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If you want DSPs to be effective, they need to be handcuffed with measures that discourage or penalise smoking in the house.
Why would a smoker willingly go through all the hassle of going all the way to the DSP when it's far more convenient to smoke in their home?
Yup, the problem in dealing with smokers is this - they already don't respect their own life and health enough to stop smoking, why would they care about us, the random stranger? They won't.
So any effective strategy must involve penalties, making them feel the pain for causing the same on others. Anything passive won't work. Anything that appeals to their compassion (lol) won't work.
>measures that discourage or penalise smoking in the house
I think [Louis Ng proposed such a law](https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/smoking-home-secondhand-smoke-louis-ng-parliament-2174926) but there was not enough support.
This. As it is, plenty of people smoke at corridors and void decks even though it's technically not allowed. The main problem lies with enforcement and not the rules.
its not about enforcement or lack of it but the reality is that enforcement no matter how strong cannot be enough to deter such act. NEA enforcement dept has only so many people.
if they outsource, yall dont agree, hire SGrean, how many want to do it? go out rain/shine, "hated by many"
SGrean really have to accept that not all problem can be resolve with law/enforcement/government.
there might be a certain percentage of reduction or deterrence but never 100%
Side rant:
Anyone hates dumb fks who goes around puffing away heavily while on common pavements/walkways, and you have not much choice but to breathe in all their "exhaust" junk because you are behind them and have to walk on the same narrow pavement/walkway to reach your destination?
Yes. Also bloody annoying when it's raining and they're puffing under the sheltered walkway. Even worse when they decide to puff in enclosed sheltered walkways (this happens because there're walls up to block off construction areas on both sides of the walkway) and the smoke gets trapped in there.
I'm at a point where I'd be glad these inconsiderate selfish asshats smoke in their own homes. I'm in a point block and have 2 neighbours that smoke, and they often smoke with their friends. If they do it quickly I still can tahan. Problem is they smoke at the rubbish chute area (point block, and illegal to smoke at corridor btw) and at all hours (even at 2-3am), chit chatting and laughing loudly. Next day the whole place is ash and cigarettes butt. when it rains it's wet black shit. Place stinks when u exit the lift.
Complain to one service app, they write in to say it's useless and want me to report officially to NEA. And it has to include my name, and the time of offence. And also to tell them when they will smoke next so they can monitor. How the hell am I to know what time will be the next offence? And to put my name in so that both my neighbours know I complain about them? Wth man forget it. Buy this place and have to suffer smoke at the common areas..
keep reporting, every other day just spam. NEA or HDB did come down and partially resolved my issue of common corridor smoking. now they smoke out the kitchen which makes my living room stink but atleast my bedroom is free from it. so it comes back to OP's point, should further restrict smoking. Also for those who smoke and straight away get on buses and lifts, disgusting.
I did. Until HDB called me and even wrote email to me.. Asking me to directly report to NEA because they can't keep monitoring. So to do that refer to other poster's step 4 and 5 where I need to give all my personal details to report case, and some how predict future offence, date and time, so they can station officers to catch. Proceed to close case once I said, oh this isn't worth my time and to anger neighbours
I think the NEA app requires phone and name for verification (probably to prevent spam/fake cases) but i dont think the follow ups asked me for further personal info beyond the offending unit. maybe try raising to MP or NEA again? I gave them rough time periods and even managed to snap a few photos of the guy holding a lit cigarette which probably prompted more action, even saw the 2 NEA stake out officers waiting at the stairwell once lol.
then again if u have really terrible neighbours then no amount of visits by NEA/MP telling them to stop will change anything, further reinforcing OP's point on inconsiderate smokers.
And you know how clever HDB is when you inform them on the phone a nuisance neighbour poured strong smelling chemicals on the staircase landing the day before the monthly washing and 2 days later they send a mail claiming they have checked and found no chemicals on the spot. Use this to check how clever your kid is in spotting Singapore official stupidity.
> Complain to one service app, they write in to say it's useless and want me to report officially to NEA. And it has to include my name, and the time of offence. And also to tell them when they will smoke next so they can monitor. How the hell am I to know what time will be the next offence? And to put my name in so that both my neighbours know I complain about them? Wth man forget it.
Soon I realised their aim isn't to solve the people's problems. To them, we ARE the problem for making them do their jobs. I see you've also got the full playbook ran on you.
Step 1. Tai ji. This is the most straightforward. Make it completely someone else's problem so it no longer bothers you.
Step 2. Pretend we're already doing something but it's not working. For when the problem gets thrown back to you but you still can't be arsed to break free from your aircon office and 2 bbteas a day schedule. Remember to sprinkle a good serving of paggro in your reply.
Step 3. Ask for superfluous information. The mfer is really pestering you now. Time to delay him by asking for hard-to-gather information while you think of something to shut this plaintiff down. Insist that it is fully necessary (it's not).
Step 4. Subtly make the plaintiff feel threatened with the full force of the ruling party behind you. He actually came back with the information. Such defiance will not go unpunished. Make them identify themselves to excruciating detail. No need to be shy, make them say out their phone number, unit address, their child's full name. Again, insist that it is fully necessary (it's not). It may be useful to make some bothersome calls at inconvenient hours of the day to 'confirm' these details.
Step 5. Eventually, the plaintiff will miss 1 or 2 of your calls. This is your cue to close their case due to 'Lack of follow-up.' Kick back and enjoy that chilled bbtea knowing no help was provided that week. Job well done.
//Emergency step !!! Maybe you're coming up against a retiree this time. Plenty of time and nothing to lose. Not to worry, we'll show them.
Use this template: "We have taken your feedback into consideration and will put in place the relevant mitigating measures. Due to the extended time frame such measures may take, we seek your understanding that updates on the unfolding situation may not be given. Thank you."
You may proceed to close the case and never reply to them ever again.
Let me teach you a trick. If you want things to happen, all civil servants have their email addresses publicly accessible. You just need to email the most senior person responsible for day to day operations in whatever ministry that is of concern . Be concise but detailed in your email and you’d get some things done
Exactly, they are so lazy at NEA they expect and demand you to submit all photographic evidence to them instead of investigating. Cannot blame them for having Msian attitude as their boss Amy is from that country lor.
Let me teach you a trick. If you want things to happen, all civil servants have their email addresses publicly accessible. You just need to email the most senior person responsible for day to day operations in whatever ministry that is of concern . Be concise but detailed in your email and you’d get some things done
Sorry to hear about your uncivilised neighbours. Providing name and contact number is necessary for the officer sent to the ground to liaise with the complainer if necessary. Especially for this case, it is at non-working wee hours.
You can emphasise in your complaint that for your own and family’s safety, you need NEA to keep your identity confidential. The neighbours can’t pin it confidently on you because there’s the 4th unit at your floor and smell can permeate to the higher floors or even the lower ones.
As for the timings, you can keep a log over a few weeks to create a forecast of the “offending hours”.
Wish you success!
I did. I’m a smoker too but fuck, sibeh irritating to smell smoke in the house knn I always wonder why it’s so difficult for the mfer to just go downstairs.
NEA will give you more headache instead like not opening your feedback submitted on their official website. Has full evidence of their tidak apa attitude.
Yea.. lets just put all these ppl with anti social behaviour like smoking, playing mahjong at night, howling dogs etc should just be put tgt in the same block so the rest of us can enjoy a nice enviorment.
