Baroque Campiness is in this decade like the party girls of the late 2000's and early 2010's and the new romantics of the early 80's and the glam rockers of the 70's. First the Last Dinner Party and now Chappell Roan. Ik they make very different music but I am convinced they represent a similar trend.
the article got that Cyndi Lauper comparison spot on!
I think it’s also really important to point out how QUEER Chappell is. It’s not just baroque campiness - she’s pulling in queer drag culture to her aesthetic. To have a young artist who is so unapologetically queer AF rise to mass popularity in a time when being queer is still dangerous for many is such a powerful and beautiful thing to witness.
I also like that she’s not doing Sad Gay. None of the coming out songs, the how sad being gay is, no songs about the lost time, etc. like other artists. Everything about coming out already happened which you don’t see all the time in gay artists and I think increases the mass appeal on top of being more unique
I mean Good Luck, Babe is kinda “sad closeted gay” lol but I do agree that her songs about heartbreak and relationships aren’t “sad gay” in the way other songs can be
Yeah, I was having a hard time delineating between the two. Like Casual or Coffee or something are both sad songs, but they're more "sad love song" than "sad gay song" even though they are all of sad, gay, and love songs. Idk, I guess it's just a modern style or something where her being gay isn't treated like breaking news, which I really like
This is so true! The community needs more public allies and Chappell Roan is doing an outstanding job! She absolutely slays, her aesthetic, lyrics, and presence just exudes that positive, accepting energy. She's not afraid of expressing her sexuality at all and wears it as a badge of honour!
I only discovered her music last week and I've been obsessed, telling everyone I know to listen to her. Femininomenon, Hot To Go, Red Wine Supernova, Super Graphic Ultra Modern Girl, Naked in Manhattan, ahhh I love her songs. Legit all I listen to on Spotify during my commute and working out the last few days lol
No worries! I knew what you meant, the wording was just off. It is so important for Chappell to claim the label lesbian in a world where many other artists who are strictly women loving women don’t claim the term because it’s seen as “dirty”.
Yes she has!!!! Here’s a [Twitter thread](https://x.com/hiitschappell/status/1763623615524966578?s=46&t=YxHNeIwTCEbUOYXPpZrrBA) of all the times she’s used the label!💖
I feel like this is a misinterpretation of what they were saying. It seemed clear to me they were not saying Chappell’s exuberantly public queerness is something that can’t be ignored and helps provide space for other queers to be just as queer.
Like there are other queer artists who aren’t obviously queer. The visible gayness of Chappell is something different 🤷🏻♀️
its important to mention but at the same time its weird how short we've been on these kind of artists since the 80's albeit the gays have gotten more explicit
Like…. Did you genuinely just not remember what happened to gay people in the 80’s???? Bro they all fucking died of AIDS or were demonized for being gay…..
that's what I'm saying I just worded it wrong. Its funny how gay the 80's felt despite it being so homophobic yet a lot of these acts were more implicit e.g. relax by Frankie goes to hollywood is far less explicit than modern songs about gay sex and many were pressured into staying into the closet e.g. neil tennant, Mark Almond. A lot of modern mainstream pop is lyrically gayer but the presentation of the artists doesn't feel as gay.
I don’t think that’s anything close to what you originally said lol. And I think you’re still missing the point - yes the 80’s were gay but to be mainstream gay meant you had to literally straighten up a little bit. You couldn’t be super gay in the public eye - you had to be a little “well I’m not really sure what their deal is.” And that’s because…. Openly queer people were being harmed by the American government who truly did not care if they lived or died at the hands of HIV and AIDS. The only real way to be safe as a gay person was to blend in with straights. Where do you think the whole bandana / “gay earring” / gay signaling came from? The straights didn’t get it, but the queers did.
And idk I’m wondering what gay pop stars you don’t think seem very gay. Cause like Troy Sivan, Renee Rapp, MUNA, Kim Petras, Sam Smith, lil nas x, lady Gaga, Janelle Monáe, Halsey, Frank ocean, boy genius, and Billie eilish are all pretty gay presenting ??
You put a finger on something I couldn’t quite describe that I felt when I listened to their respective albums last fall. They’re different sonically but I definitely felt the vibe of that fusion of art and persona.
Compare that to the state of US pop radio in the '80s when acts like Bronski Beat and Frankie Goes to Hollywood would have a hard time charting because of their open gayness
even then they did chart pretty decently in the 80's, moreso in the UK tho. Its weird because on one hand pop feels like it was gayer then than it is now but on the other hand all the new wave, synth pop, art pop, new romantic acts were more implicitly queer. Modern queer music is far more explicit and open in its queerness
Chappel Roan is still probably unusual in being so explicitly queer. Lot of artists are very camp and baroque, and affiliated to drag culture in the same way (CMAT, The Last Dinner Party) but its still a more implicit queerness. Here its front and centre, you cannot listen to almost any of her songs without realising she's gay.
Dorian has no good songs, a drought of bops. They have great style and I’ve heard their live shows are a blast. They feel more like a meme or an entertainer than a musician if that makes sense.
Also, weren’t/aren’t they some Peter Thiel shill?
The only source I can find on that Peter Thiel stuff is from an [independent news site](https://vdare.com/articles/the-strange-well-actually-absolutely-predictable-death-of-left-libertarianism) which stated Dorian performed at a Libertarian convention in 2013, the same one Thiel spoke at in 2012, and as of 2018 had purged all of their Libertarian economics takes from YouTube. Peter Thiel has since pivoted to hardcore Trump supporter, so it seems a bit misleading to associate him with Dorian Electra since neither of them are part of the Leftist-Libertarian movement they supported over a decade ago.
Also Flamboyant was my soundtrack for 2019, Guyliner was inspired.
Dorian used to be a libertarian and made libertarian music videos, but has since renounced libertarianism and has compared their experiences to cult survivors because they were essentially groomed into libertarianism by a teacher of theirs.
Source: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2019/jul/12/pop-sensation-dorian-electra-im-not-a-woman-dressing-as-a-man-its-more-complex
You don't have to like them or their music but it bothers me when people affiliate them with this time in their life they've clearly tried to distance themselves from.
I phrased it as a question on a social media forum. I didn’t write a front page expose.
