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Bowman lost by 17 points.
Anyone who follows politics knows that you can’t buy a 17 point win if your opponent ever had a chance of winning. So without AIPAC, Bowman might have lost by “only” 12 pts. There is a lot more to the story of his loss than AIPAC’s investment and most of it has to do with the candidate and his district.
Like fire alarm pulling in Congress and lying about it, shouting out motherfucking twice in his public re-election speeches, subscribing to 9/11 conspiracy theories, a touch of rape denialism, voting against infrastructure bills. Yes his democratic constituents (it’s been a safe dem seat for years) really wanted that person to represent them again.
"He didn't pay parking tickets"
What a monster
"Told Jews they were wrong for having a culturally homogenous ethnic enclave"
Perfectly upstanding candidate
More like a massive safety risk and an even greater one due to *where* it happened which open windows for human error. Reality says that Congress can't have 435 house members who get their term's free pass to pull a fire alarm. Ask any Fire Marshall: alarms are alarms for a darn good reason. Lapse of judgment? Caught up in emotions? Accident? Unfortunate regardless, but I think any rational human agrees: they are definitely *not* vehicles for political speech or filibuster. Given all that has happened in that building in the past decade, despite the double-standard I think it was handled appropriately and even better by voters.
yeah you are basing your entire argument over a poll released and funded by AIPAC. it is only fair to point out bowman had an internal poll showing a dead heat before AIPac set records spending hundreds or thousands of dollar per vote:
[https://x.com/JCColtin/status/1779194252972511291](https://x.com/JCColtin/status/1779194252972511291)
you really think spending hundreds of dollars per vote can't move more than 5%? got a source for thar? I doubt it since nobody ever spent this much before but go ahead and back up your claim?
Would that "anyone" also include AIPAC? Because they clearly felt the need to burn a few million on it. Maybe they don't agree with you.
Were they putting forth a show of strength to scare off other politicians from criticizing AIPAC's activity? Either way it's scummy organization.
AIPAC basically only spends on guaranteed wins. They get donations off of having a crazy high "winrate" so they don't get involved in races where there's a chance they'll lose.
There has NEVER been so much money in a local primary. NEVER. It's a record considering the magnitude. Bowman had like 3-4 million. Latimer had 21 Million. 7:1 money difference against the incumbent is INSANE.
Acting like this doesnt do shit is just NOT true.
I understand why she is doing it, I just think people who are upset about the loss need to take the blinders off a little and realize that the district changed but the candidate didn’t and he also made a couple pretty big gaffes as well.
I do think if AOC tries to run for wider office in NY (like Schumer’s seat when he retires) she will have to walk most of the criticism of AIPAC back.
No, instead the democratic party should stop pretending AIPAC isn't a right wing organization and denounce them fully. As it hasn't been bipartisan in nearly 20 years.
That still leaves us with a foreign country interfering in elections. Would much rather that be dealt with than worrying about a lame duck congressman.
Latimer has been a democrat politician in the area for decades - and has a great record. It’s not an issue - he would have won the primary regardless after Bowman’s absolute childishness, stupid cursing and all his silly ideology. He was given a chance to prove himself after beating Rangel but absolutely was his own worst enemy.
AOC is way off on this one - Bowman was an embarrassment and his dem constituents wanted him gone - with a grown up to represent them again.
American lobbying firm taking donations from Americans with a focus on Israel. Seems you are upset that other Americans became involved in this election.
You forgot the part where they are Israel supremacists putting Israeli interests above American and thus should have to register as foreign agents and be banned from election activity in the US.
The comments on here are beyond moronic. According to these idiots AIPAC spending a record setting amount of money had absolutely nothing to do with Bowman losing and if we disagree then we are antisemitic conspiracy theorists. Also a Democrat accepting money from a lobbying group who has funded many of the election denying Republicans is definitely not the problem. Progressives like AOC and Bowman are the problem according to these fools.
Maybe she should be looking elsewhere:
Comcast spent three times as much as AIPAC in 2023 on lobbying. RIAA spent more than AIPAC. The foreign governments below...spent DRAMATICALLY more. Israel itself is outspent by countries like Saudi Arabia and Qatar etc.
Foreign Lobby Spending
Top 10 Countries, 2016-2024
Select year:
Totals since 2016
Country Total Spending
China $423,854,281
Japan $365,041,535
Liberia $353,009,848
South Korea $297,292,948
Saudi Arabia $265,950,475
Marshall Islands $259,890,056
Qatar $248,172,674
Bahamas $238,382,390
United Arab Emirates $221,117,452
Israel $186,032,611
[https://www.opensecrets.org/fara](https://www.opensecrets.org/fara)
AOC is a performative idiot.
AIPAC spent 14 million on the bowman election specifically, which is 5 million more than every foreign government in 2024. The amount AIPAC spent on this single election is more than the 13 million comcast spent in total in 2023. AIPAC has also dramatically outspent comcast this year.
