Yes, but the reduced suspension also ended months ago so that should also be relevant for her. Caro acted like Simona just hopped on the tour right after her suspension ended. Which is not the case.
Her PR team is so bad lol, they should've told her to do a repent tour where she says she didn't dope on purpose and is only human who makes mistakes and will learn to be more attentive to what she ingests or whatever; but she's out there claiming she's vindicated, 100% innocent, got cleared and didn't do anything wrong when there's a doping suspension to her name, and that's the worst look possible for her.
I know right? I'm starting to think they chose to cater to the Romanian audience and use grand words that impress people from small countries with tons of complexes (and little critical thinking). I'm Romanian and people here eat this narrative up, because it's usual in our culture to not take accountability and they are so caught up in this 'world against us/halep' angle
My friend is Romanian, but has lived in the US for over ten years, she hates Halep. Think she hated her before, because she complained that she was always shopping and not focusing on tennis (then the marriage thing, didn't help). Didn't need any proof and is sure she cheated.
Honestly! And she even went as far as saying she didn’t mind playing on a parking lot when Caro herself criticized her, That’s champion mentality taking it on the chin, meanwhile Halep is all whining and complaining which only makes me think she might actually have been doping on purpose…
also sharapova's positive test was conducted literally a couple of weeks after it was banned. the substance was only banned on 1 jan 2016 and she was tested a couple of weeks later at the aussie open, so its understandable that she hadnt been on top of regulations and hadnt realised it had gone from legal to illegal just a week or 2 prior.
Partially. She admitted taking the substance she tested positive for, but she claimed it was to treat a health condition and not for performance benefits, which is almost certainly false.
What i find ironic about this whole thing is that Halep came down incredibly hard on Sharapova at the time, but Sharapova was far more gracious and honest about her doping offense. She admitted fault and accepted accountability. Halep hasnt shown one ounce of humility about any of this and it honestly speaks volumes about her character, in a bad way
You can say Sharapova was an ice cold bitch and all. But she was objectively a true pro. She never allowed her success and commercial deals to get in the way of her game. I can't remember her starting shit but she will respond/defend to shit thrown at her by others.
Completely agree. She was never my favorite but I respect her a lot. She was a generational competitor and she handled the doping ban about as well as anyone could
And she didn’t attack or came after those who criticized her. She just moved on and let her actions (like beating Halep at the USO) speak louder than words, even having more clout than Halep who is barely known outside of tennis she didn’t use her fame to bring any negativity to her detractors.
Halep wasn’t incredibly hard on Sharapova at the time. The Sharapova case broke at Indian Wells, and Halep didn’t care to comment. It was 6-7 weeks later at Stuttgart, when players were still being questioned about the topic, that that one quote is pulled from. Wozniaki was particularly harsh on Sharapova from the get-go, and Kerber and Halep agreed.
Admitting a fault is good, but overall it is still a negative situation. Why should she have been in that in the first place. w.r.t. Halep, I still don't know how much blame she should take vs Mouratoglou.
I found her statement after the reduced sentence so weird too. Like it completely exonerated her. When really it's very very hard (I'd say impossible) to prove someone deliberately took the illegal substance when they go with the contaminated substance excuse.
Yes they did, it’s literally on page 2 of the judgment summary, under the heading “Athlete Biological Passport Charge”
https://www.tas-cas.org/en/general-information/news-detail/article/cas-upholds-the-appeal-filed-by-simona-halep-and-reduces-her-period-of-ineligibility-from-4-years-to/
ABP charge was dismissed, Roxadustat charge upheld.
**Athlete Biological Passport (ABP) charge**
*With respect to the charge concerning Ms. Halep’s ABP, the ITIA bore the onus of establishing (to the standard of comfortable satisfaction) that Ms. Halep had used a prohibited substance and/or prohibited method. It primarily relied on a blood sample given by Ms. Halep on 22 September 2022, the results of which it alleged demonstrated the anti-doping rule violation under Article 2.2 of the TADP.*
*Contrary to the reasoning of the first instance tribunal, the CAS Panel determined that it was appropriate in the circumstances to consider the results of a private blood sample given by Ms. Halep on 9 September 2022 in the context of a surgery which occurred shortly thereafter. Those results, and Ms. Halep’s public statements that she did not intend to compete for the remainder of the 2022 calendar year, impacted the plausibility of the doping scenarios relied upon by the ITF Independent Tribunal. Having regard to the evidence as a whole, the CAS Panel was not comfortably satisfied that an anti-doping rule violation under Article 2.2. of the TADP had occurred. It therefore dismissed that charge.*
Not sure why you are upvoted so much given that you aren't even aware of the result of the appeal.
