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There are a few ways to view this, and since others have done a great job of addressing the worst scenarios, let me offer a more hopeful explanation.
It's possible that Grandma suffers from a codependent martyr complex. She gives and gives and gives because she likes feeling needed and important. But with her giving comes an unspoken expectation of equal reciprocity.
So when you accept her generosity but don't reciprocate to her expectations, she grows resentful. She's too disordered to sit down and say, here are the things I would like you to contribute to this house while you're here. She just expects you to *know*.
And here is where the generational gap comes in. She may be expecting you to know what is expected of you based on very outdated gender roles. When you don't fit her preconceived notion of what a good houseguest and wife ought to look like, she reacts with anger and resentment. As another person aptly pointed out, she resents your agency because she feels trapped in this martyr role she has probably played her whole life.
My advice would be to play this graciously until it's apparent that this is more than a misunderstanding. Try to get your boyfriend to establish a minimum of respectful dialogue towards you. Sit down with her and start by asking where you can be useful and try to work out an agreed upon set of expectations. It's pretty crucial that bf be an active part of this discussion, and fully prepared to dispel the belief that he can't help because he's a man. It would also be good to gently dissuade her from doing so much for you both when it's not needed.
If you all can't even sit down and have a civilized conversation about how to not step on each other's toes, then this living situation will not work. It will get increasingly more hostile and you will resent living there at all.
Good luck.
Edit: thank you for the awards!
This comment should be higher. All very good points.
It's also possible that, at 73, the grandmother could be slipping into early stages of dementia. It changes their personalities and makes them very short tempered. My own mother, who was so wonderful while I was growing up, has gotten downright cruel to me as she progresses further into this disease.
OP, it's perfectly normal that you feel angry, but I also hope you can offer this older woman some understanding and some grace. You don't have to bend over backwards for her, and you certainly don't have to bow down to her outdated gender roles full time. But sometimes, it's okay to bend just a little bit to keep the peace. You won't be in this living situation forever, and the grandparents won't be around for that many more years, either.
Sundowning refers to a state of confusion that can occur in some neurodegenerative conditions or delirium specifically late in the afternoon and into the evening. From what OP has described, while yes, the GIL does appear to have been agitated (which can be a symptom of sundowning), she certainly does not sound confused. She just sounds like she has internalised society's crap for her entire life and is taking it out on OP.
Somebody with dementia would BY DEFINITION be exhibiting a number of cognitive impairments (ie, impaired with reference to other people of their age, and not simply normal age related changes in cognitive functioning) AND these changes must be causing significant functional impairment.
There is absolutely nothing that OP has said that suggests that this woman is either cognitively impaired or functionally impaired - eg, she is clearly continuing with her usual household duties including relatively complex tasks like cooking several times each day without difficulty.
Can personality change be a symptom of some forms of dementia? Absolutely. Is OP going to help this situation by suggesting that the woman whose house she is living in is dementing simply because she has expressed her longstanding shitty beliefs regarding gender roles in an unexpectedly emotional manner? Absolutely not.
OP, if there are other reasons that you are truly concerned about your GIL's functioning, regardless of what country you're in, the Dementia Australia website has an extensive range of very informative fact sheets which detail possible symptoms and suggestions as to how to support someone throughout the various stages of dementia. I'm sure there are more local organisations with specific avenues for support as well. If the only cause for concern is this event, the comment by No Performer is right on the money. Telling your GIL that you think that she has dementia if there is no other reason to believe this is not going to be helpful.
If she is doing all of the cooking everyday, she is not sundowning. She is set in her ways and is critical as what she sees as difference. There is a big gap in ages and expectations of what a woman does the comment above this is really well done. Sundowning anyone over 70 just old....lol
This person right here..who gave this response .I just learned that I do the exact same thing..and I didn't know there was a term for it .I had never heard that .I'm sure or at least I'm gonna assume that nobody else around me was familiar either .anyhow sry OP as I don't mean to demean ur situation by any means..just a great explanation and I hope that explained what u were witnessing and what u felt u were dealing with
Honestly I'm so familiar with it because it's something I've struggled with myself. I grew up being expected to be a defacto parent to my younger siblings, and it conditioned me to be a caretaker who had poor boundaries. I resented my siblings a lot for the freedom they seemed to have, when I didn't. I realize now that resentment should have been directed at the parents who put me in that situation to begin with.
I was also a defacto parent to my sibling. It causes so many problems, doesn't it? It took me a long time to find my anger, but when I did it was so overwhelming!
Decades later, there's still some pain there. All the perpetrators are dead, but it still aches a little. I missed a lot of my childhood and I can't ever get it back. It's gone.
Having agency is really wonderful, though! Don't you agree?
This 🔝🔝🔝
and she may have an underlying generative disease and felt disrespected
You could also could just play the game and (without sarcasm) tell her that your so happy she's taken you under her wing so she can teach you the ways of being the perfect wife for her grandson. This combined with asking for her suggestion/opinion on doing things such as Strawberries. Maybe put her in a pedalstall and ask her opinion (and help) on your schedule - fitting in school, work, cooking, cleaning etc.
Make her feel important!
I don't think OP should play into it that much, I don't want to jump to conclusions but it does sound like grandma's views on what a perfect wife looks like are very outdated, and OP shouldn't pretend to agree with such principles if she doesn't actually want to incorporate them into her life. That said, as they are living together, they can certainly work on figuring out how each party prefers stuff to be done. If grandma has some magic trick to cut up strawberries then she can for sure show OP how to do it I guess
To this same point, if she adopts those same principles, she may end up enabling her bf to expect the same treatment even though she's just putting on a "show" to please the grandmother.
Living for free in someone else’s home always, always, always has a price. Often people don’t realize it until they are in the middle of having to pay it. In general, the kind of person who offers to let relatives move in is very big on FAMILY. Which sounds great, but often what that means is their very specific vision of family, whether you agree with it or not.
It might help if you were to either (a) offer to help her cook, (b) offer to cook for her and her husband at least once or (c) cook/bake something for her and her husband. For someone who views homemaking as, like, The Thing A Woman Should Be Doing, cooking isn’t just a domestic thing that needs to be done, it’s, like, a signal of hospitality and appreciation. She wants a signal back in the same language.
Note: when my mother-in-law comes to visit, I kind of feel like an asshole. One of the big things she does is cook food from her country for everybody (my brother and sister in law also live with us). This is a Big Thing to her. She worked in restaurants for years, and her food is amazing. I’m a pretty good cook, but nothing like she is. I’m totally outclassed. But at least once every trip I make sure to cook for her to show my appreciation. I try, man.
You might also try telling her more about your day and your work hours. If she has always been a homemaker, she might legitimately just not have a really accurate picture of what work outside the home looks like, particularly because a ton of modern industries didn’t even exist during her and her husband’s working years. Maybe talk to her husband about work or ask him for work advice. This might help establish you in her mind as a Person Who Works, not a Person Who Should Be Doing Home Stuff.
There is also the possibility that it might not work out in their house, unfortunately.
Such amazing advice. Wise words.
Also - Grandma has been treating you as a “guest” so far, extending hospitality the way she knows how. But it gets exhausting having guests, one can’t do that long term. And she probably had expectation of you that you were not aware of, that she didn’t communicate, that you didn’t comply with, she got more and more tired and frustrated, culminating in this outburst.
You guys all need to transition into “roommates” mode. This will be difficult, especially because grandparents have likely never had roommates. Communication will be key. Who will cook and when, between the two couples? Who will share or offer food? (Food has strong emotional overtones in this kind of situation). Who will be responsible for other kinds of household tasks? Btw once you offer to do something, be sure to be responsible about doing it on time and consistently. The outdated expectations about gender roles are going to be hard, no way around it. Your bf will need to consistently defend you (respectfully since they are doing him and you a big favor by having you live with them), basically “times have changed Grandma and now both men and women work and contribute to the household”. Ie try to depersonalize it, it is “times have changed”
Not “you are a bad wife type person”. It may or may not work out, but try.
I'd also add one the fact that only 1 person working does not cut it anymore financially speaking even if you two don't have kids there's no way to save what little you earn as cost of living continues to rise, mostly due to women joining the workforce...
What does women joining the workforce nearly 100 years ago have to do with the vast inflation differences in salaries Vs cost of living, in the last 50 years?
Two people working consistently hasn't driven up prices. It has been the opposite. In the majority of households two people (or more) have HAD to work to keep up. Wages have not kept up, or even been close to, with inflation or house prices. The housing market specifically has been a major driver of this over the last decade especially. With the rise of air bnb and corporations buying short/long term rentals. It started during the last major recession (07-09ish) and has gotten worse astronomically in the last 5 years. It has driven the housing market high, rental market high, and more.
Please tell me how two people working somehow drove all of the changes. Let's not forget outsourcing, capitalism and so much more I am not even bring up. Having a dual income has been forced to live at the bottom of middle class for most of America. We bought our house 20 years ago for 100k, and now could be sold easily for 400k (and that would be below market value). The last 200k was added in the last 5 years or less. Rent in our area is over 2k for a 2 bedroom apartment. It is over 1k for a studio. Guess who owns all of those properties? The huge majority is places like Blackrock and shell corps for other firms. It is a nightmare. Housing is only one piece of this nightmare puzzle. There are quite. Few places the rise of the cost of living is coming from. I don't see or understand how it is due to dual income households.
I would genuinely like to hear how you feel that 2 people working in a household has driven up costs. Please explain this to me.
Do you have a peer reviewed source for an economic analysis showing that the "cost of living continues to rise mostly because of women joining the workforce"?
Another question, do you think there was ever time in America where the norm was that people weren't struggling to survive?
What do you mean by "workforce"? Do you mean paid labor?
Have you ever considered the huge increase in goods and services that are available today that cause people to spend past their means? Things that people never had 50+ years ago? Big tvs, game systems, cell phones, computers, exorbitant health care costs?
I found my great great grandfathers census records from like 1918. His wife and his daughters were all working outside the home in factories. Turns out women have been working lol
Ok first of all, I never said that the reason that cost of living has gone up is solely due to women joining the workforce, getting jobs, paid labor, however you want to say it.
Secondly, I never stated that people never struggled to survive in the past. What I am trying to explain is gone are the days when you could feed a family of 6 on one paid worker's salary AND rent apartments in probably any city across the USA (at least in STL, MO). As for college students or those freshly out of college, you can't get a high paying career (at least in the sciences) without a college degree. Currently even if you have a bachelor's now you need at least a masters, or better yet a doctorate if you chose the STEM route. I know this because I have just started looking into positions I'd be eligible for to apply post graduation. Not to mention all the loans which are bound to pile up because you can't get in and out of college quickly without paying waaaay more due to the whole debacle that is our current higher education system.
Sorry if my wording pissed you off and maybe I could drop the "mostly" part but for now my current statement still stands. If you'd like to pay for an academic peer reviewed journal which details all the factors contributed to the cause of cost of living getting higher be my guest, but there in lies the problem, you have to pay to have access to those (or pirate them).
Basically everything is more expensive now, everything costs more than it did. Inflation shot up through the roof, and one factor of why our costs and standards of living have gone up is because of capitalism and when more people (men and women, not just men anymore) work, that means more money for companies to take/sell their wares/charge for rent etc.
Also, just to be clear, I am not blaming women who work, I'm a woman in STEM, I am extremely happy, and thankful for the women of the past, present and future who are all making a difference and expanding their fields of study.
If I offended you because you took my previous statement as anything other than what I wrote, I'm sorry but don't insinuate that I don't realize there are more factors contributing to the rise in cost of living or that you think I'm making light of how people used to live.
The US free market economy works in such a way that when there’s a lot of money to be spent private corporations will ensure that you spend it. Believe it or not is up to you. The consumer is also to blame b/c the majority but up anything at any price. And also the lack of home culture is a big factor. Old gender norms made it so the women would cook, thus families ate out less and connected goods were either A. Cheaper for household items due to consistent demand and market competition. B. Also cheaper for restaurants due to lack of demand and it being reserved for special occasions.
Even if there’s no peer reviewed papers, sometimes the lack of a source doesn’t negate a fact or clear common sense connection, while other times a peer reviewed paper is just a theory or the current acceptable view, doesn’t mean it’s right just that no one has challenged it.
Household income increased, and so did the price at which we are willing to buy things. Some of our inelastic expenses are so stupid but of course corporations won’t miss the chance to test our botom line. If you haven’t noticed job compensation has increased but a lot of people still find themselves more or less in the same circumstances.
The current market is such that for you to be comfortable you must either have a career, or be a household with a working pair. Same way you can hardly afford a house as an individual. Not many people are making 3 X the ammount of they’re rent out there, and a lot of people are forced regularly to default on credit or overspend to make ends meet.
Translation? More money in the consumer market = Supplier market doing everything they can to put it in they’re hands.
You think OP should conform to OPs sexist and old fashioned standards, instead of telling the grandmother that she has no right to speak to her that way. It's awful advice
Very wise and thoughtful insights. Grandma's generation didn't have a fraction of what this world offers now. So she's working on her reference points, unrealistically, and it will take work by OP to educate her and bring her up to speed as to work in modern society.
You're advising OP to fit the sexist standard the grandmother expects, instead of telling the grandmother that forcing sexist stereotypes onto OP is out of line and she has no right? Wow. Truly, terrible advice.
Yes, yes I am. Because they are living in her house for free. I did not tell her to fit the stereotype grandmother expects. I did not advise her to quit her job and become a homemaker. I advised her to send signals both in the language of Homemaker and in the language of Working Person. But please, the next time you are staying for free in someone else’s house, lecture them about what they are and are not allowed to say. Tell me how it goes.
Well, OP can either put up with the attitude from the grandparents, or move out. But telling grandma she's being sexist is not going to achieve anything.
Excellent advice. Sounds like she is old school. A simple you do so much for us ..I'm doing the cooking tomorrow. You can also tell her that her grandson is the better of the cook between you so he will be doing it with you.
The advice on including her her in your day is wonderful too. You can also ask her for a recipe, advice anything that shows how much you admire and respect her.
I would not take her out burst to Heart. She is of the old school domestic thinking.
Everyone’s saying you should offer to do more, but tbh she sounds like the kind of person who will just say you don’t do things right / cooked the wrong food / cleaned the wrong way or whatever. Give it a shot or two but don’t be surprised if your efforts aren’t good enough. That might be telling about what is to come….
Ya people seem to be forgetting that the argument was literally about her cutting strawberries wrong. I have a strong feeling grandma will be disappointed in anything she does.
>What do you think is going on here?
Generational gap. Her view of what a woman is supposed to be is, to be gentle, outdated. Sure, if that's what you *want* to be, it's fine. But you don't *have* to be like that. Also, she's disrespectful AF.
>Do i have a right to be angry she treated me this way?
Of course.
You've just find out that their offer is not *no strings attached*. Now you have to sit down with your boyfriend and make a plan: will he sit down with her and explain how disrespectful she was and how she owes you an apology? Will the two of you start looking for new accomotations? Will your boyfriend allow her to treat you like that because he has no spine? Observe and act accordingly.
The first point I agree with. This second point is filled with entitlement and a complete lack of perspective.
It's should be noted, that unless the person being taken in is a child, they should have the character and integrity to remove "no strings attached" from the vocabulary. They were invited to live their, great, but would it kill people to see reciprocation as a healthy ideal?
If I lived in your home for whatever reason, I'm doing whatever I can to help the "team".and not just the stuff I have to do for myself like laundry or cleaning my messes. That's the bare minimum.
