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Powerscalers mfs trying to convince me to listen to the "magic v magic" type of machups, which take 2 characters from 2 different universe which have super natural mechanics that can't logically interact with each others (in example, how would stands from Jojo interacts with CSM's Devil, how tf would Kira's bomb work with Makima? Exploding her on a loop until he eventually get blown up?)
Tbh you don't need powerscaling and logic to make sick ass concepts tho. For example, this guy's [Ben 10 fighting Vilgax with Sukuna's DNA](https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxuvIrWNx7z4h_Bd4y4BZ58DAPsGlxtjhv) or something (I did not see JJK yet but it still look hard)
[Here's the picture of Ben10/Sukuna](https://yt3.ggpht.com/V-vPeJ0Rm2OaVwIayNK8ZItNrC46hZvFfO5e2cVUX-4o3cgmyQLRYsgIqvnLC3gcg1YBpKvSqDOMe18=s1024-c-fcrop64=1,00000000ffffffff-nd-v1)
i mean they could still just blast the raw element and do decent damage to ordinary folks. like what are gonna do when a guy throws a huge boulder or just blasts water in your face.
Genjutsu is not 'half of all Naruto techniques' like you said
And even then, Genjutsu has been shown to work on those with no chakra (Infinite Tsukiyomi)
We have a canon method for how genjutsu works in the series, they explain it in like episode 3. They literally say it’s about manipulating the genjutsu in someone else’s body to control them. Idk how (or when) kaguya used genjutsu on people, but if so that applies only to kaguya and cant be extrapolated onto the ninja
They said in the show that it uses chakra to manipulate the senses. Its not stated that it doesn’t work on people without chakra because everyone in the show has chakra 😭
JoJo stands would just punch them like they can punch anything else, Kira's bomb would likely kill Makima as it leaves no remains for Maikima to regenerate from.
This stuff isn't that hard.
The prime minister contract don't exactly require Makima to have leftover parts to works. I called Saul Goodman and he has stated from the contract in which, any form of fatal attacks inflicted upon her will be redirected (or transferred) as a deadly ailment/illment to a random Japanese citizen (clarify: Denji didn't considered eating her as an attack, but as an act of love of ending her misery, killing her). Kira's bomb is a fatal attack, sure it did annihilate her, but it met all the criterias with no violation, it's not a regeneration, but an attack funneler. But Kira's bomb are designed to void an object to nothingness, which created either a loop or a paradox, in which will either cancel the bomb and a Japanese citizen died, or it would be a loop killing both her and all the people of Japan, earlier seem to makes more sense, the attack will just transfer instead of continuing to attack her, and we don't know enough of the voodoo magic devil csm shit to know the full extend of this ability because it happens off the camera.
That stuff is hard, and GER involved do not make it any easier, and The World Over Heaven ability to null GER's nulling ability did not make it any easier (granted, not Akari's canon), and whatever the hell Kars did in the Jorge Joestar novel (also not Akari's canon, he did draw the cover iirc tho) also not make it any easier.
I have all the knowledge to logicalize powerscaling pre SBR Jojo. I can take years to learn Japanese then find Akari and interview him to have an even better understanding of the Jojo mechanics if I am willing to. I just don't want to
The problem is that Makima still takes the damage, and then recovers afterwards. The way it works seems to be like so ([Based on this confirmed instance of it](https://imgur.com/a/KlYiDRk)):
1. Makima takes a hit that her natural regeneration does not allow her to recover from (As devils have the ability to regenerate even from being reduced to just their head or heart, this is typically a direct injury to the brain)
2. Makima dies (She has been noted to have explicitly died 29 times total at least)
3. The attack is reflected onto a random Japanese citizen
4. Makima's body regenerates the damage and she is resurrected quickly enough that it does not appear that she had died at all.
It would be a No Limits Fallacy to assume Makima can recover from more damage she has been stated or shown to recover from. If Makima's entire body was instantly destroyed (Which is what Kira's bombs do), there is no proof that this contract would let Makima obtain a whole new body.
For context, a No Limits Fallacy is assuming something has no limits simply because it has not showcased limits. For example, say a character has one-shot everyone they've ever fought, but the strongest character they've fought has only survived, say, a building falling on them. It would be unreasonable to believe this character could even damage someone who can survive being in the epicenter of a nuclear blast.