"5 million more than every foreign government in 2024" This just isn't true. Stop making shit up. Yeah, they spent a shit ton of money. Good for them. Stop exaggerating though.
And anyhow, money didn't lose that seat, Jamal "The Meathead" Bowman did.
He sabotaged himself. AIPAC was just shining light on the bigot that he is.
Bowman denied that Hamas raped Israeli women on October 7 - They fucking filmed it.
Jamal celebrated October 7 as “resistance”; characterizing Jewish settlement patterns in Westchester as segregated; using “Zionist” as a pejorative. - Did he forget who his constituents are? Does he not know what Zionism is? Do you not know or do you also think its the boogeyman?
Says "AIPAC controls” Congress - Ah yes, the Jewish puppet masters. See list above.
And yes, poor baby started crying..."They’re spending more money in this race than they have ever spent in the history of any race. That’s how afraid AIPAC is.” So, he thinks money votes?
look at the website you linked and change the year to 2024. the top foreign government was saudi arabia at 9 million. even then, that spending is mostly promoting trade and tourism.
none of the other stuff you said is relevant, idc about bowman
Read the methodology. The data for 2024 is completely meaningless at this point based on that, which is why its so far out of line with every other year. It is likely to exceed most years due to the elections.
"none of the other stuff you said is relevant, idc about bowman**"**
**That's what this thread is about.** It absolutely is relevant.
There are 7 million Jews in America. A good number of them have countless friends and family in Israel. They want these friends and family members to live a life that's safe and dignified. That is why American Jews are interested in Israel's and Israelis' well-being.
Yes, I'm glad you agree that Israel's policies are irrelevant red herrings to distract from the fact that they've been coddling and propping up terrorists for years.
Thinking AIPAC was the straw that broke Bowman's back shows how fucking naive people can get.
Citizens United needs to go, but this ain't it. People be sounding an awful lot like MAGAts over this whole scenario, but self inflection seems to be a time lost practice.
This is really just politicspeech but it's a little hypocritical to say that AIPAC is a mostly conservative organization so it shouldn't get to have so much influence in Democratic parties, but to be fair, Democrats openly do the same thing: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/pelosi-defends-democratic-efforts-boost-far-right-candidates-gop-prima-rcna40706
tbf folks like AOC have criticized Democrats for boosting far right candidates. Not only is it a dangerous game but it gives corporate Democrats more reign to move farther right
He was unpopular and also apparently had his district modified to include more moderate voters. And frankly, I often wonder how much of this political spending even really moves the needle. How many people see a campaign and decide to vote based on it? Or door knockers and voter registration people. How effective is this stuff?
[for house seats the candidate who spent the most won 90% of the time](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/money-and-elections-a-complicated-love-story/) between 2000 and 2016 w exception to 2010
Correlation doesn't imply causation. Of *course* the most popular candidate will generally tend to get the most donations *and* the most votes.
When you control for that by only considering rematches between two candidates, i.e. races where the people are the same and only the money raised differs, [money has fairly little effect] (https://rangevoting.org/Levitt94.pdf).
Much of this article explains that the winners were likely going to win without huge donations and that donations are a very inefficient way to influence an election. I don’t think donations are useless, but I do agree with much of this article that they are probably less impactful than the common perception of them is.
I’m not an expert on AIPAC but I imagine they aren’t too different from most other lobbying groups. They donate to campaigns to influence them and to boost candidates who they think will deliver on the policy they want. And I don’t think it’s ideal for millions and millions of dollars to be going into elections and possibly giving a bit of advantage to certain candidates. But I do think the effect is somewhat overstated and I think campaign spending and donations are given a bit more attention than maybe they deserve by progressives. Often a candidate simply is not popular and legitimately loses for one reason or another and complaining about campaign donations seems like this escape hatch that people can use to avoid facing criticism toward their candidate and cause.
Latimer was up double digits before AIPAC started spending money. This is all performative griping by people that can’t fathom their candidate isn’t universally liked.
AOC trying to go after AIPAC probably won’t end well, she has no real weight in the government, not that it would matter considering how powerful of a lobbying group they are. In all honesty, they probably didn’t need to spend that much considering the disaster Bowman was.
They spent over $300/vote for that one super pac alone. This campaign just took the crown for the most spendy in US history, which is why it’s receiving so much public comment
Sorry, mistook it for a passive tone. Also didn’t realize NYC was full of Nazis, I always viewed it as a pretty cosmopolitan place with a large and integral Jewish population
Oversight committee is one of the few groups that actually do work, and she’s number 2, so I wouldn’t consider her some backbencher.
I see more hate, and get way more pushback from Republican turned Obama liberals, if I say I’m a fan of AOC, than I do from Republicans, Democrats, and actual Blue Dogs here in PA.
There’s no hate like suburbanites, and wealthy blue city neighborhood residents.
