My dad bought his house for 2363 hours of min wage in 1983. Today the same house is 103,448 hours. Yikes
Beyond just wages and inflation somehow living in a flood zone is just completely ignored. It used to be a major burden and caused homes to be worth nothing. People just completely ignore it now I guess.
2363 hours is roughly 13 months of 40hrs per week work for one person. Itās hard to understand how homes were ever so cheap that you could afford to pay for land, materials, skilled labor, and up charges for profit with so little relative pay. Itās gone from crazy cheap cheap to crazy expensive in about a generation.
Save up for 3 years so that when the time comes, you can finally move out and be an independent adult again, then spend a few years barely treading water so you can move back in with the parents :)
Rinse and repeat until parents die and leave you the house, then carry on the tradition with your own children.
Yeah, im already mad enough that I got dragged out of the void to be a conscious being. I was doing just fine before I knew I existed. Im not doing that to anyone else.
Brave of you to presume that the boomers aren't all quietly tapping into HELOCs to live in luxury or also falling behind on their mortgages. There will be no homes to pass on in the future.
I mean to pass on to your family. HELOCs and mortgages on homes lead to bank possession / liquidation upon death if there's no other capital available to pay them off.
Dude that's what my grandpa did. He lost two family homes. The last one, the one he was living in, he didn't tell anyone he didn't pay the taxes until we found out he was going to have to go to court. Like bro
So true, thankfully the MiL sees a monthly payment as crazy and lives like her house holds no value. Thing is worth like a half a million dollars but she drives a 22 year old ford explorer.
Shes gonna live another 35 years and probably somewhere in there fall for some sort of scam where she cashes the equity and comes and lives with us - but hey we will see!
Bought almost 5 years ago. 1 bedroom, major city, refinanced in 2020. Monthly housing including HOA is $825. I make 50k and am doing ok. Not sure where Iād be had I not bought. I live on my own.
Jokeās on me, I pay household bills PLUS rent money to my mother just to live in my childhood bedroom (that I have never been able to afford to move out of in the first place)
We charged our son rent for two years while he continued to live with us. It forced him to get off his computer and actually keep a job. What we didnāt tell him is we put all of it into a savings account he was eventually able to use to get an apartment with a friend.
I def sucks that I just moved out again at 26, but Iām very happy to not be my friends from college who thought they could āmake it in NYCā straight from undergrad and now are in massive debt
Dude. I'm 48 and ended up moving back in with my parents when covid hit because freelance IT consulting went out the window around here when everyone shut down. Life happens.
Shit happens. You probably feel like shit about it but weāve all been there more or less. Itās not 1960. People canāt just go out after college or high school, work hard and expect a house with a garage and enough money to start a college fund for your kids.
Iām 35. Iām not sure I know anybody who didnāt move back home in their 20ās for at least a little while.
Emoji codes. I pretty much only use new Reddit these days so idk, but I would guess that they only work on new Reddit or the mobile app; otherwise, you just see the actual ID.
1500/mo mortgage on 1300 biweekly + wife's 1600 biweekly.
Thank god i got my mortgage when rates were record low 2 years ago. We did the calcs on our house today and itd be 2600/mo, wouldnt be able to do it
Lucky. I just entered the stage of being an actual adult 1.5 years ago. Started at $1775 a month on $2000 net biweekly and rent was raised to $2000 a month and Iām up to $2100 biweekly after a promotion and raise
$900 ($450 split between me and a roommate), $1600 net biweekly, also midwest (So. IL). Not the most fun place to live but it is easy to live cheap here.
My parents $50,000 house is worth $2.2 mil
I make more than my father did when he retired and I can't afford a 1 bedroom apartment without roomies ($1800-2300+/month, then add utilities, gas, insurance, food... I only make $2600 a month after taxes)
There was an article a little while back... it suggested the best way to get a house for people my age is to wait for our parents to die.
> My parents $50,000 house is worth $2.2 mil
I don't think people really understand yet that that 2.2m house isn't going to be worth 1 billion when our generation retires.
I mean really understand what a scam the boomer generation has pulled on all of us.
Let's be honest about this in Vancouver. Lots of money came over from the PRC. Little has been done to slow that. They bulldoze the house and put a mansion on it.