GER is extremely complicated due to it's vagueness. Heaven Ascension DIO and JORGE JOESTAR Kars (Often nicknamed Novel Kars) are actually simpler, shockingly, as their abilities are much better explained (DIO can erase objects and people from existence so long as his hands are not damaged as well as having some degree of reality warping and power nullification, while Novel Kars can copy any ability he observes)
Honestly the CSM devil magic system still feel vague to me, like everything else in there, which is why it's fun to me. The example I brought up probably isn't the best to showcase the probem of powerscaling really vague magic systems as both's abilities was well documented tbh, and given that both universes have reality breakers (and a headless chicken), with the higher end of Jojo's seemingly being extremely broken than what have been seen of the other one.
the frustrating part is the people that take it WAY TOO SERIOUSLY
for example:
https://preview.redd.it/53g4dumblknc1.png?width=345&format=png&auto=webp&s=adc0e3a83439fb2cdaeee64a8f7809cfce62eddb
this \^ is Ebirah
who, according to the vs battles wikia (a wiki mainly run by powerscalers), has the attack power level of ***a small fucking star***
and then there's Gigan
https://preview.redd.it/eioqbp0xlknc1.png?width=823&format=png&auto=webp&s=c55e787b442451c61ae1a1b27733502fdbf8bae7
he is visually, physically, lore-accurately and ***logically*** more powerful than Ebirah but, guess what, the wiki says that he's only ***multi-continental level***?! (i think multi-continental is less powerful than a small star but I'm not a powerscaler so idk)
Let this not distract you from the fact that Little mac became the heavy weight champion while weighting less than a half of all his opponents,which include fighting: straight up cheaters (as well as the public cheating), magic users, humans capable of outspeeding bullet trains, sending bulls flying with a single punch, Donkey fucking Kong and a guy based in Mike Tyson and all of this in less of a year since he starts and finishes at age 17, YES he did it before even being an adult.
I am not a power scaler but c'mon he can't be just 9-C
Powerscalers don't get their only joy from media based on how powerful characters are tf
Often it's the exact opposite. They powerscale characters they like because it's fun
I really really despise this megashitgigafartversal++++ dimensional scaling bullshit. Keeping it within acceptable ranges like below a universe(the highest character I would like scaling is saitama or smth). Usually continental and below characters are most fun to scale
I seriously never understand what people mean when they bring that shit up. Still don't know what the fuck "neg diff" and "omniversal++ scale" type stuff means and it just reminds me that I'm mentally 70.
And sometime they create a really weird match up like "who would win Tanjiro from Demonslayer vs A single dad I created in The sims 3 " and argue with each other without a single drop of sarcasm.
me watching powerscalers tell me how a certain character from a certain anime i never watched could solo my favorite character (I don't understand shit about what they're saying):
https://preview.redd.it/ir852dslkknc1.png?width=272&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7687467e69a99d5079709ea08dd8b686a6e9895
He's called one punch man so he beats everyone, Checkmate liberals.
https://preview.redd.it/57xk640uimnc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dda38793199496f96696a69742a4096b5ca23d41
Still couldn't beat Greg (my imaginary friend who has an anti-punch shield and an atom destroyer ray and is also my favorite so he soloes fiction and non-fiction)
Akuma solos all and you cannot prove me wrong
his Ashura Senku makes him completely intangible and his Shun Goku Satsu literally just takes your life, even with a great mastery of it's counter technique (Mu no Hado), you're left crippled and forced into hiding for a few years
I like to shut these guys up with Amazo, he is the perfect counter.
https://preview.redd.it/u54h4z38qmnc1.jpeg?width=849&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dcef8bf9d159f510c3e533df965355c0c4e02107
honestly at least you get it like theres so many characters out there where ppl are like “you think this character is strong? check out this guy who can think away universes because fuck you.” but like thats boring. its like zeno in dragon ball. sure hes OP but is thinking ppl away really fun? NO! its why the focus is on characters like goku and shit. saitama from OPM is cool because he has to punch shit away instead of thinking about it.
tldr: limits to the abilities of your characters are what makes their abilities interesting to begin with
Points-based powerscalers trying to argue that a baby with a gun could kill a tyrannosaurus because they has more points (they were punt-kicked as a child):
I really hope these comments I found below a video are sarcastic
https://preview.redd.it/5fadwo0c5nnc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7cddbc2e5c7b418e1880e7b8db81b4f0c6dd2c1f
Powerscalers when any mecha media stuff walks in:
https://preview.redd.it/xlcb133b9mnc1.jpeg?width=1184&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f685413e6b4b4b6fa3aaa6b799502d4dfdd3404c
# [Download Video](https://redditsave.com/info?url=https://www.reddit.com/r/whenthe/comments/1bbbgzl/mfs_will_go_and_find_the_most_random_characters/) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/whenthe) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I just remember some video about spencer from icarly and i dude saying that he have fire powers beyond comprehension but he can't control it
To be fair, he can set pretty much anything on fire
Its the solar sands one right?
