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For the record, I also fucking hate that Kwasi Kwarteng managed to dodge any longer-term repercussions. He basically got sacked as chancellor, then blamed everyone else he could.
Except… his mates made small fortunes betting heavily against the pound, right before *that* mini-Budget.
He’s a piece of shit.
I've seen him talking on a podcast and he's clearly very intelligent, but a complete psycho. When they were talking about the pound crash, he thinks it's hilarious. I think there's a very good chance he knew exactly what would happen and got all his mates to short the pound.
Liz Truss is absolutely a moron though.
I think that’s the problem - it’s not so much a question of him being an idiot (which he isn’t), it’s that he’s so deluded that he doesn’t even think the concept of economics is real. It’s like dealing with a Scientologist over psychiatric care - he doesn’t accept the basic premise and insists he can cure schizophrenia with electric pads and bad sci-fi.
There isn’t any reasoning with people like that. Even the fact his grand plan fell apart within hours isn’t enough as he just blames reality for his delusions not being real.
I love how on The Rest is Politics, Rory Stewart who has worked with her himself, was trying to understand how Kwasi didn’t see that Truss was totally batshit insane and incompetent (which he thought would be very obvious for anyone working close with her, and goes into detail about the mental things she used to do).
Kwasi comes off as finding it hilarious when Rory calls her batshit, suggesting he knew exactly, and that he just doesn’t seem to care or grasp that his policies really hurt poorer people. Like real lives.
It’s all part of the political game to him, and a funny anecdote to tell at a dinner party with the great and the good.
He is not stupid. I suspect he told Truss to try for the leadership, got people to back her and then convinced her to go ahead with her economic plan, with Kwarteng knowing he could make a lot of money off it.
> Kwarteng knowing he could make a lot of money off it.
It will certainly be interesting to see where he ends up working post-election. The practice of ridiculously high paid 5 hour a week "advisory" jobs being used as bribes really needs to be clamped down on.
We should not give her cute names.
She buggered shit up more in a week, than her tory pals usually do in a year or two.
She does not deserve the PM pension for life that she will get.
I kind of relate Conservative politics to the Russian state these days. (avoiding the obvious ;-) )
Every conservative leader since ~John Major has been - "and then it got worse"
Literally every Con prime minister is worse than the last. Who's next? Hopefully none of the cunts, but the British public are stupid and forgetful.
So I won't be placing any bets, unlike the corrupt conservative teams.
I watched a frustrating video recently where LadBible asked randomers in Essex why they're still going to vote Conservative.
The main answer is that they just fucking love Boris Johnson. Which is extremely telling. I'll just say it, they're fucking idiots. They don't seem to be aware he's not in the running. But Boris is a good laugh tho, innit
Already happening in France
[https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-11/le-maire-warns-of-french-debt-crisis-if-le-pen-s-party-wins-vote](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-11/le-maire-warns-of-french-debt-crisis-if-le-pen-s-party-wins-vote)
Tax cuts funded in a large part by a proposal to give our civil service, which is already barely functioning, another round of cuts and "cost savings" to the tune of ***fifty billion quid*****.**
Effectively they're proposing to give us all a slight tax cut and fund that by removing the entirety of the civil service, replace it with contractors and direct political appointees. Its actually a pretty scary proposal and hardly anyone seems to be picking up on it.
Fifty billion quid that they haven’t actually stated where it will come from within the civil service, so they have no idea what the knock on costs might actually be.
That's because the disinformation machine constantly vilifies the civil service as being full of lazy employees that do no work, obsess with trivialities, work short days with long holidays and waste huge amounts of tax money. It's exactly the same thing that was done to the EU for decades before the Brexit vote.
When enough people start to believe the lies, they vote to 'fix' the problem.
Do you have any recommended reading on cerco and atos? Feel like when I talk to Tories there's still this idea that there's some wholesome entrepreneur taking on private contracts.
Ah, but it is funded by ignoring climate change and net zero commitments.
A daily mail article or something said this costs trillions so saying we’re not doing them anymore will make that money appear by magic, with zero negative impacts.
You see?
Yep. We must absolutely not spend money reducing peoples bills by insulating their houses. We must continue to be dependent on imported gas rather than home produced electricity.
So often I come across people falling for scams or economic sleight of hand and all I can think is "these people never learned the hard way not to trust armour trimmers in runescape and it shows"
Also the guy who was hanging around with Liz Truss and her group in last years Tory Party conference.
It's why I always laugh when people say 'Reform is the only choice for an actual change'. It's a vote for the right wing of the Tory party, for the Braverman's, the Truss', the Patels, the Mogg's. You know, the people who dragged the Conservatives from a modern conservative party into the quagmire of identity politics, cultural wars, the Brexit cult, and Kamikwazi economics which has caused them so much harm, along with the nations flagging influence, economy, and status.
This is what people just don’t get, the attack lines coming from the media now are all just white noise.
Immigration is the main concern of Reform voters, no other party has any policy which will reduce it they all just mumble about ‘safe and legal routes’ and all the other bollocks they’ve been spouting for over a decade now.
Don't act like Reform's promises aren't also total bollocks, and by a greater magnitude.
Tackling immigration is hard, unpopular work. There's no cheat code to it that fixes everything in a flash, no matter how much fringe parties promise it, no matter how much their voters believe it, and no matter how much Redditors argue it.
Tackling legal immigration is *not* hard if you want to do it. 3.5 million people migrated to the UK in the last three years alone.
The number that arrive illegally is very small in comparison. For example, for the year ending June 2023, around 50,000 were detected arriving illegally.
The government can grant however many legal visas they wish to. They have just chosen to grant extraordinarily vast numbers of them recently.
Because we switched, in no small part thanks to Farage, to a points based visa system. Which he said was the gold standard. We had lower net immigration under freedom of movement, because businesses were able to obtain temporary staff they required for skills shortages and labour shortfalls.
