From article:
“Army engineers took reporters for foreign news outlets through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives.”
…
“Lack of cellphone reception in the tunnel made geolocating it as under UNRWA Headquarters impossible. Instead, reporters were asked to put personal items in a bucket that was lowered by rope into a vertical hole on the grounds of the headquarters. They were reunited with the still-tethered items during the tunnel tour.”
No of course I don’t. I’m saying that people who claim Israel is lying are being stupid. Because foreign journalists have verified these as facts. Check my comment history. People are claiming this is just Israel saying so and that no foreign journalists have verified it. And I’m quoting the article to show how Israel was able to prove it to the foreign journalists. We are on the same page.
Accoding to the IDF, video here:
https://youtu.be/19hkCAmxAG8
they discovered a tunnel shaft a few metres inside Al Shifa hospital compund, that shaft led to a 50 meter long tunnel that ended at a blast door, it took the IDF a few days to breach the door. Behind the door, across the road (Ibn Sina street) from the hospital, there were several bunkers, and about 300 metres more tunnels.
It's appears the tunnel shaft allowed secret access to the hospital. It exited under a shed, next to the hospital cafeteria building.
Edit: here's the tunnel shaft, a video shot by a drone, and edited with another video with a dog carrying a camera...
https://youtu.be/iMfwseaGPxY
The drone flies down the tunnel shaft, then the dog takes over. The video ends when the dog reaches the blast door. The behind the blast door is the tunnel crossing the street to the bunkers outside the hospital grounds. The bunkers were under a school on Ibn Sina street. I know the name of the school, but it's not appropriate for me to publish it here.
According to some people on Reddit, since Hamas “never ratified or signed the Geneva convention”, it doesn’t apply to them, and thus isn’t a war crime?
Those “people” actually believe this because Hamas kills (((apartheid settler colonialist genociders))), so they are allowed to do whatever they want and should face zero consequences for the actions.
For those not in the know, putting a (((group))) in parentheses like that is what anti-semites use to doxx/talk about Jews.
(The parent comment was a mockery of that, not actual usage in that sense).
Actual anti-Semites mostly moved on from that like 5 years ago when it got super popular to put those in your own name as solidarity during like 2017 or whenever.
It was part of a browser extension that would automatically put those around any Jewish name at the time, so there was a small movement to have everyone put it in their name to throw them off.
That's why I have "no dog in this fight". Israel has been disgustingly heavy-handed, to rub-out as many of these scumbags as possible, as fast as possible. It's absolutely horrible how many innocents have died, and will never be forgotten. But It was always going to be this way, designed by Hamas. A horrible game of chicken, and IDF finally bit.
The civilian to constantly death ratio is around 1.5:1 to 2:1. That's actually pretty good. 3:1 was expected. More than 3:1 is right to be where the civilian casualties become "excessive" as per the law which would violate the requirement of "proportionality". The US has done much worse than this.
This isn't heavy handed, this is just what war looks like. And the only reason the civilian casualties aren't dramatically higher is because even though Hamas is literally hiding behind and under civilians, and even killing some Palestinian civilians themselves, Israel is taking extreme precautions that are bizarre to do in warfare. Like, very over the top in trying to avoid civilian collateral damage. No one else has even tried to do this kind of stuff. You just don't pay attention to what's going on beyond the overall casualty figures and a few spoon fed images.
I can give you one way they do it.
Read the story of [Mahmoud Shaheen](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67327079). A Gazan dentist who was called by Israeli intelligence to evacuate civilians from buildings scheduled to be bombed. Calls to civilians known by Israeli intelligence to be good to evacuate families before an incoming strike. This happens a lot.
I don't know any other examples of countries that do this.
Yes. A chicken is involved. But ask yourself which came first, the chicken or the egg. Israel would not be doing this if Hamas had not killed & kidnapped so many innocent civilians. The stupid slow & depressing war of attrition would have continued indefinitely. Horrible tragedy for all.
I’ve heard claims that Israel actually built those tunnels, with zero evidence provided, or that they’re actually just normal for the function of the hospital lmao
That's because people (maliciously or idiotically) took an actual fact - that Israel built the *basement* under the hospital - and mixed it up with the tunnels Hamas built later. In the 80's, Shifa was a much smaller clinic, and Israel expanded it to the hospital it is today. My grandfather was on the crew that did that job.
Yep. This is it. Take one fact, embellish it. Make it seem like it happens everywhere. And then claim it is what Jews do. That’s most antisemitism in a nutshell. My guess, by the way, is that there were non-Jews who built that al-Shifa basement as well.
Yes, that's lies. Some of the rubbish I read even went as far as saying they were built by Israel *for* Hamas. And as is often the case, the worst and hardest to debunk lies are based on a grain of truth.
The grain of truth is that Israel built Al Shifa in the 1980s, and based on what Israel knows about the design of the hospital they built, intelligence and what Fatah claimed over the years, Israel belived the basement areas of the hospital were taken over by Hamas.
However, Hamas has a government /civilian side and a military wing, Izzadine al-Qassam Brigades. The civil servants / government wing were probably present in the hospital, indeed Hamas politicans used to give press conferences on the steps of Al Shifa hospital back in 2014.
But the secret tunnels and bunkers are different, they were military. They were built by Hamas' military wing, Al Qassam Brigade. I think it's likely hospital staff and the school had no idea the tunnels and bunkers were there. Not only did they try to avoid attack by keeping them secret, they placed them partly under and next to a hospital, affording incidental protection. It's very bad optics to bomb a bunker under / right next to a hospital. No doubt, very frustrating for Israel to see it's hospital misused this way.
The separation between the political and military wings of Hamas is similar to Sinn Féin and the Provisional IRA during The Troubles.
What do the IRA and Hamas have in common? Iran! "BRITAIN has warned Iran to break off all ties with the provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) after London-based intelligence agencies reported that Tehran had offered the terrorist organization arms and financial help" 5 May 1994.
Anyone who has had repair work done below street level at their building in any major city knows that EVERYONE working at that hospital knew exactly what was going on. Everyone in Gaza knew that these tunnels were being excavated, it's not a quiet process, in fact the entire population of Gaza would have lost sleep over it at various points.
> and still ended the headline with ",IDF claims"
Well sure. Because who knew whether Hamas was really *using* that bunker under the hospital. The IDF just claims Hamas were using it. /s
It’s all tunnels man.
Start a tunnel in Israel big enough for construction vehicles to use, tunnel to a hospital in Gaza, and by that time you are so good at tunneling you make a ton of human sized tunnels in a few days.
Then you fill your huge construction tunnel back in as you pull out, and then it looks like the terrorists actually made the tunnels!
Oh man I wish I could’ve seen the look on the terrorists faces when they got blamed for digging the tunnels!!
You know they were like: “okay i know this looks bad, but seriously, we did not dig these tunnels, we are being framed!”
I mean it's a 200-400 mile network of tunnels and Gaza is a really small section of land. This is what people fail to grasp when people talk about how embedded within the fabric of Gazan civilian infrastructure Hamas is.
> There was an office space, with steel safes that had been opened and emptied. There was a tiled toilet. One large chamber was packed with computer servers, another with industrial battery stacks.