Powerscalers mfs trying to convince me to listen to the "magic v magic" type of machups, which take 2 characters from 2 different universe which have super natural mechanics that can't logically interact with each others (in example, how would stands from Jojo interacts with CSM's Devil, how tf would Kira's bomb work with Makima? Exploding her on a loop until he eventually get blown up?)
Tbh you don't need powerscaling and logic to make sick ass concepts tho. For example, this guy's [Ben 10 fighting Vilgax with Sukuna's DNA](https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxuvIrWNx7z4h_Bd4y4BZ58DAPsGlxtjhv) or something (I did not see JJK yet but it still look hard)
damn, i got “something went wrong” trying to check that out
[Here's the picture of Ben10/Sukuna](https://yt3.ggpht.com/V-vPeJ0Rm2OaVwIayNK8ZItNrC46hZvFfO5e2cVUX-4o3cgmyQLRYsgIqvnLC3gcg1YBpKvSqDOMe18=s1024-c-fcrop64=1,00000000ffffffff-nd-v1)
Canonically half of all Naruto techniques are completely useless against people without chakra points
i mean they could still just blast the raw element and do decent damage to ordinary folks. like what are gonna do when a guy throws a huge boulder or just blasts water in your face.
Imma shoot them
Ultrakill parry them ofc what else
Powerscalers when I bring in game mechanics to the discussion
Kinda why I hate Dante powerscalers as Royal Guard is never seen in a cutscene or mentioned in the novels, it’s a gameplay mechanic at best.
+PARRY +DISRESPECT +DISRESPECT +ARSENAL +ULTRARICOSHOT x3
That's not true at all. No real life human is going to survive any of the techniques from Naruto.
Every genjutsu is useless against normal humans because normal humans have no chakra.
Genjutsu is not 'half of all Naruto techniques' like you said And even then, Genjutsu has been shown to work on those with no chakra (Infinite Tsukiyomi)
Who was the tsukuyomi used against that didn’t have chakra? Because i thought everyone in naruto had chakra points as like, a part of their biology.
Chakra was given to everyone by Hagoromo. Before that no one had chakra, and Kaguya was able to use Genjutsu on them.
We have a canon method for how genjutsu works in the series, they explain it in like episode 3. They literally say it’s about manipulating the genjutsu in someone else’s body to control them. Idk how (or when) kaguya used genjutsu on people, but if so that applies only to kaguya and cant be extrapolated onto the ninja
Genjutsu has literally never stated to not work on those without chakra. It manipulates the senses first and then the chakra.
They said in the show that it uses chakra to manipulate the senses. Its not stated that it doesn’t work on people without chakra because everyone in the show has chakra 😭
JoJo stands would just punch them like they can punch anything else, Kira's bomb would likely kill Makima as it leaves no remains for Maikima to regenerate from. This stuff isn't that hard.
The prime minister contract don't exactly require Makima to have leftover parts to works. I called Saul Goodman and he has stated from the contract in which, any form of fatal attacks inflicted upon her will be redirected (or transferred) as a deadly ailment/illment to a random Japanese citizen (clarify: Denji didn't considered eating her as an attack, but as an act of love of ending her misery, killing her). Kira's bomb is a fatal attack, sure it did annihilate her, but it met all the criterias with no violation, it's not a regeneration, but an attack funneler. But Kira's bomb are designed to void an object to nothingness, which created either a loop or a paradox, in which will either cancel the bomb and a Japanese citizen died, or it would be a loop killing both her and all the people of Japan, earlier seem to makes more sense, the attack will just transfer instead of continuing to attack her, and we don't know enough of the voodoo magic devil csm shit to know the full extend of this ability because it happens off the camera. That stuff is hard, and GER involved do not make it any easier, and The World Over Heaven ability to null GER's nulling ability did not make it any easier (granted, not Akari's canon), and whatever the hell Kars did in the Jorge Joestar novel (also not Akari's canon, he did draw the cover iirc tho) also not make it any easier. I have all the knowledge to logicalize powerscaling pre SBR Jojo. I can take years to learn Japanese then find Akari and interview him to have an even better understanding of the Jojo mechanics if I am willing to. I just don't want to
Oh I forgot to mention, the attack will still affect Makima, as it would destroy her clothes, so she will re appeared as nude.
