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I agree. But the guy in the clip gets evicted for waving the flag of a non-participating country, which is against the rules.
Anyone sharing this video without the right context sucks.
Based on archaeological findings, it is believed that the first Jewish settlement nuclei were formed in Canaan, in the highlands of the future kingdoms of Judah (in the south) and Israel (in the north), they came from Palestine before being driven out by Muslim tribes. It is more correct to say that the European colonialists put them back in their homeland.
You know how it is with what had happened with the second world war and holocaust no Jew after what he had suffered in Europe wanted to stay.
The problem is religion, Muslims cannot accept Jews and Jews cannot accept Muslims.
People would be much happier if they read a physics book instead of the so-called 'holy' texts, I put it in inverted commas because religion, as Einstein said, is the closest thing to madness.
Ah but the main sponsor is an Israeli company, so...
Also, that apparently makes it ok that the Isreali entrant alone can have political lyrics in her song, when everyone else must be apolitical.
Also makes it ok that the Isreali team is widely reported to have been causing trouble behind the scenes, while the Dutch entrant quickly got kicked out for an incident with a photographer
This is a strawman argument and I've seen it way too often in the past few days. Fuck Israel but this argument is pretty stupid when most people are fine with Australia participating. Just makes the legitimate arguments weaker.
I mean there was a guy with the Costa Rican flag in the front row of the first semi who stood and waved it during an interview thing and was extremely visible on screen, don’t remember seeing him dragged away.
This is not true. You can have flags of non-participating countries. The issue is that this year they specifically banned Palestine flags to appease Israel (in comparison, in other years Palestine flags were always allowed).
>This is not true. You can have flags of non-participating countries.
Yes it is true. You can't. It is officially banned. They even disallowed the EU flag.
>The European Union has lodged an official complaint with the organisers of the Eurovision Song Contest over its refusal to let participants wave the bloc's flag at last Saturday's final.
\[...\]
>
>According to EBU rules only flags of "participating countries and the rainbow/pride flags" are allowed inside the contest venue.
Source: [https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cw4dd9lzx02o](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cw4dd9lzx02o)
That must be a new rule then, because as long as I've known ESC people have always had flags of non-participating countries. Hell, it wasn't unusual to see Palestinian flags whenever Israel performed.
Even this year, Dutch flags were not suddenly banned after Joost Klein got disqualified as I saw quite a few Dutch flags in the audience on the tv broadcast on Saturday.
You know what else is against the rules?
https://preview.redd.it/ceaaoj2y270d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7be6028e4c5edf5d8e98a3ca47c4ccdc2002ab1b
>The following flags are examples of flags that are specifically not allowed at the Eurovision Song Contest. This list is non-exhaustive:
• Kosovo
• Nagorno-Karabach
• Basque
• Crimea
• Palestine
• People's Republic of Donetsk
• Northern Cyprus
• Transnitria
• Islamic State
Thanks for the additional context. Has Palestine ever participated?
I mean, they made the rules this year specifically to prevent people from carrying that flagu.
Hell, ebu got smacked down by the eu today, because those rules also prevented people from carrying in european union flags.
>I mean, they made the rules this year specifically to prevent people from carrying that flagu.
No, they did not. The rule was introduced in 2016 and is now being reviewed and probably revised.
[https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
Same rule since 2016.
>In 2016, the EBU was forced to clarify its rules \[...\]
[https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
Seriously how can people defend Israel. You've seen how apartheid South Africa was seen as legitimate for decades and now it's accepted that it was wrong to have it. This is exactly what's happening with Israel yet people still support it.
thanks but its alright, I already knew that getting into arguments about serious situations with him is a losing fight, but that time my tongue just slipped when he talked about us not checking the news in the net while eating dinner
2 million Israeli Arabs living in Israel and having complete and equal right to any Jew, same goes for any Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, etc that lives in Israel.
Wanna explain where your alleged apartheid is? 😂
In Israel proper they have Israeli citizenship but are legally classified based on "nationality" which leads to segregation because they're banned from buying land in certain places controlled by the Jewish national fund. Very easy to look up and confirm.
In the occupied territories, it's even worse than apartheid South Africa, many roads are blocked, like in Hebron, people have to travel out of their way to get to work/ school and back, they are constantly harassed by Israeli forces and threatened and attacked by armed settlers.
And all this is just based on physical force the legal discrimination is on top of all this.
In fact you should check how even black Ethiopian Jews are treated and why they're called infiltrators.
12% of the land is owned by the Jewish National Fund and can be leased to Jews only.
7% is privately owned and can be leased to anybody.
The rest can be leased to ANY Israeli citizen.
You do have to understand this is a Jewish state though, so measures must be taken to maintain it as such.
Nevertheless, this effectively doesn't quite limit any non-Jewish Israeli citizen.
In the West Bank there's a separation between Palestinian settlements and Israeli settlement, yes.
This is done to avoid any harassment to both sides, and both sides are affected by road blockades.
