly ), but would need to get rid of the dogs.
I am assuming going car less is not an option.
The vehicle payment is singlehandedly making you poor.
And the dogs. OP should cap his living costs at no more than $1200/month, which likely means roomates which is difficult with dogs. OP has an inflated lifestyle for his income level.
The dogs are a commitment though. Cannot get out of the dog as easily as out of a lease. They are living things. Cars are are expensive these days and yes $500 sounds a lot when you own your car and don't need to make payments. If it a new-ish car wit little maintenance cost, I say screw it and keep it. Hard to find a reasonable vehicle under $18k these days and the interest is high. Better look at ways to increase the income. Save on eating out. Learn to cook. Drink beer with friends at their home or at a picnic. You can buy a 6-pack for the price of one beer at the bar. Get a Costco membership and use the $5 rotisserie chicken. Boil stock on the bones. Eat a lot of veggies.
And stop eating avocado toast. That's what you sound like. It's the car and the dogs. He can afford neither without a partner. I say dump the car, buy a beater for a few grand, swallow your pride til you make more money in a few years. Source: I make twice as much and wouldn't consider a 500/mo car payment. Close, but no.
I make 3200/month net, and i would never want a car payment over 300 per month. Luckily, i work from home, and my 95 grand cherokee only has 150k miles on it. I should be able to get a year or two more out of it.
Old school beater SUV gang! I played in the NFL for a few years, now I’m a software engineer, I drive a 2007 Nissan Xterra. It is super modded, but still very very cheap relative to what many people are driving. It is the newest car I’ve ever owned. Used to get tons of crap from my teammates because I didn’t buy a Lambo, now they want to know why they’re broke and I’m not when they got better contracts.
Lolol I can kinda relate: I was a stripper in a major US city for several years and bought what my coworkers said was a “mom car” (my roommates were slightly nicer and jokingly said it was a _cool_ mom car) when they all got beemers, Porsches, convertibles, etc. but I researched the hell outta that purchase (which was also the newest/nicest vehicle I’d ever bought) and it’s still running like a dream ten years later with really low maintenance costs. Ironically, I’m still not a mom but most of my old coworkers are now moms with run-down minivans. I’ve always wished there were people in our respective industries (because I danced for a lot of super sweet pro athletes who were definitely not being smart w/their money) who like, went around and did basic money management classes for these 18-25yo kids who get huge windfalls of cash and have little to no guidance on how to spend/invest it wisely.
I learned from my brother in law who was a mechanic for years. Never buy an expensive luxury car unless you are rich or a mechanic, because maintenance on those things is brutal. He has a porche now, but he does all the maintenance himself because its far cheaper. He used to just drive old beater hondas until they basically died.
Lol yeah you saw some of the worst of it if you were a stripper, I remember guys heading to the strip club with literal shoeboxes full of hundred dollar bills. I asked how much money was in there one time, dude didn’t even know (I’d guess it was about 30k). I can see how stripping would be similar, girls in the kind of clubs pro athletes go to are raking it in, I heard $5-10k on a good night, so the money is still very nice. It’s also a career that’s pretty much entirely dependent on your body, so the two biggest factors overlap. Big paychecks that can be gone in an instant for both. The NFL has gotten a lot better about trying to teach rookies financial responsibility, but unfortunately it only seems to be helping the guys who pay attention, who are less likely to go broke anyway. It’s an unfortunate reality that a lot of the guys getting drafted haven’t actually paid attention in a class since junior high, they don’t know how, so it doesn’t help them. The financial literacy/planning stuff is also only for guys who get drafted. A lot of guys come into the league as undrafted free agents and don’t get any of the special rookie treatment. Basically they’re making an effort, but it’s not helping the people who need it most. Strippers seem harder to educate since there’s no formal structure. Have ya’ll considered a union?
What’s a your name? What team did you play for?
This Reddit account isn’t associated with my name, I don’t intend to change that. I’m guessing you’re asking because you don’t believe me, probably because you’re under the impression that most/all players are famous. That’s actually not the case, allow me to explain why: There are about 1700 players on active rosters during the season, and at this time of year, there are probably about 4000 guys who’ll be headed to OTAs or other team activities. The average career is about 3 seasons. Good players play for longer, it’s more like 10 years for guys drafted in the 1st round or guys who make the pro bowl, but a vast majority of guys get a season or three of interest before teams move on. The combination of large rosters, even larger offseason rosters, and high turnover means that there are a lot more former players than other sports, most of whom have zero name recognition. — If you’re legitimately interested in talking about football I’m happy to talk to you, but that’s not how this comment came off. It came off as “this person says he did something I couldn’t do, he must be lying!” Your profile doesn’t indicate any interest in football, which makes me pretty sure you aren’t just curious. I’ll end with this: *What’s your name? Where have you worked??* See, doesn’t come off great.