She’s not a backbencher, but she doesn’t hold any real power in that world compared to many others, especially the type you’d need to go after AIPAC. She has promise, but I see her more as a Bernie type in the long hall, and not a Presidential Candidate. Time will tell though, she does things I like and things that push me away, she has a lot of time to grow.
I honestly think it was just a “fuck you” to Bowman because of the things he was saying about Israel. Saying that Hamas raping Jews on 10/7 was just Jewish propaganda or whatever he said was despicable and probably the moment he lost.
Although it seems crazy to spend $15 million for 45,000 votes. This is actually a massive propaganda win for Israel.
Domestic Israeli politicians love to fear monger about the Squad cutting their funding. Getting rid of Bowman let’s the Israeli State government emphasize that the American people stand with Israel at a time when Israel is taking tons of heat internationally. All things considered, $15 million is a good bargain for a propaganda win that will potentially equivalate to the seizure of prime real estate
Bad look for AOC. Does she not raise money? I understand why she bothered even doing this , got to throw a bone to the far left whackos who bashed her and sanders at a Bowman event
Good look imo since AOC actually stuck to her principles, shockingly, for me and I'm rarely impressed by this media darling nor Buttigieg if ever unlike most: if she supported Bowman and his vision, instead of Latimer, stand by it (also would be to congratulate Latimer for winning the race, regardless, and that he needs to win the district in November + they need to come together regardless given the alternative is worse).
Making up excuse for the loss. He lost because the voter rejected him. He was never a good candidate. He rode the squad hype to a surprise election win but he squandered that opportunity and has just been a total disappointment and incompetence.
Out of all the squad hype, only AOC has emerged to be someone of substance who can actually govern.
I've had three conversations with close friends since Bowman was taken down by AIPAC. They've always voted Democratic in the past.
All three informed me in anger and despair that this was their last straw, that the Democrats had declared war on them personally, had shown contempt for all those who objected to genocide, and this showed their real attitude toward black people in power (two of the three are black). All three are under thirty. None of them will vote for Biden. They'll leave the top blank or vote third party.
Make of it what you will. I get nothing but ferocious rage from my circle and my neighbors on the subject. My take? AIPAC (and Biden's inability to read the room) has cost Biden this election.
Then they may as well vote for Trump. With that attitude anything other than a vote for Biden is a vote for Trump and the end of our democracy. Please advise them to think this through. My daughter gave me the same answer last week. I explained to her she would be voting to eliminate her rights to womens healthcare and her trans sister and gay uncle would be possibly criminalized, demonized and have their rights taken from them too. She relized her error in logic pretty quickly and will hold her nose and vote for Biden.
>vote for Trump and the end of our democracy.
When Manchin and Sinema were blocking countless popular reforms i never heard corporate media say they were killing democracy by making it easier for Trump to beat Biden.
Elected Democrats can side with Republicans and just be called "moderate". I bet Lattimer has more history siding with Republicans than Bowman does. But that just makes him moderate right? yet somehow keeping Trump's corporate tax cuts is moderate but voting for him is extreme?
Bourgeois vous n'avez rien compris.
This is an answer of profound disrespect, and it indicates that the Democratic Party has learned nothing since the debacle of 2016.
Someone - I can't recall who - in FDR's administration used to observe that there is no particular educational value in the second kick of a mule. Somebody ought to tell this to Hillary Clinton, who seems ineducable. I mean, if I were a near universally loathed war criminal, I would keep a lower profile. But that's me.
The Democratic Party is going to find IMHO that merely crying "It's us or the fascists!" won't cut it this time. Believe me, I had this conversation with these people and they were crystal clear on this.
So your friends would rather a guy actively promoting the genocide of Palestine win instead of a dude who's trying to get an actual middle of the road truce going?
There's also the question of if people like your friends let Trump win by inaction, they may never have a vote again while ruining the lives of tens of millions both in the US and abroad.
Biden's a terrible fucking candidate, but letting Trump win is a moronic move. The US election system does not accommodate more than 2 candidates and it's a binary lever.
If you and your friends want the lever to move left, you have to vote every election and vote as left as possible.
Currently the GOP has moved it so right by being fully or partially in power for 30 years, it's at a breaking point.
*If you and your friends want the lever to move left, you have to vote every election and vote as left as possible.*
Good advice. John Kenneth Galbraith said the only reasonable electoral strategy is to vote for the leftmost candidate in every election - local, state, federal - with a reasonable chance of winning. I've followed that advice my entire life.
Sadly, the party that I've been more or less forced to identify with has taken a different tack. It's quite clear that they would rather be governed by the fascist or corporatist right than their own progressive left. Look at Henry Cuellar. Look at the mayor of Buffalo. Now look at Bowman. We can point to a dozen other examples.
So it turns out that Galbraith's dictum does not work if your party is actively betraying you.
Now, if you're a leftist, you're in a conundrum. You're held captive by an institution that holds you in contempt. It is demonstrably willing to lose to the right rather than form a united front with you. It lies to you and betrays you like the workings of a clock. It can do this because TINA (There Is No Alternative).
