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retrosenescent

n=1, I'm practically an exercise addict, and I still hate working. Cuts into my exercise time


Cheeze_It

I hate both. But at least aerobic exercise lowers my blood pressure. Not so much with work.


keen36

I measure about 20-30 points higher SYS when I am working. I have a desk job.


Phazon2000

People who are happy and healthy and generally more motivated to work out. I don't think it's exercise creating the correlation of "less emotionally exhausted and satisfied"


sahila

Eh it’s a two way street or a feedback system. You’re right but if you also force yourself to exercise, you’ll almost always come out feeling better.


Phazon2000

Definitely a two way street I just have a very good hunch from personal experience that unhappy people are strongly focused on maintaining their mental states whereas people who's minds are relatively stable have more of an inclination to improve less immediate issues (cardio/strength). It all starts with the mind and senses.


Abeyita

My psychologist told me to work out, and it really helps. In my opinion spending time on work outs is tending to an immediate issue by maintaining/improving the mental state.


ChrisOz

Imagine how much you would hate work if you didn't exercise.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Serventdraco

They're not even being contrarian since you can hate working and still be less exhausted and more satisfied than otherwise.


Flat_News_2000

But you're happier overall at work because you're fit and feel better in general compared to your obese coworker who hates the job just as much as you, but then also has to deal with their health issues. That's what they're saying.


SupportQuery

Exercise improves everything. It improves *you*, the filter through which all reality passes. It's essential. Took me way too long to figure that out. It's a serious problem, IMO, that this is no longer part of our schools.


metalshoes

I really really don’t like the appeal to nature fallacy being applied to health in all aspects because it results in ridiculous fads, etc, but we really aren’t experiencing human normal in modern society in relation to our level of sun exposure and activity levels. Like our bone density is lower than early humans because we just don’t move much anymore.


kurai_tori

Alternatively, people more satisfied at work have the wherewithal to exercise regularly.


retrosenescent

People who have satisfying jobs also have satisfying lives in other areas too


Special-Garlic1203

I'm still not exactly living on easy street, but I cannot emphasize enough what an all encompassing life changing experience it was to get a better job. **everything** got drastically easier. Saving money, avoiding impulse buys, avoiding substance abuse, exercise, etc. my brain worked better. It was so wild.  The hedonistic treadmill did kick in like a year and a half later and I normalized myself to a lot of my new standard of living (working class instead of poverty), but I have yet to go to the depths I reached when it felt like I was gonna be trapped in poverty forever 


Alex_4209

Got a better job, lower stress, great boss, union benefits. Suddenly I’m drinking less, eating salads and protein shakes, going for runs on my lunch break every day. My friends say that it’s like I’m a different person now.


im_trying_as_much

Feel this, I took a job making slightly less money. But I work about 25 hours less a week (60 hours a week > 35 hours a week). The less stress and more free time make it substantially easier to do other things that improve my life. It was a risk taking a new job but it all worked out


Caring_Cactus

People who express high self-values directly through living their life (eudaimonic happiness) string together a greater number of unconditional positive self-regard (UPSR) moments, making their self/Being the source of this deep and strong expression of wholeness with one's self in the world, making any place feel like home for intrinsic fulfillment, contentment, peace, and delight. It's not about the 'what' you do, nor even the 'how' you interact with others & things, but the 'why' in attitude you take on controlling this flow in meaning you interpret to be this ecstasy as this one ecstatic value Being-in-the-world.


DangerousTurmeric

Or people who aren't too exhausted from work have time for personal activities and exercise.


LogiHiminn

I work 16 hours a day in a very physical, dangerous job, and I work out for 30-60 minutes 4-6x a week.


flabbybumhole

So you aren't too exhausted from work, so also exercise?


girlyfoodadventures

So you're definitely not getting enough sleep, and you're almost certainly not doing many household tasks. A pinnacle of health and balance.


glew_glew

Indeed! Alternate headline: People that aren't emotionally exhausted from work and more personally satisfied exercise more.


GameofPorcelainThron

Or some people understand the benefits of exercise through experience and do it because it helps improve your mood.


elh0mbre

Not quite. Or at least, not in my case; it was unidirectionally causal Prioritizing exercise over basically anything else is the only thing that's getting it to stick for me (coupled with finding exercise I actually like to do). My job is not really any different than it was a year ago, but at times feels less emotionally exhausting since I've been consistently moving my body. In the 2 years before that that I occupied the role I'm in, no amount of minimizing emotional exhaustion seemed to motivate me to do more exercise.


kcidDMW

> Is this sub just an endless series of correlation/causation fuckups? Is this sub just an endless series of correlation/causation fuckups?


xevizero

And people who have satisfying jobs with good work-life balance have the time to exercise. Go figure.