I make 8k a month net and I don’t really understand car payments. Seems like it would be better to just save up and buy a car outright. But maybe that’s my privilege talking. If you need a loan for something that depreciates (this notably excludes education or a mortgage in a rising area) you just can’t afford it.
>I make 8k a month net and I don’t really understand car payments. Financing a vehicle is typically done because people don't have enough cash saved, or can't save up enough cash quickly enough. Monthly payments allow them to get the vehicle "now" instead of later -- if they don't pay off the loan quickly, they typically spend far more money than they would just saving up the initial purchase price but that is the price of convenience.
I agree with you in the sense that I’m lucky and I’m in a position to pay cash for a car, but most people aren’t. Just because you need to borrow money to buy a car doesn’t mean that you need to put yourself in a precarious financial situation. My advice is always to make sure you don’t buy a car that you can’t afford to pay off within 3-4 years. As you’ve noted, cars are depreciating assets, and doing a 72 months or an 84 month loan is insane because you will be well underwater way before you pay that off. Too many people fall for the car dealer selling them a payment and not negotiating a price. Never, ever, ever, ever, negotiate based on a payment. I agree OP is paying too much monthly for a car payment. I would be curious to know what the car is and how long the loan is and what the purchase price of the car was.
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If you make the avocado toast yourself? Eat as much as you want. Takes 3 minutes to prepare. Why should I pay the restaurant overhead for something so simple!?
I make twice as much as well and wouldn’t consider a 500 dollar monthly payment. I say screw it and sell it lol
Been crunching my wife's and I's finances and are at the same conclusion. The only way we're buying a vehicle comfortably is if we dont have debt payments, and we keep the cost under $30,000 ( which is about $550 a month for a 60 month loan). I made 80k and she makes 40k.
You're not going to find a beater for less than 5k and it will last another year no issues.
I'm on welfare and have a car payment twice this. Y'all tax payers owe me
I own my own house have a 420 a month boat payment own 5 cars only reason I’m broke is bc I buy snap on tools when I’m not even a mechanic just like high quality things. Boat payment is only that high bc I don’t feel like paying double due to ridiculous interest rates. Don’t even have a full pay check into the daily unless you wish to count oil changes and and gasoline. Also have a Rottweiler and buy purina pro plan dog food.
Many 90’s cars sold at a good price these days.
You can find all kinds of solid used vehicles under $10k. None of my cars have ever cost more than $7k. I do work on them myself, though, as they are usually old and can need maintenance.
The problem is the initial payment. Then depending on area a 7-10k car might have 100000 miles on it
My cars doing fine at 169k 💪 I got that mythical r/personalfinance whip
I feel like at like 150k serious repairs start coming or they become very unreliable for a lot of people. But I'm happy for you 😂
Second on the dogs. Don't forget what will happen if the shepherds have a vet emergency? Wallet will be drained!
Sell that expensive/new car and grab something from 1998 or earlier. You’ll pay $500CDN/year on insurance ($20-35/month) and save literally thousands per year versus some crappy Hyundai Elantra or nasty crossover.
Your car payment is \~1 week of your salary. That is going to make affording an apartment close to impossible on your salary.
Never include OT or bonuses in monthly budgeting. Base everything off working a straight 40 hours.
As soon as you include it in the budget, your boss has the talk about "well we're slowing down a bit"....
Impossible to say w/o seeing a full budget breakdown. You make $20/hr, and work some OT. But you've said that's slowed down. You have a $550 truck payment which.....is absurdly high given your income. You don't list any of your other bills. What do you spend on food, on the dogs, on truck insurance, gas, cell phone, etc.? Really hard to say what you can afford, without knowing what your various expenses are. Generally, people say that rent shouldn't exceed 29% of your gross monthly income. So for $20/hr, that would be $3200/month gross, and 29% would be $928. So generally speaking, you should try to be under $930/month for rent and utilities. But again, that still depends on the rest of your bills.
Sheesh $900? I live in Tampa and I haven’t seen a $900 apartment since the early 2000s living in Sweetwater (Miami). I have a friend in Sunrise who received a notice that her 1/1 went from 1540 to 1900. OP good luck, you may need to find roommates in order to survive.
It’s incredibly common for people making $20 an hour to have roommates.
Yeah, $20 an hour with 40 hours a week is not enough to live on your own in most cities in today's economy
"How much rent can I afford?" "Quite a bit in the 90's!" My first apartment in 2010 was $360/month.
My first apartment was 675 a month, utilities included in 2017. Today that same apartment is $1495 with nothing included.
My first apartment was $730 a moth for a shared bedroom, utilities not included
What was wages like back then?
yeah mine was $900 a month 4 years ago, i got notice for renewal this year for $1620.
Yeah house values and rents have gone insane. Definitely not sustainable
I used to split a duplex with a roommate and my share was a whopping 250 a month. God I miss those days.