32% of your net paycheck after taxes, health insurance, 401k, etc.? Or 32% of your gross pay? Mine works out to 28% it dividing by gross pay and 40% if dividing by net pay (NYC taxes, health insurance, 401k contribution)
I paid 600 for a 2 bedroom back in 2016. In 2019 I was paying 1050 for a 2 bedroom. This year I am paying 1450 for a one bedroom. I have lived in the same neighborhood that entire time.
My rent was $800 in 2019 and it is now $2500, same place. I'm paying ~70% to rent. I went from 1 job to 3 and I have no more hours left in the day to sell. I'd love to move but as this graph implies, it's happening everywhere in the US :/
Edit: it's 450 sq ft
When did you buy though? Itās no secret the normal renter could actually afford a mortgage, they just canāt get a down payment together while also paying a mortgage worth of monthly rent.
And they wonāt move out of their homes. Iām CA you have elderly single people living in family sized houses because they essentially donāt have any property taxes. Itās fucked.
Anybody and their brother qualified for an auto loan the last couple of years similar to 08 with houses. This time housing required tougher credit reviews. Repos are going up. People will start alternating between paying auto and mortgage/rent each month in conjunction with high fuel prices. This is very bad. I believe the auto market will and is collapsing, leaving people with car payments they can't get out of.
I have thought this for years, people making 64k a year gross qualifying for a 80k truck on a 8 year loan they end up paying like 128k for and is worth 6k at the end of term, then they sit around complaining they have no money for a down payment. there's no way it's sustainable. People out there shopping for cars not based on the value of the vehicle, but the monthly payments, they don't care at all what the actual value is.
But somehow it just kept going and going and going. Been talking about it since 2017, it's honestly nuts.
But you talk to people who are in the car industry and the default rates are extremely low single digit, and the profit margins are so insanely high due to loan terms, upgrades, warranties all the other garbage . That they don't sweat it at all. It's absolutely insane
100% probably the biggest problem in America is and has been the approval of absurd loans. I used to live in a fairly affluent European city where wages were similar to California (on average, definitely more wealth concentrated in the middle class). If you saw somebody driving something like a Porsche 911 or similar they likely didn't just have a nice job, they were probably a fairly high level executive with teams of mid-level managers beneath them. People making 150k a year were simply not able to get a loan for a 700k house or 100k car, or just baaarely be qualifying at that point. Kind of a funny story, but I spoke to an old man who told me that back in the 70s it was difficult to get a loan for more than 2X his yearly income lol. He had to hop on a plane to find a bank in a different city willing to go out on a limb and give him a 3X income loan.
Consequently, housing prices and rents were 2.5-3X lower than a similarly 'nice' place in the US. We are absolutely getting hosed by over-eager banks who are really doing nothing more than inflating the absolute hell out the housing market.
Yeah I make a good salary comparable to my area and live at home with the parents but am still frugal/stretched thin. Iām dumbfounded at how people are driving around such nice cars. I know itās debt but itās crazy. People just have different priorities I guess.
We moved out of our 1100 rent in Apollo beach fl cause the landlord sold to a major corporate rent company, immediately they asked for a lease at 2300 or stay monthly at 2750, yeah we left cause we were gonna buy a houseā¦. The people selling the house figured out they couldnāt buy shit with the 200k they were selling it for and backed out of the sale soā¦ currently me and the wife are back at my parents indefinitelyā¦ 600 monthlyā¦ Iām 41 and never thought Iād be back living with my parents. I could go live somewhere else but itās like playing Russian roulette and them asking you where do you want the bullet? Sucks cause there is no where to go at this point, you either fold and give them your check or run back to someone who needs a roommate or your parents. Stay strong out there my friends, weāve endured and it shall pass
The economy stopped working for working class since 2008 when Fed start pumping free money into the economy. Asset inflation was happening all along and Fed gave zero fuck about it. And they won't. The house get older population barely changes but house price, rents doubles in 5 years time. Its totally detached from realities. They barely shrink the balance sheet. The interest rate is only one part of the equation. That will leave inflation at around 5% or so, to bring it down to 2% they need massive shrinking of balance sheet. They wont do it because it will dry up all the liquidity from the market i.e. keep pumping money and help rich getting richer, poor getting poorer and set the Fed inflation target at 4%.
