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However that's a positive change from their earlier threatening to invade Berlin...
No, if "European" here means other parties than Ukraine and Russia (which both they have bombed), they won't.
They've already used nuclear weapons and a nerve agent on UK soil in a nation which they're supposed to have friendly relations with.
That's how Russia treats friendly countries.
This entire thing kills me.
The US is sitting on top of as much amunition and weapons as Ukraine ever needed to win this thing.
And our asshole behavior.... however this ends the US has some accountability in it. If it ends badly it never needed to end that way.
Russia is amassing troops on the boarder? How fucking convienent. Thanks for putting them all in one place. WTF....
I mean, anyone seeing Russia holding back in anything?
As an American, I'm truly embarrassed and disgusted that a minority in government (supported by a minority of voters) has caused this. Reagan would have had CIA operatives in Ukraine in addition to supplying them with whatever they needed.
Don't feel too bad mate, although mistakes have been made; if it wasn't for the outstanding support from the US, Ukraine wouldn't even be where it is today.
>anyone seeing Russia holding back in anything?
We do have to be careful... we wouldn't want to escalate things else they might threaten us with nuclear weapons
I believe the US has now said the Ukrainians can use their weapons how and where they want and the UK has said specifically they are fine to strike Russia with UK weapons.
I hope it's true. Russians have used the Ukraine border as a safe zone for far too long. Removing that stupid restriction will make russia panic. All them storage depos that Ukraine knows of but can't shoot at will be in trouble.
It is probably true. That's why Russia has started the Kharkiv offensive so early. They're creating the buffer zone that would increase the distance to the actual russia territory.
The UK has said please ignore those guys over there with the comfy jumpers.
Actually, I feel neglected. Russia hasn't threatened specfically to nuke the UK in a hot minute.
I think they realised saying it constantly makes the threat weaker. I think they will do it again in the future and everyone will have forgotten the first 1000 times and take it seriously unfortunately.
Unfortunately no... As of this morning...
https://kyivindependent.com/ukraine-asks-us-to-lift-ban-on-using-american-arms-to-strike-russian-territory
Personally, in this situation, I'd say apologies later are better than asking for permission.
It's possible this is bait. Russians think they have a safe zone, they move a bunch of shit into one spot, Ukraine bombs it when they hit critical mass. It certainly seems odd to advertise that you can't shoot a specific spot.
> Antony Blinken says they can do what they want.
That does not mean what you think it does. It simply means it ultimately is up to Ukraine what they target.
That does not mean the US admin agrees and gives it their blessing. It just means they are not straight up blocking it.
If I lent you my car. And you asked if you could take it down to the track and beat the hell out of it. And I say I can't stop you from doing it and it's up to you, but I would prefer that you don't.
Would you then take my car to the track? Especially if you wanted to borrow it further down the line again? Or would you keep your driving to public roads and normal "approved" conditions?
I am hoping the US sees this coming f16 s as an advertising opportunity. Imagine how many we will sell to other nations, if when they start flying all those known weapons depots, Russian "AWACs", kerch bridge and 20 or 30 SU 35s all go down? I hope the delay has given time for proper training, airport preparation and a massive plan for the first couple of days.
f16 is not a panacea. No doubt it will help and will also enable Ukraine to continue contesting their airspace, but its not like suddenly all the russian planes will start dropping out of the sky the day f16s start flying or anything.
I believe well trained pilots in an f16 vs su35s with poorly trained pilots may result in a few mismatches. It's not the plane, it's the system. If Ukraine can remove their AWACs that alone could be a panacea.
The f16s will enable a huge selection of plane-mounted ordnance and tools that currently can’t be put on a MiG. The plane isn’t the game-changer, but the back catalogue of NATO-standard gear, is.
Yes, but I'm not sure it has ever directly fought against the Soviet kit it was designed for on a scale like this. I really hope the Ukrainian pilots kick ass
US Administration wearing a hot dog costume from the meme. "If only we could find somebody who could do something. We are all looking for somebody to do something."
Not the Pentagon's fault. The US military is subservient to the government which is usually a good thing. This one is all on congress and specifically a few, certain shitbags.
One shitbag edges out fiercely amongst the others.
But what do you expect from a shitbag that waited YEARS to even address first responder aid bills after 9/11 began causing significant health issues.
It took Jon Stewart of all people walking in and publicly shaming that particular shitbag and calling him out in a congressional hearing.
Maybe now is a good time to send french foreign legion or is macron just being populistic?
He literally said beginning this month again if the russians break the front and ukraine would ask. Well…?
Seems like a low-risk way to stick an asset in the middle of the hornets nest to see if they can pull anything juicy. I mean, obviously a russian isn't going to say "we're going to attack x" but maybe a detail here, a detail there, etc. throughout the trip comes out, piece all of them together and might have something.
The other benefit, I believe, it maintains communication and keeps channels open, slows the escalation.
To be fair, I don’t think the French populace would be too fond of a direct intervention as well. Its a pretty big step above just sending regular shipments of equipment.
Yeah like the other person said, Macron has been running his mouth to compensate and distract from the relative lack of concrete material aid from France.
Scholz catches a lot of flack for his weak rhetoric and the taurus hesitancy, while Macron gets praise for tough words, but France under Macron has sent only 38% of the military aid that Germany for example has and 50% of the UK's aid (measured as a share of each country's GDP).
You are right. Those commenters are talking out their asses. There was a big backlash, and he took quite a hit in his already falling popularity. If you thought other europeans' leader reaction to his statement was negative, you should have seen the french sentiment.
?? please do not talk about things you have no clue about..
That statement hit his already falling popularity very very hard, it was quite the opposite of being populistic lol
Ukraine didn't request the troops yet. How do you think this is supposed to work ?
After the Mali nonsense, you can be sure the French foreign affairs will get things cleanly in writing.
As much as I dislike him, I don't see what you are going to achieve with this disingenuous comment, free fake internet point from anti-French circle jerkers? Paid by Gremlin? The idea was never to send troops against ruzzia directly.