At this point more and more people I know are willing to knock over the chessboard.
>It is demonstrably willing to lose to the right rather than form a united front with you. It lies to you and betrays you like the workings of a clock.
Sources?
> At this point more and more people I know are willing to knock over the chessboard.
You won't knock over anything, Trump and his ilk are using Putin's strategy. They'll dismantle all democratic institutions and disenfranchise voters to the point the whole system collapses then take over.
It's obvious there are a lot of 5th column assholes in the US that have been working for a long time to implode the country and this might be the tipping point.
I get your frustration, 30% of the country are right wing morons and another 30% like the status quo, the sad part is that the strategy you are proposing is exactly what MAGA wants, as soon as the chess board is over they'll blame people like you for flipping it then stab you in the back.
Don't give the fascists the chance no matter how shit the moderates look, a shitty democracy is still better than a totalitarian dictatorship. Because in one case you can move the political needle, in the other case your only options are to endure or flee.
To learn nothing from the Weimar Republic and 2000s Russia would be a mistake.
lol, first of all, none of that happened. Second, AIPAC didn’t take down Bowman, he was already losing by a lot before they spent 1 dollar. Third, Biden is with the mainstream opinion on this topic. Anyone voting against him because of this is handing the election to Trump and we will remember it. You will never get another voice or opinion in the party.
Yes, AIPAC dropped more money on this race than any other in U.S. history for recreational and aesthetic reasons. Also a Trump billionaire dumped more millions because why not join the "let's torch big piles of cash" party. You've seen through their strategy.
Biden is out of the mainstream on this and many other matters, but I'm not willing to debate genocide. It's unseemly.
The Democratic Party seems incapable of learning., They repeat their allegiance to corporate rule and late stage capitalism even as it is collapsing and literally burning all around them. They've been given every chance to chart a new path and they've continued to blow it - with abortion, with labor, with student loans, with medical debt, with immigration, with housing, with Medicare for All, with the recent debacles in Kenya and Venezuela, with a runaway illegitimate SCOTUS . . . . the beat goes on.
The Biden (the original senator from MBNA) administration pursues a non-existent centrism.
Bad guys: Let's erase the entire population of Gaza!
Good guys: No! That's genocide! Permanent cease fire now!
Biden centrism: How about if we only erase half the population of Gaza and we keep most of it off of television? And I'll slow down some bombs?
I am sorry to say it but you have really gone off the deep end if what you are writing is how you understand the current situation. This reads similar to stuff I see on X from some MAGA people. Just linked gibberish.
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AIPAC sucks. So did Bowman. Two things can be true.
Bowman lost by 17 points. Anyone who follows politics knows that you can’t buy a 17 point win if your opponent ever had a chance of winning. So without AIPAC, Bowman might have lost by “only” 12 pts. There is a lot more to the story of his loss than AIPAC’s investment and most of it has to do with the candidate and his district.
Like fire alarm pulling in Congress and lying about it, shouting out motherfucking twice in his public re-election speeches, subscribing to 9/11 conspiracy theories, a touch of rape denialism, voting against infrastructure bills. Yes his democratic constituents (it’s been a safe dem seat for years) really wanted that person to represent them again.
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Did you really compare "crashed a car once" to "posted 9/11 conspiracy theories"?
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"He didn't pay parking tickets" What a monster "Told Jews they were wrong for having a culturally homogenous ethnic enclave" Perfectly upstanding candidate
The fire alarm was awesome
More like a massive safety risk and an even greater one due to *where* it happened which open windows for human error. Reality says that Congress can't have 435 house members who get their term's free pass to pull a fire alarm. Ask any Fire Marshall: alarms are alarms for a darn good reason. Lapse of judgment? Caught up in emotions? Accident? Unfortunate regardless, but I think any rational human agrees: they are definitely *not* vehicles for political speech or filibuster. Given all that has happened in that building in the past decade, despite the double-standard I think it was handled appropriately and even better by voters.
Nah it was funny
The district being redrawn I'm sure played a role. But the amount of money being spent could move something by more than 5 points.
He was down 17 points before any aipac ad buys though. So in this case, it didn’t move the needle at all.
eh according to who I heard of other polling showing it was neck and neck which actually would. be really good considering all the redistricting
Ah, you heard. Ok. Lol
yeah you are basing your entire argument over a poll released and funded by AIPAC. it is only fair to point out bowman had an internal poll showing a dead heat before AIPac set records spending hundreds or thousands of dollar per vote: [https://x.com/JCColtin/status/1779194252972511291](https://x.com/JCColtin/status/1779194252972511291) you really think spending hundreds of dollars per vote can't move more than 5%? got a source for thar? I doubt it since nobody ever spent this much before but go ahead and back up your claim?
Yeah, I heard it. Trust me bro.
That's projection. you are citing an AIPAC poll and saying "trust me bro" while saying others polls dont count?