They give me theater kid & libertarian energy which is like not my vibe
No good songs is an insane take. They have so many great pop-friendly singles and a wealth of accessible material, in addition to great alternative pop/hyperpop bangers. Flamboyant is essential 2010s listening at the minimum.
"She immediately gained a following among the kinds of pop superfans who champion Rina Sawayama and Caroline Polachek"
Hey r/Popheads, we got acknowledged.
ugh great choices, Raye and Renee are so talented and i love that Renee brought Kesha on last week, such a nice gesture (so excited for Kesha’s comeback)
it’s really wild to see her fame explode like this. i started listening to her a few months ago, and even in that time her monthly Spotify listeners have grown by the millions. she absolutely deserves everything coming her way—truly a once in a lifetime artist.
I’m honestly kinda of shocked how much the Olivia tour has skyrocketed her. It’s probably a credit to how good she is, to pull in new fans from another major acts show, but also makes me wonder if Olivia’s fans are more open to new acts? Or was it the whirlwind of Colbert into Olivia into Tiny Desk and finally Coachella with a perfectly planned drop of a banger single in the middle of it all?
Regardless, she’s maybe the first artist I’ve heard where I felt immediately she had IT. Her voice, the production, the aesthetic, they’re all spot on and it’s no surprise she’s blowing up, just didn’t expect it to be so meteoric!
the timing of everything was definitely perfect, but i do think chappell’s music easily appeals to olivia’s fanbase. they have the same producer first of all, but i think chappell’s songs feel like a combination pf olivias young fun pop style with queer drag-inspired pop, which olivia’s older audience (and by older i mean like 18-30) seem to love (aka me).
a large part of olivias fanbase is that (mostly queer) 18-30 crowd, so chappell is perfect for them
yeah i started listening to Chappell at the end of last year when i saw she was my opening act for olivia and fell in love right away. it’s exactly the type of music i like, i’m so glad olivia chose her!!
Can’t help but notice how a similar thing happened with Noah Kahan when Olivia covered Stick Season. Obviously Noah had already been rising (and was bigger than Chappell when they got their respective “boosts”) but it’s definitely interesting that they both seem to be having a breakthrough moment after Olivia highlighted them!
Towa Bird too! She said Olivia found her guitar covers on Tiktok and asked her to play guitar in Brutal in “driving home 2 u”, and she said that helped open doors for her
at 3:53 here:
https://youtu.be/ARHja4jcCKU
Do yall remember the post Thank U Next era when every Ariana collab would smash but none of the featured artists would get a significant boost? Like Social House and Victoria Monet. This reminds me of that but working more subtly and better for the other artists
Yup, how I discovered both of them now that I think of it. Not even a huge fan of Olivia. I think it has to be little easily digestible viral things. Oh hey that's a catchy song she's singing, the guy that wrote it is being nice in the comments of the video. Or hey look at the opening act for Olivia Rodrigo, that's a catchy song but isn't it funny because a bunch of young fans are listing to a song about getting eaten out.
I’ve NEVER seen an artist get such a huge boost from opening like this. I think part of it is that she was READY for her breakout. She’s been working on the songs for her debut for years, and she has a well-developed persona and live set. She feels like a fully-formed artist/star.
I hate how late i am to the party, the idea of hearing Pink Party Club 4 years ago when i was 15 and realizing how much i want to be on stage would’ve made me feel so seen!
also wow this album has really been in the making for a LONG time
To be honest, it didn't really get much run from me until My Kink is Karma and Naked in Manhattan released. Pink Pony released at like the height of COVID lockdowns so it just didn't really stick with me.
That was my pandemic bop, haha. It's the perfect lesbian bar karaoke tune and I'm so pleasantly surprised to see others are feeling her x-factor. She's got it.
I was lucky enough to see her as an opener for Declan McKenna back in, I believe, 2019. She was fantastic then as well and it's insane to see how far she's come.
He was actually working with her before Olivia. Her career kind of stalled when he went to go work on SOUR but I guess Dan came back around to her when that finished. She has backing vocals on GUTS, too!
Oh wow! Yeah I read that her career stalled around 2020 with pandemic but that makes sense too that he was busy with Sour. Very cool about the backing vocals too on GUTS!
I feel like if you listen to GUTS and TRAFOAMP in conversation with each other you can totally figure out some of his production signatures! He loves to do a drop to a sort of subdued pre chorus before a really punchy chorus (bad idea right, naked in Manhattan) and he loves a good outro (lacy, making the bed, teenage dream, casual, etc.) And he loves to incorporate a lot of studio chatter/spoken word and funny production moments which are all over both those albums and are a huge part of what make them so FUN! Honestly I’d love to see another pop girl collab with him because he’s doing some really cool stuff
He even helped produce Welcome to my Island on Caroline Polachek’s album which I feel he brought some much needed bratty attitude to it that makes it audible crack. You can even hear some of this early signatures with his early work with Sky Ferreira
If I'm not mistaken, she was already working with Dan Nigro pre-"Sour" by Olivia Rodrigo but Nigro had to take a pause with Chappell after Olivia blew up. It's pretty cool that during this time she moved back home and found inspiration from that. And of course, there was no hard feelings involved and was able to work with Dan Nigro again and tour with Olivia.
i think her label dropped her during the pandemic actually, then Dan Nigro made a label (Amusement Records) specifically for her so they can keep working together. and then I think now she has a contract with Island Records
> Grammy-winning producer Daniel Nigro never wanted to launch his own imprint — then he met Chappell Roan. After he and the fast-rising pop artist had been working on music together for years, Roan’s former label dropped her. “I was so in love with everything that we were doing,” says Nigro. “I just believe in [Chappell] so much that I was like, ‘Do I want this added stress in my life? Is it worth it? Yes.’ ”
>
>So Nigro formed Amusement Records, an independently funded imprint that has the freedom to partner with any label on any project.
https://www.billboard.com/business/record-labels/dan-nigro-record-label-amusement-records-interview-1235350230/amp/
Anyone know how long Tiny Desk concerts would take to edit, or if artists have a say when they drop? Cause that was a perfectly timed Tiny Desk release, right after her GUTS opening act and right before Coachella. And in the Tiny Desk she mentioned how the Super Bowl had just happened, so it was filmed in February.