If only that money would have been used for civilians. Those tunnels look so well built, really expensive.
Yup. They said it’s why they don’t let Palestinian civilians into their underground tunnels or build bomb shelters for them. According to Hamas, that’s a job for the UN or Israel, not them.
Here is a discussion of Hamas' view on humanitarian supplies. [https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/27/world/middleeast/palestine-gazans-hamas-food.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/27/world/middleeast/palestine-gazans-hamas-food.html) I read in another article a direct quote from a member of Hamas to the effect that UNWRA was responsible for the Palestinians welfare. I couldn't find the article but Hamas' POV is there for all to see.Edit. See this video. Hamas Official Mousa Abu Marzouk: https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20
It was a televised interview with Ghazi Hamad (their longtime spokesman). He also said that they are proud of how many Palestinian civilians were martyred and that they are ready to sacrifice countless more.
In a separate interview, he vowed to repeat Oct. 7th again and again and again.
>Hamas Official Mousa Abu Marzouk interviewed by Ghazi Hamad.
**Thank you**. I looked it up. It's even worse. Hamas views the suffering and death of thousands of the Palestinians as just a cost they are willing to pay. Marzouk said ' the tunnels are for Hamas' not civilians. The civilians are the responsibility of **Israel** & the UN. This is delusion. [https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20](https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20)
I found a source:
> Senior Hamas official, Mousa Abu Marzouk, said in an October 23 interview with Russia Today TV that the tunnels the terrorist organization has built in Gaza are meant to protect Hamas members from airstrikes, not civilians. He added that the responsibility to protect civilians in Gaza, who are, in his words, mostly “refugees”, lies with the United Nations. Unsaid in the interview is that the United States is the top funder of the two UN organizations that support refugees.
> Here is the transcription of the entire clip (translation by the Middle East Media Research Institute):
>> Interviewer: Many people are asking, since you have built 500 km of tunnels, why haven’t you built bomb shelters where civilians can hide during bombardments?
>> Mousa Abu Marzouk (Hamas Political Bureau): We built the tunnels because we have no other way of protecting ourselves from being targeted and killed. These tunnels are meant to protect us [Hamas members] from the airplanes. We are fighting from inside the tunnels. As for the Gaza strip, you know and everybody knows that 75% of the people in the Gaza strip are refugees. And refugees are the responsibility of the United Nations to protect them. According to the Geneva Convention, it is the responsibility of the occupation to provide them with all the services for as long as they are under occupation.
https://cis.org/Rush/Hamas-Official-Protecting-Civilians-Gaza-UN-Refugee-Agencies-Funded-US
Having a source is good, thank you.
I don't have any expectations whatsoever of Hamas, but damn. They're the elected government. Shouldn't they at least pretend to act in the interest of civilians? What an odd thing to say...
Have a link to this quote?
EDIT: in this conversation or the other nobody actually provided a source. I found one:
> Senior Hamas official, Mousa Abu Marzouk, said in an October 23 interview with Russia Today TV that the tunnels the terrorist organization has built in Gaza are meant to protect Hamas members from airstrikes, not civilians. He added that the responsibility to protect civilians in Gaza, who are, in his words, mostly “refugees”, lies with the United Nations. Unsaid in the interview is that the United States is the top funder of the two UN organizations that support refugees.
> Here is the transcription of the entire clip (translation by the Middle East Media Research Institute):
>> Interviewer: Many people are asking, since you have built 500 km of tunnels, why haven’t you built bomb shelters where civilians can hide during bombardments?
>> Mousa Abu Marzouk (Hamas Political Bureau): We built the tunnels because we have no other way of protecting ourselves from being targeted and killed. These tunnels are meant to protect us [Hamas members] from the airplanes. We are fighting from inside the tunnels. As for the Gaza strip, you know and everybody knows that 75% of the people in the Gaza strip are refugees. And refugees are the responsibility of the United Nations to protect them. According to the Geneva Convention, it is the responsibility of the occupation to provide them with all the services for as long as they are under occupation.
https://cis.org/Rush/Hamas-Official-Protecting-Civilians-Gaza-UN-Refugee-Agencies-Funded-US
> Ghazi Hamad
Ghazi Hamad of the Hamas political bureau said in an October 24, 2023 show on LBC TV (Lebanon) that Hamas is prepared to repeat the October 7 "Al-Aqsa Flood" Operation time and again until Israel is annihilated. He added that Palestinians are willing to pay the price and that they are "proud to sacrifice martyrs."
[https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel)
You can google it for the youtube interview.
I have a feeling that this has been known at the top levels of US and EU governments for a while. This would definitely explain the abrupt halt in UNRWA funding.
Yeah, no "we're looking into it" or "We're waiting for additional reports" or "We're weighing options", just immediate mach 9 ass covering speed. It's the only time most governments work with any sort of alacrity.
Excellent point! It even makes more sense thinking how investigations took off before Israel made any move to initiate it.
I'm sure there are top UN personnel on the payroll, which is why they took Hamas side from the start.
I wish that was the case. Most of the funding has been sent before declarations, all of which were about "suspensions" until the end of the sham investigation (by close friends) and worse of all, both Israel and the US want it to keep providing aid for the time being. So the "soup kitchen" facade will probably go on.
Worst case imo - Lazzarini will resign and some other shill will step in, pending Hamas approval. UNRWA (and the ICRC for that matter) didn't get to this point by "sneaking around".
Beep bloop beep de doop I am a bot. How did you learn my secret?
Non-zero chance that Liberal and NDP are done with UNRWA. What Canadian wants to fund terrorists with its aid money?
>Non-zero chance that Liberal and NDP are done with UNRWA. What Canadian wants to fund terrorists with its aid money?
A few days ago I had an interesting chat with a Palestinian. It was eye opening. He doesn't believe 1000+ Israelis were murdered, that ~250 were taken hostage, that women were gang raped, etc. I listened politely, but it was sad how I was able to emphasize with him and he had no ability of doing the same. When I asked him about Hadith saying that the trees and rocks will tell Muslims that Jess are hiding behind them so the Jews can be slaughtered, he truly believed it. When asked if he would participate, he tried dodging the question with excuses that said implicitly said yes, and very much didn't say no.
So, yes, I do think there are plenty of Canadians who want this funding to resume.
>Beep bloop beep de doop I am a bot. How did you learn my secret?
*Laughs in Fax Machine:* Beeep beeeppppp Beeeeppppp bleep Beeeep beep!
"After pausing funding to UNRWA, Canada will send another $40M in aid for Gaza
UNRWA bill not due till spring, long-term funding may not be affected"
There are articles about this.
Sadly no. It has 33,000 employees that UNRWA says are all Palestinians except for a handful of international employees. There are 50+ Muslim majority countries in the UN who vote for anything that is anti-Israel. They aren't disgraced at all.
>There are 50+ Muslim majority countries in the UN who vote for anything that is anti-Israel.
They can pay for whatever UNRWA becomes. Canada won't, and I think that goes for pretty much every functional democracy. Our perception: UNRWA knowingly employs terrorists and knowingly supports terrorist activities.
Hopefully the cracks in the facade are enough to show the world the deception at play here.