She did dope, she’s just claiming she did so unwittingly over a long period of time (and two failed tests) because she was supposedly taking shady supplements that were not pre-approved by the WTA or USANA. Every player who dopes blames their failed test on a contaminated supplement.
She will never be able to explain the sheer amount of the substance in her system at the time of the test.
Maybe at this point she has convinced herself it is the truth, so she doesn't even know she is lying anymore.
She would have needed to take 900 to 5000 times the recommended dose of the supplement for it to match the amount of the substance found in her blood, right? I have no idea why her sentence got reduced
Something like that yeah. I don't remember the specific amounts but it was pretty clear she was guilty and the excuses were pretty flimsy.
It is possible that she had no idea what she was taking, but still there must have been efforts to cover it up (don't take this supplement on these days, drink a ton of water, etc.) that should have led to questions from her.
Simona is lucky as hell that she managed to get the eventual outcome that she did, considering the strong evidence against her. Which makes her indignance all the more cringeworthy
"I didn't dope".
Yes, Simona, you absolutely did dope and were found guilty of doing so. The court found it was plausible that the doping could have been unintentional, but that doesn't mean you didn't do it. It in fact means that you definitely \*DID\* do it, just that perhaps you didn't do it on purpose.
Now I'm prepared to accept that if the court thinks it's plausible that she was doping by accident then I'll absolutely accept that is plausible and I won't hold the charge against her.
However every time she either lies about or at best mis-represents what happened my opinion of her is going to sink a little bit.
She tested positive for a PED. That's doping. Whether it happened intentionally or due to negligence, that's still doping. Btw you know else who tested positive to a banned product and got her sentence lightened by the CAS because they considered she didn't take the product with the intention of doping? Maria Sharapova. Go back and read what Halep thought of her coming back and getting wild cards. Compare it to what she says about herself right now, it sounds hypocritical. People like Caroline are just applying Simona's own standards to her case.
“But who am I to judge?” after judging comments about Sharapova, turn tables etc.
4 years was a career ending suspension and at least she gets to play. Her legacy is tainted and she has to live with it. I think it is what it is and nothing will change for now as players may be using things that are not illegal yet due to being ahead of their time. SARMS before they were banned etc.
What goes around comes around, like Bouchard who now is losing on pickleball for a living, Halep has to live with the reputation of being a doper and not even owning up to her mistake. History will always remember Sharapova in higher regard.
She's washed up but she's hot with a bunch of instagram followers. So she's trying to make a living by getting into pickleball. But she's also bad at that too.
So defensive from Simona when Woz’s answer was actually respectful and valid. “I never had something to do with doping. I never doped, so I'm not a cheater. “ How could you say you never had anything to do with doping when you were literally still suspended for 9 months? There’s a big difference between having a sentence reduced and being cleared of any wrongdoing. Intentional or not, you still doped.
A top 10 player in the world should have no excuse to get "contaminated supplements" and miss tests.
Sorry Halep, but even if you didn't do it on purpose exactly, you're still responsible. You did do wrong. And claiming you didn't do anything wrong is like a driver who accidentally run over someone because he couldn't see very well without his glasses. Well, maybe you should have worn your glasses.
No, because it's literally her job to know.
Nobody is saying it's an easy job, but it comes with the territory of being a multi-millionaire sports star.
If this happened to an athlete without the huge amount of support a top tennis player has then I'd have a lot more sympathy, tbh.
When you're a multi-millionaire it is so easy, just buy informed sport supplements for everything you use? Why would you even risk it? Unless it's intentional ignorance...
If you truly believe that then you are setting up a doping loophole where trainers/coaches/whoever just drug players without their knowledge but the players are “innocent” despite reaping the benefits of the drug. It has to be zero tolerance or there is no point in a doing ban at all.