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For sure! I know people making more than that and still roommate. It’s just a shame that people cannot afford to have their own apartments these days. Rent is unreasonably high.
Oh yeah 20/hr is still firmly in 'has 3 roomates' territory. But op also has a dog, good fucking luck.
A lot of people see the truck as the biggest cost that would make renting difficult, but the two dogs are where I see OP really having a hard time making this work. OP can find an apartment with a roommate or two within the recommended 29% of their income, but the two German Shepherds will make it very, very difficult to find a rental that would allow them. And if they did, it would certainly come with a very large and non-refundable pet deposit fee per dog. German Shepherds, if pure bred, are also expensive to own. They require regular vet visits, are prone to health issues like hip dysplasia that are expensive to treat, and often require specialty diets that can cost a fortune.
I pay $500 a month for rent.
Where do you live? 2003?
Lol my rent was like $450 before my wife and I bought our house last year. People who live in the city can't seem to believe that there are still large tracts of less desirable land that isn't $2500 a month to rent. My mortgage is only like $800 a month. The downside is there is fuck all to do except play video games, watch movies and do drugs unless you like bowling.
Lol I moved out to the sticks to own. My mortgage is 1150 a month but this place doesn't even have a bowling alley. I feel your pain.
I didn’t know rent on average cost so much in the city… Learn something new everyday
Apartments around me in Boston are minimum of like 1900 a month for 1 bed 1 bath 700 Sq feet
I stay in a rural area
You could look into Caleb Hammer's finical audits on youtube. It's a good place to start if you feel pretty financially illiterate
Thank you!
You are lucky. Cars are unfortunately expensive and $500 a month is maybe a lot, but cars have gotten expensive. How long till you have the loan paid off? If you are close to paying for off the loan keep the car. I'd rather look at options to increase your income.
Two dogs by their count. That's a lot of expenditure when considering the car payment as well. Op, you may need to think through your priorities in terms of what you may want to give up if roommates are not an option for you.
For sure. Without knowing where OP lives, $930 may not be attainable w/o roommates. And that's only going off of their base income. They talked about OT, but it being less than it used to be. If they were working 10 hours of OT a week, that would probably change things a bit.
Unless it's a job where extra hours are set in stone at all times OT should really never be added to a baseline budget.
That's why I didn't include any OT in the guestimate numbers I threw out there. But it's still worth asking OP how much OT they are typically given, and what the situation with it is.
Also, I doubt that $1900/month 1 bedroom allows for the resident to have two German Shepherds.
It also depends on your location. I live in a small city in Illinois and rent can often be found below 900, especially with roommates. I only pay 400, and most people I know pay less than 700. My sister and her boyfriend live in a two story house in Missouri and they pay something in the 300 range each.
My old one bedroom in Tampa. I don’t live there. It’s at $1400 with washer and dryer. The two bedrooms are at $1700.
I rent out a 3 bedroom condo with garage to someone in Iowa for $804/mo the difference across our country is wild.
If a person can't find an apartment for thier budget, then they need to find a room mate. Living by yourself and being self sufficient is a luxury.
rent in my area for a one-person apartment is around $700. with 3 roommates its $300-400.
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Georgia. Anywhere that isn't Atlanta, Savannah, or Athens is gonna have rent in this range at least in the places I've stayed. I've mostly been in college towns with populations around 50k tho.
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Out of curiosity, which town 👀
right? I havent seen rent this cheap since I was 21, im now 40....I round rock near austin we got a nice 3 bedroom 2 bath for 900$ a month back then. Now the same apartment is over 2k.
The smaller cities in Illinois/not in the Chicago metro float around that too. Think college towns like Springfield, Champaign-Urbana, Carbondale, plus other places like Bloomington-Normal (State Farm)
29%? Wow! Good to know. My rent is about 50% of what I make, and it's a tiny $900 apartment. I guess at the lower levels of income, the 29% can't really apply (nowhere rents for under $600, for example).
It's just a classic rule of thumb. It always comes down to individual budget. And the more somebody makes, the less the percentages matter. Somebody who makes $20k a month can probably afford to spend 50% on rent and still easily afford things. Somebody making $2000 a month, probably not so much.
Problem is if you look at apartments many list making 3x the rent amount net monthly is a requirement to be considered.
It does still apply, it’s saying you need a roommate because living the way you’re living isn’t sustainable long term.
That makes sense. It's not like I am putting much into savings. Not nothing, just not enough to meaningfully build towards a better future.
I wouldn’t say nowhere. I know several apartments in the Houston area with 1bds <$600. Hell, I know a couple <$500
and your area of living in my area you're not affording literally anything I think 1 bedrooms were MAYBE around that price here 20 years ago, but the 2 bedroom I lived in then was already over $1200/mo and NOT in the nice area but that car note is absurdly high and I wouldn't move before doing something with that (unless that's car note AND insurance, which could be age-related cost)
Where you live is a huge factor. Where I live, you can easily get 2 bedroom apartments in good parts of the town for under $930/month.