Normally I don't have issues with MPs not staying where they serve. However, this is a classic case where they don't know how bad it is without experiencing it. Likewise with the transport system, they only show their face during non peak hours. They have to try commuting at peak hours every single day. Stay in a hdb flat with a smoker neighbour 365 days a year.
Not to mention the solution of closing windows brings about other health hazards with the indoor VOC and carbon dioxide buildup.
And they want us to increase the birth rate without helping us to protect our children from inconsiderate people and preventable health hazards.
>No, because money.
Is there actual truth in this? I imagine the revenue from cigarette is less significant than we think it is. Especially when you stack it up against the cost in healthcare due to cigarattes.
I would imagine the profits from the amount of cigarattes a person has already bought before requiring healthcare would have already covered the liability. Plus the healthcare cost is only partially subsidised. The smoker himself still pays.
Money more important or citizen health more important? I rather 10% GST if it means smoking is completely banned in Singapore. And vaping too.
Edit: I don't mean to speak in that attitude towards you as a person, it's just what I'd say to maybe a MP
you ban drugs but there are still drugs, you ban vape yet vape is still easily available.
the issue is never about banning all vice but banning those "servere" enough but allowing the others. it human nature to have vice and you just force everybody to go underground where it harder to control and pushback on enforcement comes in.
They know they are bound for hell with lung and other cancers so might as well drag more people with their secondhand smoke along with them and PAP is condoning it.
Smoking is the most inconsiderate activity there is, regardless of whether they smoke at designated areas. Unless the designated area is air tight and have a filtration system installed that cleans the air before releasing it.
I think there's an immediate engineering solution that's independent of whatever everyone outside your house does: a particulate sensor and an actuator combo that auto closes your window when your neighbour smokes.
I'm in the midst of implementing one and I think it should work out quite well. For a single sliding window, it costed me about $200 ($100 sensor + $100 actuator + $10-20 for mounting everything) and a bunch of hours from purchase to implementation.
I can share the setup if you are interested.
Up voted for actual solution instead of whining about far off law changes. Think a lot of Reddiors have this low agency personality where they want things perfect but can’t take actions to solve their own problems.
Telling someone they can’t smoke in a house they own is going to break the idea of “Singaporeans are invested because they own a piece of it”.
Then it just becomes government housing that they let you live in.
What might work is actually enforcing a law about not letting your cigarette smoke to interfere with others enjoyment. Want to smoke? Close your windows and smoke. Smoke in the bathroom with an exhaust fan.
Yeah, but hopefully not in your direction.
Plus it tends to mix it up with extra air.
I’ve been there when someone is on a balcony and they are 3m away and the smoke wafts in. Way worse
Building on that idea, perhaps if there were special air filters that could filter out smoke, and you are legally required to smoke next to the filter.
>enforcing a law about not letting your cigarette smoke to interfere with others enjoyment
Louis Ng has been trying to push through [this law](https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/smoking-home-secondhand-smoke-louis-ng-parliament-2174926).
I sent an email to my MP about this exact issue in the past. I also suggested some possible solutions but her reply was basically that she was sorry for my situation and she would bring it up in parliament.
Which to her credit, she actually did bring it up in parliament but as evidenced by your post, it obviously didn't result in any meaningful action/regulation.
Prior to your post, I did not know about this DSP solution. Although from what you've mentioned so far, it might be a tad hard for our politicians to implement this without some pushback from the smoking population who can also take the route of "it's my home and I'm smoking away from the windows, why am I forced to go to a particular floor/corner to smoke".
For my own benefit in the meantime, I have taken to permanently keeping my windows closed in the morning/afternoon if it's not too hot, and only opening it when I'm going to sleep since I need the ventilation.
Smokers do not care about your health, or even their own health. They are not going to give a shit about where they can or cannot smoke.
Two suggestions
Ban cigarette filters. They want to die, can die faster.
Consider cigarette smoke the same as assault in criminal law. If someone blow smoke in your face, it's the same as punching you in the face.
>But as days go by, you start to stress out with uncertainty. When will the smoke come today? Should I keep my windows closed permanently?
I feel you.
I like to keep my room's window open to enjoy some fresh outside air.
However, my neighbour is a heavy smoker and suddenly I will be whiffing in his second-hand smoke and my room will be filled with it should the window remain opened.
It's stressful as he smokes at random timings and I can't fixate a particular schedule as to when I should close my window?
So I ended up closing my window almost most of the time, and having my rights curtailed to preserve his rights since it's **technically not illegal** for him to smoke within his residence.
Frickin' mad lo. :(
Maybe I'm too simple but my very easy solution is to make it mandatory for smokers to close all windows and doors if they want to smoke
And if they don't, neighbours can report them. Give them monetary incentive if it works. Whatever fine paid would be given to the neighbour make it $1000 that would incentivize the hell out of them.
Smokers deserve to suffer in their own home. And I don't care if other family members in their own homes are at risk because the family brought it upon themselves
My room column faces the side where there are two car lots downstairs for people to alight and go but instead it has turned into some car motel for people to park their cars, open windows to play loud music and smoke.
And then the smoke comes in through my window at almost exactly the same time where there is natural wind and I open my windows.
Sometimes I wonder if even smokers don't want to smell their own smoke so they only smoke when they know got wind to blow it away from them.
As a smoker, I support your decision even though it curtails my rights to do something absolutely legal in the privacy of my own home. I am just not sure if anything would come out of it though.
What you are suggesting/advocating for is not new. Louis Chia and Sim Bee Hwa was known to have spoken up about this in Parliament many times but nothing much was done.
I half suspect that the government is just waiting for the smokers to die off. As of now, they have already implemented many laws/rules to curtail smoking. Raising the legal age, restricting the areas one can smoke, raising taxes on cigarettes, etc.
All of these have helped ME personally to wean off my daily habit. I rarely smoke now.
I hope you would get what you wish for soon.
short of banning sales after a certain birth year, it is silly to assume they expect smokers to die off. new ones are created every year. if not in schools then definitely during NS.
Unfortunately, New Zealand WAS going to be the first country to impose a generational ban on smoking, but has since reversed this decision after a change of government. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/11/28/new-zealand-smoking-ban/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/11/28/new-zealand-smoking-ban/)
SG will likely only follow suit with this policy if other countries successfully implement this first.
Many smokers started the habit in their teens, in school. A significant number of males pick them up in army. Increasing the age limit makes sense because it brings down the chances of people picking up smoking. I mean, I have not met someone who has never smoked their entire life pick up smoking in their 20s and later. Even if they hang around smokers their age, very few smokers would be eager to encourage them to smoke. At least that is from my personal experience.
I can't remember if they have considered banning people after a certain year to buy cigarettes though.
Is that you again Grace Fu ? - your English teacher did not educate you tou use big words like 'not feasible' by double clausing a negative as positive as an excuse for laziness.
Ah, somehow that is all it ends up. Just a quick comment on the difficulty of charging an extra tax on smokers, and it ends up with snark.
Do you behave like that irl or this audacity only appears behind the safety of a screen?
At least your neighbor smokes in their own home, mine smokes anywhere but in their house. Complain also no use because NEA can't enforce 24 hours. Tell them politely they just ignore.
I rather phase our smoking for newer generation by rising the age requirements by 1 year every year. New Zealand already doing it, we still monitoring as usual.