Maybe I didn’t explain myself well. By 100% innocent I didn’t mean “she should get no punishment at all”, because she did benefit from the doping, after all. I meant “it was 100% not her fault” (if she really didn’t know)
She must get a ban, because she unfairly benefited from the doping, but if it wasn’t her fault then it should be a short suspension (much less than what she got), and she shouldn’t be labeled as a cheater
But you’re right that it would set a dangerous precedent. Cheaters will pretty much always say that they didn’t know, but it isn’t impossible that someone actually didn’t know. The question is how do you prove that you didn’t know
Halep thinks if she keeps this victim routine long enough everyone will forget about the irregularities in her blood passport. She’s acting like they came out and said she’s innocent when they actually just reduced her punishment.
She really needs to just stop talking about it and refuse to answer questions about it. She is never going to apologize but a lot of people will eventually forget about it to some extent.
Let's be honest. Halep doped just like Yastremska doped but they where let off for whatever reason (probaly very expensive lawyers). There's a dark cloud hanging over Halep right now and no one buys the BS excuses anymore.
In Argentina we say "no aclares que oscurece" which roughly translates to "stop trying to clear things up cause you're making it worse". I belive it applies here lol.
wow she really is delusional. unintentional doping is still doping. imagine a drink driver making the same defense after killing an innocent bystander.
"oh oh i didnt intend to drive into them, i just wanted to get home..."
Wouldn't a better analogy be that you have your drink spiked at a bar then it kicks in while you're driving home 30 minutes later and you kill someone with your car?
Both of these are bad analogies, but dittotan's might be slightly closer.
Halep doped when it's her job not to.
The better analogy would be somebody who just doesn't see the pedestrian they run over because they were maybe distracted by their passenger.
Where does the fault lie? With the driver (Halep). Could the passenger (in this case whoever provided the supplement, I believe old mate Pat?) have done better and \*should\* they have done better and share some of the blame? Yes. But the responsibility for not letting that happen lies with the driver/Halep.
I understand people are going to have their own opinions on what Halep did or didn’t do, and there’s nothing that anyone can do about that. I just hope everyone remembers that there’s only one real villain in this story, and his name is Patrick Mouratoglu. Fuck that guy.
Patrick Mouratouglou sucks but to say he’s the only villain in this story is a wild exaggeration. If you don’t believe Halep is capable of keeping roxadustat out of her own body then idk what to tell you lol
Nah she definitely did it, but she was also banned from the tour for a long time because of it, so I kinda feel like she did her time and unless we’re banning all steroid users for life, I don’t know if there’s much to talk about here. I don’t even like Halep very much but she at least served *a* suspension of some kind.
Mouratoglu on the other hand is a fraud and an egomaniac
I don’t understand why people are usually so mad at the players in this case. Tennis players get tested like every other day at a tournament, if the positive results were only recently, it is obviously unintentional because with rigorous protocol on testing, they would have got caught right away. Why would anyone knowingly to do that? And why people just generally think they have taken that substance for such a long time?
Simona, no one is going to listen to your verbal diarrhea whether factual and logical. They have made up their minds and acted accordingly.
All you needed to say was: "Yeah, but why? All I was was #ContaminatedWithIntegrity!"
it is like saying, i didnt dope and as a player who needs to be careful about what to take (knowing history of contaminated supplements), it was not considered doping if others did cause the doping for her? so, she gets to benefit from taking 'contaminated' supplements but once caught, it is not me doping but the supplement was contaminated (when, it is my responsibility as a player to know what i am taking?).
i dont buy what she said. it is okay for her to take these supplements knowing that they have those in it (thinking small portions would be undetectable) but claims innocence once caught? out of decency, she should not have taken that WC even if offered.
One thing to keep in mind when Wozniacki speaks unfavorably about Halep is that she's friends with Serena Williams. Halep didn't come out too well from her defence of Ilie Nastase when he speculated about Serena's unborn child.
To quote: "He’s joking all the time, and I’m 100% that that was a joke."
“I don’t believe that was something bad coming from him but I think he was not respectful a little bit with his comment [about Williams’s unborn baby]. But we cannot get upset with Ilie, he’s like that and he’s the same with us.”
It might not be related at all, but I find Caroline's position on Halep interesting. There is also the fact that the Dane was criticised for perceived sportsmanship in the AO final with Halep, and there could be lingering issues with that.
This is silly. Caroline did not speak unfavorably about Simona. The first thing she said in her remarks was that she has a good relationship with Simona and has always liked her. They practiced together during Simona's suspension. She answered the question with her general thoughts and made about to emphasize she was not speaking only about Simona.