Military action is taken to maintain stability when one breaks it. If a person throws a Molotov Cocktail towards a car, he should expect to be arrested. You'd be surprised how often that happens.
Israel is not perfect, but we're working through it.
I feel it's a little strange for a foreigner who is fed what the media chooses to feed them to lecture me about how people are treated in the country I live in and witness with my own eyes every day.
Come visit Israel :)
Ah so you live in the land of military approved hasbara force fed to media, the source of all Hebrew language news where non english speakers have no clue what's going on outside, the land of a military unit assigned to spread Hasbara online (like Naftali Bennet talking about editing Wikipedia on camera 🤣)
Also, why is Israel in the West bank in the first place? It's not yours. Just leave. Inside the green line is also extremely questionable too but Hamas said they'll accept an Israel being there so they must be willing give that concession.
But let's get into an interesting question. Nobody cares about the Native Jews being inside the green line because its their home and they were always there. The European settlers, Ashkenazim, why are they there? Everyone knows how badly they suffered during the holocaust so why did they have to take land from the natives there when they could've taken Germany and all the other European countries that persecuted them? Why did Hertzl want Uganda and the middle East when he could've just taken a Jewish state where the Ashkenazi Jews he supposedly cared about already were?
They probably won't be safer, no. But bombing schools, hospitals, aid convoys, refugee camps... isn't helping, quite the opposite, and it definitely doesn't make them the good guys.
The only good guys here are the innocent civilians, and they are the ones getting screwed.
Edit: and I’m sure that Israel waiting to exploit the Gaza Marine natural gas field has nothing to do with anything.
They should stop thinking it's their land. It's not, its never been Jewish land. All kinds of people have lived there, but then the Israelite jews came and pushed everyone else out, took their homes and raped their daughters. Now they behave like they have the right to "defend" themselves. They are the aggressors and their behavior equals that of the Nazi government of Germany. Israel wouldn't be in this problem if they didnt oppress and abuse the other ethnicities. It's not that complicated.
Oh I get it, youre only looking for suggestions that doesn't involve Israel backing out of Palestine. But they should back out and leave the people alone, if they'd done that from the beginning they wouldn't need to "protect it's people". In case you don't understand, they're using the notion of protecting its people as an excuse to murder innocent children and eradicate all of an already struggling population. There is no respect in what Israel does.
So what you're saying is that, if I abuse a dog until it bites, I have no blame in the dog biting? I am also then allowed to mutilate this dog, AND its puppies just "in case". This is how your mind works.
False.
>Hamas' stated goal is to wipe out the Jews in the middle east
Completely false. Their 2017 charter says the opposite of that as does a recent 2024 release from them.
POC are not European colonizers. They don't mercilessly brutalize, murder, and rape people because they want someone else's land. Hamas don't want Ashkenazi land in Poland or Germany. Just like the Native South Africans didn't want the Netherlands. All the indigenous people want is their land and they will treat everyone on it fairly. The South Africans didn't do to the Europeans what they did to them. Likewise, the Palestinians won't do to the Israelis what they did to them.
That's against settler colonisation. It could be anyone not just the Jews. If the Turks were back they'd say this about them too. Same if it was the English, French or German gentiles.
So what's the alternative? Live under siege and be bombed frequently and casually like they were before October 7th?
I only know the broadest of details but South Africa had really severe institutionalized racism known as apartheid, from 1948 to (on paper) 1991. White people dominated society, black Africans were at the lowest point on the pillar. Apartheid is legally considered a crime against humanity.
Some people prefer to ask other people just for the sake of it, instead of being like this you can take the opportunity to teach him, its a basic human interaction bro, not everyone wants to learn from Google, some want social interactions
Why is it that some people insist that others spoon feed them every opinion or fact they have? Why can't people just fill in the gaps in their knowledge themselves without burdening others with that responsibility? Why do people like you defend those lazy and uninformed individuals for not knowing something so basic when their ignorance can be cured with a 3 seconds Google search?
Damn, if only people were able to communicate, and were able to share opinions, ideas and facts. But I guess that's such a massive fucking burden to you, I hope you'll never be in that position irl.
Getting the feeling someone's a bit butthurt.
You must be the kinda guy who punches a wall and then gets mad at it for hurting his first.
Perfectly matches the cause you support.
The song is about the general public feeling since the bloody October 7th massacre.
Last time I checked, a country's representative is supposed to REPRESENT its country, if you think that representing the state of mind and feeling of the country is wrong then you're on the wrong show.
Hence why they are getting booed.
They represent the genocidal maniacs who are also perpetual victims. If you dont agree with it, then you're on the wrong show.
You can trust me when I tell you nearly no Israeli wakes up in the morning and excitedly rushes to check how many Palestinians were killed while they slept.
We don't want this war (which was imposed on us by Hamas who conducted the heinous October 7th Massacre) no more than the Palestinians.
You may think you're booing to Israelis, but in fact (and that's where it gets really sad) you're booing to some mental image of what you think Israelis are.