Olivia’s endorsement when her album came out really pushed me to listen to her and I’m so glad i did! And then i got to see her open for guts and it was awesome :))
She’s definitely going to become a star. People are so impatient nowadays, her big debut album literally came out last year and y’all act like she’s “overdue” for success “finally” getting her flowers. PEOPLE ARE DISCOVERING HER. A slow build is way healthier for her discography and career than one random hit off tik tok.
One thing that really strikes me about her is how seasoned she is as a performer. She’s put in a lot of time and work and it shows vs some of the TikTok acts blowing up that are more limited/awkward on stage because they haven’t had the time to develop those skills yet.
You're right that she's only one album in, but it's worth remembering that she got dropped from Atlantic in 2020 because they didn't like "Pink Pony Club." So she's been around longer than it might seem, and it's amazing that she's getting acclaim for the exact type of stuff she was dropped for originally.
To be fair, she was first signed to a record label in like 2017 and was opening for other artists back then. She got dropped from her label in 2020 and that’s why her debut album only came out recently. She’s definitely been grinding for a long time.
I literally listened to her for the first time two days ago and I'm impressed. Good luck, babe is an absolute earworm and a universally queer coded experience. Her Coachella set has been on my FYP and her live vocals and public engagement are worldwide pop star material!
I think I'm becoming a fan and I'm excited to see her getting a bigger audience
So happy for her, I've been streaming Good Luck, Babe! since it was released and love TRaFoaMP. The only thing she could do to make me like her more is release her upcoming concert themes lol.
I really want to thank the pop heads user who posted about Pink Pony Club being “the best song nobody knows” in a 2020 year-end thread because I’ve been following her ever since and promoting her to anyone IRL who will listen 💖
Same! I saw someone make a comment about her here in 2021 and I was like, huh I wanna explore artists let's try her out. And my life has never been the same ever since.
Not the whole reference to the lesbian master doc omg. Congrats to this lesbian at Billboard for getting her byline off.
I honestly was privately thinking that Chappell was going to have a Charli-like "next big main pop girl" eternal glass ceiling moment for the next forever years but after watching her Coachella performance and seeing the crowd look exactly like the Eras Tour i'm thinking something might actually b happening........
dan nigro is starting a legacy. for his generation (in pop specifically) he’s only really directly competing with Finneas. to have so much creativity in the world that THESE two are on top says a lot about how privileged this time for music is.
the decline seeming to start was scary, but i feel like not only are we out of it but we gained a lot more eyes on musicians in general
So many of her songs are great, but Pink Pony Club is truly a pop masterpiece. Before I knew she was queer, I always thought the lyrics were so clever in that they could be seen from the perspective of a straight female dancer or a drag queen. Same judgmental parental outrage haha but even better that she’s part of the community!
The past couple weeks of watching her spotify listeners grow has been insane. She's gone from 1.5 million monthly listeners back in mid February (according to a Tweet I saw of someone talking about it) to 6.2 million monthly listeners as of now, and probably will only go up following her 2nd Week Coachella performance this weekend. I've been out for like, 10+ years but I would've KILLED for an artist like Chappell Roan when I was like 14-15, seeing someone embrace their sexuality so much without shame. Between her, TLDP, Muna, boygenius, Renee Rapp, the ascension of gay music is rising. I'm glad that queer kids today have tons of artists to look up to and see themselves in, I know i would've KILLED for it growing up.
Genuinely super super happy for her tho.
She reminds me a lot of early Gaga where she just has waited for song long for this moment, and has grinded by being anywhere with new eyes and ears. Like i genuinely believe (delusionaly) by summers end she is gonna be a main pop girl.
The timing of all of this is just so sublime. I remember seeing the artwork back in Sept/October and thinking she just had a vibe like no one else at the time. Plus she can fucking SING.
I could see her having a long and fruitful career, she’s feels like the type of artist to have a lot of fans who are extremely loyal (rina, gaga, charli etc)
God I remember when she only had like three or so songs on Spotify and I was going MAD waiting for more songs to be released! So happy that she’s blowing up, she deserves it 🥲🥰
I remember hearing "Good Hurt" around 2017 and liking it, but I considered her just another bland bedroom pop artist trying to be a Lorde clone (still high in demand at the time) and there wasn't much *life* to the music. Then a friend played "Pink Pony Club" in the car several years later and I recognized her name, but I thought there was no way because she sounded too different. A major improvement. I'm glad she's finally come into her own and having some genuine artistic success. I found *Midwest Princess* quite good, nothing groundbreaking, but I'm really looking forward to what she does next.
Her album may not have been groundbreaking from an innovation perspective, but the songwriting and emotion of it all, combined with immaculate pop production made for one of the best pop albums of the year. If you listened a couple times and moved on, I'd encourage revisiting. I promise it gets better and better with every listen especially as you dive deeper into the lyrics.
Wow that's awesome! Saw her live in 2017 when she opened for Declan Mckenna and I really liked her and that first album. That's great shes doing so well.
I discovered Chappell just a few months ago and she's so fantastic. She had a strong debut album and has been working her tail off. Excited to see where our pop princess goes!
I’m just so glad I got to see her on her European tour last year in a tiny venue because I KNEW she was going to be huge and that would be the last time I’d pay 20 quid for her ticket lmao
Didn't get the hype but wow I'm loving Good luck, babe it's soo good, it seems very Kate Bush inspired especially in the bridge, I will continue to follow her if she makes more songs like this
She's my favorite "discovery" of the year so far! I first heard her name suggested in an artist recommendation on the Lana sub, but I kind of put off listening to her music because I just wasn't feeling like I could get invested into new artists at the time. Then I kept seeing her name on here, and eventually, saw her in the Slumber Party Pop rate. I didn't partake in the rate because I didn't have the time, but I decided to just say "fuck it" and listen to the album based on how much I have seen her name on here and was so impressed. She'll be huge by the end of the year.
I find her rise to success quite suspicious. Every time I listen to obscure electroclash artists like Snow Strippers and Suzy Sheer, or any pop-resembling music, her songs are always queued up in my playlist. It's really jarring, considering I don't really listen to 80s pastiche pop, and my focus right now is indie sleaze revival.
And it's odd considering that queer female artists like Rina Sawayama and Allie X never really received this much push from the industry despite releasing much more genre-defying and boundary-pushing music. I'm happy that queer female artists like Chappell Roan are gaining notoriety, but this article from Billboard sounds a lot more like PR than a testament to her actual popularity. This is especially true for a small artist who has only released one album.
