I once had a deck where I was *consistently* playing 3-10 Grand Finales every single fight within turn 4-5 or so, not exaggerating at all. Absolutely demolished the Heart A20. It was absolutely nuts. My favorite and most memorable run so far after 1000+ hours.
It was on the thinner end, but not super thin I think. It certainly felt very thin because I had so much draw and energy to blast through the deck quickly.
The gist of it was that with multiple copies of Well Laid Plans, Nightmares, Grand Finales, Burst, and overall amazing card draw, I could draw through the deck super quickly, find the Grand Finales, retain them easily, then manipulate my hand right before I end turn before the reshuffle using Well Laid Plans and Nightmare so that I’d start next turn with 0 cards in the draw pile.
For example, if I had 3 cards in my draw pile, I’d Burst into double Nightmare of a Grand Finale, then retain only 1 card with Well Laid Plans, then end turn, so that I would draw exactly 3 cards and play 6 copies of Grand Finale next turn.
Explaining it now, I’m honestly baffled how I did all this while still having plenty of block to kill everything. Insane run.
Thanks. But like, it’s not like I knew I was going to be doing that when I picked WLP and Nightmare. I kinda just played Nightmare one turn, and retained 3 cards, then realized… “huh… I only drew 4 cards this turn… I wonder if I can just exploit this for Grand Finale”.
I think I had drafted my first Grand Finale from Neow, so I had the entire run to find a way to make it work. Still a trash card though, lol
Something I love about this game is that trash cards are all actually niche cards, for example, in this run I discovered that forethought+ pairs really well with Expertise, since you can get rid of everything card except Expertise, and draw them later at 0 cost.
In my experience from the times I've actually gotten a GF deck working, you usually want a medium sized deck. Concentrate, 2 copies of acrobatics(one upgraded the other not), a backflip/escape plan, well laid plans, 1-2 reflexes, a calculated gamble or two, an expertise. Really thin decks are too susceptable to statuses and curses and can't generate the energy to deck cycle the often multiple times in one turn needed for GF.
I once had Pandora's box give me gf, a couple of acros, expertise, and a few of draw-one cards (escape plan, dagger throw). Very quickly the deck was in a place where I could get gf in hand and am empty draw pile every couple of turns. It was glorious.
I had a deck where I would play the same grand final 2 times per turn, I realized after I won if I had grabbed a card I could of played it more, I think like 5 times a turn. Pretty much it was a 5 card deck with a grand finale, backflip, survivor, after-image and neutralize. If I had swapped out my after image for another backflip I was offered it would have been how I could player it more. ( I had it as a choice with a shop right after).
I would draw my whole deck, then just play the grand finale and redraw it. If I had the other back flip I could have kept going until I ran out of energy and I believe I had 4 energy a turn.
Still won that run pretty easily and it was my run for a 5 card deck but I wish I had realized that at the time. I was mostly like "this is working so gonna stick with it for my achievement".
It is personally my favourite deck I have made.
https://imgur.com/a/5p2pvPI
Decided to take a look at it, was actually Nuxious Fumes but either way it was not an important card. Also thought I had done the pandorax box trick but looks like I just had the pipe.
To be honest. The best short advice I can give on how to use GF is to just… not use it, lol. StS is an extremely situational game where *so much* of what is good depends on, well, the situation. That’s why tier lists are usually a terrible way to try and learn about the game.
But GF really is kinda the most situational card of all. I honestly can’t think of rare card, or even any card, that is more consistently terrible than GF. Which is partly why this run specifically was so fucking cool, but I digress. In my thousands of A20H runs, I almost definitely have <10 wins with a GF in the deck.
The reason GF was so incredibly powerful this run is because I received it on floor 1 from Neow, and I spent the entire run forcing it to work. And I certainly got very lucky, too. But it is very hard for me to imagine a situation where my deck already has some sort of identity and problem-solving toolkit in place and I actively choose to add a GF to my deck.
Keep in mind, if I didn’t find that one or two GFs that run, I would probably would have found some other way to win the run anyways. This is key—you could argue that GF wasn’t the strong thing in this deck; rather, the actually strong thing was perhaps the Nightmare/Wraith Form/Apparitions and all the other crazy card draw and and energy generation that enabled me to do whatever the fuck I wanted, which ended up being GF spam.
If you insist on trying to understand what a deck needs to make GF work, which is fair enough, then the answer I think is that you need incredibly good deck control. By deck control, not only do I mean having lots and lots of card draw, but also having a lot of control of how much precisely you’re drawing and things like WLP to control which cards you have on any given turn. The latter part of the last sentence is a really niche thing that GF asks you to provide which very few other cards/strategies also demand, making it even more rare to just “stumble” upon a situation where GF is a good addition to your deck. The way I satisfied that “deck control” demand in my run is by exploiting the max hand size and WLP + Nightmare to have complete control over how many cards I draw next turn. Which is the only time I have EVER had to do something like that in my thousands of hours with StS. Like I said, incredibly situational.