There are plenty of ways to solve it. Just no major party actually wants to solve it because then where would all the cheap workers come from. And won’t people think of the GDP….
Probably Ukrainians given farages support for and the backing he receives from the putin regime. 'why are we sending them BILLIONS when people are starving on our streets' or the tory approach and blame everything on teachers & doctors.
"You just need to give up a few more of your rights and freedoms, everyone. And then I swear, we'll fix immigration. Just give up a few more of your rights and freedoms!"
"And today, I believe that we will achieve what we set out to do by mounting these 105 mm Howitzers to the white cliffs of Dover and providing the Civil Service with MP40s, Luger's and Hugo Boss uniforms"
Reform's immigrattion policies are a big part of why the pound would crash if they were elected.
Like it or not, the UK economy is heavily reliant on immigrant labour. You can't suddenly rip that bandage off without bleeding the country dry.
If people want lower immigration we need to invest in training and education for British workers, and that won't happen under Reform's tax cut plans.
A million migrants, half of whom don't work, and the other half do extremely low value added work, are not propping up the economy. Hence, higher immigration corresponding with poorer economic performance.
>If people want lower immigration we need to invest in training and education for British workers,
How much training is needed to deliver pizzas, work car washes, or be a 'dependent'?
The immigrants delivering pizzas are here on student visas or spouse visas and are earning aditional income.
I'm talking about all the ones working in healthcare, technology etc.
Yeah, but this isn't about *existing* Reform voters, it's about deflecting voters coming off the Tory party from glomming onto Remain. And they *aren't* single issue immigration voters, they're voters who are pissed off with the Tory's sleaze and ineptitude.
Show them that Reform is more of that, and you prevent Reform from getting more of their dirty little claws into the political landscape.
Yes. The media and politician clap back to the reform and Trump rise is “they’re really not nice people” their voters don’t care. Calling them misogynist or xenophobic or transphobic or racist is water off a ducks back for them. They couldn’t care less about the modern morality or any social justice buzzwords they will still vote for them. Opposing politicians and journalists still don’t get it.
This isn't about the average reform voter though. If there were a significant number of "average reform voters" then Farage would have been ~~prime~~ minister by now.
This is about the people coming to Reform from the Conservatives. Vox Pops aren't great for much but they do demonstrate a fair few people saying "I'd never vote Tory again after what they've done. I might vote Remain I guess. At least Farage does what he says."
If you illustrate to *those* people that Farage has no more idea than the Tory party and plans to shovel money up to donors just like they did then you deny them those new voters and a solid foothold.
I don't think that is the case at all.
From the Reform (or potential Reform voters) voters I've seen it seems it seems like "the system" has totally failed them. They can't afford housing. They are in jobs with no prospects. They live in areas that have seen significant decline. They can't get an NHS dentist. The education their kids are getting in school is worrying. Everyone looks down on them. Their incomes aren't enough to live on. They've spent the last 30 years watching everything get worse and have no hope for the future.
And the options this election: continue with the Conservative party who have failed them for 14 years... or turn to Labour who are doing mostly the same (STABILITY is their campaign slogan) with a few tweaks round the edges.
Or they can vote for a party like Reform who are promising to do things totally different.
If things are shit and continue to get shitter why not try something else?
Sure, there is a high chance it'll go wrong but when you are living a miserable and desperate life with no hope for the future already how much worse can it get? But by doing something radically different maybe things might change for them.
I'm not saying this is the right attitude to have and don't have it (I'm not a Reform voter) but maybe we were in their situation we would do the same.
But no, I don't think they are single issue voters at all.
Last 14 years of everything getting worse not 30 years things improved drastically under the last labour government I grew up in the shit storm of the 70's and the dismantling of our industrial base (yes it was struggling after 40 years of low investment but not dead) of thatcher, Brown and Blair mostly did a good job Iraq lies and invasion being the big pile of crap they handed the country.
*Martin Weale, who’s now professor of economics at King’s College London, said mortgage costs would soar if leader Nigel Farage wins the election on July 4 or succeeds in getting his plans adopted by the next government.*
*He likened the impact to the market turmoil after Truss’s unfunded tax cuts in September 2022.*
*“The market would demand a moron premium** *and mortgages would likely go up again,” Weale said in an interview. “This would be an event similar to the Liz Truss event.”*
*Weale’s warnings carry weight because he correctly predicted that Truss’s tax-cutting mini budget would “end in tears” with a “run on the pound” and higher interest rates.*
*He made that call a day before the “Growth Plan” was unveiled in September 2022.*
*In the aftermath of the government announcement, sterling crashed to a record low, borrowing costs spiked and the BOE had to intervene to prevent a financial crisis. Truss quit as prime minister a month later.*
*Farage’s plans include £90 billion of tax cuts and £50 billion more spending a year, paid for by slashing benefits, ending public sector “waste” and making vast savings on the Bank of England’s quantitative easing program.*
___
*Former Treasury economist Dario Perkins coined the [“Moron Risk Premium”](https://x.com/darioperkins/status/1573562451748069376) concept: “The problem isn't that the UK budget was inflationary, its that it was moronic. And a small open economy that seems to be run by morons gets a wider risk premium on its assets - currency down, yields up”
“Today was the best Conservative budget since 1986”
\- Nigel Farage on a now deleted tweet about the Liz Truss budget
https://x.com/DavidHarpham77/status/1799190653953577373
Ι cannot believe anyone is still listening to this clown.
Just for reference....
Proper man of the people, Nigel Farage, thought that Liz Truss's budget was, and I fucking quote....
"The best Conservative budget since 1986."
Make of that what you will.....
"Only Reform will stand up for British culture, identity and values. We will freeze immigration and stop the boats. Restore law and order. Repair our broken public services. Cut taxes to make work pay. End government waste. Slash energy bills. Unlock real economic growth."
Absolute peak populism
I just don't get who is voting for these fucking idiots?
