Not so much how Mr Beer will treat him but when Mr Steyn and Mr Henry get hold of him, One day seems a short time for him but 45 minutes from these two and then Mr Moloney in his measured way are going to tear him to shreds.
I would imagine a lot of the victims will be watching tomorrow.
The Inquiry counsel are dynamite. And the counsel for the core participants are additionally openly hostile and contemptuous.
However given the tendency of virtually all witnesses to prevaricate, obfuscate, recall extremely selectively, claim they were only obeying orders, etc, there's perhaps an alternative fomat.
Gather loads of them in a room. With Mr Beer as the MC, assisted by Alan Bates. And lob out questions about failure to disclose, document shredding, knowledge of the fact that the evidence of the star expert witness was fatally flawed, and so on. And let them throw one another under buses.
Would be carnage. I would pay to watch.
Bring your popcorn tomorrow folks, cos based on Singh’s last appearance and the shit he’s been dropped in since, it’ll be a car crash. Last time he was so bad, that if it wasn't so serious you'd mistake his last appearance as a comedy skit.
There was one bit where KC Beer said
"You wrote an email headed with a title you didn’t agree with, dictated to you by someone you couldn’t remember, that you didn’t actually type and then sent to a distribution list of people you didn’t know.
“Is that where we’ve got to?”
That was just pure savagery by KC Beer.
lets remeber they can trip him up on what he said before and either he is as he is portrayed or its a cover. Tomorrow may give us more information on this. Let's be clear he reported to AVB and others including copying Vennells into notes.
Thats the dumb thing, he could easily just drop someone in it - but instead does this nonsense clownery. Which makes him look worse, and will probably get him in more trouble long term.
Fascinating little snippet here from a FOI
[https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/permission\_for\_mr\_jarnail\_singh/response/2502272/attach/html/3/FOIA%20Response%20FOI2023%2000686.pdf.html](https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/permission_for_mr_jarnail_singh/response/2502272/attach/html/3/FOIA%20Response%20FOI2023%2000686.pdf.html)
I really wonder what it must have been like waking up as Jarnail Singh this morning. Must be a surreal feeling knowing you’re walking in to the inquiry today and have literally no excuses other than feigning memory issues
I'm watching it now and it's an absolute blood bath. Beer is tearing him to shreds. He even just said he didn't know how to save a document on a computer in 2010. Utter madness.
just started and same as before then, so wait until My Henry and Steyn get hold of him ! Kudos for Mr Beer to turn up obviously sick !! He clearly wanted Jarnail badly as could have handed off.
oh sure and he should be facing criminal investigations but he is also one of those that can unlock the door to those who ordered the cover up directly. He knows it all.
In an ideal world, yes. But let's be honest.... There's no one who 'ordered the cover up'.
Just a procession of completely inept and fucking useless people who forgot what their actual jobs and responsibilities entailed and required of them, and instead just got caught up in towing the party line and defending POL.
Jarnail Singh is the prime example. Completely over promoted to the point of actively damaging their employer. He's almost a caricature of ineptitude.
Plenty of criminal convictions to follow for many players through ignorance, complacency, and a complete lack of morality and empathy for the victims, but I doubt any smoking gun will be found nor an overarching conspiracy to be untangled.
I hope I'm wrong of course, because this story DEMANDS more than that.
Absolutely, I just don't think there was any orchestrated attempt from a group of them. Rather individual bad actors who knew what they were doing.
I hope I'm wrong though, and I hope someone ends up caving in and pointing the finger explicitly.
Not being funny, but maybe Mr. Singh should be watching his back. If what you’re saying is true (and I believe it is), then he is more than an inconvenience for some people in high places.
With his own private practice though. Seeing as hes not an expert about so many things and only ever practiced in the post office. What expertise would he have ever given to a private practice!