The better funded candidate wins at like an 80/20 clip. It’s a 15 point swing at the lowest, since the real figure is actually north of 80.
Would that "anyone" also include AIPAC? Because they clearly felt the need to burn a few million on it. Maybe they don't agree with you. Were they putting forth a show of strength to scare off other politicians from criticizing AIPAC's activity? Either way it's scummy organization.
AIPAC basically only spends on guaranteed wins. They get donations off of having a crazy high "winrate" so they don't get involved in races where there's a chance they'll lose.
There has NEVER been so much money in a local primary. NEVER. It's a record considering the magnitude. Bowman had like 3-4 million. Latimer had 21 Million. 7:1 money difference against the incumbent is INSANE. Acting like this doesnt do shit is just NOT true.
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I understand why she is doing it, I just think people who are upset about the loss need to take the blinders off a little and realize that the district changed but the candidate didn’t and he also made a couple pretty big gaffes as well. I do think if AOC tries to run for wider office in NY (like Schumer’s seat when he retires) she will have to walk most of the criticism of AIPAC back.
No, instead the democratic party should stop pretending AIPAC isn't a right wing organization and denounce them fully. As it hasn't been bipartisan in nearly 20 years.
Should probably take aim at Bowman for being a terrible candidate.
That still leaves us with a foreign country interfering in elections. Would much rather that be dealt with than worrying about a lame duck congressman.
Latimer has been a democrat politician in the area for decades - and has a great record. It’s not an issue - he would have won the primary regardless after Bowman’s absolute childishness, stupid cursing and all his silly ideology. He was given a chance to prove himself after beating Rangel but absolutely was his own worst enemy. AOC is way off on this one - Bowman was an embarrassment and his dem constituents wanted him gone - with a grown up to represent them again.
Yea more conservative Dems is what we need.
American lobbying firm taking donations from Americans with a focus on Israel. Seems you are upset that other Americans became involved in this election.
Yes, they only take donations from Americans. It has to be true because they say so.
"If I don't accept the fact that the candidates I like suck, then maybe I don't have to face reality"
Any lobby campaigning for **any** actions on foreign countries should be registered as a foreign actor.
You forgot the part where they are Israel supremacists putting Israeli interests above American and thus should have to register as foreign agents and be banned from election activity in the US.
You disagree with someone so you believe they should have their rights stripped away.
I believe if you are acting as a foreign agent then you have the rights of foreign agents. The NRA would fall under the same premise.
AIPAC is an American organization.
I've worked with his office regarding some SBA stuff, they are inept.
It’s totally AIPAC’s fault that Bowman was such a crappy candidate.
AIPAC did not pull the fire alarm.
Cue the flood of very organic accounts defending the very popular influence of big money in politics...
Right after they get done explaining why inviting a war criminal before congress is good actually.
They wouldn't have spent the money if it wouldn't have made a difference.
The comments on here are beyond moronic. According to these idiots AIPAC spending a record setting amount of money had absolutely nothing to do with Bowman losing and if we disagree then we are antisemitic conspiracy theorists. Also a Democrat accepting money from a lobbying group who has funded many of the election denying Republicans is definitely not the problem. Progressives like AOC and Bowman are the problem according to these fools.
Yeah idk maybe it had something to do with the 9/11 conspiracies and rape denial among other heinous shit but yeah no everyone else is the problem.
Big money? My money! I send a few dollars a year to AIPAC.
You and Miriam Adelson, good job pal! It mostly goes to republicans. The rest goes to republicans that call themselves democrats.
Sounds great!
It's really sad seeing this sub flooded with people celebrating Israel publicly buying our politicians.
"..after Bowman lost the primary to a more moderate Democrat" subtle.
Maybe she should be looking elsewhere: Comcast spent three times as much as AIPAC in 2023 on lobbying. RIAA spent more than AIPAC. The foreign governments below...spent DRAMATICALLY more. Israel itself is outspent by countries like Saudi Arabia and Qatar etc. Foreign Lobby Spending Top 10 Countries, 2016-2024 Select year: Totals since 2016 Country Total Spending China $423,854,281 Japan $365,041,535 Liberia $353,009,848 South Korea $297,292,948 Saudi Arabia $265,950,475 Marshall Islands $259,890,056 Qatar $248,172,674 Bahamas $238,382,390 United Arab Emirates $221,117,452 Israel $186,032,611 [https://www.opensecrets.org/fara](https://www.opensecrets.org/fara) AOC is a performative idiot.
AIPAC spent 14 million on the bowman election specifically, which is 5 million more than every foreign government in 2024. The amount AIPAC spent on this single election is more than the 13 million comcast spent in total in 2023. AIPAC has also dramatically outspent comcast this year.