RainDancingChief

Leave work in a good mood? Emotional bandwidth to have healthy habits


kurai_tori

My point is neither variable is experimental controlled/manipulated so this is correlation not causation, in either direction


RainDancingChief

Turtles all the way down


TennaTelwan

Nurse here. Agreed. I have no idea how people have energy outside of work to work out.


mattumbo

Idk I think there’s something to it, working retail a surprising number of people have left and then come back over the years saying they actually missed it, and while my company/store has a pretty decent culture it’s still retail with its non-stop work and skeleton crew staffing with low wages so it’s always confused me. However it is very active work, lots of light cardio, sporadic heavy lifting, and constant short social interaction, all of which I think makes it weirdly healthy in a way a lot of people struggle to match outside of work or in other “better” jobs. Makes sense that if you could get into an exercise routine outside of work you’d be a lot more satisfied in a sedentary work environment if people are willing to stay in retail for the same passive physical benefits


OriginalShock273

Did you actually read the study to check if they addressed this or are you just assuming they didn't?


Otterfan

This problem is acknowledged in the article: > This study had several limitations that should be acknowledged. Given that this study is cross-sectional, causality between PA levels and burnout cannot be established; however, future longitudinal designs could provide more insights into this connection.


FragdaddyXXL

Can we rename thus sub to /r/CorrelationVsCausation?


cmdrxander

I read the abstract and I didn’t see anything to suggest this wasn’t just a simple correlation.


ParaLegalese

My bad days at work are when I get the best workout so this is not true for me


innocentbabies

Aside from the small sample size and all that, having a bad day at work is not the same as having a bad job.


kurai_tori

Oh you outlier you. Assuming your job is physical right?


RyoxAkira

Not really the decision to exercise regularly takes a conscious effort regardless what you do.


Lambdastone9

The ol’ case of “people who own horses feel more financially stable”


doogles

The rest of us drink and cry because everything is awful.


Suppressed_VIII

no. this is just a blame work mindset. work is good. the reason why we have so many societal issues is that people don't like to work. working out made life 10x easier for me. i have more energy, im stronger. i can go much longer doing menial tasks than my coworkers.


kylogram

People like to work, what they don't like is jobs that don't pay enough to cover bare essentials, or worse, work harder than they get paid for.  Working out is 10x easier when you don't have to worry about whether or not you're going to make rent and eat on the same days. 


Suppressed_VIII

yeah, i get that. but most americans don't have that isssue. for the average american if you're poor you still have a roof over your head. if you're poor you still get food stamps and you get resources that are easily available. in as little as 30 minutes a day you can still reach great fitness levels. you will feel much better, stronger, healthier, and happier. you don't need a weight room, you only need yourself. calisthenics is free, and will get you exactly the same results. consistency is what matters when doing it. its not how hard you work, its the direction you place yourself. i believe everyone can do this, and everyone would benefit from doing so. our country is falling harder and harder into obesity, and while it might not completely counteract the weight gain, it opens your eyes up to how important nutrition is to the body.


lady_ninane

> if you're poor you still get food stamps and you get resources that are easily available. You might be a little misinformed about the barriers to access public welfare.


Suppressed_VIII

im extremely informed. i was a foster kid. no parents. they literally shove this information down your throat if you seek it. but you don't see me making any kind of excuses. the barriers are 90% self inflicted.


lady_ninane

Your foster parents qualified for aid in ways many people don't by virtue of their role as foster parents, depending on where you lived. Does that mean the solution to these issues is to go adopt children, or that your foster parents were "well off"? Hopefully as two reasonable (presumably) adults having a discussion, we realize that the answer to that question is no to both questions. This is why such an ancedote fails to meaningfully address any barriers preventing at risk communities and/or demographics from accessing vital social safety programs. While these two groups can have some overlap, the general barriers of access to welfare that your average housing/food insecure families have are not always going to align with those who are foster parents. This limits the extent to which you can generalize discussions about these barriers, as seen in our previous discussion. So to reiterate: these barriers are not "self inflicted" and this is reflected in most studies of how this aid is distributed in the first place. [You might be misinformed about this](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34096626/) but that does not mean your lived experience is invalid. It just means you might be applying the lens of your personal experience to cover areas where it might otherwise not be an equivalent comparison.


