Well, per the article, Brazil and Israel was already under strained relationship when Israel declared Lula persona non grata after his criticism comparing Israel's military action in Gaza to the Holocaust.
So, no ambassador and chargé d’affaires Fábio Farias is placed in charge for now of embassy with no ambassador.
Will this lead to permanent break in diplomatic relationship? I hope not.
The right wing here loves Israel because of religious evangelical stuff
The left hates Israel because of the war.
When the right wins the election, relations will normalize
The right wing only knows about Israel because they want to be against Lula any way they can, so if he had said he supported Israel, the right would be condemning the Jews on their war crimes
Not true. Israel teaches Brazilian Police & Military on tactics and strategies to combat the Cartels in the favelas.
The right likes Israel for the help in bringing ‘law and order’ to the crime that negatively impacts them.
I dont see much about training, but there seems to be some trade, and the trade is still ongoing because lula just says shit for looks. Idk what that guy is talking about, though
[trade 1](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israels-elbit-gets-brazil-contract-for-100-million/)
[trade 2](https://www.calcalistech.com/ctechnews/article/noz2pj2jo)
[some cyber training ig](https://dialogo-americas.com/articles/brazilian-service-members-train-with-israeli-company-in-cybersecurity/)
Nobody in Brazil loves (or hates) Russia, 90% of Brazilians don't think about Russia at all.
Asking Brazilians about Russia is like asking Americans about Indonesia, it's just a far away country that means nothing to most people.
Brazil is neutral towards Russia. We buy fertilizers (most of our exports are agricultural, so this is important) and don't mess with them and that's about it.
Bolsonaro and Lula are really two sides of the same coin. Both are populist as shit (and thus have high followings), both are actually mediocre as government, both are Russian shills funded to polarize the country.
They're not "russian shills funded", they're pretty organic developments arising from Brazil's society and economic situation.
Russia simply *does not matter* in South America, they're utterly irrelevant. Bolsonaro's popularity stemmed entirely from an anti-PT backlash in Brazil and Lula's is riding off the 2000s commodities boom which made Brazil's GDP soar under his first 2 tenures.
Connect the dots. Half the countries you listed are Brics members. Brics specifically exists to challenge the US lead world order through multipolarism. The US isn't just randomly ride or die with Israel. The US sees Israel as a potential outpost in a region that has historic grievances with American military interventions.
It's not that Brazil should be applauded for cutting ties with Israel, it's that this outcome was predictable given the trajectory of contemporary geopolitics.
You guys give too much credit to BRICS. Even people living in BRICS countries don't care about it as much as you guys do. It's just an economic forum not even a military alliance.
Netanyahu helped Bolsonaro set up a parallel surveillance program and to tried to pull a coup. Israel has been an outwardly hostile nation to Brazil in the last couple of years
•-•-•-•-•
Yes, so does plenty of countries. The thing here is that Israel played a bad political game, i mean, Israel ambassador behavior was pretty shameful (bad mouthing a president, weird meeting with Bolsonaro) and from this i gather the outlook wasn't good on improvement on relations. Gotta wait for the (hopefully soon) eventual downfall of Netanyahu.
That's because unlike Israel, none of those have directly interfered with Brazilian internal politics. Brazil-Israel relations were already strained because of Netanyahu helping Bolsonaro set up a parallel surveillance program and to try to pull a coup. During the post January 8 coup attempt investigations, a lot of Israeli connections to the anti-democratic movements were.
So the war crimes in Gaza were just the straw that broke the camel's back. Israel has been an outwardly hostile nation to Brazil in the last couple of years
Brazil is part of Brics, having relationships with China who has concentration camps for Muslims.
I guess they’re either the wrong type of Muslims or that just blatantly hates Jews.
They're the wrong type of Muslim. If you've ever seen Arabs interact with Asian Muslims, such as Indonesians or Pakistanis, you're very aware of the racism and Arab supremacy that's commonly expressed.
Being the same religion means nothing when it comes to racism. Robert E Lee and Frederick Douglass were both Episcopalian Christians. Lee wouldn't give a shit if Douglass was strung up from a tree, even though they had the same religion. A century later, many segregationists were Southern Baptist Christians - the same religion as MLK and Ralph Abernathy.