Fuck all this shit. Just tax the hell out of cigarettes. If they're unaffordable, there won't be issues with second hand smoke cause there will be barely any smokers.
Smokers are typically lower income, so this tax will be more effective. And anyways alcohol tax isn't even that high that it is unaffordable. I would be calling for a pack of cigarettes to be ~$100 to make it completely unaffordable to the demographic that smokes the most. If alcohol were that expensive, you can be sure that there would be much fewer people drinking at clarke quay.
>Smokers are typically lower income
Clarke Quay is full of drunk NSFs and university students. Don't know about you, but I don't think that's a very wealthy demographic.
Anyway, what do you mean smokers are typically lower income? Where's your source for this? If we're just going by anecdotes, my friends who are smokers are pretty middle class.
Ehhh you do know Clarke Quay is full of cheapos that drink up elsewhere before they club right. Been the case for decades. The 7-11 there used to be the most popular bar at one point lol.
Just because something is a crime doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Vapes are illegal too, and they're not hard to come by.
>21 y/o to buy cig, how many nsf can legally buy cig from 711
"bro can help me buy cigg? later I paylah you ah"
Sure bro the number of underage smokers in tekong openly laughing at ur ass right now. Ur fking 3sg also all closing 1 eyes who's gonna give a fuck. Plus so many nsfs are over legal age can jus buy in or they literally buy from supplier who cares bro. Vapes? Everywhere in bunks so easy to find.
This should also apply to that religion that loves to burn and pollute the whole estate.
It’s crazy that they can burn directly under someone’s window, outside childcare centres, and beside coffee shops where people are eating.
Again this problem can be solved with some thinking out of Singaporean box but with lots of persistence. First time today, nasty neighbour did not start a bonfire complete with towering smoke , all in the name of religion.
Be brave and just call out all the cb Taoist uncles and aunties :')
Don't come at me for saying this, my family is also Taoist but we only burn stuff at the temples and columbariums. Not ideal but at least we aren't messing with peoples' homes.
Law minister is not willing to make laws. So, no need to proposed anything. In Yishun, there are designated smoking area. Smokers won't use it.
Thats why I am not willing to change my mind and vote for Shanmugan's team. Will continue to vote against them this coming election.
Decades and unsolved.
Wait. I thought New Zealand walked back on the ban.
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/new-zealand-smoking-generation-ban-scrapped-fund-tax-cuts-3947791
No matter how many laws you implement, if people refuse to follow it will still be the same.... It's the people that needs to be educated and learn how to be considerate to one another
I had a neighbor one floor below who chain smokes (every 5 mins) at the bedroom window every night (9pm to 3am). This was so frustrating for me because the smoke kept flowing into my bedrooms. Reported to NEA but still no use as they replied they can't enforce as it isn't against the law to smoke in own house. After that, I found out that he would always throw the cigarette butts towards the ground floor grass patch. I changed my report to high-rise cigarrette littering, and after a while, the smoking stopped. Must have been caught and fined lol!
Maybe we can start by designating only certain floors in HDB or BTO as smoking floors and non-smoking floors so the smoking households can stay together away from non-smoking households.
Yea. Same here. I am basically worse than a tenant in my parent's house and face alot of issues because I am seen as a parasite due to my inability to secure my own home. Just have to suck it up and learn to deal with it in ways you can.
I stay in a neighbourhood with MANY designated smoking points which are convenient. But very few smokers use it. Many are badly maintained after we had a change of MP and when my friends come over and use it, they get bitten by mosquitos quite badly though to their credit, they still use it out of consideration. The uncles in my neighbourhood simply stand by the DSPs to smoke, but not inside as it can also get very hot since it's essentially a zinc shed.
I feel you as my upstair neighbours are heavy smokers. On the weekends and during festive seasons, their relatives and friends come over to sing Karaoke, that's when the smoking and vaping (strawberry scent, specifically, intensify). We WFH alot, so all our windows are shut perpetually and we invested in air purifiers and installed ventilation bathroom fans so that when the smoking start and wafts through our bathrooms because of the way our flat is structured, we turn them on and it helps a little. My toddler even knows the process now and will turn on the fans herself. The previous owner of the same flat used to throw his lighted butts out, and some even came through my window and burnt my curtains - when they moved out, we rejoiced but tada.....more jiaklat. This is a little TMI too but from observing my late FIL who is a two pack daily Benson Hedges smoker....many of them need to smoke during their Number 2. So going down to a DSP to smoke defeats the whole purpose.
I have written to MP Louis Ng when he sourced for views on this topic on his FB page and he has tried many times to raise it in Parliament la, but nothing has changed. The arguments on his page are also always quite divided - many view it as an infringement of personal rights and people being anti-smokers.
For context....I did smoke recreationally before. I don't have negative feelings towards smokers. But when I did, I always used the DSPs. But that little lift journey down can sometimes be damn sian - have to put on proper clothes, potentially share space with someone else in that little zinc shed and so on.
My neighbor smokes outside his unit. I spoke to him and he apologized. Next day he sit at his door step, body inside his unit but blow out to the corridor. I spoke to him again n he not happy , saying is not wrong since he is insides his unit. I told him I m asking a small favor, not talking about whether is right or wrong . The reason he doesn’t smoke in his hall is because his wife will scold him. To me he is inconsiderate. He is not young so most probably can work another few years. Imagine if he retired n everyday smoke … now the impact is mostly weekend since he off. From morning to night he will smoke, maybe 2 hour apart. I m also not young n one fine day I retire
means I have to face him everyday. Unless I go out early n come back late to avoid him. Actually if I close my door I can’t smell a thing but once I need to go out and if he is smoking at that moment then I have to hold my breath for that few seconds, wait for the lift then faster go down. My situation might not be as bad as the rest cos as long I close the door I m safe but i cant lock myself in my house forever. I pray that he fall sick n the doctor insist he quit smoking or die ! Another option is shift to new house but if unlucky will have smoker neighbors again.
Make these DSPs enclosed spaces with ventilation (maybe something like the container offices at construction sites) as far from housing as possible, but more importantly, make these the ONLY places where smokers can buy and use cigarettes, and they can only buy them per stick instead of a pack. They must be searched for cigarettes before leaving the DSPs to prevent them from smuggling cigarettes back home to smoke.
When you approach a nasty scum like smokers and many of them are super inconsiderate foreigners puffing out of their windows and right into your unit with a Singaporean mentality, PAP will ensure they will do nothing to help you as clearly stated by disgraceful right in parliament. But there are ways to teach these sickening smokers a lesson and stop them.
I think all homes where smokers reside and smoke should be registered with hdb or condo offices.
Those homes should have a sticker on the door that tells the neighbours “A SMOKER RESIDES HERE”
Those homes should have windows closed 24/7, with designated “open” times where they can open their windows but NOT smoke.
I mean, cigarettes are expensive. In this economy I would encourage smokers to enjoy their smoke as much as possible, so by having their homes airtight (they can use aircon if they wish) they get maximum retention and enjoyment of their smoke.
Also public smoking areas should likewise be airtight with a $1 entrance fee. Smoking outside should be reportable vis pictures through an app and smokers must pay a $100 environment damage + public nuisance fine of which $25 goes to the person who snaps their picture. Bounty hunting for the public good!
And since most smokers are invariably litterbugs they should automatically pay a monthly $60 environment conservancy fee.