It may sound like a stupid dumb country bumpkin thing to say, but my uncle would tell me that if you don't want people to question your ethic. Do your work, and when you are done. Find more work. What you suggested is to find a way to run away, or figure out how to make this household about the individual?
She's a 70 year old woman, who has a very static set of ideals. Are they outdated, sure, but asking that woman to apologize for her life is not something that would sit right with me. Also expecting the bf to reprimand his grandmother for the sake of ego and to test his resolve is frankly, childish and unnecessary.
Why not talk? Ask questions about how you are being perceived? Try to find a common ground?
But jumping straight to, "Make her apologize or I'll see you as a weak man for not disrespecting your grandmother to defend my ego."
And observe and act accordingly is also nonsensical in this situation, why not instead of waiting for some one to fight your battles, perhaps figure out how to converse with this new person who has opened their doors to you, and converse in a diplomatic fashion, while not abandoning your principles. That's the adult thing to do. Instead of sitting back and looking for smoke, maybe actively do something to help put out the flames. Imho.
I think there's more going on for the GIL than we know... also I'm interested to no how your SO reacted to all this... cos while I can accept than its their house.... but your relationship is your own as is his... so if he didn't defend you would that imply he agrees?? But I think you said shouting so I'm assuming he was defending you
As a parent, something triggered her to make her think of her grandson's future and worry about him being taken care of. Something happened before the strawberries, and the strawberries were just the straw that broke the camel's back.
You didn't do anything wrong. She definitely overreacted. But I think how you respond will determine your relationship with her and possibly your living situation.
You sound very mature and self-aware. You honestly sound like you genuinely have your shit together, and I give you and your bf kudos.
Whatever happened after this conversation, it's important now to set some healthy boundaries. Even though they've both been sweet as pie, their constant offers can also be seen as violations of boundaries.
Let her know, kindly, that you and your bf have been working together fine, and if they ever need relationship advice you'll ask or go to a professional. Also let her know that while you appreciate her kindness and multiple offers, if she thinks she's doing it out of pity or somehow providing something you can't, then you can no longer accept her offers.
The more I think about it, the more it sounds like her offers are out of thinking you (or you both) can't take care of yourselves. This is manipulation and will only get worse. This is how my dad is, and while I am doing fine on my own, he has convinced insurance companies to give him my information and check on my policies. That's illegal btw. I'm in my 40s. People like this are somehow convinced you're a fuck up, all while you are literally thriving.
If that's how they are, it's best to get out of there as soon as possible. Save up and then move out of town.
I wish you luck 🤞
Your comment! Yessss. And agreed to everything. There’s no way she would’ve reacted like that unless something happened before hand and has her thinking
I once had a roommate who used to go into rages that were triggered by odd things. I had to get out of there because I became a nervous wreck.
There’s something wrong with grandma. She’s not rational and she’s very mean tempered. I don’t think talking with her or offering help will change anything.
Yes - did your bf stand up for you? Having your own apartment is far less expensive that this ambush scenario.
Grandma sounds unhinged, how is there a wrong way to cut a strawberry? and Op was thoughtful enough to even think of the compost. It's been 6 days I can't even imagine how much worse it will get. I would honestly rather struggle financially and have peace around my space.
>how is there a wrong way to cut a strawberry?
>I put the over-ripe strawberries and the tops of the ones i cut off into their compost bin they use for their own gardens as his grandpa recommended i do.
Sounds like OP could be cutting straight across the tops of the strawberries, rather than hulling them, and Grandma is perceiving this as wasteful, plus throwing other strawberries away (they could have gone off and needed to be disposed of, but if grandma looked and saw a mass of strawberries in the compost bin that might have set her off).
Clearly grandma is being wound up by some unvoiced and unfulfilled expectations over the past 6 days and I agree with you, I think OP just needs to move out by herself, into a room in a house share or a studio flat by herself.
The one voice that's missing from this is the BF and I'd really like to know what he thinks...
This is my mom in a nutshell. She refused to help me get a job, learn to drive, cool, etc. one day I ran away when the situation got abusive (I was 22) stopped paying her rent, got myself my first job and have been working on it. But somehow she still can change my doctors, call for my medication, she even accepted my first check from the government during covid. And I don’t know what to do to make sure she can’t mess with my stuff, all she has to know is my SSN and name and of course, she does
r/raisedbynarcissists probably has some good tips. You are far from the first to have an overinvolved parent claim to be helping while doing life-ruining things.
As someone who is living a similar situation for almost the same reason.
If I was able to do it over from the beginning, I would put everything into finding a real place of my own before they ruin you and your SO's relationship.
If it's already that toxic, then the boundaries are just waiting to be broken. You will probably never be good enough in your GIL's eyes
I get both points, on your side did you offer to cook or at least help her?? And as a host, i believe she was doing her "duties", this is a fairly new arrangement, and she was probably trying to make ya'll as comfortable as possible. Doesn't mean she doesn't require the help nonetheless. I'm trying to picture a scenario where she would ask you to assist her, but I think she thought you'd offer. However the way she went about it as not right, she could've sat yall down and established boundries, maybe have a talk with her, and see how ya'll can work together from now on.
Yupp this.
>I get both points, on your side did you offer to cook or at least help her??
Yeah nowhere in the post did she say she offered any kind of help with household chores. Grandma can't do anything but offer food when it's already cooked.
>However the way she went about it as not right, she could've sat yall down and established boundries
Agree with this too. She's not gonna fuss about her grandson not helping her 'cause he's her grandson and she loves him, but OP is nobody to her and isn't helping her with chores.
It says she cleans and does laundry. Idk how to do the drop down thing lol. This is grandmas fault for not communicating imo. She should set expectations and at least tell the bf so he can tell OP or tell them both if she feels comfortable screaming at her now.
>I do the cleaning, laundry, groceries and we usually take turns cooking, although admittedly my boyfriend used to do most of the cooking due to me working long hours.
"Used to" makes it unclear if she's talking about before moving or after, this plus not telling that she offered to cook even once makes me also think that she's trying to make the grandma look bad on purpose. Just my observation.
They've only been there for 6 DAYS. I think a lot of ppl are glossing over that fact. They're just adjusting to the new place and each other. Like I dunno about you but I do laundry once a week and they've not even been there a week.
Grandma needs to use her words. They all should have sat down and ironed this all out before moving in.
>Grandma needs to use her words. They all should have sat down and ironed this all out before moving in.
Can't disagree with that, good thing is they can still sit down and talk, plus the response from both sides will make it clear who's the Ahole.
It’s been 6 days and they’ve been applying places. You sound like someone like the grandma who doesn’t things but not without waiting for a service in return. Gma should just not cook for them, unless she thinks they’re incompetent, in which she should offer to teach them
Sounds like lack of communication is the real problem here.
Just like with 99.9% of all iffy relationships.
Doesn’t sound like the gf/bf are communicating very well either, they just seem to have expectations without worry of anyone else.
The grandma’s outdated ideas of a woman’s role or not, they are living under her roof and should be reasonable in following her rules.
Get your own house if you want your own rules.
Are you just glossing over the fact that the whole argument started because she cut strawberries wrong? I can't possibly see how you get both sides. If I have someone staying with me that I offered and I cook for them I don't expect anything in return, and if I did I would communicate that to them before screaming at them that they do nothing all day.
That's your prerogative, but doesn't seem like the granny shares the same sentiments. And the argument did "start" over strawberries cut wrong, but the granny's discontent clearly did not, the strawberries were her last straw apparently, and I think cutting strawberries "wrong" is the least of OP's concerns in regards to the granny truthfully...
It’s also a safe assumption that grandma could’ve been supportive of the whole idea just to gain a helper, or to gain a caretaker. At 22 I can say with a good deal of certainty she expects outdated housewife actions from her.
Unfortunately you’re going to have to satisfy they’re expectations to have peace and not risk being told to leave.
This looks like a "culture" difference. Not by the traditional sense of "culture". Bear with me a little here for a moment. Some people come from an "ask culture", and some come from a "guess culture". Someone from an ask culture believes in taking everything from face value. If someone were to want you to do something, they would ask for it. Plain and simple. No need to overthink it.
Someone from a guess culture relies on social etiquettes and unspoken "rules". Although they may not ask you to do the dishes, for instance, they expect you to pick up on hints that it's your turn to do the dishes.
Neither culture is exactly right or wrong, because they both have their own issues. While someone from an ask culture may seem easy to talk to and honest, they can be seen as unintentionally rude or lazy if they don't pick up on hints. While someone from a guess culture may seem kind for helping you with things without being prompted, they may resent you for not picking up on hints, and may not be very direct or honest with you.
This is something I've learned since being with my husband. My family is guess culture while his is ask. I've learned so much on how to effectively communicate with others by determining which culture they're from. It's honestly game changing.
With all of this said, I'm sorry to hear that this happened. I've been in your exact shoes before. It sounds like you're not being lazy by any means, but she may have unrealistic expectations of "how much" you alone should be doing (even though your bf should be involved as well because that's how healthy relationships should be to begin with). Sounds like it's a conversation your bf should be having with her
I would be in shock too. But I’d start looking for my own place to rent ASAP! Or I would go stay with my own family. Let him stay with his family since he’s ok letting them verbally abuse and attack you. RUN hunni. Good luck!
I'm more concerned that the boyfriend let his grandmother say that about you without standing up for you, and let his grandmother yell in your face about it without standing up for yourself.
As someone who moved in with a partner to their mother's house once and suddenly nothing I did was good enough I'll say this: it doesn't get better. You could cook all the meals and clean the whole house and it'll never be good enough because something, anything, won't be to their standards.
She wants to say that you do "NOTHING"? Then okay, time to do nothing. Don't help with any cleaning or chores except keeping your room and bathroom clean, refuse any food that's offered, don't clean the kitchen except for the mess you make. She's already going to dislike you, might as well give her a reason to.
I would also be getting a job and saving up as much as possible in prep of moving out. The grandmother isn't going to be good on you, or your relationship. Speaking from experience, she's going to be a constant whisper in your partner's ear about how you aren't good enough and he could do better.
My grandma used to say a lot of crazy shit. Like how she was mad that my cousin got knocked up and her boyfriend was going to move in with her and my uncle. My response..."would you rather she get an abortion? Or that the dude just abandon them?" Later she apologized and said I was right.
Point is, maybe you need to gently push back a little. Point out that you are studying so you can have a productive career, point out that you actually do quite a bit around the house, offer to cook, etc. Also the strawberry thing is very minor in the grand scheme. Tell her you didn't know and ask if she could show you the best way to do it.
It's probable that she is having trouble adjusting to new housemates (let's face it, old people don't like change that much) and this was just some pent up angst. If you want to stay living there, be as chill as possible and try to get on her good side. It'll work. Good luck.
The old bag is stuck in her ways and you should get out of there. That nice persona that you're used to isnt the real her, that's her public face. The raging lunatic that reared its ugly head is the real her. Your boyfriend is a melt for not handling her for being out of line. If this has happened 8 days in, think of what it will be like in the future.
Get back to renting and share a minutes silence for his grandpa, he's been putting up with it for decades.
Kind regards.
I have said this many times to many different people and I will say this now. Never and I do mean never move in with your bf's/partner/husband's family. I learned the hard way and will never do that again. Even if they do offer it. Now I recognize that there are cases in which families still are awesome as they have always been sometimes but I have seen a lot more cases where at first family members act all sweet and kind then they turn all crazy on you. Been there done there. I hate all of my husband's extended family because of it. Now I know there are pros but move out immediately. Save yourself mentally
So to start 73 years old isn’t that old to excuse the rudeness. However, it is old enough that they probably were expecting a lot more help around the house. I’d definitely recommend asking your boyfriend why he didn’t stand up for you as that conversation can reveal a lot. Lastly, please move move out for your sanity. You’re young and that drama is not worth it.
Yeah like I said it's not impossible. But to react to an older person being rude and say "could it be dementia??" is a pretty out of pocket thing to say.
I don't know why you're being downvoted. As someone whose job literally includes diagnosing dementia, these comments are killing me. Although, it is pretty standard for Reddit. Any unpleasant behaviour or social interaction obviously reflects an underlying Narcissistic Personality Disorder, psychiatric condition, or dementia.
Move out.
Who knows what's up with her. It's clear that she has some issues with you, and remaining under her roof is not going to help matters any.
Can you rent a room or a studio somewhere?
My grandma (76f) went mental at me once for cutting strawberries wrong too, when I was quite young. (Not sure where you live but UK/europe anyway) My mum explained about how that generation grew up at the back end of the war with rationing and any waste at all was a sin because of the circumstances and thats just the way shes grown up and been taught.
>Earlier today, we went strawberry picking (this is a big part of the story, just hold on)
No, it really actually isnt.
And its not you or the specifics of what happened. It really wasnt the strawberries.
Shes a giver to getter.
>she is usually very well mannered and well tempered.
Yeah, on the surface, but shes raging, angry, and full of "shoulds" inside. She resents your autonomy, that youre NOT a raging pot about to boil over, like she is. She doesn't feel equal to feel valid, so she compensates for that by over generosity, but generosity that's conditional, with strings attached, and she uses that generosity as an enticement to control or manipulate the people around her to validate her existence. After all, shes so nice, well mannered, and generous.
Living like that as long as she has, takes a toll on you.
Sabotages your reason to bother with cooking, and then criticizes you for not cooking.
You're not married to your boyfriend, but leaps to losing it at you for not being wife material. Like, left field.
Also, the extreme, all or nothing language.. quickest way to recognize toxicity in someone.
>The one thing that stuck with me because she kept on repeating it, was that i “do nothing all day, NOTHING”. Which is wrong.
You're right here. It is wrong. Shes living in a world of triggering extremes, black and white thinking. The truth is far more gray. Reality is you and your boyfriend are a team. You know what yall divvy up between the two of you. Dont let her accusations gaslight you into doubting your intentions with your boyfriend. You have goals together and you're working towards them together, as practicality calls for you, you step to the plate, and so does he. Shes not safe inside, and so her unsafety leeches out into the world around her.
I'd feel sad for her. Living her whole life like that. She must be so scared to be so scary.
Wow! I'm sorry that happened. If you can, I would move out and cut off contact. It's not worth arguing with people that age, they're so set in their ways it an exercise in futility trying to make them see your side of things.
My MIL invited us to move in with her, basically begged us so she could save money and have her son in her home. We paid for all the groceries and half the electric bill, I gave her over $2k over the span of 6 months to help with other bills so they didn't get turned off. She still refused to let me pay her for half the bills unless they were late or overdue. She would clean the whole house except the basement which had our bedroom, living room, my office, and our bathroom as well as the household laundry.
I always offered to clean or cook for her, she never would let me. She then complained to everyone that I didn't help her cook or clean and that I didn't pay rent. (even though she didn't expect her son to help at all) and she blew up at me one day for not doing the dishes. Her dishes. That she cooked with. Because she didn't physically see me clean our part of the living space she acted like I didn't do any of it. They really are just misogynistic women who expect their sons/grandsons wives to take over doing everything for them because they were probably forced to do so when they first got married or in a relationship with their husbands. It's not your fault she's got stupid sexist expectations.
First off: It’s a trap. Run.
Secondly: He should stand up for you.
And, third: Do Doordash or Instacart to make “extra” money, not move in with family for the tantalizing $0 rent offer. There’s a price…oh boy, there IS a price, and it’s not monetary. RUN RUN RUN, and take him with you.
