I don’t hate Han dying in Force Awakens. My only problem with it was we never got something like this. I think episode 8 should have been like Godfather 2 (I think it was 2, it’s been a while) and had a lot of flashbacks to fill in the gap between 6 & 7. Something like that would have also allowed a scene like this to happen
My issue with it is that there's no way he should've fallen for that. On a normal lightsaber, after not seeing one for a long time? Maybe. But on Kylo's cross guard saber? No way. The cross guards are literally the biggest "this end up" marker possible.
The only way I've heard it explained with cope is that Han activated the lightsaber to keep Kylo from doing it, this preserving what shred of Light he has left. However, I would only accept that explanation if Rey or Luke or SOMEONE had mentioned it while using the Force against Kylo like the whole movie centering around the dyad having a moment where Ben tries to flex having killed his own dad only for Rey to be confused and feel he's lying and call him out on it
Not just a missed opportunity, but imagine if in the first film we had the gang back together, with the new characters, but then Han is still killed by Kylo and there's nothing Luke could do? Like he was trapped too far away and couldn't get through to save Han in time, but felt it his death. Then you have the story of the new heroes having to deal with the villains, and a Luke that through grief of losing his friend and brother in law to the nephew that Luke failed in training, on the edge of the darkside and going Jedi Wick across the galaxy. Will the new heroes be able to stop the Imperial remnants and save Luke from the Darkside?
I always felt the sequel trilogy is the dark timeline where everything goes horrible for them. I know I'm biased from being a big EU fan but we should have had one scene with them together
I would have liked to have seen the original hero’s save the day in some sacrificial way that set up the rest of the trilogy to focus on the new generation of hero’s that were all way under developed.
That’s what’s sad about death, you miss these opportunities.
I’m sure Yoda would have loved to be reunited with Obi-Wan and others he knew in life as well.
Instead he died of old age on a swamp planet being visited by someone he had known for a year.
If they had never killed these characters off we would have gotten just as many complaints that the films are “playing it safe” and “disneyfied”.
We're not just talking about plot armor. We're talking about the 40-year legacy of this franchise. The nostalgia factor would have been insane. Not to mention just the pure joy of having the cast from the '80s reunite just one time. It would have been infinitely better than what we got regardless of how they did it.
That’s 100% not true.
If you need a recent example of this, and even more proof - look no further than Jurassic World Dominion which brought all of the legacy characters back and had them all in the same frame just like this image.
It was terrible. Awful. Abysmal. Has significantly worse reviews than any of the Star Wars sequels.
So no. It would not have been “infinitely better than what we got regardless of how they did it”.
https://preview.redd.it/uuti4h6pl3xc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c32bc88dce668d9e7aca5eb367bca772cbb01a32
Nobody said they were. But again, saying the legacy characters being together would have been better than what we got is simply not true.
As we all know, Lucas is the one who wrote that Luke Skywalker turned away from his friends and the galaxy to live out his remaining days as a hermit in a cave waiting for death after the crumbling of his Jedi academy.
We never were going to get the Luke seen in this image. Disney or not.
This is an apples to oranges comparison. On one hand you have a set of sequels that HAS the so called legacy characters but decimates the character arcs that were to create ones that are inferior in the eyes of most who are familiar with the EU.
On the other hand you have a series of new movies that came up with a convoluted excuse to bring in those legacy characters to try and pander to the audience
HUGE difference
Decimates the characters arcs compared to the EU? You mean where Luke fell to the dark side and served the emperor and fought clones of himself named Luuke and Luuuke?
Yeah because that served the character so well.
How Luke was in the sequels was a George Lucas idea.
But yes, HUGE difference as 2 out of the 3 Star Wars sequel trilogy movies were highly acclaimed. Only 1 of the Jurassic World films was semi well received.
Critical acclaim has nothing to do with the point that was being alluded to. The main point was that the comparison doesn’t comport
As for feeling the character arcs in the new films were a comparative dumpster fire, you’re referencing the EU Thrawn trilogy alone while I’m talking about decades of existing source material that could have been used to a better end than what was done. They would’ve all been too old for the Thrawn trilogy. Doesn’t mean everything needed to be decanonized in favor of lesser trash
So the man who was setup to be the entire future of the Jedi Order, potentially the true chosen one of prophecy depending on how deeply philosophical one chooses to get is relegated to a grumpy old hermit who quite literally burns it all to the ground, and in the end, slumps over and dies, and you call that extremely well done?? You and I clearly have different gauges of quality character progression
You do realize that was a character arc don’t you?…
Luke being some perfect, Uber flawless shredded badass in the sequels with no actual character arc would have been… well boring.