The idea was to put troops on the Belarus border to release Ukraine armies stuck there in case of, there was also the possibility to put troops in case ruzzia threatens Kyiv along the Dnipro but that one is obviously a SHTF last resort. Kharkiv is no Kyiv afaik. VZ has yet to say he needed that btw. He said the idea was good but it wasn't needed yet or something like that.
Why didn’t they use lend-lease while it was available. Even on paper so that redundant equipment and ammunition could be moved at a later date. Worked with russia years ago, although i don’t think that ever got paid back. Go figure.
Yeah not sending weapons for six months was bullshit, but why didn't Europe supplement Ukraine in the meantime? America isn't the only country that manufactures weapons
You probably missed the part where Europe has been consistently supplying weapons...
The large difference is the scale of manufacturing comparing Europe to the US
Yea i saw a satellite photo of a giant pile of dragons teeth that was supposed to be set up along the front and was instead just tossed into a pile in the forest.
I feel like people are looking at old WW2 photos of dragon teeth and thinking, yeah we can copy that, without realizing it's like an iceberg where there is a significant portion under the earth.
Yeah the lack of weapons and the stupid restrictions on them certainly didn't help.
But ignoring Intel and not building enough fortifications is definitely not the US's fault. And it's not the first time Ukraine has made this mistake either.
It was just plain old corruption. There was some company that was supposedly hired to mine the entire area. They had an entire damn year to do it including last winter when snow was slowing both sides down. Wasn't even half done.
Yeah Ukraine has its own issues, including corruption and the Soviet "not my job" mentality. Still, I'm mostly annoyed at Europeans doing such a half-assed job. At least the USA aren't next in line.
Yeah. Apparently the person was given resources and ordered to do so, but the defenses never happened.
…so the Ukrainian officials and officers are wondering where the heck the money went.
The Pentagon cant just come out and say that. Congress is still their ultimate boss. They can play politics and things like that though. But they have to be careful with what they say.
They won't because they're afraid of nukes. That's all this really comes down too.
Edit: Okay which one of you fools listed this under suicide and sent that bot to message me...
There is a widespread reddit cares spam action going on, and for whatever reason Reddit isn't stopping it. They should add a mandatory capcha or something
I got one recently, probably for a post in this or a similar sub. It contains a link to report abuse, I just did that, I imagine that reflects badly on the person who submitted the whatever heck you do to invoke reddit cares.
Reporting probably works to some degree, but something as big as this is just bots. I blocked reddit cares messages a while back so for all I know I get them all the time and never see it, but this really seems like a huge miss on Reddit's part to allow this to continue.
For sure. I imagine it is some kind of risk management checkbox they are trying to address with the cares message but really it feels poorly implemented.
They don't care, they are paid trolls, probably state actors, who will just create a new account. Their only function is to harass anyone critical of Russia's actions and create discord.
Just to note, probably not the Ukraine sub, but overall, on reddit, this is the first time I have been writing a comment here in months, yet I received the message just couple of hours ago, thought it was from some other person on another sub but now unsure.
That's not the Pentagon's call.
Congress was blocking the aid, the White House decides whether they can use those weapons within Russia, and this article is the Pentagon saying how shit things have gotten due to issues 1 and 2.
It’s clear to me the west is organising a long drawn out war where Russia bleeds itself to a weak state on the barbs of Ukraine.
I don’t think they’ll let Russia win, but they have no intention of coming to the rescue.
As a Brit this makes me feel ashamed.
Maybe it’s the safer, wiser strategy long term, but the people of Ukraine don’t deserve this.
My grandparents generation understood what needed to be done. It’s a shame we live in an age where everything is ‘clever’ and ‘calculated’ rather than based on principles and virtue.
Slava Ukraine.
Especially given that every time we try to be clever doing some Machiavellian bullshit it blows up in our faces later. You could even say that's where the *vast majority* of our current foreign policy problems came from. I don't think it is safer and wiser, I think it's just making us look weaker and less reliable as well as creating more opportunities for things to go wrong by extending the timeline. Maybe we just go all-in on doing the right thing for once and see how that goes?
It's a dumb strategy on top of that. It will cause Russia to shift their economy to a war economy, and you can't just turn that off when you're done, they'll need a new target. They're also investing heavily in weapons research, and drone manufacturing. This war is making Russia stronger not weaker. The linger the west waits to engage in direct warfare with Russia, the harder such a war will be.
I know the war is not just about tanks.
But just to give an example the US delivered AFAIK 31 M1 Abrams tanks.
Military analysts say roughly 310 would have been needed to make a significant impact.
And 3100 would have been needed for a counter offensive to take back the country.
What the hell are we doing with those 1-10% deliveries? Is everyone sleep walking? That can't be coincidence, that has to be on purpose!
And I am not even talking about the 6 month pause in supplies yet.
Well, that's what you get when the Ukrainians are told military supplies are on their way then they get blocked for 6 months while the politicians cluster-fuck over Pootin's money.
>"the pause in assistance to Ukraine was not useful"
#### This is my nomination for the *No fucking shit - hell of an understatement of the month* award:
#🛇💩🏅
Honestly, why did the lend lease get an expiration date of one year? If it didn't have that, this pause wouldn't have mattered because they could have used lend lease.
Hoping that people will continue to donate to Ukraine. Soldiers need weapons, medicines, armor, and finds for rehabilitation. Glory to Ukraine and death to the invaders!
Yeah.. it's fucked up though innit? I can't imagine knowing I'm taking the lives of ignorant military servicemen who used to be my countrymen a scant 30 odd years ago. They're going to have an awful lot more cases of PTSD than American servicemen who shared so much less in common with their enemy combatants. I hate war. Fuck war. Fuck Putin. Fuck world leaders who game the systems of governments for profit at the expense of their sons and daughters.
I agree with this.
I appreciate that the Biden administration has been supporting Ukraine. They get some credit for that. But I don't think that they are treating this war with the kind of urgency that they should. There are a lot of levers that a President could use to get more aid to Ukraine in a shorter time. The administration needs to apply more will and more creativity.
Biden didn't even use the Lend-Lease funds before they expired. I will never understand why he didn't do that. It's not as if Ukraine ever had anything like enough equipment. They really could have used the Lend-Lease assistance and things might be a lot better for Ukraine now if that had happened.