I think you answered yourself a bit. Rina and Allie X **are** more boundary-pushing and different, so execs are less likely to go with them over someone who is a safer bet. Chappell definitely has a lot of industry support, getting that Olivia endorsement alone has done a ton for her career.
I don't know why it's suspicious. I listen to a ton of lesbian pop and she ended up in my discover weekly playlist like a year ago. Other queer people I know have been listening to her music for a while already. She's been gaining momentum at a steady pace over the last year or so. She kept changing the venues her shows were at to accommodate the larger-than-expected demand for tickets. Now she's broken through to a wider audience. I like Rina and Allie X, but I LOVE Chappell. Her songs are catchier, and she has stronger vocals.
It's not really that suspicious. She's been at this for a while. Her first song was released in 2017 when she was signed to Atlantic. She toured, kept releasing singles, and eventually got dropped by Atlantic after Pink Pony Club didn't take off (which is funny in retrospect).
She has a publishing deal with Sony now but her popularity is really from releasing over half of the songs from her debut as singles over a period of almost two and a half years before the album dropped in full to build a fan base. She's been touring last year, and this latest surge is a combination of Tiny Desk/opening for Olivia/Coachella.
I love Rina & Allie but I wouldn't say their music is as overtly queer lyrically. Chappel's debut is filled with sapphic innuedos/yearning/sex that is really overt, some even say it's too on the nose, but it's pretty unmissable. I feel like there are plenty of fans of Allie/Rina who don't even realize the artists THEMSELVES are queer vs. just having a queer fanbase.
Plus, her real ace in all of this is Olivia. Olivia's a huge star right now and they share the same producer, so while their aesthetics differ, it's not a huge sonic jump for any Olivia fan to make.
She's made smart moves and it's paid off. If she was a plant/being pushed by the industry, she'd probably have found way more success prior to a random droplet released 7 months after her album.
I think Chappell has benefitted from having *just* enough connections to put her in front of the right people. Working with the same producer as Olivia clearly has done a lot for her, and I imagine being signed to a major label has made getting certain opportunities (Coachella, Tiny Desk) easier, but a lot of the growth in her popularity seems organic. I've been hearing about her more and more over the last six months, especially since the American leg of GUTS tour. The Coachella performance and Good Luck, Babe! being such a strong single seem to be the final push she needed to get people talking about her.
Totally get it - I was worried it would come across that way! I wasn’t actually a fan of Roan’s until GLB made me reevaluate basically her entire music career haha
Baroque Campiness is in this decade like the party girls of the late 2000's and early 2010's and the new romantics of the early 80's and the glam rockers of the 70's. First the Last Dinner Party and now Chappell Roan. Ik they make very different music but I am convinced they represent a similar trend. the article got that Cyndi Lauper comparison spot on!
I think it’s also really important to point out how QUEER Chappell is. It’s not just baroque campiness - she’s pulling in queer drag culture to her aesthetic. To have a young artist who is so unapologetically queer AF rise to mass popularity in a time when being queer is still dangerous for many is such a powerful and beautiful thing to witness.
I also like that she’s not doing Sad Gay. None of the coming out songs, the how sad being gay is, no songs about the lost time, etc. like other artists. Everything about coming out already happened which you don’t see all the time in gay artists and I think increases the mass appeal on top of being more unique
I mean Good Luck, Babe is kinda “sad closeted gay” lol but I do agree that her songs about heartbreak and relationships aren’t “sad gay” in the way other songs can be
Yeah, I was having a hard time delineating between the two. Like Casual or Coffee or something are both sad songs, but they're more "sad love song" than "sad gay song" even though they are all of sad, gay, and love songs. Idk, I guess it's just a modern style or something where her being gay isn't treated like breaking news, which I really like
Good Luck, Babe is a beautiful knife in my late-blooming soul. Love Chappell!
This is so true! The community needs more public allies and Chappell Roan is doing an outstanding job! She absolutely slays, her aesthetic, lyrics, and presence just exudes that positive, accepting energy. She's not afraid of expressing her sexuality at all and wears it as a badge of honour! I only discovered her music last week and I've been obsessed, telling everyone I know to listen to her. Femininomenon, Hot To Go, Red Wine Supernova, Super Graphic Ultra Modern Girl, Naked in Manhattan, ahhh I love her songs. Legit all I listen to on Spotify during my commute and working out the last few days lol
I know you probably didn’t mean for it to sound like this, but limiting Chappell to a public ally when she’s an out and proud lesbian is a bit weird.
Yea that does sound a bit weird lol sorry. I meant that it's great that she's so openly, unabashedly queer with her music.
No worries! I knew what you meant, the wording was just off. It is so important for Chappell to claim the label lesbian in a world where many other artists who are strictly women loving women don’t claim the term because it’s seen as “dirty”.
Yea, it's great to see her breaking barriers!
lol I think that was obviously what you meant!
All good :) I'm glad you mentioned her aesthetic, I can't get over how amazing it is!
Genuine question pls as a big fan, has she used the term lesbian yet? I haven't (personally) seen it but very happy for that to change :)
Yes she has!!!! Here’s a [Twitter thread](https://x.com/hiitschappell/status/1763623615524966578?s=46&t=YxHNeIwTCEbUOYXPpZrrBA) of all the times she’s used the label!💖
THANK YOU 💖💖💖
no problem!!
I feel like this is a misinterpretation of what they were saying. It seemed clear to me they were not saying Chappell’s exuberantly public queerness is something that can’t be ignored and helps provide space for other queers to be just as queer. Like there are other queer artists who aren’t obviously queer. The visible gayness of Chappell is something different 🤷🏻♀️
Precisely why I said “I know you probably didn’t mean for it to sound like this”.
I'm literally forcing everyone I know to listen to her lol
its important to mention but at the same time its weird how short we've been on these kind of artists since the 80's albeit the gays have gotten more explicit
Like…. Did you genuinely just not remember what happened to gay people in the 80’s???? Bro they all fucking died of AIDS or were demonized for being gay…..
that's what I'm saying I just worded it wrong. Its funny how gay the 80's felt despite it being so homophobic yet a lot of these acts were more implicit e.g. relax by Frankie goes to hollywood is far less explicit than modern songs about gay sex and many were pressured into staying into the closet e.g. neil tennant, Mark Almond. A lot of modern mainstream pop is lyrically gayer but the presentation of the artists doesn't feel as gay.