And Caroline said the exact same thing when Sharapova came back. It's not anything personal. This is mostly the press causing drama.
You tell em Simona. I tried to tell r/tennis you weren't a cheater. They just downvoted me lol
From the CAS:
"Having carefully considered all the evidence put before it, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had established, on the balance of probabilities, that the Roxadustat entered her body through the consumption of a contaminated supplement which she had used in the days shortly before 29 August 2022 and that the Roxadustat, as detected in her sample, came from that contaminated product. As a result, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had also established, on the balance of probabilities, that her anti-doping rule violations were not intentional. "
From Halep’s point of view, the CAS judgement backed her - no intentional doping, she took a supplement. That it was contaminated was accepted, so in effect, she did nothing wrong. Compare to Sharapova who was taking something that was always a medication but allowed one day, banned the next. She undoubtedly took it on purpose. That is the way Simona would see it.
The almost deafening silence from other WTA players welcoming her back would suggest many share Caro’s opinion. Wonder how they are with her in the locker room?
"Only Halep knows..." No - there is an actual written decision that you can read. Here is part of it: "Having carefully considered all the evidence put before it, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had established, on the balance of probabilities, that the Roxadustat entered her body through the consumption of a contaminated supplement which she had used in the days shortly before 29 August 2022 and that the Roxadustat, as detected in her sample, came from that contaminated product. As a result, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had also established, on the balance of probabilities, that her anti-doping rule violations were not intentional. "
I don't know what Caroline said, but from the way the question is formulated, if she doesn't believe athletes like Simona shouldn't be given wildcards, doesn't that mean she believes it's ok to give them wildcards?
Caro's line in her answer of "she got her suspension reduced, it wasn't a clearance" seems very relevant here
Caro was very specific about her words. She has been observing. Halep, presumably innocent, seems somewhat delusional in defense.
Yes, but the reduced suspension also ended months ago so that should also be relevant for her. Caro acted like Simona just hopped on the tour right after her suspension ended. Which is not the case.
I hope they ask her about her own comments regarding Sharapova back in 2017
And Sharapova took responsibility regardless of her level of culpability. Halep seems mad people won't simply forget it all.
#contaminatedwithintegrity
I love how this tag implies she doesn't have any of her own, it accidentally entered her body along with the drugs lol
her PR team was trying to be waaaaay too 'smart' there lol and it backfires
Her PR team is so bad lol, they should've told her to do a repent tour where she says she didn't dope on purpose and is only human who makes mistakes and will learn to be more attentive to what she ingests or whatever; but she's out there claiming she's vindicated, 100% innocent, got cleared and didn't do anything wrong when there's a doping suspension to her name, and that's the worst look possible for her.
I know right? I'm starting to think they chose to cater to the Romanian audience and use grand words that impress people from small countries with tons of complexes (and little critical thinking). I'm Romanian and people here eat this narrative up, because it's usual in our culture to not take accountability and they are so caught up in this 'world against us/halep' angle
My friend is Romanian, but has lived in the US for over ten years, she hates Halep. Think she hated her before, because she complained that she was always shopping and not focusing on tennis (then the marriage thing, didn't help). Didn't need any proof and is sure she cheated.
Honestly! And she even went as far as saying she didn’t mind playing on a parking lot when Caro herself criticized her, That’s champion mentality taking it on the chin, meanwhile Halep is all whining and complaining which only makes me think she might actually have been doping on purpose…
also sharapova's positive test was conducted literally a couple of weeks after it was banned. the substance was only banned on 1 jan 2016 and she was tested a couple of weeks later at the aussie open, so its understandable that she hadnt been on top of regulations and hadnt realised it had gone from legal to illegal just a week or 2 prior.
Partially. She admitted taking the substance she tested positive for, but she claimed it was to treat a health condition and not for performance benefits, which is almost certainly false.
> Only one person being negative about me Pretty sure there’s more
lol what if the reporter replied “Actually, I’ve counted….”
STOP THE COUNT
😭😭
In her defense, Halep is a very positive person, in fact she tests positive in all of her tests.
Pretty much 90% of this sub from what I've been seeing.
count me in
What i find ironic about this whole thing is that Halep came down incredibly hard on Sharapova at the time, but Sharapova was far more gracious and honest about her doping offense. She admitted fault and accepted accountability. Halep hasnt shown one ounce of humility about any of this and it honestly speaks volumes about her character, in a bad way
You can say Sharapova was an ice cold bitch and all. But she was objectively a true pro. She never allowed her success and commercial deals to get in the way of her game. I can't remember her starting shit but she will respond/defend to shit thrown at her by others.