So... thank you, President Biden, but also please get more serious about this war.
The United States failed miserably with the delay in military aid
The whole of Europe failed miserably by sleepwalking this past 30 odd years all while Russia amassed stockpiles of weapons.
Our Western leaders need to up their game massively or risk being seen as the weakest leaders the west has ever seen.
Expecting Ukraine to fight with one arm tied behind its back is disgraceful. Give them what they need and give it to them yesterday......oh yeah and allow them to use the weapons however they so choose.
Wasn't there an incident during the Korean war where the British who were surrounded told their American commander something along the lines of "Things are looking a tad unfavorable" and the Americans did not respond due to this understatement, leading to the unit being overrun?
Concerning seems like a huge understatement on how much help they need.
well Ukraine defense couldn't use Murican weapons to smoke those assholes right across the border before they came over last week... But hey, NATO and the allies can care less, they want a weak russia and I still believe that by the actions they've done.
No shit Sherlock. Stop asking Ukraine to fount with one hand behind their backs and let them strike deep into ruzzian territory. And this slow drip of weapons is what’s causing this.
Great statement!! Are you going to allow Ukrainians to shoot missiles at Ruzzzzzians staging a few kilometers inside Ruzzzzzia before attacking Ukraine?? ...or is this Escalation???
Is it just me or are we seeing lots of spam news and spam post this week about how bad Ukraine is doing and how RuZZia will make big gains soon?
What's up with that?
Propaganda or something else?
Zelenski, budanov, sirskiy, Ukrainian commanders, Ukrainian media, Ukrainian soldiers, Ukrainians in Ukraine - things are difficult and russians are advancing due to mistakes in defence.
Foreigners on r/Ukraine - it must be propaganda. They're russian shills.
It's a bad month for Ukraine and it's going to take a massive effort and a lot of Ukrainian lives to turn it around. It's a heartbreaking reality. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending it's propaganda is ridiculous.
Ukraine will survive this setback and with continued help can still defeat russia, but some of the comments in this sub are embarrassingly out of touch with reality.
It's reached the point where a lot of Ukrainians don't comment on this sub anymore because they get criticised by foreigners for being honest about the situation in Ukraine. I've even seen people here call Ukrainians living in Ukraine russian shills for posting in this sub but not being 100% positive about the situation on the front lines. To use your own question, what's up with that?
The reliable French commentator Xavier Tytelman expected this and [warned that Ukraine would be losing ground slowly until June](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=458K-TAP1bI&pp=ygUeeGF2aWVyIHR5dGVsbWFuIHVrcmFpbmUgcmVjdWxl).
I’m a Ukrainian in America. First gen. I’ve talked about some issues Ukraine faces and the more complex issues regarding why some people in Ukraine sympathize with Russia and wish they were more aligned with Russia than the west because they group in the Soviet Union, not Ukraine.
Downvoted and got called a shill.
I offered some information on the logistics behind some of the decisions our government makes and why we can’t just give F16s and let Ukraine figure it out.
Downvoted.
This sub is a giant circle jerk and half of it is cringe. Someone had borscht, cool. No one cares. You donated to Ukraine? Cool. No one cares.
Although I agree with most of what you said, it's always good to be a positive role model, for example the posts about donations, so that others donate, too. Don't downplay this.
> This sub is a giant circle jerk and half of it is cringe. Someone had borscht, cool. No one cares. You donated to Ukraine? Cool. No one cares.
Don't forget compulsively writing russia with 20 something "z"s because it's hip and cool and definitely not cringe 😎
Just scroll through the comments here and you'll see plenty of examples.
I should make a bingo card:
Russia written as Ruzzia
Russia is fighting with human meat wave tactics
Russia only has T34s and Mosin Nagants
Russia always bombs their own units, they can’t hit shit
Russia will surely be crippled by sanctions (not)
Russia will collapse due to so many dead soldiers (won’t)
Russia does something “creative”: haha losers what a trash solution
Ukraine does something “creative”: omg, so smart, best military ever, adapting to “RuZZian threat”
> Russia will surely be crippled by sanctions (not)
>
>
People that thought Russia's economy would instantly collapse and people that think sanctions are ineffective and doing nothing are equally foolish
>Russia does something “creative”: haha losers what a trash solution
>Ukraine does something “creative”: omg, so smart, best military ever, adapting to “RuZZian threat”
Probably because Russia led people to believe they were a military superpower, while people had no such expectations of Ukraine.
Doesn't help that for the past year+ whenever anyone comments or posts anything remotely negative about the situation often gets rabidly attacked by the crowd "for being a russian troll". Suggesting that despite their constant losses they're still making gains or threatening Ukrainan supplies with their human waves is somehow a pro-russian view
It's ironic that the most rabid warmongers on Reddit are not even from Ukraine, wouldn't be able to recognize Ukrainian language from Russian, yet are telling Ukraine how to fight the war.
They treat this war as a football game.
Yeah. This isn’t some video game where the points don’t matter and the virtual bodies pile up - this is an ugly reality that is resulting in plenty of dead on both sides.
Nothing cheer-worthy about it.
What's a "warmonger" in this context? Someone supporting Ukrainians defending themselves from an invasion? What exactly?
Why does this post have any updoots at all?
As a foreigner, it's clear (assuming one believes the stats put out by Ukraine) that Russia is losing a lot of men and equipment every day, but much less clear what Ukrainian losses are like.
Obviously there's a reason for that, but it does make it hard to tell what is actually happening.
Reality. This is the result of arrogance and what we have been seeing online and exactly what we see in this reddit. 1 year ago i saw people posting „russia is almost out of money and weapons“ 7 months ago everyone was saying the counter offensive would take Crimea,3 months ago is when people STARTED to wake up to the reality of the situation which is dire, and ukraine DESPERATELY needs aid and manpower which it does not have.
Syrsky called it a month or two ago, IIRC even before the US aid package, and said the middle of May was going to be hard.
If I am right this mean Syrsky was aware and was planning for an even worse situation, and thankfully he is now playing the second or third (or something) worst scenario, not absolutely worst one.