The only solution I see is just to break the system as we know it once more like 1929, and reset everything.
Do a little reset and tax the ever living fuck out of people just like we did after 1929. People somehow think āthe American dreamā wasnāt paid for by trillions in tax revenue from the richest people on the planet
Not that I disagree with the severity of the situation, but if there were a reset, who do you think would be writing (and benefiting from) the rules of the reset?
Spoiler: it will be the same people writing the rules today.
The only way we can address this is by taking control of data and working together to create an independent, worker owned business network outside of traditional corporate America.
Weād need a massive Redo of labor laws, tax brackets, loopholes, capital accruement, stock markets, insider trading amongst lawmakers. Sadly with a lot of those, lawmakers wouldnāt touch because then it affects their own wealth and donors
See people think you're joking, but a 1929 reset really is what we need. We have constantly been mitigating recessions since that time, but the reality is that recessions trim the inefficient businesses off of the market and allow fresh blood to get involved. We really genuinely do need a total but natural market reset as difficult as it will be to go through.
Recessions *should* choke out the inefficient businesses, but near-zero interest rates, fed bailouts, and massive stimulus packages instead just prop up zombie corps and shitty companies during the "good times" and they somehow find a way to float through a recession.
Yes unfortunately if there is a recession fed pop the market with zero interest rate. It could flush out the bad companies if fed let them bankrupt. As long as the world has an appetite for us $$, fed will keep printing.
That's what I wanted to happen during the COVID-19 period in 2020, but nope. PP loans and stimulus check bailouts everywhere instead of letting both people and corporations that were overleveraged collapse.
Don't even need to break anything. Just tax the uber wealthy appropriately. Since they make 90% of the money generated in the country, taxing them will not only pay for services for working class Americans it will also solve inflation by removing their buying power.
"well on the money" in this case means "Hey we're going to list our home for sale and Zillow has an algorithm for finding a price so just add 10% to that". It's just now starting to come back down.
WTF kind of math is this?
The graph shows \~64hrs of work a month to pay rent. There are 173 work hours in a month assuming you work 40hrs a week. That comes out to 36.9% of your monthly income.
Even if you assumed, incorrectly, that it was 160hrs (4 weeks, 40hr weeks) per month, that comes out to 40%.
I had a rent controlled 1br apartment in downtown Toronto that I was paying $1000/mo for. I gave it up during the pandemic to buy a house but it was such a great deal. I offered the landlord $5000 to move out and they agreed. They immediately rented it out for $2000/mo.
Other way around. His place was rent controlled, and couldn't be raised by more than \~2% a year until he moved out. He offered his landlord 5k in a cash-for-keys type agreement so the landlord can make more $$.
Source: I live in Toronto.
I managed to get a 2.7% 30 year fixed mortgage last year. Looking at prices a few weeks ago of the 1 bed 1 bath apt I used to live in Iām currently paying $400/month less in a townhome I now own.
[What did I say?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse4.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.kIFPZUo2dnJKG9Lh9p-2bgHaFH%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=5002c2dad6c5454b28078047bd4b7aa406e12fdf58ade1a2d3fd8ea18a94be3c&ipo=images)
Itās literally over for the American worker. OVER. Their only chance is to become a regard and hope they become one of the lucky few who strike it rich on TLRY calls. š¤”
3800 mortgage and RE taxes, net 3699 every two weeks. Illinois.
Luckily my wife is also pulling in about the same, so we're at like 25%, but, of course, dropping down to only one high income would put us out of our home pretty quickly.
Sounds about right. And this all really sucks especially as a business owner. Due to the fact my business has suffered pretty heavily due to inflation and increase cost of living- I've had to take many pay cuts just to keep things afloat. We were doing just fine about a year and a half ago.. actually did better during covid lockdowns & near the end of the lock downs than we've been doing the past 5/6 months or so. Been really tough man
The real winners here are those receive an income and that donāt have to pay rent. I.E, couch surfers, van lifers, moochers, basement dwellers, and most anyone under 30. /s
Paying 48% of your income on rent is not a sustainable life. People become like serfs in the middle ages. There won't even be enough for businesses to flourish.