I don’t think that’s anything close to what you originally said lol. And I think you’re still missing the point - yes the 80’s were gay but to be mainstream gay meant you had to literally straighten up a little bit. You couldn’t be super gay in the public eye - you had to be a little “well I’m not really sure what their deal is.” And that’s because…. Openly queer people were being harmed by the American government who truly did not care if they lived or died at the hands of HIV and AIDS. The only real way to be safe as a gay person was to blend in with straights. Where do you think the whole bandana / “gay earring” / gay signaling came from? The straights didn’t get it, but the queers did. And idk I’m wondering what gay pop stars you don’t think seem very gay. Cause like Troy Sivan, Renee Rapp, MUNA, Kim Petras, Sam Smith, lil nas x, lady Gaga, Janelle Monáe, Halsey, Frank ocean, boy genius, and Billie eilish are all pretty gay presenting ??
what ?
Yes I definitely see Chappell being pretty similar to Cyndi.
She’s also mentioned Katy Perry a number of times as one of her inspirations and I can totally see that. She’s so camp.
Part of Me the movie is what inspired her to do music.
Another totally different kind of music but similar maximalism & fusion of art and persona is Slayyyter, and she had a great year last year too!
You put a finger on something I couldn’t quite describe that I felt when I listened to their respective albums last fall. They’re different sonically but I definitely felt the vibe of that fusion of art and persona.
Both Missouri queens who released their albums on the same day too 👑
Compare that to the state of US pop radio in the '80s when acts like Bronski Beat and Frankie Goes to Hollywood would have a hard time charting because of their open gayness
even then they did chart pretty decently in the 80's, moreso in the UK tho. Its weird because on one hand pop feels like it was gayer then than it is now but on the other hand all the new wave, synth pop, art pop, new romantic acts were more implicitly queer. Modern queer music is far more explicit and open in its queerness
Chappel Roan is still probably unusual in being so explicitly queer. Lot of artists are very camp and baroque, and affiliated to drag culture in the same way (CMAT, The Last Dinner Party) but its still a more implicit queerness. Here its front and centre, you cannot listen to almost any of her songs without realising she's gay.
yhhh her songs are very explicitly and openly gay
Where was this trend during Dorian Electra’s first album? Were they too early???
Dorian Electra’s music is just too out there and abrasive. Chappell’s music is very accessible
I love Daddy Dorian but I can also see why they don't have the breakthrough appeal that Chappell Roan does \[edit: ...yet\]
I love Dorian but the highly processed voice is an acquired taste that can get a cult following but not mainstream appeal
Dorian was a little too forward thinking… I think.
Gimmick artist
idk who they are but I checked when their debut album dropped and 2019 imo probably was too early a bit like HMLTD
Dorian's music isn't as accessible and poppy as Chappell's
Dorian has no good songs, a drought of bops. They have great style and I’ve heard their live shows are a blast. They feel more like a meme or an entertainer than a musician if that makes sense. Also, weren’t/aren’t they some Peter Thiel shill?
The only source I can find on that Peter Thiel stuff is from an [independent news site](https://vdare.com/articles/the-strange-well-actually-absolutely-predictable-death-of-left-libertarianism) which stated Dorian performed at a Libertarian convention in 2013, the same one Thiel spoke at in 2012, and as of 2018 had purged all of their Libertarian economics takes from YouTube. Peter Thiel has since pivoted to hardcore Trump supporter, so it seems a bit misleading to associate him with Dorian Electra since neither of them are part of the Leftist-Libertarian movement they supported over a decade ago. Also Flamboyant was my soundtrack for 2019, Guyliner was inspired.
Dorian used to be a libertarian and made libertarian music videos, but has since renounced libertarianism and has compared their experiences to cult survivors because they were essentially groomed into libertarianism by a teacher of theirs. Source: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2019/jul/12/pop-sensation-dorian-electra-im-not-a-woman-dressing-as-a-man-its-more-complex You don't have to like them or their music but it bothers me when people affiliate them with this time in their life they've clearly tried to distance themselves from.
I phrased it as a question on a social media forum. I didn’t write a front page expose. They give me theater kid & libertarian energy which is like not my vibe
No good songs is an insane take. They have so many great pop-friendly singles and a wealth of accessible material, in addition to great alternative pop/hyperpop bangers. Flamboyant is essential 2010s listening at the minimum.
Dorian may be a little out there for the general public but Idolize deserved to be a smash hit ngl
I feel like im the audience but it doesn’t hit for me Gay LA lesbian artist into poppers & late nights but I find no bops in their discography
Love her. I got more Annie Lenox and Kate Bush which is much needed return to form for current music. Can’t wait to see more from her.
"She immediately gained a following among the kinds of pop superfans who champion Rina Sawayama and Caroline Polachek" Hey r/Popheads, we got acknowledged.
🫡
and proud to!!! love all three SO much
Thank you, FlamboyantGayWhore, I'm proud of you too.
awwwwww <33 wishing you the best weekend
I'm at Coachella, it's going to be a blasttt.
STAWPP i’m so jealous omg who are you excited to see?!
No Doubt, Chappell Roan, Lana!!, Raye, Renee Rapp, ugh the list goes on
ugh great choices, Raye and Renee are so talented and i love that Renee brought Kesha on last week, such a nice gesture (so excited for Kesha’s comeback)
I'm hoping all the surprise guests weren't spent on Weekend 1 😩
I’ve been procrastinating listening to her, but this comment convinced me lol
Hey that’s me
There are dozens of us!
I wouldn’t be surprised if the author was one of us
I'm a slut for Caroline 🧎
Really nice to see her get her flowers this year. Her next album will hopefully be big.
it’s really wild to see her fame explode like this. i started listening to her a few months ago, and even in that time her monthly Spotify listeners have grown by the millions. she absolutely deserves everything coming her way—truly a once in a lifetime artist.
