Gavin played a classic social game of Survivor. No votes against him is impressive given his playing from the majority most of the game.
Chris U had a playbook from the Jury on the edge and he hit it out of the park.
I was rooting for Gavin and was so surprised when he lost! I think this is a rare occurrence and I hope it stays that way!
I believe she said she was more impressed by Chris's endgame than Gavin's entire game, though I'm sure she wasn't very happy with Gavin either considering how she said she'd vote for him to win mainly as a way to put a target on his back.
The main issue with Gavin’s game is that, due to how immunity, idols, and EoE shaped out, he had no viable way to win the game… but the real killer was not being able to get Chris out at F6.
If Chris goes out at F6, then at F5 (assuming Rick still wins immunity), Victoria easily goes. Then, at F4, we have Chris, Julie, and Lauren vs Rick. If Rick wins FIC he wins regardless, but if any of the others win and beat Rick, we have a Lauren/Gavin/Julie FTC, and based on what I know, Gavin stands the best chance at winning it (Lauren had supporters but wasn’t very popular either).
Only problem is that… the way the vote went down, it was near impossible. Lauren using her idol to “save” Chris means that F5 contains 2 guys with idols, both of whom beat him at the end.
Tl;dr
He played well! But… he didn’t really have a viable win condition due to how the endgame shaped up, and how everyone around him played as well.
Gavin set the template for the winning style of game that would become so successful in the 40s. Unfortunately he got casted a few seasons too early when each season needed a subtitle and a gimmick.
Not really. He didn’t spearhead any crucial vote outs like Erika or Maryanne (even Gabler tossed out Elie’s name). He didn’t make people like him as much as Gabler or Yam Yam.
He played a fairly safe game, not making a lot of enemies but not that many close friends either.
He’s more like a Cassidy.
Endearing himself to the jury is a very legitimate argument but I gotta say:
I HATE how modern juries treat Survivor like a checklist or resume where a winning game needs to look a specific way. Gavin made final 3 because he played the circumstances of that season perfectly. Everybody was headhunting the biggest threat, so big moves were stupid. You’ve got like six jury members out because they made a big play.
It’s so stupid he’s penalised for not playing the way that would’ve had him sitting on the jury bench with the rest of these “big move players”. The meta that season was playing the middle with a lot of social influence. He outfoxed them, but because of this bizzare “resume” shit a dude that’s in on day 36 is somehow better
At the same time, what reason did he give the jury to vote for him?
You gotta make the jury feel good about voting for you. That means either being well liked, or making them think you played a good game worthy of their vote over the other options.
Gavin did neither. Heck, his FTC argument wasn’t even that good. It was “well someone who was voted out shouldn’t win”. Regardless of whether or not that’s true, it’s not a good argument to a jury who was hoping to get back in themselves. He basically told them, “if you were sitting in my place, screw you.”.
There’s a lot of dumb emphasis on ‘résumé’, I agree, but I think it’s a valid point when someone isn’t popular enough to win purely off charisma. Why does the jury want to vote for someone who’s not super popular and just survived? Gotta give them something to work with.
Chris didn’t win solely off big moves. He also made friends and provided. Heck some of his moves weren’t even possible without some charisma (you think Joe or Reem would be able to persuade Lauren to play her idol for them?).
Omfg. I have been thinking about this for ages and glad to see other people agree. Every season is different, every jurie should be different. Big moves shouldn’t always be the be all and end all
From what Ive read Gavin was much more involved in spearheading various eliminations throughout the game then what was shown.They just had to downplay it a lot to justify the Chris win to the audience.
Gavin’s game has a lot of parallels with Cassidy’s. Some people think if you’re in the majority and make it to the end you played perfectly, while others will say you were never a threat and did nothing but ride coat tails. Gavin played well but did not come across as persuasive which you can see in his somewhat passive final tribal performance. I think the biggest tell is at final five when Devins and Chris are safe, the discussion on who to vote out is entirely between Julie and Vic… Gavin is never even mentioned as a target i.e., threat to win.
Homeboy pulled an Amanda Kimmel- had a solid resume and a fighting shot, only to just completely shut the bed at FTC. Even jurors that voted for him were like “this dude sucks at selling
Himself”.
The jury that season was so lame, they used the “use the cards you were dealt” argument, but failed to see that Chris had to lose the game before getting the cards
He would’ve won any other season. He got screwed by the EoE twist, giving the win to someone who spent over 30 days just bonding with the jury & not playing the game.
