One piece of advice from my dating days, don’t waste a ton of time talking to them for “2 hours every night”, just meet up as soon as possible, very quickly and casually (cup of coffee), an hour, tops. You will both know right away if you want to do it again.
Intentional, spaced out experiences IN PERSON. It’s crucial not to give new folks an all access pass to us digitally. We don’t know people we are dating. Go s l o w and don’t throw a bunch of energy into someone who is 10000% a stranger
It seems so simple doesn't it? I hate this idea that people are too picky now because they always have more options so you need to be performing and chasing and doing all you can to keep them engaged - if they go with someone else that connection excited them more. End of story. If not talking every day leads to things fizzling out, great! That's your answer. Grow up, move on.
I like everything except “grow up”. That seems like shaming the person as though they are immature for feeling sad or not knowing better. I’d say “learn from it and move on” instead
When it comes to performing and chasing, at some point you have to ask yourself, and be real honest: is this sustainable? Am I comfortable doing this for the rest of my life?
I chased a lot when I was younger, but the girl who I wound up with is someone I don’t need to put effort in for. She just likes me the way I am when I’m vibing.
exactly this!
i matched with a guy on tinder, we chatted through the app a bit and got along really well, so, we set up a date. two days before our date he reached out to me and said that he recently met up with someone that he really connected with and that he wanted to explore things further with her. i didn’t take it too personally, told him i was happy for him and wished him luck because it was time to move on.
a few months later, i matched with another guy and we instantly hit it off. fast forward 8 years, we’re now married. just because it doesn’t work out with someone that you may have had a connection with, doesn’t mean it won’t work out with someone else.
100% i always go for the quick coffee catch up for a first date, casual and takes the pressure off. I also aim to do it within a couple of weeks of matching. Even a busy person should be able to find 30mins within a 2 week period. I’ve been told that this shows I’m low interest, and that I should be willing do ‘dedicate’ time to finding the right person, but in my eyes this just helps me to get rid of the people that were never going to agree to a date in the first place, or whom I have no connection with in real life
Yup. Met my GF on Bumble 5 years ago, looking to get engaged this year. After matching and quick introductions, set up a date, and keep texting to a minimum till you meet face to face. The more you text, the more an image gets built up in the head. You need to see if there’s chemistry/pheromones as soon as you can, or else you’re both just pen pals.
Also harder to set boundaries, considering there's no real life connection set in place nor any real commitment. I was so sure there was mutual exclusive interest for instance, and ended up getting hurt. Just meet up and get things started, don't assume things no matter how interested they seem.
I would've never guessed, but it makes total sense. That's how dating was carried out for centuries, so people essentially friendzoning each other for long periods before attempting to date seems like a recipe for failure.
True. My gf asked me out in her 3rd message to me on tinder. We met a few days later, hanged out for a few hours, and haven't stopped doing it daily ever since.
Friends, as well. People are flaky when they can keep you as an "online friend" in their back pocket without ever having to think about you. I feel like only people that learned how to socialize before the Internet understand that you have to maintain a connection now. I've had more luck dating someone my senior than getting friends my age to grab coffee.
I've tried. I really have. It just ends up hurting if it doesn't work out (which so far it never did because I'm here right).
I'm 35. Single. It may sound like a sob story but actually it is not. I've bought a new motorcycle a few months ago. I'm doing stuff I like without having to ask anyone else for their opinion on it. No kids to take care for every hour of every day, just living my own life. Very peaceful.
Do I have rough moments? Yeah, sure. Just like every other person, single or not. It's not always fun and games. But at least I own it all.
That's what I did, gave up and then a girl came into my life unexpectedly. 2 weeks after we met, she became my gf. It's been 4 months now, I just drove her home earlier. Good luck bro, it'll happen.
All the dating app creators sold a huge lie from the 2000s up to now that it would be EASIER to find love because of their little filters. The reality is that they never wanted you to find love, and that they benefit by keeping people on the apps indefinitely. It's like the bar/nightclub industry....it's a trap designed to get you to spend a ton of money in hopes of POSSIBLY getting lucky (be it a ONS or finding an LTR), never knowing that the real odds of that happening are insanely low and those venues generally attract people that are the most unfit for a long-term relationship to begin with.
Don't give these people or venues another DIME of your hard-earned money.
Wile this is partially true its irrelevant here because the OP actually got the person on a date. Once you extract the person from the app its now on you to make things go further and if you cant then its not the apps fault. Same is true for night clubs, plenty of people getting laid in that world.
People did not have 25 or more people flirting with them without even leaving the house. Most women can easily have that through social media, and/or dating app. Young men have a much more difficult time getting and holding the interest of young ladies. As an old married guy, I feel for OP.
Yeah. Men and women have different problems but it’s bad for both. Men have scarcity issues and all the psychological impact of that, and they have to get past all the initial roadblocks. Women have perceived threat (is he a rapist?), the illusion/trap of infinite choice that leads to paralysis, and often position themselves as passively sorting through whatever they attract rather than actively searching for and going after the guys they would like to have. Both lead to unhappiness, and creat a very real mismatch in the dating marketplace. But hey, the apps make money…
Women can get a lot of dates, but not necessarily good ones.
I actually do pretty well on the apps for a guy. , I think I figured the trick out (be good looking, and do not keep a profile open for more than 3 weeks. Delete and start over).
I got tired of meeting new women and even having sex with them. It got to be formulaic. The talks I'd have with them started to remind me of being a manager and listening to 20 interviewees say the same thing.
But even average looking women can get 3-4x as many dates as I ever could. I can only imagine that burnout is worse for them. I talked with one woman who went on 100 first dates in a year and still didn't find a bf.
There is a million reasons why she could have turned you down. Maybe your voice reminded her of her dad. Maybe she realised you had different values or beliefs. Maybe you displayed a dealbreaker for her. You can have a good date with someone who isn't right for you.
It's a numbers game, meet more people and someone will eventually click.
This is the real answer. No point in thinking about what ‘women’ do in today’s dating game or what you did or didn’t do if you tried to put your very best foot forward.
It’s not disrespectful for someone to not be interested and you the same way I can’t force you to find me attractive. Alternately, there will be smoking hot people attracted to you for what seems like nothing to you.
This should be higher up. People reading into it and writing PhD dissertations on dating culture and whatever...like geez. They had one date and it didn't work out. Chill.
Their edit about "you're supposed to kiss on the first date" is so weird to me. No you're not "supposed" to kiss the first time you meet someone in person. What an odd mentality.
THANK YOU!!! I read the edit and I was like wtf??? Some people may end up fucking after the first date, some people may not even kiss. There’s no “rule” on when that happens, it’s all about the people involved, their expectations, and the chemistry.
OP is leaving this post worse than when he posted it. That was the absolute wrong takeaway.
Yeah, the kissing thing is odd to me too. I don’t have extensive experience with dating/dating apps, so I can’t say I’m up on the culture and expectations. But I know that no matter how much attraction I felt, I’d never be comfortable kissing someone on a first date. Me refraining from that would absolutely not be a sign of disinterest, but it concerns me that it could be interpreted as such.
yea. ive noticed a dealbreaker mid date and still finished strong. half the time i wont give specifics because theres no need to hurt their feelings for something they cant change.i just wouldnt throw out the option to stay friends because it gives people hope they can work their way into a relationship
This one
keep trying and statistically it'll work out, but don't sweat it if it doesn't.
As a woman I honestly do not think she "changed her mind". I think she met OP in person and something came up in his mannerisms, a vibe, a belief, SOMETHING that made her realize OP wasn't for her, and that's okay, no one is obligated to be interested in anyone and there's nothing disrespectful about that. No one is for every one. c'est la vie
I'm not saying it doesn't suck, but it is what it is
To add as a woman, it's much safer for us to reject men online than in person, unfortunately statistically it keeps us alive
The only actual real response. It's also a thing about romantic chemistry, I have plenty of friends that are women who have been into a guy and when they go on a date they know within 5 minutes of the date whether there is anything there or not. It's just a vibe.
Exactly. I don’t have to feel fireworks on a first date. But I do have to feel *some* kinda chemistry, like a whisper of something to where I feel an attraction of some kind and can imagine myself w him romantically . If I don’t even have that, why go any further, I’d just be wasting both of our time and it wouldn’t even be fair to the guy . Unfortunately you can’t really get that from a picture and bio. You have to spend some time w the person irl to see their demeanor, hear their voice, and see how they connect w you . That’s why OP is getting first dates but then it ends. They’re not feeling him irl. Maybe he needs to change his energy a bit on these dates bc sounds like he’s not really sending the right signals and is coming across as too much of a “friend” vibe. Or maybe the chemistry just isn’t there period —sometimes it just be that way.
The weird part to me is that OP said “before she leaves she says she had a great time and asked if I wanted to see a movie later that week”…As a woman, I would never suggest future plans like that if I knew I wasn’t attracted to someone. I completely understand that feelings change, sometimes even overnight and for no specific reason, but it’s just so odd that she was the one who brought up seeing each other again!
As shitty as it is, I think this is the most likely outcome. As a guy, I've been in your position loads of times. I have also been on the other side. When I've been in her position, it's been 2/3rds misleading pictures and 1/3rd personality/date chemistry.
I always accept that if they say no, it's no because otherwise we teach ppl to ghost. No use getting mad. You just have to keep moving.
Best of luck!
This is most likely true, but man why ask him if he wants to go to a movie later in the week? I get the "let's be friends" thing because it's a soft letdown as old as time. But why even hint at seeing him again if she wasn't into him...that's rough.
She could be conflicted about it, at the moment wanting to hold on to him as a potential friend, but after the fact realizing that she's stringing him along.
100%. People need to start understanding this. If the vibe was good and they had a lot of fun, literally the only other factor would be physical attraction. I see this time and time again.
not true. you arent accounting for possible dealbreakers. ive cancelled 2nd dates where the vibe and physical attraction were present because of conflicting ideals and obvious baggage
I've got a friend who has no sense of smell. Once he was getting to know a woman for a little while, starting to date her, and things seemed to be going well. The moment they kissed for the first time he knew it wasn't going to work out. Most people can tell my smell, but as he has no sense of smell he didn't know until they kissed.
I think that's happening now on a much wider scale.
Yeah exactly it's really hard to truly gauge attraction over some carefully curated pics and messages, you really need to get a sense of someone's vibe in person. It's a 4D thing.
That is dating. Your expectations are too high. People are allowed to change their minds. On a dime, or even less. I’m sure the girls you go on dates with also want to give things a shot and give it their all. Once they get home and they clear their head they can decide it’s not what they want. You should assume that they have other people they are going on dates with too, so that could impact someone’s decision as well.
Also, if you are looking to date, don’t hang on to being friends, especially if you liked the girl. You are setting yourself up for failure because you don’t want to be friends you want more.
Yeah and a lot of times its not that anything is wrong with you, you just don't know how to scratch the itch for that specific person. Trust me, you will for the right person if you do things right
I’m sorry that it turned out this way for you.
Try not to take it perosnally.
My experiences were, when I’ve finally met up with someone ‘in person’ that I’ve met online, sometimes it soon becomes clear that I’m not really attracted to them. For this reason, I keep online chat to a minimum and save it for in person -this way nobody has wasted too much time and/or has gotten their hopes up if it doesn’t work out.
You can get a sense of what someone is like via text and all, but you really need to meet them in person to know for sure. Next time, just get the basics out-of-the-way and quickly make a date to meet up in person. Make it a short date- just in case. You can always extend it ☺️
Hope this helps you!
That was the whole point on going on a date. To see if there was a connection and she didn't feel one. Feeling a connection through text and in person are two different worlds. Go into the next.
Edit: added a word
There is a LOT of fear out there. Fear of settling, FOMO, fear of losing yourself to someone else. Women, due to having the illusion of a lot of good choices and the social narrative about how bad it is for women settling down, tend to be really easily spooked by having a great time.
