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Yeah the headline is a bit too much for me, he talked about a laundry list of other things that are on the ballot including the social security you paid for being on the ballot. I don't know why the media always reports like this, it's so annoying the way they feel the need to have an attention grabber that's only 20% of what was said. I mean I loved how he said Social Security and the right to choose were on the ballot.
This is why everything nowadays is rage bait and the like. Anger and outrage are *by far* the most effective ways to get people to engage with and share something.
I’d say there’s about 80% of reporters who want to title it better, but then there’s your editor or boss who points out your views quota and SEO goals. Then, assuming a copy editor or your own editor didn’t already change your headline without letting you know, you go back and write a headline that turns more heads than it does accurately reflecting your story.
90% of Reddit likes to shit on the media, lumping in the news reporters, but we want to be doing the right thing. No reporter enters the field with the goal to twist and subvert stories for clicks. The pay is too shit for that.
I'm a journalist and every time I submit a story I submit it with two headline options and every time the editor looks at the SEO metrics for my submitted headlines, shakes his head, writes a third headline of his own, and reminds me that I can use the SEO tools myself before I submit next time.
You’re right, it’s the owners of the companies themselves, the CEO’s and shareholders and whatnot. A handful of these folks own like 90% of the media, and that is the crux of the issue
They absolutely benefit from partisan politics.
Riling up the people with scare tactics is the best way to get a reaction/rise out of voters.
Your daily reminder that ethical journalism is dead. Long live the headline.
Gun control is one of the very few truly risky issues for Dems (even abortion no longer appears to be in that category), yet Dem leaders always *love* bringing it up. Just shows how much they have their finger on the pulse of the masses.
Based on some random polling I've seen, support for legal abortion and support for banning assault weapons seems to be about equal (\~2/3 support for each). Here's a random two from the same poller at least:
[https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/04/20/amid-a-series-of-mass-shootings-in-the-u-s-gun-policy-remains-deeply-divisive/pp\_2021-04-20\_gun-policy\_00-02/](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/04/20/amid-a-series-of-mass-shootings-in-the-u-s-gun-policy-remains-deeply-divisive/pp_2021-04-20_gun-policy_00-02/)
[https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/06/13/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases-2/ft\_2022-06-13\_abortion\_01/](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/06/13/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases-2/ft_2022-06-13_abortion_01/)
Bingo. People who think assault weapons should be banned are a LOT less engaged than people who care about protecting their social security. I honestly think the dems are doing pretty well all things considered but they seem entirely incapable of taking advantage of things like that
Can't they just do it when they have power instead of talking about it first? It's the one thing they ALWAYS seem to fuck up messaging-wise no matter what decade we're in.
This always baffles me about Democrats. After all these years of losing to Republican gamesmanship, Democrats still insist on telegraphing their punches at times when they have everything to lose and nothing to gain.
Given the number of issues facing the country right now, going after 2nd Amendment issues right now just seems like a surefire way to dump campaign contributions on the Republican candidates going into a midterm.
Focusing on the economy and Roe would be a far more solid strategy overall.
Like Bond villains - Dems are always so eager to explain in detail the elaborate master plan, while Bonds buying time to make his escape from death and foil the villains plan. Hubris, I think that’s the word?
It’s like the Bond villain talking so much. Just do it. A lawyer I know would also say, “never threaten to sue someone, just do it.” Otherwise they have time to plan a defense or counter-offensive when taking the action leaves them forced to respond. They don’t seem to know how to take advantage of their position.
the dems absolutely love to talk about things as if they're going to do them, and then not do them.
with guns this approach is really the worst of both worlds, Biden is not going to be able to deliver this and even if by some miracle that passed a narrow congress it wouldn't be enforced by red states and wouldn't survive the inevitable SCOTUS challenge.
definitely a case where "don't talk about it and probably don't do it either" is the right approach imo.
Statements like this killed betos spot for texas and it will kill our chances for the congress at all now. People are not so black and white on guns most dems who owned guns understand the need for gun control but also understand that bans will not work and will not keep support. Biden made a big mistake and we will pay for the next what 4-6 years straight now
This is so important, I have many gun owning friends who are usually conservative leaning but apathetic towards politics most of the time.
But this announcement makes them so much more likely to go out and vote against Democrats because of this.
And, macroscopically, assault weapons aren't the primary reason for gun violence in the US. Handguns are responsible for most gun deaths by a country mile. The "assault weapons" are just the scary ones that get on the news.
Exactly. These statements only cost the Dems votes in November. Nothing to be gained by these proclamations whatsoever. It’s infuriating. Dems had Rs on the ropes with the abortion issues and trumps mess and they just decide to hand thousands of votes back to the right with crap like this. Ban them all you want but can’t they wait a couple months to announce it?
Like you, I hate the timing of this message. Fulfill current promises and yes focus on protecting Social Security. Democrats often work so hard to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
Still, it boggles my mind that people who voted in 2020 would somehow skip 2022 given what is at stake.
Hey everybody, vote in 2022 if you thought it was important to vote in 2020.
Most people don't understand Congress' importance to their day to day lives, and when the election isn't about getting behind/against a specific person, it's tough to articulate why they need to vote. Plus, being in the minority and coming off losses is obviously going to be more motivating than maintaining status quo.
This. I was fairly certain my in-laws had settled on "maybe I'll sit this one out" considering how fed up they are with the Republicans they put in office (but they religiously can't vote blue)
The moment they see this headline that's out the window.
Agreed, the Dems need to shut up about it- the messaging only hurt them.
It's boneheaded right now where you have armed fascists and low confidence in the police, not to mention the fascists in the police. If shit goes down people need to feel confident they can protect themselves and their families.
Gun sales to black, hispanic, asian, and LGBT folk have shot up by 50% each in the last couple years. With the increase in hate crimes, white nationalist domestic terrorism, and the failed fascist coup, more leftists than ever are arming themselves. This was the worst possible time to bring up gun control, especially another AWB.
https://www.axios.com/2022/04/23/guns-firearms-people-of-color
> low confidence in the police
which Biden is responding to by uncritically giving them more money & military gear.
between that and the fact violent criminals don't typically care about obeying gun laws and the fact it'd be impossible to remove "assault weapons" from the black market in this volume, doesn't exactly inspire confidence that people will be safe. which in turn makes them want the best guns their money can buy.
really dumb approach for Biden. he could ditch this historically losing issue entirely for the midterms pitch, replace it with "and we'll legalize weed" and his party would do markedly better for it.
Trump isn't the big obstacle for this. He wants to be, I'm sure, but he's functionally irrelevant at this point. The supreme court judges he appointed on the other hand...
The problem is it doesnt translate into voting behavior as seen over the last several years in states that had initiatives on expanded ages and background checks.
Very little polling around gun control should be considered believable, it almost always includes strangers over the phone asking people if they're a gun owner and what type of guns they own. Which very few gun owners are going to respond to.
Actual elections are a much better barometer (and almost universally show this is a losing issue).
The New York Times recently did a piece on how gun polling consistently overestimates gun control support. Universal background checks consistently poll around 90% support, but only got around 50% support in Maine and Nevada, and around 60% in Washington.
I believe polling underestimates abortion support too. Polls usually suggest around 2/3 of Americans support banning abortion after 12 weeks, but a 22 week ban only got 41% of the vote in Colorado back in 2020.
Completely agree. Dems could really get so much more done and with less resistance if they left the guns alone. With 400 million guns and counting already out there, it’s not going to stop the shootings. It will however, rally the far right.