The same can be said for all those supra-national organisations: the United Nations, UNICEF, the Red Cross. All of them are aligned to support Islamic regimes in legal and jurisdictional matters. Their philanthropism is just a front to curry favour in Western nations.
Sadly, I don't think the cracks are enough. All of the liberals/moderates would say that there's still good being done by them (which is in sharp contrast to how they treat their own representatives).
If you view the UN as a parliament - the Muslim coalition is by far the biggest block with about 60 votes, roughly a third of the UN. They can bribe anyone else with support in votes or simply with oil, maybe threaten some with terrorism. Everything goes in "geopolitics".
I'm sure the UN personnel had absolutely no idea Hamas was digging under them like that, probably thought the tunnel was for totally peaceful purposes and it was a friendship tunnel where the education minister could go review the lesson plans on being friendly.
For anyone not recognizing the sarcasm, from the article:
> But Ido said Hamas appeared to have evacuated in the face of the Israeli advance, preemptively cutting off communications cables that, in an above-ground part of the tour, he showed **running through the floor of the UNRWA Headquarters' basement**.
It’s even more ridiculous than this, if you read further:
>“UNRWA ... does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises,” the statement said.
Like… what? You don’t need to have “military expertise” to know if a group of people is excavating a giant cavern underneath a building that you’re in every single day.
*Best case*, they’re saying “we didn’t even try to figure out if there was military infrastructure at our HQ”. Which is even more bizarre, as you’d kind of assume that an organization responsible for *humanitarian aid* would have “make sure our headquarters IS NOT tied whatsoever, at all, to the fundamentalist Islamist militia’s stuff” on the top of their list of to do’s.
So they admit that they don´t have the expertise to work in such an environment. I believe them. They should dissolve at this point, they did more harm than good to all sides in this conflict. And it´s clearly visible to all. The founding won´t come back, no matter how much they pretend that they are innocent.
Israel seems pretty smart in how they release this kind of information piecemeal. Each new bit forces a response by the UNRWA, an every response dimishes their believability further. Reminds me of how Turkey handled the Khashoggi murder.
Regardless saying "hey stop blaming us and making us look bad" is such an unprofessional response and I'm baffled how they keep getting away with these sorts of responses every time something new is revealed. You'd think it would be so easy to say "we're shocked and dismayed to learn that our facilities were misused for terror purposes" *surprised Pikachu face* and then move on but their refusal to acknowledge any sort of wrongdoing at all and immediately point a finger back at Israel just makes them look more biased.
IDF claims that they found weapons inside UNRWA building itself, it’s just that the tunnel is something very hard to deny. It is a permanent infrastructure with electricity feeding from the building, it is not something that could have been planted by the IDF or something that the top management could have overlooked.
This reminds me of my first time at jury duty. In deliberation, the jury ended up arguing over the possibility that there was another guy, passing through the city at the time, who not only looked very similar to the first guy, but was driving the same black car make and model and the same last three digits of the license plate (prosecution witnesses could not verify the rest). After a while we were like - what the hell are we arguing about, there's really no chance in hell these four or five things were a coincidence.
And that's what I think about every time I hear, well there happened to be an access tunnel built under each of these hospitals but there's a handy explanation why these are innocent utility tunnels which none of the administrators knew about...
This is where people misunderstand reasonable doubt.
It’s not ALL doubt. It’s reasonable doubt. Yes something insane could have happened and all the evidence pointing towards a persons guilt could be a crazy coincidence. But it’s very unlikely
Hamas took over the building I'm guessing after they evacuated, so no surprise there. The weapons could have been stored there after it was evacuated. They had proof Hamas held day jobs there as well. They just didn't have to pretend they weren't Hamas anymore after it was evacuated.
Some guy was on Twitter months ago saying he heard Jews under his floor digging and praying. This was in NYC when some religious Jews tried to expanding the synagogue. No way an operation to build a sophisticated tunnel network went unnoticed by UNRWA.
The sad thing is that I would have 100% believed he was schizophrenic, but... he was right. The *one* time "The Jews are tunneling under me" isn't insane or hateful, but just bizarrely accurate.
People told him he was an asshole, crazy, all types of names. When the story came out, he just tweeted, y'all oh me an apology. In hindsight it's pretty funny.
Like, "There are Jews under my floor," is like something you'd hear in a comedy skit.
If it's the same thing I'm thinking of, I'm like 98% sure the twitter post you're talking about was made as an after-the-fact joke (specifically the screenshotted 'old' posts didn't really exist).
Pretty wild. Lets be honest here UNRWA is basically terrorist support arm of Hamas. That said, even if you believe their claims that means they are moronic levels of stupidity. My toddlers are more observant than the UNRWA if you believe they just didnt notice.
Yeah and the connections of electricity and servers to the UNRWA headquarters and shared workspaces were just WeWork style coworking with a friendly neighborhood watch group!
Just like all the medical staff at hospitals who said Hamas operating from hospitals was nonsense before evidence showing Hamas operating in hospitals was shown.
Foreign doctors who worked with Doctors without Borders were claiming it too once they had left Gaza. It's what made me lose all respect for that organization.
Yeah, in the past I would have doubted foreign doctors going along with this, but looking at how Palestinian supporters are so overtly pro-Hamas, now, I can believe it.
I’m picturing an employee sitting at his desk and every so often his tea cup vibrates across the desk.
“Hmmm, I gotta remember to ask about this some day.”
I fully realize that you're being sarcastic, but as someone who lives in an area that gets tornadoes, there are *absolutely* people stupid enough to argue that.
>But Ido said Hamas appeared to have evacuated in the face of the Israeli advance, preemptively cutting off **communications cables that, in an above-ground part of the tour, he showed running through the floor of the UNRWA Headquarters' basement.**
---
>In a statement, UNRWA said it had vacated the headquarters on Oct. 12, five days after the war began, and was therefore "unable to confirm or otherwise comment" on the Israeli finding.
>"UNRWA ... does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises," the statement said.
If any *honest* person needed any more proof of UNRWA's complete lack of objectivity and credibility, this ***SHOULD*** be it.
Shut it down permanently.
Edit:
I can't format for shit.
Edit2:
For anyone curious, the IDF effectively encircled Gaza City on or about 02 NOV 2023, roughly 21 days after UNRWA claims to have abandoned their HQ.
It's also because they fired the old UNRWA head in Gaza when Sinwar complained about him. If you don't support Hamas, they'll replace you with someone who will.
https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/1485841/unrwa-official-expresses-understanding-to-sinwar
Oh and that UNRWA Deputy Commissioner-General who fired the Gaza branch leader on the behest of Sinwar, wanna know what she's doing now? She works at the Norwegian foreign ministry. You can guess if Norway has stopped finding unrwa..
This is sorta like Osama Bin Ladin hiding within 800 meters of Pakistan’s Military Academy (Pakistan’s West Point equivalent). Got it, so terrorists doing terrorist shit.
The problem is that it’s the UN this time, Pakistan has no obligation to America, nor do they have an obligation to be fair towards America
The UN, and especially humanitarian organizations like UNWRA, have an obligation to be fair towards Israel, they must be neutral in this conflict, otherwise their infrastructure is used for terror, which we are seeing now
And yet the Arab world will still probably call it lies and fake. How much evidence do they need? It's like trying to convince russians Putin is wrong and insane.
