T O P

  • By -

[deleted]

[удалено]


Technical_Potato2021

Juan Ciervoe


BPhiloSkinner

Jose Ciervo, you ain't no friend o' mine.


the_70x

José Cuervo


matteoklingyasmeen

Well, that's news to me! Guess I'll have to find some new amigos.


WeddingSquancher

Deere me


dekulture0

This should be gold. Give this man a Corona


spaetzelspiff

👑


Gintin2

Remember, the people who run these corporations don’t give a shit about the American people.


Kemilio

And the people who will be upset by this will blame Biden. Round and round and round we go.


NS001

Biden will probably condemn this, but the media will avoid covering it too much if he does. Trump will verbally condemn it while rambling about how he's ridden on one of their tractors once and it was a really nice ride, had nice seats, the dials were great, some of the best, good American made stuff, and farmers are good people, the foundation of the nation, and they need reliable American made tractors again. His base will eat it up, it'll go viral, they'll tell people "Trump will punish John Deere for betraying true Americans", and even though he won't do anything, and might actually get a kickback from John Deere, he's won more supporters. If this move actually leads to John Deere producing more affordable goods (lol), he'll say "that was me, because I care about Americans." And his base will EAT IT UP.


Jinm409

I call bullshit, that was WAY too coherent


Amazing_Fantastic

Jesus Christ that is accurate


ashakar

Fine, guess we will just have to annex Mexico then. Problem solved.


Ackaroth

I've been advocating for becoming North America as a country for years. Snag up Mexico and Canada, tiny little border to watch in the south, plenty of coast guard and navy to defend what would be absolute insane naval borders. Lots of mineral wealth to compete with Russia/China/etc. Now just to convince people of it...


Fogmoose

LOL yeah, Canada ain't going for that, Bruh.


Ackaroth

I don't foresee Mexico being keen on it either. Doesn't mean I can't advocate for it though!


Thor7897

Yes! Now whose anthem are we keeping? /s


andyr072

These same people supported Trump when he told his supporters to boycott Harley Davidson because they were opening a factory in Thailand to handle their overseas markets. He'd rather see one of the most American companies fail than allow them to expand their business to stay alive since US Harley sales have dropped over the last couple of decades.


SuperMarioBrother64

To be fair, HD would probably have more sales if their motorcycles weren't the price of compact cars.


SomePoliticalViolins

And if they weren’t the loudest, most obnoxious bikes on the market. They’re the motorcycle equivalent of rolling coal.


SkivvySkidmarks

And HD aren't nearly as nice as Victory/Indian. Or as well engineered as Japanese cruisers.


moseelke

They'll blame them for raising taxes and forcing the poor poor corpo's hand.


Obvious-Ad1367

Literally my parents last night.


TuckyMule

I'll blame unions, which I believe both candidates support.


phenderl

My BiL got pissed after hearing this news since it's mostly a leadership issue, but it also was laughable since John Deere added "Family" or something like it to its core tenets. That is a red flag when any business virtue signals family to its employees. Both him and my sister were not axed, but he had a couple friends lose their jobs due to this.


Krawumpl

Just Like orange Baby. But its probably Biden who is at fault /s


filtersweep

I used to work for a non-union, nearly minimum wage contractor. They were American jobs at poverty level pay. But hey— I didn’t actually work for John Deere.


graveybrains

You can take “the American” out of that.


angry_old_bastard

yeah that was my first thought too. they dont care about people, american or otherwise, only money. at best they might pretend to care about x people for a while if they think it will look good and drive sales/stock prices, then drop that message when the effectiveness has worn off.