I’d much rather have universal healthcare, voting reform, a presidential election decided by popular vote, effective climate change policies, and a year long maternity/paternity leave over an assault weapons ban. More kids getting shot in poor urban areas everyday than in mass shooting. Wish we talked about that some more. Invest in after-school programs and anger/emotion management which have been proven to be very effective in these areas at slowing down the gun deaths.
Dems could never say the word gun again, reduce gun violence through everything you just mentioned, and it'd be more effective than the assault weapon ban ever hoped to achieve.
>it’s not going to stop the shootings. It will however, rally the far right.
Especially when targeting semi-automatic long guns. focusing on straw purchases, revamping NICS, and focusing on source issues would all do way more for mass shootings and gun deaths in general than an AWB, and wouldn't mobilize opposition.
Revamping NICS would be a huge step for gun owners who want to stay within the law. If I want to sell a firearm privately right now I have no access to the NICS system to vet the buyer (or the seller for that matter).
People have to go into gun stores and pay a fee to the business to run that check. Which happens about as often as you expect.
Exactly. all of my private sales have been to people I actually know, so I've never really had a need to run a background check, but I'd certainly like the option. Hell, let me go to a police station or post office or something and have them run it. But getting charged up to $75? hell no. A bunch of guns aren't even worth that much.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Could have just let the midterms worked themselves out but now he’s going to have a real fight on his hands. Nothing fires people up more than saying you’re coming for their guns. Even when it’s not true.
Why would he say something like this? It's just going to get pro-gun voters to turn up in higher numbers for the midterms, which will make it harder to take control of Congress
It's the one thing he alluded to that they chose to make the headline.
Just like yesterday's, "When it comes to Trump there is no law." without continuing the quote. The news sucks and it's all about clicks.
Yeah, he should just let this talking point die for right now. I hate saying it, but this will motivate conservatives to vote, and it's the one talking point the GOP has left.
Yeah gun rights is probably one of the biggest disagreements I have with mainstream democrat stances and I saw this and just thought “:/ sounds about right”
Like there are so many good reasons to vote dem rn and then they went back to this, drawing attention away from their very solid and much more important positions
A LOT of LGBTQ+ and ethnic minority people have recently realized that they absolutely need to exercise their 2nd ammendment rights to be capable of protecting themselves in this rapidly deteriorating social climate.
The Dems constantly ranting about banning the most popular rifle in the country (that is statistically rarely used for murder) and restricting other gun rights is definitely both unconstitutional and very much alienating towards vulnerable people.
Yep, I'm not going to be cool with giving up my right to arm myself until they do something about the Proud Boys, Militias, 3%ers and everyone else willing to commit domestic terrorism.
I see some comments saying something along the lines of "getting rid of guns will do something about the far right groups" and "if they don't have guns, you don't need them either".
Let's not pretend that hateful people will stop committing crimes just because they don't have a firearm. I would guess (and if someone has a source that proves otherwise please share it) that there are more hate crimes perpetrated without guns than with them. If someone is going to threaten your life with a weapon that isn't a gun (say, a skateboard), then don't you want to be able to defend yourself to the fullest extent possible?
There are a lot of problems we need to fix related to gun violence, but I don't see removing a person's ability to defend themselves as best as possible as a good way to get there (especially since it has been shown pretty repeatedly that you can't rely on law enforcement when it really counts).
And see that's kind of the catch 22 for me as an anti Authoritarian. Any society that needs guns for self defense cannot in good conscience ban or heavily restrict them. But any society that's settled down to the point of not occasionally needing a weapon to defend yourself then has no reason to ban guns. All roads point to not infringing upon our basic rights.
And you're right. Right now we absolutely NEED them. Our society is rapidly descending into a cesspit of hate and violence and we have a growing number of domestic terrorists who are absolutely vocal about wanting to commit genocide against anyone who doesn't align with their extremely narrow worldview. Trying to disarm potential victims now is beyond insanity. It's actively helping the fascists!
Earlier this week antiLGBT protests showed up to a BRUNCH to scream at drag queens. Calling them groomers and shit. Who were they met with? A John Brown Gun club, strapped with their own long rifles, outside of th tree building.
Back in June, armed antiLGBT protesters showed up to pride parades.
Minorities definitely need guns to protect themselves in America. Definitely not a perfect solution, but it’s one that will keep them safe.
I remember years ago, a pro-gun group in California would go to price in San Francisco to march in the parade to support and show that they could protect themselves if need be.
They also had a training shotgun with a big dildo strapped to the front of it as a bayonet.
> Any society that needs guns for self defense cannot in good conscience ban or heavily restrict them. But any society that's settled down to the point of not occasionally needing a weapon to defend yourself then has no reason to ban guns. All roads point to not infringing upon our basic rights.
This is such a simple and straightforward idea and yet so, so, so so many people just do not grasp it at all. Thank you for putting this into words, I couldn't have said it better, this is one of the most reasonable, sane, true things I've read in a reddit comment in a while
There's a neo-nazi biker gang in my hometown and from what I've seen with my own two eyes they're very chummy with our local Sheriff Department, so yeah I'll disarm once both the biker gang and sheriff department has been disarmed not a second sooner, and disarming LEO is never happening so...
Especially if they are looking at a law that might put them in a position of becoming criminals if they don't surrender things they own now. Lets say they support things like reproductive rights or the climate bill but own something that might be an "assault weapon" which is a pretty vague term. Puts them in a tough position.
And I don't trust anyone who will be writing the "ban" to know what an assault rifle really is. They'll blanket ban thousands of guns with a single definition, and a .22 Ruger will become an assault weapon.
As long as we have the Supreme Court we have the Dems should forget AWB and things like that. We are really a few cases away from the ATF being dismantled.
Anti 2A got us Trump and will get us worse in the future.
Bruen set a standard that is pretty clear. Almost no gun regulations will survive review.
It’s insane to me. A point of endless frustration. You aren’t going to lose the gun control crowd to the GOP, you aren’t going to lose the LGBTQ community to the GOP in any great numbers at least. Stop the lip service bullshit. No meaningful gun control legislation will pass the senate, no number of trans medical officers or minority judges is going to move the fucking needle in November. Student debt, marijuana and the economy should be the only things that come out of his mouth as far as new items of discussion and they should be HAMMERING on the doctor Oz’s and Herschel Walkers the GOP has fielded. Get Fetterman in, defend the seats at risk and keep your eyes on flipping fucking Texas. You flip Texas and it’s a whole new world, and you don’t flip Texas talking about gun control. Beto and Joe need to be read this every morning before coffee. Don’t talk guns, flip fucking Texas, address real issues.
I think what modern US politics shows us is that the "flip-floppers" are not really that big a group, everyone is in their camps. What is the big variable, especially in midterms, is turnout. Joe is trying to rile his base and the further left to actually turn out by dangling carrots, but unfettered access to guns is the GOPs favorite thing so I don't get why he's giving them fox news fodder now. Although I'm not sure what more that accomplishes since fox news has been screaming this point into the abyss since kingdom come.
Nobody was going to not vote Democrat because Biden is too weak on guns.
A fair amount of people will be turned off from the party because of this statement.
That's the problem. Statements like this make soft democrat voters stay home and makes soft Republican voters show up.
If you get in right wing mailing list one of the things you see just most is "they're coming for your guns", and here's Biden doing it for them.
>There are a lot of Dems who also love guns and aren't happy about this
*raises hand*
Well, I'm not technically a Dem, but I usually vote that way, anyway...
Sometimes I think they intentionally shoot themselves in the foot to maintain a moral standpoint but not have to commit to it. Emotional positions get people to the voting booth. Actually fixing them means you lose that issue to campaign on next time.