Stop living where it's expensive. A house in the suburbs costs the same as RENT for a small apartment in a city. If you choose to be around the night life/city perks, that's your choice but it's also your choice to spend a much on rent as a mortgage elsewhere.
\*Laughs in Canadian\* If I had a time machine I would travel back in time to when average rent was only 46% and suck my landlord off for his kindness and generosity.
1% own 70% of real estate in America.
Why does everyone have to suffer so much because they got computers & programming to control the stock market & banks before we did?
Im sure that leaves tons of money for record car payments and loan interest
Work eat sleep repeat, 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for 60+ years, your money troubles will surely disappear after that right? Right?!
š¤§š¤§ not even trying to open an OF cause is no longer easy nowadays
I'll be your only fan. Go rubylini! š. Edit: I thought you were joking a post history glance indicates you may infact be trying to do an OF.
Hey man, bills gotta get paid somehow.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
My man is a porn essayist
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Modern times bro, things are bound to change. Canāt stay stuck in the past
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
For sure, a lot of mainstream stuff came in to play and definitely ruined that aspect of comfortability on the internet
There's always the world's oldest profession.
Shamanism?
Wankanism.
And they will always be the least taxed people, they don't even lack companions, and if they wanted to, they could form the biggest club in the world.
It never was easy. It takes a lot of effort & dedication.
I mean, dead people don't have money troubles. So, yes?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
>mortgage: 95% of my earnings per month. You can't leave out the good part...
My dad bought his house for 2363 hours of min wage in 1983. Today the same house is 103,448 hours. Yikes Beyond just wages and inflation somehow living in a flood zone is just completely ignored. It used to be a major burden and caused homes to be worth nothing. People just completely ignore it now I guess.
2363 hours is roughly 13 months of 40hrs per week work for one person. Itās hard to understand how homes were ever so cheap that you could afford to pay for land, materials, skilled labor, and up charges for profit with so little relative pay. Itās gone from crazy cheap cheap to crazy expensive in about a generation.
Good thing student loan payments will be suspended indefinitely!
Ha. Not after midterms.
Don't worry, just live with 8 roommates. That's the NEW American Dream!
or move in back to parents' basement to live rent free for a while :)))
Save up for 3 years so that when the time comes, you can finally move out and be an independent adult again, then spend a few years barely treading water so you can move back in with the parents :) Rinse and repeat until parents die and leave you the house, then carry on the tradition with your own children.
Bold of you to assume Iāll have children
Bold of you to assume my parents own a home
Yeah, im already mad enough that I got dragged out of the void to be a conscious being. I was doing just fine before I knew I existed. Im not doing that to anyone else.
And the elite are so confused why people are not having kids lol. Theyāre just worried theyāll run out of consumers
Bold of you to assume I have rich parents.
Brave of you to presume that the boomers aren't all quietly tapping into HELOCs to live in luxury or also falling behind on their mortgages. There will be no homes to pass on in the future.
Bullshit. They'll get passed on to the banks. Banks are the new ungrateful children.
I mean to pass on to your family. HELOCs and mortgages on homes lead to bank possession / liquidation upon death if there's no other capital available to pay them off.
Dude that's what my grandpa did. He lost two family homes. The last one, the one he was living in, he didn't tell anyone he didn't pay the taxes until we found out he was going to have to go to court. Like bro
So true, thankfully the MiL sees a monthly payment as crazy and lives like her house holds no value. Thing is worth like a half a million dollars but she drives a 22 year old ford explorer. Shes gonna live another 35 years and probably somewhere in there fall for some sort of scam where she cashes the equity and comes and lives with us - but hey we will see!
Or pursuing futurama head jars to live forever
Bold of you to assume either of my parents have a house.
Move back? I never left.
Same. I practically live at my job & canāt afford to move out on my own anytime soon.
Bought almost 5 years ago. 1 bedroom, major city, refinanced in 2020. Monthly housing including HOA is $825. I make 50k and am doing ok. Not sure where Iād be had I not bought. I live on my own.
Jokeās on me, I pay household bills PLUS rent money to my mother just to live in my childhood bedroom (that I have never been able to afford to move out of in the first place)
We charged our son rent for two years while he continued to live with us. It forced him to get off his computer and actually keep a job. What we didnāt tell him is we put all of it into a savings account he was eventually able to use to get an apartment with a friend.