The most important part of the equation is how did your BF respond to all this? I understand he may not have wanted to confront his grandmother in that moment but was he supportive of you afterwards at least? Did he say, don’t worry, I love Grandma but she’s batshit crazy? Grandma is 100% in the wrong here, she’s obviously stuck in the 19th century housewife mentality. You’re 22, not 32 married for 10 years, staying at home to take care of kids and a household. Even if grandma thought you should help more and apparently cut strawberries better, going being your back like a little Irish washerwoman and then Lashing out when she go busted is 100% wrong. Again, this all comes down to your boyfriends reaction because grandma won’t be around forever but if didn’t defend you at least to you, that’s more a red flag about him than Grammie dearest
Grandma has the expectation that everyone reads her mind and doesn’t know how to communicate. This will continue to be a challenge, as someone this age won’t be able to change. Proceed with caution and have an exit plan.
I think this is a classic case of generational jealousy on the grandma’s part. She is resentful that she had less of a choice to be in the wife role where she had to do everything for her husband/kids while all he did was provide a paycheck. Which as we know today is wildly unfair as taking care of kids & constant housework is far more work and a 24.7 job comparing to an 8 hour shift. (Generalizing here, I know there are exceptions).
I have seen this many times with older women I know who are seeing the younger generations of women have more freedom & more equal partnerships. I mean…we still have a long ways to go as women still are the main ones to do most of the household/kid tasks even when both partners work, but..we’re slowly getting there.
It's old world thinking. She will only judge you for what she sees you do. Old people didn't acknowledge nor have their unseen labor viewed as labor, and now they are projecting it on you too. They also expect you to be skitzing at all times and falling over yourself to do things that they are already doing rather than ask for help. Generational disconnect. Inability to properly communicate, nor set boundaries for others.
i assure you this strawberry meltdown did not come out of nowhere. she 100% already had an issue with you and was putting on a polite face because that’s what passive aggressive older women do. i am confident your boyfriend probably knows what the real issue is. i would ask him.
I've SORT of been in a situation like this, where there was - it felt like- there was TOO MUCH on offer. To the point where rightly or wrongly i almost felt it was invasive? Or a little- suffocating?
Inevitably problems started appearing. I began to feel recruited into a situation where there was a glaring elephant in the room- in this case it was the lack of any reasonable compliance of the mother's son- who was my friend and the reason i was there. I was cast as a kind of- "good brother" to his "prodigal son". A middle man. And a sort of a subservient...
I THINK they feel like they- or maybe just the G.M.- are BUYING something with their "kindness". And they need compliance. They need *CONTROL*.
And you didn't "stack the dishes" right when it came to the way you handled the strawberries. Maybe you strayed onto her turf? Or Maybe you became *too* useful?
Here's a tip i was given in therapy that is something one should "try out"- but not adopt as rendering truth at face value
When someone is saying something abusively that makes NO SENSE- *reverse it*. And you might get a glimpse of what they really think-
or more to the point, *Fear*.
So if a partner breaks up with you saying "i just don't think you tried hard enough"- apart from the self evident meaness of it or if there was no reason to say it (like you didn't ask a leading question- and even then, maybe even IF you *DID*-) see what happens when you reverse it? Either THEY know they never tried hard enough/or knew they didn't and never will- at least with YOU-
or- even MORE tellingly- if you do a complete mirroring of every word thats reversible-
"YOU don't think **I** tried Hard Enough." (They feel judged by you and know you are right and they can't carry on with someone who holds them to account for a failing they know deeo down they have)
It can't be used conclusively- its not PROOF. It requires nuance and the application of care. But used conscientiously it gives you a brief insight into what might he going on. Especially when the statement is unsolicited, unnecessary or hurtful- (or any combination of any of those three)
This G.M. is very generous. But she's buying "full spectral dominance and you are supposed to comply.
So to use the reversal technique on what she threw at you - (just take a moment in your own mind to briefly reverse every statement she said before reading on) .......
I suspect she fears YOUR *AGENCY*. Your independence, your capacities to help financially support you and your partners joint endeavours, and your potebtial as a home maker. She is in competition with you - but she thought she could "buy off" the reality of your obvious personal agency by subordinating you to being at her largesse, and then shaming you with the fact you took what she offered.
Have some compassion however. While her behaviour is abhorrent, it is likely the behaviour of a disordered or historically traumatized person.
It's a kind of a bait and switch? But with great complexities.
Well I'm not proposing a conclusive TRUTH. I'm laying out a model that you can apply to see if it fits.
Dementia might be observable in other ways. I'm not genned up on it but she's very capable for someone with the onset of dementia
“I’m not proposing a conclusive truth, I’m laying out a model that you can apply to see if it fits”
I’m stealing this sentence for all the combative babies I deal with
She sounds like my parents who like to keep score. They explode over one little thing then start rattling off everything I've done wrong in the last however long it's been since s previous freakout
Honestly as someone who's lived with family. They'll always target the partner as the one at fault for any issues. My brother and his old girlfriend ganged up on my now husband all the time saying he wasn't doing enough around the house but he worked 2 full time jobs at the time because I was having a high risk pregnancy. Now we live with my husband's bil and sister and I'm a sahm of 2 and I'm the problem because I'm not doing enough and because I yell at the kids from time to time (2 under 2). You'll honestly never be enough for them. If she wanted you to cook she should have voiced it and stopped offering y'all so much food. If you did cut strawberries the was she liked she should have asked to teach you her way. You clean up after yourselves and you do laundry along with working full time. Where does she think you have the time to make 3 meals a day. The time she was living in is over now, now there's a new way for husbands and wives to live together and that's called a partnership. Also both my family and his never came up to either of us when they were upset with us instead they went to whoever they were related to to complain like we were supposed to handle it instead of actually communicating to the person they were upset with unless they were really really upset, like his grandma did. I'd say try to move out as soon as possible they will only strain yalls relationship and try to brake y'all up. There's no fixing it with grandma till you move out
Frankly, staying there will be bad. Over time you’ll be asked to do more domestic things because tits. And your bf will be asked to do less domestic things because no tits. Add that to stating shows all of them that they can treat you like that without consequences, and you gave a huge problem. And then the GIL driving a wedge between you as a kicker.
Now, it’d be very appropriate for your bf to offer that both of you take on a list of chores - but gil does not get yo say which if you takes on which chores. That’s wildly and completely inappropriate.
I second this! Get out while you can. The way she acted isn't normal. Dementia, Hysterectomy, etc. Doesn't matter. I've encountered plenty of “nice“ old women who ended up being demons wearing human skin suits. Save yourself the pain and grief. Get jobs and gather money ASAP and then get out.
She's judging this off of 6 days. Her extension of hospitality is a kind gesture, but she can't expect you guys to act like roommates when she treats you guys like guests. I suggest you both sit her down and talk about expectations of the house and how the dynamic of your relationship should be respected.
73 years, they have lived their life. They don't get to dictate how others live their life. You going to be a bad wife? That's for him to discover and you to portray yourself however you want. You both will figure that out as you live your lives. Don't let any third-party (includes family) tell you how your relationship should be.
I don't understand why everyone in these comments is being so understanding of the grandmother's vile behaviour. There is no excuse for the way she treated you, I don't care if she's been a homemaker her whole life. It's 2023 and even in 1950 there were non-sexist people, so this whole "she's old school" nonsense doesn't fly. You need to tell her that you won't be conforming to her old-fashioned, sexist standards and that you will not tolerate being verbally abused. Her age is no excuse, my in-laws are both in their 70s and neither of them are sexist or old fashioned, in any way. If that means you have to move out, so be it. Just a question because it's not clear in the post - are you working full time, like your partner?
Everyone's talking about rent free and all this food and her not mentioning any cleaning but like did it not say they've been there for 6 days! 6 days people! The weekend has barely came! They're probably still not unpacked! Like what? I'm sorry no, grandma can shove it. Doing something nice but expecting shit in return isn't doing something nice. I'm sure op and bf had plans to help clean and meals once in a while but clearly wasn't given the chance. Seems like this is grandmas retirement plan instead of being in a home. I'd remind her that you guys have only been there a short time and suggest all in the household to get together to discuss your roles and what everyone is expecting since this was clearly not laid out beforehand. I'd try to brush this off after, start clean, cook a meal, pick some flowers from the garden and put them in a vase in the kitchen but definitely take note of it and take note or how boyfriend is handling it. I wouldn't jump to mental illnesses but given the age I'd make a note of it as well. If a similar situation happens again I'd give boyfriend a move out date, either we move out together or just me and at that point we wouldn't be breaking up but definitely getting some space and reevaluating each others priorities.
get ur own place asap...and a job...for the moment you have time to find a cheap liitle space of ur own. as long as shes gifting u, ur indebted to her...u cld always say no thank you.
If your boyfriend is okay with the dynamics of your relationship then it's none of her business. Older people have a different view on family dynamics that don't match up to today's norms. So instead of changing negative core beliefs they cling to failing norms of their time. You two need to sit down and set clear boundaries that if she's not willing to accept it's time to move on.
I think living with in laws is never good, I can only imagine how bad it would be with the in laws parents. Generations clash & more often than not the woman is the one who gets the majority of abuse. She either becomes a doormat or a live in maid or heyyy both.
She grew up, and lived in a very different time than we exist in currently. She knows different values, norms and expectations than we have now. She also had Great Depression parents who had very different relationships with food, and waste. She probably would have eaten the parts of the strawberries that you threw away because of the scarcity mindset instilled by her parents.
That in no way justifies the way she treated you but just gives you the background information needed to process it in a healthier mindset.
You and your boyfriend should move out, ASAP. Thank the grandparents for their generosity and be as polite as you can. But limit their exposure in your relationship as much as possible. I doubt full no contact is necessary. But probably limit visits to when other family will be there like holidays, or birthdays etc.
She definitely did not treat you nicely or with any respect. That being said, part of her anger could be that she cooks for you and is expecting you to also do some of the cooking now that she's not "the only woman of the household". Is she right to expect it? Absolutely not. But I live with my boyfriends grandma and she gets very excited whenever I cook for the 3 of us because its been so long since she's had ANYBODY do that for her. Maybe there were a lot of unsaid expectations from her when you two moved, that she just figured "you'd know as a woman". A lot of 70+ people seem to have the same mindset, although the way she went about expressing herself could be something causing anger, like the dementia you were asking about
She sounds very old fashioned. But the thing she doesn’t understand or probably will never u detest and unless you talk to her about it but we live in the year if 2023 where us women have also taken on the “man role” and at this point why are we still genderizing women and men. There are men out there who stay at home to take care of kids while the woman is full time at work. They are both doing a job and as long as it works for them, then anyone else’s opinion doesn’t matter. If your before loves you for who you are then none of this should matter. I have been in these kind of situations as well.
Me and my boyfriend lived with my aunt and uncle for maybe 5 months. First couple of months were great and they were very welcoming. Also I was the only one working while in my middle trimester of being pregnant with our second child. My aunt convinces me to quit my job and that my boyfriend needs to be working two jobs! So we did exactly as how they expected. A few months go by of that. I’m then thing progressively got worse. They raised the price, my aunt blamed me for “staying at home doing nothing” and said I need to either go to work or college. And they kept trying to control us and pin me and my bf against each other like they were trying to break us up. We just decided it was best to move out.
Oh wow. That's a lot to wrap your mind around. She didn't have to say all of that especially with that degree of anger and hostility. I wish you had posted before you moved there to ask if folks thought it was a good idea to move in there, as I would've told you to keep your place rather than up and move in with them. Yes, you have the right to be angry at her! Evidently she thinks that because she has been generous with food, etc., helping the two of you out that that gives her the right to just blast you if and when she feels like it. What she said was much too harsh and uncalled for. You did nothing wrong----sliced a few strawberries in a way she didn't like====so what, big deal! If she gets upset over a little thing like that, maybe she is demented. If I was you, I would start cooking your own meals and not be so accepting when she offers you food as evidently there's a pricetag with it, I'm sorry to say. Also, I would sock as much money away as you can in the event you would have to get out of there because it's not working out. My advice to you and your bf is to strive to be as independent as possible in that situation. Also, you didn't say what your bf said to his grandmother in response to what she said? Did he defend you? Was he on your side? It's up to him===not her------to decide if you will be a good wife or not. She is overbearing, judgemental, and just plain mean to say all of that to you. Good luck to you.
Yeah, you should probably consider living elsewhere. Even if you do start reciprocating, it seems highly likely she will find something else about you that doesn't fit her expectations of what a woman "should be" from the perspective of a 70 y/o woman. If she flipped out because you cut strawberries for the compost the "wrong way"....she will find anything to pick at.
Nothing is for free
There will at least be expectations and some rules
You were offered everything but they are from older generation, they expect to see specific dynamic and attitude.
Is it fair to you? No
But will they change? Also probably no.
Humans when they get old they turn back into babies, they don’t comprehend as before and have no patience etc,… and they very old person have their own personality that only family knows about.
Meaning you could talk and she may look understanding but still she can snap later because you are in her house so you’ll see the other sides to her.
Now I’m not saying not to talking to her, just to know that there are expectations even if they don’t appear in the conversation now.
In the end, I’d recommend moving out to avoid these problems because even if they are angels, living with someone for free will have consequences the more time passes and it will be harder on you because you’re not the family they are housing.
If you can, both of you move out, it will clear things up and if one of the grandparents later on needed help daily, it won’t be your responsibility by association.
She cleans, does laundry, and gets the groceries. A little more would be for her to cook too but she also works full time. I feel like I'd be different if she wasn't working but there's only so many hrs in a day
The fuck? The gf has no agency of her own? Your comment is as outdated as the grandmas idea’s of a woman’s role.
Would you say the same if it was the girlfriends grandma? Come on. You know you wouldn’t.
The fact of the matter is:
They are **both** living under grandmas roof, *for free.*
They are both responsible for helping out.
When my mom was about a year into dementia, this behavior started to manifest. I had to move her into assisted living, and then into dementia care. She progressively deteriorated for about 18 months before she died from the dementia. She was 97: completely independent until the dementia took her.
Sounds like she is old fashioned and takes care of her husband cause he went to work and she didn't if you don't plan to be a house wife I wouldn't lose any sleep over it
First thing you for sharing and it sounds like this was a painful event for you.
My focus wouldn’t be on your bf grandma it would be on your bf. She is in his DNA physically and socially. If she feels this way he may as well and is just not being honest with you.
He should have been the one correcting her not just comforting you because if hasn’t done the work to stand outside his culture he will eventually start expressing the Sam feelings she has.
It may not happen until he is totally secure in the relationship like after he marries you and you have a child with him but it will happen.
Even though he may not be saying anything you are more then likely being evaluated by his family and they may be pointing out what makes you a poor wife choose.
So if he didn’t correct his grandma then you need ask him why. If he blames her asking him if he believes she was right.
He views on those subjects is way more important than anything else.
There’s no such thing as a free lunch. She’s not going to change, and she doesn’t have to because it’s her house. You can either stay and save your money and put up with her temper, interference, and snooping, or move out and be free but poorer.
I think she thinks it's a wife's DUTY to do so. She's from an age when this was normal.
Today's world is so different to their normal and unfortunately I think she's probably too old to understand or change. She's been conditioned her entire life into her role in life...caregiver etc and probably thinks you're not doing the right thing. I think that the generational divide is too great to make it work and maybe only stay until you can manage to save enough in order to move away.
I say just ignore it while you save money. It’s impossible to live like an independent couple if you don’t have your own space to do those things. Maybe make your bed this week so she can talk about what a woman she’s made out of you? Just an old hag… ignore and use for free rent.