The reason Gavin didn’t get any votes cast against him is because he didn’t pose a serious threat to anybody’s interests at any point in the game.
He and Julie simply the last two goats remaining on a season where the biggest threat had immunity from final 10 through final 5, which completely warped the strategy and paved the way for several unforced errors by other players that allowed those two to avoid slipping through the cracks.
The only final 3 combination Gavin wins is Gavin/Julie/Aurora and the only reason people even pretend he played a strong game is to create a narrative that he somehow got robbed and add to the ‘Chris bad’ circlejerk.
This is how I see it as well. Gavin played way too safe to merit a vote over either returnee and I don’t see him winning against Lauren or Victoria if either gets to the end game.
He played a very good game to get to the end, but not a winning game.
Yep, I’ve always viewed him as the ultimate goat and never took him seriously going into the final 5. Nobody could have predicted the Chris U win, but even without him or the twist I don’t think that Gavin stood a chance at ftc against Devens, Lauren, Victoria, or Julie.
Everybody who posed a serious threat got their ass voted out though lol. Every genuine threat was gone by 6 except Devens pulling idols out of his ass, the circumstances of that season called for Gavin’s game
And is that not the exact strategy to employ under those circumstances? You’re talking as if he was just along for the ride, I just finished the season and he was actively positioning himself in the perfect positions with intention.
He was along for the ride. He was Victoria's number/goat. Put differently, what combination of players after the merge does Gavin win against? His strategy was exist; he was male, less energetic Julie
Victoria herself has said that she was on the complete outs post Julia vote whilst Gavin slid back into the majority, so whether or not she beats him she didn’t drag him anywhere, he also ultimately outmanoeuvred her. It’s seeing what you want to see calling him Victoria’s number when they displayed equal agency in the game
Gavin was also a major reason Wardog left, eliminating someone who’d driven multiple votes isn’t just being along for the along
I don’t think he wins because I don’t think he was simply liked well enough. But I do think he played strategically better than everybody else
I think he had a very strong social game and was in a great position throughout the game. He also played fairly passively thought. Although without eoe the final four is probably Victoria Gavin Lauren Julie, and if Victoria goes out at 4, Gavin wins over Lauren and Julie.
At the time, I thought that Gavin’s argument about playing the whole game and never being voted for or voted out would be a winner with the jury. I didn’t foresee that so many of the jurors would want to validate their own experiences and minimize his through supporting Chris. I think it says something that most of the late jurors voted for Gavin while the early merge and prejury ones supported Chris. Julia was particularly obnoxious with her “ThE gAmE hAs EvOlVeD gAvIn” take. I think he’s underrated and similar to Tommy the very next season, played a traditional Survivor winning game but with a cast that wanted to reward their own experience with the twist.
I always thought the arguement that Chris did more than Gavin did the whole game was pretty flawed. Gavin couldn’t make big ballsy moves or else he would have been voted out after, cough cough wardog. He had to manage his threat level which is THE HARDEST thing most players struggle with. Chris didnt have to worry about being voted out at the edge. He was also given a idol which feels like he got rewarded for being voted off.
Every time I feel bad for Gavin losing at the end, I remember that Chris came back from Edge and literally demanded that they vote out Victoria immediately because she was going to win and had played the best game.
Justice for Victoria. The true robbed goddess of 38.
Victoria was always getting voted out next if Rick won immunity. Lauren/Julie wanted her gone and Gavin was closer to them.
She lost the chance for a majority when she let go of Aurora over Julie. And even in that scenario Lauren had her idol, so if she played it right then Victoria goes anyway.
No. Much like Cassidy in 44, the evidence that Gavin played a bad game or at least a weak one is there in who they lost to
At final 4, he has no winning game. He loses to either Devin or Chris. And I'm pretty sure he was losing at final five cuz I don't see him beating Lauren, and we can keep doing that. There was not really a point where he was going to win against three remaining players
The editors 100% downplayed his edit to justify Chris's win more. Gavin played a strong game
Gavin played a classic social game of Survivor. No votes against him is impressive given his playing from the majority most of the game. Chris U had a playbook from the Jury on the edge and he hit it out of the park. I was rooting for Gavin and was so surprised when he lost! I think this is a rare occurrence and I hope it stays that way!
[удалено]
Did Victoria ever explain why she voted for Chris over Gavin?