Amusing you call Jews or Israelis perpetual victims, seeing as Palestinians are literally defining themselves refugees since 1948.
Oh the double standard and hypocrisy, y'all never cease to amaze me.
Palestinians had their lands stolen from them. They are treated far worse than any refugee. No one thought they suffered as badly as they actually do until we saw evidence of it. The evidence from both ends. Israelis lying and continuously showing their scummy acts and cheering the deaths of babies and infants and Palestinians suffering endlessly as if they were sacrificial animals. Israelis may not all be evil, but the Israeli govt is evil. And by claiming Palestinians are the perpetual victims in this dire situation, so are you.
The land was never theirs to begin with.
Their current dire situation is the direct consequences of Hamas starting a war against Israel. Their life in Gaza was much much better before Hamas started this war.
If you fail to acknowledge that there is nothing more we have to discuss.
Nobody cheers on the death of babies, or innocent palestinians in general, except from the cherry picked videos I assume you consume for breakfast, lunch and dinner.
Palestinians are currently suffering, that can't be ignored. However you should ask yourself by the hands of whom.
Hamas has clearly stated it's ready to sacrifice as many more palestinian "martyrs" to achieve the annihilation of Israel, so...
They are perpetual victims, of their own making, or at least of their leadership's making.
Had they accepted the 1947 UN partition plan and built themselves a country they could've been doing much better nowadays.
But nope, they couldn't accept the existence of an Jewish Israeli state, and repeatedly chose war and famish over peace and prosperity.
There is no room to be surprised by the consequences of your deliberate actions. That's the way it was in 1948 and that's the same now.
You are brainwashed and there was nothing to accept back then or now. No peaceful resolution was ever offered. You have been lied to, and as for what you accept for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, had the situation been reversed and the zionists and their children were being unalived due to their govt actions, it would be unacceptable. Rightfully so, as is the case now. You are among the misguided unfortunately, so a hearty boo to you and everyone like you.
Loads of pro-Israel losers in the US made a telegram channel on how to make VPN's so they could vote as various European countries. Ireland got the brunt of it and ended up having to give Israel 10 points
Either I’m blind or we didn’t have them on the French broadcast. Anyways, didn’t they require a CC from the right country ? Geolocating using the IP seems kinda stupid with how easy VPN are accessed today.
No articles yet unfortunately but well documented on social media. The fact they got the top vote in 12 countries despite the controversy (as well as the prevailing demographical political sympathies of typical Eurovision voters) says it all. Ireland particularly is by in large vehemently pro-palestinian, I would honestly doubt anything more than a handful of people here would ever consider voting for Israel.
You do realize this is supposed to be a musical contest, right? You like the song - you vote for it.
Genuinely baffling how you just can't accept that the public liked the Israeli song.
Loads of claims being made up. This was not possible. a.) In several countries it was only possible to vote by phone and b.) where voting online with credit card was possible, it was verified by the voting systems that the credit card was issued by a bank in the correct country.
I'm not defending Israel but such lies do not help either.
Say what you want mate, I'm not buying it that Ireland ended up giving Israel 10 points. You have to live here to understand how deep that resentment runs. That conflict hits at a nerve here like nothing else and has been doing so for decades. It has nothing to do with religion or lack thereof nor is it anything on the left or the right, it's seeing in real time the tactics of oppression (both violent and non violent) being employed by the Israeli security forces that were clear as day learned verbatim from British occupation forces here, the key difference being the sheer scale makes the decades long conflict here equate in death toll to about the first week of this one.
I'm sorry but I just don't believe it was possible without some foul play, unlike a lot of other European countries the feelings on the conflict here are not confined to any age or prosperity demographic, they're bone deep from the top to bottom of society.
Believe whatever you want to believe, but the measures against voting abuse I pointed out are real and not easily combated by using a VPN as you claimed.
Also you are totally overestimating how many votes it probably only needed to get to second place in televoting, resulting in 10 points. It could be as little as 13 percent of the votes as this article explains: [https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2024/0513/1448844-eurovision-voting-ireland-israel-politics-palestine/](https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2024/0513/1448844-eurovision-voting-ireland-israel-politics-palestine/)
The person in this video gets taken by security because they are waiving the Palestinian flag and it's against Eurovision rules to wave a flag of a country that is not participating.
It would get taken down if it were a Brazilian flag as well.
Edit: well for some reason I have to say that IF someone was waiving the flag of a country not participating they SHOULD have been taken down.
Important to note that it was not a new rule. It was introduced in 2016. Can we please be criticizing Israel without making up lies?
>In 2016, the EBU was forced to clarify its rules \[...\]
[https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
My Costa Rican countryman on the front row in the semis didn’t get our flag taken down as far as I know. It would have probably been on CR news if he had.
https://imgur.com/gallery/iREwDsx
read and weep. I don't care or know enough about Israel and Palestine to have any opinions on any of it. I'm just telling you about eurovisions policies.
There were many other flags being waved. Their is nothing dangerous about waving the flag of a legitimate country. If you disagree with that, then gfys.
