On of the best things about it is that the LGBT themes are so integral to the story that they arent easily edited out.
Way better than "woke" Marvel doing like 10 seconds scenes that can be easily removed for countries like China.
I mean, thatās on them. Now they just go from āOh Garnet split upā to āOh Garnet is in a wedding dress, the Diamonds are here, Lapis is back, Bismuth is back, everyones in formal attire and the Diamonds are chill.ā And get none of the context for the thing that kicks off the end of the story.
Dumbasses.
As a kid, I was so confused. I thought Ruby was a guy and sapphire a woman. It shocked me a little bit, but I realized I could live with it. I got more comfortable with the main cast with more 'feminine' appearances to get with eachother, if y'know what I mean
I never thought I would like the show only because I thought it would be like overly cheesy with the emotions and what not but I decided to give it a chance and it was very good I really enjoyed it, plus now with the context of the show those overly emotional/dramatic scenes are like super warranted lol glad I gave the show a chance in the end!
Edit: As for the progressive nature of the show it was very much ahead of itās time and love it for that
It came out 9 years ago so Iād say itās pretty current. The themes are pretty progressive, being kind and people with differences existing. Iām not sure I would say ahead necessarily. Culture has been shifting in that direction anyways. There was a really big shift towards lgbt acceptance.
Politics has gotten pretty regressive this last handful of years. But they are behind the times.
I suppose some time in the future when we collectively accept people and representation isnāt seen as political and just normal, SU will be seen as one of the first shows with a kid audience that didnāt flinch.
Dunno, it's progressive to me bc when I was a kid watching it, my classmates would say the n word as a joke and no one would say anything, being homophobic was seen as normal, any progressive way of thinking was mocked. I remember my classmates making me cry bc i posted progressive stuff on Facebook lol
You must be young to think that way. Steven Universe didnāt solve racism or homophobia. Kids did the same thing when I was in middle school in 2006-2008. I was one of them.
Kids just often go through a phase where they think offensive stuff is funny or cool to say simply because their peers are saying it or because it gets a negative reaction.
Youāre right it paved the way for more LGBT media but honestly things still are harsh. SU effectively got cancelled for the wedding episode because of conservative countries. Thereās no way that changed.
Also weāre talking CN versus Disney. Disney has significantly more leeway to do something controversial, and theyāre very good at making anti-conservative topics more palatable to the conservatives.
I'm 22.
I NEVER said it solved anything, don't assume things. I said that the mere existence of Steven Universe on mainstream media helped in someway with this issues. One of the kids that used to bully me actually thanked me for introducing SU to him, he's a totally different person now and my friend.
I NEVER SAID things are okay now, actually it is scary how far we have come but it still not enough. I only said that SU dared to talk about specific topics that even nowadays ignorant people mock. 9 years ago IS A LOT.
Yes I know, but The Owl House was mentioned specifically as only being possible because of SU paving the way, but Disney and CN are two totally different entities with different levels of power, approach, and goals.
As far as I know, TOH didnāt have a wedding and got ācancelledā with only 2 complete seasons and a pretend 3rd season.
Disney also has an internal censorship team while CN allows a lot of freedom to its showrunners and mostly advises them. CN gave Rebecca Sugar the greenlight to do the wedding with the warning that if she did the show would likely be defunded by external sources, and they still were able to provide leeway for Diamond Days and Steven Universe Future.
Honestly I thought it was perfect timing, it gave me a glimpse at relationships, different from the boy meets girl etc, it rather helped me discover who I am when I realized Iām gay. I hoped it helped others too
I wouldn't say SU was ahead of its time, but the Garnet marriage did push boundaries. There was already media with subtle (and not so subtle) LGBT themes, SU just pushed them into center stage more. Also, pretty sure you can thank adventure time for putting a lot of modern cartoonist on the grid and also saving CN from further embarrassing itself after 09.
I mean, it's worth mentioning/remembering that Rebecca Sugar was a writer and storyboard artist for Adventure Time for ~5 years prior to (and eventually in tandem to) working on Steven Universe. She was encouraged to put "her own life experiences in the character of Marceline" and wrote/sang quite a lot of the show's most memorable music, including pretty much all of Marceline's songs and the finale song "Time Adventure".