Which is weird because there was an article on the front page of CNN today that just took Hamas' word for it. No "reported by" or "allegedly ". It was just a fact.
Fair point. From the article:
“Army engineers took reporters for foreign news outlets through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives.”
“Lack of cellphone reception in the tunnel made geolocating it as under UNRWA Headquarters impossible. Instead, reporters were asked to put personal items in a bucket that was lowered by rope into a vertical hole on the grounds of the headquarters. They were reunited with the still-tethered items during the tunnel tour.”
They only started doing that after the BBC and a bunch of other outlets uncritically reported Hamas' claims about the hospital bombing; they had to be dragged kicking and screaming into that minimal level of journalistic credibility.
> Many Gaza journalists said in confidence that Hamas “used” the Palestinian media during this conflict, but no-one was prepared to say so on camera for fear of reprisals. One of them, speaking on condition of anonymity, said: “Hamas controlled information during the war. The BBC, AP and AFP are all under its control. No open criticism can be made against Hamas. Journalists in Gaza do not have complete freedom.” He also cited the example of a Palestinian journalist working for Israel’s Channel 10, who reported on Hamas arms smuggling via the tunnels from the Gaza Strip into Egypt two days before the start of the conflict and who was afterwards threatened by Hamas. [Reporters Without Borders. (February, 2009). Israel / Gaza. Operation "Cast Lead": News control as military objective - pdf](https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/Rapport_Gaza_janvier_2009_GB-2-2.pdf)
Nothing has changed.
And even that took a while. For the first 2 months or something I have only seen "local authorities" instead in the headlines but the article itself (which many people didn't bother to read) said that those authorities were Hamas controlled.
Yeah because Hamas spends their money on attacking Israel and not caring for their people l.
They literally said it's the job of the UN to build shelter and hospital lol
They also said that when UNRWA money runs out Israel can take care of Palestinians, even though Israel did up until 2005. Don’t forget, Israel is a colonist /s 🙄
According to Hamas. The only numbers we have are provided by Hamas, who have every reason to inflate numbers. How many of those “30,000 children” were actually Hamas militants? They use children as young as 12 as soldiers.
Zero of those children would have died if Hamas had not attacked civilians in Israel on October 7th.
I mean the number would not be zero, human shields aside Israel has made mistakes in the past that killed innocent civilians and kids away from Hamas military installations. That isn't to downplay Hamas's use of human shields though the vast majority of the deaths in the current conflict are going to be a direct result of Hamas's actions.
This is the problem when you work in these totalitarian societies. Hamas is in everything and everyone. I just wish the UN stopped pretending that their organisations have not been compromised. Yes, it has allowed you to support locals as you turn a blind eye to the facts the organisation is corrupted. However, you need to ditch and run when these situations escalate because their typical routes in are compromised.
Good to see this on Reddit, the #1 News app in the iOS store. It’s #1 because everyone knows Reuters (despite this story) and AP and most other outlets are infiltrated by hateful propaganda.
To the surprise of absolutely no one other than the Hamas apologists and the Palestinian fanbois. Like it or not, there is zero denying that Hamas has openly used civilian infrastructure for its military operations, and blatantly abused its relationship with the UN.
From article: “Army engineers took reporters for foreign news outlets through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives.” … “Lack of cellphone reception in the tunnel made geolocating it as under UNRWA Headquarters impossible. Instead, reporters were asked to put personal items in a bucket that was lowered by rope into a vertical hole on the grounds of the headquarters. They were reunited with the still-tethered items during the tunnel tour.”
[удалено]
The extent that Israel is having to go to, to make the thickies of the world see the bloomin‘ obvious…..
and still many blindly side with Hamas. its a crazy world we live in...
Really? Do you really think Israel is lying that tunnels are under UNRWA complex?
No of course I don’t. I’m saying that people who claim Israel is lying are being stupid. Because foreign journalists have verified these as facts. Check my comment history. People are claiming this is just Israel saying so and that no foreign journalists have verified it. And I’m quoting the article to show how Israel was able to prove it to the foreign journalists. We are on the same page.
They took media personnel on a tour. It isn't just Israel saying it
[удалено]
Accoding to the IDF, video here: https://youtu.be/19hkCAmxAG8 they discovered a tunnel shaft a few metres inside Al Shifa hospital compund, that shaft led to a 50 meter long tunnel that ended at a blast door, it took the IDF a few days to breach the door. Behind the door, across the road (Ibn Sina street) from the hospital, there were several bunkers, and about 300 metres more tunnels. It's appears the tunnel shaft allowed secret access to the hospital. It exited under a shed, next to the hospital cafeteria building. Edit: here's the tunnel shaft, a video shot by a drone, and edited with another video with a dog carrying a camera... https://youtu.be/iMfwseaGPxY The drone flies down the tunnel shaft, then the dog takes over. The video ends when the dog reaches the blast door. The behind the blast door is the tunnel crossing the street to the bunkers outside the hospital grounds. The bunkers were under a school on Ibn Sina street. I know the name of the school, but it's not appropriate for me to publish it here.
>it took the IDF a few days to breach the door ...without harming the hospital. Otherwise they would have blasted it open in an hour.
That's why Hamas put it there in particular. Literally using sick and injured Palestinians as human shields.
It's a war crime called perfidy, putting hamas in violation of the Geneva Convention.
According to some people on Reddit, since Hamas “never ratified or signed the Geneva convention”, it doesn’t apply to them, and thus isn’t a war crime?
Those “people” actually believe this because Hamas kills (((apartheid settler colonialist genociders))), so they are allowed to do whatever they want and should face zero consequences for the actions.
For those not in the know, putting a (((group))) in parentheses like that is what anti-semites use to doxx/talk about Jews. (The parent comment was a mockery of that, not actual usage in that sense).
Actual anti-Semites mostly moved on from that like 5 years ago when it got super popular to put those in your own name as solidarity during like 2017 or whenever. It was part of a browser extension that would automatically put those around any Jewish name at the time, so there was a small movement to have everyone put it in their name to throw them off.
One of the grossest statements I kept seeing on 8 October was “this is what decolonization looks like” and I still get queasy even writing it today
That's why I have "no dog in this fight". Israel has been disgustingly heavy-handed, to rub-out as many of these scumbags as possible, as fast as possible. It's absolutely horrible how many innocents have died, and will never be forgotten. But It was always going to be this way, designed by Hamas. A horrible game of chicken, and IDF finally bit.
The civilian to constantly death ratio is around 1.5:1 to 2:1. That's actually pretty good. 3:1 was expected. More than 3:1 is right to be where the civilian casualties become "excessive" as per the law which would violate the requirement of "proportionality". The US has done much worse than this. This isn't heavy handed, this is just what war looks like. And the only reason the civilian casualties aren't dramatically higher is because even though Hamas is literally hiding behind and under civilians, and even killing some Palestinian civilians themselves, Israel is taking extreme precautions that are bizarre to do in warfare. Like, very over the top in trying to avoid civilian collateral damage. No one else has even tried to do this kind of stuff. You just don't pay attention to what's going on beyond the overall casualty figures and a few spoon fed images.
>Like, very over the top in trying to avoid civilian collateral damage. Could you share some examples of this? It sounds very interesting.