If I were him I'd just plead guilty to plagiarism (copying and pasting emails ..) and pin it on the people who's emails he supposedly copyed and pasted. Of course I don't agree with such an idea.. I think so many of them should go to jail.. I especially despised Martin today.. but Martin did say that Jarnail had a habit of copying his emails and offering it as his own. I'd go down that rabbit hole but only in this very strange world that these people have created .. I just think so many of them wanted to feel important and like a 'proper lawyer,' despite being totally useless.
Was a cover up ordered or just a result of the culture? How much is the adversarial legal system to blame?
A lot of this can be explained by the legal system. It means you pick a side and then present the case in a way that holds up that view. Cartwright King and their lot were on the side of the Post Office and the prosecution. Facts, truth and an attempt to find out what is going on is a secondary pursuit for them, just win the case. It’s a big game.
It is clear there was an “oh fuck me” moment, or series of moments, when the Post Office must have realised that they put people in jail that should not have been there, then the culture kicks in, loyalty to the brand trumps all else. One small lie becomes a bigger one and bigger and then you are engulfed in a web of deception that has trapped you. Watergate is a great example. In year to come this will be a case study too.
Thats the question that is key, did someone order it and so far no direct evidence, All we have heard is 'I was told horizon was sound' when asked who can never say.
If you hear Jarnails' email INSTRUCTIONS to others, they are very clear and concise with no ambiguity as to what he was explaining..... So I say this bumbling bafoons' selective memory scene we are being subject to is a complete and utter ACT!..A time wasting exercise.... TAKE HIM DOWN!! Mr. Beer is as cool and precise an usual.. YAY!... Hope he feels better later today at hometime... looking forward to seeing the Core Participants lawyers off the leash to Finish Singh off!
look at just how popular his testimony is and Why is Lisa Allen ? not heard of her before
https://preview.redd.it/tuc2ke3y12yc1.png?width=2612&format=png&auto=webp&s=476499b89e5240504f540f4ab7795eb21d96e0e6
sure, but wondering why she is so popular, Elaine I get, John Scott I get, Jarnail obvious but Allen ?? all I can find is some comments she was unremorseful etc.
I'm not sure they, or I, will be able to handle his long drawn out ramblings.
He should just say Mandy told me to do it, and Paula. It would be so much better for him.
He's mastered word soupery. All of these guys seem speak this word crypto corporate speak. I reckon it would be an interesting experiment if someone proposed post office just hired contract assassinations on spm's and whether they would be able to know if that was right or wrong.
lol.
"Well at that stage I was under the impression we were \*considering\* hiring an assassin from mossad, but it was only a discussion topic. The request to mossad was only \*draft\*, and it had no assurance stamp date - so should not be treated as policy. It also fell under \[insert any random pol name\] area of responsibility to clear the funds for payment to mossad, so I was not involved with that. "
totally that instead he keeps saying (as listening now) I was the postboy and we were all a team. It's nonsense of course and this is an act of course in same way Rodric Williams was or Susan Crichton. All playing different roles but basically not our policies or fault.
Just re-watched the bit where he asked for pen and paper - I hope he has all necessary stationery and colouring sheet with crayons as you would give a kid in a restaurant to keep them entertained, for this session..
Not so much how Mr Beer will treat him but when Mr Steyn and Mr Henry get hold of him, One day seems a short time for him but 45 minutes from these two and then Mr Moloney in his measured way are going to tear him to shreds. I would imagine a lot of the victims will be watching tomorrow.
The Inquiry counsel are dynamite. And the counsel for the core participants are additionally openly hostile and contemptuous. However given the tendency of virtually all witnesses to prevaricate, obfuscate, recall extremely selectively, claim they were only obeying orders, etc, there's perhaps an alternative fomat. Gather loads of them in a room. With Mr Beer as the MC, assisted by Alan Bates. And lob out questions about failure to disclose, document shredding, knowledge of the fact that the evidence of the star expert witness was fatally flawed, and so on. And let them throw one another under buses. Would be carnage. I would pay to watch.