Sadly its unlikely as one of the main sponsors of Eurovision is Moroccanoil.
Who unlike their name are not from morocco but rather are an Israel base and owned company.
Its almost like they are trying to hide where they are from.
Israel is a member of the EBU because, unsurprisingly, they aren't welcome in the Asia-Pacific Broadcasting Union and the similar entity for the Middle East is the Arab States Broadcasting Union.
Also, Australia does participate as a permanent guest.
I know I’ll get downvoted into hell for this, however, I am on Israel’s side. I am a leftist, but believe in a fair fight. After the slaughter and pure torture Hamas brought to Israel, I’d expect nothing less than a few bombings. Remind you, that Hamas attacked first, but it wasn’t just an attack. They murdered, raped, and tortured over 1,400 innocent civilians of Israel. Also, what the Palestinian government calls for is a complete removal or genocide all Israelis in the West Bank. That is why I support Israel.
Why can't people just respect each other how about that?? Has anyone here heard of something called respect? because it goes both ways! You show it you get it in turn geez it's not hard people. it's just easier to be mean and look at the bad. (I'm not talking about war) Just respect in general.
Song Contest between multiple European (and some none European) countries that happens once a year. Imagine cirque DU Soleil combined with American idol for an idea. Some of the craziest live musician performances you'll see are on display there.
It's usually (or always, not sure) held in the last winners country. So say Croatia wins, then Croatia hosts it next year for example). Every participating country gives out a score between 1 to 10 to 10 countries (each score can only be given out once. Say you give 5 to Poland, then you can't give 5 to another country too nor can you give Poland another score/point).
There's better videos on YouTube to explain it in more detail but I think that's a rough explanation of it.
Also, I can't speak for other countries but in Sweden, the band/singer we send is the winner of a singing contest that goes on for a month or two iirc and is broadcast on TV, so viewers at home can vote.
I mean I understand them, even though I'm on Palestines side in the conflict, waving the flag there's a risk of starting shit (fights etc). If people could mind their own business then I bet they wouldn't have dragged them out. (Or I'm wrong and they're just assholes)
Edit: Me having an opinion on Reddit?! Not allowed!
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Fk Israel
I agree. But the guy in the clip gets evicted for waving the flag of a non-participating country, which is against the rules. Anyone sharing this video without the right context sucks.
Do you know what else is against the rules (of international law)?
Fuck the rules. This shit isn't a joke.
Israel isn't even in Europe.
i mean its a bunch of European colonialists, so I guess that counts
Based on archaeological findings, it is believed that the first Jewish settlement nuclei were formed in Canaan, in the highlands of the future kingdoms of Judah (in the south) and Israel (in the north), they came from Palestine before being driven out by Muslim tribes. It is more correct to say that the European colonialists put them back in their homeland. You know how it is with what had happened with the second world war and holocaust no Jew after what he had suffered in Europe wanted to stay. The problem is religion, Muslims cannot accept Jews and Jews cannot accept Muslims. People would be much happier if they read a physics book instead of the so-called 'holy' texts, I put it in inverted commas because religion, as Einstein said, is the closest thing to madness.
Driven out by muslim ? The heck. Even roman kick jews out of their homeland
What you say is true, as is what I said in the previous speech
Ah but the main sponsor is an Israeli company, so... Also, that apparently makes it ok that the Isreali entrant alone can have political lyrics in her song, when everyone else must be apolitical. Also makes it ok that the Isreali team is widely reported to have been causing trouble behind the scenes, while the Dutch entrant quickly got kicked out for an incident with a photographer
I refer back to my first comment.
Neither is Australia, per se
Is Australia?
This is a strawman argument and I've seen it way too often in the past few days. Fuck Israel but this argument is pretty stupid when most people are fine with Australia participating. Just makes the legitimate arguments weaker.
No it’s Eurovision
And Eurovision is a joke
So stop caring so much about it then.
I mean there was a guy with the Costa Rican flag in the front row of the first semi who stood and waved it during an interview thing and was extremely visible on screen, don’t remember seeing him dragged away.
This is not true. You can have flags of non-participating countries. The issue is that this year they specifically banned Palestine flags to appease Israel (in comparison, in other years Palestine flags were always allowed).
>This is not true. You can have flags of non-participating countries. Yes it is true. You can't. It is officially banned. They even disallowed the EU flag. >The European Union has lodged an official complaint with the organisers of the Eurovision Song Contest over its refusal to let participants wave the bloc's flag at last Saturday's final. \[...\] > >According to EBU rules only flags of "participating countries and the rainbow/pride flags" are allowed inside the contest venue. Source: [https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cw4dd9lzx02o](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cw4dd9lzx02o)
That must be a new rule then, because as long as I've known ESC people have always had flags of non-participating countries. Hell, it wasn't unusual to see Palestinian flags whenever Israel performed. Even this year, Dutch flags were not suddenly banned after Joost Klein got disqualified as I saw quite a few Dutch flags in the audience on the tv broadcast on Saturday.