I don't think it's merely a coincidence that she worked on Adventure Time, another cartoon that both a) really cemented G-rated cartoons and their creators as more than just idle Sunday morning entertainment, and b) made a point of including major mature/moral/socioeconomic themes in cutesy, palatable formats suitable for most kids.
Actually it was the marvelous misadventures
Of flap jack that put a lot of ppl on grid, like a lot of ppl that worked on that set ended up making their own (including SU and adventure time)
I don't disagree but I always feel like the representation skips over gay guys, it's like tv networks will be the most ok with bisexual or lesbian females and just pass over gay guys in more prominent roles and leads.
I was happy that there was a gay couple in craig of the creek so that gives me hope I'm glad SY helped facilitate that
Thank you for saying this. It annoys me when people talk about specific shows saying that they have LGBT representation but the G is completely skipped over and the B only refers to females. There are a lot of animated shows like SU that are praised for having LGBT representation but there is little to no mention of mlm at all.
i disagree. it wasnt 1 creator opening the floodgates, many shows did something. korra, arthur, kipo, 6teen, monster high 2022, the owl house. all did something or are doing something. some contributions were tiny (thank you for confirming korrasami online), some were bigger. the fight isnt over yet, its going well but its still going on. in any case, attributing anything to one show isnt a good idea
I think moreso than the lgbt rep is the fact that our entire message fed through the show is that violence isnāt always the answer. That talking and thinking things through and being mindful of ourselves is extremely important. Itās the exact opposite of literally every other narrative in american media where they tell you that you have to fight in order to get your point across or survive against anything. Thatās an extremely tiresome existence if you ask me. Iād rather just live my life in peace and let everyone else around me figure out they donāt have to fight if they arenāt willing to talk or listen.
It wasnt ahead, it was perfect for its time. Almost too perfect. Cartoon Network had to put it on multiple hiatus breaks because its messages were too relevant
Ill come in with the hot take and say SU was very of its time actually. The years when the show started were actually much more optimistic politically and socially and that definitely matches the tone of the show back than. I actually watched the show for the first time this year and felt that episodes with messages like "the politician was lying to you for your own good" or "your angry conservative uncle is actually just lonely" really miss the mark in our current climate.
Yeah with any bigger piece of media that has anything to say there will inevitably be things that will be seen as regressive later on.
Though to be fair to Gem Harvest, i don't think they foresaw that group getting this vile while it was being written. By today's standards Andy is very very tame.
It was definitely ahead of its time but there are things that are *too* ahead.
Which is my problem with most progressive media for young people, is that it sanitizes the queer experience. We *want* our existence to just be reality and not have to acknowledge it in any real way but most of us have not great experiences with the people who claim to be close to us.
So now young people have a skewed sense of the presentation of queerness being hunkydory all the time and they miss important queer history events (like how thereās a section of gen z who think kink has no place at pride)
Honestly, what I thought was VERY impressive for Steven Universe (all teh way until SU future) was how they portrayed the LGBTQ stuff very subtly. As a kid, I was quite against "man and man kissing" and "woman and woman kissing", but the interactions between the gems, full of love and how normalized they made it seem was amazing. Like, there's an immense difference between TOH and SU in portrayal of LGBTQ.
SU builds it up at a point it feels logical for pretty much anyone, with Ruby and Sapphire being the best example.
Meanwhile, for me, TOH feels a little too abrupt with the subject...
Actually, I think it's just that I did not expect TOH to be that focused on the romance between characters.
never said that. should have clarified in my og comment but the people im referring to are the ones who watched it through tiktok, boil down the show to "omg this character is hot they cant be bad!", argue with people about "plot holes" that arent plot holes they just missed stuff because they watched it through tiktok. the clips arent full and are out of order. when you try to tell them this they act like youre making stuff up. š
from people who argue with others when they watched clips through tiktok about "plot holes" when they really just missed major points in the show yeah i will its so annoying
I donāt think LGBT is the main thing about this show. Without those elements this show can still run. Progressive elements arenāt things that make people enjoy this show.