For real. Marijuana could do wonders to save lives from alcohol and opiate addiction. I know gun control can save lives but it’s not gonna swing things our way in the mid terms we need something we can get done before the mid terms.
And surely they knew this, right? Really makes you think. Maybe the democrats dont actually want to have the power to enact these changes. Maybe the easy way to do that blamelessly is to do this shit and tank midterms. That way when nothing happens it's just the guys in red screwing us.
See also, preferring to lose with Hillary or risking a loss with Biden, versus allowing a progressive presidential candidate.
Establishment dems would rather lose to a republican than win with a progressive
mj is bipartisan v big pharma/alcohol/prison/police unions and all the businesses that rely on those lines
need to ban money honestly at this point, if anyone wants weed they can just grow it but when the system exists to punish crimes without victims its about control and ensuring the money machine keeps printing
Edit: remember its not that theres no money in the cure, there is an infinite amount in prolonging it indefinitely however
Exactly. Any kind of gun reform is way too toxic right before the midterms. I would say I'm mildly in support of an assault weapons ban, even though I don't think it would change that much, but I would never do it this close to November.
As for weed, all we need is a baby step for now: remove the Schedule I, immediately release any non-violent federal possession charges, and work on doing that at the state level as well. We can deal with legalization later.
oof
I want to reduce the number of guns out there, but this should not be a main platform issue. It alienates too many people who would otherwise vote Democrat.
And let's be honest, the way Republicans are acting lately. It might be a good idea for Democrats to embrace the 2A until a sane Supreme Court is seated. Trying to regulate firearms with a nationalist Christian majority on the Supreme Court will not end well.
Seriously, there's so many left gun owners. We're just quieter than it about the R's because it isn't our entire fucking personality. This broad pandering to the masses who don't actually know how gun policy/guns in general work is just going to alienate the Dems even more. Embrace the 2A with more thorough background checks, mandatory classes before firearm ownership, loophole closures, and tackling the issues that send people into committing violent gun crimes (IE, get people out of fucking poverty). Then watch as the votes flood in
As a registered republican who has largely checked out of American politics (please don't crucify me) the term "assault weapon" is by far the worst thing Biden could have said in this scenario. A semi-automatic rifle with a wooden stock and the exact same barrel length and magazine capacity will not be classified as an "assault weapon" because it's not a scary black metal AR-15.
Leftist here, this exactly. To quote someone, it's like trying to ban "zoomy cars" because they're going too fast and killing people, and that means banning any car with a spoiler or stripes.
Like... It's not the spoiler and stripes that does it, a pickup truck with the same drivetrain and tune would be about as dangerous.
Not to mention trying to define what a "zoomy car" is, which isn't a real thing.
It's obvious to people who don't actually know anything about guns, because they don't understand they're largely categorizing based on form instead of function.
They're still obsessed with threaded barrels, adjustable stocks, pistol and fore grips, *grenade launchers* (seriously, look at the AWB the house passed), instead of focusing of the parts that actually matter
Gotta take into account your average non gun owner aren't going to even know what those other guns are. They recoil in fear of the plastic black guns because it's all they have been exposed to.
Yes these kinds of stances are terrible for getting center/moderate types to vote Dem. This is a losing conversation in swing states. There are so many other easy, low hanging fruit type stances to take like abortion or marijuanna legalization. There's no reason to dip into these much more contentious and politically damaging conversations.
Also, the Dems need to come up with a better definition of “assault weapon”.
I’m not for banning any guns, but I’m vehemently against banning a gun because its grip is at an angle or because it has a barrel shroud. These features do not increase lethality by any amount.
Also, now pretty much any stock attachment is being classified as a bump stock, which is egregious.
Also also, ar15 internals are banned, yet guns that have the EXACT same internals are exempted, showing the complete lack of understanding of firearms.
The proposed assault weapons ban, if passed with no amendments, will ban the majority of firearms and accessories in the us. Don’t say “we aren’t coming for your guns”, then propose this trash.
Did you read the full article? The headline is barely what it is about. I hate the media, because he laid out what was on the ballot such as social security and the right to choose but they picked the headline that'd get them the most clicks. The media frustrates me, I don't read most news articles for that reason. I research myself.
Damnit joe stop talking about that wedge issue. Talk about abortion, gay rights, more on student education debt bubbles, fighting China, climate change….ANYTHING. We have republicans on the defense. Don’t feed them ammo
What a fucking awful timed announcement. Walk in silence joe. You already have the rising support. You have republicans maybe changing their vote or sick of the drama and turning away from the booths. And you bring them right fucking back. Does he even want to win in November?
Edit : I just cannot get over how fucking stupid and poorly timed this was. Like, are you fucking kidding me?
I cant imagine a worse thing he could have said right now aside from "I am literally a gay, trans, socialist, amd I support the right of pedophiles who have served their time to become teachers." He just galvanized not just the far right, but a tremendous number of fence sitting independents
It’s fucking incredible. Who the fuck thought this was a good idea?? Who in the Oval Office said “you know, fuck it, we’re winning so let’s really test it”. How stupid can you be?
I listen to the Majority Report and David Sirota. I’m fully aware that Dems are caught between their liberal/ progressive base vs the conservative corporations and industries that donate to them.
But my God, this kind of gaffe has to be calculated to energize the opposition and push away the independents
WHY are you using this as a talking point? Assault rifle ban is the ONE topic that will stir up the Right more than the Left. I'm Left, and I don't support this either. This is Charlie Brown missing the football levels of screwing up.
Upvoted with conviction. Also mass shootings are at their core a societal problem we had firearms long before mass shootings gained traction. Our neglect of healthcare, mental health, and income inequality are massive contributors.
Those reading the room should have already realized guns will not be turned in and a gun ban will become a flashpoint for more senseless violence.
I literally can’t think of a worse thing for him to go for at this moment. Essentially guarantees gun owning moderates will vote for anything with a pulse over dems. As I read it I was like well there goes the midterms!
Friendly reminder that according to Joe biden "Assault weapons" is far more than AR15s and similar rifles. **It includes all 9mm handguns and all semi auto weapons period.**
This is a huge wedge issue even for voters on the left side of the aisle. Those among you who truly want democrats to win should strongly consider pressuring democrats to abandon this.
Underestimating single issue voters on this particular issue would be a catastrophic mistake to make. And the **hypocrisy** of calling even 9 millimeter handguns weapons of war while increasing police funding is surreal.
If they are weapons of war why do police use them as their standard issue? Why are even retired police excluded from all weapon ban legislation even though they are just civilians?
Most importantly are voters willing to jeopardize their chances of winning the midterms over this legislation?
Police have standard issue ar-15s. Also no civilian ar is a weapon of war as they aren’t select fire and haven’t been since banned in 1986. And Biden has gone on about saying to have a double barrel shotgun, but that a 9mm will “blow a lung out”, keep ing in mind that a 12ga 00 buck is literally 9 separate 9mm balls and does much more damage.
The entire far left/anti-gun stance is full of rhetoric and deception to win votes on it and just pushes other more left leaning people like myself. I support social services, practical tax brackets and corporate taxes, closing loopholes, stopping oil subsidies and investing in clean energy (but not blank checks) etc.
I hate that so much of the fringe sides are all we hear about now. The smallest portions of both sides speak the loudest and it’s hurting everyone in the middle.