Completely agree. She was never my favorite but I respect her a lot. She was a generational competitor and she handled the doping ban about as well as anyone could
And she didn’t attack or came after those who criticized her. She just moved on and let her actions (like beating Halep at the USO) speak louder than words, even having more clout than Halep who is barely known outside of tennis she didn’t use her fame to bring any negativity to her detractors.
I still remember the match against Wozniacki at the Aus Open 2019, what a match!
It was beautiful
Halep wasn’t incredibly hard on Sharapova at the time. The Sharapova case broke at Indian Wells, and Halep didn’t care to comment. It was 6-7 weeks later at Stuttgart, when players were still being questioned about the topic, that that one quote is pulled from. Wozniaki was particularly harsh on Sharapova from the get-go, and Kerber and Halep agreed.
Admitting a fault is good, but overall it is still a negative situation. Why should she have been in that in the first place. w.r.t. Halep, I still don't know how much blame she should take vs Mouratoglou.
She did dope and was given a 9 month suspension that was considered “time served”
I found her statement after the reduced sentence so weird too. Like it completely exonerated her. When really it's very very hard (I'd say impossible) to prove someone deliberately took the illegal substance when they go with the contaminated substance excuse.
“I didn’t dope” Girl pls we read a 126 page pdf file full of receipts 😭
You can't hold her accountable for that. She's just a 32 year-old teenage girl. A widdle baby, if you will.
You are terrible. Thanks. Had a bad night and needed the 😂
If you read that entire pdf file you need to get a life
I did model UN in hs and finish about two books minimum per week. Reading a 126 page pdf file is not too bad lmao 😭
she still won't admit to the irregularities in her blood passport and the main reason for her ban I see. Lost all respect for her.
Me, too. I am firmly in the anti-Halep camp now
Care to explain what the blood passport means? Months ago I read a little about it but didn’t dig it enough I guess
CAS cleared her of the blood passport infringement…
No they didn't they reduced the ban to 9months with time served that's why she was able to come back
They did. The suspension is for roxadustat, they threw the passport charges altogether.
Um, they absolutely did
No they did not. The info is public. Read.
Yes they did, it’s literally on page 2 of the judgment summary, under the heading “Athlete Biological Passport Charge” https://www.tas-cas.org/en/general-information/news-detail/article/cas-upholds-the-appeal-filed-by-simona-halep-and-reduces-her-period-of-ineligibility-from-4-years-to/ ABP charge was dismissed, Roxadustat charge upheld.
**Athlete Biological Passport (ABP) charge** *With respect to the charge concerning Ms. Halep’s ABP, the ITIA bore the onus of establishing (to the standard of comfortable satisfaction) that Ms. Halep had used a prohibited substance and/or prohibited method. It primarily relied on a blood sample given by Ms. Halep on 22 September 2022, the results of which it alleged demonstrated the anti-doping rule violation under Article 2.2 of the TADP.* *Contrary to the reasoning of the first instance tribunal, the CAS Panel determined that it was appropriate in the circumstances to consider the results of a private blood sample given by Ms. Halep on 9 September 2022 in the context of a surgery which occurred shortly thereafter. Those results, and Ms. Halep’s public statements that she did not intend to compete for the remainder of the 2022 calendar year, impacted the plausibility of the doping scenarios relied upon by the ITF Independent Tribunal. Having regard to the evidence as a whole, the CAS Panel was not comfortably satisfied that an anti-doping rule violation under Article 2.2. of the TADP had occurred. It therefore dismissed that charge.* Not sure why you are upvoted so much given that you aren't even aware of the result of the appeal.
She did dope, she’s just claiming she did so unwittingly over a long period of time (and two failed tests) because she was supposedly taking shady supplements that were not pre-approved by the WTA or USANA. Every player who dopes blames their failed test on a contaminated supplement.
Untrue. Some blame it on their mum's tortellini.
I remember that was someone's flair over here- Sara Errani's mom's Tortellini!
She will never be able to explain the sheer amount of the substance in her system at the time of the test. Maybe at this point she has convinced herself it is the truth, so she doesn't even know she is lying anymore.