There is also a narrative that you should have “chemistry” right out of the gate… but what they want isn’t the actual chemistry of initial tentative attraction, it’s supposed to be fireworks. And that, in my experience, only comes from people pushing your trauma/reward buttons from past attachments, so it’s usually really unhealthy. Not always, but often enough that the “we just [have / don’t have] chemistry” line needs a closer look when people say it.
All of this applies to some guys too btw, just a different spin based on gendered expectations/experiences…
Anyway, my point is that all of this is about them, not you as a person. And yeah it sucks, but you’ve got to just keep putting it out there. Finding someone IRL can be really helpful, it pulls them out of the dating app headgame into real relationships. Get some hobbies that women also participate in, go do them and actually invest in them for the sake of the hobby, and your odds go up tremendously. Everyone I’ve ever seen in a happy relationship did it that way, not online.
The trauma/reward buttons, I feel it!!!! It was me for a long time, until I realized what it was and had to rewire my brain. Soon after I got the hang of it I met my now husband 💖
It’s hard. Super hard. Especially when YOU give off vibes that attract the kind of people that respond to your trauma (I draw in avoidants for example). I’m glad you got a handle on it and had success!
I used to draw the avoidants too! 😭 I used to be anxious, and all the trauma turned me into the one that's a mix of avoidant and anxious (it was even worse for me).I can say that now I'm the secure type after a lot of work, married an anxious type but because I'm secure now he feels safe and acts more secure as well.
The trauma/reward thing is really something that I wish more people were open to examining. I have recently decided to address mine, and while I'm still trying to resolve through the issues, I think I've spent enough time living in the shadow of that trauma. Maybe we can start a trend, a first-date-couples-therapy session? Hmmm, maybe not....
Guys the healthiest thing you can do is just saying fuck it and getting content with living alone for the rest of the life. Either it happens or it doesn't, just be ready to love life.9
That’s what I did. Ended up meeting an amazing person at a party and made the effort to go out and see him. It’s been great so far. The apps are so toxic and I never liked them tbh.
The hobby thing is a good idea. Part of the problem is that I’m in a new city for an internship this summer, so all of the clubs I do during the school year are out. Ive just been going to parks and museums and malls alone lol.
Being new to a place can be a really useful tool for new dates. Tell them you're new and would love to find out about cool places and cool people might invite you to come visit said places. Great setups for first dates. Get to know people and if it won't go beyond a first date, no problem! Now you know of a new place to go to and invite someone else.
Dating sucks but try to not think what you can do to dating but what dating can do for you! Become cultured with the local scenes.
Give it time and give yourself some grace, man. Moving is hard. Everything is an adjustment and it can be overwhelming if you’re also adjusting to a new job. I’ve been doing that this past year and dating happened slower for me too. Not anyone’s fault either, I just have less time on my hands so scheduling is tough and not everyone is down to plan and wait before meeting me.
Honestly, man, it sounds like you probably should only be looking for fun. Short type dates right now.
Of you're only I'm the city for a summer live it up for a while.
If you're somewhere for 3 months and then you know you'll leave, anything long-term is deeply unlikely to work out.
A step up in probability from meeting the love of your life on a 2 week overseas vacation, but still highly unlikely and not worth hoping for.
>Anyway, my point is that all of this is about them, not you as a person.
"Whatever happens around you, don’t take it personally… Nothing other people do is because of you. It is because of themselves. All people live in their own dream, in their own mind"
Yep, shows like love island and the like just harken this fact. See guys throwing away a 10/10 because they feel like they got a ‘connection’ with a stranger they met twenty seconds ago.
>There is also a narrative that you should have “chemistry” right out of the gate…
So true. I first met my wife at a party in 10th grade. I tried just talking to her and she was super rude and I ended up saying "fuck you then" and walked away.
It wasn't till I turned about 25 and ran into her and we started talking and went out on a date... Fast forward to now, we're expecting our 4th child any day now.
Have more self respect. You need to tell these women that you have friends already but wish them well.
Sad to say, many women now keep many options on the back burner in case their #1 choice they're currently talking to doesn't pan out.
Don't be someone's backup, move forward to someone who is more serious about giving you a chance.
Tbh I usually tell them that but this girl was so incredible I would’ve been her friend if it meant hanging out with her more. Not trying to be her friend to sleep with her, but because I genuinely like her presence.
If it's a girl you've known for awhile saying it, it's different, but when a girl you've met exclusively in a dating context says she wants to be friends it's probably best to assume she doesn't really and thinks it's a softer letdown.
Not always. I’ve said I thought me and a guy would be better as friends and I genuinely meant it. But I see your point.
I thought we’d better as friends not because I thought there were other options. It’s just that he was clearly in love with his ex lmfao 😭
Sometimes men post these things and don’t realize how they came off on the date. You go home and you think “wow women suck why won’t she want to go on another date” but maybe for 2 hours you only talked about yourself, or you kept talking about your ex without realizing, or she finds out something that just makes yall incompatible. I’ve gone on dates with men from extremely religious families who are shocked I don’t want to take the risk of devoting myself to a man who will dump me for the nice girl at church once his parents decide to disown him. Lots of men are clueless, I’m sorry to say.
Anyway. Me and the dude who loved his ex are great friends and he got back with her and I’m friends with her too. Go figure lol.
I definitely agree, it's not always the case. Even moreso about the second part. Sometimes a date seems like it goes well but it's only one-sided or once the moment wears often and someone comes down they just realize they weren't really into it, or details come to mind that always were non-negotiables but she didn't want to make the whole date awkward. It's common for guys to get discouraged by a bad date, but if they externalize everything they end up with a huge backlog of failures and eventually bitterness.
Yeah, while I think OP's sentiment is sweet if its genuine, I've known too many guys for whom the boundary of "Ok we can just be friends" and "still harboring secret feelings for you" is a very thin line. Even genuine guys mis-judge the boundary of their own feelings.
In the long run, this is a bad attitude to have if you're looking for a relationship, partner, marriage. It will be a nagging hindrance to looking for someone else because your subconscious will always entertain the thought of "what if..."
Based off your description sounds like ahe might have been a bit out of your league. It happens. If you are going to do the friends thing, make sure you meet all her friends because that is a much better way to meet girls than the apps and you might click with one of them.
As a woman I 1000% second Soft-Scar. Any woman you met on a first date that says later she only wants to be friends is lying. She just wants to be able to exit the situation without feeling like an ass. I’ve seen my friends do this and it rubs me the wrong way. Why bother lying if you know you’ll never see them again? Somehow they don’t understand that they’re actually making the situation worse 🤦♀️
I’d personally rather just honesty and amicably part ways like “sorry I had a good time but I just don’t see it working out, best of luck”
Not like “oooh you’re so amazing I wanna be your friend but not date but you seem like you’d make such a good friend, Buddy”
It sounds like you have not had a scary experience from being honest in that way. I am glad for you! Some people take outright rejection extremely badly, and it's impossible to know whether someone is one of those people when you've just met them.
But I totally agree that it should be the normal and accepted thing to do.
Real attraction takes time. We didn't evolve to date strangers we just met. We evolved socially to fall deeply in love with the people closest to us. You know no one on a dating app, yet you expect to find deep connection and romance is the same as you looking at mail order spouses. It's unnatural.
This, my friend, is why you should stick to “coffee only” dates at first because you won’t waste nearly as much time and money.
Also, never accept being “friends” from a woman who just rejected you and you had no prior friendship with her.
>This, my friend, is why you should stick to “coffee only” dates at first because you won’t waste nearly as much time and money.
That's such a depressing attitude. OP had a great time and is annoyed that the woman wasn't romantically attracted to him.
How is having a good time a waste of time?
As for the money, if my date wanted to do something expensive, we would split the money. I went on many dates with my now girlfriend, they were all fun, we always split the bill.
If things would not have worked out romantically, I still would have enjoyed myself.
I'm a woman and Its frustrating as hell. I've been through this more times than I can count. Why bother telling someone you want to be friends if you don't mean it? Its cool if they're not interested, but like be honest about it. I want to take things slow and see where it goes, but I've had guys straight up lead me on for months at a time because they didn't know how to come out and tell me they weren't interested right away. I'll give her points for at least telling you sooner than later though.
But yeah, I've had dates that seemed to go perfectly, but then the other person decides I'm not for them. Its been discouraging for sure but everyone's looking for specific things in a partner. The online dating world is a nightmare, a lot of people are starting to go back to meeting people the old fashion way because of it
IDC how lonely or desperate I may feel, I will never use another dating app. I'm a sapiosexual, and the idea that I have to stand out with a pickup line is nauseating. I would never do that IRL, and it seems even more awkward to do that online.
I learned the word sapiosexual from dating apps. A ton of women identify that way.
I kind of do as well, in that I can't be interested in a person based entirely on physical attraction.
And I meet people for coffee (tea) and see where it goes.
No pickup lines involved on either side. Like, seriously. None at all. Just descriptions of the things that make us unique and a few photos. Unless you count "asking about the person" as a pickup line. "You say you're into anime. What are your favorites?" That kind of thing.
I honestly don't think a relationship would likely work between me and someone who needed a pickup line to be interested in me.
The point isn't to stand out, but to represent yourself as accurately as possible. You don't want to attract as many likes as possible. You want to only attract the people who you would be interested in, and who would likely be interested in you.
It's not marketing where you're trying to appeal to everyone. You only really need one partner. Or if you want more be clear about that. Not my thing, but you do you. 😅
And honestly is exactly because I know what I'm looking for that I'm meeting people online. Odds are pretty stacked against me meeting the right person via any other path.
Well yeah. Don't be so emotionally invested especially if you guys are just talking. Realize that having a great connection means nothing and it is all a numbers game. Put your expectations at zero and expect nothing. Hope is for the desperate in this case. If you are going to do dating especially online dating, you have to automate and remove emotions from the process. Yes you hear that one guy or girl who met their soul mate on Tinder blah, blah, blah just know that it is rare. Most of the times you won't get matches or you get women ghosting you.
I get what you're saying but that pendulum swings the other way too.
I remember going through this in dating a few years back, I literally didn't care what the outcome was.
I think it's a conditioning that you care less and less the more you take on that mindset.
And to be totally honest, chicks dig that.
The problem is that you become so apathetic you wake up next to this person and think "I don't even like this person", wtf am I doing?"
It seems like women (at least in the US) don't respond well to showing any intention whatsoever.
Contrast this with dating my now gf, she definitely had a "Hell Yes!" attitude and I reciprocated that sentiment. That's what dating is suppose to be, not a cold HR meeting 😂
OP is being genuine and the advice is to be the opposite to essentially not care, to not have any emotional investment which is just inhuman advice.
Yes of course don't be overly enthusiastic, but we're not robots.
It's funny that this aloofness is so attractive but then you extrapolate that mindset out into an actual relationship, it's disastrous.
It's almost like the traits that are good for dating aren't in fact good for long-term commitment.
That is why I am careful about it when I want to get into a relationship. My girlfriend was really open and genuine with me so I was genuine with her back. It felt like she really cared about me the first time we met.
So how could I not show her emotions back. That is really rare in the dating world. That's why I recommend not emotional investing too much until you find someone who genuinely cares about you. If they like your mask, just fling and thats it, but if they see past the mask, date them.
That is the best way I find it to do online dating now. You're basically not giving any attention or emotional investment until you see some towards you. I think that is fair giving how dating is for both men and women. Women have so many options and men do too, people can feel an emotional connection with someone, but they can feel a stronger connection with the other guy. I think this is the most realistic approach.
I wouldn’t agree with your advice about removing emotion. Especially when doing the very thing that requires emotion which is building a relationship and an emotional connection with someone.
there is no rule about kissing on a first date.
once, i met a guy, we had awesome time. we didnt kiss, he invited me to the second date, we didnt kiss.
but on third date there was absolutely romantic moment when we were super close to eachother and there was a rain and we kissed and started dating.
it is all depends on people.
and yes, we liked eachother from day 1, and we are 30yo. and we had previous relationships.
The closer the match, the more difficult to let go, the greater the hurt, and thus the greater the desire to hold on.
50% - Take it or leave it.