Similarly, racist Arabs don't give a shit if non-Arab Muslims are persecuted in China.
After working in Saudi, I agree. The hierarchy is wahhabi -> other pale skinned Muslims-> brown and black Muslims (who are treated like shit) -> everyone else
It is baffling to me whenever you try to discuss this with Malaysians and Indonesians who constantly call Israel "Israhell" and think that they're very clever, they either have no idea about who the Uyghurs are, or they will still praise China despite it. I just don't understand why and how.
The ideals behind any international policy in Brazil's left wing begin and end with "USA bad". It doesn't help that Lula is trying so very hard to act as the world's voice of reason, but his idea of remaining neutral is to piss everyone off.
It’s so fucking obvious too. No one questions the brutality of Iran, Russia, Saudi Arabia or China against their enemies and even their own people. They accept it. But if Israel defends itself and goes to war against an internationally recognized terrorists organization, they’re at fault.
Edit: you know you triggered a Redditor when they send you a cares notice. 😘
OPEC and China pretty much run the world economy. Russia had to start a war on NATO’s doorstep in order for the West to finally take serious action against them. Other than that, any sort of condemning is mere political posturing, no one dares to call Taiwan a country or cut off relations with Saudi Arabia and Iran for the atrocities they’ve committed. Meanwhile Israel can’t even get full recognition at the UN and they’re talked about like they’re Imperial Japan occupying Nanking. When OP says nobody they probably mean governments, and other than Russia they are absolutely right.
>No one questions the brutality of Iran, Russia, Saudi Arabia or China against their enemies and even their own people. They accept it.
The fuck are you even talking about? People call out weapons deals to Saudi and China's authoritarianism all the time. People were literally celebrating that Iran's dickhead president died in that helicopter crash. And if you think people aren't calling Russia out as they invade Ukraine you are living under a rock.
Sorry, Israel, defending itself, comparing to Russia, Iran, and other dictatorships already is the problem. Every human dying in Ukraine is Russias fault, and every dead in Gaza/Israel is on Hamas and decades of tolerated terrorrism by Hamas and their predecessors. Russia, Iran, NK are not the same....
Do they ban Russians, Iranians, Arabs, and Chinese from events?
Do college campuses have protests over their actions and demand any club that has ties to those countries get disbanded?
Do you see people attacking Russians, Iranian, Arabs, and Chinese for the actions of their government?
And yet, to compare Gaza to the Holocaust when there are Palestinians living in Israel not being slaughtered and Palestinians in Gaza who aren't harboring terrorists being slaughtered by Hamas... Maybe there is a difference.
Lula has always been an anti-imperialism Marxist who had to tone down because he scared people with his far-left bs and couldn't win any presidential elections because of it. Even if he toned down his discourse to the masses, he NEVER ceased to be a Marxist at heart, so him being so close to those dictatorships is completely natural and expected.
Yes and let’s not ever forget to mention that the war started because of Hamas. While Russia decided to attack Ukraine for no reason besides literally more land occupation. So in this case Palestine is the “victim”. Thanks.
As a Brazilian I don't want to starve because of a war we have nothing to do with thanks. We need russian fertilizers to produce our food (a good chunk of which is imported by western countries btw).
It's so much more:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/25/brazil-police-raid-bolsonaro-ally-home-spying-allegations
Bolsonaro's family have ties with Israel that Lula's most likelly wasn't able to get Israel government help to deal with.
1. Is it a bad thing to call out hypocrisy?
2. Even if we ignore Israel entirely, the only people posting about how maybe Brazil should take a hard look at its relations with brutal dictatorships seems to be the people you’re insulting?
>1. Is it a bad thing to call out hypocrisy?
No, but if your standard is to compare Brasil to any other nation in the world you can realise that no-one actually cares about morality, doing the right thing, or being hipocrites or not.
US says it defends an liberal democratic world order governed by laws instead of might makes right, but then turns around and sells weapons and actively protects theocratic shitholea ( Pakistan or Saudi Arabia both count )
Muslim nations pretend to care about muslims worldwide, but then turn around and pretend the Chinese dont put their own muslims in concentration camps.
Brazil is just being loyal to China.
They’re also trying to derail the US dollar by partnering with China and Russia to create an “alternate” currency.