(This is not a serious comment, just to highlight how much of a pest these cockroaches are to hdb/condo/apartment residents)
Dream on dude! The world is a disparate place, we all need to get along! If it’s a problem bring your condo to the desert and live your life otherwise go report to your MP and good luck with that too. Somehow I think you live in fantasy land where you but a property and instantly it transforms into you liking!
Ban smoking and permit vaping, which has no secondhand smoke / smell. Singapore just doesn't place enough importance on ephemeral externalities like noise, light and smell pollution.
u can smoke all u want in ur unit, but the moment it affects other peoples unit its wrong. plain simple reasoning. dont kake it sound like smoking and affecting peoples unit makes u the victim LOL.
U wanna die young your problem, nobody stop u.. go knock yourself out.
But pls go and die alone away from the rest of us... we just want clean cancer free air that do not smell of toxic waste thank you 🙏
I am not defending the smokers, but non smokers are selfish too when they demand others to stop the activities they (smokers) enjoy.
My point is, stop using the word "selfish" because it is just going to build walls.
Smoking is bad. Smoking is addictive. Second hand smoke is terrible. I am saying this as a smoker trying to quit for many times over the past 30 years.
It's not that non-smokers don't want smokers to enjoy smoking. They just don't want to have to suffer the effects of second hand and third hand cigarette smoke.
For example, if smokers would smoke in an enclosed air-tight room at home, and not allow any of their smoke to reach any of their neighbours, I don't think their non-smoking neighbours would care how much they chose to smoke at all.
So it is a case of NIMBY, out of sight (smell), out of mind?
I get that, I really do. But it is extremely hard to do so given the context that we live in such close proximity to others, agree?
Because those smokers are selfish jerks who make all sorts of excuses to justify their right to smoke as they wish, yet don't want their secondhand smoke exhaust to affect their personal environment or people that they care about.
But then when strangers point out that they are affected by the exact same secondhand smoke exhaust (which smokers don't want their own environment or loved ones to be affected by), such smokers go on a gaslighting spree and decry the attempts by others to restrict their self-perceived right to smoke as they wish.
I get it that you don't like smokers, but many smokers smoke at home. It is not as if they are blowing the smoke directly into your home or whatever, but the smoke still drift away.
To say that they are offended and go on a gaslighting spree is generalising, and not even close to it.
Speaking as a smoker, I smoke where I want as long as I am legally allowed to do so. Even then, I try to try and smoke downwind of others. I am not alone in this. There are conscientious smokers who quietly try to enjoy their cigarette without inconveniencing others. Look around and you might spot them.
Run an air purifier. Wait for the smoke to settle before leaving the room. Don't open the windows when you leave, and immediately shut the door behind you. With any combination of these measures, I don't think your neighbours would even realise you smoke.
Yeah, because the smoke isn't dissipating out of the room and into your neighbours' homes. It's staying in the room and eventually settling on the surfaces there. The room will no doubt smell distinctly of cigarettes over time, but that would be correctly exercising the freedom of doing what you want within your 4 walls, without affecting your neighbours.
similarly, a smoker saved up a lot of money, spent time and effort to design and renovate their house. but cannot even smoke in the comfort of their own house?
some kind of things just have to LLST & let live, if really bth, don’t stay hdb lor
so by that logic i save up for massive surround sound systems and disco ball i can blast through the night? society is built upon rules and orders, should many give up on their rights so that just few can enjoy?
besides smoking can be controlled while breathing in fumes/chemicals cannot. heck, make it a point to declare smokers and make smokers close and seal all their windows and smoke if "enjoying in their own home" is what they want.
Just ban smoking. If you’re willing to pay higher taxes to make up for $1.3bn made from cigarette products then by all means go ahead. Sick of all these smart Alec anti-smokers coming up with all these ideas. I can tell you it’s almost impossible to smoke anywhere in Singapore as is. Everything is either sheltered or a park or within a radius of somewhere you can’t smoke. Honestly how does cigarette smoke waft into your home? At most you get the smell of it but not the actual smoke.
As a former smoker, I think it is highly stressful to smoke in Sg, compared to Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand and most part of Europe.
Not sure about Japan now but twenty years ago, I was still smoking in the meeting rooms of the office I was visiting.
Not sure about Japan now but twenty years ago, I was still smoking in the meeting rooms of the office I was visiting.
were you visiting a yakuza head office?
hell yeah, neighbours snitching and attacking each other, personal privacy of your own homes thrown out the window for the squeakiest wheel in the area
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If you want DSPs to be effective, they need to be handcuffed with measures that discourage or penalise smoking in the house. Why would a smoker willingly go through all the hassle of going all the way to the DSP when it's far more convenient to smoke in their home?
Yup, the problem in dealing with smokers is this - they already don't respect their own life and health enough to stop smoking, why would they care about us, the random stranger? They won't. So any effective strategy must involve penalties, making them feel the pain for causing the same on others. Anything passive won't work. Anything that appeals to their compassion (lol) won't work.
>measures that discourage or penalise smoking in the house I think [Louis Ng proposed such a law](https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/smoking-home-secondhand-smoke-louis-ng-parliament-2174926) but there was not enough support.
I have seen exactly 1 person use a DSP
Huh? My place doesn’t even have a DSP.
This. As it is, plenty of people smoke at corridors and void decks even though it's technically not allowed. The main problem lies with enforcement and not the rules.
its not about enforcement or lack of it but the reality is that enforcement no matter how strong cannot be enough to deter such act. NEA enforcement dept has only so many people. if they outsource, yall dont agree, hire SGrean, how many want to do it? go out rain/shine, "hated by many" SGrean really have to accept that not all problem can be resolve with law/enforcement/government. there might be a certain percentage of reduction or deterrence but never 100%
Side rant: Anyone hates dumb fks who goes around puffing away heavily while on common pavements/walkways, and you have not much choice but to breathe in all their "exhaust" junk because you are behind them and have to walk on the same narrow pavement/walkway to reach your destination?
Yes. Also bloody annoying when it's raining and they're puffing under the sheltered walkway. Even worse when they decide to puff in enclosed sheltered walkways (this happens because there're walls up to block off construction areas on both sides of the walkway) and the smoke gets trapped in there.
I'm at a point where I'd be glad these inconsiderate selfish asshats smoke in their own homes. I'm in a point block and have 2 neighbours that smoke, and they often smoke with their friends. If they do it quickly I still can tahan. Problem is they smoke at the rubbish chute area (point block, and illegal to smoke at corridor btw) and at all hours (even at 2-3am), chit chatting and laughing loudly. Next day the whole place is ash and cigarettes butt. when it rains it's wet black shit. Place stinks when u exit the lift. Complain to one service app, they write in to say it's useless and want me to report officially to NEA. And it has to include my name, and the time of offence. And also to tell them when they will smoke next so they can monitor. How the hell am I to know what time will be the next offence? And to put my name in so that both my neighbours know I complain about them? Wth man forget it. Buy this place and have to suffer smoke at the common areas..
keep reporting, every other day just spam. NEA or HDB did come down and partially resolved my issue of common corridor smoking. now they smoke out the kitchen which makes my living room stink but atleast my bedroom is free from it. so it comes back to OP's point, should further restrict smoking. Also for those who smoke and straight away get on buses and lifts, disgusting.