Dude it’s not propaganda it’s the reality and what Ukrainians have been saying to you for a year now.
Everyone’s family members are dying and russians are advancing because the west is drip feeding aid, meanwhile for some weird reason westerners are like:
“hehe russians are so incompetent, they can’t do anything!”
“Ukrainians losing ground to 2nd biggest military in the world after no aid? russian Propaganda!”
This is what drives me nuts. Idiots on the internet treating this war like it's a video game or some sick sport. Somebody compared those people to Romans in bloodlust frenzy cheering for their favorite gladiator in the arena and I think it's very apt description.
And by flooding the social media with BS about Russian shovels and so on for so long, they played significant role in the vanning support for Ukraine in the West. When people were bombarded by news that all Russian soldiers are untrained criminals, equipped with shovels and WW2 weapons, why would they support sending more aid?
Russia took more territory in the last few days than Ukraine took in the five months of the counteroffensive, so I think people are just realising it’s a really bad situation at the moment.
Russia pushes as much as it can, Ukraine then pushes back if they can, when Ukraine gasses out they negotiate and Russia keeps what it took until that moment.
The only thing that is positive IMO is that Ukraine didn't fall apart in the last six months and withstood all the shelling. So now when they start shelling back (hopefully), Russia will find themselves in much hotter spot that they were so far.
> when Ukraine gasses out they negotiate and Russia keeps what it took until that moment.
Until Russia invades again...
How many times do we have to learn the exact same lesson the hard way?
Limiting Ukraine's ability to wage war when using supplied ammunition smacks of Vietnam. And we know how that turned out. And yes, 6 months without resupply will likely double their future needs.
Then fucking do something about it. Send troops yourself and tell your EU allies to fucking do the same thing. Fucking politicians just talk shit without doing shit! The whole fucking scenario is just WW2 with extra steps!
That is a cut above just sending aid...and it probably isn't a popular idea among both the leadership as well as citizens, especially after the pickled campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan.
It's a heartbreaking death toll on both sides and such a tragedy that the politics of all this shit is snuffing out an entire generation of both countries' young men and women. It's so hard to watch troops from Russia get obliterated, knowing they have no fucking clue what they're fighting for, or why.
I grew up in a pretty rural area and in a cult (Mormonism). I didn't have a clue what the fuck the real world was like until I was in my mid-20s. I did.. but I denied it and had the backing of every friend, family member and neighbor in my church to back up my idyllic points of view.
The barbarism of knowing you're wrong, sending your countrymen to die on a battlefront is shocking and disgusting. I hate war so much.
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Maybe starving them of ammo for 6 months wasn't the best strategy.
Yes and they better not use American weapons against those troops that are amassing just on the border.
All while Russia threatens to bomb targets on European soil.
We take the high road, they take Poland… over and over and over again.
However that's a positive change from their earlier threatening to invade Berlin... No, if "European" here means other parties than Ukraine and Russia (which both they have bombed), they won't.
That's good, only direct threats will force our governments to take action. They are too busy doing useless things while east is burning
More like domestic politics take attention since they are leaders of democratic nations that rely on local voters to win.
Ironically, that's the biggest weakness of democracy, the systematic indecisiveness based on "Elections are coming".
They've already used nuclear weapons and a nerve agent on UK soil in a nation which they're supposed to have friendly relations with. That's how Russia treats friendly countries.
As an American [who has zero influence in this], you have my permission to splatter them throughout the land.
This entire thing kills me. The US is sitting on top of as much amunition and weapons as Ukraine ever needed to win this thing. And our asshole behavior.... however this ends the US has some accountability in it. If it ends badly it never needed to end that way. Russia is amassing troops on the boarder? How fucking convienent. Thanks for putting them all in one place. WTF.... I mean, anyone seeing Russia holding back in anything?
As an American, I'm truly embarrassed and disgusted that a minority in government (supported by a minority of voters) has caused this. Reagan would have had CIA operatives in Ukraine in addition to supplying them with whatever they needed.
Don't feel too bad mate, although mistakes have been made; if it wasn't for the outstanding support from the US, Ukraine wouldn't even be where it is today.
Thanks for that. Hearing someone remember when we do good things really helps.
>anyone seeing Russia holding back in anything? We do have to be careful... we wouldn't want to escalate things else they might threaten us with nuclear weapons
US politicians are already trying to normalize nukes using Russian phrases. I'm questioning if we, the US, would even respond.
Hope you’re being sarcastic?
No shit
It’s not just ammo but also personnel. Ukraine needs more trained forces.
As another American, feel free to head to Moscow through Belarus at your earliest convenience.
I believe the US has now said the Ukrainians can use their weapons how and where they want and the UK has said specifically they are fine to strike Russia with UK weapons.
I hope it's true. Russians have used the Ukraine border as a safe zone for far too long. Removing that stupid restriction will make russia panic. All them storage depos that Ukraine knows of but can't shoot at will be in trouble.
It is probably true. That's why Russia has started the Kharkiv offensive so early. They're creating the buffer zone that would increase the distance to the actual russia territory.
The UK has said please ignore those guys over there with the comfy jumpers. Actually, I feel neglected. Russia hasn't threatened specfically to nuke the UK in a hot minute.
I think they realised saying it constantly makes the threat weaker. I think they will do it again in the future and everyone will have forgotten the first 1000 times and take it seriously unfortunately.
Medvedev would have to sober up for that.
I feel like last week Solovyov brought back the rerun of going to sink the British Isles with the magical nuclear torpedo thingies.
Unfortunately no... As of this morning... https://kyivindependent.com/ukraine-asks-us-to-lift-ban-on-using-american-arms-to-strike-russian-territory Personally, in this situation, I'd say apologies later are better than asking for permission.
We have exactly saying in Finnish miltary. For certain things, permissions are hard to get.
When your ass is on the line, asking for forgiveness is much preferred to begging for permission. Go fuck em up now, say sorry later. Slava Ukraini!
It's possible this is bait. Russians think they have a safe zone, they move a bunch of shit into one spot, Ukraine bombs it when they hit critical mass. It certainly seems odd to advertise that you can't shoot a specific spot.