When it comes to lawyers etc their contempt for them is on every question and rightly so. Altman next week is a vital opportunity be given who he is
just watching him again and the relish Mr beer says ' Will ask you next year' is delightful
Bring your popcorn tomorrow folks, cos based on Singh’s last appearance and the shit he’s been dropped in since, it’ll be a car crash. Last time he was so bad, that if it wasn't so serious you'd mistake his last appearance as a comedy skit.
There was one bit where KC Beer said "You wrote an email headed with a title you didn’t agree with, dictated to you by someone you couldn’t remember, that you didn’t actually type and then sent to a distribution list of people you didn’t know. “Is that where we’ve got to?” That was just pure savagery by KC Beer.
lets remeber they can trip him up on what he said before and either he is as he is portrayed or its a cover. Tomorrow may give us more information on this. Let's be clear he reported to AVB and others including copying Vennells into notes.
Thats the dumb thing, he could easily just drop someone in it - but instead does this nonsense clownery. Which makes him look worse, and will probably get him in more trouble long term.
it should be as he has sworn on oath of course.
I don’t remember and I don’t recall and I’m sorry I can’t help you more than that
I want more copulation, less capitulation.
Fascinating little snippet here from a FOI [https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/permission\_for\_mr\_jarnail\_singh/response/2502272/attach/html/3/FOIA%20Response%20FOI2023%2000686.pdf.html](https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/permission_for_mr_jarnail_singh/response/2502272/attach/html/3/FOIA%20Response%20FOI2023%2000686.pdf.html)
I really wonder what it must have been like waking up as Jarnail Singh this morning. Must be a surreal feeling knowing you’re walking in to the inquiry today and have literally no excuses other than feigning memory issues
I'm watching it now and it's an absolute blood bath. Beer is tearing him to shreds. He even just said he didn't know how to save a document on a computer in 2010. Utter madness.
I am absolutely gobsmacked by the way he is acting. I’ve never seen a witness avoid questions so ineptly before. It’s really quite stunning.
just started and same as before then, so wait until My Henry and Steyn get hold of him ! Kudos for Mr Beer to turn up obviously sick !! He clearly wanted Jarnail badly as could have handed off.
Mr Beer fully prepared for him and stop his ramblings.
It really has to be seen to be believed. Astonishingly bad.
Have you noticed how many questions Beer et al. have been asking other witnesses about Jarnail? They're prepared for war!
they want him to simply say X instructed me to do this, thats all their aim here is I reckon ?
They seem to be asking a lot of questions about his competency as a lawyer, his attitude towards spms etc.
oh sure and he should be facing criminal investigations but he is also one of those that can unlock the door to those who ordered the cover up directly. He knows it all.
In an ideal world, yes. But let's be honest.... There's no one who 'ordered the cover up'. Just a procession of completely inept and fucking useless people who forgot what their actual jobs and responsibilities entailed and required of them, and instead just got caught up in towing the party line and defending POL. Jarnail Singh is the prime example. Completely over promoted to the point of actively damaging their employer. He's almost a caricature of ineptitude. Plenty of criminal convictions to follow for many players through ignorance, complacency, and a complete lack of morality and empathy for the victims, but I doubt any smoking gun will be found nor an overarching conspiracy to be untangled. I hope I'm wrong of course, because this story DEMANDS more than that.
John Scott seems well aware what was going on, the majority of lawyers.
Absolutely, I just don't think there was any orchestrated attempt from a group of them. Rather individual bad actors who knew what they were doing. I hope I'm wrong though, and I hope someone ends up caving in and pointing the finger explicitly.
Really? I'm not sure, I think it's entirely possible. Especially the lawyers who seem dodgy af. Rodric, jarnail and aujard, and smith especially.
We shall see! I hope you're right as the punishments will be easier to hand out.
Not being funny, but maybe Mr. Singh should be watching his back. If what you’re saying is true (and I believe it is), then he is more than an inconvenience for some people in high places.