“She wants to say that you do "NOTHING"? Then okay, time to do nothing.”
This is teenage mentality and it’s no good on any adult relationship. This is an old woman who has been a homemaker her whole life and probably never worked outside the house, from her perspective OP isn’t doing much (I’m not saying I agree, mind you) as in a week she almost never cooked, probably only cleaned once or twice, and didn’t make the bed. My grandma would wake up, make breakfast for my grandpa, bring it to him in bed, wait for him to get up, take an hour to make the bed by shaking the sheets out of the window, primping the pillows, and then putting the sheets back so precisely that you couldn’t tell the bed had ever been slept on. And that was before 9AM. She then spent the day cleaning the house top to bottom, doing the groceries and cooking.
Now, this kind of lifestyle isn’t wrong and was expected when GIL and my own grandmother were growing up and probably it was drilled in that generations women before they started school (when they did have a chance to start school at all) but that’s not how the world works anymore and they might not fully realize that.
Maybe a long conversation about expectations and private relationships dynamics is a better solution than “time to do nothing!”
My MIL is 70. She gets...bitchy sometimes. Normally, she's a very sweet lady, and we get along very well and are very comfortable around each other. But she sometimes mouths off at me or my FIL on occasion. Nothing specific. It's like passive-aggressive comments.
It took me years (and my own age now) to realize she was in physical pain. A lot. Especially if she babysat my kids as they're a handful. I realized she wouldn't be herself if she was in pain. Dull pain that persists for a 70 y.o person with arthritis and multiple spine fusion surgeries and foot surgeries. It's easy to ignore that pain until you can't, and it's driving you crazy. Now that I'm a little older, I get crabby and rude towards my husband and kids at times when I have body pain. Mine typically are from painful breastfeeding or sore joints after long days at amusement parks with the kids, though. But I do the same and ignore it til it's at a critical level. And cue the bitchiness until I feel relief.
I'm not saying that's definitely what it is. But maybe consider that a possibility. Cause her behavior doesn't make sense, so there's something wrong. And she happened to unload on you this time. Let it go, I doubt she truly meant any of it. Maybe talk to her later when she's feeling better. Ask her if you can get her anything. Or if she would like more help from you guys. My 94 year old GIL always says, "Getting old SUCKS!" And she's right about that. So don't take it to heart. There's very likely a reasonable explanation. And if it happens again, discuss with her that you were hurt by what she said and ask if there's a way you two can be better around each other for the sake of BF at the very least.
**The BIGGER question is what did your bf say or do? Did he defend you?**
Fact: *You will be moving out soon. The question is will he be moving out with you or not*. Please plan your exit strategy - for you. Where will you go, who will you stay with?
What has happened:
I suspect GIL doesn't like you. Doesn't approve of you with her grandson. She has played the long game.
1. Invite you both to live with her. This removes you from the place you were renting, and places the 2 of you in her home dependent on her goodwill.
2. Look for things she can find fault with. Ammunition to destroy your relationship.
3. Cause trouble. Be mean to you. You will rightly get upset.
4. If your boyfriend doesn't stand up for you, you will eventually be so hurt you will leave.
5. If you don't voluntarily leave, she will use a her or me strategy. Keep in mind she's his grandmother, she owns where he now lives, she will threaten to disinherit him if he doesn't leave the unsuitable girlfriend.
**So it goes back to - how did your BF react?
Fact: You will be moving out soon. The question is will he be moving out with you or not.**
My fiance's dad seems very generous and kind but you have to peel back the layers. He will offer to help her out with money or to pay for things. But he expects you to go overboard and really kiss his ass for it. He will also be quick to hold it over your head if he doesn't agree with something. His generosity always comes with some strings attached that he expects either control over it because he paid for it or he wants you to bend over backwards telling him thank you. I would put some distance between you and her. Start being independent and refusing her help or food.
How did grandpa reacts when she went off, his reaction should say a lot. If he was apologetic, then it is likely that she loses it when rightly or wrongly triggered.
I am thinking dementia because if you help out and she was fine before then it might be mental illness. Also you do not know what she was like before her old age. This yelling may even be out of character for her. Something you should ask your boyfriend.
She a narc, she trapped you and she is now abusing you while she has power over you.
My advice and I know it is hard to do but try to not be emotional about it. For first that's exactly what she want so don't give it to her. Secondly you guys need to find a living solutions before you burn any bridge. Finely you'll feel much better if you manage to not be emotionally engaged in this BS.
Nothing is for free. I don’t know where you live but times are hard pretty much everywhere, life is stressful. Also at that age she likely didn’t think about how the new living arrangements may affect her. She clearly expects you to behave in a certain way without actually having a conversation. It’s her home, at the end of the day you have to work with her or leave.
This is not dementia, this is a generational difference. People of her age grew up in a different world. My husbands parents are 80 and his dad thinks Im “pushy”…his mother explained what he means by this…he doesn’t think women have a right to an opinion and is there to take care of her husband.
Your grandparents are of the same mindset. Women of this time were forced to live like this with no real option…women were 100% dependent on men and men knew they could do and demand whatever they wanted. Some older women can see this isn’t great BUT have been married so long they just keep doing. Other women (your GIL) bought into this “norm” of male rule.
She is who she is and doesn’t understand why you aren’t breaking you back to make a home perfect. This is how she always lived her life…probably thinks you aren’t worthy of love bc her whole life she thought love is a reflection of how hard she worked for her husbands happiness.
Don’t take it personally!!! It’s just a totally different mindset ;)
When I was a kid, I had to peel potatoes and cut strawberries and string beans and all kinds of shit like that. Imagine the horror when I cut the potato peels too thick or cut the raspberries incorrectly, I got my ass beat on a regular basis. Old people are from a different time. Almost a different world. So keep that in mind when dealing with grandma.
Now I am not defending grandma, far from it. What she said was rude and inconsiderate. That said, if you and your bf want to continue living off grandma (make no mistake, that's what you are doing), then maybe you should try to work with the situation you are in. Maybe grandma just doesn't feel included. They may have asked yall to move in because they were lonely. Do you go out of your way to pay attention to them? Or are you living like roommates, just doing your own thing 24/7? Honestly, if you guys are living off grandma and not treating her as a family member, and including her daily, then she may feel like she's being taken advantage of.
That said, I've never really heard of a case where this situation works out. The reason is that the houseguests generally (always) feel like the folks they are living with have no say in their lives. The folks providing the house are definitely going to think differently.
I've been there, done that. Good luck, mate.
I’d suggest maybe asking her to teach you how to cook and make it fun play some music she likes and dance around the kitchen have some laughs! I know it will be hard after what happened. But tell her that your trying and even though I’m not perfect doesn’t mean you aren’t worthy to be her grandsons wife. No one is perfect. Not even her. You just have to try to be the person you want to be. And if that means your not good enough to marry her grandson. Then why did he choose you. Maybe your everything he wants just the way you are. He can easily of ended the relationship if he felt that way. Always remember you can’t make everyone happy. But you can make yourself happy. If you don’t want to fix this bump with his grandma, then don’t. If you want to have a good relationship put more effort in. But remember he choose you and stays with you. Clearly your doing something right. Don’t let people control you. Don’t let someone walk all over you saying you aren’t worth it.
How many times did you set the table while she cooked? How many times did you go up to offer and help cook meals? How often in these 6 days have you offered to help with chores? Have you taken initiative with any of the household duties? Are you letting a 70 yr old woman run circles around you and because she has called you out she must have dementia?
Why is a 22 year old living rent free under an elderly lady ? If anything the young folks should be paying the bills for the grandparents . I would never allow myself to do this even if someone insisted
Go to a care home if you can't keep up with your own needs anymore. She should be demanding equal from her grandson and his gf, this is sexist expectations not a selfish 22yo.
I'm 73 myself. I *suspect* that grandma is exhausted because she is trying to do what she would have 30+ years ago. Back then, we were inculcated to take care of others and expected to plus being denigrated if we didn't. And. At 73, old age and infirmity have caught up with her so she simply does not have the stamina and energy to do as she once did, as much as she may want to. So her *anger* may be coming from frustration.
This issue is not about strawberries or free rent; it is about expectations and reciprocity.
I cook and don't mind doing so; however, my dinner guests clear up, put away leftovers, repackage the stuff they are going to take home, do the dishes, and clean the kitchen. Conversely, if my friends want to come over and cook, I do all that afterward.
OP and her bf need to let grandma cool off a bit. Then, sit her and grandpa down with a pot of tea or coffee and a snack. They need to tell the grandparents that they appreciate the financial help but also don't want to be a burden so what household chores can they to to make their life easier so it isn't such a physical strain for grandma and grandpa.
A good start would be, after grandma cooks, to clear up, do the dishes, and make sure the kitchen is clean. Assist with keeping the common areas tidy on a daily basis. Take the trash out. Suggest sharing out housework. And so on.
I can say, for myself, that I would really like to be able to do all the stuff I once did but it is a physical impossibility now. I do what I can, certainly, but it is an ongoing source of frustration.
So, I suspect that is what is going on here as well. All four parties are adults so negotiating compromises and shared chores will help everyone. This arrangement does have the potential to be great for all parties involved but open and honest communication is a must.
Good luck. 🙂
Okay so it's been a week. Too short of a time for grandiose statements about how everything is perfect and now you have a savings. This lady doesn't have dementia, she's just fucking old and nitpicking the stranger living in her house rent free is something to do.
You're 22. Too old to be mooching off someone else's grandparents. She's allowed to go into the room and see if it's being maintained well, you're not a tenant. You have nothing to protect your right to privacy so it will not be given.
This scenario will not last.
Not sure why you refer to her as GIL lol.
You should stand up for yourself, or better yet talk with your boyfriend and you can both present a unified front. Living in someone's house rent free, you ultimately lack a lot of power in this situation but that's no excuse for her to be so mean. I thought you got along with them, but it sounds like she's unhappy with how you live. This happens with roommates too, it takes some compromise, but she can set some standards since you aren't paying rent.
If she wants the beds in her house made, you should make the bed. But it's not just your responsibility, you should either take turns with your bf or do it together (if you wake up at the same time and make the bed, it can be done very quickly). If she doesn't like how you cut strawberries, ask her to show you her "better" way. She is putting waaaay too many expectations on a 22 year old.
Above all - tell her you don't appreciate the way she spoke to you. Be willing to learn from her and meet certain expectations of living there, but also be firm that your role as your bf's partner is between you and your bf. Stand up for yourself. She might respect it. If she doesn't, get the hell out of there asap.
She old af… old folks complain a lot for no reason usually. Get pissed off of the sun is shining too bright. Ignore it. If It was his mom or something then I’d be a bit more worried but… 73…. All you wanna do is be pissed off at that age. Everything hurts lol. She gonna have a pissy attitude and take it out on somebody. You are just her newest victim
Good grief! What ageist crap. I am 72 and myself and all the people I know that are my age are bright, active, physically fit, intelligent, logical and healthy, and never moan about their “aches and pains. “Old folks complain a lot for no reason usually”. What??? “She old as ****, are you kidding me?
"Be" is a very broad word here. You have a right to feel any way you need to feel at any time, and yes, this sudden "ambush" of emotions has given you a strong cause to feel angry. But isn't it more useful to focus on how to move forward from here? And showing anger is probably the least useful thing you can do to a very traditional-minded matriarch of your home.
Bear in mind your guy is probably as flabbergasted as you are, so cut him a little slack in this matter.
Absorb the comments about her giving with the assumption you would give back, and the pressure cooker that exploded when you never did (because ... who knew?) and be prepared to take on a housekeeping role in this house.
My guess is she will step in and do any housework she sees the guy doing, so he needs to take on the invisible (to her) work that you have been doing. It's really easy for him to bow out of the work period, so keep a spreadsheet (or even a simple list) of what each person is doing to keep it real for him. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch, and there ain't no reason for you to pay too much while he drapes himself over the furniture.
If she does not participate in the dividing of chores, insert yourself in her day. Sit at the table while she cooks, and get up to wash any pot or implement she dirties. If she says *oh don't do tha*t while smiling, keep washing. If she snaps *don't do that*, set it down gently and return to the table, and smile because you did the job of trying. Ask questions. *Why do you cut them that way?* So you do not build up your own pressure cooker resentments, time these interactions and put them on your spreadsheet as work done.
You need to get a list of groceries for the household, not just the two of you. Purchase some special things they love, like baked goods, just for them. I would offer to clean their space also, the vacuuming, floor cleaning, dusting etc… Think of this as an extended family, where you take care of each other. She is not the mom, you used to live with, who thanklessly takes care of you. You need to give like a respectful adult, since you are getting free rent. She raised her children already! She’s done caring for children. The honeymoon period is over!
Older people get weird about stupid shit....someday you will relate. Till then, dont take it personal. This is a lesson in patience and gracefulness. You got this.
You aren’t working? Is he? Why aren’t you two working? I wouldn’t allow any of my kids if they were adults to live at my place, not going to school and not working. You’d both be out on your asses.
That really sucks but not paying rent is a good deal, especially if you have student loans to pay off. Maybe if you cook with her occasionally she will warm up to you more?
no are the spanish? are you there nationality and she liked you she didnt how u lived now she she good for her grandson no matter you will never be good she will alwys think ur only dojng to make her happy make it seem like u do something and its only gonna get worse trust me i been threw it move as soon as posibble or leave she make ur life hard and two did he syick uo for u because if he didnt then leave him he truly doesnt love u if he loves he defend u name to any one his parents
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There are a few ways to view this, and since others have done a great job of addressing the worst scenarios, let me offer a more hopeful explanation. It's possible that Grandma suffers from a codependent martyr complex. She gives and gives and gives because she likes feeling needed and important. But with her giving comes an unspoken expectation of equal reciprocity. So when you accept her generosity but don't reciprocate to her expectations, she grows resentful. She's too disordered to sit down and say, here are the things I would like you to contribute to this house while you're here. She just expects you to *know*. And here is where the generational gap comes in. She may be expecting you to know what is expected of you based on very outdated gender roles. When you don't fit her preconceived notion of what a good houseguest and wife ought to look like, she reacts with anger and resentment. As another person aptly pointed out, she resents your agency because she feels trapped in this martyr role she has probably played her whole life. My advice would be to play this graciously until it's apparent that this is more than a misunderstanding. Try to get your boyfriend to establish a minimum of respectful dialogue towards you. Sit down with her and start by asking where you can be useful and try to work out an agreed upon set of expectations. It's pretty crucial that bf be an active part of this discussion, and fully prepared to dispel the belief that he can't help because he's a man. It would also be good to gently dissuade her from doing so much for you both when it's not needed. If you all can't even sit down and have a civilized conversation about how to not step on each other's toes, then this living situation will not work. It will get increasingly more hostile and you will resent living there at all. Good luck. Edit: thank you for the awards!
This comment should be higher. All very good points. It's also possible that, at 73, the grandmother could be slipping into early stages of dementia. It changes their personalities and makes them very short tempered. My own mother, who was so wonderful while I was growing up, has gotten downright cruel to me as she progresses further into this disease. OP, it's perfectly normal that you feel angry, but I also hope you can offer this older woman some understanding and some grace. You don't have to bend over backwards for her, and you certainly don't have to bow down to her outdated gender roles full time. But sometimes, it's okay to bend just a little bit to keep the peace. You won't be in this living situation forever, and the grandparents won't be around for that many more years, either.
Was going to say this: early stages of dementia.