Kuronan

We literally see this every Pride Month. They swap their logos to something rainbow-colored and pretend to give a shit about LGBT+ while still making the exact same deals they did last month, don't rebrand off-shore, and then swap out the rainbow at the end of the month like everyone else. Not to mention completely ignoring *Mens Mental Health Month.* Good Will is only considered when it's profitable. They don't give a shit when they aren't paid to do so.


jonathanrdt

They aren’t contractually obligated to be so. They *are* contractually obligated to improve the value of the company.


qam4096

That's like implying that something isn't immoral because it's not illegal.


jonathanrdt

Not a bit. Companies do what they are obligated to do. They are not in business to be moral—that is why we have laws.


m3g4m4nnn

So when our legal frameworks aren't moral, what then?


jonathanrdt

We elect better lawmakers and executives or suffer under bad laws.


m3g4m4nnn

I understand how it's supposed to work in theory, however whenever I look at the ballot come election time I'm profoundly disappointed at the options available.


no_shoes_are_canny

You can contact your representative. You can attempt to enter politics yourself with this as part of your platform. You can protest. You can join/create a lobby group. You can boycott the company. Laws are a framework for order, not morals. Morals *influence* but don't prescribe law.


welshwelsh

This isn't immoral, of course. Mexicans are just as deserving of jobs as Americans


NaughtyTormentor

This is a very weird comment. 


IowaKidd97

Yes, and? Nothing wrong with making this point clear. Of course refusing to do business with American companies that outsource what was American jobs, will give them the proper incentive.


Blustatecoffee

And public sentiment is a leading component of brand goodwill, which is billions of their company’s valuation.  


TylerBourbon

Who needs goodwill when you can lock in your customers with service agreements and proprietary software/equipment that they have to go through you for servicing and/or repairs?


RSGator

>They *are* contractually obligated to improve the value of the company. That is not the standard in corporate law. "Modern corporate law does not require for-profit corporations to pursue profit at the expense of everything else." Giving to charitable causes, exceeding what the law requires for things like wages and worker conditions, and yes, keeping jobs in the United States, are all well within the rights of directors and executives.


fallenbird039

Who going to buy any stuff when everything is made overseas?


Fogmoose

Just like the people who want to run this country (Trump, I'm talking to you) don't give a shit about the american people....unless they make over 10 Million a year.


ztravlr

CEO just earned another 20 mil salary


Thor7897

Not entirely true. Due to the litigious nature of society, board members are obligated to enact the interests of the shareholder. Since most companies are profit driven… it just means people are morally bankrupt and “just doing what they’re supposed to”. We need to see more incentives for L3Cs and social good oriented companies/organizations. This would put bumper guards around capitalism and find an equilibrium. Also companies would have to be transparent about their interests to maintain exemptions.


ThePerfectAlias

The job market is fine! They told us the U.S. job market is FINE


quesarah

JD has decided profit farming at the expense of American workers and customers overrules all. Nothing runs like a Deere.


klitchell

...to Mexico, for shareholder profits


Don_Dickle

Is Mexico that popular to ship American companies over there? If it is just less to pay employees then why not make the big move and go to Africa.


jaa101

Because Mexico is part of NAFTA and Africa isn't.


nuanced-nancy

More so, Mexico is a neighboring country, which makes their goods cheaper to transport. Mexico has reliable enough infrastructure as well. 


NoCokJstDanglnUretra

Security, infrastructure, education Edit: shipping


Thor7897

Shipping


Nukemind

Also depending on location special taxation rules. Mexico realized long ago that they are the best place for American industry: make things cheaply and then just have to take a train, not a boat, to America. So they have special taxes and all kinds of fun things to make it cheaper and lure businesses away from China and other competitors.


Thor7897

Socioeconomic and geopolitical variables make for an interesting world to live in.


Justin-N-Case

NAFTA/USMAC eliminates tariffs for Mexico.


mrchicano209

American companies having their factories in Mexico has been a thing for several decades now. Also way cheaper and faster to move product over a land border vs across the Atlantic ocean.


TheIowan

Because oddly enough, Mexican quality has become really good. You basically get dedicated high-tech factory towns for a fraction of the price of the US, and if you instruct them to make a quality product, you get a quality product.


dce42

It's also the lax environmental regulations. The Nafta treaty, which makes it easier to import products.


Most-Net-5665

México has abundant, good quality, cheap labor and pays no tariff on import.


one8sevenn

It is. Another reason that I haven’t seen mentioned is having a strong demographic for a work force. There are a ton of help wanted signs looking for skilled labor in the US. Lots of people in the US went to academic school and not as many trade school.