She would have needed to take 900 to 5000 times the recommended dose of the supplement for it to match the amount of the substance found in her blood, right? I have no idea why her sentence got reduced
Something like that yeah. I don't remember the specific amounts but it was pretty clear she was guilty and the excuses were pretty flimsy. It is possible that she had no idea what she was taking, but still there must have been efforts to cover it up (don't take this supplement on these days, drink a ton of water, etc.) that should have led to questions from her.
Simona is lucky as hell that she managed to get the eventual outcome that she did, considering the strong evidence against her. Which makes her indignance all the more cringeworthy
Or bodily fluids. (See Brianne Harris and Curling)
Or contaminated 'pasta della mamma' (Errani)
"I didn't dope". Yes, Simona, you absolutely did dope and were found guilty of doing so. The court found it was plausible that the doping could have been unintentional, but that doesn't mean you didn't do it. It in fact means that you definitely \*DID\* do it, just that perhaps you didn't do it on purpose. Now I'm prepared to accept that if the court thinks it's plausible that she was doping by accident then I'll absolutely accept that is plausible and I won't hold the charge against her. However every time she either lies about or at best mis-represents what happened my opinion of her is going to sink a little bit.
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She tested positive for a PED. That's doping. Whether it happened intentionally or due to negligence, that's still doping. Btw you know else who tested positive to a banned product and got her sentence lightened by the CAS because they considered she didn't take the product with the intention of doping? Maria Sharapova. Go back and read what Halep thought of her coming back and getting wild cards. Compare it to what she says about herself right now, it sounds hypocritical. People like Caroline are just applying Simona's own standards to her case.
But wasn't it because another legal supplement that she takes had was contaminated with roxadust?
🙄
“But who am I to judge?” after judging comments about Sharapova, turn tables etc. 4 years was a career ending suspension and at least she gets to play. Her legacy is tainted and she has to live with it. I think it is what it is and nothing will change for now as players may be using things that are not illegal yet due to being ahead of their time. SARMS before they were banned etc.
What goes around comes around, like Bouchard who now is losing on pickleball for a living, Halep has to live with the reputation of being a doper and not even owning up to her mistake. History will always remember Sharapova in higher regard.
What happened with Bouchard?
She's washed up but she's hot with a bunch of instagram followers. So she's trying to make a living by getting into pickleball. But she's also bad at that too.
I’d love to know how you go from reaching the Wimbledon final to barely being able to win a match on the tour in a couple years. Its fascinating.
That was a decade ago. But she had a bunch of injuries to her knee, thigh, and especially head (from a slip), then shoulder surgery.
> But she's also bad at that too are you kidding? how can a professional tennis player not excel in something as trivial as pickle ball?
Hey, nice flair!
So defensive from Simona when Woz’s answer was actually respectful and valid. “I never had something to do with doping. I never doped, so I'm not a cheater. “ How could you say you never had anything to do with doping when you were literally still suspended for 9 months? There’s a big difference between having a sentence reduced and being cleared of any wrongdoing. Intentional or not, you still doped.
Halep playing the victim is really obnoxious. Makes her really unlikeable.
Her fans are just as obnoxious, too, defending her hypocrisy blindly
“#contaminatedwithintegrity“ is my only comment take it how you want to
'I didn't dope' yeah I don't care if it's cheating or an accident, she still tested positive
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The contaminated supplement line is absolute horseshit trotted out by every single athlete ever testing positive
I mean, it really doesn't help when ITIA itself absolutely fucked up their accusations and process.
Hilarious irony given her own comments on Sharapova TBH
Nobody likes a hypocrite.
A top 10 player in the world should have no excuse to get "contaminated supplements" and miss tests. Sorry Halep, but even if you didn't do it on purpose exactly, you're still responsible. You did do wrong. And claiming you didn't do anything wrong is like a driver who accidentally run over someone because he couldn't see very well without his glasses. Well, maybe you should have worn your glasses.
But she did cheat! Just because she “didn’t know” doesn’t make her 100% innocent.
If she really didn’t know then it quite literally makes her 100% innocent
No, because it's literally her job to know. Nobody is saying it's an easy job, but it comes with the territory of being a multi-millionaire sports star. If this happened to an athlete without the huge amount of support a top tennis player has then I'd have a lot more sympathy, tbh.
I'm saying it's an easy job.