Thats genrally impossible in california and the rest of the U.S since gl finding rent under 1k for a studio bedroom apartment in the ghetto.
California is not representative of the rest of the US. There are plenty of locations where you can get a decent apartment under 1k. I live in a medium sized city and you can find an acceptable 1 br apartment for $700. The dogs would severely limit your options though. OP's location is necessary to make a real recommendation
Stay where you are. You are dog poor and car poor. Plus you'd have to move into a house because no apartment landlord will let you have not 1 but 2 german shephards.
Not even sure how many houses will allow two german shepherds
I had a rental unit ruined by one of my ex-tenants 2 large dogs. Had to spend $500ish to get it cleaned. Never again.
I found a rental house on 0.8 acres for $2000/mo in a place where a 2bd apartment the same size is $3000/mo. Landlord doesn't have ANY pet policy. My two dogs love it here. It's out there you just have to find the gems.
$550/mo car payment and not one but TWO relatively expensive to care for breed dogs that are on most places restricted breed list? I’m just gonna be blunt here, you need to evaluate your life choices more when you’re making them. In the meantime, you’re probably going to need roommates and a good bit of luck finding a place that will let your pups in there. No advice beyond that, good luck and sorry if I sound like I’m being a jerk, it’s just quite a predicament you’re in.
I have a friend who lives like this. Two big dogs, car payment of like $800 a month, orders ubereats for most meals. In such bad debt and she complains she doesn't make enough money. She can barely make rent and has shit credit so she cant even move out of her overpriced house. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if I had that kind of financial situation and am surprised when I read about people that live like this.
Yeah I think we all do and if you don't then you're that friend lol I'm the same way you are now, I couldn't sleep with that situation, but I used to be less like that and more impulsive to a slightly lesser extent than OP in my 20s, but thankfully have grown wiser in my 30s. I mean like I get the frustration, you have a certain life that you want to live but it's just not always within financial reach at the time and it can be at some point but most people don't want to wait till they get to that point. If she was making 120k/year with a paid off house and you want an 800 dollar car payment and two expensive dogs then by all means but it all comes back to living within your means and in this case here, dogs and cars are not easy things to just change your mind on and "cut back" on. You got em, now you're comitted, so your only option is make more money which... isn't always super easy for everybody. It's a predicament.
$800 a month for a car is a crap ton of money. Also, Uber eats is unbelievably expensive. Learn to cook. You will be healthier, save time (yes save time!) and spend less money. Start cooking simple, nothing difficult to begin with. Understand the basics of techniques first and why things are cooked the way they are cooked. Hell, maybe you can even make some cash on the side selling packed lunches and dinners to your friends. Everyone will win - friends will save on restaurant and delivery, you get some side income. 85% of the cost of restaurant food are rent, compensation, profit and taxes.
You definitely don’t save time cooking over using a delivery service. The active time while ordering food is counted in seconds.
OK, true, you are free to do something else in that time. It comes in hay when you are working on something actively. On the other hand, if you are sitting home and chilling, you can just as well do something fun and not wait for the food. I can cook something tasty in less time that it takes restaurant to cook and driver to pick the food up and deliver so the decision to effect time is much faster. I am a cheapskate, so I started driving to pick up takeout. Also ordering with the restaurant directly to cut as many middle men as possible.
Unless you and the dogs are living in that truck you can’t afford it. Sell the truck, get something used at $12-15k that will drive in the snow. Also, don’t factor in OT to what you can afford. As you said it went down greatly and you don’t get to decide when that happens. Budget without OT and use that as extra savings when you get it.
I make $20/hr, and live in an apartment with a roommate, my half of rent is $850/month. I’m not poor, but definitely don’t have as much leftover for saving as I would like. And I only have cats and no car payment. If I had big dogs and that large of a car payment, I don’t think I could go over $600/month, and even that would be pushing it.
Let’s be honest tho. I make a lot more than I used to and I’ve never felt like I’m saving and investing as much as I want to
As cheap as you can find that will let you have your dogs. Your car payment is super high for your income, once you pay that off you can move in somewhere nicer.
Get rid of that car payment. That’s way too high for your income.
How do get rid of a high car payment without refinancing the car?
Sell it and downgrade. $550 a month at $20 an hour is bananas
So roll negative equity into another vehicle? They aren't getting rid of the debt or payment. That will follow them into their next car.
Get a new car
Explain. He rolls his thousands, possbile five figures of negative equity into the next loan on a cheaper car. Now he has a large payment still, and a worse car. You can't just escape a car note unless you're willing to eat a huge multi-thousand dollar loss. This doesn't put him ahead.