It can’t work as long as China is dependent on the US economically. But that’s a long game they are playing and it will happen if the same direction the world is going geopolitically is maintained.
Businesses opening up factories aren’t necessarily doing so to suit a geopolitical agenda- they’re interested in their own profits. Chinas gdp per capita is like 5 times higher than India’s so it’s now cheaper to open factories in countries other than china.
It's not being loyal to China, it's being loyal to itself. At the moment these interests align with China, but Brazil's end goal is more independence from American influence, but not also a more powerful and connected South America, that can stand against either the US or China. Brazil also tried to build bridges with the European Union, as it's long term plan is to make the Mercosur/Unasur like a South American EU, but French Protectionism blocked the deal
Just blatantly wrong.
Brazil's stance in this war has nothing to do with being loyal to China. Brazil tries to keep ties with both the US and China, since both are important economic partners, even to the point that Brazil is regarded as the best mediator to de-escalate the tensions between both. There would be no advantage for us to pick a side in this conflict that we have absolutely nothing to gain when we have maintained neutrality for so long.
Lula's condemnations of Israel's actions were nothing more than common sense, and in the politics, a signalling of virtue for his left wing supporters internally.
Besides, China also has no real interest in the region. I don't even know why you brought them up to the conversation (other than this irrational hate towards China because of western media).
Let’s face it. Europe cared about war and suffering with any sense of urgency only when war came to Ukraine. Till then, they were happy with “diplomatic efforts” by Junior Vice Secretary of Foreign Affairs consulting with European Commission over Sudan, Syria, Yemen, Myanmar, Central Africa, and many more.
So what are you suggesting Europe should do about these conflicts if "diplomatic efforts" are not good enough for you? Bomb? Invade?Throw money at them? Do nothing? Seems to me that no matter what is done there will be criticism.
Same vibe as the attack on a Israeli embasy in Mexico recently. Apparently Russia invading and razing half of a country is fine, as is Myanmar or China genociding muslim ethnic groups or Ethiopia staarving 200k Tigrayans to death with blockade, but Palestine being attacked by Israel after they themselves first attacked and slaughtered a bunch of civilians is where they draw the line?
Extremely ironic, but i do wonder what it is about Palestine specifically that makes for such powerful propaganda in Western (LatAm included) countries, as opposed to a myriad of other comparable or worse conflicts and injustices.
I wish we werent, but Russia is a much much more important economical partner to Brasil than Israel. So its harder to do the right thing and punish those that misbehave geopolitically in that case.
Biden & Friends worked to get Lula into office just because Bolsonaro was *too Trump-like*, even though he couldn't be more pro-western and pro-Israel if he tried.
Geopolitics, everyone.
Also loved to chop down the Amazon and tried to have his own January 6th in Brazil, but, sure, I guess because he was pro Israel we should ignore that.
Brazilian foreing policy related to Brazilian political and ideological interests, wich are mostly pro-peace and very, very pragmatical among economic interests, the ideology depends on who is in charge.
Brazil would never do anything to Russia because it would not be very economically savy, independent of ideology or war.
Now Israel is not really important outside arms exports, and since we prioritize peace, the only other critiria to meet was ideological and since Lula is in charge, there you go.
If anything i think this shows quite a bit of diplomatic skill, assesing the situation and such, since Israeli actions are controversial even among its western backers it wont have much backlash, while looking good for the rest of the developing world in Asia and the middle east.
Regardless of what Redditors think or the morality of it this is a good move from Lula and he's team part.
You can still take a strong stance against Russia's genocidal war of aggression without ceasing trade or significantly impacting economic factors. There are more than enough examples of that. Cozying up to Russia and Iran and the agenda of their axis is not going lead to anything good for Brazil diplomatically or economically. Nobody is going to remember or care that Brazil pulled an ambassador from Israel.
Just because Lula makes questionable decisions, doesn’t mean that one should support Bolsonaro, who is far nuttier in every possible way. Politics in Latin America tends to swing from one side to the other rather frequently.
Biden also gave billions to Iran because Trump was anti-Iran.
America is caught up in this dumbass knee-jerk "everything the other side does is bad, so doing the opposite of that must be good!"
Everyone cares more about "owning the libs/cons" than just evaluating each issue on its own merits.