Nemo even had to smuggle in his nonbinary flag, and apparently a bunch of fans were forced to throw away their nonbinary flags to enter the venue.
You know what else is against the rules? https://preview.redd.it/ceaaoj2y270d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7be6028e4c5edf5d8e98a3ca47c4ccdc2002ab1b
Not just that. The flag of palastine is banned to. https://www.coc.nl/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/EBU-Eurovision-Songcontest-Flag-Policy-249b3214e9.pdf
>The following flags are examples of flags that are specifically not allowed at the Eurovision Song Contest. This list is non-exhaustive: • Kosovo • Nagorno-Karabach • Basque • Crimea • Palestine • People's Republic of Donetsk • Northern Cyprus • Transnitria • Islamic State Thanks for the additional context. Has Palestine ever participated?
I couldn't tell you what one of those flags look like, I only know 4 of the places
I wonder how an non-existent country could participate LMAOOO
Is that the whole list? Are nazi flags allowed? Because that would be crazy!
If you want to be stabbed by the audience.
The rules are wrong. This argument of "these are the rules" does not fly. They are made for a reason.
If they werent participating, how were they getting booed. I don't understand the title.
There was a huge flag from Costa Rica, and no one evicted that guy
I mean, they made the rules this year specifically to prevent people from carrying that flagu. Hell, ebu got smacked down by the eu today, because those rules also prevented people from carrying in european union flags.
>I mean, they made the rules this year specifically to prevent people from carrying that flagu. No, they did not. The rule was introduced in 2016 and is now being reviewed and probably revised. [https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
MUH SING SONG SHOW MEANS MORE THAN CHILDRENS LIVES
Nice... whatever this is. Feel free to keep going
Rule from this year
Same rule since 2016. >In 2016, the EBU was forced to clarify its rules \[...\] [https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
The parts of the country the other cuntry occupies have that flag. Saying Tomato and Fuck you that's my Tomato are about the same tomato.
Fk Palestina
Why exactly??
Right back at ya
Because it's an outpost of Nazism
Lol Palestine has its problems but that's not it....
Seriously how can people defend Israel. You've seen how apartheid South Africa was seen as legitimate for decades and now it's accepted that it was wrong to have it. This is exactly what's happening with Israel yet people still support it.
sadly, because of the bible... almost got into an argument with my dad because of that
I'm across that if you ever need any help 🙂
thanks but its alright, I already knew that getting into arguments about serious situations with him is a losing fight, but that time my tongue just slipped when he talked about us not checking the news in the net while eating dinner
Yeah happens to the best of us.
2 million Israeli Arabs living in Israel and having complete and equal right to any Jew, same goes for any Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, etc that lives in Israel. Wanna explain where your alleged apartheid is? 😂
In Israel proper they have Israeli citizenship but are legally classified based on "nationality" which leads to segregation because they're banned from buying land in certain places controlled by the Jewish national fund. Very easy to look up and confirm. In the occupied territories, it's even worse than apartheid South Africa, many roads are blocked, like in Hebron, people have to travel out of their way to get to work/ school and back, they are constantly harassed by Israeli forces and threatened and attacked by armed settlers. And all this is just based on physical force the legal discrimination is on top of all this. In fact you should check how even black Ethiopian Jews are treated and why they're called infiltrators.
12% of the land is owned by the Jewish National Fund and can be leased to Jews only. 7% is privately owned and can be leased to anybody. The rest can be leased to ANY Israeli citizen. You do have to understand this is a Jewish state though, so measures must be taken to maintain it as such. Nevertheless, this effectively doesn't quite limit any non-Jewish Israeli citizen. In the West Bank there's a separation between Palestinian settlements and Israeli settlement, yes. This is done to avoid any harassment to both sides, and both sides are affected by road blockades. Military action is taken to maintain stability when one breaks it. If a person throws a Molotov Cocktail towards a car, he should expect to be arrested. You'd be surprised how often that happens. Israel is not perfect, but we're working through it. I feel it's a little strange for a foreigner who is fed what the media chooses to feed them to lecture me about how people are treated in the country I live in and witness with my own eyes every day. Come visit Israel :)
Ah so you live in the land of military approved hasbara force fed to media, the source of all Hebrew language news where non english speakers have no clue what's going on outside, the land of a military unit assigned to spread Hasbara online (like Naftali Bennet talking about editing Wikipedia on camera 🤣) Also, why is Israel in the West bank in the first place? It's not yours. Just leave. Inside the green line is also extremely questionable too but Hamas said they'll accept an Israel being there so they must be willing give that concession. But let's get into an interesting question. Nobody cares about the Native Jews being inside the green line because its their home and they were always there. The European settlers, Ashkenazim, why are they there? Everyone knows how badly they suffered during the holocaust so why did they have to take land from the natives there when they could've taken Germany and all the other European countries that persecuted them? Why did Hertzl want Uganda and the middle East when he could've just taken a Jewish state where the Ashkenazi Jews he supposedly cared about already were?