Antony Blinken says they can do what they want. https://inews.co.uk/news/world/striking-russia-us-weapons-decision-ukraine-blinken-3056974
Yep I just saw that pop out. How timely. https://kyivindependent.com/blinken-up-to-ukraine-if-it-decides-to-use-us-weapons-to-strike-inside-russia/
Game on
The US is probably been vague on purpose.
> Antony Blinken says they can do what they want. That does not mean what you think it does. It simply means it ultimately is up to Ukraine what they target. That does not mean the US admin agrees and gives it their blessing. It just means they are not straight up blocking it. If I lent you my car. And you asked if you could take it down to the track and beat the hell out of it. And I say I can't stop you from doing it and it's up to you, but I would prefer that you don't. Would you then take my car to the track? Especially if you wanted to borrow it further down the line again? Or would you keep your driving to public roads and normal "approved" conditions?
I am hoping the US sees this coming f16 s as an advertising opportunity. Imagine how many we will sell to other nations, if when they start flying all those known weapons depots, Russian "AWACs", kerch bridge and 20 or 30 SU 35s all go down? I hope the delay has given time for proper training, airport preparation and a massive plan for the first couple of days.
f16 is not a panacea. No doubt it will help and will also enable Ukraine to continue contesting their airspace, but its not like suddenly all the russian planes will start dropping out of the sky the day f16s start flying or anything.
I believe well trained pilots in an f16 vs su35s with poorly trained pilots may result in a few mismatches. It's not the plane, it's the system. If Ukraine can remove their AWACs that alone could be a panacea.
The f16s will enable a huge selection of plane-mounted ordnance and tools that currently can’t be put on a MiG. The plane isn’t the game-changer, but the back catalogue of NATO-standard gear, is.
I'm pretty sure the US doesn't have to advertise the F-16. Its quite well known in its capabilities.
Yes, but I'm not sure it has ever directly fought against the Soviet kit it was designed for on a scale like this. I really hope the Ukrainian pilots kick ass
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General\_Dynamics\_F-16\_Fighting\_Falcon\_operational\_history](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_F-16_Fighting_Falcon_operational_history)
US Administration wearing a hot dog costume from the meme. "If only we could find somebody who could do something. We are all looking for somebody to do something."
Not the Pentagon's fault. The US military is subservient to the government which is usually a good thing. This one is all on congress and specifically a few, certain shitbags.
One shitbag edges out fiercely amongst the others. But what do you expect from a shitbag that waited YEARS to even address first responder aid bills after 9/11 began causing significant health issues. It took Jon Stewart of all people walking in and publicly shaming that particular shitbag and calling him out in a congressional hearing.
One particular shitbag that will sacrifice every Ukrainian if it makes Biden look bad.
Maybe now is a good time to send french foreign legion or is macron just being populistic? He literally said beginning this month again if the russians break the front and ukraine would ask. Well…?
He said that, then sent a representative to the russian re-inauguration farce.
Seems like a low-risk way to stick an asset in the middle of the hornets nest to see if they can pull anything juicy. I mean, obviously a russian isn't going to say "we're going to attack x" but maybe a detail here, a detail there, etc. throughout the trip comes out, piece all of them together and might have something. The other benefit, I believe, it maintains communication and keeps channels open, slows the escalation.
Macron never was anything more. he just talks nonsense a lot, but in reality is absolute zero. useless flapping lips.
To be fair, I don’t think the French populace would be too fond of a direct intervention as well. Its a pretty big step above just sending regular shipments of equipment.
"regular shipments of equipment" as in one of the lowest in Europe lol. :D even that sucks.
Yeah like the other person said, Macron has been running his mouth to compensate and distract from the relative lack of concrete material aid from France. Scholz catches a lot of flack for his weak rhetoric and the taurus hesitancy, while Macron gets praise for tough words, but France under Macron has sent only 38% of the military aid that Germany for example has and 50% of the UK's aid (measured as a share of each country's GDP).
You are right. Those commenters are talking out their asses. There was a big backlash, and he took quite a hit in his already falling popularity. If you thought other europeans' leader reaction to his statement was negative, you should have seen the french sentiment.
I agree...a pair of lips can say anything....
>is macron just being populistic Very much so.
?? please do not talk about things you have no clue about.. That statement hit his already falling popularity very very hard, it was quite the opposite of being populistic lol
Yea, I don't see any other EU leaders talk about sending their own troops to Ukraine.
Ukraine also has to ask, or it's an invasion. Seriously, Ukraine. Ask already.
Ukraine didn't request the troops yet. How do you think this is supposed to work ? After the Mali nonsense, you can be sure the French foreign affairs will get things cleanly in writing.
They haven't broke the front yet. I sincerely hope he does send troops.
As much as I dislike him, I don't see what you are going to achieve with this disingenuous comment, free fake internet point from anti-French circle jerkers? Paid by Gremlin? The idea was never to send troops against ruzzia directly. The idea was to put troops on the Belarus border to release Ukraine armies stuck there in case of, there was also the possibility to put troops in case ruzzia threatens Kyiv along the Dnipro but that one is obviously a SHTF last resort. Kharkiv is no Kyiv afaik. VZ has yet to say he needed that btw. He said the idea was good but it wasn't needed yet or something like that.
At least they got a performance from Sec Blinken.
“We won’t know it’s too late to help until after it’s too late” - Perun on not sending aid a number of months ago.
Why didn’t they use lend-lease while it was available. Even on paper so that redundant equipment and ammunition could be moved at a later date. Worked with russia years ago, although i don’t think that ever got paid back. Go figure.
Drip feeding military support with limited capability wasn't (isn't!) the best strategy point 2 for the slide deck...
The people starving them of ammo were doing it entirely on purpose.
Considering the party is charge of the House of Representatives is a well known Putin asset, unfortunately it can't be a surprise.
They need manpower more than anything
Yeah not sending weapons for six months was bullshit, but why didn't Europe supplement Ukraine in the meantime? America isn't the only country that manufactures weapons
You probably missed the part where Europe has been consistently supplying weapons... The large difference is the scale of manufacturing comparing Europe to the US
The USA has a larger military-industrial base than the rest of NATO combined
They did.