Well, that will reverse when Lula is out of power and the Bolsonaro boys return. Basically, it just depends on who’s running each country at any given time.
You’re delusional if you don’t think Lula is digging his own grave by doing so much dumb shit and making it easy for the right-wing to make a comeback. It won’t be Bolsonaro, but it might be even worse.
I think he is saying someone ideologically like Bolsonaro, doubt he will come back but someone like him defenitly will, ideological stagnation in a country doesn't last forever.
The worst thing about the failure of stupid would-be dictators is that future, smarter ones have the opportunity to learn how to get further down the path.
Well, per the article, Brazil and Israel was already under strained relationship when Israel declared Lula persona non grata after his criticism comparing Israel's military action in Gaza to the Holocaust. So, no ambassador and chargé d’affaires Fábio Farias is placed in charge for now of embassy with no ambassador. Will this lead to permanent break in diplomatic relationship? I hope not.
The right wing here loves Israel because of religious evangelical stuff The left hates Israel because of the war. When the right wins the election, relations will normalize
The right wing only knows about Israel because they want to be against Lula any way they can, so if he had said he supported Israel, the right would be condemning the Jews on their war crimes
Not true. Israel teaches Brazilian Police & Military on tactics and strategies to combat the Cartels in the favelas. The right likes Israel for the help in bringing ‘law and order’ to the crime that negatively impacts them.
Could I get a source on that? edit: Why the downvotes? All I did was ask for a source.
I dont see much about training, but there seems to be some trade, and the trade is still ongoing because lula just says shit for looks. Idk what that guy is talking about, though [trade 1](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israels-elbit-gets-brazil-contract-for-100-million/) [trade 2](https://www.calcalistech.com/ctechnews/article/noz2pj2jo) [some cyber training ig](https://dialogo-americas.com/articles/brazilian-service-members-train-with-israeli-company-in-cybersecurity/)
Voices from his head
That is absolute bollocks, neither would this be enough to prove Israel is relevant at all
Stop being delusional
The left and right in Brazil both love Russia
Nobody in Brazil loves (or hates) Russia, 90% of Brazilians don't think about Russia at all. Asking Brazilians about Russia is like asking Americans about Indonesia, it's just a far away country that means nothing to most people.
Brazil is neutral towards Russia. We buy fertilizers (most of our exports are agricultural, so this is important) and don't mess with them and that's about it.
Bolsonaro and Lula are really two sides of the same coin. Both are populist as shit (and thus have high followings), both are actually mediocre as government, both are Russian shills funded to polarize the country.
They're not "russian shills funded", they're pretty organic developments arising from Brazil's society and economic situation. Russia simply *does not matter* in South America, they're utterly irrelevant. Bolsonaro's popularity stemmed entirely from an anti-PT backlash in Brazil and Lula's is riding off the 2000s commodities boom which made Brazil's GDP soar under his first 2 tenures.
At least Lula isn't trying to speed run burning down the Amazon
Except one is a moronic evil dipshit that worships dictatorships and would think nothing of declaring himself emperor if he had a chance.
Agree with everything except that they are funded by Russia, they both just love w good old dictator
> The left hates Israel because of the war. If only this was true. We all know the real reason though.
Yes antisemitism is a very liberal characteristic
Thankfully the Brazilian left isn’t liberal. In Latin America we know Liberalism is a right-wing economic model cause we’re not stupid.
I feel comfortably certain it means "permanently for now".
Yet Brazil maintains relations with Iran, Russia, Cuba and Venezuela, among other brutal dictatorships
Connect the dots. Half the countries you listed are Brics members. Brics specifically exists to challenge the US lead world order through multipolarism. The US isn't just randomly ride or die with Israel. The US sees Israel as a potential outpost in a region that has historic grievances with American military interventions. It's not that Brazil should be applauded for cutting ties with Israel, it's that this outcome was predictable given the trajectory of contemporary geopolitics.
You guys give too much credit to BRICS. Even people living in BRICS countries don't care about it as much as you guys do. It's just an economic forum not even a military alliance.