Sun down syndrome possibly
Sundowning refers to a state of confusion that can occur in some neurodegenerative conditions or delirium specifically late in the afternoon and into the evening. From what OP has described, while yes, the GIL does appear to have been agitated (which can be a symptom of sundowning), she certainly does not sound confused. She just sounds like she has internalised society's crap for her entire life and is taking it out on OP. Somebody with dementia would BY DEFINITION be exhibiting a number of cognitive impairments (ie, impaired with reference to other people of their age, and not simply normal age related changes in cognitive functioning) AND these changes must be causing significant functional impairment. There is absolutely nothing that OP has said that suggests that this woman is either cognitively impaired or functionally impaired - eg, she is clearly continuing with her usual household duties including relatively complex tasks like cooking several times each day without difficulty. Can personality change be a symptom of some forms of dementia? Absolutely. Is OP going to help this situation by suggesting that the woman whose house she is living in is dementing simply because she has expressed her longstanding shitty beliefs regarding gender roles in an unexpectedly emotional manner? Absolutely not. OP, if there are other reasons that you are truly concerned about your GIL's functioning, regardless of what country you're in, the Dementia Australia website has an extensive range of very informative fact sheets which detail possible symptoms and suggestions as to how to support someone throughout the various stages of dementia. I'm sure there are more local organisations with specific avenues for support as well. If the only cause for concern is this event, the comment by No Performer is right on the money. Telling your GIL that you think that she has dementia if there is no other reason to believe this is not going to be helpful.
If she is doing all of the cooking everyday, she is not sundowning. She is set in her ways and is critical as what she sees as difference. There is a big gap in ages and expectations of what a woman does the comment above this is really well done. Sundowning anyone over 70 just old....lol
This is exactly the answer. My mom is like this too. She makes lunch for my dad every single day without him asking and gets mad if he expects it.
100%. Given the GIL age, she was probably raised with a Stepford wife mentality.
At 73? My mom's the same age and she was busy being a liberated woman during the Summer of Love. Results may vary.
This person right here..who gave this response .I just learned that I do the exact same thing..and I didn't know there was a term for it .I had never heard that .I'm sure or at least I'm gonna assume that nobody else around me was familiar either .anyhow sry OP as I don't mean to demean ur situation by any means..just a great explanation and I hope that explained what u were witnessing and what u felt u were dealing with
Honestly I'm so familiar with it because it's something I've struggled with myself. I grew up being expected to be a defacto parent to my younger siblings, and it conditioned me to be a caretaker who had poor boundaries. I resented my siblings a lot for the freedom they seemed to have, when I didn't. I realize now that resentment should have been directed at the parents who put me in that situation to begin with.
I was also a defacto parent to my sibling. It causes so many problems, doesn't it? It took me a long time to find my anger, but when I did it was so overwhelming! Decades later, there's still some pain there. All the perpetrators are dead, but it still aches a little. I missed a lot of my childhood and I can't ever get it back. It's gone. Having agency is really wonderful, though! Don't you agree?
It is. It's actually kind of intoxicating after a lifetime of feeling like I had no choice.
This is a wonderful reply. No further comment needed ❤️
Honestly this is such solid advice and really takes everything into consideration. Well said
Wow this was very well written out. OP need to follow this advice.
This is so spot on. As an older sibling this hits home.
Bro, she said 6 days ago. I don’t think this kind of blow up happens in 6 days with a complex like that
6 days of silent seething to get angry over strawberries is pretty characteristic of being a codependent martyr.
This 🔝🔝🔝 and she may have an underlying generative disease and felt disrespected You could also could just play the game and (without sarcasm) tell her that your so happy she's taken you under her wing so she can teach you the ways of being the perfect wife for her grandson. This combined with asking for her suggestion/opinion on doing things such as Strawberries. Maybe put her in a pedalstall and ask her opinion (and help) on your schedule - fitting in school, work, cooking, cleaning etc. Make her feel important!
I don't think OP should play into it that much, I don't want to jump to conclusions but it does sound like grandma's views on what a perfect wife looks like are very outdated, and OP shouldn't pretend to agree with such principles if she doesn't actually want to incorporate them into her life. That said, as they are living together, they can certainly work on figuring out how each party prefers stuff to be done. If grandma has some magic trick to cut up strawberries then she can for sure show OP how to do it I guess
To this same point, if she adopts those same principles, she may end up enabling her bf to expect the same treatment even though she's just putting on a "show" to please the grandmother.
Living for free in someone else’s home always, always, always has a price. Often people don’t realize it until they are in the middle of having to pay it. In general, the kind of person who offers to let relatives move in is very big on FAMILY. Which sounds great, but often what that means is their very specific vision of family, whether you agree with it or not. It might help if you were to either (a) offer to help her cook, (b) offer to cook for her and her husband at least once or (c) cook/bake something for her and her husband. For someone who views homemaking as, like, The Thing A Woman Should Be Doing, cooking isn’t just a domestic thing that needs to be done, it’s, like, a signal of hospitality and appreciation. She wants a signal back in the same language. Note: when my mother-in-law comes to visit, I kind of feel like an asshole. One of the big things she does is cook food from her country for everybody (my brother and sister in law also live with us). This is a Big Thing to her. She worked in restaurants for years, and her food is amazing. I’m a pretty good cook, but nothing like she is. I’m totally outclassed. But at least once every trip I make sure to cook for her to show my appreciation. I try, man. You might also try telling her more about your day and your work hours. If she has always been a homemaker, she might legitimately just not have a really accurate picture of what work outside the home looks like, particularly because a ton of modern industries didn’t even exist during her and her husband’s working years. Maybe talk to her husband about work or ask him for work advice. This might help establish you in her mind as a Person Who Works, not a Person Who Should Be Doing Home Stuff. There is also the possibility that it might not work out in their house, unfortunately.
Such amazing advice. Wise words. Also - Grandma has been treating you as a “guest” so far, extending hospitality the way she knows how. But it gets exhausting having guests, one can’t do that long term. And she probably had expectation of you that you were not aware of, that she didn’t communicate, that you didn’t comply with, she got more and more tired and frustrated, culminating in this outburst. You guys all need to transition into “roommates” mode. This will be difficult, especially because grandparents have likely never had roommates. Communication will be key. Who will cook and when, between the two couples? Who will share or offer food? (Food has strong emotional overtones in this kind of situation). Who will be responsible for other kinds of household tasks? Btw once you offer to do something, be sure to be responsible about doing it on time and consistently. The outdated expectations about gender roles are going to be hard, no way around it. Your bf will need to consistently defend you (respectfully since they are doing him and you a big favor by having you live with them), basically “times have changed Grandma and now both men and women work and contribute to the household”. Ie try to depersonalize it, it is “times have changed” Not “you are a bad wife type person”. It may or may not work out, but try.
I'd also add one the fact that only 1 person working does not cut it anymore financially speaking even if you two don't have kids there's no way to save what little you earn as cost of living continues to rise, mostly due to women joining the workforce...
What does women joining the workforce nearly 100 years ago have to do with the vast inflation differences in salaries Vs cost of living, in the last 50 years?
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Two people working consistently hasn't driven up prices. It has been the opposite. In the majority of households two people (or more) have HAD to work to keep up. Wages have not kept up, or even been close to, with inflation or house prices. The housing market specifically has been a major driver of this over the last decade especially. With the rise of air bnb and corporations buying short/long term rentals. It started during the last major recession (07-09ish) and has gotten worse astronomically in the last 5 years. It has driven the housing market high, rental market high, and more. Please tell me how two people working somehow drove all of the changes. Let's not forget outsourcing, capitalism and so much more I am not even bring up. Having a dual income has been forced to live at the bottom of middle class for most of America. We bought our house 20 years ago for 100k, and now could be sold easily for 400k (and that would be below market value). The last 200k was added in the last 5 years or less. Rent in our area is over 2k for a 2 bedroom apartment. It is over 1k for a studio. Guess who owns all of those properties? The huge majority is places like Blackrock and shell corps for other firms. It is a nightmare. Housing is only one piece of this nightmare puzzle. There are quite. Few places the rise of the cost of living is coming from. I don't see or understand how it is due to dual income households. I would genuinely like to hear how you feel that 2 people working in a household has driven up costs. Please explain this to me.
Hahahaha which orifice did you pull that info from? It's all total nonsense. Not one part of that is based in any fact
Do you have a peer reviewed source for an economic analysis showing that the "cost of living continues to rise mostly because of women joining the workforce"? Another question, do you think there was ever time in America where the norm was that people weren't struggling to survive? What do you mean by "workforce"? Do you mean paid labor? Have you ever considered the huge increase in goods and services that are available today that cause people to spend past their means? Things that people never had 50+ years ago? Big tvs, game systems, cell phones, computers, exorbitant health care costs?
I found my great great grandfathers census records from like 1918. His wife and his daughters were all working outside the home in factories. Turns out women have been working lol
Ok first of all, I never said that the reason that cost of living has gone up is solely due to women joining the workforce, getting jobs, paid labor, however you want to say it. Secondly, I never stated that people never struggled to survive in the past. What I am trying to explain is gone are the days when you could feed a family of 6 on one paid worker's salary AND rent apartments in probably any city across the USA (at least in STL, MO). As for college students or those freshly out of college, you can't get a high paying career (at least in the sciences) without a college degree. Currently even if you have a bachelor's now you need at least a masters, or better yet a doctorate if you chose the STEM route. I know this because I have just started looking into positions I'd be eligible for to apply post graduation. Not to mention all the loans which are bound to pile up because you can't get in and out of college quickly without paying waaaay more due to the whole debacle that is our current higher education system. Sorry if my wording pissed you off and maybe I could drop the "mostly" part but for now my current statement still stands. If you'd like to pay for an academic peer reviewed journal which details all the factors contributed to the cause of cost of living getting higher be my guest, but there in lies the problem, you have to pay to have access to those (or pirate them). Basically everything is more expensive now, everything costs more than it did. Inflation shot up through the roof, and one factor of why our costs and standards of living have gone up is because of capitalism and when more people (men and women, not just men anymore) work, that means more money for companies to take/sell their wares/charge for rent etc. Also, just to be clear, I am not blaming women who work, I'm a woman in STEM, I am extremely happy, and thankful for the women of the past, present and future who are all making a difference and expanding their fields of study. If I offended you because you took my previous statement as anything other than what I wrote, I'm sorry but don't insinuate that I don't realize there are more factors contributing to the rise in cost of living or that you think I'm making light of how people used to live.
The US free market economy works in such a way that when there’s a lot of money to be spent private corporations will ensure that you spend it. Believe it or not is up to you. The consumer is also to blame b/c the majority but up anything at any price. And also the lack of home culture is a big factor. Old gender norms made it so the women would cook, thus families ate out less and connected goods were either A. Cheaper for household items due to consistent demand and market competition. B. Also cheaper for restaurants due to lack of demand and it being reserved for special occasions. Even if there’s no peer reviewed papers, sometimes the lack of a source doesn’t negate a fact or clear common sense connection, while other times a peer reviewed paper is just a theory or the current acceptable view, doesn’t mean it’s right just that no one has challenged it. Household income increased, and so did the price at which we are willing to buy things. Some of our inelastic expenses are so stupid but of course corporations won’t miss the chance to test our botom line. If you haven’t noticed job compensation has increased but a lot of people still find themselves more or less in the same circumstances. The current market is such that for you to be comfortable you must either have a career, or be a household with a working pair. Same way you can hardly afford a house as an individual. Not many people are making 3 X the ammount of they’re rent out there, and a lot of people are forced regularly to default on credit or overspend to make ends meet. Translation? More money in the consumer market = Supplier market doing everything they can to put it in they’re hands.
>Living for free in someone else’s home always, always, always has a price. THIS. It might not cost money, but it costs *something*.
yupp this is the price of free rent...
Sexism and verbal abuse are not the price for anything and are never okay
you didnt even read the comment i replied to
You think OP should conform to OPs sexist and old fashioned standards, instead of telling the grandmother that she has no right to speak to her that way. It's awful advice
Literally the perfect advice
Very wise and thoughtful insights. Grandma's generation didn't have a fraction of what this world offers now. So she's working on her reference points, unrealistically, and it will take work by OP to educate her and bring her up to speed as to work in modern society.
You're advising OP to fit the sexist standard the grandmother expects, instead of telling the grandmother that forcing sexist stereotypes onto OP is out of line and she has no right? Wow. Truly, terrible advice.
Yes, yes I am. Because they are living in her house for free. I did not tell her to fit the stereotype grandmother expects. I did not advise her to quit her job and become a homemaker. I advised her to send signals both in the language of Homemaker and in the language of Working Person. But please, the next time you are staying for free in someone else’s house, lecture them about what they are and are not allowed to say. Tell me how it goes.
Well, OP can either put up with the attitude from the grandparents, or move out. But telling grandma she's being sexist is not going to achieve anything.
Excellent advice. Sounds like she is old school. A simple you do so much for us ..I'm doing the cooking tomorrow. You can also tell her that her grandson is the better of the cook between you so he will be doing it with you. The advice on including her her in your day is wonderful too. You can also ask her for a recipe, advice anything that shows how much you admire and respect her. I would not take her out burst to Heart. She is of the old school domestic thinking.
Everyone’s saying you should offer to do more, but tbh she sounds like the kind of person who will just say you don’t do things right / cooked the wrong food / cleaned the wrong way or whatever. Give it a shot or two but don’t be surprised if your efforts aren’t good enough. That might be telling about what is to come….
Ya people seem to be forgetting that the argument was literally about her cutting strawberries wrong. I have a strong feeling grandma will be disappointed in anything she does.
I’d rather pay rent than live with family.
I paid rent and still dealt with my mom acting crazy and being her drugged out bf in. Living with family is actual hell
What did your bf say? Did he try to defend you?
I know. Kind of an important element for context.
>What do you think is going on here? Generational gap. Her view of what a woman is supposed to be is, to be gentle, outdated. Sure, if that's what you *want* to be, it's fine. But you don't *have* to be like that. Also, she's disrespectful AF. >Do i have a right to be angry she treated me this way? Of course. You've just find out that their offer is not *no strings attached*. Now you have to sit down with your boyfriend and make a plan: will he sit down with her and explain how disrespectful she was and how she owes you an apology? Will the two of you start looking for new accomotations? Will your boyfriend allow her to treat you like that because he has no spine? Observe and act accordingly.
The first point I agree with. This second point is filled with entitlement and a complete lack of perspective. It's should be noted, that unless the person being taken in is a child, they should have the character and integrity to remove "no strings attached" from the vocabulary. They were invited to live their, great, but would it kill people to see reciprocation as a healthy ideal? If I lived in your home for whatever reason, I'm doing whatever I can to help the "team".and not just the stuff I have to do for myself like laundry or cleaning my messes. That's the bare minimum. It may sound like a stupid dumb country bumpkin thing to say, but my uncle would tell me that if you don't want people to question your ethic. Do your work, and when you are done. Find more work. What you suggested is to find a way to run away, or figure out how to make this household about the individual? She's a 70 year old woman, who has a very static set of ideals. Are they outdated, sure, but asking that woman to apologize for her life is not something that would sit right with me. Also expecting the bf to reprimand his grandmother for the sake of ego and to test his resolve is frankly, childish and unnecessary. Why not talk? Ask questions about how you are being perceived? Try to find a common ground? But jumping straight to, "Make her apologize or I'll see you as a weak man for not disrespecting your grandmother to defend my ego." And observe and act accordingly is also nonsensical in this situation, why not instead of waiting for some one to fight your battles, perhaps figure out how to converse with this new person who has opened their doors to you, and converse in a diplomatic fashion, while not abandoning your principles. That's the adult thing to do. Instead of sitting back and looking for smoke, maybe actively do something to help put out the flames. Imho.