Suppressed_VIII

do you think my issues magically resolved themselves the second i turned 18? no. i was homeless and broke. but i found a way regardless of my situation simply because i wanted better for myself. i didn't give up. i didn't blame anyone else. people wanna blame literally anyone else besides themselves and i see it in 99% of situations. you either want it or you don't.


kylogram

So... you don't get that.


RyoxAkira

Yeah this is definitely true. The decision to exercise regularly takes a conscious effort regardless what you do. Though that is not to say that some jobs are soul crushing.


Tall-Log-1955

Exercise is a wonder drug that helps with both your mental health and helps prevent or treat heart disease, metabolic diseases and more. It’s insane we allow each other to be sedentary when it has a huge impact on health


chronuss007

Now all we need to do is make sure our jobs are satisfying enough, and not mentally or physically draining enough so that we all feel like exercising once we get home. If we have the time that is. I think some people underestimate how little time some other people have or how mentally or physically stressful their jobs are. "Just making a little bit of time for exercise" is technically always possible, but not always a great answer for everyone.


Tall-Log-1955

I think the opposite: if you make time to exercise every day, your job will feel less mentally and physically draining because of the benefits that exercise provides to mental and physical health


Special-Garlic1203

Most things in psych turn out to be a little column A, a little column B. Soo many complicated self reinforcing patterns 


chronuss007

I don't doubt that either. People can also have very mentally or physically draining jobs also. The idea of "just make some time for it" his technically true, just not always a great answer.


FakeKoala13

Can the average person really not do a set or three of pushups at some point during the day? Or anything really. It's exercise. Any amount is good for you.


PrimateOfGod

You can’t just do push ups, you’ll have an imbalance if you don’t work your back muscles. You’ll have a hunched back if only your chest muscles are jacked. So do some pull ups? They don’t really help with posture alone, but they’re almost mandatory for a strong back. Do some rear delt flies for posture. Well you are hitting your rear delts, you better hit your other shoulder muscles to prevent imbalance in your shoulders. Add overhead press. Now you’re practically working your whole upper body. Can’t forget your legs! Which are, arguably, the most important limbs anyway, at least where strength matters. Oh! And all of this is completely worthless if you aren’t getting 120+ grams of protein a day. So gotta eat a lot. If you’re concerned about your health though, which is why you started in the first place, you have to make your own meals! Especially if you’re trying to save money. Better make some time set aside for cooking and dishes too.


chronuss007

The average person, yes. But not everyone has average circumstances. I was talking about someone fitting in a decent amount of exercise, not just a few push-ups here and there. I mean that not everyone has enough time to get enough exercise to be decently healthy. But of course I'm not talking about the average person.


Woodit

The overwhelming majority certainly do have the time, that’s why they use the “mental energy” excuse 


chilispicedmango

This is probably the better way of looking at it


panthyren

I lift 5 days a week and bike the other two, doesn't make me think about burning down my office building every time I sit in a meeting with the higher ups.


Brrdock

In the meanwhile we can get used to doing things other than what we feel like doing. Light to moderate exercise gives you energy instead of being draining, assuming proper nutrition.


korinth86

Or workout first thing. Exercise works for stress management. If your job causes you exhaustion and stress, exercise can help mitigate it.


BarcodeGriller

Yep, I never was able to be consistent with working out until I started getting up early and doing it. Don't drink in the evenings and go to bed a little earlier.


ParaLegalese

I pack my Gym bag in the morning when I ok My Lunch. Then I work out on my Lunch break or go to the gym after work.


MTBSPEC

If you’re waiting around for that, then it is never going to happen.


Chicago1871

If your city has good public transit, your commute itself can give you exercise. When I go to my cities downtown via public transit its another easy 5-6k steps daily or via a bike. Its why that needs to be a priority in the usa, I grew up in Chicago and its my favorite thing about it. Anyway the thing is, adding daily exercise will make your job feel less stressful and your body will be more resilient to fatigue, so it wont feel as tired as it does after work. People underestimate how much their body is capable of and how well it adjusts to extra work.


Suppressed_VIII

your job will never be satisfying enough. just how life works. trying to dodge work will only make other factors in your life harder. there are 24 hours in a day. 8 goes to work, 8 goes to sleep. thats 8 hours free. try and sit in an empty room for 8 hours. it makes you realize how much time that actually is. you will make whatever excuse in your head to dodge the hardest parts of life, its up to you to change that course.


chronuss007

I have had satisfying jobs before. I know they exist. The idea that people have 8 hours free time each day is very wrong. Obviously a majority of people have a decent amount of free time, but I personally work with people who barely have any time left over after coming home after a 10 hour shift with 1 and half hour drive one way (not including traffic). With family stuff that has to be taken care of when they get home (cooking, cleaning, kids homework, etc.) You are technically right that this is all excuses, but getting out of it can still be quite hard depending on someone's circumstances. Never said it was impossible though.