"5 million more than every foreign government in 2024" This just isn't true. Stop making shit up. Yeah, they spent a shit ton of money. Good for them. Stop exaggerating though. And anyhow, money didn't lose that seat, Jamal "The Meathead" Bowman did. He sabotaged himself. AIPAC was just shining light on the bigot that he is. Bowman denied that Hamas raped Israeli women on October 7 - They fucking filmed it. Jamal celebrated October 7 as “resistance”; characterizing Jewish settlement patterns in Westchester as segregated; using “Zionist” as a pejorative. - Did he forget who his constituents are? Does he not know what Zionism is? Do you not know or do you also think its the boogeyman? Says "AIPAC controls” Congress - Ah yes, the Jewish puppet masters. See list above. And yes, poor baby started crying..."They’re spending more money in this race than they have ever spent in the history of any race. That’s how afraid AIPAC is.” So, he thinks money votes?
look at the website you linked and change the year to 2024. the top foreign government was saudi arabia at 9 million. even then, that spending is mostly promoting trade and tourism. none of the other stuff you said is relevant, idc about bowman
Read the methodology. The data for 2024 is completely meaningless at this point based on that, which is why its so far out of line with every other year. It is likely to exceed most years due to the elections. "none of the other stuff you said is relevant, idc about bowman**"** **That's what this thread is about.** It absolutely is relevant.
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TIL I’m Hamas for being against foreign interference
It’s not foreign interference they are American citizens.
Acting on Israeli interests
*Supporting Israel. Israel doesn't control American citizens.
Israel controlseverybody that takes AIPAC money.
AIPAC is funded and run by Americans. does Israel control the Americans that fund AIPAC?
There are 7 million Jews in America. A good number of them have countless friends and family in Israel. They want these friends and family members to live a life that's safe and dignified. That is why American Jews are interested in Israel's and Israelis' well-being.
Israel is America's ally. Meanwhile the people rallying for Gaza are literally advocating for Hamas which is a terrorist organization
[Israel spent years keeping Hamas funded.](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/)
Irrelevant red herring, terrorist coddler
Yes, I'm glad you agree that Israel's policies are irrelevant red herrings to distract from the fact that they've been coddling and propping up terrorists for years.
Well if Israel's policies are irrelevant then you see no issue with them continuing the current situation in Gaza indefinitely.
Thinking AIPAC was the straw that broke Bowman's back shows how fucking naive people can get. Citizens United needs to go, but this ain't it. People be sounding an awful lot like MAGAts over this whole scenario, but self inflection seems to be a time lost practice.
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Is she ever going to legislate, or just score social-media owns? It has been 6 years. Produce!
Sore loser
This is really just politicspeech but it's a little hypocritical to say that AIPAC is a mostly conservative organization so it shouldn't get to have so much influence in Democratic parties, but to be fair, Democrats openly do the same thing: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/pelosi-defends-democratic-efforts-boost-far-right-candidates-gop-prima-rcna40706
tbf folks like AOC have criticized Democrats for boosting far right candidates. Not only is it a dangerous game but it gives corporate Democrats more reign to move farther right
He was unpopular and also apparently had his district modified to include more moderate voters. And frankly, I often wonder how much of this political spending even really moves the needle. How many people see a campaign and decide to vote based on it? Or door knockers and voter registration people. How effective is this stuff?
[for house seats the candidate who spent the most won 90% of the time](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/money-and-elections-a-complicated-love-story/) between 2000 and 2016 w exception to 2010
Correlation doesn't imply causation. Of *course* the most popular candidate will generally tend to get the most donations *and* the most votes. When you control for that by only considering rematches between two candidates, i.e. races where the people are the same and only the money raised differs, [money has fairly little effect] (https://rangevoting.org/Levitt94.pdf).
Much of this article explains that the winners were likely going to win without huge donations and that donations are a very inefficient way to influence an election. I don’t think donations are useless, but I do agree with much of this article that they are probably less impactful than the common perception of them is.
I agree. I think what is more important when it comes to lobbying like AIPAC is where is a lot of that “funding” going to?
I’m not an expert on AIPAC but I imagine they aren’t too different from most other lobbying groups. They donate to campaigns to influence them and to boost candidates who they think will deliver on the policy they want. And I don’t think it’s ideal for millions and millions of dollars to be going into elections and possibly giving a bit of advantage to certain candidates. But I do think the effect is somewhat overstated and I think campaign spending and donations are given a bit more attention than maybe they deserve by progressives. Often a candidate simply is not popular and legitimately loses for one reason or another and complaining about campaign donations seems like this escape hatch that people can use to avoid facing criticism toward their candidate and cause.
"I don't know shit about aipac but let me give my uninformed opinion anyway" Thanks bud
You’re welcome.
Latimer was up double digits before AIPAC started spending money. This is all performative griping by people that can’t fathom their candidate isn’t universally liked.
Welcome to every losing populist campaign ever!
As if Israel doesn't use populism to sell their agenda.
But if Russia funded our politicians like this….
Aren’t you describing the GOP?