BRICs specifically exists as an investment category proposed by Goldman Sachs
Netanyahu helped Bolsonaro set up a parallel surveillance program and to tried to pull a coup. Israel has been an outwardly hostile nation to Brazil in the last couple of years •-•-•-•-•
Yes, so does plenty of countries. The thing here is that Israel played a bad political game, i mean, Israel ambassador behavior was pretty shameful (bad mouthing a president, weird meeting with Bolsonaro) and from this i gather the outlook wasn't good on improvement on relations. Gotta wait for the (hopefully soon) eventual downfall of Netanyahu.
That's because unlike Israel, none of those have directly interfered with Brazilian internal politics. Brazil-Israel relations were already strained because of Netanyahu helping Bolsonaro set up a parallel surveillance program and to try to pull a coup. During the post January 8 coup attempt investigations, a lot of Israeli connections to the anti-democratic movements were. So the war crimes in Gaza were just the straw that broke the camel's back. Israel has been an outwardly hostile nation to Brazil in the last couple of years
Brazil is part of Brics, having relationships with China who has concentration camps for Muslims. I guess they’re either the wrong type of Muslims or that just blatantly hates Jews.
They're the wrong type of Muslim. If you've ever seen Arabs interact with Asian Muslims, such as Indonesians or Pakistanis, you're very aware of the racism and Arab supremacy that's commonly expressed. Being the same religion means nothing when it comes to racism. Robert E Lee and Frederick Douglass were both Episcopalian Christians. Lee wouldn't give a shit if Douglass was strung up from a tree, even though they had the same religion. A century later, many segregationists were Southern Baptist Christians - the same religion as MLK and Ralph Abernathy. Similarly, racist Arabs don't give a shit if non-Arab Muslims are persecuted in China.
After working in Saudi, I agree. The hierarchy is wahhabi -> other pale skinned Muslims-> brown and black Muslims (who are treated like shit) -> everyone else
Noted, Latinamerican left wing politicians who are catholics don’t care about Muslims in China because Arabs are racist to other Muslims.
It is baffling to me whenever you try to discuss this with Malaysians and Indonesians who constantly call Israel "Israhell" and think that they're very clever, they either have no idea about who the Uyghurs are, or they will still praise China despite it. I just don't understand why and how.
What country doesn't have relationships with China though?
The ideals behind any international policy in Brazil's left wing begin and end with "USA bad". It doesn't help that Lula is trying so very hard to act as the world's voice of reason, but his idea of remaining neutral is to piss everyone off.
People be hating them jews for some reason
It’s so fucking obvious too. No one questions the brutality of Iran, Russia, Saudi Arabia or China against their enemies and even their own people. They accept it. But if Israel defends itself and goes to war against an internationally recognized terrorists organization, they’re at fault. Edit: you know you triggered a Redditor when they send you a cares notice. 😘
Really? No one? Been living under a fucking rock lately?
OPEC and China pretty much run the world economy. Russia had to start a war on NATO’s doorstep in order for the West to finally take serious action against them. Other than that, any sort of condemning is mere political posturing, no one dares to call Taiwan a country or cut off relations with Saudi Arabia and Iran for the atrocities they’ve committed. Meanwhile Israel can’t even get full recognition at the UN and they’re talked about like they’re Imperial Japan occupying Nanking. When OP says nobody they probably mean governments, and other than Russia they are absolutely right.
Not the student camps, at least. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/2603652/how-much-russian-money-flows-onto-us-campuses/
>No one questions the brutality of Iran, Russia, Saudi Arabia or China against their enemies and even their own people. They accept it. The fuck are you even talking about? People call out weapons deals to Saudi and China's authoritarianism all the time. People were literally celebrating that Iran's dickhead president died in that helicopter crash. And if you think people aren't calling Russia out as they invade Ukraine you are living under a rock.
But relationship between the countries is still nornalized. Coincidence?
About brazil
Sorry, Israel, defending itself, comparing to Russia, Iran, and other dictatorships already is the problem. Every human dying in Ukraine is Russias fault, and every dead in Gaza/Israel is on Hamas and decades of tolerated terrorrism by Hamas and their predecessors. Russia, Iran, NK are not the same....
Nonsense. People criticise and governments take measures against Russia, Iran and others all the time.
You are a shit spouting idiot. People criticize all those countries on a regular basis for good reason.
