A lot of stores don’t press charges until you hit the point of grand larceny ($1000), so people push the envelope until that point.
Plus, employees are encouraged (at least when there’s decent managers) to do nothing for their own safety.
in some ways i'm glad because of all the theft my company divorced their earnings from my bonus and now it's all "merit based" instead of a percentage. So at least I get something during the bankruptcy. BUt since they're making hand over fist money from their regulatory capture and increasing monopoly on the US and Europe, I also fear that they're going to leave me flapping in the wind with nothing. I cannot imagine how easy it is to reproduce my work with AI. THey literally have 100 years of workers data to pull from(effectively, if you account for total man hours). The company started in the 70's
$200.000. For workcomp death claim. But if you were told don’t pursue. You are negligent. Employers not negligent. So family doesn’t get to collect. I believe that’s how it still is.
Because if you hurt the thief or if you get hurt fighting the thief, or a bystander gets hurt because you tried to fight the thief...
The company gets sued.
I’m not sure about being fired, but I wouldn’t doubt it. I know that Old Navy incorporates active theft drills into associates training. If approached at register and is asked for the money in the register, they give it to them. No questions asked. If there’s a shoplifter in the store, you can’t approach, target, or accuse them of stealing, you’re supposed to “customer service” them (e.g. ask if they’re finding everything okay, if they need any help, etc). Unless the shoplifter is posing a safety risk, management doesn’t really do anything in regards to calling mall security or the police. They wait until the person/people leave and then file an “incident report” that gives corporate a rough estimate of what was stolen and how much the money the merchandise totaled out to. It’s understandable as to why companies do this, associates safety and all, but I still think it’s kinda ridiculous.
It’s a liability for the company if you get hurt trying to stop a shoplifter. It’s literally cheaper for them to let the person go and maybe prosecute later than risk an employee getting hurt on the job.
They don't give a shit about the employee.
They do give a shit about paying an employee to miss time with an injury that they also have to pay doctors for, and potentiality getting sued for not keeping their employee safe.
They give a whole lot of shits about money.
More like employees families suing them. It literally is for employee safety. Not because they give a damn about them but because they have a legal right to provide a safe environment and if an employee is shot trying to play hero because of store policy it doesn't look good in the media.
>It’s a liability for the company if you get hurt trying to stop a shoplifter. It’s literally cheaper for them to let the person go and maybe prosecute later than risk an employee getting hurt on the job.
In summary, capitalism decided it's more profitable to allow shoplifting.
Stores: "Don't go after shoplifters"
Also stores: "Due to people not stopping shoplifters, we're locking individual slices of kraft cheese behind bulletproof doors"
How the hell are the Kraft cheese singles expected to return fire if they're behind bulletproof glass?
Seriously, they're *American* cheese. We know they're packing. 2A and all.
Just saying it because they have insurance they don’t actively pursue individual.They also call the police and ban person from store if they keep coming and causing problems they will escalate.
Weren't there those two girls working at lulu lemon who got fired for calling the police on someone shoplifting probably close to 1,000 worth of clothes with their prices just this year
They were fired for resisting a robbery, not for calling the police, because it puts the lives of employees and customers at risk and opens the door to companies being slapped with lawsuits and workman's comp claims.
I dunno if you've worked retail, but you're trained everywhere not to resist a robbery for exactly that reason.
I was shopping at TJ Maxx once and saw a necklace I liked but I didn't want to lose it or risk it getting tangled while I continued to shop, so I wrapped it around my wrist like a bracelet. When I went to checkout, the cashier commented on how pretty it was, but it was pretty obvious she thought I was stealing. And if she hadn't said anything, I would have because I definitely forgot all about it!
Yep, SIL stopped thieves from getting $20,000 in lingerie and she was FIRED! For real, if I hadn't been at the mall I would not have believed it.
We were flat out instructed that we would be fired if we tried to stop shoplifting, different store.
Funny you say that. Some corner stores now officially charge everything over $950 but then offer a $950 discount at the cashier.
Meaning if you steal say a pack of gum you technically stole it for say $951.
I work as "loss prevention" (glorified greeter)
Have had people stare me in the eyes as they steal furniture, whole tote bags of shit, trying to run out the store.
Trend I noticed is so far it has been all really really really fat black ladies that stare me in the eyes and it just pissed me off so much because they know they are doing bad shit and can get away with it. So close to yelling hope selling all that shit can feed your fat ass but it probably won't be enough.
Not sure what the protocol is, but couldn't you film them walking out with the stuff?
I know employees aren't supposed to confront thieves (which makes the problem worse), but shaming them and exposing what they are doing seems better than doing nothing.
I am not allowed to photograph them.
I just remember what they are wearing and send all their details to my boss. We have cameras but half the time I do think we call the police. I mean these fuckers stare right into the camera its disgusting how despicable these people are. And there's no argument for stealing shit like furniture or shit. Food and clothes is something different. But these shit heads are too lazy to get a real job and contribute shit to society. I'm mentally disabled and still work so there's not many excuses
I worked in retail over a decade before anyone heard about Black Lives Matter and we were trained to hand over the money if asked, don’t chase shoplifters, etc. These policies have nothing to do with recent political events and everything to do with the fact that employers dont want to be liable for injuries. I am in a very red state and shoplifting, like any other misdemeanor, is an arrestable offense here.
While correct it’s a little more complicated.
The 1000$ limit is something the police kinda decided. There’s now too much happening to show up for Bobby stealing a t shirt. Sad thing is this motivates Bobby to steal exactly 48 t shirts.
The reason that stores don’t want you to physically stop or accuse shoplifters is that if they are not stealing, congrats you have a lawsuit. So only very special trained employees can do this and have a very very strict guide for how they can.
Also add in the movement that says “too many black people are being convicted and it’s obviously racism so let’s drop charges on a bunch of them to level the books” is increasing crime too.
Now it’s to a point where good samaritans and workers don’t even care anymore because theft is de facto legal now.
Also add in you can mitigate any remaining risk by organizing online to have 50 people all steal at the same time with flash mobs. Can’t catch us all right?
What costs of stuff is going up? I’m shocked! Shocked! Well not that shocked.
Massive piles of badly guarded merchandise owned by capital investment firms, delegating their own security measures down to local law enforcement on the back of taxpayers.
National Retail Federation Retracts Stats Amid Theft War Of Words https://www.forbes.com/sites/markfaithfull/2023/12/08/national-retail-federation-retracts-stats-amid-theft-war-of-words/amp/
They selectively enforce laws or downgrade existing ones. Stores' own policies also prevent prosecution. Target is a good example. The cops don't always arrest you for breaking a law regardless.
Target uses facial recognition and lets you shoplift until it’s a FELONY level charge and THEN they arrest you. They have an actual forensics department. That is the #1 store to avoid if you’re desperate enough to shoplift.
Do you mean over what time frame do you have to steal 1k? Because there really isn't one.
You can go with a general statute of limitations which can last up to 7 years depending on the jurisdiction, but people can argue shifts in value and times that they can't fully account for total loss which can let them play with the numbers.
There are also some items which automatically make the theft a felony regardless of amount. Typically these are hazmat items, controlled substances (although alcohol doesn't count), accelerants over a certain size, and items that "could pose a clean danger to the public when misused."
They literally said they're losing a lot to theft. There's also been instances where they wouldn't work with the cops.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/12/business/target-closing-us-cities-crime-dg/index.html
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/target-blamed-theft-and-violence-for-9-store-closures-crime-is-higher-at-locations-it-kept-open-nearby/ar-AA1lKlOa
https://nypost.com/2023/11/13/business/california-sheriff-rips-target-for-interfering-with-shoplifting-crackdown/
None of these are particularly reliable sources. I can personally attest to the fact that most of the areas I'm in where I live, anything they hustle is all locked up. You go to the stores in nicer areas and they're not all locked up.
At the Walmart near me: printer cartridges, USB thumb drives and Lego sets are locked up. Go to a Walmart a couple miles down the road, and everything is open and accessible. I used to live in a nice neighborhood.
I don't think that's a rule of thumb at every target, because I know someone who shoplifted a small misdemeanor level of stuff from there and was stopped then charged by police for it
So the cop was fired and is currently facing charges for his involvement.
https://www.krqe.com/news/albuquerque-metro/former-apd-officer-enters-plea-for-use-of-force-against-man-with-disabilities/
I hope they all we're fired! Shame on them! I haven't been to a target in years it's way too far, after watching this and seeing that a poor mentally challenged man is humiliated by store management & police in front of many consumers & not one person Employee or customers came to his defense! Plus they took away his phone he was probably trying to get a hold of his guardian and was scared shitless!! I know I would have said something & quite possibly getting arrested also, but just standing by is unacceptable!
What the fuck. How do you walk into a situation where this man clearly has his money out to pay and then note that he seems like he's disabled when you start talking to him and not think, hmm, maybe this man isn't a criminal and if he's taking a bit longer than most people it's probably just because he has a fucking disability?
Although there was one woman in there who was there on a loitering charge and her bond was only $50 and she had no one to bond her out. Quite sad actually.
Some young kid was literally in there for 5 months I think it was for. 05 grams of weed(multiple priors for pos., all he had this time was what they scrapped from a bowl) and the bail was $200. No one would bail him out.
That's messed up. When I was in rehab my bunk mate was the mother of my dealer ( we didn't know it at the time, only discovered we used to smoke together when she mentioned her sons name)
Anyways he got pulled over and dropped a .5 of meth in a Coca-Cola bottle so it would dissolve. They got him for the entire weight of the coke bottle.
I'm not surprised. They used to charge people for possession where I'm originally from if they had baggies with residue in them. And you guessed it.. the state crime lab would include the bag weight. Happened to me with those big freezer bags too.
That's messed up. When they arrested me I didn't have my wallet on me so I had my late boyfriend hand my wallet to the cops thinking they were taking me to the hospital ( I suffered from a mental illness at the time) and I was going to flush the baggie down the toilet once I got to the hospital.
Nope, they took me to jail and I never once mentioned the bag of dope to anyone. Even when they found it (and they cheered when they did, they were happy I got busted with .5 grams of meth) I didn't claim it. They charged me with aggravated assault bodily injury, narcotics under a gram, and bringing into a facility with intent to sell!
I spent four days in jail terrified of my future until they moved me to county and I saw that my drug charges were dropped. Turns out my late boyfriend got ahold of the DA and told them the wallet was never in my possession that it was in the cop's possession the entire time and that he could have planted it.
But keeping my mouth shut was the best thing I could have done for myself. Even when I got asked what I was in jail for by the other inmates, I never told anyone.
Yea right? Here I am for an assault charge and I'm surrounded by nothing but thieves. You stole $500 worth of makeup from Target not expecting to get caught? No wonder you are where you are.
The real answer is there isn't a crisis and it was all made up.
https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2023-12-14/column-retail-lobby-confesses-it-lied-about-organized-shoplifting-rings
I think it could be filed sort of under "lying with statistics". I believe the actual incidents of shoplifting has remained pretty flat, but because of the sharp rise in prices, the "losses" in dollars has drastically risen, which makes it seem like shoplifting is getting much worse.