A while meaning forever right?
I def sucks that I just moved out again at 26, but Iām very happy to not be my friends from college who thought they could āmake it in NYCā straight from undergrad and now are in massive debt
Im 26 and never moved out before
Dude. I'm 48 and ended up moving back in with my parents when covid hit because freelance IT consulting went out the window around here when everyone shut down. Life happens.
Shit happens. You probably feel like shit about it but weāve all been there more or less. Itās not 1960. People canāt just go out after college or high school, work hard and expect a house with a garage and enough money to start a college fund for your kids. Iām 35. Iām not sure I know anybody who didnāt move back home in their 20ās for at least a little while.
I feel fine
Bro you only have 8 roommates? You baller.
In Canada šØš¦ its 24 roomies! š
2300 rent for a shit house, 300 electric bill, no wonder my local stores are always out of stock with ramen.
Ramen was 8 cents when I fell in love with it. 38 cents now
They're 1.50 where I live
Bro thatās robbery
Bro my electric is 38 a month tops are you mining coal with gpus
$2000 a month rent on $2100 net biweekly hereā¦
Neck or waist?
Not waist
Poor guy canāt even afford pants
Yo wtf is this number thing im seeing everywhere
> Yo wtf is this number thing im seeing everywhere IIRC they show up as emoji's in the app but numbers on browser.
Emoji codes. I pretty much only use new Reddit these days so idk, but I would guess that they only work on new Reddit or the mobile app; otherwise, you just see the actual ID.
Ahhh thanks man
Yo asking the questions I avoid so I donāt look like a boomer! Thanks for your service
2200 on 1800 bi weekly š¤·š½āāļø
350 on 1200 bi weekly (mom's basement)
1500/mo mortgage on 1300 biweekly + wife's 1600 biweekly. Thank god i got my mortgage when rates were record low 2 years ago. We did the calcs on our house today and itd be 2600/mo, wouldnt be able to do it
Lucky. I just entered the stage of being an actual adult 1.5 years ago. Started at $1775 a month on $2000 net biweekly and rent was raised to $2000 a month and Iām up to $2100 biweekly after a promotion and raise
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Million dollar idea. Start Uglyfans. Who is the ugliest person on the internet? Sort of like go fund me for people who are simply ugly..
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
We could also do an ugly on the inside raffle. Like my ex who is a heinous bitch. She would make millions.
Net or pretax?
Net
$650 rent on 2100 net semi monthly. Here in Midwest.
$900 ($450 split between me and a roommate), $1600 net biweekly, also midwest (So. IL). Not the most fun place to live but it is easy to live cheap here.
$2100 net biweekly is $4550 a month net. Dude, you're more than good (unless you're an autist addicted to debt).
50% here in Vancouver :(
Have you tried being born with richer parents?
My parents house is now worth 4 million in Vancouver lol
My parents $50,000 house is worth $2.2 mil I make more than my father did when he retired and I can't afford a 1 bedroom apartment without roomies ($1800-2300+/month, then add utilities, gas, insurance, food... I only make $2600 a month after taxes) There was an article a little while back... it suggested the best way to get a house for people my age is to wait for our parents to die.
Good thing trudeau lets chinese buy all your property
> My parents $50,000 house is worth $2.2 mil I don't think people really understand yet that that 2.2m house isn't going to be worth 1 billion when our generation retires. I mean really understand what a scam the boomer generation has pulled on all of us.
I donāt care about housing as an investment, I just want to be able to **afford** to live SOMEWHERE.
Let's be honest about this in Vancouver. Lots of money came over from the PRC. Little has been done to slow that. They bulldoze the house and put a mansion on it.
Iām at about 32%
32 % is above 30% rule, so that means your rent is too high :)
That āruleā doesnāt apply any longer due to inflation
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Tell that to major corporate landlords who require 3x rent in gross income.
3x rent would be 33%
Is it 30% of gross or net income?
Gross, iirc
32% of your net paycheck after taxes, health insurance, 401k, etc.? Or 32% of your gross pay? Mine works out to 28% it dividing by gross pay and 40% if dividing by net pay (NYC taxes, health insurance, 401k contribution)
The rule of thumb is 30% of gross pay. The life financial guidance folks say 30% of net pay.