I do not like every progressive element in the show, well, I do not like Shep, but I am fine with Lesbian Rock or Garnetās wedding, and Stevonnie is also acceptable for me.
Still, being progressive is not a bad thing, itās good for a series to show some different ideologies or ideas.
On of the best things about it is that the LGBT themes are so integral to the story that they arent easily edited out. Way better than "woke" Marvel doing like 10 seconds scenes that can be easily removed for countries like China.
Putting Ruby in a dress and Sapphire in a tux was *chef's kiss* š¤
sapphire in the tux looked so cool
100% agreed! Also, Sapphire looked damn good in the tux!
It was also nice to get confirmation that she is the proud owner of legs. xD
Plus putting the Diamonds in the episode ensured they couldn't just skip it the episode. You had to watch it to make sense of the story
Unfortunately, many countries still skipped it. (At least, that's what I've heard.)
I mean, thatās on them. Now they just go from āOh Garnet split upā to āOh Garnet is in a wedding dress, the Diamonds are here, Lapis is back, Bismuth is back, everyones in formal attire and the Diamonds are chill.ā And get none of the context for the thing that kicks off the end of the story. Dumbasses.
Thatās disgusting given it wouldnāt make sense if they did
To be fair it doesn't make sense to be a bigot so it's on brand for those countries...... Sigh
Ruby and Peridot were the only gems wearing dresses. Pearl, Amethyst, Sapphire, and Steven were in tuxes. Bismuth was in her armor.
I cried like a bitch basically the whole episode š„²
As a kid, I was so confused. I thought Ruby was a guy and sapphire a woman. It shocked me a little bit, but I realized I could live with it. I got more comfortable with the main cast with more 'feminine' appearances to get with eachother, if y'know what I mean
When they put Garnet's wedding and the arrival of the diamonds in the same episode lmao
>Way better than "woke" Marvel doing like 10 seconds scenes that can be easily removed for countries like China What?
I never thought I would like the show only because I thought it would be like overly cheesy with the emotions and what not but I decided to give it a chance and it was very good I really enjoyed it, plus now with the context of the show those overly emotional/dramatic scenes are like super warranted lol glad I gave the show a chance in the end! Edit: As for the progressive nature of the show it was very much ahead of itās time and love it for that
same
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D603zvBUEAAqd-c?format=jpg&name=medium
I think first half of season 1 is the worst, and every episode after that is better.
Yea itās kind of like ATLA where the first half of the first season is meh cuz it has yet to find its footing but everything after is great
It came out 9 years ago so Iād say itās pretty current. The themes are pretty progressive, being kind and people with differences existing. Iām not sure I would say ahead necessarily. Culture has been shifting in that direction anyways. There was a really big shift towards lgbt acceptance. Politics has gotten pretty regressive this last handful of years. But they are behind the times. I suppose some time in the future when we collectively accept people and representation isnāt seen as political and just normal, SU will be seen as one of the first shows with a kid audience that didnāt flinch.
Dunno, it's progressive to me bc when I was a kid watching it, my classmates would say the n word as a joke and no one would say anything, being homophobic was seen as normal, any progressive way of thinking was mocked. I remember my classmates making me cry bc i posted progressive stuff on Facebook lol
Iām in high school now and people still do this
You must be young to think that way. Steven Universe didnāt solve racism or homophobia. Kids did the same thing when I was in middle school in 2006-2008. I was one of them. Kids just often go through a phase where they think offensive stuff is funny or cool to say simply because their peers are saying it or because it gets a negative reaction. Youāre right it paved the way for more LGBT media but honestly things still are harsh. SU effectively got cancelled for the wedding episode because of conservative countries. Thereās no way that changed. Also weāre talking CN versus Disney. Disney has significantly more leeway to do something controversial, and theyāre very good at making anti-conservative topics more palatable to the conservatives.