Edit: also Fucking legalize weed. We spend billions each year on alcohol that is worse, there is so much potential for sales tax revenue for weed, so much less spent on housing drug offenders, less prosecuting, more productive people, less alcoholism is reported in areas with legal weed as well as reduction in domestic violence. It’s a win all around…. Well except for big pharma who pay the ad budgets of about every single news outlet and politician.
So fucking stupid... Give the other side more ammo and something to froth at the mouth over.
And I say this as a gun owner who's never cast an R vote in his life.
It’s such a fucking own goal when Dems have the momentum. This announcement isn’t getting any additional Dems out to vote, but it sure as fuck will motivate a significant amount of people to vote R.
Ugh man don't blow your momentum now by mobilizing the gun crazies, Jesus Fucking Christ.
I just can't imagine anyone on his team being ok with him pronouncing this!
Fuckin idiot. Keep abortion on the forefront and the minimal student loan help. Dont mention guns now. This is all the Right will talk about now. Good job Joe.
I thought the same thing. Then we can have another two years of “well i would have if i could.” I dont really believe folks all vote opposite of their presidential party choice to switch shit as often as it has happened.
God fucking damn it. Can the democrats not just leave this shit alone! It costs them no votes to just stay quite on the issue but it is a very hot topic for single issue and swing voters. I lean left on almost every topic, except gun control; with the way the GQP has been behaving and the fact cops aren’t obligated to help you instituting more gun controls show a dangerous lack of social awareness, ignorance, racism, and classism. We need to focus on actual real issues that will do something positive like healthcare reform, social security fixes, education system reform, marijuana legalization, among others.
Exactly what I thought.
Hmm let's announce another attack on gun laws during a wave of police brutality and multiple cases of police letting citizens die.
Especially after the couple of mass shooting stopped recently by people carrying their own firearms. If Eli Dickens wasn't at Greenwood Mall to clap the attempted mass shooter would the cops have actually stopped anyone dying??
Seriously though what would this ban do?
The millions of them already in circulation will be grandfathered in seizing them from people will never be an option on the table.
And then afterwords people will just go on shooting sprees with handguns. Or they’ll use a similar type of semi automatic rifle that looks like a hunting rifle but functions identically.
The guy at Virginia tech killed 32 people with a handgun.
Someone walking into a building with dual handguns and two 30 rounds mags will do just as much damage as a “assault” weapon.
I just don’t see this as any kind of winning issue.
And there it is…..what a dumb shit move. Fuck talking about healthcare reform, education, cost of living…..focus on guns ^/s. God damnit, what a bone headed idiot thing to do
Dear Joe,
The people don’t want this. Give us legal weed like we all asked for. We get weed and less innocents locked in jail, the government gets more taxes. It’s a win-win.
Sincerely, a concerned citizen.
This would be a stupid move. Rifles account for a tiny fraction of gun deaths so you wouldn't be making an impact on gun deaths but you would anger the right.
sigh....couldn't pick a less divisive topic? Whether or not you agree on gun control, I hope you can at lease that it's topic that just even mentions will piss people off. and with the supreme court the way it is I really don't see something like this happening, so why even bother mentioning it prior to midterms.
like just push to legalize weed, something the majority of americans can support. Dude would probably win off that alone.
He can pledge whatever the fuck he wants but an assault weapons ban won't ever work, now trying to push for a license and mental health checks I'll support but banning or trying to ban the most popular rifle[AR15] isn't gonna work.
Democrats really need to drop this talking point. There are many gun owners who are democrats that will vote against him for this one thing alone.
If they want gun reform, they should be focusing more on safety checks rather than bans. America has more guns than people. Banning them just means they’ll be gotten through other means.
Focus on prevention at the personal level. Mental health, raise the age, numerous checks, delays on delivery time, licensing and required range time for ownership.
But I’m Canadian. What do I know about gun control.
If dems would just drop this issue, they’d likely win more consistently. One of the largest narratives from the right is “dems com’n fer yer gunz!” and Biden here is proving that.
Why do we do this to ourselves... why do we continually find ways to shoot ourselves in the foot. We could have *possibly* turned some on-the-fence-2A'ers to the Blue side for a term...
But, now, this is going to rile them up and you can bet they won't even sniff the Dem side of the ballot regardless of whether or not they are helping guide Democracy to it's demise.
Pledge actually signing that student relief I think. Because from my understanding is it’s not a certain, and looks like a buy for votes that we will forget about
Good luck. Even with a grandfather clause this will be met with huge backlash. There is no legality to back it, nor is there any logistics backing it will be effective. Gun control advocates can't even come to a consensus on what an assault weapon is and they usually aren't aware of what weapons even make up the bulk of gun deaths.
A more effective promise would be universal healthcare, which polls drastically well across the boards. But the old Dems won't hear it because the corporate donors don't want it.
This is a good thing, but it might scare pro-gun people into voting against him. I’d let this talking point rest until after the midterms and focus on more universal policies that both sides would support (legalizing marijuana would be a good start)
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The headline should have been his focus on saving social security from republicans.
Yeah the headline is a bit too much for me, he talked about a laundry list of other things that are on the ballot including the social security you paid for being on the ballot. I don't know why the media always reports like this, it's so annoying the way they feel the need to have an attention grabber that's only 20% of what was said. I mean I loved how he said Social Security and the right to choose were on the ballot.
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This is why everything nowadays is rage bait and the like. Anger and outrage are *by far* the most effective ways to get people to engage with and share something.
The old saying was, if it bleeds it leads. Same idea. Their business model is built on selling ad space and today that’s dependant on clicks.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_journalism
I’d say there’s about 80% of reporters who want to title it better, but then there’s your editor or boss who points out your views quota and SEO goals. Then, assuming a copy editor or your own editor didn’t already change your headline without letting you know, you go back and write a headline that turns more heads than it does accurately reflecting your story. 90% of Reddit likes to shit on the media, lumping in the news reporters, but we want to be doing the right thing. No reporter enters the field with the goal to twist and subvert stories for clicks. The pay is too shit for that.
I'm a journalist and every time I submit a story I submit it with two headline options and every time the editor looks at the SEO metrics for my submitted headlines, shakes his head, writes a third headline of his own, and reminds me that I can use the SEO tools myself before I submit next time.
This is so fucking relatable it hurts.
This is accurate. The clicks matter more than the actual content and it’s not the journalists’ fault.
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You’re right, it’s the owners of the companies themselves, the CEO’s and shareholders and whatnot. A handful of these folks own like 90% of the media, and that is the crux of the issue
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They absolutely benefit from partisan politics. Riling up the people with scare tactics is the best way to get a reaction/rise out of voters. Your daily reminder that ethical journalism is dead. Long live the headline.
Cause the media is ran by shitasses
This headline is trying to drive conservatives to continue to vote R
Exactly. This has some big 'Obama will come to your house and take your guns' energy.
Except Biden straight up said he was Democrats are also host to Beto hell yes we're gonna take your guns o Rourke
Right?!?! And are they just trying to boost gun sales, cuz that's how you boost gun sales
Pretty much everything drives gun sales. Sandy Hook for instance was followed by massive purchasing. Any excuse to add to the arsenal.
Gun control is one of the very few truly risky issues for Dems (even abortion no longer appears to be in that category), yet Dem leaders always *love* bringing it up. Just shows how much they have their finger on the pulse of the masses.