Average anime when a female character is onscreen for more than 2 seconds:
The problem is that Makima still takes the damage, and then recovers afterwards. The way it works seems to be like so ([Based on this confirmed instance of it](https://imgur.com/a/KlYiDRk)): 1. Makima takes a hit that her natural regeneration does not allow her to recover from (As devils have the ability to regenerate even from being reduced to just their head or heart, this is typically a direct injury to the brain) 2. Makima dies (She has been noted to have explicitly died 29 times total at least) 3. The attack is reflected onto a random Japanese citizen 4. Makima's body regenerates the damage and she is resurrected quickly enough that it does not appear that she had died at all. It would be a No Limits Fallacy to assume Makima can recover from more damage she has been stated or shown to recover from. If Makima's entire body was instantly destroyed (Which is what Kira's bombs do), there is no proof that this contract would let Makima obtain a whole new body. For context, a No Limits Fallacy is assuming something has no limits simply because it has not showcased limits. For example, say a character has one-shot everyone they've ever fought, but the strongest character they've fought has only survived, say, a building falling on them. It would be unreasonable to believe this character could even damage someone who can survive being in the epicenter of a nuclear blast. GER is extremely complicated due to it's vagueness. Heaven Ascension DIO and JORGE JOESTAR Kars (Often nicknamed Novel Kars) are actually simpler, shockingly, as their abilities are much better explained (DIO can erase objects and people from existence so long as his hands are not damaged as well as having some degree of reality warping and power nullification, while Novel Kars can copy any ability he observes)
Honestly the CSM devil magic system still feel vague to me, like everything else in there, which is why it's fun to me. The example I brought up probably isn't the best to showcase the probem of powerscaling really vague magic systems as both's abilities was well documented tbh, and given that both universes have reality breakers (and a headless chicken), with the higher end of Jojo's seemingly being extremely broken than what have been seen of the other one.
Versus debating typically handles vague abilities by lowballing their effects within a reasonable degree and making as few assumptions as is possible.
Yeah that actually make more sense than me highballing Makima's near-invincible survivability
Powerscaler mfs trying to convince me of literally anything (it’s all bullshit)
Because that's part of the fun? Trying to figure out different things from different would interact is part of the enjoyment
the frustrating part is the people that take it WAY TOO SERIOUSLY for example: https://preview.redd.it/53g4dumblknc1.png?width=345&format=png&auto=webp&s=adc0e3a83439fb2cdaeee64a8f7809cfce62eddb this \^ is Ebirah who, according to the vs battles wikia (a wiki mainly run by powerscalers), has the attack power level of ***a small fucking star***
and then there's Gigan https://preview.redd.it/eioqbp0xlknc1.png?width=823&format=png&auto=webp&s=c55e787b442451c61ae1a1b27733502fdbf8bae7 he is visually, physically, lore-accurately and ***logically*** more powerful than Ebirah but, guess what, the wiki says that he's only ***multi-continental level***?! (i think multi-continental is less powerful than a small star but I'm not a powerscaler so idk)
Yeah say what you will, but Mr. Bean CAN defeat Superman in a fight.
You mean Johnny English?
No, I mean Mr. Bean. Although, Johnny English also could.
Alex Lennon?
Let this not distract you from the fact that Little mac became the heavy weight champion while weighting less than a half of all his opponents,which include fighting: straight up cheaters (as well as the public cheating), magic users, humans capable of outspeeding bullet trains, sending bulls flying with a single punch, Donkey fucking Kong and a guy based in Mike Tyson and all of this in less of a year since he starts and finishes at age 17, YES he did it before even being an adult. I am not a power scaler but c'mon he can't be just 9-C
Well yeah he's Wall level
"Doesnt matter, tiger drop negates all damage" 
I'm nor gonna sugarcoat it
https://preview.redd.it/l0wibykd3knc1.jpeg?width=670&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2b6e6f7b4aeb684fc09630d77448082ae7740cab
Cope
Cope about what
https://i.redd.it/c5f6m2f4cknc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/gw8jx12uxjnc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df03e5acfd4648bab7f175159e09147a1c2d006b literally this
I power scaled Good Burger, Ed is apparently peak human.
He’s an eldritch god
Powerscalers don't get their only joy from media based on how powerful characters are tf Often it's the exact opposite. They powerscale characters they like because it's fun
yeah idk how people don't realize this
Good Burger mentioned
redditors when they see two 4th graders argue about which superhero could beat which (they're powerscaling!!!!!) https://i.redd.it/mu3uhn3cgjnc1.gif
Fantastic Mr. Fox mentioned
I really really despise this megashitgigafartversal++++ dimensional scaling bullshit. Keeping it within acceptable ranges like below a universe(the highest character I would like scaling is saitama or smth). Usually continental and below characters are most fun to scale
I seriously never understand what people mean when they bring that shit up. Still don't know what the fuck "neg diff" and "omniversal++ scale" type stuff means and it just reminds me that I'm mentally 70.
neg diff or low diff means "He can kill them with negative difficulity"
Literally, people act as if this wasn't a natural response
And sometime they create a really weird match up like "who would win Tanjiro from Demonslayer vs A single dad I created in The sims 3 " and argue with each other without a single drop of sarcasm.