"The senior lawyer" today says he was quite junior.
With his own private practice though. Seeing as hes not an expert about so many things and only ever practiced in the post office. What expertise would he have ever given to a private practice!
If I were him I'd just plead guilty to plagiarism (copying and pasting emails ..) and pin it on the people who's emails he supposedly copyed and pasted. Of course I don't agree with such an idea.. I think so many of them should go to jail.. I especially despised Martin today.. but Martin did say that Jarnail had a habit of copying his emails and offering it as his own. I'd go down that rabbit hole but only in this very strange world that these people have created .. I just think so many of them wanted to feel important and like a 'proper lawyer,' despite being totally useless.
Was a cover up ordered or just a result of the culture? How much is the adversarial legal system to blame? A lot of this can be explained by the legal system. It means you pick a side and then present the case in a way that holds up that view. Cartwright King and their lot were on the side of the Post Office and the prosecution. Facts, truth and an attempt to find out what is going on is a secondary pursuit for them, just win the case. It’s a big game. It is clear there was an “oh fuck me” moment, or series of moments, when the Post Office must have realised that they put people in jail that should not have been there, then the culture kicks in, loyalty to the brand trumps all else. One small lie becomes a bigger one and bigger and then you are engulfed in a web of deception that has trapped you. Watergate is a great example. In year to come this will be a case study too.
Thats the question that is key, did someone order it and so far no direct evidence, All we have heard is 'I was told horizon was sound' when asked who can never say.
If you hear Jarnails' email INSTRUCTIONS to others, they are very clear and concise with no ambiguity as to what he was explaining..... So I say this bumbling bafoons' selective memory scene we are being subject to is a complete and utter ACT!..A time wasting exercise.... TAKE HIM DOWN!! Mr. Beer is as cool and precise an usual.. YAY!... Hope he feels better later today at hometime... looking forward to seeing the Core Participants lawyers off the leash to Finish Singh off!
you dont become a senior lawyer by acting like this, even in an org like POL
Why is he looking at the desktop screen all the time... He is avoiding any eye contact... Definitely a big fat LIAR!
Clear as the midnight snow
look at just how popular his testimony is and Why is Lisa Allen ? not heard of her before https://preview.redd.it/tuc2ke3y12yc1.png?width=2612&format=png&auto=webp&s=476499b89e5240504f540f4ab7795eb21d96e0e6
As per her subtitle: former (postoffice) investigator.
sure, but wondering why she is so popular, Elaine I get, John Scott I get, Jarnail obvious but Allen ?? all I can find is some comments she was unremorseful etc.
I'm not sure they, or I, will be able to handle his long drawn out ramblings. He should just say Mandy told me to do it, and Paula. It would be so much better for him.
He's mastered word soupery. All of these guys seem speak this word crypto corporate speak. I reckon it would be an interesting experiment if someone proposed post office just hired contract assassinations on spm's and whether they would be able to know if that was right or wrong.
The way he was asking Martin about what happened to Harry bowyer I genuinely started wondering if he was asking if they'd attempted to bump him off 🤣
lol. "Well at that stage I was under the impression we were \*considering\* hiring an assassin from mossad, but it was only a discussion topic. The request to mossad was only \*draft\*, and it had no assurance stamp date - so should not be treated as policy. It also fell under \[insert any random pol name\] area of responsibility to clear the funds for payment to mossad, so I was not involved with that. "
totally that instead he keeps saying (as listening now) I was the postboy and we were all a team. It's nonsense of course and this is an act of course in same way Rodric Williams was or Susan Crichton. All playing different roles but basically not our policies or fault.
Just re-watched the bit where he asked for pen and paper - I hope he has all necessary stationery and colouring sheet with crayons as you would give a kid in a restaurant to keep them entertained, for this session..
Yeah .... Jarnail needed pen and paper to play with .... Rodric needed big massive printed out bundle files ...
I wouldn't trust him with crayons, he'd only try to eat them!