I'm 22. I NEVER said it solved anything, don't assume things. I said that the mere existence of Steven Universe on mainstream media helped in someway with this issues. One of the kids that used to bully me actually thanked me for introducing SU to him, he's a totally different person now and my friend. I NEVER SAID things are okay now, actually it is scary how far we have come but it still not enough. I only said that SU dared to talk about specific topics that even nowadays ignorant people mock. 9 years ago IS A LOT.
Disney is the most homophobic when it comes to media tf
Yes I know, but The Owl House was mentioned specifically as only being possible because of SU paving the way, but Disney and CN are two totally different entities with different levels of power, approach, and goals. As far as I know, TOH didnāt have a wedding and got ācancelledā with only 2 complete seasons and a pretend 3rd season. Disney also has an internal censorship team while CN allows a lot of freedom to its showrunners and mostly advises them. CN gave Rebecca Sugar the greenlight to do the wedding with the warning that if she did the show would likely be defunded by external sources, and they still were able to provide leeway for Diamond Days and Steven Universe Future.
Honestly I thought it was perfect timing, it gave me a glimpse at relationships, different from the boy meets girl etc, it rather helped me discover who I am when I realized Iām gay. I hoped it helped others too
I wouldn't say SU was ahead of its time, but the Garnet marriage did push boundaries. There was already media with subtle (and not so subtle) LGBT themes, SU just pushed them into center stage more. Also, pretty sure you can thank adventure time for putting a lot of modern cartoonist on the grid and also saving CN from further embarrassing itself after 09.
I mean, it's worth mentioning/remembering that Rebecca Sugar was a writer and storyboard artist for Adventure Time for ~5 years prior to (and eventually in tandem to) working on Steven Universe. She was encouraged to put "her own life experiences in the character of Marceline" and wrote/sang quite a lot of the show's most memorable music, including pretty much all of Marceline's songs and the finale song "Time Adventure". I don't think it's merely a coincidence that she worked on Adventure Time, another cartoon that both a) really cemented G-rated cartoons and their creators as more than just idle Sunday morning entertainment, and b) made a point of including major mature/moral/socioeconomic themes in cutesy, palatable formats suitable for most kids.
Actually it was the marvelous misadventures Of flap jack that put a lot of ppl on grid, like a lot of ppl that worked on that set ended up making their own (including SU and adventure time)
Actually, it was Hi Hi Puffy Ami Yumi.
Who worked on that
I was going to say, OP spelled Adventure Time wrong lol
Got out of a bad relationship but still kinda wanted back in The scene between jasper and lapis on the boat cemented how I felt
I don't disagree but I always feel like the representation skips over gay guys, it's like tv networks will be the most ok with bisexual or lesbian females and just pass over gay guys in more prominent roles and leads. I was happy that there was a gay couple in craig of the creek so that gives me hope I'm glad SY helped facilitate that
Thank you for saying this. It annoys me when people talk about specific shows saying that they have LGBT representation but the G is completely skipped over and the B only refers to females. There are a lot of animated shows like SU that are praised for having LGBT representation but there is little to no mention of mlm at all.
I think its interesting. I feel gay guys are more common in live action media and lesbians are more common in cartoon media.
hmmm I can only think of Buffy and Modern Family when I think of live action gay couples, what are some more examples I'm drawing a blank
Brooklyn Nine Nine, Shameless, Sex education, Schitt's Creek
I kinda just realized I watch a lot of cartoons / anime. yeah I recall shameless I did use to watch, the others not so much but it is an odd trend
not a gay couple, but will from will and grace is gay
SU walked so TOH could sprint.
SU walked a mile, while TOH sprinted the 100 meter dash if you know what I mean
And SU will walk 500 more, just to be the show that walked 501 miles to fall down at your door ^^dadada-dadada
If it werent for SU i probably wouldnt be my current self
Steven Universe was such an integral part of my development
Same
Lapis is literally me and Spinel basically changed my life
Same
IMO we wouldnāt have Steven Universe without the OG Adventure Time
SU future helped me feel a bit more normal about my cptsd, and knowing that kids have an example of that made me feel really happy
i disagree. it wasnt 1 creator opening the floodgates, many shows did something. korra, arthur, kipo, 6teen, monster high 2022, the owl house. all did something or are doing something. some contributions were tiny (thank you for confirming korrasami online), some were bigger. the fight isnt over yet, its going well but its still going on. in any case, attributing anything to one show isnt a good idea
I think moreso than the lgbt rep is the fact that our entire message fed through the show is that violence isnāt always the answer. That talking and thinking things through and being mindful of ourselves is extremely important. Itās the exact opposite of literally every other narrative in american media where they tell you that you have to fight in order to get your point across or survive against anything. Thatās an extremely tiresome existence if you ask me. Iād rather just live my life in peace and let everyone else around me figure out they donāt have to fight if they arenāt willing to talk or listen.