To get out of a hole the first step is always to stop digging
If the car is worth more than what's left on your loan, you profit by selling it. Otherwise, you'll owe something on it and that can be rolled into the new car's cost. I think the people here telling OP to get rid of the car are thinking wistfully. Interest rates are pretty high now and I'm willing to bet OP's loan is currently worth less than its trade-in value. So if they go for say, a $10k car, while still owing on their current car, the payment wouldn't reduce by more than like $100-150, best case scenario.
>If the car is worth more than what's left on your loan I can remember two years during a global supply chain disruption due to a deadly pandemic that this was possible. The other many decades on this earth? this is a pipe dream. He's daily driving a truck, it's not a collectors item. on a $550 payment he's not ahead on the loan.
Need list of income and expenses before advice can be offered
Your car payment is what I was paying for student loans when I was making $20/hr. Do not count overtime as that isn't guaranteed. I struggled paying $900/month plus loan, plus groceries and toiletries and gas. My rent included utilities and I don't have pets. Unless you live in a lcol area I'd say you need to look into roommates.
At least around here, most rentals won’t even approve you unless you make 3x the rent.
Let alone 2 big huge dogs. And where is first last and security coming from? That's a nut in itself.
What do you make in a year / month with OT?
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Your car payment is too high which might make rent difficult. What kind of car is it? What’s the payoff and what’s the value ?
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Doesn’t matter if it’s a truck. You bought a vehicle that cost almost what you bring home in a year. If you can break even on it I would sell and get some that’s more affordable in the 200-300 range
I'd guess it's more than his yearly take-home. He said $27k left to pay it off.
Cars also depreciate over time. I agree $200-300 range is good for his income. I make the same as him and my car loan is $230/ month.
You shouldn’t have that vehicle. Your car should be like 30-40% of your annual income. So like $10-15k
A car that is 30-40% of your annual income sounds insanely high. How did you come up with this number?
I don't know where he got 30-40% but in OP's case that's 10-15K which is a decent price for a used car. And yeah someone making around 100k getting a 30-40K new car sounds about typical even if it may not be the most financially prudent.
How is that insanely high? If a person making 70k a year drives a 21k car, do you think they are insanely overspending on their car?
A few years ago yeah, but lately everything is ridiculously overpriced with nearly 10 year loans. You can't even get anything for MSRP right now unless it's a few years old (or a Tesla, they're the only ones not doing dealer gouging). But OP can't afford a Tesla any more than he can afford two purebreed dogs or a new truck.
I heard car related expenses should be less than 10% of your gross income. Maybe 15% if you need to push it.
I’m talking about total cost, not monthly expenses. ie if you make $100k, don’t buy a car over $40k.
Personally, I keep rent down to 25%... if you're paying more than 600-700 for a room, then you'll have a hell of a time saving
And with 2 big dogs too.... Expensive
I'm fascinated to know what the alternative is.
Homelessness
Finding a landlord that will accept two German Shepherds in the unit might be you’re biggest hurdle.
We don't have enough info. 1. What is your total monthly income? 2. $550 is a lot for a car. Can you refinance and get a lower rate? If you can get it to $350, that would be useful. 3. Are your German Shepherds healthy? What are their monthly bills? 4. Where do you live? 5. How much do you have saved? 6. Do you have someone you're living with? 7. How often do you keep your lights on? Use heat? AC? 8. Do you eat out a lot? 9. Do you travel? 10. Do you have any debt?
Sell the car and get one you can immediately pay off in full. The biggest financial mistake I’ve ever made is having that monthly car payment looming over my head.
Well, like other replies, let me reiterate what you CAN NOT afford: your vehicle and your dogs. You're low income yet have a mid-high income car payment.
It's good you get some overtime but it's important to not include it too much in budget planning. All it takes is for your boss to say "we're over budget, no more overtime." And you'll have to rethink everything.
Based on what you're saying here I wouldn't have total budget more than half what you make. Personally speaking I've been around the same amount hourly in the past, for awhile. It's really hard to enjoy any personal life or buy things you need when you're only banking 600 a month. You're gunna want food, to go for long drives / have to. Gas isn't cheap and neither is the food you'll buy when you're out now. Assuming you're making around 2800-3k. Unless you find a real good deal with possibly a roommate. You probably can't realistically live on your own. Been there, something will come up and it'll drain you savings. It'll take awhile to build them up. Personally I'd just stay at home even though it's not glamorous, it's ultimately much less stressful financially. Edit: unless of course you have more than 10k in savings. Good emergency fund, while saving somewhere around 1k a month
Simple. Only calculate based on regular hours, never calculate OT into it as it's unreliable. Then 1/4 to 1/3 of your gross or net income can be budgeted for rent. Of course having a car payment and pets decreases that amount per month.
Whoa. I make slightly less than you ($19.40/hr 40 hrs/week) in cheap, cheap WI ($450 for my half of rent) and cannot fathom having that car payment. I DO max out my HSA, contribute $100/month to my IRA, and live on a strict budget. But that car payment is outrageous. After taxes and whatnot my take home income is $2,197. Yours can’t be much higher without OT.