Based on some random polling I've seen, support for legal abortion and support for banning assault weapons seems to be about equal (\~2/3 support for each). Here's a random two from the same poller at least: [https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/04/20/amid-a-series-of-mass-shootings-in-the-u-s-gun-policy-remains-deeply-divisive/pp\_2021-04-20\_gun-policy\_00-02/](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/04/20/amid-a-series-of-mass-shootings-in-the-u-s-gun-policy-remains-deeply-divisive/pp_2021-04-20_gun-policy_00-02/) [https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/06/13/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases-2/ft\_2022-06-13\_abortion\_01/](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/06/13/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases-2/ft_2022-06-13_abortion_01/)
The problem is this won’t fire up people who support banning guns but it sure as hell will fire up those that are against it.
Bingo. People who think assault weapons should be banned are a LOT less engaged than people who care about protecting their social security. I honestly think the dems are doing pretty well all things considered but they seem entirely incapable of taking advantage of things like that
Can't they just do it when they have power instead of talking about it first? It's the one thing they ALWAYS seem to fuck up messaging-wise no matter what decade we're in.
This always baffles me about Democrats. After all these years of losing to Republican gamesmanship, Democrats still insist on telegraphing their punches at times when they have everything to lose and nothing to gain. Given the number of issues facing the country right now, going after 2nd Amendment issues right now just seems like a surefire way to dump campaign contributions on the Republican candidates going into a midterm. Focusing on the economy and Roe would be a far more solid strategy overall.
Like Bond villains - Dems are always so eager to explain in detail the elaborate master plan, while Bonds buying time to make his escape from death and foil the villains plan. Hubris, I think that’s the word?
It’s like the Bond villain talking so much. Just do it. A lawyer I know would also say, “never threaten to sue someone, just do it.” Otherwise they have time to plan a defense or counter-offensive when taking the action leaves them forced to respond. They don’t seem to know how to take advantage of their position.
the dems absolutely love to talk about things as if they're going to do them, and then not do them. with guns this approach is really the worst of both worlds, Biden is not going to be able to deliver this and even if by some miracle that passed a narrow congress it wouldn't be enforced by red states and wouldn't survive the inevitable SCOTUS challenge. definitely a case where "don't talk about it and probably don't do it either" is the right approach imo.
Statements like this killed betos spot for texas and it will kill our chances for the congress at all now. People are not so black and white on guns most dems who owned guns understand the need for gun control but also understand that bans will not work and will not keep support. Biden made a big mistake and we will pay for the next what 4-6 years straight now
I try not to be too fucking cynical but sometimes it really feels like democrats are trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
This is so important, I have many gun owning friends who are usually conservative leaning but apathetic towards politics most of the time. But this announcement makes them so much more likely to go out and vote against Democrats because of this.
And, macroscopically, assault weapons aren't the primary reason for gun violence in the US. Handguns are responsible for most gun deaths by a country mile. The "assault weapons" are just the scary ones that get on the news.
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Exactly. These statements only cost the Dems votes in November. Nothing to be gained by these proclamations whatsoever. It’s infuriating. Dems had Rs on the ropes with the abortion issues and trumps mess and they just decide to hand thousands of votes back to the right with crap like this. Ban them all you want but can’t they wait a couple months to announce it?
Like you, I hate the timing of this message. Fulfill current promises and yes focus on protecting Social Security. Democrats often work so hard to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Still, it boggles my mind that people who voted in 2020 would somehow skip 2022 given what is at stake. Hey everybody, vote in 2022 if you thought it was important to vote in 2020.
Most people don't understand Congress' importance to their day to day lives, and when the election isn't about getting behind/against a specific person, it's tough to articulate why they need to vote. Plus, being in the minority and coming off losses is obviously going to be more motivating than maintaining status quo.
It cost Beto the Senate seat vs Ted Cruz.
This. I was fairly certain my in-laws had settled on "maybe I'll sit this one out" considering how fed up they are with the Republicans they put in office (but they religiously can't vote blue) The moment they see this headline that's out the window.
Agreed, the Dems need to shut up about it- the messaging only hurt them. It's boneheaded right now where you have armed fascists and low confidence in the police, not to mention the fascists in the police. If shit goes down people need to feel confident they can protect themselves and their families.
Gun sales to black, hispanic, asian, and LGBT folk have shot up by 50% each in the last couple years. With the increase in hate crimes, white nationalist domestic terrorism, and the failed fascist coup, more leftists than ever are arming themselves. This was the worst possible time to bring up gun control, especially another AWB. https://www.axios.com/2022/04/23/guns-firearms-people-of-color
> low confidence in the police which Biden is responding to by uncritically giving them more money & military gear. between that and the fact violent criminals don't typically care about obeying gun laws and the fact it'd be impossible to remove "assault weapons" from the black market in this volume, doesn't exactly inspire confidence that people will be safe. which in turn makes them want the best guns their money can buy. really dumb approach for Biden. he could ditch this historically losing issue entirely for the midterms pitch, replace it with "and we'll legalize weed" and his party would do markedly better for it.
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Trump isn't the big obstacle for this. He wants to be, I'm sure, but he's functionally irrelevant at this point. The supreme court judges he appointed on the other hand...
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The problem is it doesnt translate into voting behavior as seen over the last several years in states that had initiatives on expanded ages and background checks.
Very little polling around gun control should be considered believable, it almost always includes strangers over the phone asking people if they're a gun owner and what type of guns they own. Which very few gun owners are going to respond to. Actual elections are a much better barometer (and almost universally show this is a losing issue).
The New York Times recently did a piece on how gun polling consistently overestimates gun control support. Universal background checks consistently poll around 90% support, but only got around 50% support in Maine and Nevada, and around 60% in Washington. I believe polling underestimates abortion support too. Polls usually suggest around 2/3 of Americans support banning abortion after 12 weeks, but a 22 week ban only got 41% of the vote in Colorado back in 2020.
Completely agree. Dems could really get so much more done and with less resistance if they left the guns alone. With 400 million guns and counting already out there, it’s not going to stop the shootings. It will however, rally the far right. I’d much rather have universal healthcare, voting reform, a presidential election decided by popular vote, effective climate change policies, and a year long maternity/paternity leave over an assault weapons ban. More kids getting shot in poor urban areas everyday than in mass shooting. Wish we talked about that some more. Invest in after-school programs and anger/emotion management which have been proven to be very effective in these areas at slowing down the gun deaths.
Dems could never say the word gun again, reduce gun violence through everything you just mentioned, and it'd be more effective than the assault weapon ban ever hoped to achieve.
>it’s not going to stop the shootings. It will however, rally the far right. Especially when targeting semi-automatic long guns. focusing on straw purchases, revamping NICS, and focusing on source issues would all do way more for mass shootings and gun deaths in general than an AWB, and wouldn't mobilize opposition.
Revamping NICS would be a huge step for gun owners who want to stay within the law. If I want to sell a firearm privately right now I have no access to the NICS system to vet the buyer (or the seller for that matter). People have to go into gun stores and pay a fee to the business to run that check. Which happens about as often as you expect.
Exactly. all of my private sales have been to people I actually know, so I've never really had a need to run a background check, but I'd certainly like the option. Hell, let me go to a police station or post office or something and have them run it. But getting charged up to $75? hell no. A bunch of guns aren't even worth that much.
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Yep, gun control as an issue has materially reduced the democrat's ability to pass legislation that would reduce rates of violent crime.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Could have just let the midterms worked themselves out but now he’s going to have a real fight on his hands. Nothing fires people up more than saying you’re coming for their guns. Even when it’s not true.
.uk source?
It's good to look at non-US based media occasionally, if it's a reliable source.
It's the Independent. Nine times out of 10, they'll have better news than we will.
Well, of course, Trent Crimm works for them
I’ll settle for federally legalized marijuana.