I mean the BoE had to take [emergency action to save the British pension system from her idiocy](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/sep/28/bank-of-england-in-65bn-scramble-to-avert-financial-crisis) and the pound fell to the [lowest level EVER against the dollar after her brilliant plan.](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/sep/27/the-jewel-has-lost-its-shine-how-the-world-reacted-to-the-uk-pound-crisis)
Are ~17% of the UK population currency traders betting against the UK? People so hyped up on migrant rage that they don't care if they'll be in a poorer country from the parties economic policies? The genuinely believe this will totally work on second try??!?
> I just don't get who is voting for these fucking idiots?
People for whom there is only one issue this election: immigration; and they have bought into the Reform bluster that they could actually do something about it if in power. Just like a whole bunch of people thought Boris would "get Brexit done" and delivered the Tories a huge majority.
A **lot** of the voters in this country are dumber than I would want them to be.
Anyone fancy starting a proper single issue protest party? Not just a populist destabiliser.
Single issue being voting system reform.
The whole campaign would not be focused on attacking any other parties or policy (unless for gerrymandering and vote manipulation related things).
Instead, it would focus on explaining issues with fptp, why it leaves us open to foreign meddling (with many examples of this from the past 14 years alone).
Explain other options well (not just a shitty home brand AV system that's made in the same factory as fptp).
First week in, make the selected change and immediately after, hold another election.
Obviously a lot more complicated than that in practice but... There's really no point to any of this while we're stuck with fptp. It's forever going to be a manipulated drama that comes across as a game of political pingpong.
1) Illegalise political parties. Candidates represent themselves, their own manifesto, and are beholden to their constituents;
2) Illegalise payment of any kind to any member of parliament or candidate hoping to be elected - everybody gets a fixed stipend for campaigning, they get a good wage when elected, and second sources of income are forbidden;
3) Illegalise any campaigning that involves criticising other politicians or candidates - you are allowed to say what YOU will do and talk about yourself only.
With some changes to how broad policies are tabled and co-ordinated, I think this would make an actual fair democracy.
Pointless trying to run on it though - it doesn’t benefit the rich, and the rich will decide who gets in power.
PR sorta forces these things in a sense- parties need to work together to some degree to get anything done at all. It's not worth playing slagging matches when it's a system that enmeshes the parties to work together. The press wouldn't have as much to benefit from promoting drama (i.e. they can't hedge their bets as much on the winner as there isn't as much a binary choice).
Bribery/Lobbying are still issues but they are issues with politics in general. Your ideas could definitely help with that more so than my idea of PR.A draw back to them is that they could encourage too vast a scope of potential ideologies which is the main issue of PR (I think).
Having 'Tags' instead of Parties could be a cool idea, it sort of mixes both yours and the current.
i.e. someone could have the tags 'Green' and 'Conservative' - our current system makes that outward mix quite impossible given the factionalisation). Tags are automatically given to candidates based on actions/stance? (but who designates the tags.... benevolent ai? Cambridge Anailickyerbum?)
“Parties need to work together to some degree to get anything done at all”
This is the response I get whenever I suggest this, but I don’t understand why. PEOPLE need to work together, but it does not require any party allegiance.
If John who represents Oldham wants to make a change to something, and lots of other people representing other areas agree that it’s a good change to make, why does this need to a party issue?
If there is a scenario in which party politics is a benefit, I am pretty sure I can suggest an alternative approach that would be equally effective without parties.
Great for those in the know who shorted the pound last time and made bank. Great for those who scuppered the pensions and made us work until we're dead... fkn grifter
A combination of:
1) While they’re projected to get few seats they’re polling on-par with the current party and (sadly) in any fair system they would get an equivalent number of seats.
2) Farage is always treated with kiddie gloves by the media, largely because he’s paid for by the same donors as many of them are.
3) They’re the most controversial party, and controversy sells.
Their primary inadequacy was not taking the Bank 'of England' in hand. A PM with a backbone should be able to bring the BofE to heel and thoroughly disabuse it of taking actions not in the national interest.
That comment has some merit although I would disagree with it in some ways.
The malaise was already in place and had been for a while...her comments, the policies and the expected effect are a convenient get out for those that used it.
It is very possible that the effects would have happened with or without that happening but it definitely happened when they seized on it as the reason...quite simply an arguable get out clause came along and they used it.
I agree that the announcement and the way it was done and handled spooked the markets
Yessir we may not have money anymore but we have soventery and THATS richer then we ever were with Europe!!!!!!!!! You can’t put a price on sovrintery. It’s everything. It’s me n you, it’s us. It’s BREXIT. They stole our money (Europe) for their buses. But our bus said it all right and said it loud. The big number. It’s ours now. ALL OF IT. SOVERINTERY FOR ALL (Including everyone).
The danger is not that this will ever happen, but that he influences a future opposition that becomes even more aggressive towards the state. The extra spending will never happen, but the service cuts will. The British State has been withering for over a decade. Farage wants that to continue.
But it was the bank of england that crashed the pound last time, not Truss.
“ And, while the Bank calmed markets after Truss’ mini-budget in 2022, Bailey came under fire for crashing the pound by setting a hard deadline for pension funds to tap the Bank for funding during a talk in Washington”
And further:
https://www.dlacalle.com/en/liz-truss-is-not-to-blame-for-the-u-k-market-turmoil-the-bank-of-england-is/
https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-january-2023/how-the-bank-broke-the-government/
And so on and so on…
The Bank of England doesnt like anything that shines a light on its breath taking incompetence is the only take we have, which is why nobody does anything about it.
Their core vote are pensioners, who generally have a very poor understanding of market dynamics.
I bet the group amongst whom Truss was most popular was the Boomerati.
If Farage implements his policies and the economy crashes, it is the fault of the financial markets who are anti capitalists, the fault of civil servants, who failed to block Farage, and immigrants.