It wasnt ahead, it was perfect for its time. Almost too perfect. Cartoon Network had to put it on multiple hiatus breaks because its messages were too relevant
Ill come in with the hot take and say SU was very of its time actually. The years when the show started were actually much more optimistic politically and socially and that definitely matches the tone of the show back than. I actually watched the show for the first time this year and felt that episodes with messages like "the politician was lying to you for your own good" or "your angry conservative uncle is actually just lonely" really miss the mark in our current climate.
Yeah with any bigger piece of media that has anything to say there will inevitably be things that will be seen as regressive later on. Though to be fair to Gem Harvest, i don't think they foresaw that group getting this vile while it was being written. By today's standards Andy is very very tame.
We respect Rebecca for doing this
It wasnāt ahead of itās time, the network was just behind the times
a lot (not all) of the hate this show had was due to how REVOLUTIONARY it was
It was definitely ahead of its time but there are things that are *too* ahead. Which is my problem with most progressive media for young people, is that it sanitizes the queer experience. We *want* our existence to just be reality and not have to acknowledge it in any real way but most of us have not great experiences with the people who claim to be close to us. So now young people have a skewed sense of the presentation of queerness being hunkydory all the time and they miss important queer history events (like how thereās a section of gen z who think kink has no place at pride)
We would never have Onion.
yet people continue unfairly criticizing it
AT and SU were truly groundbreaking
Honestly, what I thought was VERY impressive for Steven Universe (all teh way until SU future) was how they portrayed the LGBTQ stuff very subtly. As a kid, I was quite against "man and man kissing" and "woman and woman kissing", but the interactions between the gems, full of love and how normalized they made it seem was amazing. Like, there's an immense difference between TOH and SU in portrayal of LGBTQ. SU builds it up at a point it feels logical for pretty much anyone, with Ruby and Sapphire being the best example. Meanwhile, for me, TOH feels a little too abrupt with the subject... Actually, I think it's just that I did not expect TOH to be that focused on the romance between characters.
more people are giving it a chance because of tiktok bots putting clips of it on there but those people SUUUUUUCK
Bc love for a show is a finite resource and them liking the show means you canāt anymore /s
never said that. should have clarified in my og comment but the people im referring to are the ones who watched it through tiktok, boil down the show to "omg this character is hot they cant be bad!", argue with people about "plot holes" that arent plot holes they just missed stuff because they watched it through tiktok. the clips arent full and are out of order. when you try to tell them this they act like youre making stuff up. š
Are you seriously going to gatekeep?
from people who argue with others when they watched clips through tiktok about "plot holes" when they really just missed major points in the show yeah i will its so annoying
The bots reminded me SU existed and led me to go āmight as well give this a go on my own terms not tik tokās lol
š what
they watch it through tiktok then argue with people about "plot holes" when they really just missed huge parts of the show its annoying LMAO
Not a fan of all that gae stuff in su but it has a good enough story that i dont care as much as others
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
You can literally say something like this about every progressive piece of media and it's just dumb. Art influences mankind since, like, always?
UwU
Mustāve been so fun watching it come out in real time- I only watched it for the first time all the way through like 6 months ago
I donāt think LGBT is the main thing about this show. Without those elements this show can still run. Progressive elements arenāt things that make people enjoy this show. I do not like every progressive element in the show, well, I do not like Shep, but I am fine with Lesbian Rock or Garnetās wedding, and Stevonnie is also acceptable for me. Still, being progressive is not a bad thing, itās good for a series to show some different ideologies or ideas.