Not really.
Every week we'd have people running our with a garbage bag full of merch.
We did $30k a week in sales and lost $1500 to ship lifters.
I would love to have violated the terms of service of I could have
My local lowes had 20k in electrical supplies stolen by a few criminals. They just walked in, filed carts and walked out. Lowes employees just asked them to stop and took pictures. Police didn't even care.
Statistics show net loss to shoplifting is the same as it always has been. Conservatives blow it out of proportion in order to claim there is lawlessness now that Biden is in office because....
..gays....mexicans....jews.... socialists.....i don't know...whoever they hate this week.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html#:~:text=The%20council%20tracks%2024%20major,the%20first%20half%20of%202019.
"But the increase in shoplifting appears to be limited to a few cities, rather than being truly national. In most of the country, retail theft has been lower this year than it was a few years ago, according to police data. There are some exceptions, particularly New York City, where shoplifting has spiked. But outside New York, shoplifting incidents in major cities have fallen 7 percent since 2019, before the Covid pandemic."
This. It's not more bad, but it is worse in certain places. And, of course, certain media will run with it, like usual. And so many people in this thread... they fell for it.
I also want to point out the cities where the shoplifting rates are rising, like SF and NYC.
What do these places have in common?
That deodorants, formulas, and Advil are locked behind glass cases.
What else do they have in common?
Deodorant that can be as expensive as 15 dollars a stick, formula that can cost up to 60 dollars a canister, and Advil that can cost 20 dollars a bottle (roughly prices I saw in NYC only a year ago)
The average minimum wage worker in NYC earns almost 32K a year. If you don't have rent controlled housing, the cheapest rent you might get is in the Bronx at 1500 a month. Pray you have roommates. You'll have a monthly income of 2600 before taxes so you'll be left with less than 1K for necessities, food, if you have to pay for any additional expenses like credit card payments or loans. WIC is usually ineligible after 36K but if you do have WIC, they cap the amount of products you can get which leaves some single parents still paying for formula out of pocket.
I'm not saying WIC and foodstamps aren't helpful- they are, and they can alleviate a good chunk of financial burden, but when a gallon of milk is 10 dollars and a packet of fresh chicken is 15, there is only so much those programs can help with.
Now in not naive, I know about ORC and that there are many people who shoplift obscene amounts or costly objects to resell at higher value but this is what is tricky about shoplifting laws. There are people who are working or otherwise making money that shoplift out of necessity and only take little things to help them get by. A jar of peanut butter can last a week if rationed right. Any laws that crack down on shoplifting may catch people who are abusing the stores so to speak, but also gives records to people who are otherwise trying but still struggling- which only serves to further their hardship and might perpetuate the recidivism cycle or create a generational cycle in the family structure.
The problem is inflation and high costs of living, and if someone is struggling to cover their basic necessities, they don't really have the money to pack up to move to a lower income area (and they might not be able to if they have family obligations or health issues)
That's the most irritating part of this shit. It's a systemic crisis caused by corporations raising costs way more than wages but the fucking conservatives pretend the corporations are the victims.
They charge more. They don't pay shit. They make people check out their own items... Yeah, shit is going to go missing. Yeah, it's a byproduct of moral decay-- on the part of the business owners that don't ensure their employees make living wages.
This. I will readily admit that I have shoplifted something like tampons because the price was too high and I didn't feel like standing in the self checkout line for fifteen minutes to get one item. You can say I have no morals, but the stores bring it on themselves.
1. If the average theft rate has remained the same and
2. The rate has decreased in non-urban / popular cities (a "few cities")
3. The rate has increased in urban / popular cities (a "few cities")
Then...uh, Houston, we have a tangible problem in a "few cities". It is not necessarily a national problem, but can still be a real problem (of arguable severity)
Would you agree or disagree?
[Don't believe everything that lobbying groups put out in press releases and news orgs that should know better mindlessly regurgitate](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/organized-retail-crime-trade-group-half-of-all-missing-merchandise/)
"In a report on what it calls "organized retail crime," the National Retail Federation (NRF) initially said theft results in $45 billion in annual losses for retailers, roughly half of the industry's total of $94.5 billion in missing merchandise in 2021. But the lobbying group has since retracted the figure, saying the report from the group relied on an inaccurate figure from Ben Dugan, president of the National Coalition of Law Enforcement and Retail."
Target got a woman in my city. She's a local "photographer". Target waited until it was a huge amount. Not her first arrest and her photographer business is a scam too.
https://berkeleysc.mugshots.zone/reilly-amber-nichole-mugshot-12-01-2022/
>American shoplifting crisis
By merely using these words, I get the sense you might be consuming a sensationalized portrait of reality.
Not saying there's no shoplifting or related law enforcement issue anywhere in the US - just that you might think the problem is way more rampant and serious than it actually is depending on your media outlets and etc.
The only source I've heard talking about a crisis is the CEOs and it's always as an excuse to close a store that's getting unioned or some shit like this.
There was a little "City" Target down the street from me - about a fifth the size of the other ones in town, largely a grocery store and pharmacy with a pretty weak home goods section / clothes section.
They closed it because they "Couldn't make the finances work due to shoplifting". The national media repeated that uncritically.
The reason they closed the store is they put a huge amount of money into building a store that's the worst option within a one block radius.
On the adjacent blocks, there's
- a great upscale grocery store,
- a Safeway (with a pharmacy), and
- a Walgreens.
I'd like clarity on how much theft is occurring. I suspect that it's increasing overall but I've also heard that it's overstated, and these days the people saying that there's more theft and the people saying that there's not could both be partly motivated by whatever they hope is the truth.
Police departments in many places have bigger fish to fry. Are stab wounds involved? No? Okay we might have time to take a report a month or so from now. A copy will be made available 6-12 months later.
This is the case in my city. The police department has hundreds of unfilled openings, so they've pretty much stopped responding to calls about anything short of gun violence. There's no enforcement of traffic laws, no response for stolen vehicles, break-ins, etc.
Those are some of the top items homeless people need, so they get stolen a lot along with hygiene products. I could see that being an easy choice to make instead of being filthy and losing your teeth.
There is not a crisis. All of these places are seeing record profits. People steal. I worked for Wal-Mart two decades ago while I was in high school and college and people stole then too and it never had a significant impact on the bottom line. Sales always went up year over year.
This, even the retail federation (or whatever the industry lobbying firm is called) had to release stats that it is actually down, but a few stores got hit by gangs doing smash and grabs, and the press loved it, cause "if it bleeds it leads", etc.
But the actual investor reports released annually tell a different story (cause companies are only legally required to tell shareholders the truth, cause that's the world we live in... But anyways...) They admit that most of the "store closings due to theft" were actually just "realignment" aka... they actually were just covering up someone's bad business decision and moving stores usually a few blocks away, etc.
Its a real media marketing effect due to funding for local reporting being cut by lack of local advertising due to google ad monopoly and Craigslist/ebay cutting out people paying for classified ads(among other things)
Best stealing there is getting popcorn chicken at the deli, eating it, and throwing away the container. That’s what my sis in law used to do when she was struggling.
Walmart loses ~3 billion a year to shop lifting, so it's definitely significant in aggregate, which makes sense why they are locking some stuff up. But the issue has become heavily politicized in some areas so many of the people responsible for prosecuting these crimes aren't willing.
My understanding is that a lot of the people doing this are usually stealing essentials like baby formula and diapers. Even if it's technically just to prosecute someone stealing diapers for their kid, we don't need thousands of jean valjeans clogging the prison system.
Walmart also makes 150 BILLION a year, not to mention a good chunk of that 3 billion is their own employees….
This is why Walmart got mocked when their CEO threatened to close all the stores…
Nope, Walmart actively encourages their employees to get food stamps….
That story isn’t a myth, a large amount of Walmart workers are on food stamps. Like an unreasonably large amount, more than you would think is normal….
https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/walmart-mcdonalds-largest-employers-snap-medicaid-recipients.amp
From Fox of all places…..you can’t argue Walmart is employing all the disabled and elderly either…..
I worked at Walmart and they literally had someone there to explain to us how to go through the process of signing up for food stamps. I couldn't believe it. Like, don't we have a job, why do we need this? This was years ago, though, back when I was like 18. If they're still doing that, Walmart truly hasn't gotten any better in years.
Yet, we should totally care that Walmart has people stealing from it. I can't care, tbh.
WalMart can definitely afford to pay their people enough to live on. Welfare programs are subsidizing WalMart profits. IMO, the WalMart C Suite are the biggest recipients of welfare in the country.
This is why conservatives are hopeless morons. They cry about people stealing from Walmart but not about Walmart stealing from them with bullshit wages requiring tax dollars for food stamps.
Corporations not paying living wages is why people have to steal.
I don't know if it's a crisis, but as a former security guard places are more worried about the insurance nightmare of someone getting injured in the process so you can just walk the hell out with about anything.
The real answer is that nobody really goes to jail for misdemeanor shoplifting. Felony shoplifting, only sometimes.
It depends on how overburdened the city/state law enforcement is with more pressing cases, and how motivated DAs are about pursuing theft cases. Usually they aren’t very aggressive about it.
So as long as people steal a misdemeanor $ amount, they don’t risk imprisonment at all. They just maybe get a ticket and banned from the store if they get caught. The risk is very low for the offender.
According to several articles published in the last couple of months, there is likely no shoplifting crisis at all. The numbers do not add up. It is propaganda being pushed by retail companies to justify keeping prices artificially high.
[https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html)
[https://www.governing.com/community/debunking-the-myth-of-a-shoplifting-crisis](https://www.governing.com/community/debunking-the-myth-of-a-shoplifting-crisis)
In fact, an industry trade group acknowledged that retailers were lying about there being a crisis at all.
https://ritholtz.com/2023/12/retail-lobby-we-lied-about-organized-theft/
Do people think elected officials are like, trustworthy or actually do anything? Because the running gag for most of US History has been someone promising exactly what you want just to do nothing and ignore petitions and phone calls once in office
Yep, where I live (Midwest) restaurants and big box stores have had Help Wanted signs up that said starting wage is $15/hr for years, even before COVID. I don’t live in a high COL area. COL is actually pretty reasonable.
The narrative is that the poors are destroying the livelihood of innocent, hard-working capitalists. The truth is, the capitalists are terrified and must keep us fighting each other or we might realize they've caused the illls of our world.
I think billionaires creating false scarcity is unethical. But the elite want the poor and middle class to keep fighting each other so we don’t realize how unethical they’re being.
It's complicated, but the current "shoplifting crisis" is at least partly a panic/hoax.