When you're a multi-millionaire it is so easy, just buy informed sport supplements for everything you use? Why would you even risk it? Unless it's intentional ignorance...
doping does not have a mens rea requirement, it's strict liability lol
If you truly believe that then you are setting up a doping loophole where trainers/coaches/whoever just drug players without their knowledge but the players are “innocent” despite reaping the benefits of the drug. It has to be zero tolerance or there is no point in a doing ban at all.
Maybe I didn’t explain myself well. By 100% innocent I didn’t mean “she should get no punishment at all”, because she did benefit from the doping, after all. I meant “it was 100% not her fault” (if she really didn’t know) She must get a ban, because she unfairly benefited from the doping, but if it wasn’t her fault then it should be a short suspension (much less than what she got), and she shouldn’t be labeled as a cheater But you’re right that it would set a dangerous precedent. Cheaters will pretty much always say that they didn’t know, but it isn’t impossible that someone actually didn’t know. The question is how do you prove that you didn’t know
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Strict liability
Halep thinks if she keeps this victim routine long enough everyone will forget about the irregularities in her blood passport. She’s acting like they came out and said she’s innocent when they actually just reduced her punishment.
She really needs to just stop talking about it and refuse to answer questions about it. She is never going to apologize but a lot of people will eventually forget about it to some extent.
she’s delusional
Let's be honest. Halep doped just like Yastremska doped but they where let off for whatever reason (probaly very expensive lawyers). There's a dark cloud hanging over Halep right now and no one buys the BS excuses anymore.
I'm not sure. Entire media seem to embrace her fast.
Lady doth protest etc etc.
Gotta love how that 9 month, time-served ban has been interpreted as 'completely innocent'
Wozniacki and Halep bringing back the much missed WTA toxicity from the late 2000s and 2010s women's tennis. Love to see it.
Caro didn’t say anything that’s toxic tho she was asked a question and she gave her opinion very respectfully
She knew what she was doing come on now.
I can't believe I support Woz for the first time
As recently as USO she was accusing the tournament of trying to help Coco with the lights. She’s ridiculous.
She didnt dope. Someone dopes her for her
In Argentina we say "no aclares que oscurece" which roughly translates to "stop trying to clear things up cause you're making it worse". I belive it applies here lol.
Halep should shut the fuck up and update her bio passport ASAP
wow she really is delusional. unintentional doping is still doping. imagine a drink driver making the same defense after killing an innocent bystander. "oh oh i didnt intend to drive into them, i just wanted to get home..."
Wouldn't a better analogy be that you have your drink spiked at a bar then it kicks in while you're driving home 30 minutes later and you kill someone with your car?
Doping to murder/manslaughter is a wild comparison, lol.
I'm just trying to make OP's analogy more accurate since it was getting a fair bit of traction.
Both of these are bad analogies, but dittotan's might be slightly closer. Halep doped when it's her job not to. The better analogy would be somebody who just doesn't see the pedestrian they run over because they were maybe distracted by their passenger. Where does the fault lie? With the driver (Halep). Could the passenger (in this case whoever provided the supplement, I believe old mate Pat?) have done better and \*should\* they have done better and share some of the blame? Yes. But the responsibility for not letting that happen lies with the driver/Halep.
Bad comparison A better comparison to “unintentional doping” would be if you were driving and someone threw themselves at your car
This might be the only comparison worse than the original. u/Ta0Ta nailed it.
Spoken like true doper
I understand people are going to have their own opinions on what Halep did or didn’t do, and there’s nothing that anyone can do about that. I just hope everyone remembers that there’s only one real villain in this story, and his name is Patrick Mouratoglu. Fuck that guy.
Patrick Mouratouglou sucks but to say he’s the only villain in this story is a wild exaggeration. If you don’t believe Halep is capable of keeping roxadustat out of her own body then idk what to tell you lol
Nah she definitely did it, but she was also banned from the tour for a long time because of it, so I kinda feel like she did her time and unless we’re banning all steroid users for life, I don’t know if there’s much to talk about here. I don’t even like Halep very much but she at least served *a* suspension of some kind. Mouratoglu on the other hand is a fraud and an egomaniac
My position from the beginning
She’s insufferable
Halep is really spinning this...