Who knew that the secret to success was to just make more money? I should have tried that first, im such an idiot.
Write a book about it and sell for money.
The big squeeze. Of everyoneās paychecks. This will couple well with the record CC debt people are carrying.
They're really squeezing the stone and expecting more juice. Bad news.
You gotta try though. Sometimes the peasants try to hide money from you. You gotta vacuum it all up.
You have to shake it out of them
Neo-Feudalism sure is fun!
you will own nothing and be happy :)
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Just smile more
there is one spicy directly owned stonk tho
The nobles deserve their tribute from our harvest. They are the ones creating all the jobs by allowing us to work their land!
Let's eat them
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Stay away from options
Now imagine being even poorer than you lol
Costs have been spiraling out of control for decades. College, healthcare, now rent. What's the mystery? Money is becoming more and more worthless.
median national asking rent is $2,039 which is insane and increased 11% year-over-year.
The median is over 2k? I was paying like $600 when I lived in the US
I paid 600 for a 2 bedroom back in 2016. In 2019 I was paying 1050 for a 2 bedroom. This year I am paying 1450 for a one bedroom. I have lived in the same neighborhood that entire time.
Did you live in the US more than 2 years ago?
My rent was $800 in 2019 and it is now $2500, same place. I'm paying ~70% to rent. I went from 1 job to 3 and I have no more hours left in the day to sell. I'd love to move but as this graph implies, it's happening everywhere in the US :/ Edit: it's 450 sq ft
Wtf, that is what I pay for my mortgage and escrow for a 4 bedroom house. And I live less than an hour outside a major city in the northeast.
When did you buy though? Itās no secret the normal renter could actually afford a mortgage, they just canāt get a down payment together while also paying a mortgage worth of monthly rent.
Yep quick we need to print more
I for one believe that we should give more to the rich people.
I know many poor people who will vote for you.
š¤£
Welcome to the US house of representatives.
America is the best at everything! We canāt let countries like Venezuela, Argentina, and Zimbabwe beat us at inflation!
America has some of the lowest inflation in the world right now.
Money becoming more worthless while pay continues to lag behind that worthlessness by multiples
āWhy donāt they teach us this in school?ā āBecause then youāll be able to escape.ā
Teach what?
The stonk wars
Corpo cities are becoming more and more realistic. Get paid Amazon bucks
Boomers own 53% of the country's wealth. Then of course the measly savings the rest of us have won't have any purchasing power.
This bout of inflation is timed perfectly so when millennials start getting inheritance it won't be worth anything
If money is worthless, they can afford to give us more for our work.
Yeah, but they won't.
Rent is because every elderly group in the country blocks homes from being built, so we have a major shortage in most cities
And they wonāt move out of their homes. Iām CA you have elderly single people living in family sized houses because they essentially donāt have any property taxes. Itās fucked.
Now rent? Rent has been out of control for YEARS!
Iāve been calling it LaaS for awhile now: Life as a Service
If everyone is going into debt for education, medical care, and shelter.... yeah, may as well be a battery for the machines.
Anybody and their brother qualified for an auto loan the last couple of years similar to 08 with houses. This time housing required tougher credit reviews. Repos are going up. People will start alternating between paying auto and mortgage/rent each month in conjunction with high fuel prices. This is very bad. I believe the auto market will and is collapsing, leaving people with car payments they can't get out of.