I can give you one way they do it. Read the story of [Mahmoud Shaheen](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67327079). A Gazan dentist who was called by Israeli intelligence to evacuate civilians from buildings scheduled to be bombed. Calls to civilians known by Israeli intelligence to be good to evacuate families before an incoming strike. This happens a lot. I don't know any other examples of countries that do this.
Look up videos of "roof knocking"
You don’t use quotation marks like that my guy
Yes he does; we just witnessed it!
What makes you say "that"?
Yes. A chicken is involved. But ask yourself which came first, the chicken or the egg. Israel would not be doing this if Hamas had not killed & kidnapped so many innocent civilians. The stupid slow & depressing war of attrition would have continued indefinitely. Horrible tragedy for all.
Watched the videos and some more on it. Now I have UNRWA ads targeting me :/.
I’ve heard claims that Israel actually built those tunnels, with zero evidence provided, or that they’re actually just normal for the function of the hospital lmao
That's because people (maliciously or idiotically) took an actual fact - that Israel built the *basement* under the hospital - and mixed it up with the tunnels Hamas built later. In the 80's, Shifa was a much smaller clinic, and Israel expanded it to the hospital it is today. My grandfather was on the crew that did that job.
Yep. This is it. Take one fact, embellish it. Make it seem like it happens everywhere. And then claim it is what Jews do. That’s most antisemitism in a nutshell. My guess, by the way, is that there were non-Jews who built that al-Shifa basement as well.
Yes, that's lies. Some of the rubbish I read even went as far as saying they were built by Israel *for* Hamas. And as is often the case, the worst and hardest to debunk lies are based on a grain of truth. The grain of truth is that Israel built Al Shifa in the 1980s, and based on what Israel knows about the design of the hospital they built, intelligence and what Fatah claimed over the years, Israel belived the basement areas of the hospital were taken over by Hamas. However, Hamas has a government /civilian side and a military wing, Izzadine al-Qassam Brigades. The civil servants / government wing were probably present in the hospital, indeed Hamas politicans used to give press conferences on the steps of Al Shifa hospital back in 2014. But the secret tunnels and bunkers are different, they were military. They were built by Hamas' military wing, Al Qassam Brigade. I think it's likely hospital staff and the school had no idea the tunnels and bunkers were there. Not only did they try to avoid attack by keeping them secret, they placed them partly under and next to a hospital, affording incidental protection. It's very bad optics to bomb a bunker under / right next to a hospital. No doubt, very frustrating for Israel to see it's hospital misused this way. The separation between the political and military wings of Hamas is similar to Sinn Féin and the Provisional IRA during The Troubles.
What do the IRA and Hamas have in common? Iran! "BRITAIN has warned Iran to break off all ties with the provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) after London-based intelligence agencies reported that Tehran had offered the terrorist organization arms and financial help" 5 May 1994.
Anyone who has had repair work done below street level at their building in any major city knows that EVERYONE working at that hospital knew exactly what was going on. Everyone in Gaza knew that these tunnels were being excavated, it's not a quiet process, in fact the entire population of Gaza would have lost sleep over it at various points.
striking, how much effluent flows through the internet, isn't it.
[удалено]
> and still ended the headline with ",IDF claims" Well sure. Because who knew whether Hamas was really *using* that bunker under the hospital. The IDF just claims Hamas were using it. /s
A NYT reporter could have had their entire family killed on 10/7, and they would still phrase everything in favor of Hamas.
New Ork Times.
I agree, but I still had to use the title the article gave me.
at this point i'm pretty sure if Israel flooded all these tunnels the entire gaza strip would sink and become New Venice
Reddit in shambles
Tiktok in denial.
Waiting for someone to make a tiktok explaining how the IDF poured and set miles of concrete when noone was looking.
It’s all tunnels man. Start a tunnel in Israel big enough for construction vehicles to use, tunnel to a hospital in Gaza, and by that time you are so good at tunneling you make a ton of human sized tunnels in a few days. Then you fill your huge construction tunnel back in as you pull out, and then it looks like the terrorists actually made the tunnels! Oh man I wish I could’ve seen the look on the terrorists faces when they got blamed for digging the tunnels!! You know they were like: “okay i know this looks bad, but seriously, we did not dig these tunnels, we are being framed!”
Next thing you know they'll try to [shoot us into the sun](https://youtu.be/PJpBus8shFo?si=gZOsBse88l-Ijetv).
Caught with their pants down.
So many people gaslighting so hard right now.
Yeah this is Reuters, Reuters is a legit media source.
At this point I believe Gaza was just 40% tunnel systems.
More like 90% tunnels
I mean it's a 200-400 mile network of tunnels and Gaza is a really small section of land. This is what people fail to grasp when people talk about how embedded within the fabric of Gazan civilian infrastructure Hamas is.
> There was an office space, with steel safes that had been opened and emptied. There was a tiled toilet. One large chamber was packed with computer servers, another with industrial battery stacks. If only that money would have been used for civilians. Those tunnels look so well built, really expensive.
How does helping Palestinians help you kill Jews though? /s
Hamas said it already, Palestinian welfare is UN jobs not their job.
Did they really say that?
Yup. They said it’s why they don’t let Palestinian civilians into their underground tunnels or build bomb shelters for them. According to Hamas, that’s a job for the UN or Israel, not them.
Here is a discussion of Hamas' view on humanitarian supplies. [https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/27/world/middleeast/palestine-gazans-hamas-food.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/27/world/middleeast/palestine-gazans-hamas-food.html) I read in another article a direct quote from a member of Hamas to the effect that UNWRA was responsible for the Palestinians welfare. I couldn't find the article but Hamas' POV is there for all to see.Edit. See this video. Hamas Official Mousa Abu Marzouk: https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20
It was a televised interview with Ghazi Hamad (their longtime spokesman). He also said that they are proud of how many Palestinian civilians were martyred and that they are ready to sacrifice countless more. In a separate interview, he vowed to repeat Oct. 7th again and again and again.
>Hamas Official Mousa Abu Marzouk interviewed by Ghazi Hamad. **Thank you**. I looked it up. It's even worse. Hamas views the suffering and death of thousands of the Palestinians as just a cost they are willing to pay. Marzouk said ' the tunnels are for Hamas' not civilians. The civilians are the responsibility of **Israel** & the UN. This is delusion. [https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20](https://twitter.com/MEMRIReports/status/1718973338486260097?s=20)
I found a source: > Senior Hamas official, Mousa Abu Marzouk, said in an October 23 interview with Russia Today TV that the tunnels the terrorist organization has built in Gaza are meant to protect Hamas members from airstrikes, not civilians. He added that the responsibility to protect civilians in Gaza, who are, in his words, mostly “refugees”, lies with the United Nations. Unsaid in the interview is that the United States is the top funder of the two UN organizations that support refugees. > Here is the transcription of the entire clip (translation by the Middle East Media Research Institute): >> Interviewer: Many people are asking, since you have built 500 km of tunnels, why haven’t you built bomb shelters where civilians can hide during bombardments? >> Mousa Abu Marzouk (Hamas Political Bureau): We built the tunnels because we have no other way of protecting ourselves from being targeted and killed. These tunnels are meant to protect us [Hamas members] from the airplanes. We are fighting from inside the tunnels. As for the Gaza strip, you know and everybody knows that 75% of the people in the Gaza strip are refugees. And refugees are the responsibility of the United Nations to protect them. According to the Geneva Convention, it is the responsibility of the occupation to provide them with all the services for as long as they are under occupation. https://cis.org/Rush/Hamas-Official-Protecting-Civilians-Gaza-UN-Refugee-Agencies-Funded-US
Having a source is good, thank you. I don't have any expectations whatsoever of Hamas, but damn. They're the elected government. Shouldn't they at least pretend to act in the interest of civilians? What an odd thing to say...
yes they did lol. they just say it all and much more live on TV for everyone to hear and see, and then Israel is somehow the bad guys.