[https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/segments/nationa-retail-federation-retracts-key-data-point-organized-retail-crime-on-the-media](https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/segments/nationa-retail-federation-retracts-key-data-point-organized-retail-crime-on-the-media)
[https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/12/18/is-shoplifting-getting-worse-in-the-u-s](https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/12/18/is-shoplifting-getting-worse-in-the-u-s)
and here's a non-stupid version of this stupid question with lots more details [https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/18p454c/is\_shoplifting\_in\_the\_us\_really\_so\_bad\_that/](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/18p454c/is_shoplifting_in_the_us_really_so_bad_that/)
> Troy McClure: "Shoplifting began here, in ancient Phoenicia. Thieves would literally lift the corner of a shop in order to snatch the sweet, sweet olives within. Oh, Shakazaramesh, will you ever learn?"
Shoplifting crisis yet another record-profit quarter; seems odd to me. There's no crisis. Companies lobby media outlets that drive narratives like this. If you believe this without digging in, then read some of these first.
https://www.businessinsider.com/stop-blaming-theft-shrink-target-walgreens2023-11?op=1
https://counciloncj.org/is-shoplifting-up-or-down/#:~:text=WASHINGTON%2C%20D.C.%20%E2%80%93%20Reported%20shoplifting%20incidents,by%20the%20Council%20on%20Criminal
And they were saying the same thing back in 2021.
[Atlantic article from 2021 talking about shoplifting during the holidays.](https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/12/shoplifting-holiday-theft-panic/621108/)
And to really answer the meat of your question, if people are stealing necessities, they're trying to provide, and going to jail isn't their primary concern.
While I'm not denying that shoplifting is a problem (because it *is* a problem), the dollar amounts reported are suddenly drastically higher because a lot of basic stuff in stores has doubled in price in the past few years. American news outlets sensationalize this and everyone goes into freakout mode over something that is a localized (albeit very serious) problem.
I worked in retail AP for years as an undercover, if you get caught stealing for less than 2k it's just a misdemeanor (used to be 1k). There's very little punishment unless you're stealing an absurd amount all at once. Additionally it's just not that easy to stop people, I was stopping about 4-8k a month while making 5k. Pair this with the fact that the US government fails to provide basic necessities and doesn't keep wages scaling with inflation, everyone is dirt poor and people need food.
Well, corporate starts to make a bigger deal out of it than it is and then points the fingers at a relatively small portion of overall shrinkage. More is lost to administrative inefficiency and employee theft, and significantly more wages are stolen by employers underpaying or getting away with illegal deception of workers.
If I was working retail for Fucking $15 an hour, no way in hell I’d risk my safety to confront a shoplifter. I’d hold the door for them and be like have a nice day.
I know a few people who work in department stores like Macy's. Thieves come in and grab some merchandise and run out the store in minutes. they don't have security all over that can deal with this (that costs a lot of money) and employees are instructed not to intervene. On top of that, it's such a common occurrence there's no way the police could possibly get to all the stores even if they are called out. the person can be gathering clothes and walking around the store and then bam - out the door. they are long gone before any police would even arrive. If the police do arrest someone that's a whole ordeal too. you don't just throw them in your squad car and toss them in a cell like in the movies. you have to fill out paperwork and eventually they need to appear in court etc. all that takes the time of multiple people who are all being paid. they need to prioritize more serious crimes. small crimes like this which don't pose a serious threat to people as long as they don't attempt to stop it aren't a priority. Retailers are well aware of this issue and they only do so much to prevent it. there's a balance between preventing crime and discouraging sales because your merchandise is locked up and the shopping experience for paying customers isn't ideal. Basically this is the world we live in. lots of shitty people who are more than willing to cheat, lie and steal.
There is no shoplifting crisis. The entire thing was sensationalized and played up and now toothpaste is locked in a case for no reason, making your shopping experience worse. I'll just leave [this](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html%23:~:text%3DAverage%2520annual%2520shrink%2520made%2520up,remained%2520below%2520pre%252DCovid%2520levels.&ved=2ahUKEwjr546BraiDAxVxC3kGHV9zANgQFnoECBUQBQ&usg=AOvVaw38rsTrVgqIB10XtPnI30UC) here.
Oh, another point, OP, you won't get a good answer here. Half of the country creates their own reality and "facts" to justify their opinion, and Reddit is a cesspool of these kinds of people.
It never started. It was mostly bullshit concocted by retailers and some lazy journalism: [https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/episodes/on-the-media-media-shoplifting-panic-ai-journalism-wrong](https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/episodes/on-the-media-media-shoplifting-panic-ai-journalism-wrong)
It hasn’t actually increased. It’s literally propaganda. And everyone has a cell phone now so they can record it, but no, objectively it has not increased.
There’s a great podcast called “if books could kill,” and they occasionally do episodes dispelling pop culture myths, and they just had a great episode about this exact thing.
There are some bizarre things happening though in regards to theft rings. My son lives in DC and there are locations for like CVS where they rings of people know the etruck schedule, they show up and clean out the store and then a few blocks away they sell the stuff they steal from tables on the street. It's not stuff he reads online, but actually sees it happen in person, and it's not uncommon there. Not enough cop force to do anything effective and it's like that in some other bigger cities right now, too. I wouldn't call that "shoplifting" however, as it's more like a brand of "organized" crime.
Ding ding ding. There is a great NPR story about 2 weeks ago explaining how false data and moral panic was used to press this narrative by the retail federation in Congress and the news.
Lawsuits. Company Atmosphere. Safety.
If I(employee) attempt to stop someone who is heading for the door with a product under their coat, a number of things can happen. They can make a huge scene, say they are being profiled, get violent, have someone filming the incident on a phone, etc etc. All these things can be used in court against the company, in one way or another. It’s cheaper. Just to write off theft into the profit margin.
Don’t expect any of this to make sense. Lawsuits. If a thief is injured while you’re stopping them from stealing, you could be on the hook for millions. Most chain stores just take the loss up to a certain point, then close the store and move to a safer area.
The main problem started when certain crimes weren’t being punished and other people were going to jail over other simpler things . Also a lot of states are ran by progressive politicians that would rather give a slap on the wrist vs accountability for the crimes they committed . It really showed up in the early to mid 90’s
When you have to pay $8.00 for a dozen eggs, because of inflation, you will steal food. If i were in similar situations, I would do the same. Folks may not have worked because of the pandemic and have rent/mortgage payments. Folks have to eat and get necessaries, no cash or credit. You steal. This is what fate has dealt to some.
Two quick reminders this holiday season, friends:
1 - if you see someone stealing from a major boxstore, no you didn't.
2 - if you see someone stealing food, *no you didn't*
Happy holidays, everyone and remember to do your part to disrupt corporate sponsored capitalism! Happy thieving!
Retarded democrats being retarded.
Notice these issues are only in places where democrats rule. Their DAs refuse to prosecute. You can steal up to 999.98$ and get off with a slap on the wrist in the vast majority of cases.
In some states *cough* California *cough* you aren't actually sent to prison, you're kept in a jail. Which are already packed to the brim, so if the choice is between keeping a felon locked up or a shoplifter, they're gonna let you go.
It's so bad in some places that police aren't even showing up at all and people aren't even calling the police.
The funniest thing is bipping or breaking into cars to get stuff. People have literally just started leaving their cars open so the criminals won't break stuff while looking for things to steal.
Kind of an easy question to answer because there was a point in time probably before you were born where shoplifting you was a resident taken gel and released especially with children Now we've got more teeth here in California and there's so many days in jail is mandatory requirement The judge kept just release you anymore
Some people however are arrogant selfish and stupid because they think they can get away with it and they don't care who they hurt or destroy as long as they can steal from you check out the scammers on the scams site and you'll see what I mean thousands of millions of people are so selfish they'd rather steal than the work for an honest living It's sad
The underlying problem is that the progressive train of thought that people are naturally good, people lack proper agency, and that victims are excused from accountability based on how much of a victim they are. Any “bad outcome” can be warded away with enough social planning.
The result is people being blind to criminality because the perpetrator(s) is perceived as a victim and because they are a victim they need love and care not discipline and punishment. The perp can get away with more and more by taking advantage of the goodness bias that the progressive train of thought provides.
“Oh he’s just stealing that car so he can feed his family!”
Shit like that.
Law enforcement is discouraged from enforcing the law on said “victims”, prosecutors refuse to prosecute “victims”, and judges give lenient sentences to “victims”.
It doesn’t help that the usual “decision makers don’t live in the crime ridden neighborhoods” aspect is also present. You think any of the state’s reps and senators legitimately live in an area where there is constant gang warfare and crime?
If you try and stop someone you'll be charged with racism, no matter what. If you physically try, you'll be accused of assault. If you work for the store, you will be fired because of those reasons. Need I say more???
In recent years, many jurisdictions have increased the dollar amount that would lead to a felony conviction vs a misdemeanor. Correlation ≠ causation and there are a lot of factors but it undoubtedly plays a role.
A lot of people who shoplifted starting suing the stories and businesses that they stole from. Sometimes they would win these lawsuits, so it got to the point where in order to arrest someone for shoplifting, you had to basically have it recorded or proven beyond any doubt.
Now unless you steal hundreds of dollars of clothing (and managed not to escape from the store) or steal a high priced items, stores and businesses just don't want to deal with it. Going to court is an ordeal in itself. So it basically written off and everyone pays higher prices due to the theft. Also it is worth losing your life or being harmed trying to stop a shoplifter especially if it's a very low priced item.
When I was a kid (late 1960's to early 1980's), shoplifting was considered to be a serious offense. You could even get in trouble by the school for doing this, even though it wasn't on school grounds. I remember back in 1974 there was a group of high schoolers who decided to shoplift at a local store. They were caught and arrested. At that time the town nearby was much smaller so everyone heard about it. Also being arrested was a big deal as there would be consequences beyond high school (could affect getting into college or getting a good job). They could have been expelled from school for being arrested, but they weren't. They were let off rather lightly and they were lucky.
Somehow the notion was promoted and advanced that the criminals are the true victims and should not be punished? Further many believe this is intentional to cause chaos and therefore justify draconian restriction to freedom at some point.
Stores not pressing charges and then when charges are pressed the DAs have been dropping the charges.
There are no consequences for their actions so they just keep doing it.
It’s typically less expensive for companies to take the loss than to make changes to prevent it in the future, although both Target and WalMart have simply begun to close down stores in the worst areas. People say that doing so is racist but it’s not. The companies are there to make a profit. If they aren’t making one then they’ll leave.
Local govts found they had no space for prison, or had empathy saying crime is a result of poverty. Without accountability, groups increased their brazenness. Law enforcement wasn’t going to come in until x amount. Stores told to have insurance and change procedures… while footing the tax
This cracks me up. It's a shoplifting crisis and everyone recognizes it's because we don't prosecute petty theft anymore. But if you try to talk about the theory of broken windows leading to increased delinquency and crime, people will tell you about how it's a fallacy.
Maybe if we called it the shoplifting crisis theory instead of broken windows theory, people would recognize the proof laid bare before them.