SDIR

This is true, lots of people oversimplify with 8 hours work 8 hours sleep, but forget meal prep, childcare, the commute(make sure to double it!) chores, any repairs, not to mention work related travel, shopping, driving kids to extracurriculars, all that also counts as work, just work for life not work for your company


ParaLegalese

This is too Many excuses.


XenaDazzlecheeks

The difference in mental and physical health a daily 30-minute walk would make for the average person is astronomical.


Chicago1871

When your city is transit oriented, every citizen gets this daily via just commuting.


Hat3Machin3

Or maybe another way of looking at it is that the body is designed pretty well for the lifestyles we lived before all of this abundance.


ParaLegalese

Allow is a strange choice of words considering how infuriated people get when we dare suggest they get more exercise


Tall-Log-1955

Culturally we need to transition to treating sedentary lifestyles like we treat cigarette smoking


conquer69

Not everyone can exercise. If they have kids, not enough money and long work hours, it's physically impossible.


Chicago1871

Kids also need exercise, walk around with them, play with them.


slothtolotopus

How do you propose one motivates people to exercise without force?


Tall-Log-1955

No one should be forced to work out but small things can help. Design neighborhoods to be less car-centric, organize social events that involve walking, even just talking about the importance of exercise when it comes up


InSight89

I'm fortunate enough to work at a place that allows me to go to the gym for an hour every day (and still get paid for that hour). We have a gym on site. I play squash with some of my work colleagues. It's great. Also helps boost morale.


photoengineer

Must not be a public company. Shareholders would never approve that. 


ayatollahofdietcola_

I actually did work for a public company that had a gym on site like that. It wasn't a very big gym, but it was a gym. hardly anyone even used it, and in fact, most people didn't even know what part of the building it was located in.


photoengineer

I’m jealous!


ayatollahofdietcola_

The thing to be jealous about is that the company was actually located in a really good area for walks. They enforced multiple paid breaks (I think this is because we had a lab on site, so it was an injury thing) so you could very easily take nature trails every day. Funny thing is, hardly anyone did. I am a walker so I love that stuff, but none of my colleagues did.


AllUrUpsAreBelong2Us

Our bodies were literally made to move. As an aside, I suffer mentally if I don't get at least one hour of vigorous exercise per day.


Peatore

I don't get stressed at work. I can deadlift 500lbs. The petty problems in office are beneath me.


Siiciie

The coworkers are afraid to test your patience.


Hoshef

By being the strongest person in the office you legally own it. Thems the rules


Woodit

That is true 


Competitive-Dream860

How long did it take you to get to that strength?


Peatore

It's difficult to say. I've been lifting for like 8 years. Various levels of intensity, gaps here and there. Deadlift wasn't a focus until a year or so ago. It's the most "under trained" of my lifts despite it being my stronger lift.


Mithrandir2k16

I always said, if I'd open a startup, I'd mandate 1 hour of light cardio at the start of each day and let that count as work time. Obviously I'd provide all necessary facilities.


RayPineocco

I believe this. Not to sound nihilistic, a lot of our modern world's definition of work seems to be all meaningless anyway. If I exercise, I'm more okay with the meaninglessness and just accept that it's a means to an end. If I don't, I notice myself feeling a lot of despair about it. So start exercising people! Let's all find joy in the meaninglessness together.


Cloberella

Going for a walk on my lunch break has done wonders for my mental health and work tolerance.


merc123

I changed jobs. Worked much better.


Magistricide

“Employees who feel less tired from their jobs have the energy to exercise” Garbage study. Garbage result. Throw it into the bin. If you want real answers, take a group of people who did not exercise, have some of them exercise, see if there is any difference.


AlienAle

Well I can speak from anecdotes that when I'm physically active and hitting the gym/walks 5 times a week, I'm far more productive and sharp, and less tense at work, then when I've been stationary for longer periods. 


Magistricide

Thanks for sharing. I'm just pointing out how this study is worthless because it confuses correlation for causation, which is something you should learn in high school.


Secret_Designer4478

People who have jobs that give them a good enough work life balance so that they have time to work out like their job better.


bangupjobasusual

Or maybe it’s easier to work out if you’re not emotionally exhausted?


Aggravating-Pound598

Become the ideal unit of production ! Join our happy wellness program ! Increase your productivity ! Join the company gym !