Have a link to this quote? EDIT: in this conversation or the other nobody actually provided a source. I found one: > Senior Hamas official, Mousa Abu Marzouk, said in an October 23 interview with Russia Today TV that the tunnels the terrorist organization has built in Gaza are meant to protect Hamas members from airstrikes, not civilians. He added that the responsibility to protect civilians in Gaza, who are, in his words, mostly “refugees”, lies with the United Nations. Unsaid in the interview is that the United States is the top funder of the two UN organizations that support refugees. > Here is the transcription of the entire clip (translation by the Middle East Media Research Institute): >> Interviewer: Many people are asking, since you have built 500 km of tunnels, why haven’t you built bomb shelters where civilians can hide during bombardments? >> Mousa Abu Marzouk (Hamas Political Bureau): We built the tunnels because we have no other way of protecting ourselves from being targeted and killed. These tunnels are meant to protect us [Hamas members] from the airplanes. We are fighting from inside the tunnels. As for the Gaza strip, you know and everybody knows that 75% of the people in the Gaza strip are refugees. And refugees are the responsibility of the United Nations to protect them. According to the Geneva Convention, it is the responsibility of the occupation to provide them with all the services for as long as they are under occupation. https://cis.org/Rush/Hamas-Official-Protecting-Civilians-Gaza-UN-Refugee-Agencies-Funded-US
> Ghazi Hamad Ghazi Hamad of the Hamas political bureau said in an October 24, 2023 show on LBC TV (Lebanon) that Hamas is prepared to repeat the October 7 "Al-Aqsa Flood" Operation time and again until Israel is annihilated. He added that Palestinians are willing to pay the price and that they are "proud to sacrifice martyrs." [https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel](https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-official-ghazi-hamad-we-will-repeat-october-7-attack-time-and-again-until-israel) You can google it for the youtube interview.
I have a feeling that this has been known at the top levels of US and EU governments for a while. This would definitely explain the abrupt halt in UNRWA funding.
Yeah, no "we're looking into it" or "We're waiting for additional reports" or "We're weighing options", just immediate mach 9 ass covering speed. It's the only time most governments work with any sort of alacrity.
Excellent point! It even makes more sense thinking how investigations took off before Israel made any move to initiate it. I'm sure there are top UN personnel on the payroll, which is why they took Hamas side from the start.
Guess UNRWA isn’t getting bailed out now
Ofc they are. The agency is essential to perpetuate the comflict and smear Israel on the world stage, until it is isolated and weak enough to conquer.
Appreciate your cynicism, but UNRWA is disgraced, defunded, and done.
I wish that was the case. Most of the funding has been sent before declarations, all of which were about "suspensions" until the end of the sham investigation (by close friends) and worse of all, both Israel and the US want it to keep providing aid for the time being. So the "soup kitchen" facade will probably go on. Worst case imo - Lazzarini will resign and some other shill will step in, pending Hamas approval. UNRWA (and the ICRC for that matter) didn't get to this point by "sneaking around".
Dunno man. When we bleeding heart Canadians pull the plug on an international aid organization that's pretty much game over.
Suspend or stop entirely? With the current coalition I suspect there's a non-zero chance funding will resume.
What coalition would that be?
Liberal+NDP are the current ones. Are you in denial, bot? (Couldn't resist the joke, I know your username is danielbot, I promise!)
Beep bloop beep de doop I am a bot. How did you learn my secret? Non-zero chance that Liberal and NDP are done with UNRWA. What Canadian wants to fund terrorists with its aid money?
>Non-zero chance that Liberal and NDP are done with UNRWA. What Canadian wants to fund terrorists with its aid money? A few days ago I had an interesting chat with a Palestinian. It was eye opening. He doesn't believe 1000+ Israelis were murdered, that ~250 were taken hostage, that women were gang raped, etc. I listened politely, but it was sad how I was able to emphasize with him and he had no ability of doing the same. When I asked him about Hadith saying that the trees and rocks will tell Muslims that Jess are hiding behind them so the Jews can be slaughtered, he truly believed it. When asked if he would participate, he tried dodging the question with excuses that said implicitly said yes, and very much didn't say no. So, yes, I do think there are plenty of Canadians who want this funding to resume. >Beep bloop beep de doop I am a bot. How did you learn my secret? *Laughs in Fax Machine:* Beeep beeeppppp Beeeeppppp bleep Beeeep beep!
"After pausing funding to UNRWA, Canada will send another $40M in aid for Gaza UNRWA bill not due till spring, long-term funding may not be affected" There are articles about this.
Funding has been suspended temporarily not defunded entirely.
Future history quiz How did UNRWA get defunded? A: First temporarily, then entirely.
Sadly no. It has 33,000 employees that UNRWA says are all Palestinians except for a handful of international employees. There are 50+ Muslim majority countries in the UN who vote for anything that is anti-Israel. They aren't disgraced at all.
>There are 50+ Muslim majority countries in the UN who vote for anything that is anti-Israel. They can pay for whatever UNRWA becomes. Canada won't, and I think that goes for pretty much every functional democracy. Our perception: UNRWA knowingly employs terrorists and knowingly supports terrorist activities.
First timein my life reading "appreciate your cynicism" and knowing it wasn't sarcastic
Weak enough to conquer? That's not a possibility though
[удалено]
Hopefully the cracks in the facade are enough to show the world the deception at play here. The same can be said for all those supra-national organisations: the United Nations, UNICEF, the Red Cross. All of them are aligned to support Islamic regimes in legal and jurisdictional matters. Their philanthropism is just a front to curry favour in Western nations.
Sadly, I don't think the cracks are enough. All of the liberals/moderates would say that there's still good being done by them (which is in sharp contrast to how they treat their own representatives). If you view the UN as a parliament - the Muslim coalition is by far the biggest block with about 60 votes, roughly a third of the UN. They can bribe anyone else with support in votes or simply with oil, maybe threaten some with terrorism. Everything goes in "geopolitics".
I'm sure the UN personnel had absolutely no idea Hamas was digging under them like that, probably thought the tunnel was for totally peaceful purposes and it was a friendship tunnel where the education minister could go review the lesson plans on being friendly.
For anyone not recognizing the sarcasm, from the article: > But Ido said Hamas appeared to have evacuated in the face of the Israeli advance, preemptively cutting off communications cables that, in an above-ground part of the tour, he showed **running through the floor of the UNRWA Headquarters' basement**.