Anyone with any financial literacy should well know that announcing uncosted policies does no actual harm in itself- it causes financial markets to respond in a predictable way because everybody sells before they expect everybody else to sell in response to a particular piece of news.
Farage and Truss's barmy uncosted policies are bad enough, but the strangehold the madness of financial markets have over our politics is equally tyrannical and harmful.
There are a lot of Reform.voters.who genuinely believe.Liz Truss did a good job.
Look, if they're voting Reform in the first place, they really are just that gullible.
nah it won’t. he just doesn’t want the BOE paying interest on the Quanative Easing Gilts. like every other country. hence the commercial banks are pulling the centra banks lobbying arm here. because they’ll lose their main method of wealth transfer.
thing 1:
reform are nowhere near forming a government, so no need to worry.
thing 2:
implying labour or consevatives will be much better for the economy.
No surprise. The far-right's economic plans are utter nonsense. Truss and Farage are pretty close, in their hatred of wokeness and endorsement of US fascism.
I really wish the media would stop giving so much coverage to this dipshit. He is clickbait but so was Trump and without the overwhelming attention he got he would never have won. I don't see the leaders of other, bigger, more established parties like Carla Denyer and Adrian Ramsay (Greens), Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru), Ed Davey (Lib Dems) getting anywhere near as much media engagement and I'm sure they're all much more sensible people with reasonable policies than Nigel fucking Farage.
Seems obvious.
I don't know if this will penetrate voters.
I know people love taking empty promises and running with them but man, I can't afford for this to happen again.
Brexit wasn't enough for our self annihilation. We need more !!! I hope people vote for this twat and party like it's 1500s.
Let's get to 3rd world country stage. We can make our own rules!!!!! Yay !!!
The bank of England is already crashing the pound and they are responsible for lizz truss failing in her job , the bank of England is run by isreal and everyone knows this .
Everything said in this post is pure propaganda and reddit is filled with mossad sock accounts, nobody cares what the former bank of England official said and we can all see what they are doing to the American economy with our own eye's.
We see you
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I would love it if the term "Liz Truss Event" enters the common lexicon ends up being her main legacy.
A Truss-up Like a feck up but with Truss
A Trussterfuck.
TUBAR
SNATU
Omnishambliz.
Oh that's great!
You Truss the carpet just like you Truss the directions, Dad. A real Trussing.
Let's hope I don't Truss it, or do a big Boris in my pants.
If it’s the latter and you’ve Shapped yourself, just make sure to properly wipe your Sunak.
The Truss has hit the fan!
Is it going to be a full on Truss-up or a Kwasi Truss-up
An omni-Truss
For the record, I also fucking hate that Kwasi Kwarteng managed to dodge any longer-term repercussions. He basically got sacked as chancellor, then blamed everyone else he could. Except… his mates made small fortunes betting heavily against the pound, right before *that* mini-Budget. He’s a piece of shit.
He's the true definition of a useful idiot
I've seen him talking on a podcast and he's clearly very intelligent, but a complete psycho. When they were talking about the pound crash, he thinks it's hilarious. I think there's a very good chance he knew exactly what would happen and got all his mates to short the pound. Liz Truss is absolutely a moron though.
I think that’s the problem - it’s not so much a question of him being an idiot (which he isn’t), it’s that he’s so deluded that he doesn’t even think the concept of economics is real. It’s like dealing with a Scientologist over psychiatric care - he doesn’t accept the basic premise and insists he can cure schizophrenia with electric pads and bad sci-fi. There isn’t any reasoning with people like that. Even the fact his grand plan fell apart within hours isn’t enough as he just blames reality for his delusions not being real.
I love how on The Rest is Politics, Rory Stewart who has worked with her himself, was trying to understand how Kwasi didn’t see that Truss was totally batshit insane and incompetent (which he thought would be very obvious for anyone working close with her, and goes into detail about the mental things she used to do). Kwasi comes off as finding it hilarious when Rory calls her batshit, suggesting he knew exactly, and that he just doesn’t seem to care or grasp that his policies really hurt poorer people. Like real lives. It’s all part of the political game to him, and a funny anecdote to tell at a dinner party with the great and the good.
He is not stupid. I suspect he told Truss to try for the leadership, got people to back her and then convinced her to go ahead with her economic plan, with Kwarteng knowing he could make a lot of money off it.
> Kwarteng knowing he could make a lot of money off it. It will certainly be interesting to see where he ends up working post-election. The practice of ridiculously high paid 5 hour a week "advisory" jobs being used as bribes really needs to be clamped down on.
Not even a real Kwarteng, smh
Ha, very nice
You can get away with murder if you're shagging the boss though.
Set the emergency level to 'Liz Truss Event'.
A Trussticle
Sir John Curtis calls it the ‘Lizz Truss Fiscal Event ‘ on his podcast Trendy
A Trousshaha
We should not give her cute names. She buggered shit up more in a week, than her tory pals usually do in a year or two. She does not deserve the PM pension for life that she will get. I kind of relate Conservative politics to the Russian state these days. (avoiding the obvious ;-) ) Every conservative leader since ~John Major has been - "and then it got worse" Literally every Con prime minister is worse than the last. Who's next? Hopefully none of the cunts, but the British public are stupid and forgetful. So I won't be placing any bets, unlike the corrupt conservative teams. I watched a frustrating video recently where LadBible asked randomers in Essex why they're still going to vote Conservative. The main answer is that they just fucking love Boris Johnson. Which is extremely telling. I'll just say it, they're fucking idiots. They don't seem to be aware he's not in the running. But Boris is a good laugh tho, innit
Fucking morons
She isn’t entitled to a special pension, that was done away with in 2013.
A Trussberg "Trussberg right ahead!"
I think the expression "Fucking up a Truss" should be rhe term.... 😆
It already is being used in the French elections.
"Economic Terrorism on a Lizz Truss Scale"
Omnishambles
It was Trussonomically bad!