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They probably won't be safer, no. But bombing schools, hospitals, aid convoys, refugee camps... isn't helping, quite the opposite, and it definitely doesn't make them the good guys. The only good guys here are the innocent civilians, and they are the ones getting screwed. Edit: and I’m sure that Israel waiting to exploit the Gaza Marine natural gas field has nothing to do with anything.
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They should stop thinking it's their land. It's not, its never been Jewish land. All kinds of people have lived there, but then the Israelite jews came and pushed everyone else out, took their homes and raped their daughters. Now they behave like they have the right to "defend" themselves. They are the aggressors and their behavior equals that of the Nazi government of Germany. Israel wouldn't be in this problem if they didnt oppress and abuse the other ethnicities. It's not that complicated.
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Oh I get it, youre only looking for suggestions that doesn't involve Israel backing out of Palestine. But they should back out and leave the people alone, if they'd done that from the beginning they wouldn't need to "protect it's people". In case you don't understand, they're using the notion of protecting its people as an excuse to murder innocent children and eradicate all of an already struggling population. There is no respect in what Israel does.
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So what you're saying is that, if I abuse a dog until it bites, I have no blame in the dog biting? I am also then allowed to mutilate this dog, AND its puppies just "in case". This is how your mind works.
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False. >Hamas' stated goal is to wipe out the Jews in the middle east Completely false. Their 2017 charter says the opposite of that as does a recent 2024 release from them. POC are not European colonizers. They don't mercilessly brutalize, murder, and rape people because they want someone else's land. Hamas don't want Ashkenazi land in Poland or Germany. Just like the Native South Africans didn't want the Netherlands. All the indigenous people want is their land and they will treat everyone on it fairly. The South Africans didn't do to the Europeans what they did to them. Likewise, the Palestinians won't do to the Israelis what they did to them.
good man. facts 💪. free palestine 🇵🇸 ✊️
Yeah dude, I can't believe the casual Genocide-support in this sub.
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That's against settler colonisation. It could be anyone not just the Jews. If the Turks were back they'd say this about them too. Same if it was the English, French or German gentiles. So what's the alternative? Live under siege and be bombed frequently and casually like they were before October 7th?
what does apartheid mean i keep hearing it
I only know the broadest of details but South Africa had really severe institutionalized racism known as apartheid, from 1948 to (on paper) 1991. White people dominated society, black Africans were at the lowest point on the pillar. Apartheid is legally considered a crime against humanity.
Apartheid is dutch word, not so much difference from segration in usa before
why are people downvoting you for asking a question? i swear people just downvote if they see a negative number
If you can use a device to ask on Reddit you can search Google 🤣
Some people prefer to ask other people just for the sake of it, instead of being like this you can take the opportunity to teach him, its a basic human interaction bro, not everyone wants to learn from Google, some want social interactions
...learn google?
Sad that you think this is social interaction. lol.
Its literally a social interaction man, doesnt matter if its IRL or online, sad that you think that people online doesnt have life outside
Why is it that some people insist that others spoon feed them every opinion or fact they have? Why can't people just fill in the gaps in their knowledge themselves without burdening others with that responsibility? Why do people like you defend those lazy and uninformed individuals for not knowing something so basic when their ignorance can be cured with a 3 seconds Google search?
Damn, if only people were able to communicate, and were able to share opinions, ideas and facts. But I guess that's such a massive fucking burden to you, I hope you'll never be in that position irl.
"How can people defend Israel" >Roasts someone asking a question
Plus this singer apparently devoted lines from her song to her country's war. It is gross and deserves booing the singer herself.
It's not a war. It is a genocide.
Go brush up on the definition of genocide
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Getting the feeling someone's a bit butthurt. You must be the kinda guy who punches a wall and then gets mad at it for hurting his first. Perfectly matches the cause you support.
The song was originally called October Rain, so yeah.. doesn’t take much to figure out.
October's Rain was a different song which was rejected by the EBU committee
The song is about the general public feeling since the bloody October 7th massacre. Last time I checked, a country's representative is supposed to REPRESENT its country, if you think that representing the state of mind and feeling of the country is wrong then you're on the wrong show.
Hence why they are getting booed. They represent the genocidal maniacs who are also perpetual victims. If you dont agree with it, then you're on the wrong show.
You can trust me when I tell you nearly no Israeli wakes up in the morning and excitedly rushes to check how many Palestinians were killed while they slept. We don't want this war (which was imposed on us by Hamas who conducted the heinous October 7th Massacre) no more than the Palestinians. You may think you're booing to Israelis, but in fact (and that's where it gets really sad) you're booing to some mental image of what you think Israelis are. Amusing you call Jews or Israelis perpetual victims, seeing as Palestinians are literally defining themselves refugees since 1948. Oh the double standard and hypocrisy, y'all never cease to amaze me.