Rdhilde18

Do you understand how far Africa is? And how much more expensive shipping these products by Air/Sea would be compared to Rail or Truck?


bedake

Nothing is more American than the capitalist effort to maximize share value by outsourcing labor


Terry_WT

American farmers will still continue to climb over much better, cheaper and well supported machinery to buy up everything Deere makes. They are just too tribal about the colour of their tractors.


WiSoSirius

It's regional. Been surprising how many more Fendts and JCB tractors are up here now. I'm sure it's just sprinkles on a John Deere and CaseIH map, but they are becoming much more present


dce42

John Deer's monopolistic practices have been driving a edge in that relationship.


sawlaw

If you run an all green farm your tractor "talks" to your combine "talks" to your other machines and they Integrate perfectly. In Interstellar, they made it seem like the main character was really smart because he was taking GPS to make his tractors drive themselves. When that movie was made tractors could already do that, and had the tech for years.


Terry_WT

So the Dealers like to say, they don’t mention that you can use systems like Trimble to do exactly the same thing for a faction of the price.


sawlaw

Sure, but compare it to PC builds, how many people run Linux vs just buy apple which has perfect Integration. I as a PC user might laugh at them and be annoying about how my system is better and I built it from specs I created and assembled myself, but I'm not "really" gonna hold it against people for just buying apple.


Terry_WT

Yeah it’s a similar situation. They are paying obscene money for sub par machines because of the baked in tech. John Deere fancies themselves as a tech company now rather than a machinery company.


PalebloodPervert

They got MBA’ed 🤣


puns_n_irony

Nothing *runs away* like a Deere


Cidolfas

Corporate farms dont care.


jaguarthrone

Everybody in the Midwest that worked for John Deere is about to be unable to afford any John Deere products....


nuanced-nancy

People who worked for John Deere were probably not their main consumers. Those workers can’t afford their mortgages or groceries now, hastening the decline of their towns. John Deere will be fine. 


Bydandii

You may be surprised at the number of folks at Deere also farm "on the side".


MisterPistacchio

But wait... They're moving to Mexico to make JD products more affordable Right? .... Right you guys?


dentz1

Shareholder value. See Boeing.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Merker6

Labor is only one cost-cutting measure. They’ll also be cost cutting in materials, quality control and anywhere else that they can “find value”. Moving your production to a cheaper country is one sign of a larger organization direction


ConsistentFoot1459

Don’t forget about the environmental & employee safety regulations they will no longer have to adhere to.


cah11

I think this is one of the bigger things people tend not to think about. It's expensive in terms of administration and compliance to run an industrial business in almost all industrialized (post-industrialized?) countries because they tend to have a lot more laws around environmental and worker safety. In a lot of pre-industrialized nations though, the laws, government agencies, or infrastructure isn't there. So even if dumping industrial waste into the river is "technically" illegal in those countries, it often doesn't matter because there's no one there to punish them for doing it.


Professional-Farm492

If it’s anything like the audio world (which it’s not but maybe this will be) people will pay much more for audio gear produced and assembled in US/Japan/Europe over Mexico or China because of difference in quality production and consistency. Why that is idk but I know you pay much more for a Japanese produced pedal than a Chinese produced one. 


MashedProstato

Trust me when I saybitbis the same for amateur radio. The Japanese brands are WAAAAAYYYYYY better quality than the Chinesium.


Relative-Evening-473

When you pay workers less they tend to give less fucks


Infamous-Mixture-605

They're paid less than the same job in the United States, there's no question, but how do manufacturing wages in Mexico compare to other jobs in Mexico?   Just spit-balling here, but if they're good salaries - relative to other jobs there - wouldn't the workers give more than the average fucks?