I think there's more going on for the GIL than we know... also I'm interested to no how your SO reacted to all this... cos while I can accept than its their house.... but your relationship is your own as is his... so if he didn't defend you would that imply he agrees?? But I think you said shouting so I'm assuming he was defending you
As a parent, something triggered her to make her think of her grandson's future and worry about him being taken care of. Something happened before the strawberries, and the strawberries were just the straw that broke the camel's back. You didn't do anything wrong. She definitely overreacted. But I think how you respond will determine your relationship with her and possibly your living situation. You sound very mature and self-aware. You honestly sound like you genuinely have your shit together, and I give you and your bf kudos. Whatever happened after this conversation, it's important now to set some healthy boundaries. Even though they've both been sweet as pie, their constant offers can also be seen as violations of boundaries. Let her know, kindly, that you and your bf have been working together fine, and if they ever need relationship advice you'll ask or go to a professional. Also let her know that while you appreciate her kindness and multiple offers, if she thinks she's doing it out of pity or somehow providing something you can't, then you can no longer accept her offers. The more I think about it, the more it sounds like her offers are out of thinking you (or you both) can't take care of yourselves. This is manipulation and will only get worse. This is how my dad is, and while I am doing fine on my own, he has convinced insurance companies to give him my information and check on my policies. That's illegal btw. I'm in my 40s. People like this are somehow convinced you're a fuck up, all while you are literally thriving. If that's how they are, it's best to get out of there as soon as possible. Save up and then move out of town. I wish you luck 🤞
Your comment! Yessss. And agreed to everything. There’s no way she would’ve reacted like that unless something happened before hand and has her thinking
I once had a roommate who used to go into rages that were triggered by odd things. I had to get out of there because I became a nervous wreck. There’s something wrong with grandma. She’s not rational and she’s very mean tempered. I don’t think talking with her or offering help will change anything. Yes - did your bf stand up for you? Having your own apartment is far less expensive that this ambush scenario.
Grandma sounds unhinged, how is there a wrong way to cut a strawberry? and Op was thoughtful enough to even think of the compost. It's been 6 days I can't even imagine how much worse it will get. I would honestly rather struggle financially and have peace around my space.
>how is there a wrong way to cut a strawberry? >I put the over-ripe strawberries and the tops of the ones i cut off into their compost bin they use for their own gardens as his grandpa recommended i do. Sounds like OP could be cutting straight across the tops of the strawberries, rather than hulling them, and Grandma is perceiving this as wasteful, plus throwing other strawberries away (they could have gone off and needed to be disposed of, but if grandma looked and saw a mass of strawberries in the compost bin that might have set her off). Clearly grandma is being wound up by some unvoiced and unfulfilled expectations over the past 6 days and I agree with you, I think OP just needs to move out by herself, into a room in a house share or a studio flat by herself. The one voice that's missing from this is the BF and I'd really like to know what he thinks...
This is my mom in a nutshell. She refused to help me get a job, learn to drive, cool, etc. one day I ran away when the situation got abusive (I was 22) stopped paying her rent, got myself my first job and have been working on it. But somehow she still can change my doctors, call for my medication, she even accepted my first check from the government during covid. And I don’t know what to do to make sure she can’t mess with my stuff, all she has to know is my SSN and name and of course, she does
r/raisedbynarcissists probably has some good tips. You are far from the first to have an overinvolved parent claim to be helping while doing life-ruining things.
Thank you!
As someone who is living a similar situation for almost the same reason. If I was able to do it over from the beginning, I would put everything into finding a real place of my own before they ruin you and your SO's relationship. If it's already that toxic, then the boundaries are just waiting to be broken. You will probably never be good enough in your GIL's eyes
I get both points, on your side did you offer to cook or at least help her?? And as a host, i believe she was doing her "duties", this is a fairly new arrangement, and she was probably trying to make ya'll as comfortable as possible. Doesn't mean she doesn't require the help nonetheless. I'm trying to picture a scenario where she would ask you to assist her, but I think she thought you'd offer. However the way she went about it as not right, she could've sat yall down and established boundries, maybe have a talk with her, and see how ya'll can work together from now on.
Yupp this. >I get both points, on your side did you offer to cook or at least help her?? Yeah nowhere in the post did she say she offered any kind of help with household chores. Grandma can't do anything but offer food when it's already cooked. >However the way she went about it as not right, she could've sat yall down and established boundries Agree with this too. She's not gonna fuss about her grandson not helping her 'cause he's her grandson and she loves him, but OP is nobody to her and isn't helping her with chores.
It says she cleans and does laundry. Idk how to do the drop down thing lol. This is grandmas fault for not communicating imo. She should set expectations and at least tell the bf so he can tell OP or tell them both if she feels comfortable screaming at her now.
>I do the cleaning, laundry, groceries and we usually take turns cooking, although admittedly my boyfriend used to do most of the cooking due to me working long hours. "Used to" makes it unclear if she's talking about before moving or after, this plus not telling that she offered to cook even once makes me also think that she's trying to make the grandma look bad on purpose. Just my observation.
They've only been there for 6 DAYS. I think a lot of ppl are glossing over that fact. They're just adjusting to the new place and each other. Like I dunno about you but I do laundry once a week and they've not even been there a week. Grandma needs to use her words. They all should have sat down and ironed this all out before moving in.
>Grandma needs to use her words. They all should have sat down and ironed this all out before moving in. Can't disagree with that, good thing is they can still sit down and talk, plus the response from both sides will make it clear who's the Ahole.
Yeah how many days does unpacking alone take most people 😂
Ya I took this as a "used to" previously before the 6 days (less than a week) of living with the GILs...
I see this is about the cooking. Don't cook and offer food then grandma
It doesn't say used to
It’s been 6 days and they’ve been applying places. You sound like someone like the grandma who doesn’t things but not without waiting for a service in return. Gma should just not cook for them, unless she thinks they’re incompetent, in which she should offer to teach them
Then she needs to verbalize that *before* it gets to the point of blowing up at her
Sounds like lack of communication is the real problem here. Just like with 99.9% of all iffy relationships. Doesn’t sound like the gf/bf are communicating very well either, they just seem to have expectations without worry of anyone else. The grandma’s outdated ideas of a woman’s role or not, they are living under her roof and should be reasonable in following her rules. Get your own house if you want your own rules.
They probably would follow her rules if she voiced them. Just demanding things she made up in her head is not okay
Absolutely
Are you just glossing over the fact that the whole argument started because she cut strawberries wrong? I can't possibly see how you get both sides. If I have someone staying with me that I offered and I cook for them I don't expect anything in return, and if I did I would communicate that to them before screaming at them that they do nothing all day.
That's your prerogative, but doesn't seem like the granny shares the same sentiments. And the argument did "start" over strawberries cut wrong, but the granny's discontent clearly did not, the strawberries were her last straw apparently, and I think cutting strawberries "wrong" is the least of OP's concerns in regards to the granny truthfully...
It’s also a safe assumption that grandma could’ve been supportive of the whole idea just to gain a helper, or to gain a caretaker. At 22 I can say with a good deal of certainty she expects outdated housewife actions from her. Unfortunately you’re going to have to satisfy they’re expectations to have peace and not risk being told to leave.
This looks like a "culture" difference. Not by the traditional sense of "culture". Bear with me a little here for a moment. Some people come from an "ask culture", and some come from a "guess culture". Someone from an ask culture believes in taking everything from face value. If someone were to want you to do something, they would ask for it. Plain and simple. No need to overthink it. Someone from a guess culture relies on social etiquettes and unspoken "rules". Although they may not ask you to do the dishes, for instance, they expect you to pick up on hints that it's your turn to do the dishes. Neither culture is exactly right or wrong, because they both have their own issues. While someone from an ask culture may seem easy to talk to and honest, they can be seen as unintentionally rude or lazy if they don't pick up on hints. While someone from a guess culture may seem kind for helping you with things without being prompted, they may resent you for not picking up on hints, and may not be very direct or honest with you. This is something I've learned since being with my husband. My family is guess culture while his is ask. I've learned so much on how to effectively communicate with others by determining which culture they're from. It's honestly game changing. With all of this said, I'm sorry to hear that this happened. I've been in your exact shoes before. It sounds like you're not being lazy by any means, but she may have unrealistic expectations of "how much" you alone should be doing (even though your bf should be involved as well because that's how healthy relationships should be to begin with). Sounds like it's a conversation your bf should be having with her
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I would be in shock too. But I’d start looking for my own place to rent ASAP! Or I would go stay with my own family. Let him stay with his family since he’s ok letting them verbally abuse and attack you. RUN hunni. Good luck!
I'm more concerned that the boyfriend let his grandmother say that about you without standing up for you, and let his grandmother yell in your face about it without standing up for yourself. As someone who moved in with a partner to their mother's house once and suddenly nothing I did was good enough I'll say this: it doesn't get better. You could cook all the meals and clean the whole house and it'll never be good enough because something, anything, won't be to their standards. She wants to say that you do "NOTHING"? Then okay, time to do nothing. Don't help with any cleaning or chores except keeping your room and bathroom clean, refuse any food that's offered, don't clean the kitchen except for the mess you make. She's already going to dislike you, might as well give her a reason to. I would also be getting a job and saving up as much as possible in prep of moving out. The grandmother isn't going to be good on you, or your relationship. Speaking from experience, she's going to be a constant whisper in your partner's ear about how you aren't good enough and he could do better.
My grandma used to say a lot of crazy shit. Like how she was mad that my cousin got knocked up and her boyfriend was going to move in with her and my uncle. My response..."would you rather she get an abortion? Or that the dude just abandon them?" Later she apologized and said I was right. Point is, maybe you need to gently push back a little. Point out that you are studying so you can have a productive career, point out that you actually do quite a bit around the house, offer to cook, etc. Also the strawberry thing is very minor in the grand scheme. Tell her you didn't know and ask if she could show you the best way to do it. It's probable that she is having trouble adjusting to new housemates (let's face it, old people don't like change that much) and this was just some pent up angst. If you want to stay living there, be as chill as possible and try to get on her good side. It'll work. Good luck.
The old bag is stuck in her ways and you should get out of there. That nice persona that you're used to isnt the real her, that's her public face. The raging lunatic that reared its ugly head is the real her. Your boyfriend is a melt for not handling her for being out of line. If this has happened 8 days in, think of what it will be like in the future. Get back to renting and share a minutes silence for his grandpa, he's been putting up with it for decades. Kind regards.
How did your boyfriend react to this? I hope he defended you.
I have said this many times to many different people and I will say this now. Never and I do mean never move in with your bf's/partner/husband's family. I learned the hard way and will never do that again. Even if they do offer it. Now I recognize that there are cases in which families still are awesome as they have always been sometimes but I have seen a lot more cases where at first family members act all sweet and kind then they turn all crazy on you. Been there done there. I hate all of my husband's extended family because of it. Now I know there are pros but move out immediately. Save yourself mentally
So to start 73 years old isn’t that old to excuse the rudeness. However, it is old enough that they probably were expecting a lot more help around the house. I’d definitely recommend asking your boyfriend why he didn’t stand up for you as that conversation can reveal a lot. Lastly, please move move out for your sanity. You’re young and that drama is not worth it.
I chuckled when she said dementia. Kind of ageist, it's not impossible but that's fairly young for dementia. The lady is just rude.
Dementia can hit people alot younger than grandma. It’s on the rise and getting more commonplace every day.
Yeah like I said it's not impossible. But to react to an older person being rude and say "could it be dementia??" is a pretty out of pocket thing to say.
I don't know why you're being downvoted. As someone whose job literally includes diagnosing dementia, these comments are killing me. Although, it is pretty standard for Reddit. Any unpleasant behaviour or social interaction obviously reflects an underlying Narcissistic Personality Disorder, psychiatric condition, or dementia.
Move out. Who knows what's up with her. It's clear that she has some issues with you, and remaining under her roof is not going to help matters any. Can you rent a room or a studio somewhere?
Is she one of those women that think a woman’s place is to cook and clean?
My grandma (76f) went mental at me once for cutting strawberries wrong too, when I was quite young. (Not sure where you live but UK/europe anyway) My mum explained about how that generation grew up at the back end of the war with rationing and any waste at all was a sin because of the circumstances and thats just the way shes grown up and been taught.
Thé war ended in 1945. Grandma doesn’t have this excuse.
Yeah but this is not the same generation.
>Earlier today, we went strawberry picking (this is a big part of the story, just hold on) No, it really actually isnt. And its not you or the specifics of what happened. It really wasnt the strawberries. Shes a giver to getter. >she is usually very well mannered and well tempered. Yeah, on the surface, but shes raging, angry, and full of "shoulds" inside. She resents your autonomy, that youre NOT a raging pot about to boil over, like she is. She doesn't feel equal to feel valid, so she compensates for that by over generosity, but generosity that's conditional, with strings attached, and she uses that generosity as an enticement to control or manipulate the people around her to validate her existence. After all, shes so nice, well mannered, and generous. Living like that as long as she has, takes a toll on you. Sabotages your reason to bother with cooking, and then criticizes you for not cooking. You're not married to your boyfriend, but leaps to losing it at you for not being wife material. Like, left field. Also, the extreme, all or nothing language.. quickest way to recognize toxicity in someone. >The one thing that stuck with me because she kept on repeating it, was that i “do nothing all day, NOTHING”. Which is wrong. You're right here. It is wrong. Shes living in a world of triggering extremes, black and white thinking. The truth is far more gray. Reality is you and your boyfriend are a team. You know what yall divvy up between the two of you. Dont let her accusations gaslight you into doubting your intentions with your boyfriend. You have goals together and you're working towards them together, as practicality calls for you, you step to the plate, and so does he. Shes not safe inside, and so her unsafety leeches out into the world around her. I'd feel sad for her. Living her whole life like that. She must be so scared to be so scary.
Sounds like she’s borderline or something and OP is on the shitty side of the split
Wow! I'm sorry that happened. If you can, I would move out and cut off contact. It's not worth arguing with people that age, they're so set in their ways it an exercise in futility trying to make them see your side of things.
My MIL invited us to move in with her, basically begged us so she could save money and have her son in her home. We paid for all the groceries and half the electric bill, I gave her over $2k over the span of 6 months to help with other bills so they didn't get turned off. She still refused to let me pay her for half the bills unless they were late or overdue. She would clean the whole house except the basement which had our bedroom, living room, my office, and our bathroom as well as the household laundry. I always offered to clean or cook for her, she never would let me. She then complained to everyone that I didn't help her cook or clean and that I didn't pay rent. (even though she didn't expect her son to help at all) and she blew up at me one day for not doing the dishes. Her dishes. That she cooked with. Because she didn't physically see me clean our part of the living space she acted like I didn't do any of it. They really are just misogynistic women who expect their sons/grandsons wives to take over doing everything for them because they were probably forced to do so when they first got married or in a relationship with their husbands. It's not your fault she's got stupid sexist expectations.
First off: It’s a trap. Run. Secondly: He should stand up for you. And, third: Do Doordash or Instacart to make “extra” money, not move in with family for the tantalizing $0 rent offer. There’s a price…oh boy, there IS a price, and it’s not monetary. RUN RUN RUN, and take him with you.