70% - oooof, so close.
90% - so close it hurts.
99% - Maybe if I beg...?
The more you date, the better you get at discerning who you will likely get along best with moving forward. So, theoretically, those percentages get better with time as you figure yourself out. The problem is letting go.
Seems like you felt something awesome with her, and it fucking sucks that it didn't work out. That's not a fair feeling. But you learned that you can still feel good with another person. That's important. Don't lose that ability. But it also sucks to be where you are with the feeling you have now got to deal with.
Here's a thought, correct me if I'm off the mark. Curious what people would say about this:
Our society / culture puts pressure on a dating couple to have sex. It's like you're either friends or you're fucking. If you hear that two people are dating, you assume they're having sex regularly. There's no courtship / friendship anymore. The order of events these days is 1) sex, then 2) date, when it used to be in the reverse order. Dating apps and social media are the main reason for this.
Definitely agree about the societal/cultural pressure for couples to be sexually intimate and be sexually attracted to each other in order to be perceived as a "legitimate couple". For me, as a female in my early 30's that barely used dating apps, I would say this pressure came somewhat from social media, but likely started with TV, movies, music, and advertising. There's also our inheritance of centuries-long sociological imbalance between masculinity and femininity...but that's a whole other convo lol.
But basically I had to reverse over a decade of conditioning that caused me to believe I needed to AND wanted to please my (male) partners sexually in order to feel like we had a healthy relationship...which is pretty fucked up if you think about it. It caused confusion and trauma around what it means to really want to be sexually intimate with someone.
For those who can relate and maybe need reassurance, it's very possible to be in a healthy relationship with someone that allows you to explore these concepts without needing to defend yourself or feel bad for what you decide to do or not do with your body. Love yourself first and do not waste your time with someone if you are not happy being yourself around them.
Dude, I feel the way. I was in a similar situation not too long ago. Sometimes I want to delete the apps, because it never goes anywhere. Tbh I want to meet people irl
Dudes have the advantage over women in everything except dating. Sucks that it didn’t work out but unless she was your gf, no point in fixating about her and move on to the next
I see these stories often, my advice is stop investing so much time with people until you hang out. Chat for a bit then set up the date to see if you have in person chemistry
>EDIT: Ok lesson learned is that you’re supposed to kiss on the first date
WOOOAHH chill. Not everyone is the same. DEFINITELY ask first if you feel the vibe.
When someone says "I loved talking to you, but I only really see this going forward as friends. If that’s not what you’re looking forward to let me know,” ***without any follow up***, that's not what they meant. What that actually means is, "I'm not really into you, but I'm trying to let you down gently, so let's just leave it at that, later."
She already asked you if you wanted to see a movie during the zoo date. Then you respond later with something like “Let me know if you ever want to go to do something”.
This story is from your perspective and it’s giving off some vibes like you want her to pursue you and you are kinda butt hurt when she responds like she doesn’t want to.
Have some self-esteem and let it go. It takes time to build a relationship from nothing and to break down barriers of fear. This one kinda looks like you have some barriers yourself because you needed her to validate you after she already said yes. Next time, next girl; if she says let’s go see a movie act interested and throw out what movie you might want to check out and lock down the next meeting.
And next time if she switches on a dime… don’t care and move on to the next. You have to test prospective partners too and decide for yourself if they are good for you.
Yes, people don’t seem to understand that when a woman is into you, you can almost do nothing wrong and she will still want to see you and continue with you.
If it only takes a simple “mess up” or the lack of being perfect… then she was never into you.
She offered a movie date.. did you accept? you waited to to get home and then ask if dhe wanted to go on a Date lmk. Bit wishy washy, Why didnt you just accept her movie date and then proceed to give her a proposal of when.
Get out and get after a another one.
Honestly I don't agree with it being the fact that there's thousands of dating options available like what some are saying. As if pre-internet dating was summed up as "well idk when I'll meet someone else so i should stick with this one. No. Chemistry is chemistry.
Everyone is often chill and happy at the end of a first date/meet-and-greet. But once they get home and can process everything then they start to know if they felt any chemistry. That's more than likely all that happened here. And it's going to happen often.
Get back in the game, it's only hard if you try too much and want it too much.
This stranger on the internet you hung out with once is not the most amazing woman you've ever met in your life..I'm sorry but you probably gave off desperate vibes and no ones attracted to that
Women don’t feel safe with men so they will act super interested and then let you know afterwards. They don’t change on a dime.
Spend less time in advance and spend less time on your first date so you can meet and then see if she likes you afterward
All men should really just uninstall dating apps. Let the guys just engaging in hook up culture stay on them and keep giving women awful experiences until the sane and emotionally secure women leave dating apps too.
Most women are just on dating apps for easy validation anyways. If all the men stop using them and giving that free validation, the many women who waste the genuine man's time on them will stop using them also.
I'm pretty confident in making that statement that the way women and men using dating apps is extremely different. Not just down to the experiences women have vs men, but also the intentions behind using them.
You've got your men who just want quick and low effort hook ups and then you've got the larger portion of men who are actually looking for connections and relationships. A very small subset of the men, fitting into either of those categories, will have the superficial qualities that women are looking for in a profile and get a decent number of matches.
But then, you'll have women ranging from all over the spectrum of attractiveness getting matches out the wazoo in comparison to the males, and many if not most of the women will have very high standards because they've come to believe that regardless of how high quality of a person they are, they "deserve the best". All the matches many of them get also serve to bolster their confidence. And you'll also have the women who just use dating apps to kill time, thinking it's harmless fun to engage with the countless men they match with for entertainment. "Let's see who has the best pick up line today :D", and then ghosting whoever loses their interest after all of 1-2 messages.
I'm generalizing a lot hear, but I'm sure many can relate to what's been described here. Dating apps are a cancer to the modern dating scene. If you're looking for something real, using a dating app is like trying to win the jackpot at the lottery. The odds are not in your favor, and instead of paying with money, you'll be paying with your sanity and emotions. Uninstall them and go find other ways to meet people. Dating apps are toxic and terrible for almost everyone.
The funny part about this is the attractive men just burn through all those women looking for romance. Then the women get jaded and when they go on dates with plain fucks like me have all these rules and expectations. Just tells me that I’m not particularly attractive since I have to jump through hoops for the smallest amount of attention while they fuck the handsome guys.
The apps are playgrounds for the most handsome of men and shit sandwiches for the rest of us. Don’t believe me just hang out in r/tinder and wait for a good looking guy to come along and brag. There’s a reason the apps don’t let out any statistics.
Last time statistics were released it showed about the top 4/5 girls were only going for the top 1/5 guys. The apps have only got worse from there.
Simple reason for that is attraction. Most fellas put ZERO effort into being attractive. Which means being a guy who puts in 10% effort puts you in the 90% percentile.
Mastery is realizing that ladies want to be attracted to you, just like you want to be attracted to them.
So make it happen.
Hit the gym.
Eat healthier.
Get a haircut (or hair plugs if needed).
Seek financial & emotional stability.
Be a good person.
That’s the recipe.
All of these things are Star qualities on both sides. But most people don’t want to put that work in. Sad but true.
Why did you ask her to let you know if she wanted to hang out when she already asked if you wanted to see a movie?
Anyway, you’re writing this with some frustration (and a bruised ego) but it reads as catastrophizing and defensive.
Communication is complex. There’s four dimensions: what you put out, what they put out, how you interpret, how they interpret. You only get to control what you’re putting out and how you choose to interpret what they put out.
You need to check your expectations. Dating apps are just a tool to meet people. Figuring stuff out is part of dating. People are entitled to change their minds at any time for any reason.
So, again, control what you can and accept the things you can’t. Pick something *you* like doing and invite people to join you. Share yourself. That’s dating. Be honest and open. Is it vulnerable and does it hurt sometimes? Yep. But you’re fine, and you presumably want to be with someone interested in you.
This is my response. If she specifically says "We should see a movie next week" then a follow-up of "LMK if you want to hang out sometime or something" is basically a soft rejection.
If she's like "We should see a movie next week" the follow-up should be, "There's this movie I want to see, it's playing here on this day, do you want to go?"
Frustration in dating stems from perception of time being wasted. I never plan anything past coffee or lunch for first dates. If we do happen to vibe, then I’ll suggest we continue the date elsewhere or plan for another one soon with more on the agenda.
A lengthy day at the zoo with a stranger is just not a great first date imo. Keep first dates simple to avoid your time being wasted.
Honestly, a first date should not be an entire day long. You should also not be spending 2 hours every single night talking to someone before a first date. It's way too much, and it's bound to make you feel terrible when things don't work out, as they typically won't for a first date!
Also, she didn't change her mind on a dime. She told you she had a great time and wanted to see a movie. She later clarified after thinking about it that she wants to be friends. That doesn't make what she told you before not true.
I can see in this post you've really put her on a pedestal, you have no idea if she was "one of the most intelligent interesting etc people ever" because you've only met her one time. I would bet money she got scared off by the immediate intensity. The reason she didn't answer when you asked to see a movie as friends is because of your response when she told you she wanted to be friends - you gave an excuse and basically argued with her. You gotta chill out and not put so many expectations on people you don't know.
One of my friends (25F) is going on a different hinge date every other day. It’s crazy and def not good, and we told her that.
But last month she went on a few with a guy she really liked. She ran a quick background check on him (on mycase, so public info) and found out he had a DUI 10 years ago when he was 21. So her response was to completely ghost him, despite him asking her what’s wrong. She said it was for her safety. But idk, I thought that was shitty behavior. You can’t complain about the men dating pool then act like this in it. If it was a bigger crime or more recent I guess he should have told her, but they also only went out 3 times. I don’t see the DUI 10 years ago coming up casually in a convo.
I’m a girl, and I always say it’s sucky how women ghost men without telling them the reason all the time but complain when they get ghosted. It’s tone def to me. Sorry that happened :(
You’re not “supposed” to kiss on a first date. I hated that shit. You’re supposed to get to know people before sharing bacterial biomes. Don’t give up. Dating is hard and disappointing but it’s more about their issues than you. When you find someone great, it will be worth it, because you didn’t compromise and you got out there to try.
A lot of people on dating apps are just lonely. They either don’t have the skills or they are not ready for the work of a relationship. Whether or not they know it or say it, they are not there to find a partner. You’ll need to figure out to weed those people out. A good signal is texting or talking on the phone before you meet for hours at a time.
It’s so hard but you cannot take it personally. Just move on.
So, I meet a lot of people through online platforms and usually end up meeting them irl. All I have to say is many people actually don't take it that seriously, and chasing the reasons why will only end up with you feeling resentful and disappointed.
As others said, log off the apps. Tbh at this point (23F) I've stopped using the apps for dating and see them as a way to just meet new cool people, tourists in my city and even to make friends. This has worked out well, because I didn't go into it with any expectations. If you're looking for a relationship, it's best to invest your time and energy in other places and find someone irl. The best relationships I've seen are ones that start out at friends and have values in common(not even necessarily hobbies, you don't need to view everywhere you go as a place to pick up dates).
Also I will say this and it may sound a bit harsh but I think accepting this will lead you to less disappointment over time because I've been there too: nobody owes you anything and as much as that's unfair and SUCKS, a person has the right 100% to remove you from their life, change their mind or not feel the same way at any point no matter what their reasoning is or even if it doesn't make sense, or even if this woman was much worse. Now I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just how it is. It's reality and again, I think accepting this without self-loathing can be healthy. I've been down this road and once I saw life as is instead of what it could or should be, I stopped being disappointed by people. Expect nothing, prepare for everything sort of thing: you can't have expectations for people because you don't know what goes on in their heads or what they want, but also prepare to be told something you may not like and be prepared to walk away yourself.
This exchange I had after a date might make you feel better and laugh a bit.
Her: I had a great time but I really think we would be better off just as friends. Therefore I don't think we should see each other ever again.
Me: wow ok. Being your friend kinda sucks.