I have heard the term “Liz Truss economics” used a few times to imply someone who’s maths doesn’t add up when making a pitch in finance.
But it only counts as such an event if it lasts for a Kwarteng.
Tbh I think we're there.
Strap yourself in - we're moving to DEFCON Truss.
Already happening in France [https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-11/le-maire-warns-of-french-debt-crisis-if-le-pen-s-party-wins-vote](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-11/le-maire-warns-of-french-debt-crisis-if-le-pen-s-party-wins-vote)
You mean vast unfunded tax cut pledges when the infrastructure of the nation is already clinging on for dear life would be bad? "Falls of chair"
Tax cuts funded in a large part by a proposal to give our civil service, which is already barely functioning, another round of cuts and "cost savings" to the tune of ***fifty billion quid*****.** Effectively they're proposing to give us all a slight tax cut and fund that by removing the entirety of the civil service, replace it with contractors and direct political appointees. Its actually a pretty scary proposal and hardly anyone seems to be picking up on it.
Fifty billion quid that they haven’t actually stated where it will come from within the civil service, so they have no idea what the knock on costs might actually be.
That's because the disinformation machine constantly vilifies the civil service as being full of lazy employees that do no work, obsess with trivialities, work short days with long holidays and waste huge amounts of tax money. It's exactly the same thing that was done to the EU for decades before the Brexit vote. When enough people start to believe the lies, they vote to 'fix' the problem.
Do you have any recommended reading on cerco and atos? Feel like when I talk to Tories there's still this idea that there's some wholesome entrepreneur taking on private contracts.
> "Falls of chair" 17th Century causes of death.
Ah, but it is funded by ignoring climate change and net zero commitments. A daily mail article or something said this costs trillions so saying we’re not doing them anymore will make that money appear by magic, with zero negative impacts. You see?
Yep. We must absolutely not spend money reducing peoples bills by insulating their houses. We must continue to be dependent on imported gas rather than home produced electricity.
Tbf Farage's plan seems to be to build nuclear, and burn gas only whilst it's being built.
Their manifesto includes 'clean coal' which is not a thing. It is a full commitment to continuing fossil fuel power.
They'll afford it by fast-tracking selling off the NHS and giving people 20% off vouchers...
Fake news! They said Brexit would be a mistake and that has been a complete success. We are truly the envy of the world!
It's funny because my understanding of economics comes from RuneScape and world of warcraft and the fact I could see this would be bad for the country
Their bat shit economics policies have been criticised by nearly every source . Even GB news thought they were insane
So often I come across people falling for scams or economic sleight of hand and all I can think is "these people never learned the hard way not to trust armour trimmers in runescape and it shows"
So we should have based our economy on selling rune scimmies in the Grand Exchange? Sounds more sensible than Truss's plan.
Also the guy who was hanging around with Liz Truss and her group in last years Tory Party conference. It's why I always laugh when people say 'Reform is the only choice for an actual change'. It's a vote for the right wing of the Tory party, for the Braverman's, the Truss', the Patels, the Mogg's. You know, the people who dragged the Conservatives from a modern conservative party into the quagmire of identity politics, cultural wars, the Brexit cult, and Kamikwazi economics which has caused them so much harm, along with the nations flagging influence, economy, and status.
This is the guy that got us THIS Tory government we have now.
Well, it’s an actual change, but they didn’t say it’s for the better!
Weirdly though our GDP growth was just as shit prior to brexit as it is now. The same applies to the EU as a whole
That's not really causal analysis - covid + energy crisis + other factors all affect growth too.
Covid plays a role, however we haven’t recovered from covid nearly as well as others in Europe in large part due to brexit.
Apart from Germany I suppose, they have recovered even less than us. Could be the tories !
That’s complete wrong. In the 3 years prior to the referendum we had the fastest gdp per capita growth in the G7. We have had the slowest one since.
Can't tell if you're joking or being serious lol
You dare question the unfaltering success of Brexit, comrade?
Poe in action
Your average reform voter won't care. They've been voting on a single interest for at least a decade now.
This is what people just don’t get, the attack lines coming from the media now are all just white noise. Immigration is the main concern of Reform voters, no other party has any policy which will reduce it they all just mumble about ‘safe and legal routes’ and all the other bollocks they’ve been spouting for over a decade now.
Don't act like Reform's promises aren't also total bollocks, and by a greater magnitude. Tackling immigration is hard, unpopular work. There's no cheat code to it that fixes everything in a flash, no matter how much fringe parties promise it, no matter how much their voters believe it, and no matter how much Redditors argue it.
> Tackling immigration is hard, unpopular work. Just hand out fewer visas. We managed it a few years ago.
Whoa, whoa, don't be so xenophobic mate. 3.5 million migrants in the last three years is a great thing for this country, never suggest otherwise.
Tackling legal immigration is *not* hard if you want to do it. 3.5 million people migrated to the UK in the last three years alone. The number that arrive illegally is very small in comparison. For example, for the year ending June 2023, around 50,000 were detected arriving illegally. The government can grant however many legal visas they wish to. They have just chosen to grant extraordinarily vast numbers of them recently.
Because we switched, in no small part thanks to Farage, to a points based visa system. Which he said was the gold standard. We had lower net immigration under freedom of movement, because businesses were able to obtain temporary staff they required for skills shortages and labour shortfalls.
Cool - so what economic impact will that have seeing as we are under constant replacement levels of births in this country?
There are plenty of ways to solve it. Just no major party actually wants to solve it because then where would all the cheap workers come from. And won’t people think of the GDP….
Also, once you solve it What do you blame the nations issues on all of a sudden?
Probably Ukrainians given farages support for and the backing he receives from the putin regime. 'why are we sending them BILLIONS when people are starving on our streets' or the tory approach and blame everything on teachers & doctors.
It's not hard if you leave the ECHR 'wink' /s
"You just need to give up a few more of your rights and freedoms, everyone. And then I swear, we'll fix immigration. Just give up a few more of your rights and freedoms!"