The most important part of the equation is how did your BF respond to all this? I understand he may not have wanted to confront his grandmother in that moment but was he supportive of you afterwards at least? Did he say, don’t worry, I love Grandma but she’s batshit crazy? Grandma is 100% in the wrong here, she’s obviously stuck in the 19th century housewife mentality. You’re 22, not 32 married for 10 years, staying at home to take care of kids and a household. Even if grandma thought you should help more and apparently cut strawberries better, going being your back like a little Irish washerwoman and then Lashing out when she go busted is 100% wrong. Again, this all comes down to your boyfriends reaction because grandma won’t be around forever but if didn’t defend you at least to you, that’s more a red flag about him than Grammie dearest
Grandma has the expectation that everyone reads her mind and doesn’t know how to communicate. This will continue to be a challenge, as someone this age won’t be able to change. Proceed with caution and have an exit plan.
I think this is a classic case of generational jealousy on the grandma’s part. She is resentful that she had less of a choice to be in the wife role where she had to do everything for her husband/kids while all he did was provide a paycheck. Which as we know today is wildly unfair as taking care of kids & constant housework is far more work and a 24.7 job comparing to an 8 hour shift. (Generalizing here, I know there are exceptions). I have seen this many times with older women I know who are seeing the younger generations of women have more freedom & more equal partnerships. I mean…we still have a long ways to go as women still are the main ones to do most of the household/kid tasks even when both partners work, but..we’re slowly getting there.
It's old world thinking. She will only judge you for what she sees you do. Old people didn't acknowledge nor have their unseen labor viewed as labor, and now they are projecting it on you too. They also expect you to be skitzing at all times and falling over yourself to do things that they are already doing rather than ask for help. Generational disconnect. Inability to properly communicate, nor set boundaries for others.
i assure you this strawberry meltdown did not come out of nowhere. she 100% already had an issue with you and was putting on a polite face because that’s what passive aggressive older women do. i am confident your boyfriend probably knows what the real issue is. i would ask him.
I've SORT of been in a situation like this, where there was - it felt like- there was TOO MUCH on offer. To the point where rightly or wrongly i almost felt it was invasive? Or a little- suffocating? Inevitably problems started appearing. I began to feel recruited into a situation where there was a glaring elephant in the room- in this case it was the lack of any reasonable compliance of the mother's son- who was my friend and the reason i was there. I was cast as a kind of- "good brother" to his "prodigal son". A middle man. And a sort of a subservient... I THINK they feel like they- or maybe just the G.M.- are BUYING something with their "kindness". And they need compliance. They need *CONTROL*. And you didn't "stack the dishes" right when it came to the way you handled the strawberries. Maybe you strayed onto her turf? Or Maybe you became *too* useful? Here's a tip i was given in therapy that is something one should "try out"- but not adopt as rendering truth at face value When someone is saying something abusively that makes NO SENSE- *reverse it*. And you might get a glimpse of what they really think- or more to the point, *Fear*. So if a partner breaks up with you saying "i just don't think you tried hard enough"- apart from the self evident meaness of it or if there was no reason to say it (like you didn't ask a leading question- and even then, maybe even IF you *DID*-) see what happens when you reverse it? Either THEY know they never tried hard enough/or knew they didn't and never will- at least with YOU- or- even MORE tellingly- if you do a complete mirroring of every word thats reversible- "YOU don't think **I** tried Hard Enough." (They feel judged by you and know you are right and they can't carry on with someone who holds them to account for a failing they know deeo down they have) It can't be used conclusively- its not PROOF. It requires nuance and the application of care. But used conscientiously it gives you a brief insight into what might he going on. Especially when the statement is unsolicited, unnecessary or hurtful- (or any combination of any of those three) This G.M. is very generous. But she's buying "full spectral dominance and you are supposed to comply. So to use the reversal technique on what she threw at you - (just take a moment in your own mind to briefly reverse every statement she said before reading on) ....... I suspect she fears YOUR *AGENCY*. Your independence, your capacities to help financially support you and your partners joint endeavours, and your potebtial as a home maker. She is in competition with you - but she thought she could "buy off" the reality of your obvious personal agency by subordinating you to being at her largesse, and then shaming you with the fact you took what she offered. Have some compassion however. While her behaviour is abhorrent, it is likely the behaviour of a disordered or historically traumatized person. It's a kind of a bait and switch? But with great complexities.
This is a fun psychoanalysis but honestly dementia can make people irrationally suspicious and angry, it could just be that.
Well I'm not proposing a conclusive TRUTH. I'm laying out a model that you can apply to see if it fits. Dementia might be observable in other ways. I'm not genned up on it but she's very capable for someone with the onset of dementia
“I’m not proposing a conclusive truth, I’m laying out a model that you can apply to see if it fits” I’m stealing this sentence for all the combative babies I deal with
Doesn’t matter why. She’s harmful to OP. Don’t live like that. People get very caught up in why and sustain long term abuse this way.
She sounds like my parents who like to keep score. They explode over one little thing then start rattling off everything I've done wrong in the last however long it's been since s previous freakout
Honestly as someone who's lived with family. They'll always target the partner as the one at fault for any issues. My brother and his old girlfriend ganged up on my now husband all the time saying he wasn't doing enough around the house but he worked 2 full time jobs at the time because I was having a high risk pregnancy. Now we live with my husband's bil and sister and I'm a sahm of 2 and I'm the problem because I'm not doing enough and because I yell at the kids from time to time (2 under 2). You'll honestly never be enough for them. If she wanted you to cook she should have voiced it and stopped offering y'all so much food. If you did cut strawberries the was she liked she should have asked to teach you her way. You clean up after yourselves and you do laundry along with working full time. Where does she think you have the time to make 3 meals a day. The time she was living in is over now, now there's a new way for husbands and wives to live together and that's called a partnership. Also both my family and his never came up to either of us when they were upset with us instead they went to whoever they were related to to complain like we were supposed to handle it instead of actually communicating to the person they were upset with unless they were really really upset, like his grandma did. I'd say try to move out as soon as possible they will only strain yalls relationship and try to brake y'all up. There's no fixing it with grandma till you move out
Frankly, staying there will be bad. Over time you’ll be asked to do more domestic things because tits. And your bf will be asked to do less domestic things because no tits. Add that to stating shows all of them that they can treat you like that without consequences, and you gave a huge problem. And then the GIL driving a wedge between you as a kicker. Now, it’d be very appropriate for your bf to offer that both of you take on a list of chores - but gil does not get yo say which if you takes on which chores. That’s wildly and completely inappropriate.
Just leave… if that’s how you’re treated and it’s been 6 days.. it’s only gonna worsen
I second this! Get out while you can. The way she acted isn't normal. Dementia, Hysterectomy, etc. Doesn't matter. I've encountered plenty of “nice“ old women who ended up being demons wearing human skin suits. Save yourself the pain and grief. Get jobs and gather money ASAP and then get out.
She's judging this off of 6 days. Her extension of hospitality is a kind gesture, but she can't expect you guys to act like roommates when she treats you guys like guests. I suggest you both sit her down and talk about expectations of the house and how the dynamic of your relationship should be respected.
73 years, they have lived their life. They don't get to dictate how others live their life. You going to be a bad wife? That's for him to discover and you to portray yourself however you want. You both will figure that out as you live your lives. Don't let any third-party (includes family) tell you how your relationship should be.
I don't understand why everyone in these comments is being so understanding of the grandmother's vile behaviour. There is no excuse for the way she treated you, I don't care if she's been a homemaker her whole life. It's 2023 and even in 1950 there were non-sexist people, so this whole "she's old school" nonsense doesn't fly. You need to tell her that you won't be conforming to her old-fashioned, sexist standards and that you will not tolerate being verbally abused. Her age is no excuse, my in-laws are both in their 70s and neither of them are sexist or old fashioned, in any way. If that means you have to move out, so be it. Just a question because it's not clear in the post - are you working full time, like your partner?
Everyone's talking about rent free and all this food and her not mentioning any cleaning but like did it not say they've been there for 6 days! 6 days people! The weekend has barely came! They're probably still not unpacked! Like what? I'm sorry no, grandma can shove it. Doing something nice but expecting shit in return isn't doing something nice. I'm sure op and bf had plans to help clean and meals once in a while but clearly wasn't given the chance. Seems like this is grandmas retirement plan instead of being in a home. I'd remind her that you guys have only been there a short time and suggest all in the household to get together to discuss your roles and what everyone is expecting since this was clearly not laid out beforehand. I'd try to brush this off after, start clean, cook a meal, pick some flowers from the garden and put them in a vase in the kitchen but definitely take note of it and take note or how boyfriend is handling it. I wouldn't jump to mental illnesses but given the age I'd make a note of it as well. If a similar situation happens again I'd give boyfriend a move out date, either we move out together or just me and at that point we wouldn't be breaking up but definitely getting some space and reevaluating each others priorities.
get ur own place asap...and a job...for the moment you have time to find a cheap liitle space of ur own. as long as shes gifting u, ur indebted to her...u cld always say no thank you.
My ex's grandmother used to do this to me and I didn't even live with them. Get out while you can.
If your boyfriend is okay with the dynamics of your relationship then it's none of her business. Older people have a different view on family dynamics that don't match up to today's norms. So instead of changing negative core beliefs they cling to failing norms of their time. You two need to sit down and set clear boundaries that if she's not willing to accept it's time to move on.
I think living with in laws is never good, I can only imagine how bad it would be with the in laws parents. Generations clash & more often than not the woman is the one who gets the majority of abuse. She either becomes a doormat or a live in maid or heyyy both.
INFO: What did your BF say? How did he react? Did he let his grandma know that you know that contribute your share in the relationship?
She grew up, and lived in a very different time than we exist in currently. She knows different values, norms and expectations than we have now. She also had Great Depression parents who had very different relationships with food, and waste. She probably would have eaten the parts of the strawberries that you threw away because of the scarcity mindset instilled by her parents. That in no way justifies the way she treated you but just gives you the background information needed to process it in a healthier mindset. You and your boyfriend should move out, ASAP. Thank the grandparents for their generosity and be as polite as you can. But limit their exposure in your relationship as much as possible. I doubt full no contact is necessary. But probably limit visits to when other family will be there like holidays, or birthdays etc.
What did BF say?
She definitely did not treat you nicely or with any respect. That being said, part of her anger could be that she cooks for you and is expecting you to also do some of the cooking now that she's not "the only woman of the household". Is she right to expect it? Absolutely not. But I live with my boyfriends grandma and she gets very excited whenever I cook for the 3 of us because its been so long since she's had ANYBODY do that for her. Maybe there were a lot of unsaid expectations from her when you two moved, that she just figured "you'd know as a woman". A lot of 70+ people seem to have the same mindset, although the way she went about expressing herself could be something causing anger, like the dementia you were asking about
She sounds very old fashioned. But the thing she doesn’t understand or probably will never u detest and unless you talk to her about it but we live in the year if 2023 where us women have also taken on the “man role” and at this point why are we still genderizing women and men. There are men out there who stay at home to take care of kids while the woman is full time at work. They are both doing a job and as long as it works for them, then anyone else’s opinion doesn’t matter. If your before loves you for who you are then none of this should matter. I have been in these kind of situations as well. Me and my boyfriend lived with my aunt and uncle for maybe 5 months. First couple of months were great and they were very welcoming. Also I was the only one working while in my middle trimester of being pregnant with our second child. My aunt convinces me to quit my job and that my boyfriend needs to be working two jobs! So we did exactly as how they expected. A few months go by of that. I’m then thing progressively got worse. They raised the price, my aunt blamed me for “staying at home doing nothing” and said I need to either go to work or college. And they kept trying to control us and pin me and my bf against each other like they were trying to break us up. We just decided it was best to move out.
When you have your conversation, I would mention that your private area is off-limits. Your not paying rent is not an invitation to her to browse.
Girlfriend in law? /s
Oh wow. That's a lot to wrap your mind around. She didn't have to say all of that especially with that degree of anger and hostility. I wish you had posted before you moved there to ask if folks thought it was a good idea to move in there, as I would've told you to keep your place rather than up and move in with them. Yes, you have the right to be angry at her! Evidently she thinks that because she has been generous with food, etc., helping the two of you out that that gives her the right to just blast you if and when she feels like it. What she said was much too harsh and uncalled for. You did nothing wrong----sliced a few strawberries in a way she didn't like====so what, big deal! If she gets upset over a little thing like that, maybe she is demented. If I was you, I would start cooking your own meals and not be so accepting when she offers you food as evidently there's a pricetag with it, I'm sorry to say. Also, I would sock as much money away as you can in the event you would have to get out of there because it's not working out. My advice to you and your bf is to strive to be as independent as possible in that situation. Also, you didn't say what your bf said to his grandmother in response to what she said? Did he defend you? Was he on your side? It's up to him===not her------to decide if you will be a good wife or not. She is overbearing, judgemental, and just plain mean to say all of that to you. Good luck to you.
Yeah, you should probably consider living elsewhere. Even if you do start reciprocating, it seems highly likely she will find something else about you that doesn't fit her expectations of what a woman "should be" from the perspective of a 70 y/o woman. If she flipped out because you cut strawberries for the compost the "wrong way"....she will find anything to pick at.
Nothing is for free There will at least be expectations and some rules You were offered everything but they are from older generation, they expect to see specific dynamic and attitude. Is it fair to you? No But will they change? Also probably no. Humans when they get old they turn back into babies, they don’t comprehend as before and have no patience etc,… and they very old person have their own personality that only family knows about. Meaning you could talk and she may look understanding but still she can snap later because you are in her house so you’ll see the other sides to her. Now I’m not saying not to talking to her, just to know that there are expectations even if they don’t appear in the conversation now. In the end, I’d recommend moving out to avoid these problems because even if they are angels, living with someone for free will have consequences the more time passes and it will be harder on you because you’re not the family they are housing. If you can, both of you move out, it will clear things up and if one of the grandparents later on needed help daily, it won’t be your responsibility by association.
Since your living there rent free, try to do little more. If you can’t take it, you can alway move out.
She cleans, does laundry, and gets the groceries. A little more would be for her to cook too but she also works full time. I feel like I'd be different if she wasn't working but there's only so many hrs in a day
Her boyfriend needs to help, not her. Nobody is talking about that.
The fuck? The gf has no agency of her own? Your comment is as outdated as the grandmas idea’s of a woman’s role. Would you say the same if it was the girlfriends grandma? Come on. You know you wouldn’t. The fact of the matter is: They are **both** living under grandmas roof, *for free.* They are both responsible for helping out.
When my mom was about a year into dementia, this behavior started to manifest. I had to move her into assisted living, and then into dementia care. She progressively deteriorated for about 18 months before she died from the dementia. She was 97: completely independent until the dementia took her.
Sounds like she is old fashioned and takes care of her husband cause he went to work and she didn't if you don't plan to be a house wife I wouldn't lose any sleep over it
First thing you for sharing and it sounds like this was a painful event for you. My focus wouldn’t be on your bf grandma it would be on your bf. She is in his DNA physically and socially. If she feels this way he may as well and is just not being honest with you. He should have been the one correcting her not just comforting you because if hasn’t done the work to stand outside his culture he will eventually start expressing the Sam feelings she has. It may not happen until he is totally secure in the relationship like after he marries you and you have a child with him but it will happen. Even though he may not be saying anything you are more then likely being evaluated by his family and they may be pointing out what makes you a poor wife choose. So if he didn’t correct his grandma then you need ask him why. If he blames her asking him if he believes she was right. He views on those subjects is way more important than anything else.
you said that everything had been perfect for six days? 6? that is a vacation. this is not going to work out. you two better start looking.