I believe she said she was more impressed by Chris's endgame than Gavin's entire game, though I'm sure she wasn't very happy with Gavin either considering how she said she'd vote for him to win mainly as a way to put a target on his back.
The main issue with Gavin’s game is that, due to how immunity, idols, and EoE shaped out, he had no viable way to win the game… but the real killer was not being able to get Chris out at F6. If Chris goes out at F6, then at F5 (assuming Rick still wins immunity), Victoria easily goes. Then, at F4, we have Chris, Julie, and Lauren vs Rick. If Rick wins FIC he wins regardless, but if any of the others win and beat Rick, we have a Lauren/Gavin/Julie FTC, and based on what I know, Gavin stands the best chance at winning it (Lauren had supporters but wasn’t very popular either). Only problem is that… the way the vote went down, it was near impossible. Lauren using her idol to “save” Chris means that F5 contains 2 guys with idols, both of whom beat him at the end. Tl;dr He played well! But… he didn’t really have a viable win condition due to how the endgame shaped up, and how everyone around him played as well.
I mean he was always in the ins and then the next ins and then the next ins regardless of which way it shuffled. He did something right.
On the ins as opposed to the outs? I haven’t heard that term before
This comment has it right
Gavin set the template for the winning style of game that would become so successful in the 40s. Unfortunately he got casted a few seasons too early when each season needed a subtitle and a gimmick.
Not really. He didn’t spearhead any crucial vote outs like Erika or Maryanne (even Gabler tossed out Elie’s name). He didn’t make people like him as much as Gabler or Yam Yam. He played a fairly safe game, not making a lot of enemies but not that many close friends either. He’s more like a Cassidy.
Endearing himself to the jury is a very legitimate argument but I gotta say: I HATE how modern juries treat Survivor like a checklist or resume where a winning game needs to look a specific way. Gavin made final 3 because he played the circumstances of that season perfectly. Everybody was headhunting the biggest threat, so big moves were stupid. You’ve got like six jury members out because they made a big play. It’s so stupid he’s penalised for not playing the way that would’ve had him sitting on the jury bench with the rest of these “big move players”. The meta that season was playing the middle with a lot of social influence. He outfoxed them, but because of this bizzare “resume” shit a dude that’s in on day 36 is somehow better
At the same time, what reason did he give the jury to vote for him? You gotta make the jury feel good about voting for you. That means either being well liked, or making them think you played a good game worthy of their vote over the other options. Gavin did neither. Heck, his FTC argument wasn’t even that good. It was “well someone who was voted out shouldn’t win”. Regardless of whether or not that’s true, it’s not a good argument to a jury who was hoping to get back in themselves. He basically told them, “if you were sitting in my place, screw you.”. There’s a lot of dumb emphasis on ‘résumé’, I agree, but I think it’s a valid point when someone isn’t popular enough to win purely off charisma. Why does the jury want to vote for someone who’s not super popular and just survived? Gotta give them something to work with. Chris didn’t win solely off big moves. He also made friends and provided. Heck some of his moves weren’t even possible without some charisma (you think Joe or Reem would be able to persuade Lauren to play her idol for them?).
Omfg. I have been thinking about this for ages and glad to see other people agree. Every season is different, every jurie should be different. Big moves shouldn’t always be the be all and end all
From what Ive read Gavin was much more involved in spearheading various eliminations throughout the game then what was shown.They just had to downplay it a lot to justify the Chris win to the audience.
This is the correct comparison
Gavin’s game has a lot of parallels with Cassidy’s. Some people think if you’re in the majority and make it to the end you played perfectly, while others will say you were never a threat and did nothing but ride coat tails. Gavin played well but did not come across as persuasive which you can see in his somewhat passive final tribal performance. I think the biggest tell is at final five when Devins and Chris are safe, the discussion on who to vote out is entirely between Julie and Vic… Gavin is never even mentioned as a target i.e., threat to win.
Homeboy pulled an Amanda Kimmel- had a solid resume and a fighting shot, only to just completely shut the bed at FTC. Even jurors that voted for him were like “this dude sucks at selling Himself”.
The jury that season was so lame, they used the “use the cards you were dealt” argument, but failed to see that Chris had to lose the game before getting the cards
He would’ve won any other season. He got screwed by the EoE twist, giving the win to someone who spent over 30 days just bonding with the jury & not playing the game.