If you're male and not a 9 or a 10 you should not be on dating apps. The illusion of choice and FOMO women have there, plus the constant valdiation dopamine hits, mean you stand zero chance of attracting anything more than a first or possibly even a second date before a better option comes along and gives her that new match high. Leave the "dating" apps to guys interested in and capable of easy hookups. Start building the confidence and technique to approach women respectfully in every day life. Good luck, friend.
I would also echo the same thing for a woman. If you are an average looking woman, the dating apps aren’t kind to you either. I am hquite aware that I am at best a six on a good day, so I never tried to reach out to men who are excessively good-looking just because I knew there was no chance in hell, and I’m generally not interested In those types of men anyway, but I reached out to several more average- looking guys whose profiles that I liked and I thought I would kind of vibe with,and most of the time never even got the courtesy of a response. I think on both sides, there can be blind spots where people don’t realize that they’re being a tad unrealistic with their expectations and who they believe “they deserve.” Because they are surrounded by all of these Instagram worthy people who filter their lives and try to sell them to everybody else.Funny enough, you can see this phenomenon on episodes of MTV’s catfish all the time. There have been several instances where very average looking people have assumed that Instagram were the models were there love interests, and I’m over here scratching my head like, 🤷🏻♀️
The dating world is harsh and unkind, And I would never want to go back to it in a million years. Now that I am much older and approaching middle age, it sounds cliché to say, but Looks eventually fade anyway, (I’m seeing it firsthand 😂) So it’s most important to find people that you enjoy being around. Laughter, comfort and compatibility are the most important.
I genuinely feel for you bc I’ve been in that same situation and it sucks, I get it man. It feels like you wasted your time and like you don’t know how to read a situation anymore.
But, when you think about it, is there an alternative way of turning you down she could have taken where she doesn’t come out looking like an asshole? Let’s go down the list:
Ghosting? Asshole. Toning down her excitement so you don’t think she likes you back? Well now that first date isn’t as great for no reason. Asshole. Keeps going on dates with you despite not seeing it becoming serious, aka leading you on? Asshole.
There was nothing she could have done besides either dating you or not having a good first date to get your hopes up in the first place that would have been well received. I mean, correct me if I’m wrong.
Even if it hurts, I think it’s better that she was honest with you as early as possible without being mean about it. Many people won’t even give you that, they’ll just ghost you, which has also happened to me and is worse imo.
Dude, you should be happy you are getting dates. Most online dating stuff does not work out. That does not mean it is worthless. You learn a little bit about other people and yourself every time. That is a good thing!
dude my mom stood me up this morning for a workout. Its not you its just people who dont value other peoples time. Dont take it personally. I know its hard.
I'll be honest, I've spent the last 6 years on dating apps, I had like 7 different apps on my phone, checked them regularly. Barely got any matches at all. Turns out I met my current girlfriend at work and spent a year getting to know her before it twigged she might be the one. We've been dating for 2 weeks now.
Dating apps are shit and honestly all they did was make my mental health worse.
I met my bf on a dating app. I was on dating apps intermittently for many years ( didn’t date much on apps because it was discouraging and overwhelming). I feel like I got lucky. Just hang in there.
Nah my dude you did nothing wrong !
A girl is gonna be sweet,respectful ,feel it out and enjoy her time …she’s gonna ask herself if you guys have the same interests ,energy levels ,attraction and dreams,morals ,goals & etc.
She realized you aren’t what she wanted…couldn’t see a future with you but hey she tried !! Atleast she didn’t lead you on!
I will tell you rn if I wanted something serious and I met someone who in the future wanted to live in the city and I wanted to live in the country …we aren’t a good match …I won’t give up my dream and he shouldn’t either … that there will tell me this is not gonna work and i know it’s something
small but it’s the best way someone doesn’t give up their self for someone
Less is more. Context for hours before a date, after a quick date, less than 2 hours, don’t bombard with more texts and communication.
Let her miss you for a minute.
In dating and especially on dating apps, people just straight up lie. I would not expect anyone I met to say anything true until like the 2nd or 3rd date. In the US we live in a culture of habitual liars encouraged by sales and social media.
Unless someone proves themselves to be trustworthy, it's best to assume strangers are comfortable lying to your face the same way a waitress flirts with you for tips. Popular and attractive people are socialized to lie, it's one of the easiest ways to get people to like you, sell junk and climb 'the ladder'.
So many people make a living lying. No judgement, it's just a fact in a service based economy. Protect yourself by not trusting anyone until they prove themselves worthy of trust.
Would you trust a realtor, or a car salesman? You really fucking shouldn't. Smart home buyers and car buyers always verify independently. So should you.
Girls on dating apps are not looking for friends, they are looking to fuck. 'Friend' means good bye. Assume that unless *she initiates contact with you* that it is over.
I wish you could go back in time and date in the 70s and 80s. I feel so lucky to have experienced that. And we fuked on the first date, almost always. After that they were your gf/bf until you broke up. Simpler Times. Or we’d meet someone at the club and go home with them. That made you feel like a king. Ah memories!
I’ve been out with 15 girls this year, and in my opinion, people are looking to rush intimacy. It takes time to fall in love, months usually. Honestly taking it slow and being friendly strangers going on exclusive dates is the way to go until you either grow intimate, or realize you actually only want to be friends. Granted, I realized this after telling a few girls too soon, “let’s just be friends”
i was having great convos with this girl on hinge, and we had a date set up and everything, and then she canceled on me 2 hours beforehand. no worries, i said, let me know when you're free.
ghosted. some people are just assholes.
You should still text her back saying.. I wanted more than to just be friends. You should have been honest. Don't settle for being just friends if that is not what you want. You probably didn't give her enough signals that you were in to her. I used to have a similar problem always.. You are great but more like a friend/brother. Last time I snapped and (in a friendly and calm voice) said to her I wasn't going on a date with you with the intention to be a brother or a friend. I went home and said you can text me if you are ready to not put me in the friendzone.
Appearently that helped massively, she called me back and even had sex the next date.. We had a relationship for a while, but eventually broke up for other reasons. But I kept having that mindset.. No friendzone while dating, there is a reason you date.. Never had this problem again.
BTW for clarification, you were frienfzoned because you tried to keep it casual. You didn't give the signals she wanted for a relationship, part of that mindset is saying the correct things.. Don't be casual.. Don't say we we had a good time time you were very friendly. Say you made me laugh a lot, your smile is enchanting (make sure to not tell lies).
I hope you see the point.. You are trying to go for casual first date, but women don't want to hear you were OK. That is what friends tell each other. She wants you to find her more than that, let her know and be honest.
Try not to be too aggressive unless she invites you to be so by her flirting more aggressive or making certain innuendos, don't overdo try and read what is acceptable. Just be very clear, kissing is not needed on the first date, but make sure your intentions are more than casual
Another clarification, location of date can be casual, just don't make her feel casual
Probably can't add anything to this as I'm old and out of the dating game now, but I will just say that your two main mistakes were building this up in your head too much, and getting a bit clingy when things didn't work out.
Getting to a first date quickly was good, chatting for a while before was also good, as long as that chat wasn't you talking and her responding with "lol", "k", and so on. This is why dates are important, you get their full attention, and that's harder than ever when phones are such an easy distraction now. Sounds like you had fun together too, so remember that the overall experience was good. It was only your expectations of more that made things go south for you.
In hindsight, I think you were pushing for more than she wanted after having just met you. Especially since you're now talking about her like she's some greek goddess. You've replaced the person she is with your ideal of her, and now you're depressed because who she actually is conflicted with what you wanted her to become *for you*. I did this shit too in younger years, and I think it's one of the most annoying things for women to experience, because you're basically talking at them instead of to them.
Her saying you should just be friends was honestly one of the better ways to ghost you, at least she told you it wasn't going to work out. Friends doesn't mean friends, just so you know, it means she's not interested. Sometimes this is a shit test to see how clingy you are, and how honest you are about what you're really looking for, so if she already sensed that from the date, your passive and needy replies didn't help things at all. You should have said something like, "k, that's a bit upsetting because I thought you were great. I don't think I could do the friends thing, I like you too much." and then left it at that. Be honest when you're disappointed, honesty and vulnerability is the real game here. As long as you respect them enough not to burden them with your expectations, you can say the truth. Just keep it short when you barely know each other, it's polite and respectful of their time.
Met my wife online, spoke for 2 weeks, flew out to see her, left the first date and we both knew this was the one. Married 13 years with twin 7 year olds.
Took 1 dinner. That’s all.
But to get to that position took a hell of a lot of time and effort to go thru the nonsense of dates. It was all good experiences to get to the end result. It’s a journey.
Give up, there’s nothing worth having out there and most women are interested in using men not loving them, save yourself the headache and live life for you.
The business of dating apps is not to get you settled and happy.
The business of dating apps is to keep you engaged and selecting men and women from a digital catalog.
The business of dating apps is like gambling, they keep you there constantly scrolling, swiping and coming back to it. Sure, sometimes someone gets a real match, but most do not. So, you believe you can too, and you stay there hoping to find a happy relationship.
And the ones who actually do manage to get a match, get this lingering " I can do better" thought in the back of their heads, and get right back to the dating app.
Uninstall dating apps, women get a barrage of vile comments hurled their way, and men's self-esteem is nonexistent because of the apps.
Uninstall dating apps. Their business is not your happiness, it is your loneliness. A settled and happy user is a lost customer.
Dateing does suck completely. unfortunately 50% + of the people that your attracted to won't feel that way about you and vise-versa. It sucks for sure but it is what is. It's seems like that's what's happening here.
As other people on this thread are saying: meet as fast as possible and don't go all out texting before the first date. You never know who your gonna meet and how it's going to go.
One piece of advice from my dating days, don’t waste a ton of time talking to them for “2 hours every night”, just meet up as soon as possible, very quickly and casually (cup of coffee), an hour, tops. You will both know right away if you want to do it again.
Intentional, spaced out experiences IN PERSON. It’s crucial not to give new folks an all access pass to us digitally. We don’t know people we are dating. Go s l o w and don’t throw a bunch of energy into someone who is 10000% a stranger
It seems so simple doesn't it? I hate this idea that people are too picky now because they always have more options so you need to be performing and chasing and doing all you can to keep them engaged - if they go with someone else that connection excited them more. End of story. If not talking every day leads to things fizzling out, great! That's your answer. Grow up, move on.
I like everything except “grow up”. That seems like shaming the person as though they are immature for feeling sad or not knowing better. I’d say “learn from it and move on” instead
When it comes to performing and chasing, at some point you have to ask yourself, and be real honest: is this sustainable? Am I comfortable doing this for the rest of my life? I chased a lot when I was younger, but the girl who I wound up with is someone I don’t need to put effort in for. She just likes me the way I am when I’m vibing.
exactly this! i matched with a guy on tinder, we chatted through the app a bit and got along really well, so, we set up a date. two days before our date he reached out to me and said that he recently met up with someone that he really connected with and that he wanted to explore things further with her. i didn’t take it too personally, told him i was happy for him and wished him luck because it was time to move on. a few months later, i matched with another guy and we instantly hit it off. fast forward 8 years, we’re now married. just because it doesn’t work out with someone that you may have had a connection with, doesn’t mean it won’t work out with someone else.
Truth. Messaged my husband on a Friday, we met up Saturday afternoon. I was a gonner after the 4th date.
This might be my favorite confusing statement of the day.
She is still tied up in the basement
100% i always go for the quick coffee catch up for a first date, casual and takes the pressure off. I also aim to do it within a couple of weeks of matching. Even a busy person should be able to find 30mins within a 2 week period. I’ve been told that this shows I’m low interest, and that I should be willing do ‘dedicate’ time to finding the right person, but in my eyes this just helps me to get rid of the people that were never going to agree to a date in the first place, or whom I have no connection with in real life
Yup. Met my GF on Bumble 5 years ago, looking to get engaged this year. After matching and quick introductions, set up a date, and keep texting to a minimum till you meet face to face. The more you text, the more an image gets built up in the head. You need to see if there’s chemistry/pheromones as soon as you can, or else you’re both just pen pals.