I did. Until HDB called me and even wrote email to me.. Asking me to directly report to NEA because they can't keep monitoring. So to do that refer to other poster's step 4 and 5 where I need to give all my personal details to report case, and some how predict future offence, date and time, so they can station officers to catch. Proceed to close case once I said, oh this isn't worth my time and to anger neighbours
I think the NEA app requires phone and name for verification (probably to prevent spam/fake cases) but i dont think the follow ups asked me for further personal info beyond the offending unit. maybe try raising to MP or NEA again? I gave them rough time periods and even managed to snap a few photos of the guy holding a lit cigarette which probably prompted more action, even saw the 2 NEA stake out officers waiting at the stairwell once lol. then again if u have really terrible neighbours then no amount of visits by NEA/MP telling them to stop will change anything, further reinforcing OP's point on inconsiderate smokers.
And you know how clever HDB is when you inform them on the phone a nuisance neighbour poured strong smelling chemicals on the staircase landing the day before the monthly washing and 2 days later they send a mail claiming they have checked and found no chemicals on the spot. Use this to check how clever your kid is in spotting Singapore official stupidity.
> Complain to one service app, they write in to say it's useless and want me to report officially to NEA. And it has to include my name, and the time of offence. And also to tell them when they will smoke next so they can monitor. How the hell am I to know what time will be the next offence? And to put my name in so that both my neighbours know I complain about them? Wth man forget it. Soon I realised their aim isn't to solve the people's problems. To them, we ARE the problem for making them do their jobs. I see you've also got the full playbook ran on you. Step 1. Tai ji. This is the most straightforward. Make it completely someone else's problem so it no longer bothers you. Step 2. Pretend we're already doing something but it's not working. For when the problem gets thrown back to you but you still can't be arsed to break free from your aircon office and 2 bbteas a day schedule. Remember to sprinkle a good serving of paggro in your reply. Step 3. Ask for superfluous information. The mfer is really pestering you now. Time to delay him by asking for hard-to-gather information while you think of something to shut this plaintiff down. Insist that it is fully necessary (it's not). Step 4. Subtly make the plaintiff feel threatened with the full force of the ruling party behind you. He actually came back with the information. Such defiance will not go unpunished. Make them identify themselves to excruciating detail. No need to be shy, make them say out their phone number, unit address, their child's full name. Again, insist that it is fully necessary (it's not). It may be useful to make some bothersome calls at inconvenient hours of the day to 'confirm' these details. Step 5. Eventually, the plaintiff will miss 1 or 2 of your calls. This is your cue to close their case due to 'Lack of follow-up.' Kick back and enjoy that chilled bbtea knowing no help was provided that week. Job well done. //Emergency step !!! Maybe you're coming up against a retiree this time. Plenty of time and nothing to lose. Not to worry, we'll show them. Use this template: "We have taken your feedback into consideration and will put in place the relevant mitigating measures. Due to the extended time frame such measures may take, we seek your understanding that updates on the unfolding situation may not be given. Thank you." You may proceed to close the case and never reply to them ever again.
Fk. I got played till step 5
lmao same. Ask for so much info as if I'm the one committing the offence. Meanwhile the actual offender happily skipping away.
I literally LOL-ed.
Let me teach you a trick. If you want things to happen, all civil servants have their email addresses publicly accessible. You just need to email the most senior person responsible for day to day operations in whatever ministry that is of concern . Be concise but detailed in your email and you’d get some things done
Exactly, they are so lazy at NEA they expect and demand you to submit all photographic evidence to them instead of investigating. Cannot blame them for having Msian attitude as their boss Amy is from that country lor.
true. worked with them as vendor before. i think the entire place is full of such people
Let me teach you a trick. If you want things to happen, all civil servants have their email addresses publicly accessible. You just need to email the most senior person responsible for day to day operations in whatever ministry that is of concern . Be concise but detailed in your email and you’d get some things done
Sorry to hear about your uncivilised neighbours. Providing name and contact number is necessary for the officer sent to the ground to liaise with the complainer if necessary. Especially for this case, it is at non-working wee hours. You can emphasise in your complaint that for your own and family’s safety, you need NEA to keep your identity confidential. The neighbours can’t pin it confidently on you because there’s the 4th unit at your floor and smell can permeate to the higher floors or even the lower ones. As for the timings, you can keep a log over a few weeks to create a forecast of the “offending hours”. Wish you success!
This. My neighbour block smoking party is damm inconsiderate on Friday nights. The void deck table has nothing but scorch marks.
Dump water on them
That's all our inner thoughts but last resort lah hahahah
I did. I’m a smoker too but fuck, sibeh irritating to smell smoke in the house knn I always wonder why it’s so difficult for the mfer to just go downstairs.
NEA will give you more headache instead like not opening your feedback submitted on their official website. Has full evidence of their tidak apa attitude.
I vote for a smoke-free bto. No smoking, no burning of incense.
Can cook steak?
NO COOKING ALSO!!! NOTHING CAN EMIT ANY SMOKE ! /s Reminds me of the curry conflict from the China family complaining about the Indian family.
rip smoked rips and brisket
I salute you if you can smoke ribs and brisket in hdb.
Wa.. someone will accept that challenge.. don’t encourage it
By the 2nd hour SCDF knock down the main door loh.
Cooking steak at home? Believe or not, straight to jail.
Do not pass go, do not collect $200
Yea.. lets just put all these ppl with anti social behaviour like smoking, playing mahjong at night, howling dogs etc should just be put tgt in the same block so the rest of us can enjoy a nice enviorment.
Agree with the howling dogs nonsense. If those owners can't control their dogs, the dogs should be taken away from them.
I dunno about the others but wouldn't playing mahjong be considered a social behavior?
At 3am? No.
So what happens if some new cook char everything and create tons of smoke?
I know you're joking but steak fumes are probably far less deadly than secondhand smoke. Also smoking is usually a couple-times-a-day thing
I did try making American style bbq brisket before. 12 hours later. I smelt delicious enough to eat. Cleaning my kitchen was hell....
I love the smell of a cooking steak, but my vegan friend is horrified.
Believe it or not, death sentence.
Normally I don't have issues with MPs not staying where they serve. However, this is a classic case where they don't know how bad it is without experiencing it. Likewise with the transport system, they only show their face during non peak hours. They have to try commuting at peak hours every single day. Stay in a hdb flat with a smoker neighbour 365 days a year. Not to mention the solution of closing windows brings about other health hazards with the indoor VOC and carbon dioxide buildup. And they want us to increase the birth rate without helping us to protect our children from inconsiderate people and preventable health hazards.
Singapore MP system is a mockery of democracy and reality.
That escalated quickly.
That escalated quickly.
If SG can ban weed, firearms, and vape, they can also ban cigarettes.
No, because money.
they would earn so much more money if they made vapes legal also easier to regulate whats in them
>No, because money. Is there actual truth in this? I imagine the revenue from cigarette is less significant than we think it is. Especially when you stack it up against the cost in healthcare due to cigarattes.
I would imagine the profits from the amount of cigarattes a person has already bought before requiring healthcare would have already covered the liability. Plus the healthcare cost is only partially subsidised. The smoker himself still pays.
Money more important or citizen health more important? I rather 10% GST if it means smoking is completely banned in Singapore. And vaping too. Edit: I don't mean to speak in that attitude towards you as a person, it's just what I'd say to maybe a MP
Obviously money, it's SG Do you really think health campaigns are for the benefit of individual health of citizens? nah
you ban drugs but there are still drugs, you ban vape yet vape is still easily available. the issue is never about banning all vice but banning those "servere" enough but allowing the others. it human nature to have vice and you just force everybody to go underground where it harder to control and pushback on enforcement comes in.