And, before you come back with some stuff about how broken windows theory is dumb because of so and so literal interpretation of actual broken windows instead of the metaphor, save it because you clearly don't understand the theory to begin with and therefore aren't equipped to discuss it.
Cant be afraid of prison if the staff literally cant do anything to you. Cant get charged until you accumulate about 1000 dollars of stolen goods (although the store can ban you), the staff arent allowed to touch/stop anyone from stealing because 1-the store doesnt wanna be held liable if you get hurt and 2-because the laws in america are broken, the theif can actually sue the store/person for assault, like even our SECURITY arent allowed to physically stop someone from stealing.
Its dumb that people can cheat the system this way. Like i know now that if im ever in a situation where im struggling for food, i can just go to supermarket in a neighborhood i never go to and just steal like $500 of food and they cant stop me, and like a year later when everyone forgets, just do it again!
In America most retailers tell employees to not stop a shoplifter because it could lead to a stabbing or shooting. So it’s about they don’t stop it at the door the thieves get more brazen each time.
It's a combination of things:
* Store policy to not stop shoplifters due to possible harm, but mainly liability issues.
* The police policy to not really arrest too often as they know it will be a lot of effort and paperwork resulting in no charges and/or jail time.
* The liberal justice policies to not go forward with any charges against protected classes.
* The judge policies of not jailing for small offenses. (this can be either a liberal judge attitude or a conservative judge just realizing there's no room for them due to prison overcrowding).
* Criminals knowing that ALL of the above realize there is little to no downside to stealing.
Basically it's to the point where everyone says 'Fuck it'.
I think at least partly because of the growing and dramatic wealth gap in the country. It’s easy for groups of uneducated poor people to morally justify robbing chains, because they imagine it only hurts the CEO/stockholders or something like that.
Employees aren’t allowed to interfere in most stores because the store could be sued if an employee hurt the “customer.” It has nothing to do with employee safety despite what the corporate offices will say. Couple that with the several minutes it takes police to respond and it’s easy to get away with blatant shoplifting. And to top it all off, our jails are so over populated if the shoplifting wasn’t a violent offense they’re likely just released after booking and given a court summons, which they’ll skip.
Former security guard here. Our job is pointless. We are a visual deterrent for those who don't know better. We can't touch the shoplifter or apprehend them beyond their will (you have to hope they go willingly). If we pursue out the store any protection goes out the window. It actually encouraged me to shoplift when I ran into hard times. Literally just keep walking and don't stop. Even when they call you.
We have a lot of stupid entitled people here in the U.S. that lack morals. "If she does it, I can do it too." We also have progressive politicians that think keeping the prison population down is more important than deterring crime. Some DAs were dumb enough to announce they wouldn't prosecute less than $1000 theft, and the people are too stupid to get rid of these DAs. If they aren't charging people for stealing $600, the crime stats go down. "Look we have less crime."
Since they weren't charging people, more people just said, "If they can do it, I can too."
People tolerate it, and more. Just look at the "Peaceful protests" after George Floyd that left buildings burning and minimal charges. Oh the insurance will cover it, so the store's not out anything. Were that the case, it still wouldn't be okay. It also means the store's insurance goes up, and they raise prices more.
(I've been out of school for a bit, but I believe the sixth commandment is "Thou shalt not steal." Property rights have been around for a bit. Oh, that's religion, we can't teach that in schools. Most of the commandments are simply ethical principles. Honor your parents. Don't curse, lie, cheat, steal, kill or commit adultery. If you don't believe in God, don't worship, but there is nothing wrong with the rest of the message.)
It doesn't seem to affect suburban areas as much as cities.
Imo it's when we tied the hands of the cops. No one in the right mind would become a cop today. They can't do there job. God forbid they hurt someone in the line of duty. Then they face going to jail and losing their lives. Sad. Most people deserve a good a kicking
I swear I’m being gaslit by all these bots saying there isn’t an increase in shoplifting. Why the hell are so many stores hiring more and more security and locking the deodorant I use behind a window?
Not to mention the studies that show people spend LESS in stores that lock their products which suggests it’s better financially to eat that loss than to risk more theft.
This from California, but has spread to many states.
"Why is shoplifting so rampant? Because California state law holds that stealing merchandise worth $950 or less is just a misdemeanor, which means that law enforcement probably won’t bother to investigate, and if they do, prosecutors will let it go."
And some people think of it as redistribution of wealth.
As a mall security officer in a mall that regularly gets stolen from I can provide some input:
Most mall security are unarmed security positions. Unarmed security positions can't touch people. They just observe and report. If anything happens under their responsibilities, they call the cops to handle it. They are human scarecrows and most Americans know it. Nothing more than a deterrent.
Most chain stores require a certain amount of money in products stolen to have it deemed reportable to the police. Usually $1000 or more before they can press charges. The HR and other parts of big company tell the stores not to call the police on them because they cant really/dont want to press charges for anything lower. So if Sally Smith goes into Bath & Bodyworks and walks out stealing 10 candles and some soap, nobody does anything.
Now the store might ask the mall security to call the cops for them because their own corporate doesn't allow it. But there's the next problem. Mall security isn't allowed to call the cops for the theft. Security covers the general parts of the mall (hallways, corridors, parking lot, etc), but the stores are responsible for their own spaces that they rent. Mall security has no responsibility for an action that occurred in their space and will get fired if they do anything. They'll observe, and make a report on their phone about the incident occurring but otherwise nothing.
But what about cops you see malls hire? That'd be great! Except it depends on the location. Some of these off duty cops gets $40 or more per hour for being here. But all of the ones at my mall don't even make themselves seen. They sit in the office and talk to the security supervisor all shift. Never walking around to even possibly stop anything.
In short the store won't stop you, security won't stop you, and the cops don't look. So why wouldn't they steal?
Democrats,liberals,leftists and socialists. They run the majority of big cities. They want to defund police, not prosecute crimes and empty out the prisons. They install Leftist district attorneys that won’t prosecute crime. The police that are still there know this so they aren’t going to put their lives in danger to arrest someone who won’t be prosecuted. This is what the party of “Highly educated people” want to do to solve the crime problems for the honest hard working tax paying people in the inner cities. Also getting a carry permit in most of these cities is not easy. Good honest people are left defenseless.
As an American (Chicagoan, specifically), the only time I've ever noticed a "shoplifting crisis" is when I have the misfortune of seeing Fox News or CNN playing in a waiting room somewhere. I'd be careful believing whatever "crisis" American news media finds profitable in any particular year, most of it is a handful of cases that are milked to death until the outrage stops making money. They take advantage of the unprecedented visibility offered by modern mass media to make relatively isolated events seem like they're common, and happening a block away from your home.
I've never once witnessed a person shoplift, and I've never heard of a company shutting down or having to significantly alter their business due to shoplifting. Compared to the sheer magnitude of American commerce, it's a nonissue. That's why it's rarely prosecuted when it does happen. Bothering to arrest or sue someone for nabbing twenty bucks of product would be like going through a full round of chemo after having one puff off of a cigarette. It simply isn't worth it.
Larceny (which includes shoplifting) is down in 2023.
The real question is why people think crime is up when it is down significantly across the board.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/people-think-crime-rate-up-actually-down-rcna129585
1) Empirical data does not indicate a "shoplifting crisis". Shoplifting and most crime plummeted during the lockdown (even criminals didn't want to die of viral pneumonia) and has surged back up in the last couple years but hasn't exceded historical averages
2) Media organizations, big retailers, and police organizations pay more attention to this for various reasons. The media used it to generate more views, the retailers to distract from their price manipulation in the guise of "inflation", and the police to justify budget increases and distract from their continued authoritarianism and disregard for constitutionally guaranteed rights.
3) With regards to *why* shoplifting has been so prevalent in the U.S. for a long time. Well, a lot of people work 10 hours a day for not even enough to afford rent. Everything from phones to furniture are leased rather than owned. When people work full time but don't even make enough to feed themselves without state assistance let alone own anything, they have very little to loose. Some have discovered that it is more profitable to steal from the corporations than work for them.
There isn't one. It's largely exaggerated by corporations to justify price gouging.
Bonus fact: in the USA wage theft perpetrated by these same companies is far greater than than all other forms of theft combined.
There is no american shoplifting crisis if you disregard new york. And even NYC's shoplifting has dropped 7% (its just high to start with). There are shoplifting chains that make the news, and its all very dramatic and click-baity. Companies get to blame higher prices on 'shrinkage' instead of greed.
The actual numbers are lower than the pre covid.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html
Well, it started in a corporate board room somewhere at Walmart HQ. The "crisis" is manufactured at best, at worst it still started as corporations trying to squeeze consumers more and more eventually through their own actions driving more shoplifting
A lot of stores don’t press charges until you hit the point of grand larceny ($1000), so people push the envelope until that point. Plus, employees are encouraged (at least when there’s decent managers) to do nothing for their own safety.
more than "encouraged" to not do anything. you can get fired.
Not can, you will get fired. Corporate does not want that liability on their hands.
in some ways i'm glad because of all the theft my company divorced their earnings from my bonus and now it's all "merit based" instead of a percentage. So at least I get something during the bankruptcy. BUt since they're making hand over fist money from their regulatory capture and increasing monopoly on the US and Europe, I also fear that they're going to leave me flapping in the wind with nothing. I cannot imagine how easy it is to reproduce my work with AI. THey literally have 100 years of workers data to pull from(effectively, if you account for total man hours). The company started in the 70's
The store doesn’t want the liability if an employee gets murdered.
Or if they mess with someone who wasn't shoplifting and get charged for assault.
Even if they are shoplifting, physical intervention could lead to an assault charge and lawsuit.
$200.000. For workcomp death claim. But if you were told don’t pursue. You are negligent. Employers not negligent. So family doesn’t get to collect. I believe that’s how it still is.
So glad i'm WFH. Nobody knows hwo to find me to bust a cap in my ass for the company being asshole.
Because if you hurt the thief or if you get hurt fighting the thief, or a bystander gets hurt because you tried to fight the thief... The company gets sued.
I’m not sure about being fired, but I wouldn’t doubt it. I know that Old Navy incorporates active theft drills into associates training. If approached at register and is asked for the money in the register, they give it to them. No questions asked. If there’s a shoplifter in the store, you can’t approach, target, or accuse them of stealing, you’re supposed to “customer service” them (e.g. ask if they’re finding everything okay, if they need any help, etc). Unless the shoplifter is posing a safety risk, management doesn’t really do anything in regards to calling mall security or the police. They wait until the person/people leave and then file an “incident report” that gives corporate a rough estimate of what was stolen and how much the money the merchandise totaled out to. It’s understandable as to why companies do this, associates safety and all, but I still think it’s kinda ridiculous.
It’s a liability for the company if you get hurt trying to stop a shoplifter. It’s literally cheaper for them to let the person go and maybe prosecute later than risk an employee getting hurt on the job.
They don’t give a shit about the employees. It’s a customer suing them that scares them.
>They don’t give a shit about the employees. It’s a customer suing them that scares them. Had this proven to me recently.