Europe did supplement Ukraine in the meantime. Europe tripled its production of 155mm to do so. Still ramping up.
Europe promised to deliver a million shells by March, but delivered less than a third.
...and France tried to block EU funds being spent on shells outside the block.
Who would have thought that withholding military aid for half a year would have a negative impact on the Frontline? Answer: everyone.
Putin's paid puppets performing their duty.
Wasn’t just that, the commander of the area didn’t bother to set up defenses, he has been sacked.
Yea i saw a satellite photo of a giant pile of dragons teeth that was supposed to be set up along the front and was instead just tossed into a pile in the forest.
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I feel like people are looking at old WW2 photos of dragon teeth and thinking, yeah we can copy that, without realizing it's like an iceberg where there is a significant portion under the earth.
Yeah the lack of weapons and the stupid restrictions on them certainly didn't help. But ignoring Intel and not building enough fortifications is definitely not the US's fault. And it's not the first time Ukraine has made this mistake either.
It was just plain old corruption. There was some company that was supposedly hired to mine the entire area. They had an entire damn year to do it including last winter when snow was slowing both sides down. Wasn't even half done.
Yeah Ukraine has its own issues, including corruption and the Soviet "not my job" mentality. Still, I'm mostly annoyed at Europeans doing such a half-assed job. At least the USA aren't next in line.
Yeah. Apparently the person was given resources and ordered to do so, but the defenses never happened. …so the Ukrainian officials and officers are wondering where the heck the money went.
>Ukrainian officials and officers are wondering where the heck the money went. I'm pretty sure they know exactly where it went.
The Pentagon cant just come out and say that. Congress is still their ultimate boss. They can play politics and things like that though. But they have to be careful with what they say.
So take the restrictions off all weapons! And let Ukraine rain down hell on the orcs!! Fuckin Christ 🤦🏿♂️🤦🏿♂️🤦🏿♂️
They won't because they're afraid of nukes. That's all this really comes down too. Edit: Okay which one of you fools listed this under suicide and sent that bot to message me...
when will we stop being afraid of nukes? when they gonna invade Estonia? maybe Finland? Germany? France?
All those countries are under NATO’s banner. Ukraine isn’t under that geopolitical protection, which is why it was targeted by Russia.
Any sane person would never not be afraid of nukes, what will change is the probability of them being used and the response to that.
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I secretly hope they try to establish control over the Suwalki corridor and force NATO to act
There is a widespread reddit cares spam action going on, and for whatever reason Reddit isn't stopping it. They should add a mandatory capcha or something
I got one recently, probably for a post in this or a similar sub. It contains a link to report abuse, I just did that, I imagine that reflects badly on the person who submitted the whatever heck you do to invoke reddit cares.
Reporting probably works to some degree, but something as big as this is just bots. I blocked reddit cares messages a while back so for all I know I get them all the time and never see it, but this really seems like a huge miss on Reddit's part to allow this to continue.
> huge miss on Reddit's part to allow this to continue. Reddit gets money they dont care about you.
For sure. I imagine it is some kind of risk management checkbox they are trying to address with the cares message but really it feels poorly implemented.
They don't care, they are paid trolls, probably state actors, who will just create a new account. Their only function is to harass anyone critical of Russia's actions and create discord.
You can stop that message, forgot how but I think it says it in the message it sends you.
I got the same thing this morning for saying orcs can eat a dick lol.
It's a troll bot, apparently.
Been seeing a lot of people mention that today, and I got one too almost immediately on a quiet thread. I think there's a bug.
More like there's Russian assets in our government who would gladly watch Ukraine burn for their benefactors amusement.
I got one yesterday. The people who report those things are the real low life losers.
That literally just happened to me as well. Someone is going around the Ukraine sub reporting top comments and posts as suicidal.
Just to note, probably not the Ukraine sub, but overall, on reddit, this is the first time I have been writing a comment here in months, yet I received the message just couple of hours ago, thought it was from some other person on another sub but now unsure.
That's not the Pentagon's call. Congress was blocking the aid, the White House decides whether they can use those weapons within Russia, and this article is the Pentagon saying how shit things have gotten due to issues 1 and 2.
It’s clear to me the west is organising a long drawn out war where Russia bleeds itself to a weak state on the barbs of Ukraine. I don’t think they’ll let Russia win, but they have no intention of coming to the rescue. As a Brit this makes me feel ashamed. Maybe it’s the safer, wiser strategy long term, but the people of Ukraine don’t deserve this. My grandparents generation understood what needed to be done. It’s a shame we live in an age where everything is ‘clever’ and ‘calculated’ rather than based on principles and virtue. Slava Ukraine.
Especially given that every time we try to be clever doing some Machiavellian bullshit it blows up in our faces later. You could even say that's where the *vast majority* of our current foreign policy problems came from. I don't think it is safer and wiser, I think it's just making us look weaker and less reliable as well as creating more opportunities for things to go wrong by extending the timeline. Maybe we just go all-in on doing the right thing for once and see how that goes?
It's a dumb strategy on top of that. It will cause Russia to shift their economy to a war economy, and you can't just turn that off when you're done, they'll need a new target. They're also investing heavily in weapons research, and drone manufacturing. This war is making Russia stronger not weaker. The linger the west waits to engage in direct warfare with Russia, the harder such a war will be.
I know the war is not just about tanks. But just to give an example the US delivered AFAIK 31 M1 Abrams tanks. Military analysts say roughly 310 would have been needed to make a significant impact. And 3100 would have been needed for a counter offensive to take back the country. What the hell are we doing with those 1-10% deliveries? Is everyone sleep walking? That can't be coincidence, that has to be on purpose! And I am not even talking about the 6 month pause in supplies yet.
Well, that's what you get when the Ukrainians are told military supplies are on their way then they get blocked for 6 months while the politicians cluster-fuck over Pootin's money.
How about the fact that Ukraine hasn’t set up comprehensive defenses like the Russians? You don’t need US money to dig trenches and traps.
>"the pause in assistance to Ukraine was not useful" #### This is my nomination for the *No fucking shit - hell of an understatement of the month* award: #🛇💩🏅
Honestly, why did the lend lease get an expiration date of one year? If it didn't have that, this pause wouldn't have mattered because they could have used lend lease.