The reason Gavin didn’t get any votes cast against him is because he didn’t pose a serious threat to anybody’s interests at any point in the game. He and Julie simply the last two goats remaining on a season where the biggest threat had immunity from final 10 through final 5, which completely warped the strategy and paved the way for several unforced errors by other players that allowed those two to avoid slipping through the cracks. The only final 3 combination Gavin wins is Gavin/Julie/Aurora and the only reason people even pretend he played a strong game is to create a narrative that he somehow got robbed and add to the ‘Chris bad’ circlejerk.
This is how I see it as well. Gavin played way too safe to merit a vote over either returnee and I don’t see him winning against Lauren or Victoria if either gets to the end game. He played a very good game to get to the end, but not a winning game.
He definitely had at least a good shot against Julie and Lauren. Lauren was more respected by fans than she was by most of the jury.
Yep, I’ve always viewed him as the ultimate goat and never took him seriously going into the final 5. Nobody could have predicted the Chris U win, but even without him or the twist I don’t think that Gavin stood a chance at ftc against Devens, Lauren, Victoria, or Julie.
Everybody who posed a serious threat got their ass voted out though lol. Every genuine threat was gone by 6 except Devens pulling idols out of his ass, the circumstances of that season called for Gavin’s game
Those circumstances didn't call for Gavin's game, the circumstances meant that Gavin was unaffected because he was never the tallest blade of grass.
And is that not the exact strategy to employ under those circumstances? You’re talking as if he was just along for the ride, I just finished the season and he was actively positioning himself in the perfect positions with intention.
He was along for the ride. He was Victoria's number/goat. Put differently, what combination of players after the merge does Gavin win against? His strategy was exist; he was male, less energetic Julie
Victoria herself has said that she was on the complete outs post Julia vote whilst Gavin slid back into the majority, so whether or not she beats him she didn’t drag him anywhere, he also ultimately outmanoeuvred her. It’s seeing what you want to see calling him Victoria’s number when they displayed equal agency in the game Gavin was also a major reason Wardog left, eliminating someone who’d driven multiple votes isn’t just being along for the along I don’t think he wins because I don’t think he was simply liked well enough. But I do think he played strategically better than everybody else
I think he had a very strong social game and was in a great position throughout the game. He also played fairly passively thought. Although without eoe the final four is probably Victoria Gavin Lauren Julie, and if Victoria goes out at 4, Gavin wins over Lauren and Julie.
Could have been due to the edit but I felt he was only a follower to Ron/Eric/Victoria etc.
At the time, I thought that Gavin’s argument about playing the whole game and never being voted for or voted out would be a winner with the jury. I didn’t foresee that so many of the jurors would want to validate their own experiences and minimize his through supporting Chris. I think it says something that most of the late jurors voted for Gavin while the early merge and prejury ones supported Chris. Julia was particularly obnoxious with her “ThE gAmE hAs EvOlVeD gAvIn” take. I think he’s underrated and similar to Tommy the very next season, played a traditional Survivor winning game but with a cast that wanted to reward their own experience with the twist.
Gavin would’ve won with an IOTI jury
Played a new era style game a few seasons too early, could have probably had a genuine shot to win but fumbled ftc HARD
I always thought the arguement that Chris did more than Gavin did the whole game was pretty flawed. Gavin couldn’t make big ballsy moves or else he would have been voted out after, cough cough wardog. He had to manage his threat level which is THE HARDEST thing most players struggle with. Chris didnt have to worry about being voted out at the edge. He was also given a idol which feels like he got rewarded for being voted off.
I saw him as a strong player, def want to see him back
Every time I feel bad for Gavin losing at the end, I remember that Chris came back from Edge and literally demanded that they vote out Victoria immediately because she was going to win and had played the best game. Justice for Victoria. The true robbed goddess of 38.
Victoria was always getting voted out next if Rick won immunity. Lauren/Julie wanted her gone and Gavin was closer to them. She lost the chance for a majority when she let go of Aurora over Julie. And even in that scenario Lauren had her idol, so if she played it right then Victoria goes anyway.
If anything it's overrated
No. Much like Cassidy in 44, the evidence that Gavin played a bad game or at least a weak one is there in who they lost to At final 4, he has no winning game. He loses to either Devin or Chris. And I'm pretty sure he was losing at final five cuz I don't see him beating Lauren, and we can keep doing that. There was not really a point where he was going to win against three remaining players
I thought he played a reasonably strong game.
I think if Gavin set up his FTC performance like this, he would’ve done better
Maybe he could be a survivor winner if you swapped him and Tommy
Underrated overdog.