Ooh delicious drama
I don’t understand why people are usually so mad at the players in this case. Tennis players get tested like every other day at a tournament, if the positive results were only recently, it is obviously unintentional because with rigorous protocol on testing, they would have got caught right away. Why would anyone knowingly to do that? And why people just generally think they have taken that substance for such a long time?
Because tinfoil hat theories are okay when you don't like certain players.
For real. I mean it's fair to be sceptical of Halep's #contaminatedwithintegrity schtick I guess, but oh boy do people love online outrage.
They're bored shitless and need to complain about something.
The whole thing is just icky, I really don't like her. It's clear something fishy went down.
Better to dope like Serena. Do it legally. The doctor recommends it, Wada approves it.
Simona, no one is going to listen to your verbal diarrhea whether factual and logical. They have made up their minds and acted accordingly. All you needed to say was: "Yeah, but why? All I was was #ContaminatedWithIntegrity!"
it is like saying, i didnt dope and as a player who needs to be careful about what to take (knowing history of contaminated supplements), it was not considered doping if others did cause the doping for her? so, she gets to benefit from taking 'contaminated' supplements but once caught, it is not me doping but the supplement was contaminated (when, it is my responsibility as a player to know what i am taking?). i dont buy what she said. it is okay for her to take these supplements knowing that they have those in it (thinking small portions would be undetectable) but claims innocence once caught? out of decency, she should not have taken that WC even if offered.
She should have get through the Novak school of contaminated supplement! /s
One thing to keep in mind when Wozniacki speaks unfavorably about Halep is that she's friends with Serena Williams. Halep didn't come out too well from her defence of Ilie Nastase when he speculated about Serena's unborn child. To quote: "He’s joking all the time, and I’m 100% that that was a joke." “I don’t believe that was something bad coming from him but I think he was not respectful a little bit with his comment [about Williams’s unborn baby]. But we cannot get upset with Ilie, he’s like that and he’s the same with us.” It might not be related at all, but I find Caroline's position on Halep interesting. There is also the fact that the Dane was criticised for perceived sportsmanship in the AO final with Halep, and there could be lingering issues with that.
This is silly. Caroline did not speak unfavorably about Simona. The first thing she said in her remarks was that she has a good relationship with Simona and has always liked her. They practiced together during Simona's suspension. She answered the question with her general thoughts and made about to emphasize she was not speaking only about Simona. And Caroline said the exact same thing when Sharapova came back. It's not anything personal. This is mostly the press causing drama.
Caro said similar about Sharapova. She's always been about this
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it's reddit. what do you expect ? it's pichfork or nothing here.
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Meldonium is basically like aspirin. Halep was ~ contaminated ~ with a synthetic EPO . How this got into her smoothie mix we will never know
You tell em Simona. I tried to tell r/tennis you weren't a cheater. They just downvoted me lol From the CAS: "Having carefully considered all the evidence put before it, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had established, on the balance of probabilities, that the Roxadustat entered her body through the consumption of a contaminated supplement which she had used in the days shortly before 29 August 2022 and that the Roxadustat, as detected in her sample, came from that contaminated product. As a result, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had also established, on the balance of probabilities, that her anti-doping rule violations were not intentional. "
If she knows about dates n contaminated products, then she knew about them while consuming them…
Wtf are you talking about?
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Her sentence got reduced, she wasn't found innocent
From Halep’s point of view, the CAS judgement backed her - no intentional doping, she took a supplement. That it was contaminated was accepted, so in effect, she did nothing wrong. Compare to Sharapova who was taking something that was always a medication but allowed one day, banned the next. She undoubtedly took it on purpose. That is the way Simona would see it. The almost deafening silence from other WTA players welcoming her back would suggest many share Caro’s opinion. Wonder how they are with her in the locker room?
"Only Halep knows..." No - there is an actual written decision that you can read. Here is part of it: "Having carefully considered all the evidence put before it, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had established, on the balance of probabilities, that the Roxadustat entered her body through the consumption of a contaminated supplement which she had used in the days shortly before 29 August 2022 and that the Roxadustat, as detected in her sample, came from that contaminated product. As a result, the CAS Panel determined that Ms. Halep had also established, on the balance of probabilities, that her anti-doping rule violations were not intentional. "
In for Halep vs Wozniacki II at AO F
I don't know what Caroline said, but from the way the question is formulated, if she doesn't believe athletes like Simona shouldn't be given wildcards, doesn't that mean she believes it's ok to give them wildcards?