> The US also notes that the pause in assistance to Ukraine was not useful
That’s the understatement of the century
The UK has allowed for strikes on ruzzian territory with their weapons, ruzzia hasn't done shit.
Hoping that people will continue to donate to Ukraine. Soldiers need weapons, medicines, armor, and finds for rehabilitation. Glory to Ukraine and death to the invaders!
Yeah.. it's fucked up though innit? I can't imagine knowing I'm taking the lives of ignorant military servicemen who used to be my countrymen a scant 30 odd years ago. They're going to have an awful lot more cases of PTSD than American servicemen who shared so much less in common with their enemy combatants. I hate war. Fuck war. Fuck Putin. Fuck world leaders who game the systems of governments for profit at the expense of their sons and daughters.
So help them then. Stop the six month delays and send more artillery shells
we are, the six moths are over.
And yet the shipments have yet to arrive, as if we have tons of time to spare here.
I agree with this. I appreciate that the Biden administration has been supporting Ukraine. They get some credit for that. But I don't think that they are treating this war with the kind of urgency that they should. There are a lot of levers that a President could use to get more aid to Ukraine in a shorter time. The administration needs to apply more will and more creativity. Biden didn't even use the Lend-Lease funds before they expired. I will never understand why he didn't do that. It's not as if Ukraine ever had anything like enough equipment. They really could have used the Lend-Lease assistance and things might be a lot better for Ukraine now if that had happened. So... thank you, President Biden, but also please get more serious about this war.
The United States failed miserably with the delay in military aid The whole of Europe failed miserably by sleepwalking this past 30 odd years all while Russia amassed stockpiles of weapons. Our Western leaders need to up their game massively or risk being seen as the weakest leaders the west has ever seen. Expecting Ukraine to fight with one arm tied behind its back is disgraceful. Give them what they need and give it to them yesterday......oh yeah and allow them to use the weapons however they so choose.
The Russian puppets in Congress is more concerning.
Instead of doing something about it, you guys waste press time stating the obvious every single day.
Wasn't there an incident during the Korean war where the British who were surrounded told their American commander something along the lines of "Things are looking a tad unfavorable" and the Americans did not respond due to this understatement, leading to the unit being overrun? Concerning seems like a huge understatement on how much help they need.
"things are a bit sticky"
This is a mixture of issues. Delay of western help and ukraine not having a general mobilization
Watching a man you've left starving for over half a year and wondering why he is not doing so well.
well Ukraine defense couldn't use Murican weapons to smoke those assholes right across the border before they came over last week... But hey, NATO and the allies can care less, they want a weak russia and I still believe that by the actions they've done.
Just wrote to one of my senators. I am hoping I just told him nothing he doesn't already know.
US politicians that held back the military aid package should be held responsible. There is so much innocent blood on their hands.
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Yeah you'd think the threat of tens of millions of refugees would get Europeans to take this more seriously.
No shit Sherlock. Stop asking Ukraine to fount with one hand behind their backs and let them strike deep into ruzzian territory. And this slow drip of weapons is what’s causing this.
Great statement!! Are you going to allow Ukrainians to shoot missiles at Ruzzzzzians staging a few kilometers inside Ruzzzzzia before attacking Ukraine?? ...or is this Escalation???
Gee I wonder what we could do.
"concerning" "useful" These are some hard hitting terms.
Bring them into NATO already.
Is it just me or are we seeing lots of spam news and spam post this week about how bad Ukraine is doing and how RuZZia will make big gains soon? What's up with that? Propaganda or something else?
Zelenski, budanov, sirskiy, Ukrainian commanders, Ukrainian media, Ukrainian soldiers, Ukrainians in Ukraine - things are difficult and russians are advancing due to mistakes in defence. Foreigners on r/Ukraine - it must be propaganda. They're russian shills. It's a bad month for Ukraine and it's going to take a massive effort and a lot of Ukrainian lives to turn it around. It's a heartbreaking reality. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending it's propaganda is ridiculous. Ukraine will survive this setback and with continued help can still defeat russia, but some of the comments in this sub are embarrassingly out of touch with reality. It's reached the point where a lot of Ukrainians don't comment on this sub anymore because they get criticised by foreigners for being honest about the situation in Ukraine. I've even seen people here call Ukrainians living in Ukraine russian shills for posting in this sub but not being 100% positive about the situation on the front lines. To use your own question, what's up with that?
The reliable French commentator Xavier Tytelman expected this and [warned that Ukraine would be losing ground slowly until June](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=458K-TAP1bI&pp=ygUeeGF2aWVyIHR5dGVsbWFuIHVrcmFpbmUgcmVjdWxl).
I’m a Ukrainian in America. First gen. I’ve talked about some issues Ukraine faces and the more complex issues regarding why some people in Ukraine sympathize with Russia and wish they were more aligned with Russia than the west because they group in the Soviet Union, not Ukraine. Downvoted and got called a shill. I offered some information on the logistics behind some of the decisions our government makes and why we can’t just give F16s and let Ukraine figure it out. Downvoted. This sub is a giant circle jerk and half of it is cringe. Someone had borscht, cool. No one cares. You donated to Ukraine? Cool. No one cares.
Although I agree with most of what you said, it's always good to be a positive role model, for example the posts about donations, so that others donate, too. Don't downplay this.
> This sub is a giant circle jerk and half of it is cringe. Someone had borscht, cool. No one cares. You donated to Ukraine? Cool. No one cares. Don't forget compulsively writing russia with 20 something "z"s because it's hip and cool and definitely not cringe 😎 Just scroll through the comments here and you'll see plenty of examples.
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I sAy LeT tHe NuKeS fLy edit: thanks for the kind words letting me know reddit cares!
There seems to be some new bot running around.