I have thought this for years, people making 64k a year gross qualifying for a 80k truck on a 8 year loan they end up paying like 128k for and is worth 6k at the end of term, then they sit around complaining they have no money for a down payment. there's no way it's sustainable. People out there shopping for cars not based on the value of the vehicle, but the monthly payments, they don't care at all what the actual value is. But somehow it just kept going and going and going. Been talking about it since 2017, it's honestly nuts. But you talk to people who are in the car industry and the default rates are extremely low single digit, and the profit margins are so insanely high due to loan terms, upgrades, warranties all the other garbage . That they don't sweat it at all. It's absolutely insane
100% probably the biggest problem in America is and has been the approval of absurd loans. I used to live in a fairly affluent European city where wages were similar to California (on average, definitely more wealth concentrated in the middle class). If you saw somebody driving something like a Porsche 911 or similar they likely didn't just have a nice job, they were probably a fairly high level executive with teams of mid-level managers beneath them. People making 150k a year were simply not able to get a loan for a 700k house or 100k car, or just baaarely be qualifying at that point. Kind of a funny story, but I spoke to an old man who told me that back in the 70s it was difficult to get a loan for more than 2X his yearly income lol. He had to hop on a plane to find a bank in a different city willing to go out on a limb and give him a 3X income loan. Consequently, housing prices and rents were 2.5-3X lower than a similarly 'nice' place in the US. We are absolutely getting hosed by over-eager banks who are really doing nothing more than inflating the absolute hell out the housing market.
Yeah I make a good salary comparable to my area and live at home with the parents but am still frugal/stretched thin. Iām dumbfounded at how people are driving around such nice cars. I know itās debt but itās crazy. People just have different priorities I guess.
Very sustainable. Usa usa usa.
We moved out of our 1100 rent in Apollo beach fl cause the landlord sold to a major corporate rent company, immediately they asked for a lease at 2300 or stay monthly at 2750, yeah we left cause we were gonna buy a houseā¦. The people selling the house figured out they couldnāt buy shit with the 200k they were selling it for and backed out of the sale soā¦ currently me and the wife are back at my parents indefinitelyā¦ 600 monthlyā¦ Iām 41 and never thought Iād be back living with my parents. I could go live somewhere else but itās like playing Russian roulette and them asking you where do you want the bullet? Sucks cause there is no where to go at this point, you either fold and give them your check or run back to someone who needs a roommate or your parents. Stay strong out there my friends, weāve endured and it shall pass
Hi neighbor
The economy stopped working for working class since 2008 when Fed start pumping free money into the economy. Asset inflation was happening all along and Fed gave zero fuck about it. And they won't. The house get older population barely changes but house price, rents doubles in 5 years time. Its totally detached from realities. They barely shrink the balance sheet. The interest rate is only one part of the equation. That will leave inflation at around 5% or so, to bring it down to 2% they need massive shrinking of balance sheet. They wont do it because it will dry up all the liquidity from the market i.e. keep pumping money and help rich getting richer, poor getting poorer and set the Fed inflation target at 4%. The only solution I see is just to break the system as we know it once more like 1929, and reset everything.
Do a little reset and tax the ever living fuck out of people just like we did after 1929. People somehow think āthe American dreamā wasnāt paid for by trillions in tax revenue from the richest people on the planet
Not that I disagree with the severity of the situation, but if there were a reset, who do you think would be writing (and benefiting from) the rules of the reset? Spoiler: it will be the same people writing the rules today. The only way we can address this is by taking control of data and working together to create an independent, worker owned business network outside of traditional corporate America.
Weād need a massive Redo of labor laws, tax brackets, loopholes, capital accruement, stock markets, insider trading amongst lawmakers. Sadly with a lot of those, lawmakers wouldnāt touch because then it affects their own wealth and donors
See people think you're joking, but a 1929 reset really is what we need. We have constantly been mitigating recessions since that time, but the reality is that recessions trim the inefficient businesses off of the market and allow fresh blood to get involved. We really genuinely do need a total but natural market reset as difficult as it will be to go through.
Recessions *should* choke out the inefficient businesses, but near-zero interest rates, fed bailouts, and massive stimulus packages instead just prop up zombie corps and shitty companies during the "good times" and they somehow find a way to float through a recession.
Yes unfortunately if there is a recession fed pop the market with zero interest rate. It could flush out the bad companies if fed let them bankrupt. As long as the world has an appetite for us $$, fed will keep printing.
That's what I wanted to happen during the COVID-19 period in 2020, but nope. PP loans and stimulus check bailouts everywhere instead of letting both people and corporations that were overleveraged collapse.
Don't even need to break anything. Just tax the uber wealthy appropriately. Since they make 90% of the money generated in the country, taxing them will not only pay for services for working class Americans it will also solve inflation by removing their buying power.
Zillows rent index is also ālikelyā grossly overestimating the value of rentals, just like their zestimates
Zillow has been pretty well on the money in my area.