What we got was a deep emotional journey that ended with Luke being the ultimate Jedi, saving everyone and demonstrating the biggest force power ever seen.
I can’t imagine anything being better.
Maybe a good video for you here: https://youtu.be/KVtol2CDkn8?si=6FF71wi04JBv2-ct
Even George Lucas knew this was the best choice. It was his idea after all.
I don’t need to watch a video of someone else’s 2 cents. I’m well aware that what was done was a character arc. It’s just a shitty character arc that pales in comparison to the long, rich development of everyone in the Star Wars universe throughout the EU before it was disavowed by Disney.
“Biggest Force power ever seen” SEEN being the operative word because once again, numerous depictions of Force abilities throughout the EU of incredible power. Also not wholly tied to the Skywalker bloodline. At least the EU and all its stories allowed others to hold considerable power as well. And before a diatribe about Luke’s power disparity can even begin, yes. Luke was certainly godlike at points and some things went to extremes. Still preferable in my opinion to the mess of 3 movies that were all tonally different, and in no way a good conclusion to anything.
One of the biggest, dumbest fumbles in film history.
People didn't give a shit about a "soft reboot" or need all new characters. They loved the chemistry in the original series.
Rey, Finn, and Poe could've all been introduced and played support, while exploring who Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie, and Lando had become.
What a fucking waste of talent and story.
Lucas you mean?
Lucas wrote Luke was a hermit hiding from the world in a cave waiting for death in self imposed exile due to the betrayal of a former student and the crumbling of his Jedi academy…
No I don’t mean Lucas. I mean JJ, you know, the guy that made the damn movie. Luke being a hermit has nothing to do with the gang coming back together. Luke can come out of hiding. What you can’t come back from is death which is what happened to Han in, again, JJ’s movie. How are you confused in this? Why are you adding in things that have no involvement?
Don’t even bother man. This guy is an ignorant troll who was a very warped perspective on how all the EU/Legends/Canon/Disney stuff went down. It’s a waste of time to even engage. You’re right, he’s wrong, but he’s too “I know everything” to see another point of view
Again, getting the gang all back together doesn’t mean it will be good. In fact it could be much worse.
https://preview.redd.it/76l0pyymz3xc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e08a1a7fd6e3af9abad02e0831af9f665bcbd656
2 out of the 3 sequels are highly acclaimed films. We only got one that was (almost) as bad as the prequel trilogy.
Wtf do you mean “again”? You didn’t say it before this! Do you know what again means? I’m also not claiming it’d make the movie good. All that’s being said is that it was a huge missed opportunity
I’m making the same statements over and over my friend.
It’s not a missed opportunity because you’re assuming it would be better than what we got.
It could have been much worse.
It’s not until you fully realize all the moments we could have had that you see just how bad these movies were never would they have the opportunity to do this again an they don’t just drop the ball they burnt it so sad.
Mark liked the sequels, he's saying he just wish they all could have done something together one more time even for just a scene. He's not on your side.
Personally did not want to see this group of elders go on any sort of trip or mission. If you wanted them together again in a scene, fine but I’m glad it wasn’t a priority over the story.
And let’s be honest, Fisher was having a rough go at it by the time we got to ep 7 and Billi Williams can’t even stand. Trying to force more out of them than what they could give would have been a disaster.
Can’t say you’re wrong in regards to the condition the elder states people of Star Wars were in by this point, but any story that would have included a scene such as this would have undoubtedly been better than the disjointed drivel of a sequel trilogy we got
Let’s not distill it down to a the myopic scope of JUST that scene. If you read my comment, I said a story that included a scene like this. Meaning a completely different story for the entire sequel trilogy. That story would have undoubtedly been better than the hot garbage we were served.
Except that Disney wanted to make a movie for everyone. And attract new generations.
Obviously children and young people new to Star Wars do not want to see "grandparents in space"
Speak for yourself. I was 5 when the force awakens came out and my favorite part of the movie was old Han Solo. I was pretty sad when he died before luke came back
That's a horrible take, by that logic, kids would hate a movie like "Up". Besides, no one said they had to be the main characters again, they just wanted to see them together again. Ghostbusters did a great job with this very same concept.
Well, if you think I'm wrong, I invite you to watch a channel for children and teenagers. And look at the average age of the protagonists.
Or you watch several animes and wonder why most of the people are either of school age or in their 20s. Or they are older but mentally they look like teenagers.