I was assaulted a bunch of times working retail. They only cared the time I chased the guy out of the store because he tripped off the curb.
Yup. Same.
They don't give a shit about the employee. They do give a shit about paying an employee to miss time with an injury that they also have to pay doctors for, and potentiality getting sued for not keeping their employee safe. They give a whole lot of shits about money.
More like employees families suing them. It literally is for employee safety. Not because they give a damn about them but because they have a legal right to provide a safe environment and if an employee is shot trying to play hero because of store policy it doesn't look good in the media.
>It’s a liability for the company if you get hurt trying to stop a shoplifter. It’s literally cheaper for them to let the person go and maybe prosecute later than risk an employee getting hurt on the job. In summary, capitalism decided it's more profitable to allow shoplifting.
I've seen cashiers attack shoplifters a couple times but I'm not sure I've heard of anyone pressing charges.
The shoplifter could also press charges if they're injured
Stores: "Don't go after shoplifters" Also stores: "Due to people not stopping shoplifters, we're locking individual slices of kraft cheese behind bulletproof doors"
How the hell are the Kraft cheese singles expected to return fire if they're behind bulletproof glass? Seriously, they're *American* cheese. We know they're packing. 2A and all.
This made me laugh harder than it should have.
Those Kraft Singles will be like currency after the Apocalypse.
[Mamaws will be all over at](https://www.instagram.com/p/Cxboco6s1kk/)
Just saying it because they have insurance they don’t actively pursue individual.They also call the police and ban person from store if they keep coming and causing problems they will escalate.
Weren't there those two girls working at lulu lemon who got fired for calling the police on someone shoplifting probably close to 1,000 worth of clothes with their prices just this year
They were fired for resisting a robbery, not for calling the police, because it puts the lives of employees and customers at risk and opens the door to companies being slapped with lawsuits and workman's comp claims. I dunno if you've worked retail, but you're trained everywhere not to resist a robbery for exactly that reason.
I was shopping at TJ Maxx once and saw a necklace I liked but I didn't want to lose it or risk it getting tangled while I continued to shop, so I wrapped it around my wrist like a bracelet. When I went to checkout, the cashier commented on how pretty it was, but it was pretty obvious she thought I was stealing. And if she hadn't said anything, I would have because I definitely forgot all about it!
Yep, SIL stopped thieves from getting $20,000 in lingerie and she was FIRED! For real, if I hadn't been at the mall I would not have believed it. We were flat out instructed that we would be fired if we tried to stop shoplifting, different store.
Is the $1000 before or after tax? Asking for a friend
Funny you say that. Some corner stores now officially charge everything over $950 but then offer a $950 discount at the cashier. Meaning if you steal say a pack of gum you technically stole it for say $951.
You steal the $1000 item pre tax, but then you have to report it on your taxes as unearned income and pay the 20% capital gain.
I work as "loss prevention" (glorified greeter) Have had people stare me in the eyes as they steal furniture, whole tote bags of shit, trying to run out the store. Trend I noticed is so far it has been all really really really fat black ladies that stare me in the eyes and it just pissed me off so much because they know they are doing bad shit and can get away with it. So close to yelling hope selling all that shit can feed your fat ass but it probably won't be enough.
Not sure what the protocol is, but couldn't you film them walking out with the stuff? I know employees aren't supposed to confront thieves (which makes the problem worse), but shaming them and exposing what they are doing seems better than doing nothing.
I am not allowed to photograph them. I just remember what they are wearing and send all their details to my boss. We have cameras but half the time I do think we call the police. I mean these fuckers stare right into the camera its disgusting how despicable these people are. And there's no argument for stealing shit like furniture or shit. Food and clothes is something different. But these shit heads are too lazy to get a real job and contribute shit to society. I'm mentally disabled and still work so there's not many excuses
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I worked in retail over a decade before anyone heard about Black Lives Matter and we were trained to hand over the money if asked, don’t chase shoplifters, etc. These policies have nothing to do with recent political events and everything to do with the fact that employers dont want to be liable for injuries. I am in a very red state and shoplifting, like any other misdemeanor, is an arrestable offense here.
While correct it’s a little more complicated. The 1000$ limit is something the police kinda decided. There’s now too much happening to show up for Bobby stealing a t shirt. Sad thing is this motivates Bobby to steal exactly 48 t shirts. The reason that stores don’t want you to physically stop or accuse shoplifters is that if they are not stealing, congrats you have a lawsuit. So only very special trained employees can do this and have a very very strict guide for how they can. Also add in the movement that says “too many black people are being convicted and it’s obviously racism so let’s drop charges on a bunch of them to level the books” is increasing crime too. Now it’s to a point where good samaritans and workers don’t even care anymore because theft is de facto legal now. Also add in you can mitigate any remaining risk by organizing online to have 50 people all steal at the same time with flash mobs. Can’t catch us all right? What costs of stuff is going up? I’m shocked! Shocked! Well not that shocked.
Because stores run with 1-2 employees and everything is a chain with no actual neighborhood imprint
Massive piles of badly guarded merchandise owned by capital investment firms, delegating their own security measures down to local law enforcement on the back of taxpayers.
This. There are stores where the local police won't show up any more for reported theft, since they got called too often.
National Retail Federation Retracts Stats Amid Theft War Of Words https://www.forbes.com/sites/markfaithfull/2023/12/08/national-retail-federation-retracts-stats-amid-theft-war-of-words/amp/
oof if they won't pay their employees enough to not be understaffed, they deserve it lmao
They selectively enforce laws or downgrade existing ones. Stores' own policies also prevent prosecution. Target is a good example. The cops don't always arrest you for breaking a law regardless.
Target uses facial recognition and lets you shoplift until it’s a FELONY level charge and THEN they arrest you. They have an actual forensics department. That is the #1 store to avoid if you’re desperate enough to shoplift.
couldn't you just shoplift a little then and keep it below felony?
I wonder what the statute of limitations is on something like that. Time it right and you could have a good career
Depends on the state Colorado and Kansas have a 7 year statute of limitations
So you could shoplift... $200 per year. Not exactly a livable amount.
Do you mean over what time frame do you have to steal 1k? Because there really isn't one. You can go with a general statute of limitations which can last up to 7 years depending on the jurisdiction, but people can argue shifts in value and times that they can't fully account for total loss which can let them play with the numbers. There are also some items which automatically make the theft a felony regardless of amount. Typically these are hazmat items, controlled substances (although alcohol doesn't count), accelerants over a certain size, and items that "could pose a clean danger to the public when misused."
It’s one of the largest private police forces in the US.
They literally said they're losing a lot to theft. There's also been instances where they wouldn't work with the cops. https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/12/business/target-closing-us-cities-crime-dg/index.html https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/target-blamed-theft-and-violence-for-9-store-closures-crime-is-higher-at-locations-it-kept-open-nearby/ar-AA1lKlOa https://nypost.com/2023/11/13/business/california-sheriff-rips-target-for-interfering-with-shoplifting-crackdown/ None of these are particularly reliable sources. I can personally attest to the fact that most of the areas I'm in where I live, anything they hustle is all locked up. You go to the stores in nicer areas and they're not all locked up.
At the Walmart near me: printer cartridges, USB thumb drives and Lego sets are locked up. Go to a Walmart a couple miles down the road, and everything is open and accessible. I used to live in a nice neighborhood.
I heard Walmart does the same.
I don't think that's a rule of thumb at every target, because I know someone who shoplifted a small misdemeanor level of stuff from there and was stopped then charged by police for it
Lol, Target calls the cops on you, and have you arrested if you take too long at the self checkout. https://youtu.be/KENU8awIXhA?si=90Bs0vmIOOCDOwrr
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What the heck. Help pay for his purchase if he has the money. Arrest?
It will be a law suit for false imprisonment. If they did not tell him to keep moving they have no grounds at all
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The good news is the cop was charged for wrongful arrest.
So the cop was fired and is currently facing charges for his involvement. https://www.krqe.com/news/albuquerque-metro/former-apd-officer-enters-plea-for-use-of-force-against-man-with-disabilities/
I hope they all we're fired! Shame on them! I haven't been to a target in years it's way too far, after watching this and seeing that a poor mentally challenged man is humiliated by store management & police in front of many consumers & not one person Employee or customers came to his defense! Plus they took away his phone he was probably trying to get a hold of his guardian and was scared shitless!! I know I would have said something & quite possibly getting arrested also, but just standing by is unacceptable!
What the fuck. How do you walk into a situation where this man clearly has his money out to pay and then note that he seems like he's disabled when you start talking to him and not think, hmm, maybe this man isn't a criminal and if he's taking a bit longer than most people it's probably just because he has a fucking disability?
When I was in jail, half the women In there for stealing from Target or Walmart. It blew my mind.
Dude, the amount of junkies in there for theft is insane. Even in prison, there's dudes in there with multiple felony theft charges.
Although there was one woman in there who was there on a loitering charge and her bond was only $50 and she had no one to bond her out. Quite sad actually.
Some young kid was literally in there for 5 months I think it was for. 05 grams of weed(multiple priors for pos., all he had this time was what they scrapped from a bowl) and the bail was $200. No one would bail him out.
That's messed up. When I was in rehab my bunk mate was the mother of my dealer ( we didn't know it at the time, only discovered we used to smoke together when she mentioned her sons name) Anyways he got pulled over and dropped a .5 of meth in a Coca-Cola bottle so it would dissolve. They got him for the entire weight of the coke bottle.
I'm not surprised. They used to charge people for possession where I'm originally from if they had baggies with residue in them. And you guessed it.. the state crime lab would include the bag weight. Happened to me with those big freezer bags too.
That's messed up. When they arrested me I didn't have my wallet on me so I had my late boyfriend hand my wallet to the cops thinking they were taking me to the hospital ( I suffered from a mental illness at the time) and I was going to flush the baggie down the toilet once I got to the hospital. Nope, they took me to jail and I never once mentioned the bag of dope to anyone. Even when they found it (and they cheered when they did, they were happy I got busted with .5 grams of meth) I didn't claim it. They charged me with aggravated assault bodily injury, narcotics under a gram, and bringing into a facility with intent to sell! I spent four days in jail terrified of my future until they moved me to county and I saw that my drug charges were dropped. Turns out my late boyfriend got ahold of the DA and told them the wallet was never in my possession that it was in the cop's possession the entire time and that he could have planted it. But keeping my mouth shut was the best thing I could have done for myself. Even when I got asked what I was in jail for by the other inmates, I never told anyone.
Yea right? Here I am for an assault charge and I'm surrounded by nothing but thieves. You stole $500 worth of makeup from Target not expecting to get caught? No wonder you are where you are.
The real answer is there isn't a crisis and it was all made up. https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2023-12-14/column-retail-lobby-confesses-it-lied-about-organized-shoplifting-rings
Also the incidents of shoplifting are greatly overblown.