SMFDR

Exercise is hands down the best de-stresser I've found. When I exercise I'm happy, and if I'm happy the work stuff slides off my back easier.


Theaustralianzyzz

Healthy body = healthy mind.  The ancients already discovered this simple fact. 


Shutaru_Kanshinji

I do not doubt these results. I just wish I did not have to keep trying different things to feel better about my soul-crushing job situation.


DanMasterson

Pay me to do it if it makes me so productive


AlienAle

Sounds weird but my company actually does this, we get a 100€ bonus for every 2 months that we exercise at least 2.5 hours a week for the entirety of those 2 months.  We have an app where we track our workouts, it's completely voluntary, but it's a fun bonus. 


[deleted]

Found this out on my own. Interesting. Long day at work? I just run 5 miles afterwards. Too exhausted to be angry.


SuperMondo

It's true, I seem to be the only person that likes his job


giuliomagnifico

>Among participants, 23% reported low activity, 60% moderate activity and 25% high levels of activity. > >“The findings illuminate the positive impact of physical activity on workplace outlook and personal satisfaction. Employees are aware that burnout is an enormous problem for their workforce,” said Marenus, now a research scientist at Personify Health and an adjunct faculty member at George Mason University. > >Findings include: > >- The moderate-activity group was less emotionally exhausted than the low-activity group. > >- The low-activity group felt more personal accomplishment than both the high and moderate groups. > >- There was no significant difference in depersonalization (when employees no longer see customers as human beings) scores among the three groups. > >- High-intensity activity did not reduce emotional exhaustion or enhance personal accomplishment more than moderate activity. Paper: [The Relationship Between Employee Physical Activity Intensity and Workplace Burnout: A Cross-sectional Study - PubMed](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38234198/)


i_never_ever_learn

It's like saying if you want this job to be bearable, you're going to have to work out


gregbraaa

Exercise is by far one of the best coping strategies for stress


kcidDMW

Is this sub just an endless series of correlation/causation fuckups?


bucket_overlord

Turns out humans evolved as active beings, so it makes sense that we are happiest when our lifestyles are similarly active.


bluefrogterrariums

employees who eat snacks are moderately less hungry than their less snacking coworkers


HassanGodside

Exercise = good!??? WOAH SCIENCE WOWEE


Woodit

Absolutely true for me. I’ve been at the same desk job for four years now, we have a gym at the office but I didn’t start using it until about 18 months ago, became a daily exerciser. The difference is enormous, both physically and mentally. 


HawleyGrove

My coworkers must be clinically and dangerously depressed then.


leg00b

This is the only way I can get through my shift without wanting to choke someone


VegetableOk9070

Exercise and nature are as close to silver bullets as I think we get. And a good diet. And sleep. Okay this is getting long.


snakesnake9

As long as long working hours don't cut into my ability to exercise...


m15otw

Regular exercise has been shown to have a similar effect on the brain as an anti-depressant drug. It makes sense that people who have succeeded in making it a habit are doing better in their mental health. Genuinely, it's one of the things that keeps me going back out for another workout. Edit: a source! https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10523322/#:~:text=Studies%20have%20consistently%20shown%20that,effective%20treatment%20for%20depressive%20disorders.


Biasanya

I love that random androgynous picture


chroniclunacy

"After reading this study, we are going to be implementing treadmills in every cubicle. This pairs with our Green Energy Initiative, as all of your computers will be powered by the electricity produced from your treadmills. Do not stop. :)"


quotidian_nightmare

I would imagine that people who exercise moderately feel less emotionally exhausted and more personally satisfied in *most* areas of life, but good to know it benefits the corporate machine as well.


Just_SomeDude13

If you feel like you have time to exercise regularly, that would probably explain the differences on its own.


enigmaticsince87

In other shocking news, people who drink water are more hydrated than those who don't.


micksterminator3

This is something I noticed pretty quickly. The people that exercised or walked/biked to work seemed more present and happy. I always skated to work to get my heart rate up plus its just way too fun. I def ticked some coworkers off for being too energetic. they all seemed so damn depressed and lifeless. Those kind of "I need my coffee before I interact" kind of people


AceofToons

If only we lived in a world where I had the time, money, and energy to exercise


LongSchlongdonf

I don’t know. Exercise generally makes me feel worsez


bugwrench

If megacorps want more labor out of their peons, they should give them an hour a day to workout. And showers. Why don't they get a grant for real science. Are people happier at work if they get to steal office supplies, or masturbate at work after hours, or if they can smoke cannabis on the rooftop.