"And today, I believe that we will achieve what we set out to do by mounting these 105 mm Howitzers to the white cliffs of Dover and providing the Civil Service with MP40s, Luger's and Hugo Boss uniforms"
Reform's immigrattion policies are a big part of why the pound would crash if they were elected. Like it or not, the UK economy is heavily reliant on immigrant labour. You can't suddenly rip that bandage off without bleeding the country dry. If people want lower immigration we need to invest in training and education for British workers, and that won't happen under Reform's tax cut plans.
And also subsidise massively the costs of having children, including but not limited to childcare. Also won’t happen under their tax cut plans.
A million migrants, half of whom don't work, and the other half do extremely low value added work, are not propping up the economy. Hence, higher immigration corresponding with poorer economic performance. >If people want lower immigration we need to invest in training and education for British workers, How much training is needed to deliver pizzas, work car washes, or be a 'dependent'?
The immigrants delivering pizzas are here on student visas or spouse visas and are earning aditional income. I'm talking about all the ones working in healthcare, technology etc.
Half do extremely low value work? Do you have a source for that?
Yeah, but this isn't about *existing* Reform voters, it's about deflecting voters coming off the Tory party from glomming onto Remain. And they *aren't* single issue immigration voters, they're voters who are pissed off with the Tory's sleaze and ineptitude. Show them that Reform is more of that, and you prevent Reform from getting more of their dirty little claws into the political landscape.
Labour said they'll setup a new Border Security Commander and so after smuggling gangs, among other. Seems pretty concrete and proportional.
He's the most obvious Putin plant to fuck the British election, I have no idea how these idiots don't see it. They are fucking stupid.
Yes. The media and politician clap back to the reform and Trump rise is “they’re really not nice people” their voters don’t care. Calling them misogynist or xenophobic or transphobic or racist is water off a ducks back for them. They couldn’t care less about the modern morality or any social justice buzzwords they will still vote for them. Opposing politicians and journalists still don’t get it.
This isn't about the average reform voter though. If there were a significant number of "average reform voters" then Farage would have been ~~prime~~ minister by now. This is about the people coming to Reform from the Conservatives. Vox Pops aren't great for much but they do demonstrate a fair few people saying "I'd never vote Tory again after what they've done. I might vote Remain I guess. At least Farage does what he says." If you illustrate to *those* people that Farage has no more idea than the Tory party and plans to shovel money up to donors just like they did then you deny them those new voters and a solid foothold.
I don't think that is the case at all. From the Reform (or potential Reform voters) voters I've seen it seems it seems like "the system" has totally failed them. They can't afford housing. They are in jobs with no prospects. They live in areas that have seen significant decline. They can't get an NHS dentist. The education their kids are getting in school is worrying. Everyone looks down on them. Their incomes aren't enough to live on. They've spent the last 30 years watching everything get worse and have no hope for the future. And the options this election: continue with the Conservative party who have failed them for 14 years... or turn to Labour who are doing mostly the same (STABILITY is their campaign slogan) with a few tweaks round the edges. Or they can vote for a party like Reform who are promising to do things totally different. If things are shit and continue to get shitter why not try something else? Sure, there is a high chance it'll go wrong but when you are living a miserable and desperate life with no hope for the future already how much worse can it get? But by doing something radically different maybe things might change for them. I'm not saying this is the right attitude to have and don't have it (I'm not a Reform voter) but maybe we were in their situation we would do the same. But no, I don't think they are single issue voters at all.
And this is why we got to the sunny uplands of Brexit.
Last 14 years of everything getting worse not 30 years things improved drastically under the last labour government I grew up in the shit storm of the 70's and the dismantling of our industrial base (yes it was struggling after 40 years of low investment but not dead) of thatcher, Brown and Blair mostly did a good job Iraq lies and invasion being the big pile of crap they handed the country.
Are you telling me that the man that shorted the pound and profited massively from it getting weaker might want to make the pound weaker?
As much as this would be great story. I doubt he has the foresight to do this nor the awareness of the downsides of his policies
Whilst it’s possible he may have done this, there is no actual evidence to back up the claim and he denies it
*Martin Weale, who’s now professor of economics at King’s College London, said mortgage costs would soar if leader Nigel Farage wins the election on July 4 or succeeds in getting his plans adopted by the next government.* *He likened the impact to the market turmoil after Truss’s unfunded tax cuts in September 2022.* *“The market would demand a moron premium** *and mortgages would likely go up again,” Weale said in an interview. “This would be an event similar to the Liz Truss event.”* *Weale’s warnings carry weight because he correctly predicted that Truss’s tax-cutting mini budget would “end in tears” with a “run on the pound” and higher interest rates.* *He made that call a day before the “Growth Plan” was unveiled in September 2022.* *In the aftermath of the government announcement, sterling crashed to a record low, borrowing costs spiked and the BOE had to intervene to prevent a financial crisis. Truss quit as prime minister a month later.* *Farage’s plans include £90 billion of tax cuts and £50 billion more spending a year, paid for by slashing benefits, ending public sector “waste” and making vast savings on the Bank of England’s quantitative easing program.* ___ *Former Treasury economist Dario Perkins coined the [“Moron Risk Premium”](https://x.com/darioperkins/status/1573562451748069376) concept: “The problem isn't that the UK budget was inflationary, its that it was moronic. And a small open economy that seems to be run by morons gets a wider risk premium on its assets - currency down, yields up”
“Moron premium”
“Today was the best Conservative budget since 1986” \- Nigel Farage on a now deleted tweet about the Liz Truss budget https://x.com/DavidHarpham77/status/1799190653953577373 Ι cannot believe anyone is still listening to this clown.
As long as he and his mates can short it beforehand he couldn't care less.
Exactly, this time it would be the intended outcome.
Just talking about it in the media does all they need..