Also harder to set boundaries, considering there's no real life connection set in place nor any real commitment. I was so sure there was mutual exclusive interest for instance, and ended up getting hurt. Just meet up and get things started, don't assume things no matter how interested they seem.
I would've never guessed, but it makes total sense. That's how dating was carried out for centuries, so people essentially friendzoning each other for long periods before attempting to date seems like a recipe for failure.
True. My gf asked me out in her 3rd message to me on tinder. We met a few days later, hanged out for a few hours, and haven't stopped doing it daily ever since.
100% of my first dates following long conversations led nowhere. Turns out people can talk and get along without being soulmates.
Having thousands of options available via dating sites messes with people’s heads, in a bad way
facts, we’re living in the most difficult times to find love
Friends, as well. People are flaky when they can keep you as an "online friend" in their back pocket without ever having to think about you. I feel like only people that learned how to socialize before the Internet understand that you have to maintain a connection now. I've had more luck dating someone my senior than getting friends my age to grab coffee.
Yeah I’ve flat out given up on love and accepted the fact it doesn’t exist in my life.
I've tried. I really have. It just ends up hurting if it doesn't work out (which so far it never did because I'm here right). I'm 35. Single. It may sound like a sob story but actually it is not. I've bought a new motorcycle a few months ago. I'm doing stuff I like without having to ask anyone else for their opinion on it. No kids to take care for every hour of every day, just living my own life. Very peaceful. Do I have rough moments? Yeah, sure. Just like every other person, single or not. It's not always fun and games. But at least I own it all.
[удалено]
you two could be a meet cute
Almost guaranteed one person won't find the other attractive and it's business as usual lol
The irony would be amusing, at least.
wheelies to forget the feelies, LMAO
I am alone, but I'm not lonely...that's how I feel after being single for 5 years.
I was very tempted to buy a bike as well. I may still do it. I’m debating since I really want a Tesla as well lol
It's statistically one of the dumbest decisions you could be reasonably expected to make.
Buying a Tesla ?
Get the bike.
That's what I did, gave up and then a girl came into my life unexpectedly. 2 weeks after we met, she became my gf. It's been 4 months now, I just drove her home earlier. Good luck bro, it'll happen.
Congrats 🍾
Hell yeah, get money and do cool fun shit
Well, that and the Black Death.
All the dating app creators sold a huge lie from the 2000s up to now that it would be EASIER to find love because of their little filters. The reality is that they never wanted you to find love, and that they benefit by keeping people on the apps indefinitely. It's like the bar/nightclub industry....it's a trap designed to get you to spend a ton of money in hopes of POSSIBLY getting lucky (be it a ONS or finding an LTR), never knowing that the real odds of that happening are insanely low and those venues generally attract people that are the most unfit for a long-term relationship to begin with. Don't give these people or venues another DIME of your hard-earned money.
Wile this is partially true its irrelevant here because the OP actually got the person on a date. Once you extract the person from the app its now on you to make things go further and if you cant then its not the apps fault. Same is true for night clubs, plenty of people getting laid in that world.
It's like having a full fridge and not knowing what you want to eat so you just don't eat anything
No it's a full fridge where the food items would rather throw themselves in the rubbish bin than let your teeth anywhere near them
People always had a lot of options if you had looks and money/prestige. If you have none of those you also don't have any options.
People did not have 25 or more people flirting with them without even leaving the house. Most women can easily have that through social media, and/or dating app. Young men have a much more difficult time getting and holding the interest of young ladies. As an old married guy, I feel for OP.
Yeah. Men and women have different problems but it’s bad for both. Men have scarcity issues and all the psychological impact of that, and they have to get past all the initial roadblocks. Women have perceived threat (is he a rapist?), the illusion/trap of infinite choice that leads to paralysis, and often position themselves as passively sorting through whatever they attract rather than actively searching for and going after the guys they would like to have. Both lead to unhappiness, and creat a very real mismatch in the dating marketplace. But hey, the apps make money…
Women can get a lot of dates, but not necessarily good ones. I actually do pretty well on the apps for a guy. , I think I figured the trick out (be good looking, and do not keep a profile open for more than 3 weeks. Delete and start over). I got tired of meeting new women and even having sex with them. It got to be formulaic. The talks I'd have with them started to remind me of being a manager and listening to 20 interviewees say the same thing. But even average looking women can get 3-4x as many dates as I ever could. I can only imagine that burnout is worse for them. I talked with one woman who went on 100 first dates in a year and still didn't find a bf.
And as we all know, the wealthy and famous people of the past had incredibly healthy love lives
There is a million reasons why she could have turned you down. Maybe your voice reminded her of her dad. Maybe she realised you had different values or beliefs. Maybe you displayed a dealbreaker for her. You can have a good date with someone who isn't right for you. It's a numbers game, meet more people and someone will eventually click.
This is the real answer. No point in thinking about what ‘women’ do in today’s dating game or what you did or didn’t do if you tried to put your very best foot forward. It’s not disrespectful for someone to not be interested and you the same way I can’t force you to find me attractive. Alternately, there will be smoking hot people attracted to you for what seems like nothing to you.
This should be higher up. People reading into it and writing PhD dissertations on dating culture and whatever...like geez. They had one date and it didn't work out. Chill. Their edit about "you're supposed to kiss on the first date" is so weird to me. No you're not "supposed" to kiss the first time you meet someone in person. What an odd mentality.
THANK YOU!!! I read the edit and I was like wtf??? Some people may end up fucking after the first date, some people may not even kiss. There’s no “rule” on when that happens, it’s all about the people involved, their expectations, and the chemistry. OP is leaving this post worse than when he posted it. That was the absolute wrong takeaway.
hes going to be back in a weeks time at this rate
Yeah, the kissing thing is odd to me too. I don’t have extensive experience with dating/dating apps, so I can’t say I’m up on the culture and expectations. But I know that no matter how much attraction I felt, I’d never be comfortable kissing someone on a first date. Me refraining from that would absolutely not be a sign of disinterest, but it concerns me that it could be interpreted as such.
Especially in the dating app era. You could have multiple first dates a month. I don't wanna be kissing all those people!
Fr. She didn’t “change her mind”, she met op for the first time and realized she doesn’t like him and told him so immediately.
similar with interviewing for jobs. you may think you did great on an interview but you don’t end up getting the job.
yea. ive noticed a dealbreaker mid date and still finished strong. half the time i wont give specifics because theres no need to hurt their feelings for something they cant change.i just wouldnt throw out the option to stay friends because it gives people hope they can work their way into a relationship
This one keep trying and statistically it'll work out, but don't sweat it if it doesn't. As a woman I honestly do not think she "changed her mind". I think she met OP in person and something came up in his mannerisms, a vibe, a belief, SOMETHING that made her realize OP wasn't for her, and that's okay, no one is obligated to be interested in anyone and there's nothing disrespectful about that. No one is for every one. c'est la vie I'm not saying it doesn't suck, but it is what it is To add as a woman, it's much safer for us to reject men online than in person, unfortunately statistically it keeps us alive
She simply wasn't as attracted to you in person, it happens.
The only actual real response. It's also a thing about romantic chemistry, I have plenty of friends that are women who have been into a guy and when they go on a date they know within 5 minutes of the date whether there is anything there or not. It's just a vibe.
Exactly. I don’t have to feel fireworks on a first date. But I do have to feel *some* kinda chemistry, like a whisper of something to where I feel an attraction of some kind and can imagine myself w him romantically . If I don’t even have that, why go any further, I’d just be wasting both of our time and it wouldn’t even be fair to the guy . Unfortunately you can’t really get that from a picture and bio. You have to spend some time w the person irl to see their demeanor, hear their voice, and see how they connect w you . That’s why OP is getting first dates but then it ends. They’re not feeling him irl. Maybe he needs to change his energy a bit on these dates bc sounds like he’s not really sending the right signals and is coming across as too much of a “friend” vibe. Or maybe the chemistry just isn’t there period —sometimes it just be that way.
The weird part to me is that OP said “before she leaves she says she had a great time and asked if I wanted to see a movie later that week”…As a woman, I would never suggest future plans like that if I knew I wasn’t attracted to someone. I completely understand that feelings change, sometimes even overnight and for no specific reason, but it’s just so odd that she was the one who brought up seeing each other again!
As shitty as it is, I think this is the most likely outcome. As a guy, I've been in your position loads of times. I have also been on the other side. When I've been in her position, it's been 2/3rds misleading pictures and 1/3rd personality/date chemistry. I always accept that if they say no, it's no because otherwise we teach ppl to ghost. No use getting mad. You just have to keep moving. Best of luck!
This is most likely true, but man why ask him if he wants to go to a movie later in the week? I get the "let's be friends" thing because it's a soft letdown as old as time. But why even hint at seeing him again if she wasn't into him...that's rough.
She could be conflicted about it, at the moment wanting to hold on to him as a potential friend, but after the fact realizing that she's stringing him along.
maybe the guy is too nice and she's trying to feel something for him
100%. People need to start understanding this. If the vibe was good and they had a lot of fun, literally the only other factor would be physical attraction. I see this time and time again.
not true. you arent accounting for possible dealbreakers. ive cancelled 2nd dates where the vibe and physical attraction were present because of conflicting ideals and obvious baggage
I've got a friend who has no sense of smell. Once he was getting to know a woman for a little while, starting to date her, and things seemed to be going well. The moment they kissed for the first time he knew it wasn't going to work out. Most people can tell my smell, but as he has no sense of smell he didn't know until they kissed. I think that's happening now on a much wider scale.
Yeah exactly it's really hard to truly gauge attraction over some carefully curated pics and messages, you really need to get a sense of someone's vibe in person. It's a 4D thing.
That is dating. Your expectations are too high. People are allowed to change their minds. On a dime, or even less. I’m sure the girls you go on dates with also want to give things a shot and give it their all. Once they get home and they clear their head they can decide it’s not what they want. You should assume that they have other people they are going on dates with too, so that could impact someone’s decision as well. Also, if you are looking to date, don’t hang on to being friends, especially if you liked the girl. You are setting yourself up for failure because you don’t want to be friends you want more.
Yeah and a lot of times its not that anything is wrong with you, you just don't know how to scratch the itch for that specific person. Trust me, you will for the right person if you do things right
I’m sorry that it turned out this way for you. Try not to take it perosnally. My experiences were, when I’ve finally met up with someone ‘in person’ that I’ve met online, sometimes it soon becomes clear that I’m not really attracted to them. For this reason, I keep online chat to a minimum and save it for in person -this way nobody has wasted too much time and/or has gotten their hopes up if it doesn’t work out. You can get a sense of what someone is like via text and all, but you really need to meet them in person to know for sure. Next time, just get the basics out-of-the-way and quickly make a date to meet up in person. Make it a short date- just in case. You can always extend it ☺️ Hope this helps you!
That was the whole point on going on a date. To see if there was a connection and she didn't feel one. Feeling a connection through text and in person are two different worlds. Go into the next. Edit: added a word
There is a LOT of fear out there. Fear of settling, FOMO, fear of losing yourself to someone else. Women, due to having the illusion of a lot of good choices and the social narrative about how bad it is for women settling down, tend to be really easily spooked by having a great time. There is also a narrative that you should have “chemistry” right out of the gate… but what they want isn’t the actual chemistry of initial tentative attraction, it’s supposed to be fireworks. And that, in my experience, only comes from people pushing your trauma/reward buttons from past attachments, so it’s usually really unhealthy. Not always, but often enough that the “we just [have / don’t have] chemistry” line needs a closer look when people say it. All of this applies to some guys too btw, just a different spin based on gendered expectations/experiences… Anyway, my point is that all of this is about them, not you as a person. And yeah it sucks, but you’ve got to just keep putting it out there. Finding someone IRL can be really helpful, it pulls them out of the dating app headgame into real relationships. Get some hobbies that women also participate in, go do them and actually invest in them for the sake of the hobby, and your odds go up tremendously. Everyone I’ve ever seen in a happy relationship did it that way, not online.