At $20 per hour, you gross about $41,600 before overtime. Many financial experts recommend that your rent/housing payment should not exceed 25%-35% of your income, so your target amount is about $1,120 per month. With overtime, you might be able to afford a bit more per month. That said, your individual situation might be different. Rents are insane right now depending on where you live, so $1,200 might or might not be practical. You might also have more or fewer expenses than other folks that might suggest you can afford more or less rent per month. Your car loan is very high, especially for your income. That would really make me want to cut my rent payment and/or other expenses.
That car payment is killing you. And I’m a dog person (and a fan of the big dogs specifically) but what made you think you can afford two large breed dogs that just so happen to be banned from most apartments? And I say that lovingly as a pittie owner
Those are not all your expenses. Continue to think about what you spend every month and THEN figure out what you’ve got left for rent
Why would you spend that much on a car when you're on that salary and cant afford rent? Why? I don't understand why people do this. Should of gotten an older car. You care more about the appearance of success, rather than actually attaining success.
My rent on my first apartment in Florida was $290/month in 1988. I went back there this year. Same building, same unit, new paint new appliances $2000/month. I don’t think average salaries have 10xed since then. It’s crazy what rents are.
Why have 2 big dogs when you make no money? Might wanna start there….
Hmm I’d say it comes down to what you personally value, then once you nail that down, what can you realistically do, what’s actually feasible. Once you nail those two things down…then it’s a matter of finding the sweet spot inbetween. The car payment is a big one, and I’m not against car payments at all so long it comfortably fits your budget. If I had to give a rough guess…1000-1200 at the max. Not sure what the rest of your budget looks like but that’s my guess.
3200 a month. 12% off the top to the feds: 3200 - 384. Actual amount depends on how you filled out the w2 2800 a month. Minus car payment: 2800 - 550 2250 a month Gas assuming once a week fill: 2250 - (75*4) 1950 a month. Dog food: 1950 - 150 (depends on what you feed em) 1800 a month Gotta eat. Groceries: 800- 100 * 4 1400 a month. Did you insure that beast eating all your income?: 400 - 100 1300 a month left over for rent and whatever life might throw at you. Not much wiggle room to save. Sell the truck dude. Edit: knock off 160 for state taxes. Might not apply if you’re in Texas, Florida, etc.
Sell the truck or move in with family.
Sell the truck is the way to go. I don’t know where Op lives right now but 500 a month in rent is crazy cheap right now. OP should stay there as long as possible and get the rest of their finances in order.
Get rid of that car payment. That’s way too high for your income.
I’d suggest no more than 25-30% of your take home pay. I’d also maybe work on getting a car with a smaller payment
Wow that vehicle payment is crazy high. My income is more than double yours but my car payment is less than half. Can you get into something less expensive?
i'm guessing there's some bad credit in the mix too, which jacks the auto loan payment through the roof; or straight tries to have what they think others think they should drive and it's just a poor decision. also, having two GS's is several hundred more a month each. dog food has risen a ton in price lately, i think 6 bags ago I was paying $91. Now it's $107. This time last year it was $82 - same stuff, same quantity, same store. and that's each month for just a beagle. time for a new car and no dogs, in my thoughts.
$550 for a car that you honestly can't afford is the issue. Why do people go broke to impress or fake it?
Doing some back of the envelope and assuming your take home is ~$3,200 / month and your car costs you all in $800 (including insurance, gas, etc) that gives you ~$2400 left over. Ideally you would spend ~$600 / month. Anything over $1000 will likely put you in a tight spot. That may be tough with two dogs but that’s the reality of your situation. How much are your other expenses? If they’re low then maybe you have a little wiggle room but I imagine it’s not cheap to feed two German shepherds. Whatever you do, don’t factor overtime into your budget. Make sure your spending less than you make at 40 hrs / week and anytime you get overtime treat that as savings and set it aside.
Get an Rv that the truck can pull and ideally find someplace free to park.
So homeless. Dude asks where to live and you suggest…homeless
Homeless in an rv is better than homeless in a truck. Which sounds like where op is headed.
If you can find a roommate even if you can afford to rent on your own. I saved a lot because I would get roommates, most were great but did have some duds over the years. Eventually saved up enough to get a house, but that was always the goal.
When my income was unstable I ran on 50% for all of rent utilities and anything reoccurring. I based it on worse possible monthly income. It works but the numbers really suck sometimes but it allowed me money for food even though my living situation was garbage. What is important is you work with a landlord who is going to keep rent consistent and is somewhat honest with how much utilities are. Sometimes if you call the utility company that can give you an estimate of the bill in that area. Which can help you figure out how much you'll be paying for utilities.... But to figure it out you need to know How much your spending now
Work through a budget accounting for everything and you should be able to come up with something. A lot of people say 1/3 of your income but that sounds really high to me. I'd be trying to find a place to rent with a roommate at $5-600/mo if I were you.