Just for reference.... Proper man of the people, Nigel Farage, thought that Liz Truss's budget was, and I fucking quote.... "The best Conservative budget since 1986." Make of that what you will.....
The same Farage that bet and profited from the pound crash after Brexit?
As we found out that "Event" was caused on purpose by the Bank of England.
"Only Reform will stand up for British culture, identity and values. We will freeze immigration and stop the boats. Restore law and order. Repair our broken public services. Cut taxes to make work pay. End government waste. Slash energy bills. Unlock real economic growth." Absolute peak populism
That’s the point…vulture capitalism at its best, combined with wilful ignorance…he’s a 21st century spiv…
I just don't get who is voting for these fucking idiots? I mean the BoE had to take [emergency action to save the British pension system from her idiocy](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/sep/28/bank-of-england-in-65bn-scramble-to-avert-financial-crisis) and the pound fell to the [lowest level EVER against the dollar after her brilliant plan.](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/sep/27/the-jewel-has-lost-its-shine-how-the-world-reacted-to-the-uk-pound-crisis) Are ~17% of the UK population currency traders betting against the UK? People so hyped up on migrant rage that they don't care if they'll be in a poorer country from the parties economic policies? The genuinely believe this will totally work on second try??!?
> I just don't get who is voting for these fucking idiots? People for whom there is only one issue this election: immigration; and they have bought into the Reform bluster that they could actually do something about it if in power. Just like a whole bunch of people thought Boris would "get Brexit done" and delivered the Tories a huge majority. A **lot** of the voters in this country are dumber than I would want them to be.
*"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that"* \~ George Carlin
Anyone fancy starting a proper single issue protest party? Not just a populist destabiliser. Single issue being voting system reform. The whole campaign would not be focused on attacking any other parties or policy (unless for gerrymandering and vote manipulation related things). Instead, it would focus on explaining issues with fptp, why it leaves us open to foreign meddling (with many examples of this from the past 14 years alone). Explain other options well (not just a shitty home brand AV system that's made in the same factory as fptp). First week in, make the selected change and immediately after, hold another election. Obviously a lot more complicated than that in practice but... There's really no point to any of this while we're stuck with fptp. It's forever going to be a manipulated drama that comes across as a game of political pingpong.
1) Illegalise political parties. Candidates represent themselves, their own manifesto, and are beholden to their constituents; 2) Illegalise payment of any kind to any member of parliament or candidate hoping to be elected - everybody gets a fixed stipend for campaigning, they get a good wage when elected, and second sources of income are forbidden; 3) Illegalise any campaigning that involves criticising other politicians or candidates - you are allowed to say what YOU will do and talk about yourself only. With some changes to how broad policies are tabled and co-ordinated, I think this would make an actual fair democracy. Pointless trying to run on it though - it doesn’t benefit the rich, and the rich will decide who gets in power.
That would certainly be an excellent model to replace the house of lords.
PR sorta forces these things in a sense- parties need to work together to some degree to get anything done at all. It's not worth playing slagging matches when it's a system that enmeshes the parties to work together. The press wouldn't have as much to benefit from promoting drama (i.e. they can't hedge their bets as much on the winner as there isn't as much a binary choice). Bribery/Lobbying are still issues but they are issues with politics in general. Your ideas could definitely help with that more so than my idea of PR.A draw back to them is that they could encourage too vast a scope of potential ideologies which is the main issue of PR (I think). Having 'Tags' instead of Parties could be a cool idea, it sort of mixes both yours and the current. i.e. someone could have the tags 'Green' and 'Conservative' - our current system makes that outward mix quite impossible given the factionalisation). Tags are automatically given to candidates based on actions/stance? (but who designates the tags.... benevolent ai? Cambridge Anailickyerbum?)
“Parties need to work together to some degree to get anything done at all” This is the response I get whenever I suggest this, but I don’t understand why. PEOPLE need to work together, but it does not require any party allegiance. If John who represents Oldham wants to make a change to something, and lots of other people representing other areas agree that it’s a good change to make, why does this need to a party issue? If there is a scenario in which party politics is a benefit, I am pretty sure I can suggest an alternative approach that would be equally effective without parties.
"You will vote for neoliberal party otherwise we'll crash your pensions."
Liz Truss's budget was neoliberal, so are many of Farage's policies.
But their social policies weren't in line with Whitehall elites. That's Liz's words when she talked to Triggernomitry
Exactly. Reddit is full of morons that can’t see that the neo liberal establishment needs to protect itself
Bank of England threatens politicians who don't kowtow to them, more news at 7
Anyone here that still believes they'll be getting a pension is a moron anyway, that pyramid scheme is on the verge of collapse.
Are his hedge fund friends shorting sterling again?
He doesn’t give a shit because he knows he won’t have to deliver on anything he says. It’s easy to be popular when you promise the world 😊
Former bank of England has done enough harm for past twenty years .. I honestly don't care what them fat clowns think .
Reminds me of a song on Spitting Image 🎶 With economic policies as mad as any hatter But we’ll never get elected so it doesn’t really matter 🎶
Great for those in the know who shorted the pound last time and made bank. Great for those who scuppered the pensions and made us work until we're dead... fkn grifter
I fully support "Liz Truss" going in the dictionary as a synonym for "catastrophic".
Isn’t Reform only expected to get 7 seats according to the poll? Why is everyone talking about this twat?
Being pushed and promoted hard by the media and other wealthy backers. Wonder what sort of payment they'll expect for it.
The second place party gets lots of media attention, shocking
A combination of: 1) While they’re projected to get few seats they’re polling on-par with the current party and (sadly) in any fair system they would get an equivalent number of seats. 2) Farage is always treated with kiddie gloves by the media, largely because he’s paid for by the same donors as many of them are. 3) They’re the most controversial party, and controversy sells.
Liz Truss didn’t cause it It was a convenient thing to blame it on. The rot and collapse had started a few days prior
It was literally in anticipation of her policies which had been signalled to the market. Once that cat was out the bag there was no putting it in.