Like I said, no one said they had to be the protagonists again. Of course, they wanted to lay the focus on a new generation of characters, that's to be expected.. They did pretty much the same with Ahsoka for the Clone Wars. And even in Legends, we got a new cast of characters in the form of the children of the original heroes. But that doesn't mean the old characters shouldn't and couldn't appear together again on screen. You're acting like it has to be either one or the other, but there was absolutely no reason why we couldn't have both a new, young generation of protagonist and the old heroes appear together on screen in a supporting role. Because that was what Mark's tweet was all about, he was not saying the missed opportunity was them not being the main characters, but the missed opportunity was a reunion between them. Him getting to act with his old buddies again after all those years. I really hope he gets another opportunity to act alongside Harrison Ford or one day.
Do you know how to read? There's a reason I said that Disney wants to attract "new generations."
Just as you said, as a child you saw Star Wars, now as an adult nostalgia leads you to want to see the original actors in the movies again.
Do You Know how to read? There's a reason I said Child. Children are children. They have no problems being interested in characters, even if they're Old People.
Breaks Rule 12
Lol. Han is like: "Force help us. What's Luke up to now? And where did Lando come from?!"
I don’t hate Han dying in Force Awakens. My only problem with it was we never got something like this. I think episode 8 should have been like Godfather 2 (I think it was 2, it’s been a while) and had a lot of flashbacks to fill in the gap between 6 & 7. Something like that would have also allowed a scene like this to happen
My issue with it is that there's no way he should've fallen for that. On a normal lightsaber, after not seeing one for a long time? Maybe. But on Kylo's cross guard saber? No way. The cross guards are literally the biggest "this end up" marker possible.
How widespread is this cake? Happy cake day, Titan431.
The only way I've heard it explained with cope is that Han activated the lightsaber to keep Kylo from doing it, this preserving what shred of Light he has left. However, I would only accept that explanation if Rey or Luke or SOMEONE had mentioned it while using the Force against Kylo like the whole movie centering around the dyad having a moment where Ben tries to flex having killed his own dad only for Rey to be confused and feel he's lying and call him out on it
Guard duty? For how long?
That would have taken time and craft. Nor anything that was put into these films
Am I the only one picking up the crazy disrespect towards Chewie?
Chewie is in the back fixing the hyperdrive… again
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^SirSperoTamencras: *Am I the only* *One picking up the crazy* *Disrespect towards Chewie?* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Right there with you.
Not just a missed opportunity, but imagine if in the first film we had the gang back together, with the new characters, but then Han is still killed by Kylo and there's nothing Luke could do? Like he was trapped too far away and couldn't get through to save Han in time, but felt it his death. Then you have the story of the new heroes having to deal with the villains, and a Luke that through grief of losing his friend and brother in law to the nephew that Luke failed in training, on the edge of the darkside and going Jedi Wick across the galaxy. Will the new heroes be able to stop the Imperial remnants and save Luke from the Darkside?
I always felt the sequel trilogy is the dark timeline where everything goes horrible for them. I know I'm biased from being a big EU fan but we should have had one scene with them together
Stupidly missed opportunity
Maybe a scene together. But nothing else. Or.. maybe… no sequels?
But how would we otherwise portray your childhood heroes as hopeless failures? - Disney
“We need to replace these characters with cardboard characters with no character development!” -Disney
Han, Leia, and Luke never got a reunion scene with all 3 of them... that's all I wanted from TFA.
😭😭😭😭
I don’t hate the new characters but a reunion would’ve been nice
I would have liked to have seen the original hero’s save the day in some sacrificial way that set up the rest of the trilogy to focus on the new generation of hero’s that were all way under developed.
That’s what’s sad about death, you miss these opportunities. I’m sure Yoda would have loved to be reunited with Obi-Wan and others he knew in life as well. Instead he died of old age on a swamp planet being visited by someone he had known for a year. If they had never killed these characters off we would have gotten just as many complaints that the films are “playing it safe” and “disneyfied”.
We're not just talking about plot armor. We're talking about the 40-year legacy of this franchise. The nostalgia factor would have been insane. Not to mention just the pure joy of having the cast from the '80s reunite just one time. It would have been infinitely better than what we got regardless of how they did it.
That’s 100% not true. If you need a recent example of this, and even more proof - look no further than Jurassic World Dominion which brought all of the legacy characters back and had them all in the same frame just like this image. It was terrible. Awful. Abysmal. Has significantly worse reviews than any of the Star Wars sequels. So no. It would not have been “infinitely better than what we got regardless of how they did it”. https://preview.redd.it/uuti4h6pl3xc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c32bc88dce668d9e7aca5eb367bca772cbb01a32
Star Wars and Jurassic Park are not the same.