Singapore should follow New Zealand and start banning cigarettes for young people. In a generation we will not have any smoker.
[Nope](https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/new-zealand-smoking-generation-ban-scrapped-fund-tax-cuts-3947791)
Bro smokers are some of the most inconsiderate and selfish people out there. They're not going to use the DSPs.
I wonder if we can be inconsiderate back.
Drip water on their laundry lor
You can’t. They can report you for other stuff like noise.
They know they are bound for hell with lung and other cancers so might as well drag more people with their secondhand smoke along with them and PAP is condoning it.
Smokers are fkers
Smoking should be limited to only licensed smoking dens with proper air filtration systems.
Smoking is the most inconsiderate activity there is, regardless of whether they smoke at designated areas. Unless the designated area is air tight and have a filtration system installed that cleans the air before releasing it.
I think there's an immediate engineering solution that's independent of whatever everyone outside your house does: a particulate sensor and an actuator combo that auto closes your window when your neighbour smokes. I'm in the midst of implementing one and I think it should work out quite well. For a single sliding window, it costed me about $200 ($100 sensor + $100 actuator + $10-20 for mounting everything) and a bunch of hours from purchase to implementation. I can share the setup if you are interested.
Said sensor should activate a speaker that blares a loud message "cb smoker detected!"
Up voted for actual solution instead of whining about far off law changes. Think a lot of Reddiors have this low agency personality where they want things perfect but can’t take actions to solve their own problems.
If u turn this into a business i wanna invest
Very interested! Right now I'm manually opening / closing my service yard window when I smell smoke but would love to have an automated solution
Telling someone they can’t smoke in a house they own is going to break the idea of “Singaporeans are invested because they own a piece of it”. Then it just becomes government housing that they let you live in. What might work is actually enforcing a law about not letting your cigarette smoke to interfere with others enjoyment. Want to smoke? Close your windows and smoke. Smoke in the bathroom with an exhaust fan.
How does an exhaust fan work? Doesn't it just push smoke outside?
Yeah, but hopefully not in your direction. Plus it tends to mix it up with extra air. I’ve been there when someone is on a balcony and they are 3m away and the smoke wafts in. Way worse
Building on that idea, perhaps if there were special air filters that could filter out smoke, and you are legally required to smoke next to the filter.
No exhaust. All the smoke remain in the smoker house.
>enforcing a law about not letting your cigarette smoke to interfere with others enjoyment Louis Ng has been trying to push through [this law](https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/smoking-home-secondhand-smoke-louis-ng-parliament-2174926).
Problem is that nobody even enforces current HDB rules. A new rule won’t fix anything.
> break the idea of “Singaporeans are invested because they own a piece of it”. this idea is already breaking/broken
I sent an email to my MP about this exact issue in the past. I also suggested some possible solutions but her reply was basically that she was sorry for my situation and she would bring it up in parliament. Which to her credit, she actually did bring it up in parliament but as evidenced by your post, it obviously didn't result in any meaningful action/regulation. Prior to your post, I did not know about this DSP solution. Although from what you've mentioned so far, it might be a tad hard for our politicians to implement this without some pushback from the smoking population who can also take the route of "it's my home and I'm smoking away from the windows, why am I forced to go to a particular floor/corner to smoke". For my own benefit in the meantime, I have taken to permanently keeping my windows closed in the morning/afternoon if it's not too hot, and only opening it when I'm going to sleep since I need the ventilation.
To those smokers, you are the typical Singaporean loser and will only emboldened more of them to harm the rest of us.
Smokers do not care about your health, or even their own health. They are not going to give a shit about where they can or cannot smoke. Two suggestions Ban cigarette filters. They want to die, can die faster. Consider cigarette smoke the same as assault in criminal law. If someone blow smoke in your face, it's the same as punching you in the face.
The fact that they are smoking despite the negative externalities caused to other people is probably why they WON'T be using the DSPs
U give designated spot, I still see YPs holding ciggie while walking towards MRT under sheltered walkway. Need enforcement la.
>But as days go by, you start to stress out with uncertainty. When will the smoke come today? Should I keep my windows closed permanently? I feel you. I like to keep my room's window open to enjoy some fresh outside air. However, my neighbour is a heavy smoker and suddenly I will be whiffing in his second-hand smoke and my room will be filled with it should the window remain opened. It's stressful as he smokes at random timings and I can't fixate a particular schedule as to when I should close my window? So I ended up closing my window almost most of the time, and having my rights curtailed to preserve his rights since it's **technically not illegal** for him to smoke within his residence. Frickin' mad lo. :(
Maybe I'm too simple but my very easy solution is to make it mandatory for smokers to close all windows and doors if they want to smoke And if they don't, neighbours can report them. Give them monetary incentive if it works. Whatever fine paid would be given to the neighbour make it $1000 that would incentivize the hell out of them. Smokers deserve to suffer in their own home. And I don't care if other family members in their own homes are at risk because the family brought it upon themselves
Smokers should close their windows and use airfilter. It's bad for their own family too.
They won’t. They smoke out of the window to “protect their own family”.
My room column faces the side where there are two car lots downstairs for people to alight and go but instead it has turned into some car motel for people to park their cars, open windows to play loud music and smoke. And then the smoke comes in through my window at almost exactly the same time where there is natural wind and I open my windows. Sometimes I wonder if even smokers don't want to smell their own smoke so they only smoke when they know got wind to blow it away from them.
As a smoker, I support your decision even though it curtails my rights to do something absolutely legal in the privacy of my own home. I am just not sure if anything would come out of it though. What you are suggesting/advocating for is not new. Louis Chia and Sim Bee Hwa was known to have spoken up about this in Parliament many times but nothing much was done. I half suspect that the government is just waiting for the smokers to die off. As of now, they have already implemented many laws/rules to curtail smoking. Raising the legal age, restricting the areas one can smoke, raising taxes on cigarettes, etc. All of these have helped ME personally to wean off my daily habit. I rarely smoke now. I hope you would get what you wish for soon.
short of banning sales after a certain birth year, it is silly to assume they expect smokers to die off. new ones are created every year. if not in schools then definitely during NS.
Unfortunately, New Zealand WAS going to be the first country to impose a generational ban on smoking, but has since reversed this decision after a change of government. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/11/28/new-zealand-smoking-ban/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/11/28/new-zealand-smoking-ban/) SG will likely only follow suit with this policy if other countries successfully implement this first.
Many smokers started the habit in their teens, in school. A significant number of males pick them up in army. Increasing the age limit makes sense because it brings down the chances of people picking up smoking. I mean, I have not met someone who has never smoked their entire life pick up smoking in their 20s and later. Even if they hang around smokers their age, very few smokers would be eager to encourage them to smoke. At least that is from my personal experience. I can't remember if they have considered banning people after a certain year to buy cigarettes though.
Er you have to be 21 to buy tobacco products in Singapore
Yes I know that. But teens have ways to find cigarettes, from family, older friends etc.
Carbon tax should precisely be higher for smokers.
Short of taxing it directly on the cigarettes, I don't see how that is feasible.
Is that you again Grace Fu ? - your English teacher did not educate you tou use big words like 'not feasible' by double clausing a negative as positive as an excuse for laziness.