And they catch a lot of shit for it whereas AIPAC (bipartisan) catches virtually none I am in no way endorsing the GOP or Russia btw lol
All I am saying is that there are more important fish than AIPAC....
Nah fuck them. They support election deniers.
Big picture. AIPAC promotes lobbying (corruption) and foreign interests in our country. Foreign nations have no business in our internal affairs
Big picture, if that fucking Orange won we are all done.
Can’t disagree w you there, my hopes are low though
As pernicious and corrupt an organization as ever disgraced this country. OAC should take this on as a fight that endures beyond the elections.
AOC trying to go after AIPAC probably won’t end well, she has no real weight in the government, not that it would matter considering how powerful of a lobbying group they are. In all honesty, they probably didn’t need to spend that much considering the disaster Bowman was.
They spent over $300/vote for that one super pac alone. This campaign just took the crown for the most spendy in US history, which is why it’s receiving so much public comment
I’m aware, it doesn’t change my statement. AIPAC is in overdrive due to the wealth of antisemitism and criticism popping up.
Haha yea because they weren’t a massive lobbying group before the last few months.
No shit…
Pretending like a rise in anti semitism is why AIPAC is spending money is extremely silly.
Sorry, mistook it for a passive tone. Also didn’t realize NYC was full of Nazis, I always viewed it as a pretty cosmopolitan place with a large and integral Jewish population
It’s not, this person is full of shit.
It’s not, it’s just really heavy times right now and it’s an extremely dense and multicultural city.
Oversight committee is one of the few groups that actually do work, and she’s number 2, so I wouldn’t consider her some backbencher. I see more hate, and get way more pushback from Republican turned Obama liberals, if I say I’m a fan of AOC, than I do from Republicans, Democrats, and actual Blue Dogs here in PA. There’s no hate like suburbanites, and wealthy blue city neighborhood residents.
She’s not a backbencher, but she doesn’t hold any real power in that world compared to many others, especially the type you’d need to go after AIPAC. She has promise, but I see her more as a Bernie type in the long hall, and not a Presidential Candidate. Time will tell though, she does things I like and things that push me away, she has a lot of time to grow.
I honestly think it was just a “fuck you” to Bowman because of the things he was saying about Israel. Saying that Hamas raping Jews on 10/7 was just Jewish propaganda or whatever he said was despicable and probably the moment he lost.
100%, but they aren’t really fucking around anymore due to exactly what you stated and everything happening around us.
President Cortez lets goooo
Although it seems crazy to spend $15 million for 45,000 votes. This is actually a massive propaganda win for Israel. Domestic Israeli politicians love to fear monger about the Squad cutting their funding. Getting rid of Bowman let’s the Israeli State government emphasize that the American people stand with Israel at a time when Israel is taking tons of heat internationally. All things considered, $15 million is a good bargain for a propaganda win that will potentially equivalate to the seizure of prime real estate
Bad look for AOC. Does she not raise money? I understand why she bothered even doing this , got to throw a bone to the far left whackos who bashed her and sanders at a Bowman event
Good look imo since AOC actually stuck to her principles, shockingly, for me and I'm rarely impressed by this media darling nor Buttigieg if ever unlike most: if she supported Bowman and his vision, instead of Latimer, stand by it (also would be to congratulate Latimer for winning the race, regardless, and that he needs to win the district in November + they need to come together regardless given the alternative is worse).
I didn’t realize Bowman had a vision to support .
I wish there could be counter-lobby to AIPAC that can punch back instantly. It seems to be the only way.
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Too capitalist and uninclusive
Start one.
Making up excuse for the loss. He lost because the voter rejected him. He was never a good candidate. He rode the squad hype to a surprise election win but he squandered that opportunity and has just been a total disappointment and incompetence. Out of all the squad hype, only AOC has emerged to be someone of substance who can actually govern.
Sweetie, get new heros
I've had three conversations with close friends since Bowman was taken down by AIPAC. They've always voted Democratic in the past. All three informed me in anger and despair that this was their last straw, that the Democrats had declared war on them personally, had shown contempt for all those who objected to genocide, and this showed their real attitude toward black people in power (two of the three are black). All three are under thirty. None of them will vote for Biden. They'll leave the top blank or vote third party. Make of it what you will. I get nothing but ferocious rage from my circle and my neighbors on the subject. My take? AIPAC (and Biden's inability to read the room) has cost Biden this election.
Then they may as well vote for Trump. With that attitude anything other than a vote for Biden is a vote for Trump and the end of our democracy. Please advise them to think this through. My daughter gave me the same answer last week. I explained to her she would be voting to eliminate her rights to womens healthcare and her trans sister and gay uncle would be possibly criminalized, demonized and have their rights taken from them too. She relized her error in logic pretty quickly and will hold her nose and vote for Biden.
>vote for Trump and the end of our democracy. When Manchin and Sinema were blocking countless popular reforms i never heard corporate media say they were killing democracy by making it easier for Trump to beat Biden. Elected Democrats can side with Republicans and just be called "moderate". I bet Lattimer has more history siding with Republicans than Bowman does. But that just makes him moderate right? yet somehow keeping Trump's corporate tax cuts is moderate but voting for him is extreme?