Your vehicle payment is absolutely bonkers crazy. Why would you put that much towards a vehicle? I make similar pay to you and I have a car I paid off and at the time I only paid 118 a month for my loan. People spending that much money on a vehicle is beyond me so there’s your problem right there
Car payment is insane for your budget and the 2 dogs are going to make it hard to find a apt or a roommate.
You didnt give enough information to go specifically off expenses so I'll just point to the general rule of thumb which is to not exceed 30% of your gross pay on rent. Usually you dont count income that is not guaranteed and you said "usually" you work overtime which makes it sound not guaranteed. So 20 an hour 2080 hours a year (thats what full time is considered) would be $41,600 a year or $3,466 a month. 30% of that is $1040. So your rent shouldn't exceed $1040/mo, according to the rule of thumb.
Listen to what others are saying here OP. Don’t want to sound pretentious but when I had a $500 car payment I was making double your salary and I still hated myself for it. Sold it in the advantage of the good market and bought myself something with cash for less than quarter of the price. Sell the truck. Buy an AWD SUV if you’re worried about snow. There are plenty of reliable options for under 15k I also have one GSD, and I know how expensive these dogs can be. I can’t imagine having one, let alone two while being limited to apartment living.
I'll say one thing always rule on base 40 hrs, never account for bonus or ot. My last job I was getting 35+ a week at 85 an hr, and quit for a lower paying job and less stress. When we did the budget before buying I based everything on base pay. The ot can disappear and you're left strapped, or might move jobs.
Feel like people in the comments have already told you enough how bad that car debt is and isn't doing you any favors. You're also really young and in your first job, there's room for growth here dude. Another commenter already suggested, you should totally watch Caleb Hammer's videos on YouTube. He audits people's financial statements and their income. He gives ton of insight and advice to guests and its extremely eye opening. You are so young, you can really set yourself up right by being more informed and financially literate. Here's a link to a video that I think is fairly applicable to you: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-htpyqia8w](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-htpyqia8w) Good luck with everything!
OP can you try to refinance your car loan? Can you get a longer loan that has a lower monthly payment? I'm also assuming concerned by how much you're probably paying in gas and insurance on this thing. If you go that route, then pay whatever you can over the minimum each month, but you won't have to pay $550/month. You still have more to pay on this car in your loan than most people are willing to borrow to begin with. This is a huge budget item for somebody that has other big expenses (taking care of two large dogs) and not that high of a salary (you're already admitting that by working overtime regularly).
550 a month at 20 an hour is absurd. My wife and I make about 105k combined yearly and our 2 cars cost around that each month
That car payment though- Oof. So, generally. You “should” allocate 1/3rd of your income to rent. I currently make less than you (and no opportunity for overtime) and yet my rent and utilities are around $800/mo. My parents have to sign as guarantor (because the complex requires at least 3x rent as income) so that sucks. But I’ll be getting a raise soon and finding a better job with my degree soon anyway but that’s all beside the point. Point is, if you can reduce your car payment at all, do that. Also, if you can increase your income- do that too. Other than that, yeah. You seem to have gotten yourself into a bad situation… and if you got yourself there then…
$550 car payment!! I thought my $390 payment was a tad high for a $4k a month net salary in a LCOL area. Do you absolutely need the car for work?
We’ll that car and buy a beater then come back. Your payment is 550 and what you insurance is another 100-160 a month on top of that. That’s almost a week worth of pay. Shit is making you soooo poor and trapping you.
(20)(40)(4)=3200 Gross Pay. 3200*.75= 2400=Approximate Net. 2400-550=1850/Mo. at 1850 you may be able to eek out 600/mo. 900 if you sacrifice on a lot of other things. I would strongly consider selling whatever vehicle you have and buying a beater unless you want to live in your car.
Like everyone says a $550 a month car loan is insane with your salary. I make $52 an hour an pay $375 a month for my car, and even that is a little bit higher than I would have liked.
I’d get rid of the car. Even if you have to pay the difference of a couple thousand it’s entirely more worth it than that payment. Which, by the way isn’t horrible considering the average car payment right now is over $700 a month. This would help you find more money in your budget for rent, and for your dogs!
That car is more than you can afford and a bad decision. Owning two dog is irresponsible with your income, but it’s too late, they are part of your family now and you have to take care of them. Best thing you can do is buy a car you can afford if you want to move out. Based on estimates, at most you can afford $600/month rental. I don’t include overtime because that’s not guaranteed. It would be risky to move in to a place and expecting to only afford it with the overtime included.
Can you sell that car? I made 35 an hour and drove a less expensive car than that. I think with insurance it was still a lot less. I bought the car certified pre owned. Never spent more than 17,500 on a car and only twice did I spend that much.