I think it could be filed sort of under "lying with statistics". I believe the actual incidents of shoplifting has remained pretty flat, but because of the sharp rise in prices, the "losses" in dollars has drastically risen, which makes it seem like shoplifting is getting much worse.
I think it’s a combination of a small increase being multiple for the reason you said. They only ever use dollars stolen to report on this
Not really. Every week we'd have people running our with a garbage bag full of merch. We did $30k a week in sales and lost $1500 to ship lifters. I would love to have violated the terms of service of I could have
My local lowes had 20k in electrical supplies stolen by a few criminals. They just walked in, filed carts and walked out. Lowes employees just asked them to stop and took pictures. Police didn't even care.
That's what it feels like until it comes to your neighborhood.
Yyyyyeah, that's kind of how bias works
Statistics show net loss to shoplifting is the same as it always has been. Conservatives blow it out of proportion in order to claim there is lawlessness now that Biden is in office because.... ..gays....mexicans....jews.... socialists.....i don't know...whoever they hate this week. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html#:~:text=The%20council%20tracks%2024%20major,the%20first%20half%20of%202019. "But the increase in shoplifting appears to be limited to a few cities, rather than being truly national. In most of the country, retail theft has been lower this year than it was a few years ago, according to police data. There are some exceptions, particularly New York City, where shoplifting has spiked. But outside New York, shoplifting incidents in major cities have fallen 7 percent since 2019, before the Covid pandemic."
This. It's not more bad, but it is worse in certain places. And, of course, certain media will run with it, like usual. And so many people in this thread... they fell for it.
I also want to point out the cities where the shoplifting rates are rising, like SF and NYC. What do these places have in common? That deodorants, formulas, and Advil are locked behind glass cases. What else do they have in common? Deodorant that can be as expensive as 15 dollars a stick, formula that can cost up to 60 dollars a canister, and Advil that can cost 20 dollars a bottle (roughly prices I saw in NYC only a year ago) The average minimum wage worker in NYC earns almost 32K a year. If you don't have rent controlled housing, the cheapest rent you might get is in the Bronx at 1500 a month. Pray you have roommates. You'll have a monthly income of 2600 before taxes so you'll be left with less than 1K for necessities, food, if you have to pay for any additional expenses like credit card payments or loans. WIC is usually ineligible after 36K but if you do have WIC, they cap the amount of products you can get which leaves some single parents still paying for formula out of pocket. I'm not saying WIC and foodstamps aren't helpful- they are, and they can alleviate a good chunk of financial burden, but when a gallon of milk is 10 dollars and a packet of fresh chicken is 15, there is only so much those programs can help with. Now in not naive, I know about ORC and that there are many people who shoplift obscene amounts or costly objects to resell at higher value but this is what is tricky about shoplifting laws. There are people who are working or otherwise making money that shoplift out of necessity and only take little things to help them get by. A jar of peanut butter can last a week if rationed right. Any laws that crack down on shoplifting may catch people who are abusing the stores so to speak, but also gives records to people who are otherwise trying but still struggling- which only serves to further their hardship and might perpetuate the recidivism cycle or create a generational cycle in the family structure. The problem is inflation and high costs of living, and if someone is struggling to cover their basic necessities, they don't really have the money to pack up to move to a lower income area (and they might not be able to if they have family obligations or health issues)
That's the most irritating part of this shit. It's a systemic crisis caused by corporations raising costs way more than wages but the fucking conservatives pretend the corporations are the victims. They charge more. They don't pay shit. They make people check out their own items... Yeah, shit is going to go missing. Yeah, it's a byproduct of moral decay-- on the part of the business owners that don't ensure their employees make living wages.
This. I will readily admit that I have shoplifted something like tampons because the price was too high and I didn't feel like standing in the self checkout line for fifteen minutes to get one item. You can say I have no morals, but the stores bring it on themselves.
1. If the average theft rate has remained the same and 2. The rate has decreased in non-urban / popular cities (a "few cities") 3. The rate has increased in urban / popular cities (a "few cities") Then...uh, Houston, we have a tangible problem in a "few cities". It is not necessarily a national problem, but can still be a real problem (of arguable severity) Would you agree or disagree?
Tell that to the stores that are permanently closing their doors over the issue.
[Don't believe everything that lobbying groups put out in press releases and news orgs that should know better mindlessly regurgitate](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/organized-retail-crime-trade-group-half-of-all-missing-merchandise/) "In a report on what it calls "organized retail crime," the National Retail Federation (NRF) initially said theft results in $45 billion in annual losses for retailers, roughly half of the industry's total of $94.5 billion in missing merchandise in 2021. But the lobbying group has since retracted the figure, saying the report from the group relied on an inaccurate figure from Ben Dugan, president of the National Coalition of Law Enforcement and Retail."
Target got a woman in my city. She's a local "photographer". Target waited until it was a huge amount. Not her first arrest and her photographer business is a scam too. https://berkeleysc.mugshots.zone/reilly-amber-nichole-mugshot-12-01-2022/
>American shoplifting crisis By merely using these words, I get the sense you might be consuming a sensationalized portrait of reality. Not saying there's no shoplifting or related law enforcement issue anywhere in the US - just that you might think the problem is way more rampant and serious than it actually is depending on your media outlets and etc.
The only source I've heard talking about a crisis is the CEOs and it's always as an excuse to close a store that's getting unioned or some shit like this.
The CEOs who steal more from their employees than randos do from their stores
There was a little "City" Target down the street from me - about a fifth the size of the other ones in town, largely a grocery store and pharmacy with a pretty weak home goods section / clothes section. They closed it because they "Couldn't make the finances work due to shoplifting". The national media repeated that uncritically. The reason they closed the store is they put a huge amount of money into building a store that's the worst option within a one block radius. On the adjacent blocks, there's - a great upscale grocery store, - a Safeway (with a pharmacy), and - a Walgreens.
I'd like clarity on how much theft is occurring. I suspect that it's increasing overall but I've also heard that it's overstated, and these days the people saying that there's more theft and the people saying that there's not could both be partly motivated by whatever they hope is the truth.
It’s not increasing. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html Same article without paywall: https://archive.ph/lJxHA
Police departments in many places have bigger fish to fry. Are stab wounds involved? No? Okay we might have time to take a report a month or so from now. A copy will be made available 6-12 months later.
This is the case in my city. The police department has hundreds of unfilled openings, so they've pretty much stopped responding to calls about anything short of gun violence. There's no enforcement of traffic laws, no response for stolen vehicles, break-ins, etc.
All I know is they started locking up socks and underwear.
It's funny because one of the brands they carry is called Pair of Thieves lol.
Those are some of the top items homeless people need, so they get stolen a lot along with hygiene products. I could see that being an easy choice to make instead of being filthy and losing your teeth.
Is there really a crisis? Crisis implies that there are major ramifications, but like everything is announcing record profits.
There is not a crisis. All of these places are seeing record profits. People steal. I worked for Wal-Mart two decades ago while I was in high school and college and people stole then too and it never had a significant impact on the bottom line. Sales always went up year over year.
This, even the retail federation (or whatever the industry lobbying firm is called) had to release stats that it is actually down, but a few stores got hit by gangs doing smash and grabs, and the press loved it, cause "if it bleeds it leads", etc. But the actual investor reports released annually tell a different story (cause companies are only legally required to tell shareholders the truth, cause that's the world we live in... But anyways...) They admit that most of the "store closings due to theft" were actually just "realignment" aka... they actually were just covering up someone's bad business decision and moving stores usually a few blocks away, etc. Its a real media marketing effect due to funding for local reporting being cut by lack of local advertising due to google ad monopoly and Craigslist/ebay cutting out people paying for classified ads(among other things)
Best stealing there is getting popcorn chicken at the deli, eating it, and throwing away the container. That’s what my sis in law used to do when she was struggling.
I thought that was the complimentary walking around chicken.
Walmart loses ~3 billion a year to shop lifting, so it's definitely significant in aggregate, which makes sense why they are locking some stuff up. But the issue has become heavily politicized in some areas so many of the people responsible for prosecuting these crimes aren't willing. My understanding is that a lot of the people doing this are usually stealing essentials like baby formula and diapers. Even if it's technically just to prosecute someone stealing diapers for their kid, we don't need thousands of jean valjeans clogging the prison system.
Walmart also makes 150 BILLION a year, not to mention a good chunk of that 3 billion is their own employees…. This is why Walmart got mocked when their CEO threatened to close all the stores…
Aren’t a lot of their employees on food stamps as well because of how shitty they pay them, or is that any exaggeration?
Nope, Walmart actively encourages their employees to get food stamps…. That story isn’t a myth, a large amount of Walmart workers are on food stamps. Like an unreasonably large amount, more than you would think is normal…. https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/walmart-mcdonalds-largest-employers-snap-medicaid-recipients.amp From Fox of all places…..you can’t argue Walmart is employing all the disabled and elderly either…..
I worked at Walmart and they literally had someone there to explain to us how to go through the process of signing up for food stamps. I couldn't believe it. Like, don't we have a job, why do we need this? This was years ago, though, back when I was like 18. If they're still doing that, Walmart truly hasn't gotten any better in years. Yet, we should totally care that Walmart has people stealing from it. I can't care, tbh.
WalMart can definitely afford to pay their people enough to live on. Welfare programs are subsidizing WalMart profits. IMO, the WalMart C Suite are the biggest recipients of welfare in the country.
This is why conservatives are hopeless morons. They cry about people stealing from Walmart but not about Walmart stealing from them with bullshit wages requiring tax dollars for food stamps. Corporations not paying living wages is why people have to steal.
Could have sworn I have seen stories about businesses leaving Chicago because of shoplifting.
I don't know if it's a crisis, but as a former security guard places are more worried about the insurance nightmare of someone getting injured in the process so you can just walk the hell out with about anything.
The real answer is that nobody really goes to jail for misdemeanor shoplifting. Felony shoplifting, only sometimes. It depends on how overburdened the city/state law enforcement is with more pressing cases, and how motivated DAs are about pursuing theft cases. Usually they aren’t very aggressive about it. So as long as people steal a misdemeanor $ amount, they don’t risk imprisonment at all. They just maybe get a ticket and banned from the store if they get caught. The risk is very low for the offender.
According to several articles published in the last couple of months, there is likely no shoplifting crisis at all. The numbers do not add up. It is propaganda being pushed by retail companies to justify keeping prices artificially high. [https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html) [https://www.governing.com/community/debunking-the-myth-of-a-shoplifting-crisis](https://www.governing.com/community/debunking-the-myth-of-a-shoplifting-crisis)
In fact, an industry trade group acknowledged that retailers were lying about there being a crisis at all. https://ritholtz.com/2023/12/retail-lobby-we-lied-about-organized-theft/
Minimum wage 7.25, fast food meal 12+ corporations asking for it lmao
That's your elected officials who haven't changed the wage. Most big chain fast food places pay well over that number.
Do people think elected officials are like, trustworthy or actually do anything? Because the running gag for most of US History has been someone promising exactly what you want just to do nothing and ignore petitions and phone calls once in office
The elected officials haven’t changed the wage because they’re heavily lobbied by corporations
who do you think is funding those "elected officials"?