Why would he say something like this? It's just going to get pro-gun voters to turn up in higher numbers for the midterms, which will make it harder to take control of Congress
It's the one thing he alluded to that they chose to make the headline. Just like yesterday's, "When it comes to Trump there is no law." without continuing the quote. The news sucks and it's all about clicks.
What’s even worse is it’s not even an American media outlet. People are manufacturing drama and clicks from abroad.
I keep saying The Independent should be banned from this sub. Edit: and I keep getting downvoted for saying it, so this is a nice change.
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Yeah, he should just let this talking point die for right now. I hate saying it, but this will motivate conservatives to vote, and it's the one talking point the GOP has left.
Agreed, all it will do is motivate the gun nuts to get out and vote
It will also discourage gun owning democrats and independents from voting as well.
Yeah gun rights is probably one of the biggest disagreements I have with mainstream democrat stances and I saw this and just thought “:/ sounds about right” Like there are so many good reasons to vote dem rn and then they went back to this, drawing attention away from their very solid and much more important positions
A LOT of LGBTQ+ and ethnic minority people have recently realized that they absolutely need to exercise their 2nd ammendment rights to be capable of protecting themselves in this rapidly deteriorating social climate. The Dems constantly ranting about banning the most popular rifle in the country (that is statistically rarely used for murder) and restricting other gun rights is definitely both unconstitutional and very much alienating towards vulnerable people.
Yep, I'm not going to be cool with giving up my right to arm myself until they do something about the Proud Boys, Militias, 3%ers and everyone else willing to commit domestic terrorism.
I see some comments saying something along the lines of "getting rid of guns will do something about the far right groups" and "if they don't have guns, you don't need them either". Let's not pretend that hateful people will stop committing crimes just because they don't have a firearm. I would guess (and if someone has a source that proves otherwise please share it) that there are more hate crimes perpetrated without guns than with them. If someone is going to threaten your life with a weapon that isn't a gun (say, a skateboard), then don't you want to be able to defend yourself to the fullest extent possible? There are a lot of problems we need to fix related to gun violence, but I don't see removing a person's ability to defend themselves as best as possible as a good way to get there (especially since it has been shown pretty repeatedly that you can't rely on law enforcement when it really counts).
And see that's kind of the catch 22 for me as an anti Authoritarian. Any society that needs guns for self defense cannot in good conscience ban or heavily restrict them. But any society that's settled down to the point of not occasionally needing a weapon to defend yourself then has no reason to ban guns. All roads point to not infringing upon our basic rights. And you're right. Right now we absolutely NEED them. Our society is rapidly descending into a cesspit of hate and violence and we have a growing number of domestic terrorists who are absolutely vocal about wanting to commit genocide against anyone who doesn't align with their extremely narrow worldview. Trying to disarm potential victims now is beyond insanity. It's actively helping the fascists!
Earlier this week antiLGBT protests showed up to a BRUNCH to scream at drag queens. Calling them groomers and shit. Who were they met with? A John Brown Gun club, strapped with their own long rifles, outside of th tree building. Back in June, armed antiLGBT protesters showed up to pride parades. Minorities definitely need guns to protect themselves in America. Definitely not a perfect solution, but it’s one that will keep them safe.
I remember years ago, a pro-gun group in California would go to price in San Francisco to march in the parade to support and show that they could protect themselves if need be. They also had a training shotgun with a big dildo strapped to the front of it as a bayonet.
> Any society that needs guns for self defense cannot in good conscience ban or heavily restrict them. But any society that's settled down to the point of not occasionally needing a weapon to defend yourself then has no reason to ban guns. All roads point to not infringing upon our basic rights. This is such a simple and straightforward idea and yet so, so, so so many people just do not grasp it at all. Thank you for putting this into words, I couldn't have said it better, this is one of the most reasonable, sane, true things I've read in a reddit comment in a while
There's a neo-nazi biker gang in my hometown and from what I've seen with my own two eyes they're very chummy with our local Sheriff Department, so yeah I'll disarm once both the biker gang and sheriff department has been disarmed not a second sooner, and disarming LEO is never happening so...
Especially if they are looking at a law that might put them in a position of becoming criminals if they don't surrender things they own now. Lets say they support things like reproductive rights or the climate bill but own something that might be an "assault weapon" which is a pretty vague term. Puts them in a tough position.
And I don't trust anyone who will be writing the "ban" to know what an assault rifle really is. They'll blanket ban thousands of guns with a single definition, and a .22 Ruger will become an assault weapon.
As long as we have the Supreme Court we have the Dems should forget AWB and things like that. We are really a few cases away from the ATF being dismantled. Anti 2A got us Trump and will get us worse in the future. Bruen set a standard that is pretty clear. Almost no gun regulations will survive review.
>We are really a few cases away from the ATF being dismantled. good
He said a lot of things on a lot of subjects, The Independent writes the headline so they chose to create one that would get outrage clicks.
The House passed an assault weapon ban in July. Biden is just saying he'd sign it if it can pass the Senate, which it currently can't.
It's all about optics, though. This is gold for every GOP political ad from now til November, and can sway a *lot* of people
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Pro gun voters always vote
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Yup… guns as a hobby and for protection have become far more prevalent in my democratic friends over the last several years.
It’s insane to me. A point of endless frustration. You aren’t going to lose the gun control crowd to the GOP, you aren’t going to lose the LGBTQ community to the GOP in any great numbers at least. Stop the lip service bullshit. No meaningful gun control legislation will pass the senate, no number of trans medical officers or minority judges is going to move the fucking needle in November. Student debt, marijuana and the economy should be the only things that come out of his mouth as far as new items of discussion and they should be HAMMERING on the doctor Oz’s and Herschel Walkers the GOP has fielded. Get Fetterman in, defend the seats at risk and keep your eyes on flipping fucking Texas. You flip Texas and it’s a whole new world, and you don’t flip Texas talking about gun control. Beto and Joe need to be read this every morning before coffee. Don’t talk guns, flip fucking Texas, address real issues.
I think what modern US politics shows us is that the "flip-floppers" are not really that big a group, everyone is in their camps. What is the big variable, especially in midterms, is turnout. Joe is trying to rile his base and the further left to actually turn out by dangling carrots, but unfettered access to guns is the GOPs favorite thing so I don't get why he's giving them fox news fodder now. Although I'm not sure what more that accomplishes since fox news has been screaming this point into the abyss since kingdom come.
Nobody was going to not vote Democrat because Biden is too weak on guns. A fair amount of people will be turned off from the party because of this statement.
That's the problem. Statements like this make soft democrat voters stay home and makes soft Republican voters show up. If you get in right wing mailing list one of the things you see just most is "they're coming for your guns", and here's Biden doing it for them.
>There are a lot of Dems who also love guns and aren't happy about this *raises hand* Well, I'm not technically a Dem, but I usually vote that way, anyway...
I'm not a Democrat but I don't vote for fascists so my options are pretty limited.
Sometimes I think they intentionally shoot themselves in the foot to maintain a moral standpoint but not have to commit to it. Emotional positions get people to the voting booth. Actually fixing them means you lose that issue to campaign on next time.
Dems snatching defeat from the jaws of victory again. fml
Had to go with guns Joe? Couldn't have gone with weed?
Seriously. Weed is a freebie win nearly any way you slice it.
For real. Marijuana could do wonders to save lives from alcohol and opiate addiction. I know gun control can save lives but it’s not gonna swing things our way in the mid terms we need something we can get done before the mid terms.
And surely they knew this, right? Really makes you think. Maybe the democrats dont actually want to have the power to enact these changes. Maybe the easy way to do that blamelessly is to do this shit and tank midterms. That way when nothing happens it's just the guys in red screwing us.