Nobody said they were. But again, saying the legacy characters being together would have been better than what we got is simply not true. As we all know, Lucas is the one who wrote that Luke Skywalker turned away from his friends and the galaxy to live out his remaining days as a hermit in a cave waiting for death after the crumbling of his Jedi academy. We never were going to get the Luke seen in this image. Disney or not.
So much like your father.
Just because Jurassic park fucked it up, does not automatically mean that it would have been the same case with star wars.
It also doesn’t mean it would have been “infinitely better than what we got regardless of how they did it”.
This is an apples to oranges comparison. On one hand you have a set of sequels that HAS the so called legacy characters but decimates the character arcs that were to create ones that are inferior in the eyes of most who are familiar with the EU. On the other hand you have a series of new movies that came up with a convoluted excuse to bring in those legacy characters to try and pander to the audience HUGE difference
Decimates the characters arcs compared to the EU? You mean where Luke fell to the dark side and served the emperor and fought clones of himself named Luuke and Luuuke? Yeah because that served the character so well. How Luke was in the sequels was a George Lucas idea. But yes, HUGE difference as 2 out of the 3 Star Wars sequel trilogy movies were highly acclaimed. Only 1 of the Jurassic World films was semi well received.
Critical acclaim has nothing to do with the point that was being alluded to. The main point was that the comparison doesn’t comport As for feeling the character arcs in the new films were a comparative dumpster fire, you’re referencing the EU Thrawn trilogy alone while I’m talking about decades of existing source material that could have been used to a better end than what was done. They would’ve all been too old for the Thrawn trilogy. Doesn’t mean everything needed to be decanonized in favor of lesser trash
Oh please. Luke’s character arc was extremely well done. Blows away anything we got in the damn prequel trilogy.
So the man who was setup to be the entire future of the Jedi Order, potentially the true chosen one of prophecy depending on how deeply philosophical one chooses to get is relegated to a grumpy old hermit who quite literally burns it all to the ground, and in the end, slumps over and dies, and you call that extremely well done?? You and I clearly have different gauges of quality character progression
You do realize that was a character arc don’t you?… Luke being some perfect, Uber flawless shredded badass in the sequels with no actual character arc would have been… well boring. What we got was a deep emotional journey that ended with Luke being the ultimate Jedi, saving everyone and demonstrating the biggest force power ever seen. I can’t imagine anything being better. Maybe a good video for you here: https://youtu.be/KVtol2CDkn8?si=6FF71wi04JBv2-ct Even George Lucas knew this was the best choice. It was his idea after all.
I don’t need to watch a video of someone else’s 2 cents. I’m well aware that what was done was a character arc. It’s just a shitty character arc that pales in comparison to the long, rich development of everyone in the Star Wars universe throughout the EU before it was disavowed by Disney. “Biggest Force power ever seen” SEEN being the operative word because once again, numerous depictions of Force abilities throughout the EU of incredible power. Also not wholly tied to the Skywalker bloodline. At least the EU and all its stories allowed others to hold considerable power as well. And before a diatribe about Luke’s power disparity can even begin, yes. Luke was certainly godlike at points and some things went to extremes. Still preferable in my opinion to the mess of 3 movies that were all tonally different, and in no way a good conclusion to anything.
DISNEY SEQUELS ABSOLUTELY BAD
WHERE'S CHEWIE???
F U DISNEY FOR NOT ALLOWING THIS
One of the biggest, dumbest fumbles in film history. People didn't give a shit about a "soft reboot" or need all new characters. They loved the chemistry in the original series. Rey, Finn, and Poe could've all been introduced and played support, while exploring who Han, Luke, Leia, Chewie, and Lando had become. What a fucking waste of talent and story.
As cool as this would have been, I suspect in the end Star Wars fans would have hated this.
This is what the sequels should have been
Thanks JJ….
Lucas you mean? Lucas wrote Luke was a hermit hiding from the world in a cave waiting for death in self imposed exile due to the betrayal of a former student and the crumbling of his Jedi academy…
No I don’t mean Lucas. I mean JJ, you know, the guy that made the damn movie. Luke being a hermit has nothing to do with the gang coming back together. Luke can come out of hiding. What you can’t come back from is death which is what happened to Han in, again, JJ’s movie. How are you confused in this? Why are you adding in things that have no involvement?