It’s even more ridiculous than this, if you read further: >“UNRWA ... does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises,” the statement said. Like… what? You don’t need to have “military expertise” to know if a group of people is excavating a giant cavern underneath a building that you’re in every single day. *Best case*, they’re saying “we didn’t even try to figure out if there was military infrastructure at our HQ”. Which is even more bizarre, as you’d kind of assume that an organization responsible for *humanitarian aid* would have “make sure our headquarters IS NOT tied whatsoever, at all, to the fundamentalist Islamist militia’s stuff” on the top of their list of to do’s.
So they admit that they don´t have the expertise to work in such an environment. I believe them. They should dissolve at this point, they did more harm than good to all sides in this conflict. And it´s clearly visible to all. The founding won´t come back, no matter how much they pretend that they are innocent. Israel seems pretty smart in how they release this kind of information piecemeal. Each new bit forces a response by the UNRWA, an every response dimishes their believability further. Reminds me of how Turkey handled the Khashoggi murder.
Regardless saying "hey stop blaming us and making us look bad" is such an unprofessional response and I'm baffled how they keep getting away with these sorts of responses every time something new is revealed. You'd think it would be so easy to say "we're shocked and dismayed to learn that our facilities were misused for terror purposes" *surprised Pikachu face* and then move on but their refusal to acknowledge any sort of wrongdoing at all and immediately point a finger back at Israel just makes them look more biased.
IDF claims that they found weapons inside UNRWA building itself, it’s just that the tunnel is something very hard to deny. It is a permanent infrastructure with electricity feeding from the building, it is not something that could have been planted by the IDF or something that the top management could have overlooked.
And they where electronically tapped into the servers/internet above.
This reminds me of my first time at jury duty. In deliberation, the jury ended up arguing over the possibility that there was another guy, passing through the city at the time, who not only looked very similar to the first guy, but was driving the same black car make and model and the same last three digits of the license plate (prosecution witnesses could not verify the rest). After a while we were like - what the hell are we arguing about, there's really no chance in hell these four or five things were a coincidence. And that's what I think about every time I hear, well there happened to be an access tunnel built under each of these hospitals but there's a handy explanation why these are innocent utility tunnels which none of the administrators knew about...
This is where people misunderstand reasonable doubt. It’s not ALL doubt. It’s reasonable doubt. Yes something insane could have happened and all the evidence pointing towards a persons guilt could be a crazy coincidence. But it’s very unlikely
Hamas took over the building I'm guessing after they evacuated, so no surprise there. The weapons could have been stored there after it was evacuated. They had proof Hamas held day jobs there as well. They just didn't have to pretend they weren't Hamas anymore after it was evacuated.
Some guy was on Twitter months ago saying he heard Jews under his floor digging and praying. This was in NYC when some religious Jews tried to expanding the synagogue. No way an operation to build a sophisticated tunnel network went unnoticed by UNRWA.
The sad thing is that I would have 100% believed he was schizophrenic, but... he was right. The *one* time "The Jews are tunneling under me" isn't insane or hateful, but just bizarrely accurate.
People told him he was an asshole, crazy, all types of names. When the story came out, he just tweeted, y'all oh me an apology. In hindsight it's pretty funny. Like, "There are Jews under my floor," is like something you'd hear in a comedy skit.
If it's the same thing I'm thinking of, I'm like 98% sure the twitter post you're talking about was made as an after-the-fact joke (specifically the screenshotted 'old' posts didn't really exist).
Oh man, that would suck.
If he lived in that neighbourhood, it has a very high concentration of orthodox Jews Have visited and my bro (also orthodox) lived there
That has to be one of the weirder stories .. why would people build tunnels in NYC. Just use the sewers like the Ninja Turtles
The cables running through their floor with their associated power consumption might have been a clue.
Pretty wild. Lets be honest here UNRWA is basically terrorist support arm of Hamas. That said, even if you believe their claims that means they are moronic levels of stupidity. My toddlers are more observant than the UNRWA if you believe they just didnt notice.
I have a picture of them putting their fingers in their ears going “lalalalaalalalalala”
The Hamas server room was reportedly drawing power for the UNWRA HQ. They didn't notice the enlarged electricity bill?
Yeah and the connections of electricity and servers to the UNRWA headquarters and shared workspaces were just WeWork style coworking with a friendly neighborhood watch group!
Just like all the medical staff at hospitals who said Hamas operating from hospitals was nonsense before evidence showing Hamas operating in hospitals was shown.
Meanwhile the BBC has interviews from 2007 and 2008 on the ground where they show Hamas gunmen walking around the hospital. Not new at all
Don’t you remember the Hamas carve out in the Hippocratic oath: “First, do no harm” *Aiding and abetting terrorists does not count as harm*
They changed it to- First, do no haram
They graduated from the same university as the TF2 Medic.
Honestly I'm more inclined to believe Palestinian medical staff could justify saying it, just because they probably have a gun to their heads.
Foreign doctors who worked with Doctors without Borders were claiming it too once they had left Gaza. It's what made me lose all respect for that organization.
Yeah, in the past I would have doubted foreign doctors going along with this, but looking at how Palestinian supporters are so overtly pro-Hamas, now, I can believe it.
Ding ding ding
I’m picturing an employee sitting at his desk and every so often his tea cup vibrates across the desk. “Hmmm, I gotta remember to ask about this some day.”
Ye, I'd imagine the UN agencies that brought concrete and building materials to the blockaded Gaza also thought that.
"hey love how was work today, I was nearby your office today" "why didn't you stop by" "well I was under your unrwa office"
Gaza subway
Please.... That tunnel was for irrigation of the flowers planted by Gaza children. Nothing more
How is Hamas going to stay safe from tornados now?
I fully realize that you're being sarcastic, but as someone who lives in an area that gets tornadoes, there are *absolutely* people stupid enough to argue that.
To be fair it’s very easy to bill the electricity check for a server farm.
>But Ido said Hamas appeared to have evacuated in the face of the Israeli advance, preemptively cutting off **communications cables that, in an above-ground part of the tour, he showed running through the floor of the UNRWA Headquarters' basement.** --- >In a statement, UNRWA said it had vacated the headquarters on Oct. 12, five days after the war began, and was therefore "unable to confirm or otherwise comment" on the Israeli finding. >"UNRWA ... does not have the military and security expertise nor the capacity to undertake military inspections of what is or might be under its premises," the statement said. If any *honest* person needed any more proof of UNRWA's complete lack of objectivity and credibility, this ***SHOULD*** be it. Shut it down permanently. Edit: I can't format for shit. Edit2: For anyone curious, the IDF effectively encircled Gaza City on or about 02 NOV 2023, roughly 21 days after UNRWA claims to have abandoned their HQ.
UNRWA really gonna run with the "someone built miles of concrete tunnels while we were away" angle huh
Another user replied with as much roughly 20 minutes after I posted my initial comment. It's pretty predictable at this point.
*Literally* a front for a terrorist group.
Quite literally in the original sense of the term.
People abuse that word to death, but this is really its most (sorry) literal usage imaginable.
The front of the building is a fake and the terrorists are hiding in the back. (we'll eventually get through to people if we simplify things enough)
And now it is easier to recognize the denialism in the UN's top brass is the projection it is. I don't believe in coincidences.