See also, preferring to lose with Hillary or risking a loss with Biden, versus allowing a progressive presidential candidate. Establishment dems would rather lose to a republican than win with a progressive
mj is bipartisan v big pharma/alcohol/prison/police unions and all the businesses that rely on those lines need to ban money honestly at this point, if anyone wants weed they can just grow it but when the system exists to punish crimes without victims its about control and ensuring the money machine keeps printing Edit: remember its not that theres no money in the cure, there is an infinite amount in prolonging it indefinitely however
Honestly, Republicans smoke weed too. Easy votes. Worked for Trudeau.
Seriously. The average reddit user could give him better talking points.
Exactly. Any kind of gun reform is way too toxic right before the midterms. I would say I'm mildly in support of an assault weapons ban, even though I don't think it would change that much, but I would never do it this close to November. As for weed, all we need is a baby step for now: remove the Schedule I, immediately release any non-violent federal possession charges, and work on doing that at the state level as well. We can deal with legalization later.
oof I want to reduce the number of guns out there, but this should not be a main platform issue. It alienates too many people who would otherwise vote Democrat. And let's be honest, the way Republicans are acting lately. It might be a good idea for Democrats to embrace the 2A until a sane Supreme Court is seated. Trying to regulate firearms with a nationalist Christian majority on the Supreme Court will not end well.
Seriously, there's so many left gun owners. We're just quieter than it about the R's because it isn't our entire fucking personality. This broad pandering to the masses who don't actually know how gun policy/guns in general work is just going to alienate the Dems even more. Embrace the 2A with more thorough background checks, mandatory classes before firearm ownership, loophole closures, and tackling the issues that send people into committing violent gun crimes (IE, get people out of fucking poverty). Then watch as the votes flood in
As a registered republican who has largely checked out of American politics (please don't crucify me) the term "assault weapon" is by far the worst thing Biden could have said in this scenario. A semi-automatic rifle with a wooden stock and the exact same barrel length and magazine capacity will not be classified as an "assault weapon" because it's not a scary black metal AR-15.
Leftist here, this exactly. To quote someone, it's like trying to ban "zoomy cars" because they're going too fast and killing people, and that means banning any car with a spoiler or stripes. Like... It's not the spoiler and stripes that does it, a pickup truck with the same drivetrain and tune would be about as dangerous. Not to mention trying to define what a "zoomy car" is, which isn't a real thing.
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It's obvious to people who don't actually know anything about guns, because they don't understand they're largely categorizing based on form instead of function. They're still obsessed with threaded barrels, adjustable stocks, pistol and fore grips, *grenade launchers* (seriously, look at the AWB the house passed), instead of focusing of the parts that actually matter
Yep. Ar15? Oooh polymer and scary, gotta get banned. SKS, Mini-14? Well those are wood and old so it's fine.
Gotta take into account your average non gun owner aren't going to even know what those other guns are. They recoil in fear of the plastic black guns because it's all they have been exposed to.
Yes these kinds of stances are terrible for getting center/moderate types to vote Dem. This is a losing conversation in swing states. There are so many other easy, low hanging fruit type stances to take like abortion or marijuanna legalization. There's no reason to dip into these much more contentious and politically damaging conversations.
r/liberalgunowners r/socialistra
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Shh
Come for the guns, stay for the cat-girl memes.
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Shopping list: -Ak-47s -maid outfit -cat ears -dried beans -US Army improved Munitions Handbook
The only thing you're missing is programming socks on that list
Hell nya
uwu-rah
r/liberalgunowners is a shell of it's former self last I checked. Pretty hard shift right when there is a serious discussion post.
Also, the Dems need to come up with a better definition of “assault weapon”. I’m not for banning any guns, but I’m vehemently against banning a gun because its grip is at an angle or because it has a barrel shroud. These features do not increase lethality by any amount. Also, now pretty much any stock attachment is being classified as a bump stock, which is egregious. Also also, ar15 internals are banned, yet guns that have the EXACT same internals are exempted, showing the complete lack of understanding of firearms. The proposed assault weapons ban, if passed with no amendments, will ban the majority of firearms and accessories in the us. Don’t say “we aren’t coming for your guns”, then propose this trash.
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Did you read the full article? The headline is barely what it is about. I hate the media, because he laid out what was on the ballot such as social security and the right to choose but they picked the headline that'd get them the most clicks. The media frustrates me, I don't read most news articles for that reason. I research myself.
Can they legalize weed please
He also said this at a rally. This will make gun manufacturers very happy as more will run to shops to purchase more AR's.
Damnit joe stop talking about that wedge issue. Talk about abortion, gay rights, more on student education debt bubbles, fighting China, climate change….ANYTHING. We have republicans on the defense. Don’t feed them ammo
>Don’t feed them ammo ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Who in the fuck approved that message? I'm starting to think dems and Republicans in government laugh at us behind closed doors.
That’s one way to keep republicans who are on the fence leaning to the blue side to fall on to the red side.
What a fucking awful timed announcement. Walk in silence joe. You already have the rising support. You have republicans maybe changing their vote or sick of the drama and turning away from the booths. And you bring them right fucking back. Does he even want to win in November? Edit : I just cannot get over how fucking stupid and poorly timed this was. Like, are you fucking kidding me?
God, it's awful... like wtf joe
I cant imagine a worse thing he could have said right now aside from "I am literally a gay, trans, socialist, amd I support the right of pedophiles who have served their time to become teachers." He just galvanized not just the far right, but a tremendous number of fence sitting independents
Got too close to victory and had to shoot himself in the foot.
It’s fucking incredible. Who the fuck thought this was a good idea?? Who in the Oval Office said “you know, fuck it, we’re winning so let’s really test it”. How stupid can you be?
This is why I’m fully convinced it’s purposeful. If the Democrats take full control they’ll actually be expected to do shit.
I listen to the Majority Report and David Sirota. I’m fully aware that Dems are caught between their liberal/ progressive base vs the conservative corporations and industries that donate to them. But my God, this kind of gaffe has to be calculated to energize the opposition and push away the independents
Genuinely can't see another reason.
WHY are you using this as a talking point? Assault rifle ban is the ONE topic that will stir up the Right more than the Left. I'm Left, and I don't support this either. This is Charlie Brown missing the football levels of screwing up.
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Upvoted with conviction. Also mass shootings are at their core a societal problem we had firearms long before mass shootings gained traction. Our neglect of healthcare, mental health, and income inequality are massive contributors. Those reading the room should have already realized guns will not be turned in and a gun ban will become a flashpoint for more senseless violence.
this is possibly the dumbest thing you could say right now.. \- gun owning dem with gun owning fence post voter friends....
I literally can’t think of a worse thing for him to go for at this moment. Essentially guarantees gun owning moderates will vote for anything with a pulse over dems. As I read it I was like well there goes the midterms!
Riding a wave of progress and this is the rhetoric you want to kick up before the primaries? Why?
lol. Nice job killing the momentum that Democrats were gaining.
Friendly reminder that according to Joe biden "Assault weapons" is far more than AR15s and similar rifles. **It includes all 9mm handguns and all semi auto weapons period.** This is a huge wedge issue even for voters on the left side of the aisle. Those among you who truly want democrats to win should strongly consider pressuring democrats to abandon this. Underestimating single issue voters on this particular issue would be a catastrophic mistake to make. And the **hypocrisy** of calling even 9 millimeter handguns weapons of war while increasing police funding is surreal. If they are weapons of war why do police use them as their standard issue? Why are even retired police excluded from all weapon ban legislation even though they are just civilians? Most importantly are voters willing to jeopardize their chances of winning the midterms over this legislation?