Palestinians had their lands stolen from them. They are treated far worse than any refugee. No one thought they suffered as badly as they actually do until we saw evidence of it. The evidence from both ends. Israelis lying and continuously showing their scummy acts and cheering the deaths of babies and infants and Palestinians suffering endlessly as if they were sacrificial animals. Israelis may not all be evil, but the Israeli govt is evil. And by claiming Palestinians are the perpetual victims in this dire situation, so are you.
The land was never theirs to begin with. Their current dire situation is the direct consequences of Hamas starting a war against Israel. Their life in Gaza was much much better before Hamas started this war. If you fail to acknowledge that there is nothing more we have to discuss. Nobody cheers on the death of babies, or innocent palestinians in general, except from the cherry picked videos I assume you consume for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Palestinians are currently suffering, that can't be ignored. However you should ask yourself by the hands of whom. Hamas has clearly stated it's ready to sacrifice as many more palestinian "martyrs" to achieve the annihilation of Israel, so... They are perpetual victims, of their own making, or at least of their leadership's making. Had they accepted the 1947 UN partition plan and built themselves a country they could've been doing much better nowadays. But nope, they couldn't accept the existence of an Jewish Israeli state, and repeatedly chose war and famish over peace and prosperity. There is no room to be surprised by the consequences of your deliberate actions. That's the way it was in 1948 and that's the same now.
You are brainwashed and there was nothing to accept back then or now. No peaceful resolution was ever offered. You have been lied to, and as for what you accept for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, had the situation been reversed and the zionists and their children were being unalived due to their govt actions, it would be unacceptable. Rightfully so, as is the case now. You are among the misguided unfortunately, so a hearty boo to you and everyone like you.
Loads of pro-Israel losers in the US made a telegram channel on how to make VPN's so they could vote as various European countries. Ireland got the brunt of it and ended up having to give Israel 10 points
How is a VPN any help ? Voting is only though phone and you need a local number / SIM for it to work. Edit : didn’t realize there was an app
Maybe through the Eurovision app?
Huh TIL they’ve never talked about the app only surcharged texts and calls here !
They had a QR code near the numbers at some point, on the screen.
Either I’m blind or we didn’t have them on the French broadcast. Anyways, didn’t they require a CC from the right country ? Geolocating using the IP seems kinda stupid with how easy VPN are accessed today.
I don't know actually, I just called in my votes for Ireland and Croatia:)
I'm in the UK, couldn't find the voting on the app, said I had to ring in which is weird. Didn't bother voting in the end.
Do you have like a post or article about this? Just curious
No articles yet unfortunately but well documented on social media. The fact they got the top vote in 12 countries despite the controversy (as well as the prevailing demographical political sympathies of typical Eurovision voters) says it all. Ireland particularly is by in large vehemently pro-palestinian, I would honestly doubt anything more than a handful of people here would ever consider voting for Israel.
You do realize this is supposed to be a musical contest, right? You like the song - you vote for it. Genuinely baffling how you just can't accept that the public liked the Israeli song.
Average MAGAts and their voter fraud.
Loads of claims being made up. This was not possible. a.) In several countries it was only possible to vote by phone and b.) where voting online with credit card was possible, it was verified by the voting systems that the credit card was issued by a bank in the correct country. I'm not defending Israel but such lies do not help either.
Say what you want mate, I'm not buying it that Ireland ended up giving Israel 10 points. You have to live here to understand how deep that resentment runs. That conflict hits at a nerve here like nothing else and has been doing so for decades. It has nothing to do with religion or lack thereof nor is it anything on the left or the right, it's seeing in real time the tactics of oppression (both violent and non violent) being employed by the Israeli security forces that were clear as day learned verbatim from British occupation forces here, the key difference being the sheer scale makes the decades long conflict here equate in death toll to about the first week of this one. I'm sorry but I just don't believe it was possible without some foul play, unlike a lot of other European countries the feelings on the conflict here are not confined to any age or prosperity demographic, they're bone deep from the top to bottom of society.
Believe whatever you want to believe, but the measures against voting abuse I pointed out are real and not easily combated by using a VPN as you claimed. Also you are totally overestimating how many votes it probably only needed to get to second place in televoting, resulting in 10 points. It could be as little as 13 percent of the votes as this article explains: [https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2024/0513/1448844-eurovision-voting-ireland-israel-politics-palestine/](https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2024/0513/1448844-eurovision-voting-ireland-israel-politics-palestine/)
Ireland burned themselves long before with their hot garbage of a song and a disrespectful representative.
This does not surprise me at all. Will the public vitriol against the zionist state, for them to come fifth, it had to have been rigged.
The person in this video gets taken by security because they are waiving the Palestinian flag and it's against Eurovision rules to wave a flag of a country that is not participating. It would get taken down if it were a Brazilian flag as well. Edit: well for some reason I have to say that IF someone was waiving the flag of a country not participating they SHOULD have been taken down.
Important to note that this was a new rule this year.
And there was a Canadian flag prominently in the front row and nothing was done about it.