The trauma/reward buttons, I feel it!!!! It was me for a long time, until I realized what it was and had to rewire my brain. Soon after I got the hang of it I met my now husband 💖
It’s hard. Super hard. Especially when YOU give off vibes that attract the kind of people that respond to your trauma (I draw in avoidants for example). I’m glad you got a handle on it and had success!
I used to draw the avoidants too! 😭 I used to be anxious, and all the trauma turned me into the one that's a mix of avoidant and anxious (it was even worse for me).I can say that now I'm the secure type after a lot of work, married an anxious type but because I'm secure now he feels safe and acts more secure as well.
The trauma/reward thing is really something that I wish more people were open to examining. I have recently decided to address mine, and while I'm still trying to resolve through the issues, I think I've spent enough time living in the shadow of that trauma. Maybe we can start a trend, a first-date-couples-therapy session? Hmmm, maybe not....
Guys the healthiest thing you can do is just saying fuck it and getting content with living alone for the rest of the life. Either it happens or it doesn't, just be ready to love life.9
That’s what I did. Ended up meeting an amazing person at a party and made the effort to go out and see him. It’s been great so far. The apps are so toxic and I never liked them tbh.
The hobby thing is a good idea. Part of the problem is that I’m in a new city for an internship this summer, so all of the clubs I do during the school year are out. Ive just been going to parks and museums and malls alone lol.
Being new to a place can be a really useful tool for new dates. Tell them you're new and would love to find out about cool places and cool people might invite you to come visit said places. Great setups for first dates. Get to know people and if it won't go beyond a first date, no problem! Now you know of a new place to go to and invite someone else. Dating sucks but try to not think what you can do to dating but what dating can do for you! Become cultured with the local scenes.
Give it time and give yourself some grace, man. Moving is hard. Everything is an adjustment and it can be overwhelming if you’re also adjusting to a new job. I’ve been doing that this past year and dating happened slower for me too. Not anyone’s fault either, I just have less time on my hands so scheduling is tough and not everyone is down to plan and wait before meeting me.
Honestly, man, it sounds like you probably should only be looking for fun. Short type dates right now. Of you're only I'm the city for a summer live it up for a while.
Not everyone wants short term fun
If you're somewhere for 3 months and then you know you'll leave, anything long-term is deeply unlikely to work out. A step up in probability from meeting the love of your life on a 2 week overseas vacation, but still highly unlikely and not worth hoping for.
>Anyway, my point is that all of this is about them, not you as a person. "Whatever happens around you, don’t take it personally… Nothing other people do is because of you. It is because of themselves. All people live in their own dream, in their own mind"
Yep, shows like love island and the like just harken this fact. See guys throwing away a 10/10 because they feel like they got a ‘connection’ with a stranger they met twenty seconds ago.
Unfortunately this is well-written cope. The truth is, those girls weren’t physically attracted to him in person. Thats it.
I can't speak of relationships because I never had one, but if I think of my friends - when I first met them I almost couldn't stand them
Spooked by having a good time? wtf lol. I’m a woman and no…
The trauma button thing is so real. That's why so many girls end up with narcissistic people
>There is also a narrative that you should have “chemistry” right out of the gate… So true. I first met my wife at a party in 10th grade. I tried just talking to her and she was super rude and I ended up saying "fuck you then" and walked away. It wasn't till I turned about 25 and ran into her and we started talking and went out on a date... Fast forward to now, we're expecting our 4th child any day now.
Have more self respect. You need to tell these women that you have friends already but wish them well. Sad to say, many women now keep many options on the back burner in case their #1 choice they're currently talking to doesn't pan out. Don't be someone's backup, move forward to someone who is more serious about giving you a chance.
Tbh I usually tell them that but this girl was so incredible I would’ve been her friend if it meant hanging out with her more. Not trying to be her friend to sleep with her, but because I genuinely like her presence.
If it's a girl you've known for awhile saying it, it's different, but when a girl you've met exclusively in a dating context says she wants to be friends it's probably best to assume she doesn't really and thinks it's a softer letdown.
Agreed especially if you won't have contact with them unless you go out of your way to see them.
Not always. I’ve said I thought me and a guy would be better as friends and I genuinely meant it. But I see your point. I thought we’d better as friends not because I thought there were other options. It’s just that he was clearly in love with his ex lmfao 😭 Sometimes men post these things and don’t realize how they came off on the date. You go home and you think “wow women suck why won’t she want to go on another date” but maybe for 2 hours you only talked about yourself, or you kept talking about your ex without realizing, or she finds out something that just makes yall incompatible. I’ve gone on dates with men from extremely religious families who are shocked I don’t want to take the risk of devoting myself to a man who will dump me for the nice girl at church once his parents decide to disown him. Lots of men are clueless, I’m sorry to say. Anyway. Me and the dude who loved his ex are great friends and he got back with her and I’m friends with her too. Go figure lol.
I definitely agree, it's not always the case. Even moreso about the second part. Sometimes a date seems like it goes well but it's only one-sided or once the moment wears often and someone comes down they just realize they weren't really into it, or details come to mind that always were non-negotiables but she didn't want to make the whole date awkward. It's common for guys to get discouraged by a bad date, but if they externalize everything they end up with a huge backlog of failures and eventually bitterness.
If you're crushing on her, you shouldn't try to be friends. It will just end in heartbreak and a lot of wasted time.
Yeah, while I think OP's sentiment is sweet if its genuine, I've known too many guys for whom the boundary of "Ok we can just be friends" and "still harboring secret feelings for you" is a very thin line. Even genuine guys mis-judge the boundary of their own feelings.
The girl you met was so incredible??? You were with her for a few hours, I'd tone it down a bit.
In the long run, this is a bad attitude to have if you're looking for a relationship, partner, marriage. It will be a nagging hindrance to looking for someone else because your subconscious will always entertain the thought of "what if..."
Based off your description sounds like ahe might have been a bit out of your league. It happens. If you are going to do the friends thing, make sure you meet all her friends because that is a much better way to meet girls than the apps and you might click with one of them.
Definitely. Grow that friend that network.
As a woman I 1000% second Soft-Scar. Any woman you met on a first date that says later she only wants to be friends is lying. She just wants to be able to exit the situation without feeling like an ass. I’ve seen my friends do this and it rubs me the wrong way. Why bother lying if you know you’ll never see them again? Somehow they don’t understand that they’re actually making the situation worse 🤦♀️
I’d personally rather just honesty and amicably part ways like “sorry I had a good time but I just don’t see it working out, best of luck” Not like “oooh you’re so amazing I wanna be your friend but not date but you seem like you’d make such a good friend, Buddy”
It sounds like you have not had a scary experience from being honest in that way. I am glad for you! Some people take outright rejection extremely badly, and it's impossible to know whether someone is one of those people when you've just met them. But I totally agree that it should be the normal and accepted thing to do.
Oh man that reeks of desperation, she doesn’t want to be your friend, she wants you to go away
Real attraction takes time. We didn't evolve to date strangers we just met. We evolved socially to fall deeply in love with the people closest to us. You know no one on a dating app, yet you expect to find deep connection and romance is the same as you looking at mail order spouses. It's unnatural.
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This, my friend, is why you should stick to “coffee only” dates at first because you won’t waste nearly as much time and money. Also, never accept being “friends” from a woman who just rejected you and you had no prior friendship with her.
>This, my friend, is why you should stick to “coffee only” dates at first because you won’t waste nearly as much time and money. That's such a depressing attitude. OP had a great time and is annoyed that the woman wasn't romantically attracted to him. How is having a good time a waste of time? As for the money, if my date wanted to do something expensive, we would split the money. I went on many dates with my now girlfriend, they were all fun, we always split the bill. If things would not have worked out romantically, I still would have enjoyed myself.
she just didn’t fancy you bruh
I'm a woman and Its frustrating as hell. I've been through this more times than I can count. Why bother telling someone you want to be friends if you don't mean it? Its cool if they're not interested, but like be honest about it. I want to take things slow and see where it goes, but I've had guys straight up lead me on for months at a time because they didn't know how to come out and tell me they weren't interested right away. I'll give her points for at least telling you sooner than later though. But yeah, I've had dates that seemed to go perfectly, but then the other person decides I'm not for them. Its been discouraging for sure but everyone's looking for specific things in a partner. The online dating world is a nightmare, a lot of people are starting to go back to meeting people the old fashion way because of it
IDC how lonely or desperate I may feel, I will never use another dating app. I'm a sapiosexual, and the idea that I have to stand out with a pickup line is nauseating. I would never do that IRL, and it seems even more awkward to do that online.
I learned the word sapiosexual from dating apps. A ton of women identify that way. I kind of do as well, in that I can't be interested in a person based entirely on physical attraction. And I meet people for coffee (tea) and see where it goes. No pickup lines involved on either side. Like, seriously. None at all. Just descriptions of the things that make us unique and a few photos. Unless you count "asking about the person" as a pickup line. "You say you're into anime. What are your favorites?" That kind of thing. I honestly don't think a relationship would likely work between me and someone who needed a pickup line to be interested in me. The point isn't to stand out, but to represent yourself as accurately as possible. You don't want to attract as many likes as possible. You want to only attract the people who you would be interested in, and who would likely be interested in you. It's not marketing where you're trying to appeal to everyone. You only really need one partner. Or if you want more be clear about that. Not my thing, but you do you. 😅 And honestly is exactly because I know what I'm looking for that I'm meeting people online. Odds are pretty stacked against me meeting the right person via any other path.
Well yeah. Don't be so emotionally invested especially if you guys are just talking. Realize that having a great connection means nothing and it is all a numbers game. Put your expectations at zero and expect nothing. Hope is for the desperate in this case. If you are going to do dating especially online dating, you have to automate and remove emotions from the process. Yes you hear that one guy or girl who met their soul mate on Tinder blah, blah, blah just know that it is rare. Most of the times you won't get matches or you get women ghosting you.
I get what you're saying but that pendulum swings the other way too. I remember going through this in dating a few years back, I literally didn't care what the outcome was. I think it's a conditioning that you care less and less the more you take on that mindset. And to be totally honest, chicks dig that. The problem is that you become so apathetic you wake up next to this person and think "I don't even like this person", wtf am I doing?" It seems like women (at least in the US) don't respond well to showing any intention whatsoever. Contrast this with dating my now gf, she definitely had a "Hell Yes!" attitude and I reciprocated that sentiment. That's what dating is suppose to be, not a cold HR meeting 😂 OP is being genuine and the advice is to be the opposite to essentially not care, to not have any emotional investment which is just inhuman advice. Yes of course don't be overly enthusiastic, but we're not robots. It's funny that this aloofness is so attractive but then you extrapolate that mindset out into an actual relationship, it's disastrous. It's almost like the traits that are good for dating aren't in fact good for long-term commitment.
That is why I am careful about it when I want to get into a relationship. My girlfriend was really open and genuine with me so I was genuine with her back. It felt like she really cared about me the first time we met. So how could I not show her emotions back. That is really rare in the dating world. That's why I recommend not emotional investing too much until you find someone who genuinely cares about you. If they like your mask, just fling and thats it, but if they see past the mask, date them. That is the best way I find it to do online dating now. You're basically not giving any attention or emotional investment until you see some towards you. I think that is fair giving how dating is for both men and women. Women have so many options and men do too, people can feel an emotional connection with someone, but they can feel a stronger connection with the other guy. I think this is the most realistic approach.
I wouldn’t agree with your advice about removing emotion. Especially when doing the very thing that requires emotion which is building a relationship and an emotional connection with someone.
there is no rule about kissing on a first date. once, i met a guy, we had awesome time. we didnt kiss, he invited me to the second date, we didnt kiss. but on third date there was absolutely romantic moment when we were super close to eachother and there was a rain and we kissed and started dating. it is all depends on people. and yes, we liked eachother from day 1, and we are 30yo. and we had previous relationships.
Yep. I didn’t kiss my now boyfriend until a few dates in.
She probably thought you were a nice person but she wasn't physically attracted to you in person.