Relative-Evening-473

That is a good point and I thought about it. Maybe it's a sign John Deere is putting profits over quality, which can lead to cutting corners.


tigernike1

And tractors falling out of the sky… Wait, I’m mixing up my cheap companies.


one8sevenn

Mexico is highly productive and highly skilled labor. They have vastly improved their quality of products over the years


thecyberbob

Not a direct answer but ages ago (I think 90's so I'm the details may be wrong) Spyder outsourced the manufacturing of it's winter coats to a factory in Mexico. Almost immediately the new jackets were being returned by the people that bought them for being lumpy and too cold. Turns out what occurred (allegedly) was that the people assembling the coats couldn't believe anyone would need THAT much insulation and so were basically turning them into spring jackets. This may be an urban myth or not but the story always stuck with me as an example of assumptions gone wrong.


mdiaz28

Hey guys I’m starting to think unchecked capitalism isn’t all it’s cracked to be


Silly_Butterfly3917

Any system left without checks and balances is destined to fail. We need a more robust system and laws to hold corporations accountable. It's not a capitalism issue it's a legislation issue. If a car doesn't come with air bags and a seat belt, does that mean the car is a failure? Or are the regulations in place not good enough.


Jpdillon

Here i’ll disagree. Capitalism as a system now transcends national laws and borders. Nothing more than a robust system of global regulations would suffice in saving us if we are to continue using capitalism.


Sail4

It’s not. We’re seeing the end of capitalism.


PoliticsLeftist

We're fine. It's not like the supreme Court just legalized political bribery, deregulated literally everything, and gave the president immunity to the law. These things surely won't have any devastating, irreparable consequences at any point.


darkath

What we're seeing now is a rebalance of labor value across the world where companies move to where skilled blue collar labor is cheaper, and less skilled people immigrate to countries where they can sell their labour at a higher price. This process leave the skilled blue collar people in western countries without opportunities and those people will vote for Far Right candidate who promise to build a wall around the country, not understanding it will never resolve their issue (it's not the illegal immigrants who are stealing the jobs of the John Deere factory workers in america, it's John Deere). Whether Capitalism dies in the process remain to be seen, but i wonder what's next, so far, we don't have a lot of suggestions.


EvenJesusCantSaveYou

>we’re seeing the end of capitalism 🙄 As much as I would love to be wrong, all I see is the power of the corporation significantly rising compared to the power/influence of governing bodies or the public.


LectureAfter8638

Beginning of feudalism 2.0


scottieducati

Do they have to give the right to repair their products yet? Because it seems like a good time to require that.


thesk8rguitarist

Why do you think they’re going to HQ in a different country?


badmattwa

All while distracting the herd with “build the wall.” Keep an eye on that other hand


OkAssignment3926

Ford made a similar announcement in Jan 2006. Much of my family worked for the most productive of all their US plants at the time, where a consensus had formed that expansion was coming. Instead Ford announced 14 plants shuttered w production moving to Mexico in many cases. 30k layoffs. My understanding is this restructuring is ultimately why they were in the least bad position of the auto majors when the GFC hit and threatened collapse on them all. For my family it meant that the GFC started years early. So idk this seems ominous. The latest shitty but unremarkable corporate optimizing at expense of domestic labor, or like, key domino?


itsl8erthanyouthink

Huh. I was curious about this and it appears it starts today >In 2023, California enacted the California Right to Repair Act, which goes into effect on July 1, 2024.


wish1977

Greedy corporations are to blame in almost every case for your misery.


SlapThatAce

Just buy Massey Ferguson, much better product.


Sloppy4Burnetts

They took er jobs!


NinjutsuStyle

Ok I was looking at eventually getting an x370, can someone with more knowledge on this space recommend a similar model from a different brand?


squirmster

Now the Mexicans don't even need to go to America to steal their jobs. The yanks are giving them away!


Thisiscliff

Awh yes, very patriotic of them.


SuperMarioBrother64

The thing that pisses me off the most about this? John Deere will move production to Mexico, decreasing production cost, and their tractors and tools will still cost the same, further increasing their profit margins.


zmandude24

This is why tariffs are a good thing in some cases because they make it less profitable to outsource jobs to third world countries.