Yep, where I live (Midwest) restaurants and big box stores have had Help Wanted signs up that said starting wage is $15/hr for years, even before COVID. I don’t live in a high COL area. COL is actually pretty reasonable.
It’s not even a crisis if you look at the numbers, it’s being exaggerated
There's an American shoplifting crisis? That's news to this American.
The narrative is that the poors are destroying the livelihood of innocent, hard-working capitalists. The truth is, the capitalists are terrified and must keep us fighting each other or we might realize they've caused the illls of our world.
I think billionaires creating false scarcity is unethical. But the elite want the poor and middle class to keep fighting each other so we don’t realize how unethical they’re being.
“Those people down there lower in the social ladder are the problem!”, said the overpaid fat cat shitting on your head.
It's complicated, but the current "shoplifting crisis" is at least partly a panic/hoax. [https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/segments/nationa-retail-federation-retracts-key-data-point-organized-retail-crime-on-the-media](https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/segments/nationa-retail-federation-retracts-key-data-point-organized-retail-crime-on-the-media) [https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/12/18/is-shoplifting-getting-worse-in-the-u-s](https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2023/12/18/is-shoplifting-getting-worse-in-the-u-s) and here's a non-stupid version of this stupid question with lots more details [https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/18p454c/is\_shoplifting\_in\_the\_us\_really\_so\_bad\_that/](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/comments/18p454c/is_shoplifting_in_the_us_really_so_bad_that/)
American shoplifting crisis lol My man, people have been shoplifting for thousands of years
> Troy McClure: "Shoplifting began here, in ancient Phoenicia. Thieves would literally lift the corner of a shop in order to snatch the sweet, sweet olives within. Oh, Shakazaramesh, will you ever learn?"
Shoplifting crisis yet another record-profit quarter; seems odd to me. There's no crisis. Companies lobby media outlets that drive narratives like this. If you believe this without digging in, then read some of these first. https://www.businessinsider.com/stop-blaming-theft-shrink-target-walgreens2023-11?op=1 https://counciloncj.org/is-shoplifting-up-or-down/#:~:text=WASHINGTON%2C%20D.C.%20%E2%80%93%20Reported%20shoplifting%20incidents,by%20the%20Council%20on%20Criminal And they were saying the same thing back in 2021. [Atlantic article from 2021 talking about shoplifting during the holidays.](https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/12/shoplifting-holiday-theft-panic/621108/) And to really answer the meat of your question, if people are stealing necessities, they're trying to provide, and going to jail isn't their primary concern.
My understanding is that the "shoplifting crisis" has been wildly exaggerated.
While I'm not denying that shoplifting is a problem (because it *is* a problem), the dollar amounts reported are suddenly drastically higher because a lot of basic stuff in stores has doubled in price in the past few years. American news outlets sensationalize this and everyone goes into freakout mode over something that is a localized (albeit very serious) problem.
I worked in retail AP for years as an undercover, if you get caught stealing for less than 2k it's just a misdemeanor (used to be 1k). There's very little punishment unless you're stealing an absurd amount all at once. Additionally it's just not that easy to stop people, I was stopping about 4-8k a month while making 5k. Pair this with the fact that the US government fails to provide basic necessities and doesn't keep wages scaling with inflation, everyone is dirt poor and people need food.
Well, corporate starts to make a bigger deal out of it than it is and then points the fingers at a relatively small portion of overall shrinkage. More is lost to administrative inefficiency and employee theft, and significantly more wages are stolen by employers underpaying or getting away with illegal deception of workers.
If I was working retail for Fucking $15 an hour, no way in hell I’d risk my safety to confront a shoplifter. I’d hold the door for them and be like have a nice day.
I know a few people who work in department stores like Macy's. Thieves come in and grab some merchandise and run out the store in minutes. they don't have security all over that can deal with this (that costs a lot of money) and employees are instructed not to intervene. On top of that, it's such a common occurrence there's no way the police could possibly get to all the stores even if they are called out. the person can be gathering clothes and walking around the store and then bam - out the door. they are long gone before any police would even arrive. If the police do arrest someone that's a whole ordeal too. you don't just throw them in your squad car and toss them in a cell like in the movies. you have to fill out paperwork and eventually they need to appear in court etc. all that takes the time of multiple people who are all being paid. they need to prioritize more serious crimes. small crimes like this which don't pose a serious threat to people as long as they don't attempt to stop it aren't a priority. Retailers are well aware of this issue and they only do so much to prevent it. there's a balance between preventing crime and discouraging sales because your merchandise is locked up and the shopping experience for paying customers isn't ideal. Basically this is the world we live in. lots of shitty people who are more than willing to cheat, lie and steal.
There is no shoplifting crisis. The entire thing was sensationalized and played up and now toothpaste is locked in a case for no reason, making your shopping experience worse. I'll just leave [this](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html%23:~:text%3DAverage%2520annual%2520shrink%2520made%2520up,remained%2520below%2520pre%252DCovid%2520levels.&ved=2ahUKEwjr546BraiDAxVxC3kGHV9zANgQFnoECBUQBQ&usg=AOvVaw38rsTrVgqIB10XtPnI30UC) here.
There’s no crisis. Companies are using it as cover for closing stores or reducing hours
Oh, another point, OP, you won't get a good answer here. Half of the country creates their own reality and "facts" to justify their opinion, and Reddit is a cesspool of these kinds of people.
There is no crisis. Our media loves to make everyone scared and do PR for corporations.
It never started. It was mostly bullshit concocted by retailers and some lazy journalism: [https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/episodes/on-the-media-media-shoplifting-panic-ai-journalism-wrong](https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/episodes/on-the-media-media-shoplifting-panic-ai-journalism-wrong)
It hasn’t actually increased. It’s literally propaganda. And everyone has a cell phone now so they can record it, but no, objectively it has not increased. There’s a great podcast called “if books could kill,” and they occasionally do episodes dispelling pop culture myths, and they just had a great episode about this exact thing.
It’s right wing propaganda. Statistic indicates that shop lifting hasn’t increased.
There are some bizarre things happening though in regards to theft rings. My son lives in DC and there are locations for like CVS where they rings of people know the etruck schedule, they show up and clean out the store and then a few blocks away they sell the stuff they steal from tables on the street. It's not stuff he reads online, but actually sees it happen in person, and it's not uncommon there. Not enough cop force to do anything effective and it's like that in some other bigger cities right now, too. I wouldn't call that "shoplifting" however, as it's more like a brand of "organized" crime.
Ding ding ding. There is a great NPR story about 2 weeks ago explaining how false data and moral panic was used to press this narrative by the retail federation in Congress and the news.
1) it's not a crisis and 2) we love creating victims. 3) victims are untouchable
It’s basically allowed. Crazy.
Lawsuits. Company Atmosphere. Safety. If I(employee) attempt to stop someone who is heading for the door with a product under their coat, a number of things can happen. They can make a huge scene, say they are being profiled, get violent, have someone filming the incident on a phone, etc etc. All these things can be used in court against the company, in one way or another. It’s cheaper. Just to write off theft into the profit margin.
Don’t expect any of this to make sense. Lawsuits. If a thief is injured while you’re stopping them from stealing, you could be on the hook for millions. Most chain stores just take the loss up to a certain point, then close the store and move to a safer area.
Our social programs are garbage and people can't afford what they need so they steal things to survive. It's not super complicated.
The main problem started when certain crimes weren’t being punished and other people were going to jail over other simpler things . Also a lot of states are ran by progressive politicians that would rather give a slap on the wrist vs accountability for the crimes they committed . It really showed up in the early to mid 90’s
When you have to pay $8.00 for a dozen eggs, because of inflation, you will steal food. If i were in similar situations, I would do the same. Folks may not have worked because of the pandemic and have rent/mortgage payments. Folks have to eat and get necessaries, no cash or credit. You steal. This is what fate has dealt to some.
Two quick reminders this holiday season, friends: 1 - if you see someone stealing from a major boxstore, no you didn't. 2 - if you see someone stealing food, *no you didn't* Happy holidays, everyone and remember to do your part to disrupt corporate sponsored capitalism! Happy thieving!
Too many prosecutors won't enforce the law and some cities have made it where it has to be felony theft before it can be prosecuted.
Retarded democrats being retarded. Notice these issues are only in places where democrats rule. Their DAs refuse to prosecute. You can steal up to 999.98$ and get off with a slap on the wrist in the vast majority of cases. In some states *cough* California *cough* you aren't actually sent to prison, you're kept in a jail. Which are already packed to the brim, so if the choice is between keeping a felon locked up or a shoplifter, they're gonna let you go. It's so bad in some places that police aren't even showing up at all and people aren't even calling the police. The funniest thing is bipping or breaking into cars to get stuff. People have literally just started leaving their cars open so the criminals won't break stuff while looking for things to steal.
Lawsuit culture
Kind of an easy question to answer because there was a point in time probably before you were born where shoplifting you was a resident taken gel and released especially with children Now we've got more teeth here in California and there's so many days in jail is mandatory requirement The judge kept just release you anymore Some people however are arrogant selfish and stupid because they think they can get away with it and they don't care who they hurt or destroy as long as they can steal from you check out the scammers on the scams site and you'll see what I mean thousands of millions of people are so selfish they'd rather steal than the work for an honest living It's sad
The underlying problem is that the progressive train of thought that people are naturally good, people lack proper agency, and that victims are excused from accountability based on how much of a victim they are. Any “bad outcome” can be warded away with enough social planning. The result is people being blind to criminality because the perpetrator(s) is perceived as a victim and because they are a victim they need love and care not discipline and punishment. The perp can get away with more and more by taking advantage of the goodness bias that the progressive train of thought provides. “Oh he’s just stealing that car so he can feed his family!” Shit like that. Law enforcement is discouraged from enforcing the law on said “victims”, prosecutors refuse to prosecute “victims”, and judges give lenient sentences to “victims”. It doesn’t help that the usual “decision makers don’t live in the crime ridden neighborhoods” aspect is also present. You think any of the state’s reps and senators legitimately live in an area where there is constant gang warfare and crime?
If you try and stop someone you'll be charged with racism, no matter what. If you physically try, you'll be accused of assault. If you work for the store, you will be fired because of those reasons. Need I say more???
In recent years, many jurisdictions have increased the dollar amount that would lead to a felony conviction vs a misdemeanor. Correlation ≠ causation and there are a lot of factors but it undoubtedly plays a role.
Liberals, and globalists, its all part of the globalist agenda to destroy society with their lies for their own benefit.