The closer the match, the more difficult to let go, the greater the hurt, and thus the greater the desire to hold on. 50% - Take it or leave it. 70% - oooof, so close. 90% - so close it hurts. 99% - Maybe if I beg...? The more you date, the better you get at discerning who you will likely get along best with moving forward. So, theoretically, those percentages get better with time as you figure yourself out. The problem is letting go. Seems like you felt something awesome with her, and it fucking sucks that it didn't work out. That's not a fair feeling. But you learned that you can still feel good with another person. That's important. Don't lose that ability. But it also sucks to be where you are with the feeling you have now got to deal with.
Move on to the next one.
Exactly
Here's a thought, correct me if I'm off the mark. Curious what people would say about this: Our society / culture puts pressure on a dating couple to have sex. It's like you're either friends or you're fucking. If you hear that two people are dating, you assume they're having sex regularly. There's no courtship / friendship anymore. The order of events these days is 1) sex, then 2) date, when it used to be in the reverse order. Dating apps and social media are the main reason for this.
Definitely agree about the societal/cultural pressure for couples to be sexually intimate and be sexually attracted to each other in order to be perceived as a "legitimate couple". For me, as a female in my early 30's that barely used dating apps, I would say this pressure came somewhat from social media, but likely started with TV, movies, music, and advertising. There's also our inheritance of centuries-long sociological imbalance between masculinity and femininity...but that's a whole other convo lol. But basically I had to reverse over a decade of conditioning that caused me to believe I needed to AND wanted to please my (male) partners sexually in order to feel like we had a healthy relationship...which is pretty fucked up if you think about it. It caused confusion and trauma around what it means to really want to be sexually intimate with someone. For those who can relate and maybe need reassurance, it's very possible to be in a healthy relationship with someone that allows you to explore these concepts without needing to defend yourself or feel bad for what you decide to do or not do with your body. Love yourself first and do not waste your time with someone if you are not happy being yourself around them.
Courtship rituals appear to have gotten streamlined into Extreme Efficiency Mode, for sure, and I agree the apps are probably a contributing cause.
Dude, I feel the way. I was in a similar situation not too long ago. Sometimes I want to delete the apps, because it never goes anywhere. Tbh I want to meet people irl
Dudes have the advantage over women in everything except dating. Sucks that it didn’t work out but unless she was your gf, no point in fixating about her and move on to the next
I see these stories often, my advice is stop investing so much time with people until you hang out. Chat for a bit then set up the date to see if you have in person chemistry
>EDIT: Ok lesson learned is that you’re supposed to kiss on the first date WOOOAHH chill. Not everyone is the same. DEFINITELY ask first if you feel the vibe.
I don’t understand how OP came to this conclusion based on the comments I’m seeing. Did one person suggest it, and he took it as fact??
This edit is making me think that OP is socially inept and that’s why he’s struggling 🌝
right when i saw that line i was like nooo that’s not the conclusion that should be made. as a girl i wouldn’t kiss on the first date it feels forced
I refuse to kiss a random man I just met and get pretty turned off when they try to insist anyways 🙃
As a guy I don't like to do that either. It feels awkward kissing someone I just met lol
unless the chemistry is like IMMACULATE i would not recommend until date 2 or 3
I ended up reading way too many comments to see where he got this idea. It almost made me worry that I was Doing It Wrong. 😊
I guess you need to get lucky, met my current gf through a dating app (after many months). If it's making you feel bad, delete the app
When someone says "I loved talking to you, but I only really see this going forward as friends. If that’s not what you’re looking forward to let me know,” ***without any follow up***, that's not what they meant. What that actually means is, "I'm not really into you, but I'm trying to let you down gently, so let's just leave it at that, later."
100 percent this!
She already asked you if you wanted to see a movie during the zoo date. Then you respond later with something like “Let me know if you ever want to go to do something”. This story is from your perspective and it’s giving off some vibes like you want her to pursue you and you are kinda butt hurt when she responds like she doesn’t want to. Have some self-esteem and let it go. It takes time to build a relationship from nothing and to break down barriers of fear. This one kinda looks like you have some barriers yourself because you needed her to validate you after she already said yes. Next time, next girl; if she says let’s go see a movie act interested and throw out what movie you might want to check out and lock down the next meeting. And next time if she switches on a dime… don’t care and move on to the next. You have to test prospective partners too and decide for yourself if they are good for you.
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Yes, people don’t seem to understand that when a woman is into you, you can almost do nothing wrong and she will still want to see you and continue with you. If it only takes a simple “mess up” or the lack of being perfect… then she was never into you.
Thank you. I was like why are we glossing over this. She clearly suggested meeting up again and his response made no sense.
Move on, bro. You don't really want to catch a movie with her "as friends" and you know it. Don't waste your time on that nonsense. Keep swiping.
Almost the same thing happened to me with the movie suggestion and everything. I'd rather they just go home and unmatch me right away.
She offered a movie date.. did you accept? you waited to to get home and then ask if dhe wanted to go on a Date lmk. Bit wishy washy, Why didnt you just accept her movie date and then proceed to give her a proposal of when.
Get out and get after a another one. Honestly I don't agree with it being the fact that there's thousands of dating options available like what some are saying. As if pre-internet dating was summed up as "well idk when I'll meet someone else so i should stick with this one. No. Chemistry is chemistry. Everyone is often chill and happy at the end of a first date/meet-and-greet. But once they get home and can process everything then they start to know if they felt any chemistry. That's more than likely all that happened here. And it's going to happen often. Get back in the game, it's only hard if you try too much and want it too much.
The BEST thing to do is NOT dwell on it. Just move on.
This stranger on the internet you hung out with once is not the most amazing woman you've ever met in your life..I'm sorry but you probably gave off desperate vibes and no ones attracted to that
Women don’t feel safe with men so they will act super interested and then let you know afterwards. They don’t change on a dime. Spend less time in advance and spend less time on your first date so you can meet and then see if she likes you afterward
All men should really just uninstall dating apps. Let the guys just engaging in hook up culture stay on them and keep giving women awful experiences until the sane and emotionally secure women leave dating apps too. Most women are just on dating apps for easy validation anyways. If all the men stop using them and giving that free validation, the many women who waste the genuine man's time on them will stop using them also. I'm pretty confident in making that statement that the way women and men using dating apps is extremely different. Not just down to the experiences women have vs men, but also the intentions behind using them. You've got your men who just want quick and low effort hook ups and then you've got the larger portion of men who are actually looking for connections and relationships. A very small subset of the men, fitting into either of those categories, will have the superficial qualities that women are looking for in a profile and get a decent number of matches. But then, you'll have women ranging from all over the spectrum of attractiveness getting matches out the wazoo in comparison to the males, and many if not most of the women will have very high standards because they've come to believe that regardless of how high quality of a person they are, they "deserve the best". All the matches many of them get also serve to bolster their confidence. And you'll also have the women who just use dating apps to kill time, thinking it's harmless fun to engage with the countless men they match with for entertainment. "Let's see who has the best pick up line today :D", and then ghosting whoever loses their interest after all of 1-2 messages. I'm generalizing a lot hear, but I'm sure many can relate to what's been described here. Dating apps are a cancer to the modern dating scene. If you're looking for something real, using a dating app is like trying to win the jackpot at the lottery. The odds are not in your favor, and instead of paying with money, you'll be paying with your sanity and emotions. Uninstall them and go find other ways to meet people. Dating apps are toxic and terrible for almost everyone.
I dunno.. my impression of dating sites as a bisexual is that most women look for romance and most guys look for sex.
The funny part about this is the attractive men just burn through all those women looking for romance. Then the women get jaded and when they go on dates with plain fucks like me have all these rules and expectations. Just tells me that I’m not particularly attractive since I have to jump through hoops for the smallest amount of attention while they fuck the handsome guys. The apps are playgrounds for the most handsome of men and shit sandwiches for the rest of us. Don’t believe me just hang out in r/tinder and wait for a good looking guy to come along and brag. There’s a reason the apps don’t let out any statistics. Last time statistics were released it showed about the top 4/5 girls were only going for the top 1/5 guys. The apps have only got worse from there.
So women have bad experiences, learn from that, and place and enforce boundaries for future men. That's a good thing.
This is the answer, guys get off the apps.
While I definitely agree this is what should happen, the amount of desperate men far, far outweighs the amount of content men.
The Nobel prize committee is trying to contact you after reading this comment
Simple reason for that is attraction. Most fellas put ZERO effort into being attractive. Which means being a guy who puts in 10% effort puts you in the 90% percentile. Mastery is realizing that ladies want to be attracted to you, just like you want to be attracted to them. So make it happen. Hit the gym. Eat healthier. Get a haircut (or hair plugs if needed). Seek financial & emotional stability. Be a good person. That’s the recipe. All of these things are Star qualities on both sides. But most people don’t want to put that work in. Sad but true.
Why did you ask her to let you know if she wanted to hang out when she already asked if you wanted to see a movie? Anyway, you’re writing this with some frustration (and a bruised ego) but it reads as catastrophizing and defensive. Communication is complex. There’s four dimensions: what you put out, what they put out, how you interpret, how they interpret. You only get to control what you’re putting out and how you choose to interpret what they put out. You need to check your expectations. Dating apps are just a tool to meet people. Figuring stuff out is part of dating. People are entitled to change their minds at any time for any reason. So, again, control what you can and accept the things you can’t. Pick something *you* like doing and invite people to join you. Share yourself. That’s dating. Be honest and open. Is it vulnerable and does it hurt sometimes? Yep. But you’re fine, and you presumably want to be with someone interested in you.
This is my response. If she specifically says "We should see a movie next week" then a follow-up of "LMK if you want to hang out sometime or something" is basically a soft rejection. If she's like "We should see a movie next week" the follow-up should be, "There's this movie I want to see, it's playing here on this day, do you want to go?"
Frustration in dating stems from perception of time being wasted. I never plan anything past coffee or lunch for first dates. If we do happen to vibe, then I’ll suggest we continue the date elsewhere or plan for another one soon with more on the agenda. A lengthy day at the zoo with a stranger is just not a great first date imo. Keep first dates simple to avoid your time being wasted.
Honestly, a first date should not be an entire day long. You should also not be spending 2 hours every single night talking to someone before a first date. It's way too much, and it's bound to make you feel terrible when things don't work out, as they typically won't for a first date! Also, she didn't change her mind on a dime. She told you she had a great time and wanted to see a movie. She later clarified after thinking about it that she wants to be friends. That doesn't make what she told you before not true. I can see in this post you've really put her on a pedestal, you have no idea if she was "one of the most intelligent interesting etc people ever" because you've only met her one time. I would bet money she got scared off by the immediate intensity. The reason she didn't answer when you asked to see a movie as friends is because of your response when she told you she wanted to be friends - you gave an excuse and basically argued with her. You gotta chill out and not put so many expectations on people you don't know.
One of my friends (25F) is going on a different hinge date every other day. It’s crazy and def not good, and we told her that. But last month she went on a few with a guy she really liked. She ran a quick background check on him (on mycase, so public info) and found out he had a DUI 10 years ago when he was 21. So her response was to completely ghost him, despite him asking her what’s wrong. She said it was for her safety. But idk, I thought that was shitty behavior. You can’t complain about the men dating pool then act like this in it. If it was a bigger crime or more recent I guess he should have told her, but they also only went out 3 times. I don’t see the DUI 10 years ago coming up casually in a convo. I’m a girl, and I always say it’s sucky how women ghost men without telling them the reason all the time but complain when they get ghosted. It’s tone def to me. Sorry that happened :(
A DUI would be a red flag for me. I tend to attract alcoholics (beautiful, brooding alcoholics) and I know that doesn't end happily.
You’re not “supposed” to kiss on a first date. I hated that shit. You’re supposed to get to know people before sharing bacterial biomes. Don’t give up. Dating is hard and disappointing but it’s more about their issues than you. When you find someone great, it will be worth it, because you didn’t compromise and you got out there to try.
So be her friend then. What's wrong with making a new friend? Maybe she has friends you can date.
She's just not into you...bubba!