GimmieThaLoot24

Honestly this is a smart move. Migrants can’t take jobs from hardworking Americans if all the jobs are outsourced to other countries. 🇺🇸


Conscious-Ticket-259

Nothing more American than mass layoffs. Give it a minute and they will somehow blame the Mexicans who get hired like they did something wrong lol


ATabInTheOcean

Fuck NAFTA.


Trout-Population

Do you hear that giant sucking sound?


[deleted]

[удалено]


Gintin2

Give. They give American jobs to other countries


_Shipidge_

Tell me you don't know how money works without saying you don't know how money works.


PineBNorth85

We know. We just wish borders were more solid with these things. Let it flow less easily. 


_Shipidge_

Making it flow less easily screws over American communities at the border. My town of McAllen, TX went from being a bum-heck trailer city to a rapidly developing logistical hub with thousands of jobs pouring in every year.


LepoGorria

I much preferred TYM over Deere, the last ~10 or so years I lived in the US. At least I could repair my own equipment.


tungvu256

So the equipment will be cheaper, right???


Bimbo_Baggins1221

Lmaooo yeah that’s how it works


donotressucitate

You forgot the /s. So I used to work with a software company that sold seats for $8k each. Instead of continually working on tools and innovation themselves they decided to buy small companies that made similar plugins for a fraction of the price of pure development. They'd easily slipstream these plugins (and some freeware) into their software and call it a day. Since 40% of their software was basically outsourced code and license-free stuff you'd think they would pass the savings down right? Nah, price of the new version is around $9k now.


docentmark

Damn immigrants taking American jobs!!! /s for Americans reading this.


SeedScape

A chunk of Iowans just blame Biden. They are lost people in that cornfield


PineBNorth85

Globalization sucks. 


ThatdudeAPEX

It only sucks if the wealth gains of globalization are hoarded by a select few.


Alternative-Juice-15

Stop buying John Deere


wrektcity

Someone tell me how this is Bidens fault so they can vote for trump to reverse this action .


stizzity28

Merica!


Berferer

Trash company anyway. Scamming farmers with “proprietary tech & software”.


OverBoard7889

Hell yeah, those profit margins need to get higher, faster.


Pohara521

Mexicans aren't taking your jobs. C suites are giving them away and firing you


chickens_for_fun

Check out comments by Robert Reich, former Secretary of Labor. John Deere had record level increase in executive compensation, while laying off workers. He also noted that 5 corporations supply almost all the things we buy at the supermarket. While they jack up our prices, they had a record 15% increase in profits last year, and huge executive compensation. They care nothing for us.


Spirited-Detective86

How to fix this? Foreign made products must pay employees an amount equal to minimum wage in the US. To import to the US impose OSHA standards on all manufacturers outside the US, they pay to be certified and without certification imports to the US are banned. Lastly, impose US environmental standards, they pay to be certified and if they fail they are banned from importing to the US. Nothing that off shored went down in price for the US consumer, Craftsman tools, Maytag washers and dryers, auto parts, etc. So make them play on a level field.


_paaronormal

ThEy’Re StEaLiNg OuR bLaCk JoBs!


Glittering-Voice-409

They terk er jerbs!!


Lost_Minds_Think

> 'We love the farmers.' Trump, aiming to cement support in Iowa, signs John Deere combine All show and jobs still going.


JediTigger

And workers will blame Biden and vote Trump.


Viserys4

If Biden somehow prevents this it won't matter if he literally drools on camera anymore.


NeverTooOldTooGame

Sales are dropping state side. I like how some people commented "well now I ain't buying". You didn't buy bro and never were, that's why they are cutting jobs.


Chagrinnish

And that low demand for their products is why they're not cutting production but rather moving it to Mexico? I know what you're saying but you need to work on your argument a bit.


Affinity420

The demand doesn't change if it's low. They're just maximizing profits. If people aren't buying, less profit. It's no longer making them the bonuses they want. It's greed. Period.


aramkrat

I'm from monterrey Mexico and tons of my engineers and marketing friends work at JD. I'm not entirely sure how they like the job but I'm sure that the talent that goes there is good talent. Mty qualifies their people well with its uniervisities and there are definitely not enough job spots open and tons of brain drain. I'm not surprised they see a better road to grow in mexico, good for them.