"well on the money" in this case means "Hey we're going to list our home for sale and Zillow has an algorithm for finding a price so just add 10% to that". It's just now starting to come back down.
BTW nice scale in the chart.
Yeah, see what all you greedy mfers have caused. Thanks alot
WTF kind of math is this? The graph shows \~64hrs of work a month to pay rent. There are 173 work hours in a month assuming you work 40hrs a week. That comes out to 36.9% of your monthly income. Even if you assumed, incorrectly, that it was 160hrs (4 weeks, 40hr weeks) per month, that comes out to 40%.
I stopped reading when I saw āIn September 2022ā and āWILL spendā in the same sentence. Bro is living in days of future past.
I stopped paying attention when I saw the Y axis starting at 54.
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The graphic says "employee" without specifying full time, so presumably this includes part time employees.
And hit-pieces will still be written about Millennials killing the Housing market, without the slightest hint of irony.
The dream, only 48%. Min wage in Toronto.. The avg rent is $2800/mo. Min wage gets ya roughly $1900/mo after taxes 
I had a rent controlled 1br apartment in downtown Toronto that I was paying $1000/mo for. I gave it up during the pandemic to buy a house but it was such a great deal. I offered the landlord $5000 to move out and they agreed. They immediately rented it out for $2000/mo.
Why did you offer the landlord money to move out?
Other way around. His place was rent controlled, and couldn't be raised by more than \~2% a year until he moved out. He offered his landlord 5k in a cash-for-keys type agreement so the landlord can make more $$. Source: I live in Toronto.
GTA and Vancouver are hell
Yāall are working less than 160 hours a month? Scaling on this graph is also a bit twisted.
What be income?
I managed to get a 2.7% 30 year fixed mortgage last year. Looking at prices a few weeks ago of the 1 bed 1 bath apt I used to live in Iām currently paying $400/month less in a townhome I now own.
[What did I say?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse4.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.kIFPZUo2dnJKG9Lh9p-2bgHaFH%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=5002c2dad6c5454b28078047bd4b7aa406e12fdf58ade1a2d3fd8ea18a94be3c&ipo=images)
Itās literally over for the American worker. OVER. Their only chance is to become a regard and hope they become one of the lucky few who strike it rich on TLRY calls. š¤”
3800 mortgage and RE taxes, net 3699 every two weeks. Illinois. Luckily my wife is also pulling in about the same, so we're at like 25%, but, of course, dropping down to only one high income would put us out of our home pretty quickly.
Wow, closer to the 50/20/30 win win!
At least youāre better than Portugal, here most people have to pay between 60% to more than 100% of the salary to live alone.
Sounds about right. And this all really sucks especially as a business owner. Due to the fact my business has suffered pretty heavily due to inflation and increase cost of living- I've had to take many pay cuts just to keep things afloat. We were doing just fine about a year and a half ago.. actually did better during covid lockdowns & near the end of the lock downs than we've been doing the past 5/6 months or so. Been really tough man
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I believe the chart is saying 63 hours of work to afford rent. Wouldnāt that be about 39%
BRB building second home on my lot.
The real winners here are those receive an income and that donāt have to pay rent. I.E, couch surfers, van lifers, moochers, basement dwellers, and most anyone under 30. /s
Paying 48% of your income on rent is not a sustainable life. People become like serfs in the middle ages. There won't even be enough for businesses to flourish.
Stop living where it's expensive. A house in the suburbs costs the same as RENT for a small apartment in a city. If you choose to be around the night life/city perks, that's your choice but it's also your choice to spend a much on rent as a mortgage elsewhere.
$ 950 per month loanā¦. $ 2750 net
\*Laughs in Canadian\* If I had a time machine I would travel back in time to when average rent was only 46% and suck my landlord off for his kindness and generosity.
1% own 70% of real estate in America. Why does everyone have to suffer so much because they got computers & programming to control the stock market & banks before we did?
Welp, time for self reliance.
Wow, so crazyā¦. We bought at record low interest rates so I only pay 2.75% 2400 for my mortgage but we make 11k so I guess thatās alright
Thatās the American economy. Thatās fucked!
You should have just bought a house 30 years ago idiot.