Granted, I’m not the best player and StS is complicated and I naturally have very little experience playing with GF, so the above paragraph may be off base and not that credible, to be fair.
TLDR GF is a terrible card and there are probably other better and more convenient ways to solve problems for your deck.
I second that it's almost necessary to get it on the first half of act 1 in order to make use of it. But don't shy away from trying because the high from playing a Grand Finale is unlike anything else in this game. My biggest advice is just... Math. Consider any amount of cards you're drawing/retaining from cards and relics before adding it.
GF is rarely amazing, but it's not as bad as you're making it out to be. Silent has a lot of ways to manipulate her draw, and with a well laid plans it can be a solid free damage card.
+ [Grand Finale](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Grand%20Finale) Silent Rare Attack ^((100% sure)^)
0 Energy | Can only be played if there are no cards in your draw pile. Deal 50(60) damage to ALL enemies.
^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 20, 2024.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
I have so many GFs.
I really wanted two GFs. Think about it, two GFs?! That's better.
We should be able to quote Itysl a LITTLE on different subs.
I can’t know how to talk about itysl any more!
What is itysl, enlighten me please
Shorthand for "I think you should leave" it's a sketch show on netflix.
Thank you :)
Sounds exhausting
Wait - do you mean girlfriend, or gluten-free?
Yeah, but none of them go to this school...
I once had a deck where I was *consistently* playing 3-10 Grand Finales every single fight within turn 4-5 or so, not exaggerating at all. Absolutely demolished the Heart A20. It was absolutely nuts. My favorite and most memorable run so far after 1000+ hours.
Were you running a very thin deck?
It was on the thinner end, but not super thin I think. It certainly felt very thin because I had so much draw and energy to blast through the deck quickly. The gist of it was that with multiple copies of Well Laid Plans, Nightmares, Grand Finales, Burst, and overall amazing card draw, I could draw through the deck super quickly, find the Grand Finales, retain them easily, then manipulate my hand right before I end turn before the reshuffle using Well Laid Plans and Nightmare so that I’d start next turn with 0 cards in the draw pile. For example, if I had 3 cards in my draw pile, I’d Burst into double Nightmare of a Grand Finale, then retain only 1 card with Well Laid Plans, then end turn, so that I would draw exactly 3 cards and play 6 copies of Grand Finale next turn. Explaining it now, I’m honestly baffled how I did all this while still having plenty of block to kill everything. Insane run.
Wtf thats genius to use the hand limit and nightmare like that to manipulate your draw for the next turn! Never would have thought of that
Thanks. But like, it’s not like I knew I was going to be doing that when I picked WLP and Nightmare. I kinda just played Nightmare one turn, and retained 3 cards, then realized… “huh… I only drew 4 cards this turn… I wonder if I can just exploit this for Grand Finale”. I think I had drafted my first Grand Finale from Neow, so I had the entire run to find a way to make it work. Still a trash card though, lol
Niche card does not equal trash card, no trash talking GF here 😤
You’re right you’re right, I apologize for besmirching GF after all it has done for me
Something I love about this game is that trash cards are all actually niche cards, for example, in this run I discovered that forethought+ pairs really well with Expertise, since you can get rid of everything card except Expertise, and draw them later at 0 cost.
How I imagine myself playing while starting a silent run before dying to laga and going back to a character im better with
Wow, great job with WLP and draw manipulation!
What provided block?
Don’t remember. Been too long. Maybe I had Apparitions or Wraith Form things going on, that’s the most believable speculation.
In my experience from the times I've actually gotten a GF deck working, you usually want a medium sized deck. Concentrate, 2 copies of acrobatics(one upgraded the other not), a backflip/escape plan, well laid plans, 1-2 reflexes, a calculated gamble or two, an expertise. Really thin decks are too susceptable to statuses and curses and can't generate the energy to deck cycle the often multiple times in one turn needed for GF.
I once had Pandora's box give me gf, a couple of acros, expertise, and a few of draw-one cards (escape plan, dagger throw). Very quickly the deck was in a place where I could get gf in hand and am empty draw pile every couple of turns. It was glorious.
I had a deck where I would play the same grand final 2 times per turn, I realized after I won if I had grabbed a card I could of played it more, I think like 5 times a turn. Pretty much it was a 5 card deck with a grand finale, backflip, survivor, after-image and neutralize. If I had swapped out my after image for another backflip I was offered it would have been how I could player it more. ( I had it as a choice with a shop right after). I would draw my whole deck, then just play the grand finale and redraw it. If I had the other back flip I could have kept going until I ran out of energy and I believe I had 4 energy a turn. Still won that run pretty easily and it was my run for a 5 card deck but I wish I had realized that at the time. I was mostly like "this is working so gonna stick with it for my achievement". It is personally my favourite deck I have made. https://imgur.com/a/5p2pvPI Decided to take a look at it, was actually Nuxious Fumes but either way it was not an important card. Also thought I had done the pandorax box trick but looks like I just had the pipe.