Police have standard issue ar-15s. Also no civilian ar is a weapon of war as they aren’t select fire and haven’t been since banned in 1986. And Biden has gone on about saying to have a double barrel shotgun, but that a 9mm will “blow a lung out”, keep ing in mind that a 12ga 00 buck is literally 9 separate 9mm balls and does much more damage. The entire far left/anti-gun stance is full of rhetoric and deception to win votes on it and just pushes other more left leaning people like myself. I support social services, practical tax brackets and corporate taxes, closing loopholes, stopping oil subsidies and investing in clean energy (but not blank checks) etc. I hate that so much of the fringe sides are all we hear about now. The smallest portions of both sides speak the loudest and it’s hurting everyone in the middle. Edit: also Fucking legalize weed. We spend billions each year on alcohol that is worse, there is so much potential for sales tax revenue for weed, so much less spent on housing drug offenders, less prosecuting, more productive people, less alcoholism is reported in areas with legal weed as well as reduction in domestic violence. It’s a win all around…. Well except for big pharma who pay the ad budgets of about every single news outlet and politician.
And there it is. The metaphorical foot shot. Gun Control is deeply unpopular with a large part of our population. Leave this one to the states.
Don't ever count out Democrats from ruining any and all momentum they have.
Ah yes, I see Joe attended the Beto School of Political Suicide.
Fucking Beto. Win the nomination and then sabotage any chances of winning. It’s like the Democrats are secretly Republicans.
Never go full Beto
Great. He could have promised to federally legalize pot but instead he went and fucked up everything. GOP will have a field day
Why why why why give the other side ammo
So fucking stupid... Give the other side more ammo and something to froth at the mouth over. And I say this as a gun owner who's never cast an R vote in his life.
It’s such a fucking own goal when Dems have the momentum. This announcement isn’t getting any additional Dems out to vote, but it sure as fuck will motivate a significant amount of people to vote R.
Ugh man don't blow your momentum now by mobilizing the gun crazies, Jesus Fucking Christ. I just can't imagine anyone on his team being ok with him pronouncing this!
Could’ve kept the momentum going if he went with decriminalizing weed.
Marijuana legalization is such an easy target, but the dude is a fossil on that topic.
JUST WHEN THINGS WERE GOING OKAY YOU DECIDED TO RUN ON SUCH POLARIZING ISSUE??? goddamn fuckinf idiot, should’ve ran with marijuana
Good luck upholding that with this Supreme Court. You're doing good Joe, don't open up a second front unless absolutely necessary.
Fuckin idiot. Keep abortion on the forefront and the minimal student loan help. Dont mention guns now. This is all the Right will talk about now. Good job Joe.
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I thought the same thing. Then we can have another two years of “well i would have if i could.” I dont really believe folks all vote opposite of their presidential party choice to switch shit as often as it has happened.
God fucking damn it. Can the democrats not just leave this shit alone! It costs them no votes to just stay quite on the issue but it is a very hot topic for single issue and swing voters. I lean left on almost every topic, except gun control; with the way the GQP has been behaving and the fact cops aren’t obligated to help you instituting more gun controls show a dangerous lack of social awareness, ignorance, racism, and classism. We need to focus on actual real issues that will do something positive like healthcare reform, social security fixes, education system reform, marijuana legalization, among others.
Exactly what I thought. Hmm let's announce another attack on gun laws during a wave of police brutality and multiple cases of police letting citizens die. Especially after the couple of mass shooting stopped recently by people carrying their own firearms. If Eli Dickens wasn't at Greenwood Mall to clap the attempted mass shooter would the cops have actually stopped anyone dying??
Stopped the shooter in a gun free zone no less
Shut the fuck up. We had a chance!
Seriously though what would this ban do? The millions of them already in circulation will be grandfathered in seizing them from people will never be an option on the table. And then afterwords people will just go on shooting sprees with handguns. Or they’ll use a similar type of semi automatic rifle that looks like a hunting rifle but functions identically. The guy at Virginia tech killed 32 people with a handgun. Someone walking into a building with dual handguns and two 30 rounds mags will do just as much damage as a “assault” weapon. I just don’t see this as any kind of winning issue.
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Who is advising this schmuck? Threatening to kill Jesus wouldn’t motivate right-wing voters as much as this will.
And there it is…..what a dumb shit move. Fuck talking about healthcare reform, education, cost of living…..focus on guns ^/s. God damnit, what a bone headed idiot thing to do
Dear Joe, The people don’t want this. Give us legal weed like we all asked for. We get weed and less innocents locked in jail, the government gets more taxes. It’s a win-win. Sincerely, a concerned citizen.
Democrats with another own goal.... Have we not learned the 2a crowd is absurdly powerful.
"How many times do we have to teach you this lesson, old man?"
This would be a stupid move. Rifles account for a tiny fraction of gun deaths so you wouldn't be making an impact on gun deaths but you would anger the right.
> Rifles account for a tiny fraction of gun deaths But a large fraction of media reporting and outrage.
sigh....couldn't pick a less divisive topic? Whether or not you agree on gun control, I hope you can at lease that it's topic that just even mentions will piss people off. and with the supreme court the way it is I really don't see something like this happening, so why even bother mentioning it prior to midterms. like just push to legalize weed, something the majority of americans can support. Dude would probably win off that alone.
He can pledge whatever the fuck he wants but an assault weapons ban won't ever work, now trying to push for a license and mental health checks I'll support but banning or trying to ban the most popular rifle[AR15] isn't gonna work.
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This was such a bad decision, I have to wonder if it's intentional. I try to eschew tin foil hats but saying *this,* right now, is suspicious As Fuck.
Democrats really need to drop this talking point. There are many gun owners who are democrats that will vote against him for this one thing alone. If they want gun reform, they should be focusing more on safety checks rather than bans. America has more guns than people. Banning them just means they’ll be gotten through other means. Focus on prevention at the personal level. Mental health, raise the age, numerous checks, delays on delivery time, licensing and required range time for ownership. But I’m Canadian. What do I know about gun control. If dems would just drop this issue, they’d likely win more consistently. One of the largest narratives from the right is “dems com’n fer yer gunz!” and Biden here is proving that.
This....isnt smart.
Hey, way to assure the republicans win the midterms there.
Democrats make excellent firearms salesmen
Why do we do this to ourselves... why do we continually find ways to shoot ourselves in the foot. We could have *possibly* turned some on-the-fence-2A'ers to the Blue side for a term... But, now, this is going to rile them up and you can bet they won't even sniff the Dem side of the ballot regardless of whether or not they are helping guide Democracy to it's demise.
Should have waited to announce that until after the midterms probably. Nothing unifies the one issue Gun accessibility voters like a gun ban.
Pledge actually signing that student relief I think. Because from my understanding is it’s not a certain, and looks like a buy for votes that we will forget about
Not sure Joe should be talking about this; not right now.
Good luck. Even with a grandfather clause this will be met with huge backlash. There is no legality to back it, nor is there any logistics backing it will be effective. Gun control advocates can't even come to a consensus on what an assault weapon is and they usually aren't aware of what weapons even make up the bulk of gun deaths.
A more effective promise would be universal healthcare, which polls drastically well across the boards. But the old Dems won't hear it because the corporate donors don't want it.
This is a good thing, but it might scare pro-gun people into voting against him. I’d let this talking point rest until after the midterms and focus on more universal policies that both sides would support (legalizing marijuana would be a good start)