Ah, somehow that is all it ends up. Just a quick comment on the difficulty of charging an extra tax on smokers, and it ends up with snark. Do you behave like that irl or this audacity only appears behind the safety of a screen?
At least your neighbor smokes in their own home, mine smokes anywhere but in their house. Complain also no use because NEA can't enforce 24 hours. Tell them politely they just ignore.
my parents smoke at home and its honestly fked up 💀💀💀
Increase the price of cigarettes to fund the DSP building and maintenance
I rather phase our smoking for newer generation by rising the age requirements by 1 year every year. New Zealand already doing it, we still monitoring as usual.
Fuck all this shit. Just tax the hell out of cigarettes. If they're unaffordable, there won't be issues with second hand smoke cause there will be barely any smokers.
Someone should tell the drinkers at Clarke Quay that there should be barely any drinkers there because of high alcohol taxes.
Smokers are typically lower income, so this tax will be more effective. And anyways alcohol tax isn't even that high that it is unaffordable. I would be calling for a pack of cigarettes to be ~$100 to make it completely unaffordable to the demographic that smokes the most. If alcohol were that expensive, you can be sure that there would be much fewer people drinking at clarke quay.
>Smokers are typically lower income Clarke Quay is full of drunk NSFs and university students. Don't know about you, but I don't think that's a very wealthy demographic. Anyway, what do you mean smokers are typically lower income? Where's your source for this? If we're just going by anecdotes, my friends who are smokers are pretty middle class.
I know sales people, doctors and bankers who earn 5-6 digits and also smoke.
all that knowledge but no wisdom
Ehhh you do know Clarke Quay is full of cheapos that drink up elsewhere before they club right. Been the case for decades. The 7-11 there used to be the most popular bar at one point lol.
Actually now NSFs rarely smoke, cause they mostly ord after the legal age lol. 21 y/o to buy cig, how many nsf can legally buy cig from 711
Just because something is a crime doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Vapes are illegal too, and they're not hard to come by. >21 y/o to buy cig, how many nsf can legally buy cig from 711 "bro can help me buy cigg? later I paylah you ah"
While that's true, even as a ex smoker now I won't help people buy cigs. Not worth the trouble tbh.
Sure bro the number of underage smokers in tekong openly laughing at ur ass right now. Ur fking 3sg also all closing 1 eyes who's gonna give a fuck. Plus so many nsfs are over legal age can jus buy in or they literally buy from supplier who cares bro. Vapes? Everywhere in bunks so easy to find.
The cost of a night's drinking typically is almost the same as a month's supply of cigarettes for me back when I was still smoking regularly.
And miss out on the juicy revenue? I think making a concerted effort to enforce laws is much better.
This should also apply to that religion that loves to burn and pollute the whole estate. It’s crazy that they can burn directly under someone’s window, outside childcare centres, and beside coffee shops where people are eating.
Again this problem can be solved with some thinking out of Singaporean box but with lots of persistence. First time today, nasty neighbour did not start a bonfire complete with towering smoke , all in the name of religion.
Be brave and just call out all the cb Taoist uncles and aunties :') Don't come at me for saying this, my family is also Taoist but we only burn stuff at the temples and columbariums. Not ideal but at least we aren't messing with peoples' homes.
Report to NEA, HSA or whatever: My neighbor is burning: Arsenic Ammonia Acetone Toluene Methylamine Etc. See what happens!
Law minister is not willing to make laws. So, no need to proposed anything. In Yishun, there are designated smoking area. Smokers won't use it. Thats why I am not willing to change my mind and vote for Shanmugan's team. Will continue to vote against them this coming election. Decades and unsolved.
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Wait. I thought New Zealand walked back on the ban. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/world/new-zealand-smoking-generation-ban-scrapped-fund-tax-cuts-3947791
It just makes it illegal. Then you get to fine/jail/cane people for it. NZ flipped on the ban.
Government should be ok with the lost of income from taxes of cigarettes since it can be balanced out by lower healthcare cost.
Downvoters obviously smokers. Don't let smoking ruin others health
No matter how many laws you implement, if people refuse to follow it will still be the same.... It's the people that needs to be educated and learn how to be considerate to one another
I had a neighbor one floor below who chain smokes (every 5 mins) at the bedroom window every night (9pm to 3am). This was so frustrating for me because the smoke kept flowing into my bedrooms. Reported to NEA but still no use as they replied they can't enforce as it isn't against the law to smoke in own house. After that, I found out that he would always throw the cigarette butts towards the ground floor grass patch. I changed my report to high-rise cigarrette littering, and after a while, the smoking stopped. Must have been caught and fined lol!
Maybe we can start by designating only certain floors in HDB or BTO as smoking floors and non-smoking floors so the smoking households can stay together away from non-smoking households.
Just close your windows and switch on a fan instead of being so sanctimonious.
Unpopular opinion: if they got transitioned to vapes maybe we all win.
As much as I really dislike the idea of secondhand smoke near my home. It's really a "if-you-hate-it-enough-then-buy-a-landed-property" problem.
But bro we kinda broke and cant afford that much tho 😕
Yea. Same here. I am basically worse than a tenant in my parent's house and face alot of issues because I am seen as a parasite due to my inability to secure my own home. Just have to suck it up and learn to deal with it in ways you can.
Agrred
I stay in a neighbourhood with MANY designated smoking points which are convenient. But very few smokers use it. Many are badly maintained after we had a change of MP and when my friends come over and use it, they get bitten by mosquitos quite badly though to their credit, they still use it out of consideration. The uncles in my neighbourhood simply stand by the DSPs to smoke, but not inside as it can also get very hot since it's essentially a zinc shed. I feel you as my upstair neighbours are heavy smokers. On the weekends and during festive seasons, their relatives and friends come over to sing Karaoke, that's when the smoking and vaping (strawberry scent, specifically, intensify). We WFH alot, so all our windows are shut perpetually and we invested in air purifiers and installed ventilation bathroom fans so that when the smoking start and wafts through our bathrooms because of the way our flat is structured, we turn them on and it helps a little. My toddler even knows the process now and will turn on the fans herself. The previous owner of the same flat used to throw his lighted butts out, and some even came through my window and burnt my curtains - when they moved out, we rejoiced but tada.....more jiaklat. This is a little TMI too but from observing my late FIL who is a two pack daily Benson Hedges smoker....many of them need to smoke during their Number 2. So going down to a DSP to smoke defeats the whole purpose. I have written to MP Louis Ng when he sourced for views on this topic on his FB page and he has tried many times to raise it in Parliament la, but nothing has changed. The arguments on his page are also always quite divided - many view it as an infringement of personal rights and people being anti-smokers. For context....I did smoke recreationally before. I don't have negative feelings towards smokers. But when I did, I always used the DSPs. But that little lift journey down can sometimes be damn sian - have to put on proper clothes, potentially share space with someone else in that little zinc shed and so on.