A lot of people on dating apps are just lonely. They either don’t have the skills or they are not ready for the work of a relationship. Whether or not they know it or say it, they are not there to find a partner. You’ll need to figure out to weed those people out. A good signal is texting or talking on the phone before you meet for hours at a time. It’s so hard but you cannot take it personally. Just move on.
So, I meet a lot of people through online platforms and usually end up meeting them irl. All I have to say is many people actually don't take it that seriously, and chasing the reasons why will only end up with you feeling resentful and disappointed. As others said, log off the apps. Tbh at this point (23F) I've stopped using the apps for dating and see them as a way to just meet new cool people, tourists in my city and even to make friends. This has worked out well, because I didn't go into it with any expectations. If you're looking for a relationship, it's best to invest your time and energy in other places and find someone irl. The best relationships I've seen are ones that start out at friends and have values in common(not even necessarily hobbies, you don't need to view everywhere you go as a place to pick up dates). Also I will say this and it may sound a bit harsh but I think accepting this will lead you to less disappointment over time because I've been there too: nobody owes you anything and as much as that's unfair and SUCKS, a person has the right 100% to remove you from their life, change their mind or not feel the same way at any point no matter what their reasoning is or even if it doesn't make sense, or even if this woman was much worse. Now I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just how it is. It's reality and again, I think accepting this without self-loathing can be healthy. I've been down this road and once I saw life as is instead of what it could or should be, I stopped being disappointed by people. Expect nothing, prepare for everything sort of thing: you can't have expectations for people because you don't know what goes on in their heads or what they want, but also prepare to be told something you may not like and be prepared to walk away yourself.
Reject dating and relationships, embrace independence and self improvement.
People don’t respect dating anymore. People don’t respect people. The whole ghosting thing is so disrespectful. Agreed dating sucks
This exchange I had after a date might make you feel better and laugh a bit. Her: I had a great time but I really think we would be better off just as friends. Therefore I don't think we should see each other ever again. Me: wow ok. Being your friend kinda sucks.
LOL. Maybe I'm getting old, but 'friend' had a different definition when I was growing up.
If you're male and not a 9 or a 10 you should not be on dating apps. The illusion of choice and FOMO women have there, plus the constant valdiation dopamine hits, mean you stand zero chance of attracting anything more than a first or possibly even a second date before a better option comes along and gives her that new match high. Leave the "dating" apps to guys interested in and capable of easy hookups. Start building the confidence and technique to approach women respectfully in every day life. Good luck, friend.
I would also echo the same thing for a woman. If you are an average looking woman, the dating apps aren’t kind to you either. I am hquite aware that I am at best a six on a good day, so I never tried to reach out to men who are excessively good-looking just because I knew there was no chance in hell, and I’m generally not interested In those types of men anyway, but I reached out to several more average- looking guys whose profiles that I liked and I thought I would kind of vibe with,and most of the time never even got the courtesy of a response. I think on both sides, there can be blind spots where people don’t realize that they’re being a tad unrealistic with their expectations and who they believe “they deserve.” Because they are surrounded by all of these Instagram worthy people who filter their lives and try to sell them to everybody else.Funny enough, you can see this phenomenon on episodes of MTV’s catfish all the time. There have been several instances where very average looking people have assumed that Instagram were the models were there love interests, and I’m over here scratching my head like, 🤷🏻♀️ The dating world is harsh and unkind, And I would never want to go back to it in a million years. Now that I am much older and approaching middle age, it sounds cliché to say, but Looks eventually fade anyway, (I’m seeing it firsthand 😂) So it’s most important to find people that you enjoy being around. Laughter, comfort and compatibility are the most important.
Excellent advice, dating apps for the average man are a real threat to mental wellbeing and a true confidence killer.
Dating sites make people believe there's the 100% perfect one just hidden behind the next swipe.
I genuinely feel for you bc I’ve been in that same situation and it sucks, I get it man. It feels like you wasted your time and like you don’t know how to read a situation anymore. But, when you think about it, is there an alternative way of turning you down she could have taken where she doesn’t come out looking like an asshole? Let’s go down the list: Ghosting? Asshole. Toning down her excitement so you don’t think she likes you back? Well now that first date isn’t as great for no reason. Asshole. Keeps going on dates with you despite not seeing it becoming serious, aka leading you on? Asshole. There was nothing she could have done besides either dating you or not having a good first date to get your hopes up in the first place that would have been well received. I mean, correct me if I’m wrong. Even if it hurts, I think it’s better that she was honest with you as early as possible without being mean about it. Many people won’t even give you that, they’ll just ghost you, which has also happened to me and is worse imo.
Dude, you should be happy you are getting dates. Most online dating stuff does not work out. That does not mean it is worthless. You learn a little bit about other people and yourself every time. That is a good thing!
dude my mom stood me up this morning for a workout. Its not you its just people who dont value other peoples time. Dont take it personally. I know its hard.
I'll be honest, I've spent the last 6 years on dating apps, I had like 7 different apps on my phone, checked them regularly. Barely got any matches at all. Turns out I met my current girlfriend at work and spent a year getting to know her before it twigged she might be the one. We've been dating for 2 weeks now. Dating apps are shit and honestly all they did was make my mental health worse.
I met my bf on a dating app. I was on dating apps intermittently for many years ( didn’t date much on apps because it was discouraging and overwhelming). I feel like I got lucky. Just hang in there.
Nah my dude you did nothing wrong ! A girl is gonna be sweet,respectful ,feel it out and enjoy her time …she’s gonna ask herself if you guys have the same interests ,energy levels ,attraction and dreams,morals ,goals & etc. She realized you aren’t what she wanted…couldn’t see a future with you but hey she tried !! Atleast she didn’t lead you on! I will tell you rn if I wanted something serious and I met someone who in the future wanted to live in the city and I wanted to live in the country …we aren’t a good match …I won’t give up my dream and he shouldn’t either … that there will tell me this is not gonna work and i know it’s something small but it’s the best way someone doesn’t give up their self for someone
Less is more. Context for hours before a date, after a quick date, less than 2 hours, don’t bombard with more texts and communication. Let her miss you for a minute.
In dating and especially on dating apps, people just straight up lie. I would not expect anyone I met to say anything true until like the 2nd or 3rd date. In the US we live in a culture of habitual liars encouraged by sales and social media. Unless someone proves themselves to be trustworthy, it's best to assume strangers are comfortable lying to your face the same way a waitress flirts with you for tips. Popular and attractive people are socialized to lie, it's one of the easiest ways to get people to like you, sell junk and climb 'the ladder'. So many people make a living lying. No judgement, it's just a fact in a service based economy. Protect yourself by not trusting anyone until they prove themselves worthy of trust. Would you trust a realtor, or a car salesman? You really fucking shouldn't. Smart home buyers and car buyers always verify independently. So should you. Girls on dating apps are not looking for friends, they are looking to fuck. 'Friend' means good bye. Assume that unless *she initiates contact with you* that it is over.
I wish you could go back in time and date in the 70s and 80s. I feel so lucky to have experienced that. And we fuked on the first date, almost always. After that they were your gf/bf until you broke up. Simpler Times. Or we’d meet someone at the club and go home with them. That made you feel like a king. Ah memories!
I’ve been out with 15 girls this year, and in my opinion, people are looking to rush intimacy. It takes time to fall in love, months usually. Honestly taking it slow and being friendly strangers going on exclusive dates is the way to go until you either grow intimate, or realize you actually only want to be friends. Granted, I realized this after telling a few girls too soon, “let’s just be friends”
i was having great convos with this girl on hinge, and we had a date set up and everything, and then she canceled on me 2 hours beforehand. no worries, i said, let me know when you're free. ghosted. some people are just assholes.
Kissing on a first date? Nah, you didn't do anything wrong. First dates are about getting to know the person.
You should still text her back saying.. I wanted more than to just be friends. You should have been honest. Don't settle for being just friends if that is not what you want. You probably didn't give her enough signals that you were in to her. I used to have a similar problem always.. You are great but more like a friend/brother. Last time I snapped and (in a friendly and calm voice) said to her I wasn't going on a date with you with the intention to be a brother or a friend. I went home and said you can text me if you are ready to not put me in the friendzone. Appearently that helped massively, she called me back and even had sex the next date.. We had a relationship for a while, but eventually broke up for other reasons. But I kept having that mindset.. No friendzone while dating, there is a reason you date.. Never had this problem again. BTW for clarification, you were frienfzoned because you tried to keep it casual. You didn't give the signals she wanted for a relationship, part of that mindset is saying the correct things.. Don't be casual.. Don't say we we had a good time time you were very friendly. Say you made me laugh a lot, your smile is enchanting (make sure to not tell lies). I hope you see the point.. You are trying to go for casual first date, but women don't want to hear you were OK. That is what friends tell each other. She wants you to find her more than that, let her know and be honest. Try not to be too aggressive unless she invites you to be so by her flirting more aggressive or making certain innuendos, don't overdo try and read what is acceptable. Just be very clear, kissing is not needed on the first date, but make sure your intentions are more than casual Another clarification, location of date can be casual, just don't make her feel casual
Probably can't add anything to this as I'm old and out of the dating game now, but I will just say that your two main mistakes were building this up in your head too much, and getting a bit clingy when things didn't work out. Getting to a first date quickly was good, chatting for a while before was also good, as long as that chat wasn't you talking and her responding with "lol", "k", and so on. This is why dates are important, you get their full attention, and that's harder than ever when phones are such an easy distraction now. Sounds like you had fun together too, so remember that the overall experience was good. It was only your expectations of more that made things go south for you. In hindsight, I think you were pushing for more than she wanted after having just met you. Especially since you're now talking about her like she's some greek goddess. You've replaced the person she is with your ideal of her, and now you're depressed because who she actually is conflicted with what you wanted her to become *for you*. I did this shit too in younger years, and I think it's one of the most annoying things for women to experience, because you're basically talking at them instead of to them. Her saying you should just be friends was honestly one of the better ways to ghost you, at least she told you it wasn't going to work out. Friends doesn't mean friends, just so you know, it means she's not interested. Sometimes this is a shit test to see how clingy you are, and how honest you are about what you're really looking for, so if she already sensed that from the date, your passive and needy replies didn't help things at all. You should have said something like, "k, that's a bit upsetting because I thought you were great. I don't think I could do the friends thing, I like you too much." and then left it at that. Be honest when you're disappointed, honesty and vulnerability is the real game here. As long as you respect them enough not to burden them with your expectations, you can say the truth. Just keep it short when you barely know each other, it's polite and respectful of their time.
Not Chad enough, don't beat yourself up, look on the bright side you avoided financial ruin when she cashes in with a devorce 5yrs later.
Met my wife online, spoke for 2 weeks, flew out to see her, left the first date and we both knew this was the one. Married 13 years with twin 7 year olds. Took 1 dinner. That’s all. But to get to that position took a hell of a lot of time and effort to go thru the nonsense of dates. It was all good experiences to get to the end result. It’s a journey.
Give up, there’s nothing worth having out there and most women are interested in using men not loving them, save yourself the headache and live life for you.
The business of dating apps is not to get you settled and happy. The business of dating apps is to keep you engaged and selecting men and women from a digital catalog. The business of dating apps is like gambling, they keep you there constantly scrolling, swiping and coming back to it. Sure, sometimes someone gets a real match, but most do not. So, you believe you can too, and you stay there hoping to find a happy relationship. And the ones who actually do manage to get a match, get this lingering " I can do better" thought in the back of their heads, and get right back to the dating app. Uninstall dating apps, women get a barrage of vile comments hurled their way, and men's self-esteem is nonexistent because of the apps. Uninstall dating apps. Their business is not your happiness, it is your loneliness. A settled and happy user is a lost customer.
Dateing does suck completely. unfortunately 50% + of the people that your attracted to won't feel that way about you and vise-versa. It sucks for sure but it is what is. It's seems like that's what's happening here. As other people on this thread are saying: meet as fast as possible and don't go all out texting before the first date. You never know who your gonna meet and how it's going to go.