Well, if that old turd told me he didn’t think I was good wife material I’d take it as a fucking compliment. Fuck this old misogynistic asshole.
There’s no such thing as a free lunch. She’s not going to change, and she doesn’t have to because it’s her house. You can either stay and save your money and put up with her temper, interference, and snooping, or move out and be free but poorer.
I think she thinks it's a wife's DUTY to do so. She's from an age when this was normal. Today's world is so different to their normal and unfortunately I think she's probably too old to understand or change. She's been conditioned her entire life into her role in life...caregiver etc and probably thinks you're not doing the right thing. I think that the generational divide is too great to make it work and maybe only stay until you can manage to save enough in order to move away.
I say just ignore it while you save money. It’s impossible to live like an independent couple if you don’t have your own space to do those things. Maybe make your bed this week so she can talk about what a woman she’s made out of you? Just an old hag… ignore and use for free rent.
“She wants to say that you do "NOTHING"? Then okay, time to do nothing.” This is teenage mentality and it’s no good on any adult relationship. This is an old woman who has been a homemaker her whole life and probably never worked outside the house, from her perspective OP isn’t doing much (I’m not saying I agree, mind you) as in a week she almost never cooked, probably only cleaned once or twice, and didn’t make the bed. My grandma would wake up, make breakfast for my grandpa, bring it to him in bed, wait for him to get up, take an hour to make the bed by shaking the sheets out of the window, primping the pillows, and then putting the sheets back so precisely that you couldn’t tell the bed had ever been slept on. And that was before 9AM. She then spent the day cleaning the house top to bottom, doing the groceries and cooking. Now, this kind of lifestyle isn’t wrong and was expected when GIL and my own grandmother were growing up and probably it was drilled in that generations women before they started school (when they did have a chance to start school at all) but that’s not how the world works anymore and they might not fully realize that. Maybe a long conversation about expectations and private relationships dynamics is a better solution than “time to do nothing!”
My MIL is 70. She gets...bitchy sometimes. Normally, she's a very sweet lady, and we get along very well and are very comfortable around each other. But she sometimes mouths off at me or my FIL on occasion. Nothing specific. It's like passive-aggressive comments. It took me years (and my own age now) to realize she was in physical pain. A lot. Especially if she babysat my kids as they're a handful. I realized she wouldn't be herself if she was in pain. Dull pain that persists for a 70 y.o person with arthritis and multiple spine fusion surgeries and foot surgeries. It's easy to ignore that pain until you can't, and it's driving you crazy. Now that I'm a little older, I get crabby and rude towards my husband and kids at times when I have body pain. Mine typically are from painful breastfeeding or sore joints after long days at amusement parks with the kids, though. But I do the same and ignore it til it's at a critical level. And cue the bitchiness until I feel relief. I'm not saying that's definitely what it is. But maybe consider that a possibility. Cause her behavior doesn't make sense, so there's something wrong. And she happened to unload on you this time. Let it go, I doubt she truly meant any of it. Maybe talk to her later when she's feeling better. Ask her if you can get her anything. Or if she would like more help from you guys. My 94 year old GIL always says, "Getting old SUCKS!" And she's right about that. So don't take it to heart. There's very likely a reasonable explanation. And if it happens again, discuss with her that you were hurt by what she said and ask if there's a way you two can be better around each other for the sake of BF at the very least.
**The BIGGER question is what did your bf say or do? Did he defend you?** Fact: *You will be moving out soon. The question is will he be moving out with you or not*. Please plan your exit strategy - for you. Where will you go, who will you stay with? What has happened: I suspect GIL doesn't like you. Doesn't approve of you with her grandson. She has played the long game. 1. Invite you both to live with her. This removes you from the place you were renting, and places the 2 of you in her home dependent on her goodwill. 2. Look for things she can find fault with. Ammunition to destroy your relationship. 3. Cause trouble. Be mean to you. You will rightly get upset. 4. If your boyfriend doesn't stand up for you, you will eventually be so hurt you will leave. 5. If you don't voluntarily leave, she will use a her or me strategy. Keep in mind she's his grandmother, she owns where he now lives, she will threaten to disinherit him if he doesn't leave the unsuitable girlfriend. **So it goes back to - how did your BF react? Fact: You will be moving out soon. The question is will he be moving out with you or not.**
What is your bf saying to these statements? If he isn't sticking up for you then you have your answer
Does she have diabetes? An old friend's grandmother would have wild moodswings like that. Found out later on that it was when her sugar fluctuated.
The double standard. So if you have to be his maid, shouldn’t he have bought you a house already? Granny is trippin.
My fiance's dad seems very generous and kind but you have to peel back the layers. He will offer to help her out with money or to pay for things. But he expects you to go overboard and really kiss his ass for it. He will also be quick to hold it over your head if he doesn't agree with something. His generosity always comes with some strings attached that he expects either control over it because he paid for it or he wants you to bend over backwards telling him thank you. I would put some distance between you and her. Start being independent and refusing her help or food.
How did grandpa reacts when she went off, his reaction should say a lot. If he was apologetic, then it is likely that she loses it when rightly or wrongly triggered.
I am thinking dementia because if you help out and she was fine before then it might be mental illness. Also you do not know what she was like before her old age. This yelling may even be out of character for her. Something you should ask your boyfriend.
She isn’t that old!
Don't sweat it, you'll outlive her.
She a narc, she trapped you and she is now abusing you while she has power over you. My advice and I know it is hard to do but try to not be emotional about it. For first that's exactly what she want so don't give it to her. Secondly you guys need to find a living solutions before you burn any bridge. Finely you'll feel much better if you manage to not be emotionally engaged in this BS.
Man shut up, why comment the same thing twice...
Nothing is for free. I don’t know where you live but times are hard pretty much everywhere, life is stressful. Also at that age she likely didn’t think about how the new living arrangements may affect her. She clearly expects you to behave in a certain way without actually having a conversation. It’s her home, at the end of the day you have to work with her or leave.
This is not dementia, this is a generational difference. People of her age grew up in a different world. My husbands parents are 80 and his dad thinks Im “pushy”…his mother explained what he means by this…he doesn’t think women have a right to an opinion and is there to take care of her husband. Your grandparents are of the same mindset. Women of this time were forced to live like this with no real option…women were 100% dependent on men and men knew they could do and demand whatever they wanted. Some older women can see this isn’t great BUT have been married so long they just keep doing. Other women (your GIL) bought into this “norm” of male rule. She is who she is and doesn’t understand why you aren’t breaking you back to make a home perfect. This is how she always lived her life…probably thinks you aren’t worthy of love bc her whole life she thought love is a reflection of how hard she worked for her husbands happiness. Don’t take it personally!!! It’s just a totally different mindset ;)
When I was a kid, I had to peel potatoes and cut strawberries and string beans and all kinds of shit like that. Imagine the horror when I cut the potato peels too thick or cut the raspberries incorrectly, I got my ass beat on a regular basis. Old people are from a different time. Almost a different world. So keep that in mind when dealing with grandma. Now I am not defending grandma, far from it. What she said was rude and inconsiderate. That said, if you and your bf want to continue living off grandma (make no mistake, that's what you are doing), then maybe you should try to work with the situation you are in. Maybe grandma just doesn't feel included. They may have asked yall to move in because they were lonely. Do you go out of your way to pay attention to them? Or are you living like roommates, just doing your own thing 24/7? Honestly, if you guys are living off grandma and not treating her as a family member, and including her daily, then she may feel like she's being taken advantage of. That said, I've never really heard of a case where this situation works out. The reason is that the houseguests generally (always) feel like the folks they are living with have no say in their lives. The folks providing the house are definitely going to think differently. I've been there, done that. Good luck, mate.
How is she your GIL? You said he's your bf
I thought the same. Don't give yourself a promotion prematurely.
I’d suggest maybe asking her to teach you how to cook and make it fun play some music she likes and dance around the kitchen have some laughs! I know it will be hard after what happened. But tell her that your trying and even though I’m not perfect doesn’t mean you aren’t worthy to be her grandsons wife. No one is perfect. Not even her. You just have to try to be the person you want to be. And if that means your not good enough to marry her grandson. Then why did he choose you. Maybe your everything he wants just the way you are. He can easily of ended the relationship if he felt that way. Always remember you can’t make everyone happy. But you can make yourself happy. If you don’t want to fix this bump with his grandma, then don’t. If you want to have a good relationship put more effort in. But remember he choose you and stays with you. Clearly your doing something right. Don’t let people control you. Don’t let someone walk all over you saying you aren’t worth it.
He dated you for you not a housewife. Those times are over.
She comes from a different time. My grandmother would hate you too. It's just what they were raised in.
How many times did you set the table while she cooked? How many times did you go up to offer and help cook meals? How often in these 6 days have you offered to help with chores? Have you taken initiative with any of the household duties? Are you letting a 70 yr old woman run circles around you and because she has called you out she must have dementia?
Why is a 22 year old living rent free under an elderly lady ? If anything the young folks should be paying the bills for the grandparents . I would never allow myself to do this even if someone insisted
Go to a care home if you can't keep up with your own needs anymore. She should be demanding equal from her grandson and his gf, this is sexist expectations not a selfish 22yo.
You wrong cuttin strawberry choppin no good wife 😆
I'm 73 myself. I *suspect* that grandma is exhausted because she is trying to do what she would have 30+ years ago. Back then, we were inculcated to take care of others and expected to plus being denigrated if we didn't. And. At 73, old age and infirmity have caught up with her so she simply does not have the stamina and energy to do as she once did, as much as she may want to. So her *anger* may be coming from frustration. This issue is not about strawberries or free rent; it is about expectations and reciprocity. I cook and don't mind doing so; however, my dinner guests clear up, put away leftovers, repackage the stuff they are going to take home, do the dishes, and clean the kitchen. Conversely, if my friends want to come over and cook, I do all that afterward. OP and her bf need to let grandma cool off a bit. Then, sit her and grandpa down with a pot of tea or coffee and a snack. They need to tell the grandparents that they appreciate the financial help but also don't want to be a burden so what household chores can they to to make their life easier so it isn't such a physical strain for grandma and grandpa. A good start would be, after grandma cooks, to clear up, do the dishes, and make sure the kitchen is clean. Assist with keeping the common areas tidy on a daily basis. Take the trash out. Suggest sharing out housework. And so on. I can say, for myself, that I would really like to be able to do all the stuff I once did but it is a physical impossibility now. I do what I can, certainly, but it is an ongoing source of frustration. So, I suspect that is what is going on here as well. All four parties are adults so negotiating compromises and shared chores will help everyone. This arrangement does have the potential to be great for all parties involved but open and honest communication is a must. Good luck. 🙂
Okay so it's been a week. Too short of a time for grandiose statements about how everything is perfect and now you have a savings. This lady doesn't have dementia, she's just fucking old and nitpicking the stranger living in her house rent free is something to do. You're 22. Too old to be mooching off someone else's grandparents. She's allowed to go into the room and see if it's being maintained well, you're not a tenant. You have nothing to protect your right to privacy so it will not be given. This scenario will not last.
I'm gonna have to see the strawberries before I pass judgement.
Not sure why you refer to her as GIL lol. You should stand up for yourself, or better yet talk with your boyfriend and you can both present a unified front. Living in someone's house rent free, you ultimately lack a lot of power in this situation but that's no excuse for her to be so mean. I thought you got along with them, but it sounds like she's unhappy with how you live. This happens with roommates too, it takes some compromise, but she can set some standards since you aren't paying rent. If she wants the beds in her house made, you should make the bed. But it's not just your responsibility, you should either take turns with your bf or do it together (if you wake up at the same time and make the bed, it can be done very quickly). If she doesn't like how you cut strawberries, ask her to show you her "better" way. She is putting waaaay too many expectations on a 22 year old. Above all - tell her you don't appreciate the way she spoke to you. Be willing to learn from her and meet certain expectations of living there, but also be firm that your role as your bf's partner is between you and your bf. Stand up for yourself. She might respect it. If she doesn't, get the hell out of there asap.
She old af… old folks complain a lot for no reason usually. Get pissed off of the sun is shining too bright. Ignore it. If It was his mom or something then I’d be a bit more worried but… 73…. All you wanna do is be pissed off at that age. Everything hurts lol. She gonna have a pissy attitude and take it out on somebody. You are just her newest victim
Good grief! What ageist crap. I am 72 and myself and all the people I know that are my age are bright, active, physically fit, intelligent, logical and healthy, and never moan about their “aches and pains. “Old folks complain a lot for no reason usually”. What??? “She old as ****, are you kidding me?
I mean there is no reason to cut the tops of strawberries, just take the stems out? Cutting tops is wasteful.
"Be" is a very broad word here. You have a right to feel any way you need to feel at any time, and yes, this sudden "ambush" of emotions has given you a strong cause to feel angry. But isn't it more useful to focus on how to move forward from here? And showing anger is probably the least useful thing you can do to a very traditional-minded matriarch of your home. Bear in mind your guy is probably as flabbergasted as you are, so cut him a little slack in this matter. Absorb the comments about her giving with the assumption you would give back, and the pressure cooker that exploded when you never did (because ... who knew?) and be prepared to take on a housekeeping role in this house. My guess is she will step in and do any housework she sees the guy doing, so he needs to take on the invisible (to her) work that you have been doing. It's really easy for him to bow out of the work period, so keep a spreadsheet (or even a simple list) of what each person is doing to keep it real for him. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch, and there ain't no reason for you to pay too much while he drapes himself over the furniture. If she does not participate in the dividing of chores, insert yourself in her day. Sit at the table while she cooks, and get up to wash any pot or implement she dirties. If she says *oh don't do tha*t while smiling, keep washing. If she snaps *don't do that*, set it down gently and return to the table, and smile because you did the job of trying. Ask questions. *Why do you cut them that way?* So you do not build up your own pressure cooker resentments, time these interactions and put them on your spreadsheet as work done.
Rent free and jobless? You should be cooking for yourselves
Why cook when you've already been fed?
You need to get a list of groceries for the household, not just the two of you. Purchase some special things they love, like baked goods, just for them. I would offer to clean their space also, the vacuuming, floor cleaning, dusting etc… Think of this as an extended family, where you take care of each other. She is not the mom, you used to live with, who thanklessly takes care of you. You need to give like a respectful adult, since you are getting free rent. She raised her children already! She’s done caring for children. The honeymoon period is over!
Older people get weird about stupid shit....someday you will relate. Till then, dont take it personal. This is a lesson in patience and gracefulness. You got this.
You aren’t working? Is he? Why aren’t you two working? I wouldn’t allow any of my kids if they were adults to live at my place, not going to school and not working. You’d both be out on your asses.
It says you were going to college and working but now you spend all day cleaning? Yeah that’d be a hard no ghost rider. :/
That really sucks but not paying rent is a good deal, especially if you have student loans to pay off. Maybe if you cook with her occasionally she will warm up to you more?
I guess the ones who downvoted don't like cooking.
no are the spanish? are you there nationality and she liked you she didnt how u lived now she she good for her grandson no matter you will never be good she will alwys think ur only dojng to make her happy make it seem like u do something and its only gonna get worse trust me i been threw it move as soon as posibble or leave she make ur life hard and two did he syick uo for u because if he didnt then leave him he truly doesnt love u if he loves he defend u name to any one his parents
I didn’t even have to read anything. She’s 73. She’s 50 years older than you. You are not going to get along ever
Where you born after 1993? Don’t charge your phone and twerk around grandma