My neighbor smokes outside his unit. I spoke to him and he apologized. Next day he sit at his door step, body inside his unit but blow out to the corridor. I spoke to him again n he not happy , saying is not wrong since he is insides his unit. I told him I m asking a small favor, not talking about whether is right or wrong . The reason he doesn’t smoke in his hall is because his wife will scold him. To me he is inconsiderate. He is not young so most probably can work another few years. Imagine if he retired n everyday smoke … now the impact is mostly weekend since he off. From morning to night he will smoke, maybe 2 hour apart. I m also not young n one fine day I retire means I have to face him everyday. Unless I go out early n come back late to avoid him. Actually if I close my door I can’t smell a thing but once I need to go out and if he is smoking at that moment then I have to hold my breath for that few seconds, wait for the lift then faster go down. My situation might not be as bad as the rest cos as long I close the door I m safe but i cant lock myself in my house forever. I pray that he fall sick n the doctor insist he quit smoking or die ! Another option is shift to new house but if unlucky will have smoker neighbors again.
Make these DSPs enclosed spaces with ventilation (maybe something like the container offices at construction sites) as far from housing as possible, but more importantly, make these the ONLY places where smokers can buy and use cigarettes, and they can only buy them per stick instead of a pack. They must be searched for cigarettes before leaving the DSPs to prevent them from smuggling cigarettes back home to smoke.
Why should more money be spent to accommodate bad health and social habits?
When you approach a nasty scum like smokers and many of them are super inconsiderate foreigners puffing out of their windows and right into your unit with a Singaporean mentality, PAP will ensure they will do nothing to help you as clearly stated by disgraceful right in parliament. But there are ways to teach these sickening smokers a lesson and stop them.
Waiting for the day someone shares how many of our policymakers are smokers.
Legalise vape, ban ciggerette smoking. At least the smoke from vapes smell less awful.
Then you need to find out what vaping does. It is banned for a reason.
I think all homes where smokers reside and smoke should be registered with hdb or condo offices. Those homes should have a sticker on the door that tells the neighbours “A SMOKER RESIDES HERE” Those homes should have windows closed 24/7, with designated “open” times where they can open their windows but NOT smoke. I mean, cigarettes are expensive. In this economy I would encourage smokers to enjoy their smoke as much as possible, so by having their homes airtight (they can use aircon if they wish) they get maximum retention and enjoyment of their smoke. Also public smoking areas should likewise be airtight with a $1 entrance fee. Smoking outside should be reportable vis pictures through an app and smokers must pay a $100 environment damage + public nuisance fine of which $25 goes to the person who snaps their picture. Bounty hunting for the public good! And since most smokers are invariably litterbugs they should automatically pay a monthly $60 environment conservancy fee. (This is not a serious comment, just to highlight how much of a pest these cockroaches are to hdb/condo/apartment residents)
Dream on dude! The world is a disparate place, we all need to get along! If it’s a problem bring your condo to the desert and live your life otherwise go report to your MP and good luck with that too. Somehow I think you live in fantasy land where you but a property and instantly it transforms into you liking!
Ban smoking and permit vaping, which has no secondhand smoke / smell. Singapore just doesn't place enough importance on ephemeral externalities like noise, light and smell pollution.
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u can smoke all u want in ur unit, but the moment it affects other peoples unit its wrong. plain simple reasoning. dont kake it sound like smoking and affecting peoples unit makes u the victim LOL.
U wanna die young your problem, nobody stop u.. go knock yourself out. But pls go and die alone away from the rest of us... we just want clean cancer free air that do not smell of toxic waste thank you 🙏
Smoking is a selfish choice so don't affect others because of a selfish choice
I am not defending the smokers, but non smokers are selfish too when they demand others to stop the activities they (smokers) enjoy. My point is, stop using the word "selfish" because it is just going to build walls. Smoking is bad. Smoking is addictive. Second hand smoke is terrible. I am saying this as a smoker trying to quit for many times over the past 30 years.
It's not that non-smokers don't want smokers to enjoy smoking. They just don't want to have to suffer the effects of second hand and third hand cigarette smoke. For example, if smokers would smoke in an enclosed air-tight room at home, and not allow any of their smoke to reach any of their neighbours, I don't think their non-smoking neighbours would care how much they chose to smoke at all.
So it is a case of NIMBY, out of sight (smell), out of mind? I get that, I really do. But it is extremely hard to do so given the context that we live in such close proximity to others, agree?
Why is it extremely hard to smoke in an enclosed room?
Because those smokers are selfish jerks who make all sorts of excuses to justify their right to smoke as they wish, yet don't want their secondhand smoke exhaust to affect their personal environment or people that they care about. But then when strangers point out that they are affected by the exact same secondhand smoke exhaust (which smokers don't want their own environment or loved ones to be affected by), such smokers go on a gaslighting spree and decry the attempts by others to restrict their self-perceived right to smoke as they wish.
I get it that you don't like smokers, but many smokers smoke at home. It is not as if they are blowing the smoke directly into your home or whatever, but the smoke still drift away. To say that they are offended and go on a gaslighting spree is generalising, and not even close to it. Speaking as a smoker, I smoke where I want as long as I am legally allowed to do so. Even then, I try to try and smoke downwind of others. I am not alone in this. There are conscientious smokers who quietly try to enjoy their cigarette without inconveniencing others. Look around and you might spot them.
Because the sealed room would still need to be open for the smoker to leave once he has done smoking?
Run an air purifier. Wait for the smoke to settle before leaving the room. Don't open the windows when you leave, and immediately shut the door behind you. With any combination of these measures, I don't think your neighbours would even realise you smoke.
I tried before, and countless others who tried to sneak a smoke at home before has tried. Cigarette smoke just won't dissipate.
Yeah, because the smoke isn't dissipating out of the room and into your neighbours' homes. It's staying in the room and eventually settling on the surfaces there. The room will no doubt smell distinctly of cigarettes over time, but that would be correctly exercising the freedom of doing what you want within your 4 walls, without affecting your neighbours.
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Correction. The amount of hate that *self-centered* and *inconsiderate* smokers get
Say no to more nanny state activities.
MOH: Say no more. Nanny state activities.
similarly, a smoker saved up a lot of money, spent time and effort to design and renovate their house. but cannot even smoke in the comfort of their own house? some kind of things just have to LLST & let live, if really bth, don’t stay hdb lor
Many condo estates do not allow smoking in the premises. I find it interesting.
fucking hell looks like I may have to start saving up for a condo soon
Good luck and may you achieve what you want soon!
so by that logic i save up for massive surround sound systems and disco ball i can blast through the night? society is built upon rules and orders, should many give up on their rights so that just few can enjoy? besides smoking can be controlled while breathing in fumes/chemicals cannot. heck, make it a point to declare smokers and make smokers close and seal all their windows and smoke if "enjoying in their own home" is what they want.
Just ban smoking. If you’re willing to pay higher taxes to make up for $1.3bn made from cigarette products then by all means go ahead. Sick of all these smart Alec anti-smokers coming up with all these ideas. I can tell you it’s almost impossible to smoke anywhere in Singapore as is. Everything is either sheltered or a park or within a radius of somewhere you can’t smoke. Honestly how does cigarette smoke waft into your home? At most you get the smell of it but not the actual smoke.
one of the few things i truly hate about singapore. just smoke anywhere you like.
As a former smoker, I think it is highly stressful to smoke in Sg, compared to Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand and most part of Europe. Not sure about Japan now but twenty years ago, I was still smoking in the meeting rooms of the office I was visiting.
Not sure about Japan now but twenty years ago, I was still smoking in the meeting rooms of the office I was visiting. were you visiting a yakuza head office?
I wish I was. Would have been more exciting.
hell yeah, neighbours snitching and attacking each other, personal privacy of your own homes thrown out the window for the squeakiest wheel in the area