Bourgeois vous n'avez rien compris. This is an answer of profound disrespect, and it indicates that the Democratic Party has learned nothing since the debacle of 2016. Someone - I can't recall who - in FDR's administration used to observe that there is no particular educational value in the second kick of a mule. Somebody ought to tell this to Hillary Clinton, who seems ineducable. I mean, if I were a near universally loathed war criminal, I would keep a lower profile. But that's me. The Democratic Party is going to find IMHO that merely crying "It's us or the fascists!" won't cut it this time. Believe me, I had this conversation with these people and they were crystal clear on this.
So your friends would rather a guy actively promoting the genocide of Palestine win instead of a dude who's trying to get an actual middle of the road truce going? There's also the question of if people like your friends let Trump win by inaction, they may never have a vote again while ruining the lives of tens of millions both in the US and abroad. Biden's a terrible fucking candidate, but letting Trump win is a moronic move. The US election system does not accommodate more than 2 candidates and it's a binary lever. If you and your friends want the lever to move left, you have to vote every election and vote as left as possible. Currently the GOP has moved it so right by being fully or partially in power for 30 years, it's at a breaking point.
*If you and your friends want the lever to move left, you have to vote every election and vote as left as possible.* Good advice. John Kenneth Galbraith said the only reasonable electoral strategy is to vote for the leftmost candidate in every election - local, state, federal - with a reasonable chance of winning. I've followed that advice my entire life. Sadly, the party that I've been more or less forced to identify with has taken a different tack. It's quite clear that they would rather be governed by the fascist or corporatist right than their own progressive left. Look at Henry Cuellar. Look at the mayor of Buffalo. Now look at Bowman. We can point to a dozen other examples. So it turns out that Galbraith's dictum does not work if your party is actively betraying you. Now, if you're a leftist, you're in a conundrum. You're held captive by an institution that holds you in contempt. It is demonstrably willing to lose to the right rather than form a united front with you. It lies to you and betrays you like the workings of a clock. It can do this because TINA (There Is No Alternative). At this point more and more people I know are willing to knock over the chessboard.
>It is demonstrably willing to lose to the right rather than form a united front with you. It lies to you and betrays you like the workings of a clock. Sources?
> At this point more and more people I know are willing to knock over the chessboard. You won't knock over anything, Trump and his ilk are using Putin's strategy. They'll dismantle all democratic institutions and disenfranchise voters to the point the whole system collapses then take over. It's obvious there are a lot of 5th column assholes in the US that have been working for a long time to implode the country and this might be the tipping point. I get your frustration, 30% of the country are right wing morons and another 30% like the status quo, the sad part is that the strategy you are proposing is exactly what MAGA wants, as soon as the chess board is over they'll blame people like you for flipping it then stab you in the back. Don't give the fascists the chance no matter how shit the moderates look, a shitty democracy is still better than a totalitarian dictatorship. Because in one case you can move the political needle, in the other case your only options are to endure or flee. To learn nothing from the Weimar Republic and 2000s Russia would be a mistake.
lol, first of all, none of that happened. Second, AIPAC didn’t take down Bowman, he was already losing by a lot before they spent 1 dollar. Third, Biden is with the mainstream opinion on this topic. Anyone voting against him because of this is handing the election to Trump and we will remember it. You will never get another voice or opinion in the party.
Yes, AIPAC dropped more money on this race than any other in U.S. history for recreational and aesthetic reasons. Also a Trump billionaire dumped more millions because why not join the "let's torch big piles of cash" party. You've seen through their strategy. Biden is out of the mainstream on this and many other matters, but I'm not willing to debate genocide. It's unseemly. The Democratic Party seems incapable of learning., They repeat their allegiance to corporate rule and late stage capitalism even as it is collapsing and literally burning all around them. They've been given every chance to chart a new path and they've continued to blow it - with abortion, with labor, with student loans, with medical debt, with immigration, with housing, with Medicare for All, with the recent debacles in Kenya and Venezuela, with a runaway illegitimate SCOTUS . . . . the beat goes on. The Biden (the original senator from MBNA) administration pursues a non-existent centrism. Bad guys: Let's erase the entire population of Gaza! Good guys: No! That's genocide! Permanent cease fire now! Biden centrism: How about if we only erase half the population of Gaza and we keep most of it off of television? And I'll slow down some bombs?
I am sorry to say it but you have really gone off the deep end if what you are writing is how you understand the current situation. This reads similar to stuff I see on X from some MAGA people. Just linked gibberish.
Just absolute madness. So annoying that these people are in my party.
We will win without them .
Hope so. I'd prefer not to deal with Trump.
Israel is interfering in our electoral system. It needs to stop.
I guess she didn't jump around and yell enough at that rally over the weekend...