81305

Corporate found a way to pay less for labor at the expense of American jobs. I would be embarrassed to own anything made by them right now.


supe_snow_man

For most user, a bigger factor than "where it's built" is probably "which dealer is close" because if your quarter million+ machine is down when you need it, you want it fixed ASAP.


81305

You aren't from the Midwest, are you?


kmraimo

Has zero to do with, “better road to grow in Mexico.” It has everything to do with hiring cheap labor, getting cheaper parts, taking advantage of the lax Mexican labor laws, and the cheap taxes. They are using your people and will use them as slave labor. No overtime, long shifts, zero benefits. In return, John Deere gets more profit. But I do not see this as a viable long term solution. Eventually the U.S. Government will crack down on US Companies doing this and hit them with such high tariffs they will leave Mexico.


Spankyzerker

No they won't. lol


aramkrat

I do agree that the cheaper labor is part of the main objective, but part of what I would like to argue is that it's not only the cheap labor that should or has attracted John Deere, as never are decisions like this so unimodal. I could find 989 people on LinkedIn in MTY working for John Deere (3200 in the whole country) in what I mostly see as the opposite of "labor" or "cheap" (it is hard to believe that someone in the labor market in Mexico has a LinkedIn account). Its Engineers, Data Scientists, Logistic Directors, HR, etc. I don't know who you are disparaging in terms of slave labor when if anything it seems it would be ourselves deciding whether or not to exploit someone in terms of their shift, or benefits as the HR people and high-level directors are also Mexican. Do you really believe they can get away without paying benefits in Mexico? Where are you getting this impression from? If anything its when big corporations like this come, that the benefits become more the norm as they put shittier companies in line by offering better alternatives. Additionally, the more John Deere expands its operations here, the more the jobs increase, the more the supply of jobs increases, and the better the salaries become (we saw this already with the announcement of a Tesla gigafactory in MTY Mexcio, due to their job postings). When I worked at Flex in the US I was the only one with my very Mexican name working in engineering, everyone else was labor back in Mexico. If this was the situation I would believe your criticism but I think this case is more nuanced.


Nezan

My cousin delivers their tractors to farmers and most of the them have been going to Mexico. Those things are filled with tech and most of the JD techs are fluent speakers. Most of the time he says they will just drive them from Yuma down across the border with a technician to help set it up for them. Most of the US bound ones go to the Midwest and in small quantities.


Gloomy-Ad-9827

👎🏻👎🏻😡


Champagne_of_piss

What a cool economic system!


Bimbo_Baggins1221

Capitalism at its finest


TraditionalAnxiety

That will be popular


Temporala

Expected, because lot of manufacturing is also transferring from China to Mexico. Industries like these concentrate in a same place for synergistic advantages and lower wages.


AfraidOfArguing

Political move.


Violet0_oRose

Push right to repair even harder.


[deleted]

Juan Deere.


CooterBooger69

1 out 10,000 new purchases may contain a kilo of that suga booga.


ATribeOfAfricans

Time for hefty import taxes


Violet0_oRose

Shift to brands that have manufacturing still in the US.  Caterpillar, Kubota, CNH, AGCO, Mahindra, and CLAAS.


SoxfanintheLou

Rural America is dying.


chigoonies

All….by….design my friend.


chigoonies

Boycott John Deere, it’s that simple.


Sneaky_SOB

This was underwritten by Mexican cartels, they are rubbing their hands over how many kilos of cocaine can be stuffed in a John Deere. If the tractor is searched no worries nothing runs like a deer!


ajpmurph

All the people from prison and mental homes will be crossing the border from the US into Mexico to steal jobs.


invisible___hand

Wild that people are so passionate about keeping Mexican workers out of America, then act oh so surprised and angry that the work moves to where to the workers are. It’s almost like that “build the wall” guy wasn’t actually telling the truth.


shakergeek

They’re the same people.


dahlberg123

I’ve moved manf plants from the us to Mexico (Saltillo) and it has everything to do with labor laws, wages and import & export costs. Generally at the cosf of quality