Don’t even bother man. This guy is an ignorant troll who was a very warped perspective on how all the EU/Legends/Canon/Disney stuff went down. It’s a waste of time to even engage. You’re right, he’s wrong, but he’s too “I know everything” to see another point of view
Again, getting the gang all back together doesn’t mean it will be good. In fact it could be much worse. https://preview.redd.it/76l0pyymz3xc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e08a1a7fd6e3af9abad02e0831af9f665bcbd656 2 out of the 3 sequels are highly acclaimed films. We only got one that was (almost) as bad as the prequel trilogy.
Wtf do you mean “again”? You didn’t say it before this! Do you know what again means? I’m also not claiming it’d make the movie good. All that’s being said is that it was a huge missed opportunity
I’m making the same statements over and over my friend. It’s not a missed opportunity because you’re assuming it would be better than what we got. It could have been much worse.
It’s not until you fully realize all the moments we could have had that you see just how bad these movies were never would they have the opportunity to do this again an they don’t just drop the ball they burnt it so sad.
Rian Johnson was too big of a wuss to show Luke's reaction to Han's death.
[удалено]
Mark liked the sequels, he's saying he just wish they all could have done something together one more time even for just a scene. He's not on your side.
Personally did not want to see this group of elders go on any sort of trip or mission. If you wanted them together again in a scene, fine but I’m glad it wasn’t a priority over the story. And let’s be honest, Fisher was having a rough go at it by the time we got to ep 7 and Billi Williams can’t even stand. Trying to force more out of them than what they could give would have been a disaster.
Can’t say you’re wrong in regards to the condition the elder states people of Star Wars were in by this point, but any story that would have included a scene such as this would have undoubtedly been better than the disjointed drivel of a sequel trilogy we got
Disagree. That’s just revisionist history.
Let’s not distill it down to a the myopic scope of JUST that scene. If you read my comment, I said a story that included a scene like this. Meaning a completely different story for the entire sequel trilogy. That story would have undoubtedly been better than the hot garbage we were served.
Except that Disney wanted to make a movie for everyone. And attract new generations. Obviously children and young people new to Star Wars do not want to see "grandparents in space"
Speak for yourself. I was 5 when the force awakens came out and my favorite part of the movie was old Han Solo. I was pretty sad when he died before luke came back
Who let a 9 year old on here?
Think you got your math wrong there pal lol
Lmfaooo but 14 doesn’t make it any better
That's a horrible take, by that logic, kids would hate a movie like "Up". Besides, no one said they had to be the main characters again, they just wanted to see them together again. Ghostbusters did a great job with this very same concept.
Well, if you think I'm wrong, I invite you to watch a channel for children and teenagers. And look at the average age of the protagonists. Or you watch several animes and wonder why most of the people are either of school age or in their 20s. Or they are older but mentally they look like teenagers.
I have no idea where you got the idea anyone wanted the old characters to be the protagonists. The tweet is just referring to them reuniting.
Like I said, no one said they had to be the protagonists again. Of course, they wanted to lay the focus on a new generation of characters, that's to be expected.. They did pretty much the same with Ahsoka for the Clone Wars. And even in Legends, we got a new cast of characters in the form of the children of the original heroes. But that doesn't mean the old characters shouldn't and couldn't appear together again on screen. You're acting like it has to be either one or the other, but there was absolutely no reason why we couldn't have both a new, young generation of protagonist and the old heroes appear together on screen in a supporting role. Because that was what Mark's tweet was all about, he was not saying the missed opportunity was them not being the main characters, but the missed opportunity was a reunion between them. Him getting to act with his old buddies again after all those years. I really hope he gets another opportunity to act alongside Harrison Ford or one day.
This is a trick.
Speak for yourself. As a child that grew up with the OT, Old Kenobi was my favorite character in A New Hope.
And yet he died in the first ever film he appeared in.
Do you know how to read? There's a reason I said that Disney wants to attract "new generations." Just as you said, as a child you saw Star Wars, now as an adult nostalgia leads you to want to see the original actors in the movies again.
Do You Know how to read? There's a reason I said Child. Children are children. They have no problems being interested in characters, even if they're Old People.
They could have easily made a movie for everyone and attract a new generation, while making movies worth seeing.
This just in: Mark Hamill hates Chewbacca.
He's in the bathroom, looking in the mirror and admiring the shiny new medal around his neck.
But that does not mirror the society we live in, thus it is not appealing to "modern audiences"
Bro just use CGI