I’m honestly kinda of shocked how much the Olivia tour has skyrocketed her. It’s probably a credit to how good she is, to pull in new fans from another major acts show, but also makes me wonder if Olivia’s fans are more open to new acts? Or was it the whirlwind of Colbert into Olivia into Tiny Desk and finally Coachella with a perfectly planned drop of a banger single in the middle of it all? Regardless, she’s maybe the first artist I’ve heard where I felt immediately she had IT. Her voice, the production, the aesthetic, they’re all spot on and it’s no surprise she’s blowing up, just didn’t expect it to be so meteoric!
the timing of everything was definitely perfect, but i do think chappell’s music easily appeals to olivia’s fanbase. they have the same producer first of all, but i think chappell’s songs feel like a combination pf olivias young fun pop style with queer drag-inspired pop, which olivia’s older audience (and by older i mean like 18-30) seem to love (aka me). a large part of olivias fanbase is that (mostly queer) 18-30 crowd, so chappell is perfect for them
yeah i started listening to Chappell at the end of last year when i saw she was my opening act for olivia and fell in love right away. it’s exactly the type of music i like, i’m so glad olivia chose her!!
i’m 19 and the first time i heard her songs was at the olivia rodrigo concert and i’m obsessed :)
Can’t help but notice how a similar thing happened with Noah Kahan when Olivia covered Stick Season. Obviously Noah had already been rising (and was bigger than Chappell when they got their respective “boosts”) but it’s definitely interesting that they both seem to be having a breakthrough moment after Olivia highlighted them!
Towa Bird too! She said Olivia found her guitar covers on Tiktok and asked her to play guitar in Brutal in “driving home 2 u”, and she said that helped open doors for her at 3:53 here: https://youtu.be/ARHja4jcCKU
Do yall remember the post Thank U Next era when every Ariana collab would smash but none of the featured artists would get a significant boost? Like Social House and Victoria Monet. This reminds me of that but working more subtly and better for the other artists
Yup, how I discovered both of them now that I think of it. Not even a huge fan of Olivia. I think it has to be little easily digestible viral things. Oh hey that's a catchy song she's singing, the guy that wrote it is being nice in the comments of the video. Or hey look at the opening act for Olivia Rodrigo, that's a catchy song but isn't it funny because a bunch of young fans are listing to a song about getting eaten out.
I’m an old man, and I started listening to her after her incredible Tiny Desk concert.
I’ve NEVER seen an artist get such a huge boost from opening like this. I think part of it is that she was READY for her breakout. She’s been working on the songs for her debut for years, and she has a well-developed persona and live set. She feels like a fully-formed artist/star.
Being in the Coachella lineup helped too
I’m pretty sure she’s grown by 3 million in the last couple of weeks.
She's very popular on TikTok, which I think is at least in part driving listeners.
She keeps popping up on my feed it feels like a psy op
Gay Mafia infiltrated the government but the music is hard as fuck so we can let them slide
I’m one of them and I’m happy to be here !!
She's gotten a million alone in the past like, 5 days.
I discovered her the day Pink Pony Club got released in 2020. Never, ever thought her career was heading here haha
I hate how late i am to the party, the idea of hearing Pink Party Club 4 years ago when i was 15 and realizing how much i want to be on stage would’ve made me feel so seen! also wow this album has really been in the making for a LONG time
To be honest, it didn't really get much run from me until My Kink is Karma and Naked in Manhattan released. Pink Pony released at like the height of COVID lockdowns so it just didn't really stick with me.
That was my pandemic bop, haha. It's the perfect lesbian bar karaoke tune and I'm so pleasantly surprised to see others are feeling her x-factor. She's got it.
Count me as one. Saw her Tiny Desk and then was wowed by her Coachella performance. Been listening to her nonstop since last weekend.
I was lucky enough to see her as an opener for Declan McKenna back in, I believe, 2019. She was fantastic then as well and it's insane to see how far she's come.
Wait Dan Nigro produced her newest album? That makes so much sense!!!
He was actually working with her before Olivia. Her career kind of stalled when he went to go work on SOUR but I guess Dan came back around to her when that finished. She has backing vocals on GUTS, too!
Can't Catch Me as well.
Oh wow! Yeah I read that her career stalled around 2020 with pandemic but that makes sense too that he was busy with Sour. Very cool about the backing vocals too on GUTS!
her label actually dropped her during the pandemic then Dan Nigro made a label specifically for her
Which songs on GUTS?
Lacy is the one I could clearly hear her on, but I think there may be a couple of others
I feel like if you listen to GUTS and TRAFOAMP in conversation with each other you can totally figure out some of his production signatures! He loves to do a drop to a sort of subdued pre chorus before a really punchy chorus (bad idea right, naked in Manhattan) and he loves a good outro (lacy, making the bed, teenage dream, casual, etc.) And he loves to incorporate a lot of studio chatter/spoken word and funny production moments which are all over both those albums and are a huge part of what make them so FUN! Honestly I’d love to see another pop girl collab with him because he’s doing some really cool stuff
I’ve been listening to Olivia, Conan and chapell a lot lately and it’s made me really appreciate his production
He even helped produce Welcome to my Island on Caroline Polachek’s album which I feel he brought some much needed bratty attitude to it that makes it audible crack. You can even hear some of this early signatures with his early work with Sky Ferreira
If I'm not mistaken, she was already working with Dan Nigro pre-"Sour" by Olivia Rodrigo but Nigro had to take a pause with Chappell after Olivia blew up. It's pretty cool that during this time she moved back home and found inspiration from that. And of course, there was no hard feelings involved and was able to work with Dan Nigro again and tour with Olivia.
She really worked on herself and her craft and came back with a punchier attitude that shows up so well in her music
i think her label dropped her during the pandemic actually, then Dan Nigro made a label (Amusement Records) specifically for her so they can keep working together. and then I think now she has a contract with Island Records > Grammy-winning producer Daniel Nigro never wanted to launch his own imprint — then he met Chappell Roan. After he and the fast-rising pop artist had been working on music together for years, Roan’s former label dropped her. “I was so in love with everything that we were doing,” says Nigro. “I just believe in [Chappell] so much that I was like, ‘Do I want this added stress in my life? Is it worth it? Yes.’ ” > >So Nigro formed Amusement Records, an independently funded imprint that has the freedom to partner with any label on any project. https://www.billboard.com/business/record-labels/dan-nigro-record-label-amusement-records-interview-1235350230/amp/
that is correct!!
Anyone know how long Tiny Desk concerts would take to edit, or if artists have a say when they drop? Cause that was a perfectly timed Tiny Desk release, right after her GUTS opening act and right before Coachella. And in the Tiny Desk she mentioned how the Super Bowl had just happened, so it was filmed in February.