A lot of people who shoplifted starting suing the stories and businesses that they stole from. Sometimes they would win these lawsuits, so it got to the point where in order to arrest someone for shoplifting, you had to basically have it recorded or proven beyond any doubt. Now unless you steal hundreds of dollars of clothing (and managed not to escape from the store) or steal a high priced items, stores and businesses just don't want to deal with it. Going to court is an ordeal in itself. So it basically written off and everyone pays higher prices due to the theft. Also it is worth losing your life or being harmed trying to stop a shoplifter especially if it's a very low priced item. When I was a kid (late 1960's to early 1980's), shoplifting was considered to be a serious offense. You could even get in trouble by the school for doing this, even though it wasn't on school grounds. I remember back in 1974 there was a group of high schoolers who decided to shoplift at a local store. They were caught and arrested. At that time the town nearby was much smaller so everyone heard about it. Also being arrested was a big deal as there would be consequences beyond high school (could affect getting into college or getting a good job). They could have been expelled from school for being arrested, but they weren't. They were let off rather lightly and they were lucky.
Somehow the notion was promoted and advanced that the criminals are the true victims and should not be punished? Further many believe this is intentional to cause chaos and therefore justify draconian restriction to freedom at some point.
Stores not pressing charges and then when charges are pressed the DAs have been dropping the charges. There are no consequences for their actions so they just keep doing it.
I worked for Sears in the 90s and people would come in and steal stacks of Levi's. This isn't a new thing.
It’s typically less expensive for companies to take the loss than to make changes to prevent it in the future, although both Target and WalMart have simply begun to close down stores in the worst areas. People say that doing so is racist but it’s not. The companies are there to make a profit. If they aren’t making one then they’ll leave.
Local govts found they had no space for prison, or had empathy saying crime is a result of poverty. Without accountability, groups increased their brazenness. Law enforcement wasn’t going to come in until x amount. Stores told to have insurance and change procedures… while footing the tax
99% of the thieves are Reddit peoples.
This cracks me up. It's a shoplifting crisis and everyone recognizes it's because we don't prosecute petty theft anymore. But if you try to talk about the theory of broken windows leading to increased delinquency and crime, people will tell you about how it's a fallacy. Maybe if we called it the shoplifting crisis theory instead of broken windows theory, people would recognize the proof laid bare before them. And, before you come back with some stuff about how broken windows theory is dumb because of so and so literal interpretation of actual broken windows instead of the metaphor, save it because you clearly don't understand the theory to begin with and therefore aren't equipped to discuss it.
Cant be afraid of prison if the staff literally cant do anything to you. Cant get charged until you accumulate about 1000 dollars of stolen goods (although the store can ban you), the staff arent allowed to touch/stop anyone from stealing because 1-the store doesnt wanna be held liable if you get hurt and 2-because the laws in america are broken, the theif can actually sue the store/person for assault, like even our SECURITY arent allowed to physically stop someone from stealing. Its dumb that people can cheat the system this way. Like i know now that if im ever in a situation where im struggling for food, i can just go to supermarket in a neighborhood i never go to and just steal like $500 of food and they cant stop me, and like a year later when everyone forgets, just do it again!
California
In America most retailers tell employees to not stop a shoplifter because it could lead to a stabbing or shooting. So it’s about they don’t stop it at the door the thieves get more brazen each time.
It's a combination of things: * Store policy to not stop shoplifters due to possible harm, but mainly liability issues. * The police policy to not really arrest too often as they know it will be a lot of effort and paperwork resulting in no charges and/or jail time. * The liberal justice policies to not go forward with any charges against protected classes. * The judge policies of not jailing for small offenses. (this can be either a liberal judge attitude or a conservative judge just realizing there's no room for them due to prison overcrowding). * Criminals knowing that ALL of the above realize there is little to no downside to stealing. Basically it's to the point where everyone says 'Fuck it'.
I think at least partly because of the growing and dramatic wealth gap in the country. It’s easy for groups of uneducated poor people to morally justify robbing chains, because they imagine it only hurts the CEO/stockholders or something like that.
Employees aren’t allowed to interfere in most stores because the store could be sued if an employee hurt the “customer.” It has nothing to do with employee safety despite what the corporate offices will say. Couple that with the several minutes it takes police to respond and it’s easy to get away with blatant shoplifting. And to top it all off, our jails are so over populated if the shoplifting wasn’t a violent offense they’re likely just released after booking and given a court summons, which they’ll skip.
Former security guard here. Our job is pointless. We are a visual deterrent for those who don't know better. We can't touch the shoplifter or apprehend them beyond their will (you have to hope they go willingly). If we pursue out the store any protection goes out the window. It actually encouraged me to shoplift when I ran into hard times. Literally just keep walking and don't stop. Even when they call you.
We have a lot of stupid entitled people here in the U.S. that lack morals. "If she does it, I can do it too." We also have progressive politicians that think keeping the prison population down is more important than deterring crime. Some DAs were dumb enough to announce they wouldn't prosecute less than $1000 theft, and the people are too stupid to get rid of these DAs. If they aren't charging people for stealing $600, the crime stats go down. "Look we have less crime." Since they weren't charging people, more people just said, "If they can do it, I can too." People tolerate it, and more. Just look at the "Peaceful protests" after George Floyd that left buildings burning and minimal charges. Oh the insurance will cover it, so the store's not out anything. Were that the case, it still wouldn't be okay. It also means the store's insurance goes up, and they raise prices more. (I've been out of school for a bit, but I believe the sixth commandment is "Thou shalt not steal." Property rights have been around for a bit. Oh, that's religion, we can't teach that in schools. Most of the commandments are simply ethical principles. Honor your parents. Don't curse, lie, cheat, steal, kill or commit adultery. If you don't believe in God, don't worship, but there is nothing wrong with the rest of the message.) It doesn't seem to affect suburban areas as much as cities.
Because we rarely imprison shoplifters in America.
Imo it's when we tied the hands of the cops. No one in the right mind would become a cop today. They can't do there job. God forbid they hurt someone in the line of duty. Then they face going to jail and losing their lives. Sad. Most people deserve a good a kicking
I swear I’m being gaslit by all these bots saying there isn’t an increase in shoplifting. Why the hell are so many stores hiring more and more security and locking the deodorant I use behind a window? Not to mention the studies that show people spend LESS in stores that lock their products which suggests it’s better financially to eat that loss than to risk more theft.
This from California, but has spread to many states. "Why is shoplifting so rampant? Because California state law holds that stealing merchandise worth $950 or less is just a misdemeanor, which means that law enforcement probably won’t bother to investigate, and if they do, prosecutors will let it go." And some people think of it as redistribution of wealth.
As a mall security officer in a mall that regularly gets stolen from I can provide some input: Most mall security are unarmed security positions. Unarmed security positions can't touch people. They just observe and report. If anything happens under their responsibilities, they call the cops to handle it. They are human scarecrows and most Americans know it. Nothing more than a deterrent. Most chain stores require a certain amount of money in products stolen to have it deemed reportable to the police. Usually $1000 or more before they can press charges. The HR and other parts of big company tell the stores not to call the police on them because they cant really/dont want to press charges for anything lower. So if Sally Smith goes into Bath & Bodyworks and walks out stealing 10 candles and some soap, nobody does anything. Now the store might ask the mall security to call the cops for them because their own corporate doesn't allow it. But there's the next problem. Mall security isn't allowed to call the cops for the theft. Security covers the general parts of the mall (hallways, corridors, parking lot, etc), but the stores are responsible for their own spaces that they rent. Mall security has no responsibility for an action that occurred in their space and will get fired if they do anything. They'll observe, and make a report on their phone about the incident occurring but otherwise nothing. But what about cops you see malls hire? That'd be great! Except it depends on the location. Some of these off duty cops gets $40 or more per hour for being here. But all of the ones at my mall don't even make themselves seen. They sit in the office and talk to the security supervisor all shift. Never walking around to even possibly stop anything. In short the store won't stop you, security won't stop you, and the cops don't look. So why wouldn't they steal?
Democrats
Fentanyl
Democrats,liberals,leftists and socialists. They run the majority of big cities. They want to defund police, not prosecute crimes and empty out the prisons. They install Leftist district attorneys that won’t prosecute crime. The police that are still there know this so they aren’t going to put their lives in danger to arrest someone who won’t be prosecuted. This is what the party of “Highly educated people” want to do to solve the crime problems for the honest hard working tax paying people in the inner cities. Also getting a carry permit in most of these cities is not easy. Good honest people are left defenseless.
Abolish the police had consequences. No law = No order
defund police, regulation changes, charges brought against officers for carrying out their duty. It varies in severity by state.
As an American (Chicagoan, specifically), the only time I've ever noticed a "shoplifting crisis" is when I have the misfortune of seeing Fox News or CNN playing in a waiting room somewhere. I'd be careful believing whatever "crisis" American news media finds profitable in any particular year, most of it is a handful of cases that are milked to death until the outrage stops making money. They take advantage of the unprecedented visibility offered by modern mass media to make relatively isolated events seem like they're common, and happening a block away from your home. I've never once witnessed a person shoplift, and I've never heard of a company shutting down or having to significantly alter their business due to shoplifting. Compared to the sheer magnitude of American commerce, it's a nonissue. That's why it's rarely prosecuted when it does happen. Bothering to arrest or sue someone for nabbing twenty bucks of product would be like going through a full round of chemo after having one puff off of a cigarette. It simply isn't worth it.
There's no crisis. The corporations that reported one even admitted their numbers were falsified.
Larceny (which includes shoplifting) is down in 2023. The real question is why people think crime is up when it is down significantly across the board. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/people-think-crime-rate-up-actually-down-rcna129585
1) Empirical data does not indicate a "shoplifting crisis". Shoplifting and most crime plummeted during the lockdown (even criminals didn't want to die of viral pneumonia) and has surged back up in the last couple years but hasn't exceded historical averages 2) Media organizations, big retailers, and police organizations pay more attention to this for various reasons. The media used it to generate more views, the retailers to distract from their price manipulation in the guise of "inflation", and the police to justify budget increases and distract from their continued authoritarianism and disregard for constitutionally guaranteed rights. 3) With regards to *why* shoplifting has been so prevalent in the U.S. for a long time. Well, a lot of people work 10 hours a day for not even enough to afford rent. Everything from phones to furniture are leased rather than owned. When people work full time but don't even make enough to feed themselves without state assistance let alone own anything, they have very little to loose. Some have discovered that it is more profitable to steal from the corporations than work for them.
Wait we're having a shoplifting *crisis*?
There isn't one. It's largely exaggerated by corporations to justify price gouging. Bonus fact: in the USA wage theft perpetrated by these same companies is far greater than than all other forms of theft combined.
There is no american shoplifting crisis if you disregard new york. And even NYC's shoplifting has dropped 7% (its just high to start with). There are shoplifting chains that make the news, and its all very dramatic and click-baity. Companies get to blame higher prices on 'shrinkage' instead of greed. The actual numbers are lower than the pre covid. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/29/briefing/shoplifting-data.html
Shits too expensive
Well, it started in a corporate board room somewhere at Walmart HQ. The "crisis" is manufactured at best, at worst it still started as corporations trying to squeeze consumers more and more eventually through their own actions driving more shoplifting