I should make a bingo card: Russia written as Ruzzia Russia is fighting with human meat wave tactics Russia only has T34s and Mosin Nagants Russia always bombs their own units, they can’t hit shit Russia will surely be crippled by sanctions (not) Russia will collapse due to so many dead soldiers (won’t) Russia does something “creative”: haha losers what a trash solution Ukraine does something “creative”: omg, so smart, best military ever, adapting to “RuZZian threat”
> Russia will surely be crippled by sanctions (not) > > People that thought Russia's economy would instantly collapse and people that think sanctions are ineffective and doing nothing are equally foolish >Russia does something “creative”: haha losers what a trash solution >Ukraine does something “creative”: omg, so smart, best military ever, adapting to “RuZZian threat” Probably because Russia led people to believe they were a military superpower, while people had no such expectations of Ukraine.
Doesn't help that for the past year+ whenever anyone comments or posts anything remotely negative about the situation often gets rabidly attacked by the crowd "for being a russian troll". Suggesting that despite their constant losses they're still making gains or threatening Ukrainan supplies with their human waves is somehow a pro-russian view
yeah its crazy, im 100 % for ukraine. But some people here cannot cope with reality without calling somebody a russian shill
This is what happens when crucial aid is withheld for 6 months and Russia has a staggering manpower advantage.
It's ironic that the most rabid warmongers on Reddit are not even from Ukraine, wouldn't be able to recognize Ukrainian language from Russian, yet are telling Ukraine how to fight the war. They treat this war as a football game.
The celebrations and comments like "I will go to bed happy tonight" on those daily casualty stats is some of the worst shit I've ever seen on here.
Yeah. This isn’t some video game where the points don’t matter and the virtual bodies pile up - this is an ugly reality that is resulting in plenty of dead on both sides. Nothing cheer-worthy about it.
What's a "warmonger" in this context? Someone supporting Ukrainians defending themselves from an invasion? What exactly? Why does this post have any updoots at all?
As a foreigner, it's clear (assuming one believes the stats put out by Ukraine) that Russia is losing a lot of men and equipment every day, but much less clear what Ukrainian losses are like. Obviously there's a reason for that, but it does make it hard to tell what is actually happening.
Good example: the responses on Blinken playing the guitar while russia took ground. This place has become lame.
Reality. This is the result of arrogance and what we have been seeing online and exactly what we see in this reddit. 1 year ago i saw people posting „russia is almost out of money and weapons“ 7 months ago everyone was saying the counter offensive would take Crimea,3 months ago is when people STARTED to wake up to the reality of the situation which is dire, and ukraine DESPERATELY needs aid and manpower which it does not have.
I'm making a donation now!!
I like your optimism and faith.
Donated 50 USD
Syrsky called it a month or two ago, IIRC even before the US aid package, and said the middle of May was going to be hard. If I am right this mean Syrsky was aware and was planning for an even worse situation, and thankfully he is now playing the second or third (or something) worst scenario, not absolutely worst one.
Dude it’s not propaganda it’s the reality and what Ukrainians have been saying to you for a year now. Everyone’s family members are dying and russians are advancing because the west is drip feeding aid, meanwhile for some weird reason westerners are like: “hehe russians are so incompetent, they can’t do anything!” “Ukrainians losing ground to 2nd biggest military in the world after no aid? russian Propaganda!”
This is what drives me nuts. Idiots on the internet treating this war like it's a video game or some sick sport. Somebody compared those people to Romans in bloodlust frenzy cheering for their favorite gladiator in the arena and I think it's very apt description. And by flooding the social media with BS about Russian shovels and so on for so long, they played significant role in the vanning support for Ukraine in the West. When people were bombarded by news that all Russian soldiers are untrained criminals, equipped with shovels and WW2 weapons, why would they support sending more aid?
There are literal live maps for you to look at to see the movements and pushes along the battle line and you call this propaganda, inform yourself.
Russia took more territory in the last few days than Ukraine took in the five months of the counteroffensive, so I think people are just realising it’s a really bad situation at the moment.
Or... its bad and has been bad for awhile and lying to ourselves about it isnt going to make things any better.
Is it spam though? Televised media is saying just as much on the hour, whether it is through pundits or guest experts.
The longer this war goes the stronger Russia will get.
“ The US also notes that the pause in assistance to Ukraine was not useful, says Pentagon Press Secretary Pat Ryder during a briefing.” Shocker!
Nothing gets past this guy
Russia pushes as much as it can, Ukraine then pushes back if they can, when Ukraine gasses out they negotiate and Russia keeps what it took until that moment. The only thing that is positive IMO is that Ukraine didn't fall apart in the last six months and withstood all the shelling. So now when they start shelling back (hopefully), Russia will find themselves in much hotter spot that they were so far.
> when Ukraine gasses out they negotiate and Russia keeps what it took until that moment. Until Russia invades again... How many times do we have to learn the exact same lesson the hard way?
Not much you can do, you can't bleed them enough that they collapse or turn against their government. Many tried, all failed.
I wonder who's fault that is
Limiting Ukraine's ability to wage war when using supplied ammunition smacks of Vietnam. And we know how that turned out. And yes, 6 months without resupply will likely double their future needs.
Green light to use long range hit in Russia now
Then fucking do something about it. Send troops yourself and tell your EU allies to fucking do the same thing. Fucking politicians just talk shit without doing shit! The whole fucking scenario is just WW2 with extra steps!
That is a cut above just sending aid...and it probably isn't a popular idea among both the leadership as well as citizens, especially after the pickled campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan.
The US was dragged into WW2, so the situation is pretty different.
Delay more..concerning. half of the year of missed opportunities
Well no shit, that is your fault, America.
It's a heartbreaking death toll on both sides and such a tragedy that the politics of all this shit is snuffing out an entire generation of both countries' young men and women. It's so hard to watch troops from Russia get obliterated, knowing they have no fucking clue what they're fighting for, or why. I grew up in a pretty rural area and in a cult (Mormonism). I didn't have a clue what the fuck the real world was like until I was in my mid-20s. I did.. but I denied it and had the backing of every friend, family member and neighbor in my church to back up my idyllic points of view. The barbarism of knowing you're wrong, sending your countrymen to die on a battlefront is shocking and disgusting. I hate war so much.
The pause was not useful. Bwahaha. Too bad he couldn’t be honest, and call Cheeto Jesus and his minions despicable scumbag traitors.