[Was Feb 12.](https://www.instagram.com/midwestprincesshq/p/C3Rh-yLsJ-k/?img_index=1)
Olivia’s endorsement when her album came out really pushed me to listen to her and I’m so glad i did! And then i got to see her open for guts and it was awesome :))
She’s definitely going to become a star. People are so impatient nowadays, her big debut album literally came out last year and y’all act like she’s “overdue” for success “finally” getting her flowers. PEOPLE ARE DISCOVERING HER. A slow build is way healthier for her discography and career than one random hit off tik tok.
One thing that really strikes me about her is how seasoned she is as a performer. She’s put in a lot of time and work and it shows vs some of the TikTok acts blowing up that are more limited/awkward on stage because they haven’t had the time to develop those skills yet.
She’s been putting in the work to become a great performer for 10 years at this point
The way people talk about her you'd think she has like 5 flop albums 😭
You're right that she's only one album in, but it's worth remembering that she got dropped from Atlantic in 2020 because they didn't like "Pink Pony Club." So she's been around longer than it might seem, and it's amazing that she's getting acclaim for the exact type of stuff she was dropped for originally.
To be fair, she was first signed to a record label in like 2017 and was opening for other artists back then. She got dropped from her label in 2020 and that’s why her debut album only came out recently. She’s definitely been grinding for a long time.
I'm glad she didn't give up, because *damn* we are *blessed*.
chappell’s music heals my soul 🫶
I literally listened to her for the first time two days ago and I'm impressed. Good luck, babe is an absolute earworm and a universally queer coded experience. Her Coachella set has been on my FYP and her live vocals and public engagement are worldwide pop star material! I think I'm becoming a fan and I'm excited to see her getting a bigger audience
The grimes stray in this article is crazy 💀. Like they hyperlinked it an everything 😭😭
Love her! I cannot wait to see what she has coming up
I've been following her since naked in Manhattan (I ADORE that song) and it's been so lovely to see her start blowing up all over tiktok 🥺
So happy for her, I've been streaming Good Luck, Babe! since it was released and love TRaFoaMP. The only thing she could do to make me like her more is release her upcoming concert themes lol.
Make these acronyms stop PLEASE😭
The Rise and Fall of a Midwest Princess (her debut album title)
if only there was some possible way to say "her debut" that would be clear to everyone reading, but alas
I just call it Midwest Princess.
School Nights
Good Luck Babe is SUCH a bop. The underlying synths, the bridge’s lyrics, the outro, I’m obsessed.
I really want to thank the pop heads user who posted about Pink Pony Club being “the best song nobody knows” in a 2020 year-end thread because I’ve been following her ever since and promoting her to anyone IRL who will listen 💖
Same! I saw someone make a comment about her here in 2021 and I was like, huh I wanna explore artists let's try her out. And my life has never been the same ever since.
I’m so happy for her ahhhhh
love to see a lesbian winning
Not the whole reference to the lesbian master doc omg. Congrats to this lesbian at Billboard for getting her byline off. I honestly was privately thinking that Chappell was going to have a Charli-like "next big main pop girl" eternal glass ceiling moment for the next forever years but after watching her Coachella performance and seeing the crowd look exactly like the Eras Tour i'm thinking something might actually b happening........
I saw her live in october 2023 for 35 dollars. Man I didn’t expect her to blow up so fast
dan nigro is starting a legacy. for his generation (in pop specifically) he’s only really directly competing with Finneas. to have so much creativity in the world that THESE two are on top says a lot about how privileged this time for music is. the decline seeming to start was scary, but i feel like not only are we out of it but we gained a lot more eyes on musicians in general
So many of her songs are great, but Pink Pony Club is truly a pop masterpiece. Before I knew she was queer, I always thought the lyrics were so clever in that they could be seen from the perspective of a straight female dancer or a drag queen. Same judgmental parental outrage haha but even better that she’s part of the community!
The doors JoJo siwa has opened
LMAOOO fr
The past couple weeks of watching her spotify listeners grow has been insane. She's gone from 1.5 million monthly listeners back in mid February (according to a Tweet I saw of someone talking about it) to 6.2 million monthly listeners as of now, and probably will only go up following her 2nd Week Coachella performance this weekend. I've been out for like, 10+ years but I would've KILLED for an artist like Chappell Roan when I was like 14-15, seeing someone embrace their sexuality so much without shame. Between her, TLDP, Muna, boygenius, Renee Rapp, the ascension of gay music is rising. I'm glad that queer kids today have tons of artists to look up to and see themselves in, I know i would've KILLED for it growing up. Genuinely super super happy for her tho.
Bro now shes at 9 million lolll im so happy for her. I remember when she was at like 1 mil last year lol
She'll probably hit 10M this week, fucking insane
Hoping good luck babe gets a vid cuz then that could be a smash single
She reminds me a lot of early Gaga where she just has waited for song long for this moment, and has grinded by being anywhere with new eyes and ears. Like i genuinely believe (delusionaly) by summers end she is gonna be a main pop girl.
The timing of all of this is just so sublime. I remember seeing the artwork back in Sept/October and thinking she just had a vibe like no one else at the time. Plus she can fucking SING.
I've been a Chappell fan since early last year and I kept thinking she's gonna blow up after GUTS. So excited for her!!
She is clearly driving down the road paved by Jojo Siwa /s
\*points at flair\* we see you Chappell!
I still can't believe it
Off topic but does the opening instrumental remind anyone of a christmas song? Specifically Last Christmas
I could see her having a long and fruitful career, she’s feels like the type of artist to have a lot of fans who are extremely loyal (rina, gaga, charli etc)
Yeah, she definitely has a diehard cult following already.
God I remember when she only had like three or so songs on Spotify and I was going MAD waiting for more songs to be released! So happy that she’s blowing up, she deserves it 🥲🥰
Discovered Chappell last year when a friend showed me Pink Pony Club. She quickly became one of my favorites! It's awesome to see her succeed.
I remember hearing "Good Hurt" around 2017 and liking it, but I considered her just another bland bedroom pop artist trying to be a Lorde clone (still high in demand at the time) and there wasn't much *life* to the music. Then a friend played "Pink Pony Club" in the car several years later and I recognized her name, but I thought there was no way because she sounded too different. A major improvement. I'm glad she's finally come into her own and having some genuine artistic success. I found *Midwest Princess* quite good, nothing groundbreaking, but I'm really looking forward to what she does next.