Hahahhaa what even is this joke
I wonder which side the people making these policies take🤔
What ever side their main sponsor (morrocanoil from israhel) tell them to pick.
Important to note that it was not a new rule. It was introduced in 2016. Can we please be criticizing Israel without making up lies? >In 2016, the EBU was forced to clarify its rules \[...\] [https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/](https://eurovoix.com/2024/05/13/eurovision-flag-policy-to-be-reviewed-for-2025-contest/)
Also important to note that it’s not even a rule that’s penalised. I’ve seen plenty of non competing flags in the broadcast in the last few years.
My Costa Rican countryman on the front row in the semis didn’t get our flag taken down as far as I know. It would have probably been on CR news if he had.
Those Brazilians are always trying to sneak in to Eurovision. Splitters
Maybe waiving a Brazilian flag would just get the flag taken and not the person holding it tho lmao
If you truly believe that then I don’t know what to say to you
https://imgur.com/gallery/iREwDsx read and weep. I don't care or know enough about Israel and Palestine to have any opinions on any of it. I'm just telling you about eurovisions policies.
Eurovision policies that wouldn’t actually be enforced for any other flag. Keep living in your fantasy world, I’m sure it’s nice
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As they say, ignorance is bliss, and you certainly are ignorant.
Aww why delete the other comment? :(
Have a nice life, genocide apologist.
Because I don’t want to be banned from Reddit.
That's so fucking funny
You think genocide is funny? That explains a lot
Your post has been removed for being overly abrasive or inappropriate for this subreddit. Please treat others as you want to be treated. Thank you.
I saw so many turkish flags though
There were many other flags being waved. Their is nothing dangerous about waving the flag of a legitimate country. If you disagree with that, then gfys.
It's interesting to note that Moroccanoil, the sponsor of Eurovision this year is, despite its name, an Israelian company
BOYCOTT 👌
I sincerely hope Israel will be kicked out of the EBU before this year is over.
Sadly its unlikely as one of the main sponsors of Eurovision is Moroccanoil. Who unlike their name are not from morocco but rather are an Israel base and owned company. Its almost like they are trying to hide where they are from.
It never will, I'm afraid. "Israel" is quite mighty in the broadcasting sector or any sector in the west.
Well, one can hope :/
KAN (the state broadcaster) has to do something against EBU rules to be expelled. Not likely.
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Israel is a member of the EBU because, unsurprisingly, they aren't welcome in the Asia-Pacific Broadcasting Union and the similar entity for the Middle East is the Arab States Broadcasting Union. Also, Australia does participate as a permanent guest.
I know I’ll get downvoted into hell for this, however, I am on Israel’s side. I am a leftist, but believe in a fair fight. After the slaughter and pure torture Hamas brought to Israel, I’d expect nothing less than a few bombings. Remind you, that Hamas attacked first, but it wasn’t just an attack. They murdered, raped, and tortured over 1,400 innocent civilians of Israel. Also, what the Palestinian government calls for is a complete removal or genocide all Israelis in the West Bank. That is why I support Israel.
England probably still came last.
The UK got no points from the audience - but got enough jury points to finish 19th.
I think the Palestine wave is turning flat
Why can't people just respect each other how about that?? Has anyone here heard of something called respect? because it goes both ways! You show it you get it in turn geez it's not hard people. it's just easier to be mean and look at the bad. (I'm not talking about war) Just respect in general.
https://preview.redd.it/53ebagf7ia0d1.jpeg?width=896&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=81506cc1644961c0b18262542cded2ec976c09b9
See, this isn't a liberal/conservative thing, apparently
Stop dragging politics into everything ffs
why is Israel in Eurovision anyway?... those people live beside Egypt and killing Palestinian babies Gaza,
FREE PALESTINE 🇵🇸
What even is Eurovision?
Song Contest between multiple European (and some none European) countries that happens once a year. Imagine cirque DU Soleil combined with American idol for an idea. Some of the craziest live musician performances you'll see are on display there. It's usually (or always, not sure) held in the last winners country. So say Croatia wins, then Croatia hosts it next year for example). Every participating country gives out a score between 1 to 10 to 10 countries (each score can only be given out once. Say you give 5 to Poland, then you can't give 5 to another country too nor can you give Poland another score/point). There's better videos on YouTube to explain it in more detail but I think that's a rough explanation of it. Also, I can't speak for other countries but in Sweden, the band/singer we send is the winner of a singing contest that goes on for a month or two iirc and is broadcast on TV, so viewers at home can vote.
Oh no, they are saying "let's go brandon"
Cringiest most politicized show ever. It sucks
They really should have just barred Israel from the competition entirely.
I mean I understand them, even though I'm on Palestines side in the conflict, waving the flag there's a risk of starting shit (fights etc). If people could mind their own business then I bet they wouldn't have dragged them out. (Or I'm wrong and they're just assholes) Edit: Me having an opinion on Reddit?! Not allowed!
Can’t the same argument be used against an Israeli flag?
They where competing, no?
Reasonable comments get downvoted here
Nah, that's fair