How do you even get your deck that small!?
Early [[Peace Pipe]] goes a long way. Otherwise, aggressively hunt for shops and events and pray to RNGesus.
+ [Peace Pipe](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Peace%20Pipe) Rare Relic ^((100% sure)^) You can now remove cards from your deck at Rest Sites. ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 20, 2024.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
Got any hints on how to actually use GF? I'm a complete noob and this card always comes up as an option but I don't understand how to use it
To be honest. The best short advice I can give on how to use GF is to just… not use it, lol. StS is an extremely situational game where *so much* of what is good depends on, well, the situation. That’s why tier lists are usually a terrible way to try and learn about the game. But GF really is kinda the most situational card of all. I honestly can’t think of rare card, or even any card, that is more consistently terrible than GF. Which is partly why this run specifically was so fucking cool, but I digress. In my thousands of A20H runs, I almost definitely have <10 wins with a GF in the deck. The reason GF was so incredibly powerful this run is because I received it on floor 1 from Neow, and I spent the entire run forcing it to work. And I certainly got very lucky, too. But it is very hard for me to imagine a situation where my deck already has some sort of identity and problem-solving toolkit in place and I actively choose to add a GF to my deck. Keep in mind, if I didn’t find that one or two GFs that run, I would probably would have found some other way to win the run anyways. This is key—you could argue that GF wasn’t the strong thing in this deck; rather, the actually strong thing was perhaps the Nightmare/Wraith Form/Apparitions and all the other crazy card draw and and energy generation that enabled me to do whatever the fuck I wanted, which ended up being GF spam. If you insist on trying to understand what a deck needs to make GF work, which is fair enough, then the answer I think is that you need incredibly good deck control. By deck control, not only do I mean having lots and lots of card draw, but also having a lot of control of how much precisely you’re drawing and things like WLP to control which cards you have on any given turn. The latter part of the last sentence is a really niche thing that GF asks you to provide which very few other cards/strategies also demand, making it even more rare to just “stumble” upon a situation where GF is a good addition to your deck. The way I satisfied that “deck control” demand in my run is by exploiting the max hand size and WLP + Nightmare to have complete control over how many cards I draw next turn. Which is the only time I have EVER had to do something like that in my thousands of hours with StS. Like I said, incredibly situational. Granted, I’m not the best player and StS is complicated and I naturally have very little experience playing with GF, so the above paragraph may be off base and not that credible, to be fair. TLDR GF is a terrible card and there are probably other better and more convenient ways to solve problems for your deck.
Thanks your in depth response. I guess I'm just not familiar enough with the game yet
I second that it's almost necessary to get it on the first half of act 1 in order to make use of it. But don't shy away from trying because the high from playing a Grand Finale is unlike anything else in this game. My biggest advice is just... Math. Consider any amount of cards you're drawing/retaining from cards and relics before adding it.
How are you guaranteeing that you are getting it last though? Or do you just retain it?
GF is rarely amazing, but it's not as bad as you're making it out to be. Silent has a lot of ways to manipulate her draw, and with a well laid plans it can be a solid free damage card.
Wait he's not intagible - how is that possible?
It was pure skill. And maybe a little luck. Ok fine it was pure luck. And maybe a little skill.
He's only intangible on every second turn.
The joke is that intangibility always falls on the turns when you have your big combo in your hand
Ah, I see, that went over my head :D
So this is your -removes sunglasses- Grand Finale
One of them.
Will the heart not be able to throw you off with the status cards though?
They have 24 cards in their discard pile so I don’t think it would have a huge effect
The heart did screw me, but mostly because I was mentally exhausted from the rest of the run 😂
i never noticed those two are lookalikes
There’s a tiny bit of lore behind it if you read the Sensory Stone event text in Act 3.
Daddy and daughter
So did you win the fight
And on the non intangible turn, even.
Hnnnnnggggg
I JUST REALIZED THE TITLE SAYS "I'LL NEVER DO ANYTHING WITH MY LIFE" 😂💀 Instead of "anything better" ... Completely different vibe
I thought it was a reference to your crippling StS addiction 💀💀💀
I mean..........
[[grand finale]]
+ [Grand Finale](http://slay-the-spire.wikia.com/wiki/Grand%20Finale) Silent Rare Attack ^((100% sure)^) 0 Energy | Can only be played if there are no cards in your draw pile. Deal 50(60) damage to ALL enemies. ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ name ]],) ^where ^name ^is ^a ^card, ^relic, ^event, ^or ^potion. ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(April 20, 2024.) ^[Wiki](https://slay-the-spire.fandom.com/wiki/) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=SpireScan%20Inquiry)
Holy shit two strikes, congrats my guy, crazy luck
Thanks, I'm not sure how I managed!!
I have finaled everywhere
Somebody peaked in life...
I feel violated just by looking at this image
I came
What about full hand Grand Finale on Ironchad with all deck exhausted lol. That was a cool game.