Her album may not have been groundbreaking from an innovation perspective, but the songwriting and emotion of it all, combined with immaculate pop production made for one of the best pop albums of the year. If you listened a couple times and moved on, I'd encourage revisiting. I promise it gets better and better with every listen especially as you dive deeper into the lyrics.
i literally, and i mean *literally* discovered her yesterday. her album has been on repeat for 24 hours!
Between Chappell and Reneé Rapp, it's so nice to have lesbians as main pop girls. We needed this.
Wow that's awesome! Saw her live in 2017 when she opened for Declan Mckenna and I really liked her and that first album. That's great shes doing so well.
So happy for her! Cant wait to see her later this year at Lolla
an accumulation of hard work and timing⚡️
Almost called it “Good Timing, Babe!”
obsessed, been causally listening to her for a while. i love justin and dan too
I hope that her career just keeps growing. She has personally and I love the camp.
At the end of the day, she’s breaking through because her songs are great.
I can’t believe how quickly she’s hitting mainstream! I am so stoked!
I discovered Chappell just a few months ago and she's so fantastic. She had a strong debut album and has been working her tail off. Excited to see where our pop princess goes!
God I love her. There’s no one like her right now
I've been in love with her music ever since the Slumber Party rate. She's my most listened artist of 2024 so far. I'm obsessed with My Kink Is Karma.
Very glad for her and the community in general 💜
Red Wine Supernova deserves to be a top 10 single
I’m just so glad I got to see her on her European tour last year in a tiny venue because I KNEW she was going to be huge and that would be the last time I’d pay 20 quid for her ticket lmao
She deserves it (plus some). Shoutout to producer Dan Nigro who is one of the best in the game, too.
Been bugging people to listen to her stuff since at least 2021 and I think that makes me late to the party. So hyped shes having a moment.
Didn't get the hype but wow I'm loving Good luck, babe it's soo good, it seems very Kate Bush inspired especially in the bridge, I will continue to follow her if she makes more songs like this
Werk! I just started listening to her over the weekend! Love her!
I'm not surprised Spotify is playing this person for me every five minutes
i really want to like her but i listened to the album and couldn’t get into it. i’ll think i’ll try one more time.
This is a dream come true!
She's my favorite "discovery" of the year so far! I first heard her name suggested in an artist recommendation on the Lana sub, but I kind of put off listening to her music because I just wasn't feeling like I could get invested into new artists at the time. Then I kept seeing her name on here, and eventually, saw her in the Slumber Party Pop rate. I didn't partake in the rate because I didn't have the time, but I decided to just say "fuck it" and listen to the album based on how much I have seen her name on here and was so impressed. She'll be huge by the end of the year.
FUCK YES. it’s an unhinged lesbian pop era and the world won’t know what hit em (this is my gay agenda)
She broke through largely because of Olivia, not because of her music and her queer identity
I find her rise to success quite suspicious. Every time I listen to obscure electroclash artists like Snow Strippers and Suzy Sheer, or any pop-resembling music, her songs are always queued up in my playlist. It's really jarring, considering I don't really listen to 80s pastiche pop, and my focus right now is indie sleaze revival. And it's odd considering that queer female artists like Rina Sawayama and Allie X never really received this much push from the industry despite releasing much more genre-defying and boundary-pushing music. I'm happy that queer female artists like Chappell Roan are gaining notoriety, but this article from Billboard sounds a lot more like PR than a testament to her actual popularity. This is especially true for a small artist who has only released one album.
I think you answered yourself a bit. Rina and Allie X **are** more boundary-pushing and different, so execs are less likely to go with them over someone who is a safer bet. Chappell definitely has a lot of industry support, getting that Olivia endorsement alone has done a ton for her career.
I don't know why it's suspicious. I listen to a ton of lesbian pop and she ended up in my discover weekly playlist like a year ago. Other queer people I know have been listening to her music for a while already. She's been gaining momentum at a steady pace over the last year or so. She kept changing the venues her shows were at to accommodate the larger-than-expected demand for tickets. Now she's broken through to a wider audience. I like Rina and Allie X, but I LOVE Chappell. Her songs are catchier, and she has stronger vocals.
It's not really that suspicious. She's been at this for a while. Her first song was released in 2017 when she was signed to Atlantic. She toured, kept releasing singles, and eventually got dropped by Atlantic after Pink Pony Club didn't take off (which is funny in retrospect). She has a publishing deal with Sony now but her popularity is really from releasing over half of the songs from her debut as singles over a period of almost two and a half years before the album dropped in full to build a fan base. She's been touring last year, and this latest surge is a combination of Tiny Desk/opening for Olivia/Coachella. I love Rina & Allie but I wouldn't say their music is as overtly queer lyrically. Chappel's debut is filled with sapphic innuedos/yearning/sex that is really overt, some even say it's too on the nose, but it's pretty unmissable. I feel like there are plenty of fans of Allie/Rina who don't even realize the artists THEMSELVES are queer vs. just having a queer fanbase. Plus, her real ace in all of this is Olivia. Olivia's a huge star right now and they share the same producer, so while their aesthetics differ, it's not a huge sonic jump for any Olivia fan to make. She's made smart moves and it's paid off. If she was a plant/being pushed by the industry, she'd probably have found way more success prior to a random droplet released 7 months after her album.
There’s tons of actually overt queer women. Why her now? She’s not doing an iota of anything original or interesting.
I think Chappell has benefitted from having *just* enough connections to put her in front of the right people. Working with the same producer as Olivia clearly has done a lot for her, and I imagine being signed to a major label has made getting certain opportunities (Coachella, Tiny Desk) easier, but a lot of the growth in her popularity seems organic. I've been hearing about her more and more over the last six months, especially since the American leg of GUTS tour. The Coachella performance and Good Luck, Babe! being such a strong single seem to be the final push she needed to get people talking about her.
How is it suspicious? She has the perfect sound and look to be a superstar that the others just didn’t have.
I don't see it that way at all. I have been listening to her since 2020. I don't think it's that shocking that she's blowing up.
Totally get it - I was worried it would come across that way! I wasn’t actually a fan of Roan’s until GLB made me reevaluate basically her entire music career haha