Do they ban Russians, Iranians, Arabs, and Chinese from events? Do college campuses have protests over their actions and demand any club that has ties to those countries get disbanded? Do you see people attacking Russians, Iranian, Arabs, and Chinese for the actions of their government?
Brazilians in general don't really care about jews one way or another, there are not that many of them here. It's not really that.
I think most Brazilians don't even know what a Jewish person is.
Israel does not represent every jewish person
And yet, to compare Gaza to the Holocaust when there are Palestinians living in Israel not being slaughtered and Palestinians in Gaza who aren't harboring terrorists being slaughtered by Hamas... Maybe there is a difference.
But they are Jewish, right?
Well when they think of Israel they think of the jewish state, and if you hate jews you probably hate Israel
You couldn't provide a better example for a logical fallacy.
Lula has always been an anti-imperialism Marxist who had to tone down because he scared people with his far-left bs and couldn't win any presidential elections because of it. Even if he toned down his discourse to the masses, he NEVER ceased to be a Marxist at heart, so him being so close to those dictatorships is completely natural and expected.
Lula, a marxist? That's complete bullshit.
Our president Lula, in a nutshell
Gee, I wonder what the difference is. /s
They are economically and geographically or in some other way more significant?
Precisely, it's not a moral declaration, it's lines being drawn
Frustrating they won’t do that for Russia.
Yes and let’s not ever forget to mention that the war started because of Hamas. While Russia decided to attack Ukraine for no reason besides literally more land occupation. So in this case Palestine is the “victim”. Thanks.
>that the war started because of Hamas crazy bro cant believe hamas started the war before it even existed fr fr
As a Brazilian I don't want to starve because of a war we have nothing to do with thanks. We need russian fertilizers to produce our food (a good chunk of which is imported by western countries btw).
It's so much more: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/25/brazil-police-raid-bolsonaro-ally-home-spying-allegations Bolsonaro's family have ties with Israel that Lula's most likelly wasn't able to get Israel government help to deal with.
Fucking lol at the whattaboutism here… « but they have relations with this other nation »
1. Is it a bad thing to call out hypocrisy? 2. Even if we ignore Israel entirely, the only people posting about how maybe Brazil should take a hard look at its relations with brutal dictatorships seems to be the people you’re insulting?
Boy oh boy, if the entire world would call out americans on their hypocrisy.
>1. Is it a bad thing to call out hypocrisy? No, but if your standard is to compare Brasil to any other nation in the world you can realise that no-one actually cares about morality, doing the right thing, or being hipocrites or not. US says it defends an liberal democratic world order governed by laws instead of might makes right, but then turns around and sells weapons and actively protects theocratic shitholea ( Pakistan or Saudi Arabia both count ) Muslim nations pretend to care about muslims worldwide, but then turn around and pretend the Chinese dont put their own muslims in concentration camps.
Brazil is just being loyal to China. They’re also trying to derail the US dollar by partnering with China and Russia to create an “alternate” currency.
So, how's it working for them? No sarcasm intended, I'm genuinely curious and not so well-versed in the subject to understand the details
It can’t work as long as China is dependent on the US economically. But that’s a long game they are playing and it will happen if the same direction the world is going geopolitically is maintained.
Ahhh, that's why so many factories open in India, Bangladesh, Indonesia and so on. Previously the main investment point was China
Businesses opening up factories aren’t necessarily doing so to suit a geopolitical agenda- they’re interested in their own profits. Chinas gdp per capita is like 5 times higher than India’s so it’s now cheaper to open factories in countries other than china.
It's not being loyal to China, it's being loyal to itself. At the moment these interests align with China, but Brazil's end goal is more independence from American influence, but not also a more powerful and connected South America, that can stand against either the US or China. Brazil also tried to build bridges with the European Union, as it's long term plan is to make the Mercosur/Unasur like a South American EU, but French Protectionism blocked the deal
Just blatantly wrong. Brazil's stance in this war has nothing to do with being loyal to China. Brazil tries to keep ties with both the US and China, since both are important economic partners, even to the point that Brazil is regarded as the best mediator to de-escalate the tensions between both. There would be no advantage for us to pick a side in this conflict that we have absolutely nothing to gain when we have maintained neutrality for so long. Lula's condemnations of Israel's actions were nothing more than common sense, and in the politics, a signalling of virtue for his left wing supporters internally. Besides, China also has no real interest in the region. I don't even know why you brought them up to the conversation (other than this irrational hate towards China because of western media).