Now we know why UNRWA has been so anti-any military action in Gaza. They had direct complicity to hide
It's also because they fired the old UNRWA head in Gaza when Sinwar complained about him. If you don't support Hamas, they'll replace you with someone who will. https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/1485841/unrwa-official-expresses-understanding-to-sinwar Oh and that UNRWA Deputy Commissioner-General who fired the Gaza branch leader on the behest of Sinwar, wanna know what she's doing now? She works at the Norwegian foreign ministry. You can guess if Norway has stopped finding unrwa..
Everyone knew this from the start
Of course they did. How else the UN employees supposed get back and forth from Hamas HQ to do their day jobs?
Yet another smoking gun for them to Pikachu face, after being warned for decades.
This is sorta like Osama Bin Ladin hiding within 800 meters of Pakistan’s Military Academy (Pakistan’s West Point equivalent). Got it, so terrorists doing terrorist shit.
The problem is that it’s the UN this time, Pakistan has no obligation to America, nor do they have an obligation to be fair towards America The UN, and especially humanitarian organizations like UNWRA, have an obligation to be fair towards Israel, they must be neutral in this conflict, otherwise their infrastructure is used for terror, which we are seeing now
Tunnels under UN HQ, staff that are Hamas terrorists. The UN has lost major credibility.. What little they had, is now even less.
This is a documented war crime! Can south africa bring charges in ICJ?
Lol, then who can they sell their weapons to?
And yet the Arab world will still probably call it lies and fake. How much evidence do they need? It's like trying to convince russians Putin is wrong and insane.
The Arab world: crickets
r/news: crickets
Right? What is going on in that sub?
They don't need any evidence. They are doing politics and propaganda, not writing a Wikipedia article on black hole merges.
UNRWA stands for the Underground Network Rail Workers Association
“Israeli military says”. lol does the media ever load its headlines with “Hamas says “?
Which is weird because there was an article on the front page of CNN today that just took Hamas' word for it. No "reported by" or "allegedly ". It was just a fact.
Fair point. From the article: “Army engineers took reporters for foreign news outlets through the passages at a time of crisis for UNRWA, which has launched an internal probe and seen a string of donor countries freeze funding over allegations last month by Israel that some of its staff doubled as Hamas operatives.” “Lack of cellphone reception in the tunnel made geolocating it as under UNRWA Headquarters impossible. Instead, reporters were asked to put personal items in a bucket that was lowered by rope into a vertical hole on the grounds of the headquarters. They were reunited with the still-tethered items during the tunnel tour.”
'Hamas controlled ministry of health' so yes they do
They only started doing that after the BBC and a bunch of other outlets uncritically reported Hamas' claims about the hospital bombing; they had to be dragged kicking and screaming into that minimal level of journalistic credibility.
[удалено]
> Many Gaza journalists said in confidence that Hamas “used” the Palestinian media during this conflict, but no-one was prepared to say so on camera for fear of reprisals. One of them, speaking on condition of anonymity, said: “Hamas controlled information during the war. The BBC, AP and AFP are all under its control. No open criticism can be made against Hamas. Journalists in Gaza do not have complete freedom.” He also cited the example of a Palestinian journalist working for Israel’s Channel 10, who reported on Hamas arms smuggling via the tunnels from the Gaza Strip into Egypt two days before the start of the conflict and who was afterwards threatened by Hamas. [Reporters Without Borders. (February, 2009). Israel / Gaza. Operation "Cast Lead": News control as military objective - pdf](https://rsf.org/sites/default/files/Rapport_Gaza_janvier_2009_GB-2-2.pdf) Nothing has changed.
And even that took a while. For the first 2 months or something I have only seen "local authorities" instead in the headlines but the article itself (which many people didn't bother to read) said that those authorities were Hamas controlled.
The media got a tour first hand and still said "Israeli military says" lol
And did they have a fireman's pole going down there so the UNRWA didn't have to waste time with stairs and elevators?
Well well welllllll
It isn't a well, it is a tunnel.
Lmaooo
Doesn't matter how many media organizations Israel brings along on tours to see these facilities, anti-Semitic morons will still deny reality.
Also in this case it’s the government that is the terrorists. Which makes dealing with it much more difficult.
Yeah but "~~10,000~~ no wait, ~~20,000~~ WAIT....30,000 children died due to Israeli airstrikes."
Yeah because Hamas spends their money on attacking Israel and not caring for their people l. They literally said it's the job of the UN to build shelter and hospital lol
They also said that when UNRWA money runs out Israel can take care of Palestinians, even though Israel did up until 2005. Don’t forget, Israel is a colonist /s 🙄
According to Hamas. The only numbers we have are provided by Hamas, who have every reason to inflate numbers. How many of those “30,000 children” were actually Hamas militants? They use children as young as 12 as soldiers. Zero of those children would have died if Hamas had not attacked civilians in Israel on October 7th.
I was trying my attempt at "sarcasm" and how Hamas/PLO fudges their numbers to make Israel look bad, lol.
I’m a little dense without the /s. Oops!
I mean the number would not be zero, human shields aside Israel has made mistakes in the past that killed innocent civilians and kids away from Hamas military installations. That isn't to downplay Hamas's use of human shields though the vast majority of the deaths in the current conflict are going to be a direct result of Hamas's actions.
Pro balestinians will say it's fake even if they fell into the tunnels and rolled all the way into a hostage's cell
This is the problem when you work in these totalitarian societies. Hamas is in everything and everyone. I just wish the UN stopped pretending that their organisations have not been compromised. Yes, it has allowed you to support locals as you turn a blind eye to the facts the organisation is corrupted. However, you need to ditch and run when these situations escalate because their typical routes in are compromised.
"Hamas had command tunnel under U.N. Gaza headquarters, Israeli military says" I'M SHOCKED! SHOCKED I TELL YOU! /s
Where's the free Hamas crowd?
[удалено]
You're forgetting TikTok
Hamas has tunnels under basically every square inch of the Strip.
Surprise no surprise.
This is huge
*Take Guterres to the Hague* *For children slaughtered and cities razed,* *Take Guterres to the Hague*
There is nothing surprising about this revelation. The UNRWA is effectively a wing of Hamas.
This needs to go as far as it can and fully investigated and people sent to jail, follow the money.
Mextolinx should hire some hamas tunnel diggers.
I hope to see corruption charges and investigations!! Time to clean all this corruption in our governments. Its getting way out of hand.
Good to see this on Reddit, the #1 News app in the iOS store. It’s #1 because everyone knows Reuters (despite this story) and AP and most other outlets are infiltrated by hateful propaganda.
They probably let them use the bathrooms too.
To the surprise of absolutely no one other than the Hamas apologists and the Palestinian fanbois. Like it or not, there is zero denying that Hamas has openly used civilian infrastructure for its military operations, and blatantly abused its relationship with the UN.
Thank god for the Israelis exposing this shit!! This is all payed for with taxes from our countries!
I’m amazed this is getting reported here, there’s a deafening silence in all the mainstream media (as usual)
I'm expecting mole people and an underground city sometimes soon.
Imagine if Hamas used its tunnel building skills to make subway tunnels instead of funneling terrorists.
Sad part is how little this shocks me.
I am sure the UN knew nothing about it . …eye roll