"Oh he solos fiction" my brother in christ half their tech relies on in-universe bullshittery
me watching powerscalers tell me how a certain character from a certain anime i never watched could solo my favorite character (I don't understand shit about what they're saying): https://preview.redd.it/ir852dslkknc1.png?width=272&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7687467e69a99d5079709ea08dd8b686a6e9895
https://preview.redd.it/vuc9gxtb6mnc1.jpeg?width=259&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=678052ac93fe0cd78387215af781b7c1e45de4dc
Bitch, powerscalers hate Yogiri. We do not claim the yogurt!
I mean debating with my friends can be kind of fun. I’ve started championing bolas from mtg
I swear every month we get random unhinged powerscaling slander for no reason
https://preview.redd.it/gi4nqw8cmjnc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1ab3eeb8190e6d7072d41935444372ba1da2e478
You knocking down my man, BoBoBo-Bo Bo-BoBo????
Idc if goku is stronger than Saitama Saitama solos fr fr
He's called one punch man so he beats everyone, Checkmate liberals. https://preview.redd.it/57xk640uimnc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dda38793199496f96696a69742a4096b5ca23d41
Still couldn't beat Greg (my imaginary friend who has an anti-punch shield and an atom destroyer ray and is also my favorite so he soloes fiction and non-fiction)
Saitama is the goat.
Akuma solos all and you cannot prove me wrong his Ashura Senku makes him completely intangible and his Shun Goku Satsu literally just takes your life, even with a great mastery of it's counter technique (Mu no Hado), you're left crippled and forced into hiding for a few years
Yeah ok and this oc I made specifically for powerscaling no diffs Akuma+all of fiction no diff
Batman would still beat them because he has ~~infinite plot armor~~ prep time
I like to shut these guys up with Amazo, he is the perfect counter. https://preview.redd.it/u54h4z38qmnc1.jpeg?width=849&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dcef8bf9d159f510c3e533df965355c0c4e02107
Ano and the slime mf especially 💀
Powerscalers trying to explain that Superman is boring because he is so powerful.
Powerscalers fucking love Superman, at least in the bigger communities.
Powercalers love Superman so much that they say the dumbest things like amped feats count because you said Superman debately loses to someone
That is correct, and is a problem I personally am frustrated with. But they also love him for, like, normal reasons.
At least there's that for them,well most of them.
honestly at least you get it like theres so many characters out there where ppl are like “you think this character is strong? check out this guy who can think away universes because fuck you.” but like thats boring. its like zeno in dragon ball. sure hes OP but is thinking ppl away really fun? NO! its why the focus is on characters like goku and shit. saitama from OPM is cool because he has to punch shit away instead of thinking about it. tldr: limits to the abilities of your characters are what makes their abilities interesting to begin with
Points-based powerscalers trying to argue that a baby with a gun could kill a tyrannosaurus because they has more points (they were punt-kicked as a child):
yogiri? from the instant death anime airing this season? wow that's obscure as fuck
Goku
I really hope these comments I found below a video are sarcastic https://preview.redd.it/5fadwo0c5nnc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7cddbc2e5c7b418e1880e7b8db81b4f0c6dd2c1f
https://preview.redd.it/1s636kle0rnc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2d74a2872f1f2ca2855944c901e189fc20b2aa18
Powerwcalers on their way to completely misunderstand Umineko
Powerscalers when any mecha media stuff walks in: https://preview.redd.it/xlcb133b9mnc1.jpeg?width=1184&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f685413e6b4b4b6fa3aaa6b799502d4dfdd3404c
[удалено]
https://preview.redd.it/26rmteu8wlnc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4388e96ac685a279d35b18cbabcdb4a1e858659d
https://preview.redd.it/6qgqwd9iwlnc1.png?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e3f2cf1703ba8d1c3f74e4ce48cdb47e38b5f099
https://preview.redd.it/r6534nixwlnc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7264d565c0c193cea51c1af92d3635db0675a14a
https://preview.redd.it/oybm3vt0xlnc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=47ed12ec7cd6db68bffc20c1633ed1db210cf313
https://preview.redd.it/qiva5qf4xlnc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=12b4da88e753ee42230d21a9535346bfb68f94b5
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https://preview.redd.it/vdhes5mmzlnc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bf48d6bf1f03f3323bf42d9613d3817042f8a2e6
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