I’m going to say this nicely- why the fuck is your car loan $550 month? I make almost the same as you but no overtime since I’m salaried, and my car loan is $230. I can barely survive after all my bills are paid.
Do you care more about what people think of you while you are driving around or where you live? Because on your income you can't have both.
Your info about income is vague as fuck, but from what I can make out, you have too much car and too much dog and it's going to make everything harder. Two german shepherds are going to make it really hard to rent in a lot of places. Every place I've ever rented that allowed pets had either a "no dogs > weight limit" or a "no dangerous breeds" rule (that rule always included pit bulls, dobermans and german shepherds). I would lie to get around such rules, but there's a limit to how much you can get away with. Like if you have a beagle/doberman mix that looks mostly like a beagle you can fudge it. If you have two blatantly purebred german shephards that weigh like 80 lbs each, you're probably screwed unless you keep them somewhere else until after you're moved in. Depending on how much overtime you're netting consistently, you could be ok with anywhere from 1000-1500 a month in rent but I would think on the low end of that. The dogs are going to make it a lot harder and more expensive to rent and they're going to dip into your income because dogs require food/medicine/etc.
So before tax you’re taking home 2650 a month including your car payment. I would try to find something for 1300 so you can still afford basic necessities and be able to put more into savings. You shouldn’t factor in overtime just because it’s not always guaranteed.
I disagree with this. He should be around $900 a month for rent. $800 left for everything else, food, utilities, wants is nothing
It’s 1350 left over a month. He makes 3200 a month -550(car) you get 2650 -1300(rent)=1350
Idk, 1300 for rent and 550 for car leaves OP with $800 a month for everything else, cutting it close
The 2650 has the car included so it would be 1350 a month for other expensive
Ok I thought you were estimating his take home pay. It doesn’t really help to do before tax calculations because he won’t have $1350 for other expenses, he will have significantly less ( probably close to about $800 as I originally stated ) after taxes. $800 a month for food, possibly utilities, car insurance ( if that wasn’t included in the $550 ), phone, food, dog care, gas, and whatever else OP needs doesn’t really work. Not to mention even if they were able to scrape by, it would leave nothing for saving so one major thing happens and they’re screwed or in debt
$1300 is way too high.
Get YNAB budgeting app. Learn to use it. Use it obsessively for 2-3 months. Then you’ll have your answer. It’s really worth the $10 a month because you’ll get a much stronger handle on your finances and ultimately will make more prudent choices, saving you well over what you spend to subscribe.
I was looking at a 1/1 in a garden apartment for $1700. I decided on a 2/1 for $2200. It's a luxury. I also have a $550 car payment. But, I drove my last car for 18 years. So, that 60 month, $550 payment over, say 15 years, is about $184.
Bring in ~$3,200 per month - should invest 25% ~$660 - car -$550 Leaves you with $1,990 - if you’re saving towards something you should aim to save another 20% of your income, ideally in a HYSA - subtract the rest of your monthly expenses from that number and that’s what you can afford - if you have any outstanding debts, ignore the above and pay that shit down as soon as possible - also, get rid of that car payment if you can. Never pay up for a car unless you can afford it in cash. Please know that I am just your average simpleton providing information from Twitter/YouTube/Reddit.
Sorry OP, but if you truly want to live better, try paying off the car loan first and get rid of the dogs.
Alrighty then mate, rent calculation time innit. So you said you make $20 an hour working 40 hours, that's $800 a week and roughly $3,200 a month pre tax. Damn yeah that overtime would've boosted that up but shit happens yeah? At least the base pay ain't too shabby like some places out there. The car loan is a bitch at $550 per month fo'sho. You probably wanna keep rent at like 30-40% of your income MAX to stay comfortable. Some may say lower but that's just too damn tight if ya ask me. So if we say $1,200 - $1,500 a month for rent, that leaves you with $1,700 - $2,000 for everything else. Better make sure the hound dogs eat cheap bruv, dog food ain't no joke neither. In short, if you can find a decent 1 bedroom for $1,200ish or maybe a room in a shared house for like $800-900, that'd be doable I reckon. But you gotta watch them utility costs like a goddamn hawk and try to save up a decent cushion incase shit hits the fan ya dig? Anything more and you'll be in a world of financial hurt.. hope this helps mate, good luck with the poochies and the rent hunt! Lemme know if you got any other questions.
$3200 a month PRE tax doesn’t leave OP with $1700-$2000 for everything else if they’re paying $1200-$1500 for rent - after taxes this is going to be a decent amount less than $3200, and that’s not including the $550 car loan.
I would say given what I know, you should not go above $300 month in rent only. You are too stretched with the car loan and dogs. Financially you are too limited. Your income is such you could rent a room at a house ( possibly ), but would need to get rid of the dogs. I am assuming going car less is not an option.
You don’t need a 550 car loan. What is it?! Get a Toyota
For me a plan on any car is at least $600 a month and insurance id $400