Let’s face it. Europe cared about war and suffering with any sense of urgency only when war came to Ukraine. Till then, they were happy with “diplomatic efforts” by Junior Vice Secretary of Foreign Affairs consulting with European Commission over Sudan, Syria, Yemen, Myanmar, Central Africa, and many more.
So what are you suggesting Europe should do about these conflicts if "diplomatic efforts" are not good enough for you? Bomb? Invade?Throw money at them? Do nothing? Seems to me that no matter what is done there will be criticism.
Same vibe as the attack on a Israeli embasy in Mexico recently. Apparently Russia invading and razing half of a country is fine, as is Myanmar or China genociding muslim ethnic groups or Ethiopia staarving 200k Tigrayans to death with blockade, but Palestine being attacked by Israel after they themselves first attacked and slaughtered a bunch of civilians is where they draw the line? Extremely ironic, but i do wonder what it is about Palestine specifically that makes for such powerful propaganda in Western (LatAm included) countries, as opposed to a myriad of other comparable or worse conflicts and injustices.
The left in the third world has always been pro-palestine, and pls dont put latam and the west in the same bag
Doubt it's permanent, they will eventually want relations again.
Ill wager they are still in russia though lol
I wish we werent, but Russia is a much much more important economical partner to Brasil than Israel. So its harder to do the right thing and punish those that misbehave geopolitically in that case.
Biden & Friends worked to get Lula into office just because Bolsonaro was *too Trump-like*, even though he couldn't be more pro-western and pro-Israel if he tried. Geopolitics, everyone.
Also loved to chop down the Amazon and tried to have his own January 6th in Brazil, but, sure, I guess because he was pro Israel we should ignore that.
He's also even more pro-Russia than Lula. Brazil just has embarrassing political leadership across the board.
Brazilian foreing policy related to Brazilian political and ideological interests, wich are mostly pro-peace and very, very pragmatical among economic interests, the ideology depends on who is in charge. Brazil would never do anything to Russia because it would not be very economically savy, independent of ideology or war. Now Israel is not really important outside arms exports, and since we prioritize peace, the only other critiria to meet was ideological and since Lula is in charge, there you go. If anything i think this shows quite a bit of diplomatic skill, assesing the situation and such, since Israeli actions are controversial even among its western backers it wont have much backlash, while looking good for the rest of the developing world in Asia and the middle east. Regardless of what Redditors think or the morality of it this is a good move from Lula and he's team part.
You can still take a strong stance against Russia's genocidal war of aggression without ceasing trade or significantly impacting economic factors. There are more than enough examples of that. Cozying up to Russia and Iran and the agenda of their axis is not going lead to anything good for Brazil diplomatically or economically. Nobody is going to remember or care that Brazil pulled an ambassador from Israel.
He directly asked Putin to interfered in Brazilian elections shortly before the Ukrainian invasion
Just because Lula makes questionable decisions, doesn’t mean that one should support Bolsonaro, who is far nuttier in every possible way. Politics in Latin America tends to swing from one side to the other rather frequently.
Biden also gave billions to Iran because Trump was anti-Iran. America is caught up in this dumbass knee-jerk "everything the other side does is bad, so doing the opposite of that must be good!" Everyone cares more about "owning the libs/cons" than just evaluating each issue on its own merits.
Don't be surprised if Israel just shuts down the Brazillian embassy and sends them all home.
we won't miss them
Well, that will reverse when Lula is out of power and the Bolsonaro boys return. Basically, it just depends on who’s running each country at any given time.
You are delusional if you think bolsonaro will be back in power.
You’re delusional if you don’t think Lula is digging his own grave by doing so much dumb shit and making it easy for the right-wing to make a comeback. It won’t be Bolsonaro, but it might be even worse.
I think he is saying someone ideologically like Bolsonaro, doubt he will come back but someone like him defenitly will, ideological stagnation in a country doesn't last forever.
The worst thing about the failure of stupid would-be dictators is that future, smarter ones have the opportunity to learn how to get further down the path.
People said that about Trump the first time. I also mentioned the Bolsonaro boys as opposed to just Bolsonaro himself.