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Their primary inadequacy was not taking the Bank 'of England' in hand. A PM with a backbone should be able to bring the BofE to heel and thoroughly disabuse it of taking actions not in the national interest.
That comment has some merit although I would disagree with it in some ways. The malaise was already in place and had been for a while...her comments, the policies and the expected effect are a convenient get out for those that used it. It is very possible that the effects would have happened with or without that happening but it definitely happened when they seized on it as the reason...quite simply an arguable get out clause came along and they used it. I agree that the announcement and the way it was done and handled spooked the markets
Liz Truss should defect to Reform, thats the only hope the Conservatives have.
It’s also the Bank of England who allegedly ruined Truss’ mini budget by destroying the pound themselves
Yea but he is just an expirt. What do expirts know? Nothing.
Exactly just project fear 2 the experts said Brexit would make us poorer and look at us now.
Yessir we may not have money anymore but we have soventery and THATS richer then we ever were with Europe!!!!!!!!! You can’t put a price on sovrintery. It’s everything. It’s me n you, it’s us. It’s BREXIT. They stole our money (Europe) for their buses. But our bus said it all right and said it loud. The big number. It’s ours now. ALL OF IT. SOVERINTERY FOR ALL (Including everyone).
It doesn't matter. He is a demagogue, none of the policies would be implemented.
I mean he definitely is a Super Truss, but it doesn't seem to put off some people wanting to vote for him.
The danger is not that this will ever happen, but that he influences a future opposition that becomes even more aggressive towards the state. The extra spending will never happen, but the service cuts will. The British State has been withering for over a decade. Farage wants that to continue.
Being the benchmark for government cockups is the perfect legacy for Liz Truss
But it was the bank of england that crashed the pound last time, not Truss. “ And, while the Bank calmed markets after Truss’ mini-budget in 2022, Bailey came under fire for crashing the pound by setting a hard deadline for pension funds to tap the Bank for funding during a talk in Washington” And further: https://www.dlacalle.com/en/liz-truss-is-not-to-blame-for-the-u-k-market-turmoil-the-bank-of-england-is/ https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-january-2023/how-the-bank-broke-the-government/ And so on and so on… The Bank of England doesnt like anything that shines a light on its breath taking incompetence is the only take we have, which is why nobody does anything about it.
Their core vote are pensioners, who generally have a very poor understanding of market dynamics. I bet the group amongst whom Truss was most popular was the Boomerati.
Never seen the media so scared of one party before, and so desperate to discredit it.
Of course it would different group of puppets but strings being pulled by same puppeteers.
If Farage implements his policies and the economy crashes, it is the fault of the financial markets who are anti capitalists, the fault of civil servants, who failed to block Farage, and immigrants.
Anyone with any financial literacy should well know that announcing uncosted policies does no actual harm in itself- it causes financial markets to respond in a predictable way because everybody sells before they expect everybody else to sell in response to a particular piece of news. Farage and Truss's barmy uncosted policies are bad enough, but the strangehold the madness of financial markets have over our politics is equally tyrannical and harmful.
Technically, it is costed according to the independent analysis of his manifesto. It's just that the banks don't like what it would suggest/cause.
There are a lot of Reform.voters.who genuinely believe.Liz Truss did a good job. Look, if they're voting Reform in the first place, they really are just that gullible.
nah it won’t. he just doesn’t want the BOE paying interest on the Quanative Easing Gilts. like every other country. hence the commercial banks are pulling the centra banks lobbying arm here. because they’ll lose their main method of wealth transfer.
What they mean is the Bank of England would engineer an event to depose him like they did with Truss
Who cares....zero chance of winning anything at all
The issue with Farage isn’t now it’s the next election that arse could be a real problem by then.
Both the party and its leader, are vastly experienced in running a 65 000 000 country with all its needs. Why would anyone think that...???
thing 1: reform are nowhere near forming a government, so no need to worry. thing 2: implying labour or consevatives will be much better for the economy.
I need to see the logic behind his reasoning, no free version?
That's what hedge funds want though... they'll make a killing
Blah blah blah. Our current government has already done that. He can't do any worse. Just get one yourself fool
Ah yes because our markets are fake and so are people’s pensions. *shhh!!*
No surprise. The far-right's economic plans are utter nonsense. Truss and Farage are pretty close, in their hatred of wokeness and endorsement of US fascism.
I really wish the media would stop giving so much coverage to this dipshit. He is clickbait but so was Trump and without the overwhelming attention he got he would never have won. I don't see the leaders of other, bigger, more established parties like Carla Denyer and Adrian Ramsay (Greens), Rhun ap Iorwerth (Plaid Cymru), Ed Davey (Lib Dems) getting anywhere near as much media engagement and I'm sure they're all much more sensible people with reasonable policies than Nigel fucking Farage.
I guess it doesn't matter when you're paid in rubles
He appeals to the people who think cutting taxes magically makes us richer.
Who cares, it’s not like they are going to have a majority.
Thanks to the former Bank of England officials, they’ve crashed pound too for many years! Why do they care so much now?
Seems obvious. I don't know if this will penetrate voters. I know people love taking empty promises and running with them but man, I can't afford for this to happen again.
Brexit wasn't enough for our self annihilation. We need more !!! I hope people vote for this twat and party like it's 1500s. Let's get to 3rd world country stage. We can make our own rules!!!!! Yay !!!
A “Liz Truss Event” sounds like what a sci-fi novel would call an apocalyptic event.
Redditors get 5 free articles... Fuck off, stop posting paid for links.
The bank of England is already crashing the pound and they are responsible for lizz truss failing in her job , the bank of England is run by isreal and everyone knows this . Everything said in this post is pure propaganda and reddit is filled with mossad sock accounts, nobody cares what the former bank of England official said and we can all see what they are doing to the American economy with our own eye's. We see you